[All4BigGuns]

Which is why i said interesting, not decisive

Still. I get the debate. If MysAds have all access to start with, the Magician's Way quality is PARTICULARLY bad for 20 karma.

But if they don't, MysAds are just plain limited.

Even if MysAds have to buy the Magician's Way to buy non-Adept metamagics- they can't be reasonably called 'limited'.

If they weren't the ONLY character type that loses out permanently on an aspect of their character if they don't take any Negative Qualities, maybe. But, they are.

If they're so horrible, why are there so many mysAds out there?

Technomancers on the other hand...

Technomancers are pretty bad off, but at least they can get good after they've gotten some karma.

The Mystic Adept, on the other hand, completely loses all opportunity to get any Power Points that he didn't get in generation no matter how much karma or cash he gets in play leaving him permanently behind the one that did get them. Just reducing the karma cost for those Power Points to 4 instead of 5 would make them more "in line".

[Pap Renvela]

I agree that PP should be 4 so they don't need to get a negative quality if they want 6 at chargen.
However, it was the SR community that lobbied for the nerfing, Catalyst originally had it at 2 Karma.

And MysAds can always choose to take a PP upon initiating instead of a metamagic.

[All4BigGuns]

I agree that PP should be 4 so they don't need to get a negative quality if they want 6 at chargen.
However, it was the SR community that lobbied for the nerfing, Catalyst originally had it at 2 Karma.

And MysAds can always choose to take a PP upon initiating instead of a metamagic.

Those that do get all of them at generation can do that as well, so they're still ahead.

And, it wasn't the entire community. It was a very vocal segment of forum population, and forum-goers (at least beyond the occasional browsing without signing up and posting) are actually a minority among the player base.

[Dinendae]

I agree that PP should be 4 so they don't need to get a negative quality if they want 6 at chargen.
However, it was the SR community that lobbied for the nerfing, Catalyst originally had it at 2 Karma.

And MysAds can always choose to take a PP upon initiating instead of a metamagic.

Those that do get all of them at generation can do that as well, so they're still ahead.

And, it wasn't the entire community. It was a very vocal segment of forum population, and forum-goers (at least beyond the occasional browsing without signing up and posting) are actually a minority among the player base.

I'm not sure any other archetype sees as much vocal hatred as the MysAd. I remember the threads from the start of 5th Edition when the typo had it at 2 karma per power point. I proposed the cost at 4 karma per point, along with others, and there were a lot of posts that absolutely refused to accept that, with out anything of substance to back it up. Then again, back in 4th Edition when they were errata'd into being almost useless, there were still people who thought they were overpowered. /shrug


Since then I've slightly evolved my stance on them: If Catalyst refuses to completely rework them, then I still think it should be 4 karma per power point (not going to happen, I know). However, I think that aspected mages and MysAds should be combined together; the new MysAd would have power points equal to their magic score, and select either the Sorcery, Enchanting, or Conjuring Skill Group. Of course that would require that Catalyst would be willing to go back and make massive changes to those things that need it, which in the last word we heard (in the technomancer supplement thread) wasn't going to happen either. 

[All4BigGuns]

There should be the possibility of being an Aspected Mystic Adept, but requiring it is nowhere near necessary.

I'm a firm believer that there should be "tiers" of Awakened, something like below.

1 - Full Magic Mystic Adept
2 - Full Magician
3 - Aspected Magic Mystic Adept
4 - Physical / Social / Mental Adept
5 - Aspected Sorcerer / Conjurer
6 - Aspected Enchanter
7 - Paracritter / Dual Natured Metasapients


The argument of "why play anything else" if something is more powerful is straight up a straw man. There is always a very good reason to play any of the others--because that's what you want to play.

[All4BigGuns]

<< Realize that "double posting" is generally a no-no, but it's necessary here. >>

The character generation for Priority really should have looked something like this (in quotes to make it clean looking):

Metatype
A – Any
B – Any
C – Troll, Dwarf, Ork, Elf or Human
D – Ork, Elf or Human
E – Human

Top two Priorities required for Meta-variants, Shapeshifters and AIs

Attributes
A – 28
B – 24
C – 20
D – 16
E – 12

Skills and Skill Groups
A – 50 / 15
B – 40 / 10
C – 30 / 5
D – 20 / 2
E – 12 / 0

Special Attributes
A – 12
B – 10
C – 8
D – 6
E – 4

Three Special Attributes
Magic
Qi
Edge
If one buys neither Magic nor Qi, they're Mundane
If they buy Magic, they're Magician
If they buy Qi, they're Adept
If they buy both, they're Mystic Adept
Aspected is a 10 karma Negative Quality

Resources
A – 750,000
B – 450,000
C – 150,000
D – 75,000
E – 25,000

25 Karma in 'Finishing Touches' to round out the character

Knowledge Skills – (Logic + Intuition) x 3
Charisma x 3 “Contact Points”
Additional Contacts may be purchased for 1 Karma per point of Loyalty and Connection totaled together
Additional Contacts may also be purchased for 1,000 nuyen per point of Loyalty and Connection totaled together