[Arkayne]

I just started up a new campaign, starting with the simple "Food Fight" scenario. The run doesn't pay much, but it's also pretty short.

One of the things the players started talking about was salvaging tech during runs. For example, the decker wanted to pull the guns out of the ceiling turrets for his drones, and probably take the deck off the enemy decker and the guns off the mafia goons.

Is this pretty common? It seems gear salvage would pretty quickly escalate the available nuyen, even if they got bad resale value, especially for high-end items like decks. 

In general, it seems like a lot of scenarios can be rushed along by introducing security guards, Lone Star cops, etc., not giving them time to loot the area, but I can see this being a reoccurring thing. How do you handle stuff like this?

EDIT: I found this thread from a couple of years back: http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=13329.0

[psycho835]

Depends. Some tables/teams/GMs frown at looting. If no one at your table does, then I would suggest applying some rules to the process:
1. Corporate/government prototypes and such are OFF-LIMITS unless objectives of the run say otherwise. The owner WILL chase you for this.
2. RFID tags. Damn things are everywhere these days. Kill every fragging tag you can find with extreme prejudice.
3. As you pointed out, time. Don't bother gutting these turrets , unless there is a specific component that you need from them, and even then, only if it's important. If you want to take the guns off of them, you should be able to do so relatively quickly, provided you've got the right tools on you.
4. Encumberance. All that gear you are going to steal has it's weight. And it still has it's size. Sure, your cybered up to the gills street sam might be able to carry that bundle of assault rifles, but good luck with not moving like a complete klutz. Nevermind fighting or going in public. Therefore, prioritize. Go for items with greatest value-to-weight/size ratio.

Here's an amusing supplement, written in character:
https://www.fanfiction.net/s/7598620/1/Creative-Looting-101

[NoxMortem]

I usually handle this out of game with my players and ask them what kind of shadowrun they want to play and if we can agree that the law enforcment will look for them much heavier when they start robbing whomever they kill.

I personally distate the looting game in shadowrun but Pay Data which is the virtual variant of looting ingame items is a part of shadowrun since the first edition. I have one person who loots ammunitions and looks for interesting personal items.

Therefore I do not have a problem with looting small items, but once the begin to load several heavy guns or even begin to dismantle the stationary guns I would definetly set up long times and let security intervene after e.g. 1d6 to 2d6 minutes.

[MijRai]

Yeah, the trick to looting in Shadowrun is a matter of time and effort.  Do you go to the effort of stripping down everything that can be traced and risk missing something or being found on-scene, or do you just pick and choose a few very important things for the road? 

Also keep in mind two things; maybe the Johnson says 'hey, you guys are being hired not to loot' to rein in their proclivities.  Especially for jobs that are internal.  The Ares Executive trying to usurp his superior doesn't want to deal with spending his budget on replacing everything his tools stole.  Selling the stuff you loot can be hard as well.  The most reliable way is to sell it to a relevant contact with high loyalty, which guarantees a set percentage of nuyen from the sale. 

[Mirikon]

Picking up a gun off a dead guard is one thing. Sticking around to dismantle drop-down turrets when you know the Knights have probably gotten at least a half dozen PANICBUTTON calls from the SINners shopping there, that's another. In some respects, salvaging gear is an accepted thing. Drop a guard, and do it quick and quiet enough that you don't have to worry about alarms just yet? Sure, pocket his gun and his credstick, maybe even his commlink, if you want. Other runner team tries to ambush you? Loot the hell out of their bodies. But going back over ground after a running firefight? No. Stealing things from the high-tech lab that aren't on your list? Not only do you risk blowing the job (especially the sneaky jobs), but WHEN (not if) corpsec starts looking for the prototype, you risk burning your contacts for this. And there's all kinds of bad that can come from that.

So basically, use your head when 'salvaging' gear. Moderation is key, and there may be times you don't get a single 'freebie' during the entire run. That's just fine.

[Stoneglobe]

Another thing to consider is that if your players insist on looting and making off with the high end goods is all the fun you can have with the consequences. This is especially true for players that go down the hunt the decker route. Cyberdecks are high end bits of kit and worth lots of cash, even at resale value, which make them very tempting for players to grab but if they keep doing this you can make the consequences incredibly severe.

