[Dinendae]

that said, my chars that take the Automatics skill use MP's 95% of the time. if the situation is really grim, they bring out an SMG. haven't found a situation where i was glad of an AR as yet, i prefer concealability and a large clip size over raw stopping power most of the time

The beauty of ARs comes in at damage, and more importantly, range. You can start reaching out and touching the bad guys a lot farther with an AR than either MPs or SMGs. Not generally an issue in heavy urban environments, but I can assure you that you will be glad to have the range if you get caught out in one of the more wide open areas.

[MadBear]

that said, my chars that take the Automatics skill use MP's 95% of the time. if the situation is really grim, they bring out an SMG. haven't found a situation where i was glad of an AR as yet, i prefer concealability and a large clip size over raw stopping power most of the time

The beauty of ARs comes in at damage, and more importantly, range. You can start reaching out and touching the bad guys a lot farther with an AR than either MPs or SMGs. Not generally an issue in heavy urban environments, but I can assure you that you will be glad to have the range if you get caught out in one of the more wide open areas.

Yes, but good luck walking around downtown with an AR. A MP, and in the right situations a well concealed SMG, are easy to conceal, and make a better 'walkin around' weapon. A good GM will make you life a living hell for trying to openly carry around an AR, and especially a LMG, even in a Pink Mohawk game. Don't get me wrong, having a good AR stashed away for runs in the Z-zone is always a good idea...

[martinchaen]

I refute the "a good GM will" call, because there are as many personal variances on setting as there are GMs...

Sure, walking around downtown Seattle with an AR on your back is very likely to attract attention in most people's view of the setting, but that does not mean all. Nor does it mean that walking around with an AR on your back in Snohomish is going to be a problem. I'd encourage everyone to do away with the "a good GM will" arguments, because there's no such thing as an objective grading scale for what a GM should and should not to, only what makes the game fun for the group...

In one of my games, my character carries an Assault Cannon on the streets of Redmond (and quite possibly the outlaying areas). Sure, he probably won't be doing that if and when we get to Downtown Seattle, but I'd like to see anyone calling our GM "not good" for allowing that particular behaviour, and this game has gone from one end of the subtlety scale to the other from session to session.

[Dinendae]

Yes, but good luck walking around downtown with an AR. A MP, and in the right situations a well concealed SMG, are easy to conceal, and make a better 'walkin around' weapon. A good GM will make you life a living hell for trying to openly carry around an AR, and especially a LMG, even in a Pink Mohawk game. Don't get me wrong, having a good AR stashed away for runs in the Z-zone is always a good idea...

I never said that they would be useful in every situation, just that there is a use for them (beyond higher damage ratings) when you are being attacked at range. In the middle of downtown, that situation doesn't apply; all the buildings and other obstructions reduce any range advantage you might have had. In the more open areas of the Barrens though? That's where the range advantage will shine; you can drop your enemy long before they can get into the effective range of a SMG or MP.

[Sichr]

Which is why I think it's a bad move to declare mounted weapons all have 250 rounds available. Without that, even a heavily-modded AR still only has 200 rounds available, while the LMG has 250 without trying and can get ammo-bins for 500 or even more rounds. At that point it truly is the weapon it should be. Not to mention it makes it an actual decent drone-weapon, since a drone with 500 rounds doesn't need to go in for a reload as often as one with only 40 rounds pre-mods.

Srsly...how many times you have used 250 rounds on the run?

[CanRay]

Srsly...how many times you have used 250 rounds on the run?

*Cough*

Then again, I'm the GM.

I'm always the GM.   

[Sichr]

Well, I think it is doable. If your Lagos based team is hired by UN to extract at least some of those inspectors from Assamondo, you may find even 500 ex-ex rounds in every gun your team has at its disposal is not enought...

[Michael Chandra]

If your drone is operating separately and is providing cover fire, it's quite easy to run through 500 rounds in bad circumstances.

[Sichr]

Well its about 25 combat turns of suppressive fire. That means main battle, not the firefight during standard mission But I know, that from time to time, there are situations that call for this...

[Michael Chandra]

Not just a single fight, you may spend quite a bit of time without being able to reload the drone.

[Reaver]

In a contest of Player Will Vs Tactically Smart. ... Player Will usually wins :-)
I have had games where the players literally turn to each other and go "you know, the really smart thing to do here is run, right?" And the other go "Yea, but you heard what he said... no one says tgat about Moma and lives!!"


It is at these times that ammo count and "right tools for the right job" comes into play... and it is not always about the highest level of damage...

[MadBear]

I refute the "a good GM will" call, because there are as many personal variances on setting as there are GMs...

Sure, walking around downtown Seattle with an AR on your back is very likely to attract attention in most people's view of the setting, but that does not mean all. Nor does it mean that walking around with an AR on your back in Snohomish is going to be a problem. I'd encourage everyone to do away with the "a good GM will" arguments, because there's no such thing as an objective grading scale for what a GM should and should not to, only what makes the game fun for the group...

You are correct, I misspoke.

[KarmaInferno]

In SR4 it was possible to camo cloak your AR or LMG. A lot of times passerby did not have high enough perception to see the cloaked weapon, and if they did it was a blurry shape, not "hey, that's a gun".


-k

[Sichr]

Even chameleon coating is an option

[MadBear]

Now that Narrow Bursts to increase damage are gone, LMGs aren't nearly as useful, IMHO, other than as cover fire and intimidation. Sure, an Ares Alpha might do more damage/bullet, but staring down the barrel of an Ingram Valiant can be pretty damn frightening. Of course, they were a LOT more intimidating when you knew they could fire a Narrow Long burst for +5DV...
I'm still not sure why the designers eliminated Narrow Bursts. And I don't buy the whole simplifying the game argument considering how relatively complicated they made shot guns. Increasing damage with bursts has been part of the game from the start, and I for one miss it. I liked Narrow Bursts; but then, I also kinda miss staging up 6M to 9S, and I even sometimes miss 7M2 damage...