[Ultra Violet]

"Mind Over Machine" is an advanced echo (see UW, p. 148 ). It's basically the power to "jump into" (like riggers do) any device, without the need of a rigger control.
My question isn't an easy one:
What can you do with that echo, and more important, what can't you do?

I had a discussion with another player about it and we realized that on that point of question is the parting of the ways.
So that decided to ask you guys, where are the limits of that echo?

Thanks up front!


Yours faithfully,
UV

[Kot]

That echo works just like a Control Rig cyberware, as far as I remember. That's all.

[Chaemera]

That echo works just like a Control Rig cyberware, as far as I remember. That's all.

Actually, two ranks of the Immersion echo is the same as the Control Rig cyberware (okay, Immersion is better, it's a bonus to all tests).

All a Control Rig gives you is +2 on vehicle skill tests while jumped in (SR4A, pg 338). The only requirement for jumping into a drone or vehicle is that the device has a rigger adaptation, if that criteria is met, anyone in VR with access to the drone/vehicle can jump in, no extra hardware required (SR4A, pg 244).

What the Mind over Machine echo grants is the ability to jump into matrix devices that don't have a rigger adaptation vehicle/drone mod. So, now you can enter the toaster and be the toaster. You can jump into a car with no rigger adaptation and really scare the driver something awful (imagine, you're tooling down the road, and all of a sudden your car says "Hello, Dave." and steers into oncoming traffic).

[Ultra Violet]

That echo works just like a Control Rig cyberware, as far as I remember. That's all.

Not quiet...

Mind Over Machine
A technomancer can “jump into” any wireless device, even those that aren’t usually equipped with rigger adaptation—e.g., cameras, locks, commlinks, etc. If the technomancer does not have access to the device, they must first hack in as normal.

The question is what kind of access will be needed, and more important where are the limits? Can a TM hack a device on the other side of the world and jump into it? Is there anything somebody can do against that?

I use the listed examples to show you some of my questions or worries...
The camera: The TM jumps into a camera now she is the camera! But what does it mean? What can and what can't she do with it?
The lock: Same as before only this time she is the lock. Can she unlock easily without an alarm or not?
The commlink: Now she became the commlink she wants to hack. What can she do being the commlink at all?
And another one by me...
She became a cyberarm she is the cyberarm, now she controls it. Does she get her Matrix Initiative to act? That would be a very cheap Ini improvement for trusting teammates

[Ultra Violet]

I try to explain it again:
1. What kind of access is needed?
That means, do I have to get an account access or do I have to get only inside the node? And do I really have to hack into it or does spoofing do the trick, too?

2. What can a jumped in rigger do with a device and where are the limits?
How much control over the device has a technomancer with this echo?
And can the TM do things that usually needs other tests and game mechanics? (i.e. can she unlock a security door from inside without have to hack the master, or can she command a re-boot, or getting a soda-machine to spill some soda canes without payment...)

3. Does you use the standard rigger rules, inclusive Matrix Initiative as Device Initiative (of course only if it's mobile)?

4. All questions above leading to a big one: Can a technomancer with that echo, jump into any device she got access, all over the globe?

[Chaemera]

1. I would assume it follows the same rules as jumping into a device that does have rigger adaptation. That is, a subscription to the node (SR4A, pg 245), which typically requires an account (Unwired, pg. 52-53 and 55) or hacking (which grants the hacker access to an account, Unwired pg 97). Spoofing doesn't cut it, as it doesn't establish a subscription. Spoofing is specifically limited to sending specific commands (SR4A, pg 232). Also remember, we're mostly talking peripheral nodes/devices, so odds are there's only an Admin level account (Unwired, pg 48).

2. The limits are, presumably, what the object could do normally. Ultimately, this is in the realm of GM fiat. Using your examples:

 I would say that yes, the Techno could unlock a security door when jumped into the lock, though other sensors would likely detect pressure changes, a magnetic sensor on the door might notice it opening, etc.
 Commanding a reboot would, of course, dump the techno out of the node, so if he hadn't created his own account, he'd have to start over. However, it's a normal part of operations, so yes, I'd allow him to reboot.
 Unless there's a mechanical lock-out on the soda machine (not likely with the switch to virtual money instead of coins), I'd allow you to dump out the contents of the soda machine.

All of these are within the normal capabilities of the device, and you are now the device.

3. Yes.

4. If the techno has an account & a subscription to the device, anywhere in the world, yes. The basic rigging rules don't preclude jumping into a drone in Africa from the comfort of your couch in Seattle, provided you meet all the other requirements (account + subscription), so I don't see why an echo that allows jumping into non-rigger adapted devices would suddenly gain that limitation.

[Ultra Violet]

Okay, than back to the commlink example...
What can the TM do within a targets commlink?
i.e. can the TM switch a hacker who is running in cold sim to hot sim? Can he take a picture with the integrated camera and send it to someone? Can he delete the memory without the hackers knowledge? a.s.o.
You see there are many little things in question.

