[kyoto kid]

...so I have to spend an extra initiation? Wow that's really expensive on top of paying 20 Karma for The Magician's Way just to be able to use other metamagics. Makes playing a mystic adept pretty worthless if she doesn't have physical combat skills (the character is a Social Adept with primarily Illusion and Manipulation spells). 

So for example at grade 4, the character would only have Masking and Cleansing, instead of the two metamagics and two extra power points  because two grades need to be used on the Art first.

[Chummer 5 is Alive]

No? When using Street Grimoire's initiation rules, you first initiate into an Art, and/or take a metamagic from any other Arts you've already initiated into. If you don't like taking that step, enable the Houserule 'Ignore Art Requirements'.

[kyoto kid]

...so if you take the art through the SG, you also have the metamagic?  A bit confused here

[Chummer 5 is Alive]

Okay, so I'm a mage. I want to be able to Quicken my spells, so I choose to Initiate into the Defensive Art of Quickening.
I click the Add Initiate Grade button, and am now Initiate Grade 1.
I then right-click on the Initiate Grade and click Add Art, selecting the Quickening Art from the list.
I can then right-click again and select Add Metamagic, where Quickening is listed.
That's all the Metamagics I'm allowed to add for this Initiate Grade, so we're done for now.

For my next Initiation, I decide I want Anchoring. I add an initiate grade and because I'm already initiated into the Quickening Art, I just click Add Metamagic and find Anchoring in the list. If I instead wanted to get to know rocks more intimately, I could initiate into the Geomancy Art instead and start the process over again.

[kyoto kid]

...ahh I see how that works.  So it give you a second click but doesn't require a second initiation.  Wasn't as clear as that when I read the SG rules.

[kyoto kid]

...OK hate being something of a a pest but I read another thread which debated whether Mystic adepts can simply choose an art and then metamagic without having to dump 20 karma into taking Magician's Way.  The consensus seemed split down the middle.

So I did a test with a backup of my MA character who didn't have the Magician's Way quality, initiated, selected the Centering Art, then the Centering Metamagic and Chummer allowed it.  So this makes me wonder is the quality a prerequisite or not or is this a glitch in the programme?

[Chummer 5 is Alive]

Depends on what you'd call a glitch, I suppose. As far as Chummer is concerned, you have the adeptenabled and magicianenabled flags, so you get both. HIstorically there's never been a need for fine-grain control over the difference between a magician and mystic adept. Magician's Way is the only RAW indication that that shouldn't be the case.

[kyoto kid]

....so you are saying the mystic Adept really does not need that particular  Way in order to take a non adept art/metamagic. To me it also makes perfect sense.

As my character has a number of area affect spells one of the Arts/metamagics she needs is Spell Shaping.  Also would like to get Cleansing to deal with BGC as this is a Missions character in Chicago

Oh and for the test I did make sure the Houserule box was not checked.

[The Wyrm Ouroboros]

He's saying that Chummer5 doesn't bother to track that.  Going by RAW, however, until you take a Way you are considered as on the 'Undecided Way' (which is no real way at all) and only receive access to those Rituals (Attune (Animal or Item), Empower, Imbue) and Metamagics (Adept Centering, Efficient Ritual, Flexible Signature, Flux, Infusion, Improved Masking, Masking, Qi Sculpt, and Power Point).  in order to gain access to other metamagics - including non-adept and/or exclusive ones - you need to follow a Way; non-adept metamagics require the Magician's Way.

Considering the 50% Power Point break on anything you want except for Improved Reflexes, this can be a massive benefit to your Adept..  With proper planning, you can gain 6 points of Adept abilities for only 3 points.  Not necessarily right out the gate, but cutting 2 down to 1, or 3 down to 1.5, can be a serious advantage ...

[kyoto kid]

...bugger, so spell shaping would be out.  20 Karma when you only have a cap of 25 is pretty steep especially when having to purchase power points with starting Karma as well.  Like I mentioned, take a Mentor Spirit and to parphrase the Soup Nazi, "no more positive qualities for you" (unless you blow a lot of Karma purchasing them after chargen at double the cost.).  Some only can only be purchased during chargen so those are lost.

Kind of kills the character concept as she relies on a number of AOE spells. Since she is not a physical combatant  Adept centring is pretty much useless (she uses spells like Fopreboding, to "soften" the oppos up Trid Phantasm to distract them, or with Mob Mind to mess with them, if she has to launch a more direct attack she uses injection syringes with the Fling spell as she has only a 1 STR),  The powers she has include severl levels of Combat Sense since she is very "aware" of her surroundings, and a few PPs in of Cool Resolve to aid her social skills (the character concept is a total "mess with your mind" one). 

[The Wyrm Ouroboros]

The key point at any conundrum in a game is 'talk to your GM'.

[kyoto kid]

...the character was built for Missions so I don't think there is any latitude from RAW allowed.

[kyoto kid]

He's saying that Chummer5 doesn't bother to track that.  Going by RAW, however, until you take a Way you are considered as on the 'Undecided Way' (which is no real way at all) and only receive access to those Rituals (Attune (Animal or Item), Empower, Imbue) and Metamagics (Adept Centering, Efficient Ritual, Flexible Signature, Flux, Infusion, Improved Masking, Masking, Qi Sculpt, and Power Point).  in order to gain access to other metamagics - including non-adept and/or exclusive ones - you need to follow a Way; non-adept metamagics require the Magician's Way.

Considering the 50% Power Point break on anything you want except for Improved Reflexes, this can be a massive benefit to your Adept..  With proper planning, you can gain 6 points of Adept abilities for only 3 points.  Not necessarily right out the gate, but cutting 2 down to 1, or 3 down to 1.5, can be a serious advantage ...

...Is there an exact page reference in either the core book or Street Grimoire where this is specifically stated as RAW?  Usually rules expansions published in supplements tend to be "optional".

[The Wyrm Ouroboros]

If the Street Grimoire is optional, i.e. 'not permitted', then all the neat metamagics in it aren't permitted either.  And for Missions, Street Grimoire in general is allowed, and the sidebared 'optional rules' are disallowed.  This is not a sidebar 'optional' rule; this is in the crunchy/hard rules section.

Unlike their physical counterparts, mystic adepts following this Way have access to all non-adept metamagic abilities for which they meet the prerequisites.

Therefore, by definition, any other adepts including non-Magician's Way mystic adepts, only have access to those metamagics found in the Undecided Way list (quoted above) and those to be found in whatever Way (if any) they take.

[kyoto kid]

...a few days ago I've started having something odd occur when I open a character.  I get a message pop up that reads:

"This character was created with the following books that are not enabled:

Unknown Book ()

This may cause issues. Do you want to continue loading the character.?"

Now this happens when I open a character that originally was created in an older version of Chummer (which I have done with this same particular character file several times) and never received this message until this past Tuesday.  Not sure why this suddenly is popping up as all the books selected in the older version are also selected in  the new one.

I no longer can open it in the old Version (.178) as it has been updated in .182 and thus kicks up an "Unhandled exception" error in the older release.

Using ver .182 which has been very stable.