Firstly any decker or technomancer associated with the party should really start to feel uncomfortable as the deckers being hunted down could well be their friends and sparring partners on the boards and in the matrix. Being associated with such mercenary and callous teams will soon get them ostracised in what many of them consider their preferred reality. Also, how long will it be before the rest of the team turn on them either for their own expensive gear or to sell them for a bounty to a corp research facility. Use this to twist their minds and up their paronoia within the team massively.

Secondly, any team consistently doing this will end up getting notoriety regardless of how loyal their fence is. An increase in the number of secondhand decks combined with dead or missing deckers will raise questions in the community and answers will be found. After all have your players managed to erase every scrap of video evidence of them looting the bodies?

Now comes the really fun part, the consequences.

Pretty soon the shadowrunners will find it difficult to recruit any form of matrix support. After all who'd want to work for people who were just as likely to kill them afterwards to make a quick buck.

Then their contacts will start to dry up as they also rely on deckers for vast amounts of information and work. If they start putting pressure on the team's contacts to stop working for them or they'll stop those contacts are very quickly going to disappear. You can now reward your characters with a bonus quality - Hung Out to Dry.

Now comes the really fun part. All those lovingly crafted false ID's and licences your characters have were crafted by, you guessed it, deckers. If they can craft it and put it in circulation they can very easily burn it. Just imagine the fun you can have when the assault rifle toting samurai gets stopped by KE and cockily hands over that perfect rating 6 ID, which he's been able to afford thanks to all those decks he's been selling, only to find himself looking down the barrel of their guns when said ID comes back burnt and obviously false. Maybe he manages to fight his way out of that one but now his face is known thanks to the cameras recording and broadcasting back to the station everything that the officer does and there's a manhunt on.

Said sammie manages to slip the net this time. Not a problem, now he needs a new ID otherwise he's not going anywhere soon. But wait, where's that new ID going to come from. He hasn't got any contacts he can turn to and the team's decker, if the team even has a decker any more, isn't actually capable of creating a functioning false ID.

I always say let the players do whatever they want and just enjoy having fun letting the consequences land on them. When they create their next team looting won't be a problem. Of course if you're happy with them looting you don't have to apply any of the consequences. It's all about having fun.

[Hobbes]

Let 'em.  It's all wireless so unless the team hacks and turns off, or all carry multiple tag erasers (only one charge per 10 seconds..) they're going to be tracked.  The stuff that can be pocketed easily usually isn't very valuable. 

Do that math, each runner grabs a couple thousand worth of crap they don't need.  You spend a minute or two after a fire fight deactivating the trackers, after the run the PCs can sell the stuff for what 20% or so of the cost.  Then divided up between the team.  And I guarantee you not all the runners are going to be pack mules.   It's an extra couple hundred Nuyen per runner per run.  Long term really not worth it unless the team finds itself in a situation where they're left alone to strip corpses and cart off a couple hundred kilos of lewt ( the bodies are probably worth as much as anything they're carrying.) 

[Reaver]

I would suggest you read over the ownership rules. (Have aspirn ready, it's headache and a half). Now remember, anything that is worth stealing is wireless - right down to the gangers dirty undies!

That owner can easily track their own gear through the matrix.... and right to the thief..... so go ahead and loot! Makes the authorities job of finding you easier!

Second point:

Johnsons are looking to hire well trained PROFESSIONALS, there is nothing professional about looting corpses....

[psycho835]

Let 'em.  It's all wireless so unless the team hacks and turns off, or all carry multiple tag erasers (only one charge per 10 seconds..) they're going to be tracked.  The stuff that can be pocketed easily usually isn't very valuable. 

Well, there's always 4E "Pulse" spell, specifically to deal with these pesky tags. Unless they are hardened, of course.

[MijRai]

Yeah, if you're going to loot things in Shadowrun, tag erasers are a secondary goal, after taking out the batteries.  A secondary goal (one I've done for characters in the past) is a Faraday Cage-style compartment in their vehicles and homes.  A place to store wireless things safely is always a good idea.