The other thing is what can the target do against that? The thing is the device has usually no rigger adaption, so that a hacker or rigger can't get the TM out of the control, or what do you think?

Another example was the rigged cyberarm. So she is the cyberarm, what can she do as such?
A cyberarm has no visual sensors but a rigger adaption gives usually a set off sensory as base to work, is that sensory base within the echo? That means can the cyberarm see in some way?
Assuming it doesn't if the target has an Smartgun and holding a gun with a gun-camera can a technomancer use the gun-cam to see through?
What does a TM with that echo need to control the cyberarm of a fellow teammate, to use her 3-5 IP instead of his 1-4?
If his cyberware or cyberbody is clustert to one node, does that mean if the TM get in that cluster-node she can control his whole body(-ware)?

[Chaemera]

Okay, than back to the commlink example...
What can the TM do within a targets commlink?
i.e. can the TM switch a hacker who is running in cold sim to hot sim?

From my understanding of hot-sim modified sim modules, either you're moded for hot sim (and running it) or you aren't. It's a hardware, not software, question.

Can he take a picture with the integrated camera and send it to someone?

I would argue yes, if the account he's using to jump-in has the right access permissions (ie, if the commlink is configured to require admin authorization to delete a file and he doesn't have admin, then even acting via jump-in, he couldn't pull it off). Mind, this one is fully GM fiat, other GMs might be more, or less, restrictive.

Can he delete the memory without the hackers knowledge? a.s.o.
You see there are many little things in question.

I think if it requires a program to do it (like the Edit program), then you can't do it via jumping-in, only fundamental to the machine behaviors (for a commlink, utilize sensors, change wireless modes, drop/establish subscriptions).

As I said above, this is thoroughly GM Fiat territory.

The other thing is what can the target do against that? The thing is the device has usually no rigger adaption, so that a hacker or rigger can't get the TM out of the control, or what do you think?

I think manual controls always override digital. So, if the hacker notices a problem with his comm-link, he can reboot it using manual controls, dumping the techno back out. If he has admin and the techno doesn't, he can disconnect the techno and delete the account. All the same tricks that work against a hacker still apply, the techno has to get in past the firewall, avoid detection, and be better than the node's owner at cyber combat if he is detected. If the node he wants access to is slaved to another system, it's that much harder to jump in, since now, it won't accept connections except from the master node, so you can only spoof (unless you establish a hard-wired connection).

Another example was the rigged cyberarm. So she is the cyberarm, what can she do as such?
A cyberarm has no visual sensors but a rigger adaption gives usually a set off sensory as base to work, is that sensory base within the echo? That means can the cyberarm see in some way?

Sensors are a function of the device, not the access, so I don't think you'd be granted "cyberarm sight" via the echo. However, you'd have the sense of touch (can't use a cyber arm without a sense of touch), heuristic sense to tell the arm where it is in relation to the rest of the sammy it's attached to, and arguably some kind of "sense" that interpreted signals from the meat of the street samurai.

She can make the cyberarm go limp, she could make it seize up, she could use the heuristic sense and sense of touch to attempt to strangle the street samurai, or shut it down. Not a whole heck of a lot else to be done there.

Assuming it doesn't if the target has an Smartgun and holding a gun with a gun-camera can a technomancer use the gun-cam to see through?

The TM would need to jump into the smartgun, not the cyberarm, even if the smartgun were mounted in the cyberarm, they're treated as two separate nodes. So, now TM has control of the smartgun, but not the cyberarm.

What does a TM with that echo need to control the cyberarm of a fellow teammate, to use her 3-5 IP instead of his 1-4?

If he's got an account with the cyberarm, once he's jumped in, he could control the cyberarm (within the limitations of the cyberarm's senses mentioned above) on his IPs in lieu of the teammate. But, if the teammate needed to coordinate that arm with the rest of his body, he's up shit creek. I don't see this as a good tactic, if the cyberlimb doesn't have an integrated sensor suite to provide LOS.

Over all, this strategy seems too cumbersome for much use, IMO.

If his cyberware or cyberbody is clustert to one node, does that mean if the TM get in that cluster-node she can control his whole body(-ware)?

If he was dumb enough to cluster his cyberware, then yeah, you could treat it as a single node for jumping-in purposes, and thus get control over the conglomerate of cyberware in his body (complete with all senses clustered). Since all your cyberware is already effectively clustered into your brain, I see no reason why you'd ever find someone in this setup, though.

Of course, all this is my opinion, and how I'd run it at my table. I would use the general philosophy that you can only accomplish tasks which fall within the basic hardware (not software) functionality of the device. Other GMs are completely within their rights to disagree with me, because I don't see where the books ever get into what you could or couldn't do with this kind of access.