[FastJack]

Yeah, I've been warned against War!.

That's a shame.

[Charybdis]

Yeah, I've been warned against War!.

That's a shame.

That's a crying shame 

There are some sweet, SWEET things  in that book....

[CanRay]

I've heard it being referred to as "The Bogota Sourcebook without a map, oh, and some gear" book.

[FastJack]

Granted, I'm a fanboi. And the book does have some issues, but I still like it and have not regretted the purchase.

[CanRay]

I'm a fanboy on a budget.   

[Dakka]

I've heard it being referred to as "The Bogota Sourcebook without a map, oh, and some gear" book.

This is actually a pretty fair description.  Except I would also add "some gear which includes a Battle Rifle with High Velocity Full Auto but no FA mode, so its the most expensive sport rifle ever."

Some of the rules coming out of War! make for a game breaking experience.  If you thought the tanks had high armor BEFORE, now its fairly simple to get 18/11 on a starting character with body 5 and strength 5.  None of it is even restricted, you will simply always LOOK like a 'Runner.

[CanRay]

Yeah, one new rifle doesn't offer enough for me to spend my limited funds on.

If War! was about, you know, war around the world, make-up of 2070s military units, or even just touching on the hot spots and border skirmishes and so on...  You know, like "Fields of Fire" was for mercs (Even if it was a bit preachy)...  Maybe even touch on the human loss that occurs.  OH!  And Desert Wars!  I so wanted to hear how those were set up!

But, yeah, "Bogota the Sourcebook" doesn't interest me that much, sorry.  And, well, the lack of a map as well...  Makes doing a house-to-house fighting campaign difficult if you don't even have a good idea what the neighborhoods are, to see where you're fighting to and what you're trying to take and why.  Maybe one as a Downloadable for the website might peak my interest more.

[FastJack]

Eh, to each his own.

[CanRay]

I'd also need a group interested in a military campaign.  Especially an urban one.

I'm the only militaria nut in my group.

[Critias]

If War! was about, you know, war around the world, make-up of 2070s military units, or even just touching on the hot spots and border skirmishes and so on...  You know, like "Fields of Fire" was for mercs (Even if it was a bit preachy)...  Maybe even touch on the human loss that occurs.  OH!  And Desert Wars!  I so wanted to hear how those were set up!

I think it's important to point out (amidst the War! hyperbole flying around the interwebs) that lots of that is covered in War!.  Hotspots and border skirmishes, generic stats for an assortment of various soldiers and sailors for GMs throwing together military units, etc, etc.

It's not a perfect sourcebook, and it's not just Fields of Fire, Part Deux, but pages 115-180 have nothing to do with Bogota.  It's got a global hotspots chapter, warfare vs. shadowrunning, suggestions for running a military/merc campaign, additional rules (like for the Leadership skill, one of my personal favorite parts of the book), new grunts and contacts (various types of soldiers and MPs and such), and then about 25 pages of new guns, armor, vehicles, etc, etc, etc. 

I'll admit right alongside everyone that it's not my favorite sourcebook, by a longshot (and it's true, a map would've been nice).  But it's not the ZOMG WORST BOOK EVAR that some folks have made it out to be, either.

I also hope people get over their surprise at it being a mixture of specific setting -> general setting -> fluff -> crunch all in one book, because it's the basic format for several upcoming books.  Rather than it being "Target: Bogota: Plus Some Other Crap," it's a format designed to provide some setting information for Bogota, then some information on the war in Bogota, then some information on war in general (all complete with rules).  Instead of talking about war wholly in the abstract, it's a book about war in Shadowrun, yes, but with a focus on an actual war that's currently going on.

[Loki]

I also hope people get over their surprise at it being a mixture of specific setting -> general setting -> fluff -> crunch all in one book, because it's the basic format for several upcoming books.  Rather than it being "Target: Bogota: Plus Some Other Crap," it's a format designed to provide some setting information for Bogota, then some information on the war in Bogota, then some information on war in general (all complete with rules).  Instead of talking about war wholly in the abstract, it's a book about war in Shadowrun, yes, but with a focus on an actual war that's currently going on.

Precisely, The only difference between the layout of War and of Runner Havens, Feral Cities, etc is instead of two in depth areas they covered one and added a bunch of military rules and fluff.

[aimlessfreak]

I'm still planning on getting War, though its no on the top of my list right now, but the thing that I've heard that bugs me the most is that there wasn't much in the way Jackpoint comments.

[Critias]

I'm still planning on getting War, though its no on the top of my list right now, but the thing that I've heard that bugs me the most is that there wasn't much in the way Jackpoint comments.

Which is actually, for me, a big part of why I don't like it as much as I could have.  It's also something that was missed by more than just you, though -- trust me -- and what I've seen, and what I've written myself, of upcoming sourcebooks ameliorates that lack of shadowtalk goodness.

[aimlessfreak]

Thank you 

[CanRay]

OK, good to get a second opinion on it.  I'll wait and see if I can look at a copy of it before I make my decision.

As for a lack of shadowtalk, BOO!  I likes me my shadowtalk.

Wish I could edit it and do a "ShadowSEA" version or something with more Shadowtalk...  Guess the JackPointers just don't have much to say about war.  Which kind of makes sense, there's only, what, two, three people that have actual military experience in the group?