[Xzylvador]

Sure, you can get a weapon to be built out of ceramic/plasteel components to beat a MAD scanner, but the problem is, 9 out of 10 places with a MAD scanner will also have a cyberware scanner, even the lowest rating of which can spot that weapon immediately... why even bother with the MAD scanner really?

Is there any way to sneak a weapon, even if only a holdout, on an airplane, inside a police station?
Would a suitcase with a disguised/hidden faraday cage install beat cyberware scanner?
One player suggested wireless inhibiting paint, but this doesn't seem to beat a millimeter-wave scanner.
Is the SA Puzzler the only weapon that'd stand a chance? But if it scans (which it will), won't a rating 6 weapon recognition software be able to recognize the separate parts?

[Angelone]

I wonder the same thing... I've been told easy breakdown is better at sneaking a weapon through checkpoints than ceramic components. Which honestly seems wrong to me. The Puzzler breaks down to bits of jewelery so I don't think you'd have any problems sneaking anything like that anywhere.

[Xzylvador]

Wow... just had a look at easy breakdown... that might actually work.
I always figured it'd be like a sniper rifle, barrel, scope and butt/stock removable to fit in a briefcase, but still easily recognizable as a rifle.
But it does specifically mention pistols breaking down to pieces of jewelry... that should actually work.

How's this played by you experienced GM's? This does seem to obsolete ceramic/plasteel components almost completely.

[Bradd]

I don't assume that everyone has cyberware scanners, chem sniffers, and so on. Metal detectors are good enough for a lot of places, so the extra gear is just wasted nuyen.

[Charybdis]

How's this played by you experienced GM's? This does seem to obsolete ceramic/plasteel components almost completely.

Honestly, I rarely roll for security systems anymore and treat it more like an extended perception test for scanners to detect illegal items. Unless specific security is an important part of the run that's been prepared in advance, or they're taking weapons into public buildings, I allow the PC's a lot of lee-way for if and when security comes a calling.

Also, my group is particularly paranoid about that stuff. One even gets hermetically-sealed caseless ammo for his custom ceramic Heavy Pistol. Heinously expensive, but lets him feel a bit more secure when the other runners have decided to ditch the weapons....

Also, none of them have cyber-weaponry (no embedded shotguns or spurs) so even if Cyber is detected, most of it is legal anyway,

In public places, very few queries are raised if an R4 sin with a permit for their heavy Pistol shows up in the scanner with Smartlink-ware.  The world is a much more armed and armoured place in the Shadowrun universe

As for on runs, the rigger/hacker normally own components of the security system before the sammies set foot inside, so who cares if the chem-sniffer smells C3, when the Hacker is the only one watching the alarm?

[Triggvi]

This thread is making great case for weapons like tasers, which are legal even with out permits in shadowrun. I have people laugh when I tell them my character's primary weapon is a taser or stun baton. They laugh right up until they get jealous that my taser has taken down more people than there assault rifles.

[James McMurray]

I don't assume that everyone has cyberware scanners, chem sniffers, and so on. Metal detectors are good enough for a lot of places, so the extra gear is just wasted nuyen.

This is what I do too. If you're walking into the Arcology Mall downtown you're going to be scrutinized by a cyberware detetor. But if you're going to some middle class mall in Tacoma it's just a MAD. If it's a blasted wreck of a street bazaar in Puyallup it'll be a MAD too, but nobody will bat an eyelash unless you don't set it off, in which case you'd better watch your back.

[mdp]

Where does it state in the rules that a cyberware scanner detects plasteel or ceramic weapons?  I just assumed ceramic weapons weren't recognized on scanners (as this would imply that the cyberware scanner should also give an alarm when I walk through it with a ceramic vase in my hands

[James McMurray]

Where does it state in the rules that a cyberware scanner detects plasteel or ceramic weapons?  I just assumed ceramic weapons weren't recognized on scanners (as this would imply that the cyberware scanner should also give an alarm when I walk through it with a ceramic vase in my hands

Cyberware scanners are not based on metal in any way shape or form. They effectively take video of you through your clothing and skin then compare that video to their database to see if they recognize the shapes of any weapons or cyberware. Unless someone invents a gun shaped like a ceramic vase and it becomes popular enough to make it into the next security patch there's not going to be any risk of a cyberware scanner getting a false positive.

[KarmaInferno]

Cyberware scanners are millimeter-wave radar systems, not magnetic-based.

"Millimeter wave scans can detect any non-biological item by its shape and composition" - SR4A, pg 265

They detect the object's density, and as such most weapons will show up, since even if ceramic or plasteel they are plenty dense enough to trigger the scanner. As the scanner databases are probably updated regularly, if a weapon-shaped dense object shows up, the scanner will bark.


-k

[mdp]

So when you get your gun, make it all plasteel and ceramic, then give it a custom look it shouldn't be a problem?  As this scanner compares to a database, that 'normally' won't contain a picture of this gun it should not be recognised I guess?

[KarmaInferno]

The scanner will probably ping that detected a dense object, but can't identify it. It may display the object on the screen.

Whether or not the operator decides to investigate further depends on the level of security and/or the laziness of the operator.



-k

[Stahlseele]

There's still a barrel and a place for bullets. That's what they mean.

[KarmaInferno]

Yeah, you'd have to do some serious disguising of the weapon to fool the operator.

I've seen in real life a knife hidden in a comb, you pull off the "head" of the comb to expose the plastic blade. But as the whole comb is made from the same plastic, it shows up as just a comb on scanners.

If you made the barrel look like some other more reasonable tube-shaped object, it might work. I'd give the operator some sort of perception check to detect the disguise.



-k

[James McMurray]

Intuition + Perception vs. the creator's Intuition + Artisan (capped by their Armorer) feels right.