[elrikthebastard]

Thanks guys,

I have finally read the Technomancer details a bit more clearly (Not drunk and late at night) and I see why he wanted the bioware to up his Logic and Memory.

I am way behind the rules so playing catchup. I appreciate your help in this.

[Namikaze]

Yeah, the bioware is really helpful.  Unfortunately, the story just needs work.  I think a response of "just willing to see what you'll allow" is kind of ... worrisome.  A player that is pushing boundaries simply for the sake of pushing them might become troublesome later.

[elrikthebastard]

Hey Namikaze

Yup, I am getting to him. He was more snide then usual at our Sunday Game and challenged my Game Idea at a local grocery store. He just about jumped out of his seat at me when I dared challenge his idea of how a Technomancer connected to external data devices.

Do they discuss the Technomancers Aura in the game at all? Do we just presume it is normal... can't see why it would be normal, but that is just me.

The original story so far in summery... (the one I have veto'ed)
Raised in a Rich Tir Family. Family only loved their Mages. He never awoke but he has an uncanny talent for tech and hung out with the House Security Rigger and Decker. As he got older and did not "Awaken" his Family became less interested in him. There was muck and muck here and there. Eventually he steals some of the Family money and has some Bioware installed (SynapticL3/MnemonicL3) then ran away. Eventually he ends up with the wrong crowd, gets caught in some botched robbery and gets Criminal SIN. While in prison he awakens to his Technomancer, and with the help of a Spirit Mentor he gets some help and protection. At this point he is on the street.

Most of the story I didn't have issue with, but the Bioware was a no go. That is pretty much when he started to get angry at me. Obviously I have found his buttons, and have sharpened my nails.

I already have a huge issue with his gaming methodology. I don't think it is going to get better. But I am going to start having fun instead of getting angry at him. It's crazy, he has cased to much damage, that people will not even talk about it. I have only seen that a few times in my long life.

Sorry to rant.

Thanks

E

[martinchaen]

If you're using standard character generation rules, he can't get Synaptic Boosters OR Mnemonic Enhancer at Rating 3, as both have an availability greater than 12 (3*5=15 and 3*6=18R, respectively).

It's not a problem cash-wise, as it's "only" 27k + 285k, respectively. However, if he's a technomancer he's severely limiting himself in some other fashion as Resources generally ends up fairly low down on a Technomancers priorities list due to other more important aspects (Attributes, Skills, Metatype (if he wants any Edge), and, most importantly Resonance, are all "more" important than cash for most players).

I'd challenge him to post his build here on the forum if he's active, or for you to do so if you're comfortable doing it. That way we can provide a critique of the character concept and how it relates to mechanics rather than the player (though my impression of both is not good right now).

PS:
Don't worry about ranting; that's what we're here for!

[elrikthebastard]

When I get the character I will ask Matinchaen. =-)

[Namikaze]

Do they discuss the Technomancers Aura in the game at all? Do we just presume it is normal... can't see why it would be normal, but that is just me.

A technomancer can be assensed with 5 successes on the assensing test.

The original story so far in summery... (the one I have veto'ed)
Raised in a Rich Tir Family. Family only loved their Mages. He never awoke but he has an uncanny talent for tech and hung out with the House Security Rigger and Decker. As he got older and did not "Awaken" his Family became less interested in him. There was muck and muck here and there. Eventually he steals some of the Family money and has some Bioware installed (SynapticL3/MnemonicL3) then ran away. Eventually he ends up with the wrong crowd, gets caught in some botched robbery and gets Criminal SIN. While in prison he awakens to his Technomancer, and with the help of a Spirit Mentor he gets some help and protection. At this point he is on the street.

That story is okay up to a point.  That point is where he steals family money and buys a bunch of bioware.  Sure, he buys it and installs it prior to his emergence, but it just sounds like justification for munchkin behavior.  If you wanted to let it in, though, you could just have his family hunt him down for the money he stole.  Since they're rich, they can possibly even send some Tir Paladins (or ex-Paladins, more likely) after him.  That should teach him a thing or two.

Sorry to rant.

Ranting is part of the reason for the GM lounge section of the boards. 

[emsquared]

I generally don't like to weigh in on races in which I don't have a dog entered, but this is something special. Don't give an inch to this guy, you do and he will likely challenge your authority any and every time you GM and have to make a call. Which not only can ruin your experience, but the entire tables, real quick.

Everyone else plays by the rules (of chargen), why can't/shouldn't he? He can have any cobbled together, nonsensical story he wants IF it fits within the not at all restrictive confines of the chargen mechanics. No free ware, no houseruled paragon (unless you make/clear it), there's no reason at all why he can't do this story using the actual rules other than (it sounds like) he's a selfish twat that wants to get some stuff for free and to prove to himself he's the best.

Sorry, osyran, it sounds like you know this guy, maybe he's your friend? Tell your friend he's being a twat.

Stories like these that make me sooo grateful to have the group I do. Biggest trouble we've ever had is disagreements over using the High Fantasy point buy instead of Epic.

[elrikthebastard]

Thanks for coming over Emsquared.

There is a swatch of damage this individual has caused and I am just getting into it. Osyran has had to deal with the player longer then I have, and as much as I like him, the Munckin in question is a RPG menace. A fair bit of me is speaking in frustration. This player has single handedly destroyed two groups in his tenure as Munchkin. Osyran tries very hard to not speak badly of people, but you can see the stress when he smokes =-)

[Critias]

Just a heads up, but are you sure he's not asking for a Cerebral Booster and a Mnemonic Enhancer?  Synaptic Booster is the reaction enhancer/initiative booster (and is also .5 Essence per level, which is pure murder on the Magic/Resonance for those who care about that sort of thing).  Cerebral Booster [3] and Mnemonic Enhancer [3], conversely, would give him a +3 to Logic and +3 dice on memory related tests (which he would no doubt insist was pretty much everything), while still sneaking in at 0.9 Essence.

