[Aethelwulf1972]

I am not sure if this should be here or the rules forum so my apologies if I am posting in the wrong place.

as you probably know, for 15 karma and chargen, an adept can treat augmentations as having alphaware essence costs, but if I gain 2 points of magic through initiations and appropriate karma spending, the adept loses that quality.  for an adept that will be using a bow, and some form of close combat in the style of the tv series Arrow, would the 15 karma cost (plus taking up some of my positive quality limit) and it disappearing eventually through initiation be worth while for getting muscle augmentation and possibly something else to round out to an even 1 or maybe even 2 essence loss?  (the character will be Nocturna so will already have a pretty high agi)

[8-bit]

Not if you are losing only 1 or 2 Essence. You go Burnout to go all the way. I mean like, down to 1, maybe 2 Essence. Rarely, you can go 3 Essence, but that's the maximum.

What kind of augmentations are you looking at? Because, for decently cheap (aka, C Resources) you can get Muscle Toner 3 + Datajack + Smartlink. All for only 1 Essence, and 1 Magic.

[ZeldaBravo]

Since that "counts as alphaware" status doesn't go away with the Way of Burnout I'd go all the way to 2 or 1 essence too.

[Aethelwulf1972]

8-Bit:  I was actually looking at muscle augmentation to get some extra strength for a higher rating bow, and melee damage, as with nocturna I will already have an agi of 8

[gilga]

Burnout way let you build a 'street sam' with very low essence, and just 1-2 adept points.
So you basically, a street SAM with future development options of an adept.

[adzling]

I disagree, just using it for two or three essence points of ware will be exceptionally useful if you pick the right stuff. Choose the ware that costs less essence than the magic point cost for the adept ability.

Example improved reflexes level 2 is 2.5 magic.
You can get the same thing in bioware for .8 essence.
That's way more effective for the essence/ magic cost effectively netting you 1.7 magic points!!

Same goes for muscle toner and a few other choice bits of bioware.

Screw burning out all the way, that's for chumps.

[8-bit]

I disagree, just using it for two or three essence points of ware will be exceptionally useful if you pick the right stuff. Choose the ware that costs less essence than the magic point cost for the adept ability.

Example improved reflexes level 2 is 2.5 magic.
You can get the same thing in bioware for .8 essence.
That's way more effective for the essence/ magic cost effectively netting you 1.7 magic points!!

Same goes for muscle toner and a few other choice bits of bioware.

Screw burning out all the way, that's for chumps.

Eh, if you say so. You could also get Synaptic Boosters 2 for only 1.0 Essence without taking the quality. Or Muscle Toner 3 (at Used Rating), which is even more "power point" efficient, and wouldn't benefit from the Burnout's Way.

Basically, most Bioware is so Essence Friendly, that you can fit it in at Used Grade, for less cost, and still come out ahead. The Burnout's Way is not really necessary for that. I mean, I see your point, but YMMV.

8-Bit:  I was actually looking at muscle augmentation to get some extra strength for a higher rating bow, and melee damage, as with nocturna I will already have an agi of 8

Same effect, just cheaper in nuyen.

[Glyph]

It is good for, say, Availability: 12 standard grade bioware (platelet factories, rating: 2 synaptic boosters), since alphaware normally increases Availability, too.  Otherwise, being able to treat standard grade augmentations as alphaware is not that impressive in SR5, where alphaware is only 1.2 times more expensive.  I would set down your list of augmentations you are going to take, first.  Then, calculate the Essence cost of them and ask yourself if taking the burnout's way saves you a Magic point in Essence costs (remembering that unless it is Availability: 11 or 12 to start with, you have the option of making it alphaware for a slight cost increase, instead).

[UnLimiTeD]

Really, Burnout way is horribly cheesy. And yes, it's totally worth it for just two Essence. It's just 15 Karma, you can save more than that in Karma converted to money, if you even could convert that much to money.
Hell, you could grab Alpha Grade Wired Reflexes, which per the English CRB stack with Adrenaline Boost.
Sure, you could also burn out all the way, but that's A) Cheese, and B) before an Augmentation Rulebook comes out, not really all that useful. Bioware is just more efficient unless you really need that Grenade Launcher in your Arm.

[Aethelwulf1972]

Okay then, for anocturna adept character with archery and melee skills, what is better: strength or agility?

[Lucean]

Stick'n-Shock can let you succeed with a low amount of STR. For melee I'd recommend Shock Gloves and/or Nerve Strike for unarmed, although your Physical Limit should be watched and so a moderate amount of STR is needed.

[Spooky]

Toss a coin. Strength gives you better bow range and damage, agility gives you a better chance to hit.

[ZeldaBravo]

Why not both? Muscle replacement is there for a reason.

[Aethelwulf1972]

I considered muscle replacement, but that is also a hefty availability and price tag as well.  If I decide to go with the bioware, I will need to choose either augmentation or toner...

[8-bit]

I considered muscle replacement, but that is also a hefty availability and price tag as well.  If I decide to go with the bioware, I will need to choose either augmentation or toner...

It's more about whether you want to lose only a point or two, or go down to Essence 1 or 2. Also, Muscle Replacement is cheaper than either Augmentation or Toner, and certainly cheaper than both combined.

As for whether to go Augmentation or Toner, personally I would go Toner. More Agility means more dice, which means more hits, which scales damage. Considering you can't go over a Rating 6 Bow at Character Creation anyway, being able to use Explosive, Incendiary, Injection, and Stick-n-Shock Arrows means you don't need that high of a Strength.

Also, if you don't plan to take Burnout's Way, it's actually cheaper to go Muscle Toner/Augmentation 3 at Used Grade. As long as you don't get any more extensive 'ware, you still only limit your loss to 1 Magic Point.