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[SR5] Q's re: perceiving the matrix

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StagCutlery

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« on: <12-09-13/0700:48> »
I read all 60 pages of the Clarification FAQ... and I'm more confused about the game than when I started.

I made a technomancer and bought an Ares machine pistol with a smartlink already installed, but near as I can tell that's useless to me because a TM has no native way to establish DNI? I can buy some cyber goggles and pair the sm link to those, but doesn't that mean I'm either using the goggles or my L persona?? If I'm butchering one or more rules here, please correct me.

Next, I have a few questions about what I can see and affect in the matrix. Let's say my target has a cyberarm, a commlink, a smartgun, and I'm in VR.
Do I see this: His Persona (no comm since that's what he's using to connect), an icon for his gun, and an icon for his arm?
  • Assuming the above is true, is it possible I just see his persona and he has everything else Hidden? I can't tell from the sidebar on PG. 235 if I can search for a specific, hidden icon. Is that possible? If I can only do a general search for hidden icons, my life is going to suck if every runner I come across has his devices hidden.
  • Would I see other devices, like his MP3-playing jeans?
Is his cyberarm a device?
  • If yes, with enough Marks/Puppeteer can I make him drop his gun? I'm assuming no since there's an example of not being able to break someone's spine. I'm also assuming this means I can't make him choke himself.
  • If yes, can I brick it? What happens? Does the arm stop functioning, or does it just stop displaying AROs? I'm assuming it goes offline, but game-wise nothing else really happens. I haven't perused the cybernetics section, but I'm assuming any special things about the arm, like hidden compartments, probably wouldn't function either.
Is his gun a device? If it has an internal sm link, is it still one device? I'm assuming the gun is a device because firearms have a wireless entry in the book.
  • With enough Marks/Puppeteer can I make the gun fire? Can I engage the safety? Can I switch its firing mode? There's an example to eject the clip, but I'm not certain how much control I can exert.
  • Can I do the above to any firearm, or only firearms that are sm linked?


Next, I need help perceiving grids.
Say I want to infiltrate an Ares building. I can't imagine it's connected to the matrix; I can't hack the electronic locks in the Pentagon from my home in 2013, so I can't see why that'd be an option in 2075. I'm certain there's an Ares grid though, and unless I'm an Ares employee, I'm certain I don't have access to it.
  • Would this building be a Host on the Ares grid, or would this building be an Ares grid?
  • Assuming that a building is not its own grid, is the Ares grid global? Would all the Ares buildings appear as hosts on this grid?

Any help would be greatly appreciated. I did some searching, like the TM and DNI thread, but wasn't getting far. I didn't understand the matrix in 2nd (my friend had an excel sheet just for runs), understood it in 3rd, kind of understood it in 4th, got really excited for 5th and marking and CFs feeling like spells and not programs you build off the cuff, but now I'm not sure.

Thanks.

Michael Chandra

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« Reply #1 on: <12-09-13/0702:04> »
The cyberarm is a device, but any runner will run with wireless off on cyberware that has no wireless bonus.
How am I not part of the forum?? O_O I am both active and angry!

StagCutlery

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« Reply #2 on: <12-09-13/0841:51> »
The cyberarm is a device, but any runner will run with wireless off on cyberware that has no wireless bonus.
That makes sense.

FenrisFrost

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« Reply #3 on: <12-09-13/1140:09> »
Next, I need help perceiving grids.
Say I want to infiltrate an Ares building. I can't imagine it's connected to the matrix; I can't hack the electronic locks in the Pentagon from my home in 2013, so I can't see why that'd be an option in 2075. I'm certain there's an Ares grid though, and unless I'm an Ares employee, I'm certain I don't have access to it.
  • Would this building be a Host on the Ares grid, or would this building be an Ares grid?
  • Assuming that a building is not its own grid, is the Ares grid global? Would all the Ares buildings appear as hosts on this grid?

Any help would be greatly appreciated. I did some searching, like the TM and DNI thread, but wasn't getting far. I didn't understand the matrix in 2nd (my friend had an excel sheet just for runs), understood it in 3rd, kind of understood it in 4th, got really excited for 5th and marking and CFs feeling like spells and not programs you build off the cuff, but now I'm not sure.

Thanks.
My understanding of this part of your post is that ostensibly the Ares grid would be connected to the Matrix. You can access any grid from anywhere explicitly, but suffer a slight negative modifier for working across grids. The building is not a grid, but likely is a host on the Ares grid.

In much the same way, you totally CAN get into and hack the Pentagon's computers from the outside world, as they are almost surely physically able to communicate with the internet at large, there is just a series of gateways you would need to get through first once you get into the Pentagon's network. But you can definitely reach it from the outside, or at least the equivalent of it's "host" and "grid."

It is important not to think of the wireless hacking-friendly Matrix as analogous to anything we have today, but if you have to, think of it like this:

The Matrix is a vast web of interconnected Grids which themselves have many Hosts connected, each of which house Personas and Icons.
The Internet is a vast web of interconnected ISP Networks which themselves have many Local Networks connected, each of which houses users' computers and other personal devices.

Matrix = Internet
Grid = ISP's WAN
Host = Local Network
Personas = Users, using account credentials on a Local Network PC
Icons = Individual machines

Xenon

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« Reply #4 on: <12-09-13/1234:42> »
Just note that PANS (and devices in WANS also for that matter) are not longer single point of entry networks where you first have to breach a firewall or a router -and then access each node within the network (it was this way in SR4).

In SR5 you access each device individually.

Think blue tooth.
...But with more than 10m range.
In fact unlimited range (since all devices route the traffic for all other devices that route the traffic for all other devices...)