Either way, though, the answer is to just say "No, you don't get free stuff for cooking up a backstory.  A backstory is how you justify to yourself and the GM to have the stuff you pay for, like normal, during character generation.  Yes, your Tir-centric backstory is fine for justifying the purchase of some Bioware.  But if you want to buy the Bioware, you follow the rules for buying Bioware, assign the right Resources, and stick within the Availability limits of the campaign."  He can buy them at up to rating 2 like everyone else (limited by Avail), and he can figure out how to shuffle points and pony up the cash for them like everyone else, too. 

Also, I would explain to him that Paragons don't really exist in 5E yet, so if he wants to he can squat on some karma until they come out (but that no, he can't just neatly port over one from 4E to 5E).   

And shame on him for trying to use the Tir to weasel into this many free points.

[elrikthebastard]

Critias, he did ask for the Cerebral Boost and I said no. LOL

Predictable is predictable.

Thanks!

[Mara]

Eh..I could see Cerebral Booster on a Technomancer. It is actually a fairly good choice if they
are able to squeeze the funds out.

No, the problem is the guy bad mouthing your game concept at a grocery store? Coming close
to jumping across the table because you, as the GM, who has the job to set the consistent world
view, disagreed with him on how something worked? Is trying to bully you into porting something
over from the previous edition that doesn't even work with the current edition? Sorry..but, there is
a point where you might want to politely ask the group: "Do we really need this guy?"

[Namikaze]

I've come to that point with two players in the past.  One of them was asked politely to simply stop playing with us.  He agreed, since he realized that we were just disagreeing too much.  We're still friends, but we don't game together anymore (much to our communal loss, as he's actually quite a good player when he's not being a munchkin).  The second player has been talked with, and it was determined his problem stems from some old groups that didn't take the game very seriously, and only played Shadowrun as an in-between game while waiting for something more Pathfinder-y to happen.  The second player has been making large strides in realizing the effect he has on the game is much greater than he realized, and he's starting to become a very valuable player and the rest of the group is really helping to pull him along.  Still, we're not averse to finding a replacement for him.

My point is that the best way to handle this is to sit him/her down face-to-face and just talk it out.  If this person is even remotely mature, he/she'll either toe the line or get out of the way.  If they can't do that, then kick them out.  Don't be afraid to say it just like that.  "I'm sorry, but you are disruptive to the group and I will not run a game while you are acting this way."  Stand your ground, like a parent with an angry toddler, and you'll come away looking like the better man, hopefully earning the respect and admiration of the rest of your group while also putting this troublemaker in his/her place.

[Critias]

Critias, he did ask for the Cerebral Boost and I said no. LOL

Predictable is predictable.

Thanks!

It went from Cerebral to Synaptic in a post upthread, I was just trying to keep track. 

But yeah...this is totally a player expectation/communication issue (as is so often the case in gaming, for whatever reasons).  You need to just have a talk with him about campaign goals and expectations, explain that no one else is getting to bust the character generation rules wide open for funsies, tell him you're glad he's got a backstory and is engaged with the character but that a backstory isn't there to let you start leaps and bounds ahead of other characters, blah blah blah all that sort of thing.

[elrikthebastard]

@Mara
You are correct. And I don't think we need this guy. He has agitated osyran enough to drop his remaining few game sessions in favour of me tormenting the Munchkin. osyran your a Jerk!

@Namikaze
As far as I am concerned this is his last chance at my table. This coming Sunday is the discuss the view of the game, make the final characters, review said characters and basically set my Authority. I am all about hearing the issue with a rule, but the moment you freak out at the table I am done, and the player can leave. My Issue is I am gaming at Osyran's place. So I need his help.

@Critias
I ran a youth RPG club and have three kids. I have a plan of action =-)

Thank you everyone!!

[osyran]

...You are correct. And I don't think we need this guy. He has agitated osyran enough to drop his remaining few game sessions in favour of me tormenting the Munchkin. osyran your a Jerk!

Yeah, I know...um...sorry? 

...My Issue is I am gaming at Osyran's place. So I need his help...

We'll addendum the table rules contract we posted when we started and sign it in blood.

I stopped the last game when I realized that his character WILL result in the deaths of the remaining party members and he'd walk free. I couldn't challenge him even if I tried. Game is over now, so I'm glad to get back to the basics. Shadowrun is my favorite game, and I was so inexperienced as a gamemaster I was unable to deal with that; short of using GM ability to kill the entire cosmos, that is. I had a 2 year sabbatical, since players left the last game pissed at the ADHD kid that was in the group at the time (few people know how to deal with that, so they ran - one of which I will personally beat to an inch of his life if he every comes to my home because of how he treated that kid). That kid (adult now) is back and medicated (mostly), and is actually a pleasant player (most of the time) to have in the group, so I will always invite him. He too, knows the rules, but doesn't know the games enough to become a 'problem' player (character).

We are all friends, so I hope we can get this down to a playable and fun game. I agree that a back story shouldn't provide more than we have been given (following character creation rules to the letter). If anything, he could have had it, then it was stripped from him (no essence gained back) while he was in prison as the price for stealing from pappy...