So no, if you think it through and take precautions there is little to no chance of them finding you by following that item.  It's why resale value with Contacts is what, 5% per point of Loyalty?  You have to have maxed out loyalty to get 30% of an item's value in most cases (much less than the usual 50% you see in other systems).  You pass the item off to people who can clean up and sell those items.  If you took something special, it might become a different story; hopefully your contact is loyal enough to warn you instead of passing on your contact information. 

As far as a reputation goes...  That's extremely subjective.  In my opinion, no-one is going to look at you funny for grabbing a firearm or two, maybe some notable valuables unless told otherwise (or if you're hired for a subtle job and the like).  Equipment is precious, and if you can acquire something you need without going through the hoops, that could as easily be construed as self-sufficiency as anything else.  Going for 'ware to harvest is a very different matter, though.  That goes past taking something off of a person or place (who doesn't need to be dead or even present) to taking something out of someone.  Even if a group has a habit of grabbing the 'decks of their opponents if they take them out, I wouldn't be throwing that many difficulties their way (of course, I'm also all for dropping the price of 'decks as well).

[CitizenJoe]

Re: professional.  Looting being unprofessional is entirely BS.  If I have kill someone, I want to know who it is so I know who is coming after me.  I want their comms so I can listen in.  I want to deny any weapons to my enemy. Cybereyes? Gotta take those due to photo evidence. Sure, I could burn the body to ash with thermite, but taking stuff is a lot easier.

I will gladly take that notoriety point if you claim looting is unprofessional and then I'll make the GM pay for it.

Looting is entirely a house policy. You can't do it in living world play because of the multiple GM situation affecting balance.  But if it is just your table, then it is just a matter of how your group wants to play it.  And don't let any of us Internet GMs tell you otherwise.  It is your game. If you're having fun then you're playing it right.

[MijRai]

Okay, there's a difference between destroying evidence and taking the eyes out of someone's skull to salvage.  Just saying. 

[psycho835]

Yeah, if you're going to loot things in Shadowrun, tag erasers are a secondary goal, after taking out the batteries.  A secondary goal (one I've done for characters in the past) is a Faraday Cage-style compartment in their vehicles and homes.  A place to store wireless things safely is always a good idea.

"Hard Targets" gives us a Faraday pocket as a possible armor mod.

[halflingmage]

The real question on salvage and fencing is "is it worth the time".  In a more streetwise campaign maybe, in high power campaigns probably not.  Anything with a wireless presence requires hours of work per item to change the ownership.  And then you can spend days or weeks finding your own buyer, or you can sell it to a fixer for a tiny fraction of the street value.  If its a cyberdeck or a Thunderstruck rifle its probably worth the time.  If its a couple of basic pistols it may not be.

Also, keep in mind the looting can bring extra heat.  A corp expects people to try to steal from them.  But if on the way out of the lab you carve the cybergear out of the captured guard, snag the office furniture, and set the place on fire trying to get the vending machine in the back of the van you have committed a nearly unforgivable sin for a shadowrunner: you made it personal.  Killing a Red Samurai guard in battle is one thing, but take his sword and armor and you have a lifelong vendetta with the rest of this clan. 

Sp its sort of a balancing act.  You want to grab stuff that is worth enough to make it worth the time, but not so rare, expensive, or personal that you get chased down or tracked by trying to move it.

[Novocrane]

Something that flies under the radar somewhat regarding tag erasers - they brick devices, and their range is abysmal at 5mm. Corps have the art of filling objects with RFID tags down pat - standard, stealth, security, and tracker (stealth + security) tags. If you don't know what you're dealing with inside out (ie; knowledge skills or blueprints), then you're almost certainly looking at a choice between damaging whatever you stole vs not getting all the tags. You can mitigate that with a radio signal scanner, which will help find any tag that is currently turned on, but it's not particularly difficult to set tags to shutdown with a random reboot timer and ping every few days / weeks / months. Even blueprints can contain factual errors, in order to catch out thieves, reverse engineering in rival corps, etc. (IIRC, cartographers do this fairly regularly with minor details)

The short of it is that, 99% of the time, you should be stealing stuff you're prepared to steal.