You access each individual device directly (without first hacking the commlink or host)
- even if they are part of a PAN or a WAN
(just that each individual device might have hardened firewalls if they are part of a PAN or a WAN).

Xenon

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« Reply #5 on: <12-09-13/1519:53> »
I made a technomancer and bought an Ares machine pistol with a smartlink already installed, but near as I can tell that's useless to me because a TM has no native way to establish DNI?
To use a smartgun you need a smartlink.
The smartlink take up capacity in an imaging device (such as a pair of goggles).
You can access the smartgun features if run a cable from your smartgun to your imaging device

You get reduced penalty from wind by one level, camera to shoot around cover without exposing yourself and increasing accuracy by two.
If you use wireless from your smartgun to your imaging device instead of a cable you also get a positive dice pool modifier of 1 dice.

The things you will miss out on because you don't have a data jack or trodes include 1 more positive dice pool modifier for wireless. And depending on your reading you must use a simple action to eject clip and change fire mode instead of a free [mental] action... and you can not fire the weapon without touching the trigger by using a mental command (but you can probably fire it with an ARO).

You don't use a persona for this (there is no need for a commlink... or a sim-module).

...Let's say my target has a cyberarm, a commlink, a smartgun, and I'm in VR.
...Would I see other devices, like his MP3-playing jeans?
Default setting you see the design of his Persona and his PAN
- and if his smartgun is not running silent then it will stick out as a dangerous Icon.
You can choose to see all his icons- that will be lots of icons.
(every single non-protected music album he got on his commlink will be a file icon of its own...)

...if I can search for a specific, hidden icon. Is that possible?
If I can only do a general search for hidden icons, my life is going to suck if every runner I come across has his devices hidden.
There are some debate on this topic and rules can be read either way

I choose to make this interpretation of the rules as they are written:
To spot an hidden icon you first have to have an idea that there is is one in the first place.
If his smartgun is running in silent mode then you would not see the smartgun by default.
You could run a matrix perception test to locate all hidden icons within the PAN, but that might or might not render you a list of quite a few icons...
If you have more information of the hidden icon your are looking for then you can ask a more precise question and get better results.

If you for example see your target in the meat world and see that he got an Ingram Smartgun with no cable attached to his smartgoggles but at the same time you don't see any smartgun icon from your augmented reality overlay... then you can take a matrix perception test to look for a wireless ingram smartgun icon on your target. Either you will find it or you will not find it (because you failed to locate it or because it is wireless OFF instead of running silent).

Is his cyberarm a device?
Yes, but cyberarms does not have a wireless bonus so odds are he have it wireless OFF and you will not see an icon for it in VR.
If you see your target in meat world you might see that he got a cybernetic arm but no corresponding device icon in AR.
You can try to locate the device icon, but if it is wireless OFF instead of running silent then you will never find one.

If yes, can I brick it? What happens?
If you attack it and don't manage to brick it in one data spike then your target will turn off wireless on his next action (or at the very least go full matrix defense). A cyberarm does not have any wireless bonus or function; it will function just fine with wireless OFF (odds are it will be wireless OFF to begin with). If you brick it then it will stop working until at least one point of matrix damage is repaired. The owner will probably not be too happy about it and he will probably come looking for you with his Ingram Smartgun (wireless OFF this time) in his left hand....

Is his gun a device?
It is.
If it have an internal smartgun then the smartgun system and the firearm is the same icon.

With enough Marks/Puppeteer can I make the gun fire? Can I engage the safety? Can I switch its firing mode? There's an example to eject the clip, but I'm not certain how much control I can exert.
Yes you can fire the gun.
Unclear on the safety.
Yes you can switch fire mode.
Yes you can eject clip.
(all three are DNI wireless action bonus or mentioned as a smartgun feature (p.433) so you will at least have access to them)

Can I do the above to any firearm
Unclear if you can fire the gun.
Unclear on the safety
Yes you can switch fire mode.
Yes you can eject clip.
(both are DNI wireless action bonus for firearm (p.424) so you will at least have access to them)
« Last Edit: <12-09-13/1540:35> by Xenon »

Xenon

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« Reply #6 on: <12-09-13/1531:00> »
Next, I need help perceiving grids.
Say I want to infiltrate an Ares building. I can't imagine it's connected to the matrix;
Sure it is.
There might be some super duper secret tech labs that are not connected (or maybe rather a few underground floors that are sealed off the rest of the matrix) but you will find almost all of Ares buildings on the Ares Global Grid.

Would this building be a Host on the Ares grid, or would this building be an Ares grid?
Devices in the building will be on the Ares Global Grid.
They might or might not be slaved to a host for better protection.

Physical device Icons are always located on the Grid.
They might be slaved to a host (part of a WAN), but they are still located on the Grid.

Would all the Ares buildings appear as hosts on this grid?
Some devices in some of Ares buildings will be part of a WAN.
All devices in all of Ares buildings does not have to be part of a WAN.

You can either access a device on the Grid, by attaching a physical cable to it for direct access or by hacking into the Host it is slaved to for direct access.
If you have direct access you don't have to fight Host ratings when attacking the device.
« Last Edit: <12-09-13/1546:09> by Xenon »

StagCutlery

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« Reply #7 on: <12-09-13/1639:09> »
God, I long for a node. :-)
I get this feeling that they had a checklist of things they wanted to change from 4th to 5th, but didn't take anything else in to account. Like this edition looked far superior when I read it, but now I'm running into problems when I try to apply it.

Thanks for the replies, it helps me a lot. I don't feel as awesome as I thought I'd be as a TM, but I'm getting a better handle on things.

In keeping with my grid example, my Stun Monitor is precious to me, so I'd try and acquire a CorpSIN before tackling the Renraku grid.