NEWS

GM: So...I had this submitted to me...

  • 38 Replies
  • 10256 Views

Caimbuel

  • *
  • Newb
  • *
  • Posts: 20
« on: <02-19-13/0812:23> »
I am a new GM to Shadowrun, and have been running a game since November, now I am not 110% versed on the rules yet but I like to think I am not an idiot. So I decided to pass the reigns to one of the players, to take over the game and run his own, runs. Now he isnt the player I am referring to here, this new GM asked if people wanted to keep playing their old characters or run new ones fresh from character creation. The player I am referring to that submitted the following character should be aware of character creation rules as I know hes read them.

This is pretty much exactly as he did it in Chummer, which does the map for you... Was he thinking we wouldnt check or notice? I just... I dont know.. Oh also half the cyberware is Alpha/betaware... all told 770,000 + Nuyen for JUST the cyberware/bioware


[spoiler]== Info ==
Street Name:
Name: Unnamed Character
Movement: 10/25, Swim: 5
Karma: 0
Street Cred: 0
Notoriety: 1
Public Awareness: 0
Human
Composure: 8
Judge Intentions: 9
Lift/Carry: 8 (60 kg/40 kg)
Memory: 7
Nuyen: 0

== Attributes ==
BOD: 4
AGI: 5 (7)
REA: 4 (7)
STR: 2 (4)
CHA: 5
INT: 4
LOG: 4
WIL: 3
EDG: 5

== Derived Attributes ==
Essence:                   0.835
Initiative:                8 (11)
IP:                        1 (4)
Matrix Initiative:         5
Matrix IP:                 1
Physical Damage Track:     11
Stun Damage Track:         10

== Active Skills ==
Aeronautics Mechanic       : 2                      Pool: 6
Animal Handling            : 0                      Pool: 3
Animal Training            : 0                      Pool: 3
Archery                    : 0                      Pool: 6
Armorer                    : 2                      Pool: 6
Artisan                    : 0                      Pool: 3
Automatics                 : 6                      Pool: 13
Automotive Mechanic        : 2                      Pool: 6
Blades                     : 1                      Pool: 8
Climbing                   : 1                      Pool: 7
Clubs                      : 1                      Pool: 8
Computer                   : 1                      Pool: 5
Con                        : 1                      Pool: 10
Cybercombat                : 1                      Pool: 5
Data Search                : 1                      Pool: 5
Demolitions                : 1                      Pool: 5
Disguise                   : 2                      Pool: 6
Diving                     : 0                      Pool: 3
Dodge                      : 1                      Pool: 8
Electronic Warfare         : 1                      Pool: 5
Escape Artist              : 1                      Pool: 8
Etiquette                  : 1                      Pool: 10
First Aid                  : 1                      Pool: 5
Flight                     : 1                      Pool: 7
Forgery                    : 0                      Pool: 6
Gunnery                    : 1                      Pool: 8
Gymnastics                 : 1                      Pool: 10
Hacking                    : 1                      Pool: 5
Hardware                   : 1                      Pool: 5
Heavy Weapons              : 0                      Pool: 6
Industrial Mechanic        : 2                      Pool: 6
Infiltration               : 2                      Pool: 9
Instruction                : 0                      Pool: 4
Intimidation               : 0                      Pool: 4
Leadership                 : 1                      Pool: 10
Locksmith                  : 1                      Pool: 8
Longarms                   : 3                      Pool: 10
Nautical Mechanic          : 2                      Pool: 6
Navigation                 : 1                      Pool: 5
Negotiation                : 1                      Pool: 10
Palming                    : 2                      Pool: 9
Parachuting                : 0                      Pool: 3
Perception                 : 4                      Pool: 8
Pilot Aircraft             : 1                      Pool: 8
Pilot Ground Craft         : 1                      Pool: 8
Pilot Watercraft           : 1                      Pool: 8
Pistols                    : 3                      Pool: 10
Riding                     : 0                      Pool: 6
Running                    : 1                      Pool: 7
Shadowing                  : 2                      Pool: 6
Software                   : 1                      Pool: 5
Survival                   : 1                      Pool: 4
Swimming                   : 1                      Pool: 7
Throwing Weapons           : 2                      Pool: 9
Tracking                   : 1                      Pool: 5
Unarmed Combat             : 1                      Pool: 8

== Knowledge Skills ==
Area Knowledge: LA         : 2                      Pool: 6
Area Knowledge: Seattle    : 2                      Pool: 6
Combat Tactics             : 3                      Pool: 7
English                    : 2                      Pool: 6
Firearms                   : 2                      Pool: 6
Military                   : 2                      Pool: 6
Music                      : 1                      Pool: 5
Or'zet                     : 2                      Pool: 6
security companies         : 2                      Pool: 6
security tactics           : 2                      Pool: 6
Spanish                    : 2                      Pool: 6
underworld                 : 2                      Pool: 6

== Contacts ==
Enemy (4, 2)
Fixer (4, 5)
Mechanic (3, 3)

== Qualities ==
Common Sense
Photographic Memory
Poor Self Control (Compulsive - Low Danger) (Tidy)
Records on File (Merc Company)
SINner (Standard) (UCAS)

== Lifestyles ==
RV Bison  1 months
   Comforts:      Low
   Entertainment: Middle
   Necessities:   Middle
   Neighborhood:  Squatter
   Security:      Middle
   Qualities:     Alternate Energy [1LP]
                  Rad Pad [1LP]
                  Stocked Up [1LP]
                  Workplace [1LP]
                  Green Plan [-1LP]
                  Leaky Faucet [-2LP]
                  Loud Neighborhood [-1LP]
                  No Forwarding Address [-1LP]
                  The Building that Time Forgot [-1LP]

== Cyberware/Bioware ==
Biomonitor
Bone Lacing (Kevlar)
Commlink
Control Rig
Cyberears Rating 3
   +Ear Recording Unit
   +Sound Link
   +Damper
   +Increased Sensitivity
   +Select Sound Filter Rating 2
   +Spatial Recognizer
   +Audio Enhancement Rating 3
Cybereyes Basic System Rating 2
   +Eye Recording Unit
   +Image Link
   +Low-Light Vision
   +Smartlink
   +Thermographic Vision
   +Vision Enhancement Rating 3
   +Flare Compensation
Data Lock
Datajack
Essence Hole Rating 4
Muscle Augmentation Rating 3
Muscle Toner Rating 3
Obvious Full Arm (BOD 5, AGI 3, STR 3) (Left)
   +Scanner System Rating 4
   +Enhanced Body Rating 2
   +Shock Hand
   +Grapple Gun
Olfactory Booster Rating 3
Orthoskin Rating 3
Pain Editor
Synaptic Booster Rating 3
Synthacardium Rating 2

== Armor ==
Form-Fitting Full-Body Suit6/2
SecureTech Helmet         0/2
   +Internal Air Tank
   +Flare Compensation
   +Ultrasound
SecureTech PPP Armor (Ensemble)2/4
Victory: Globetrotter Heavy Armor Clothing4/2

== Weapons ==
Ceska vz/120
   +Guncam
   +Laser Designator Rating 3
   +Silencer
   +Smartgun System, Internal
   Pool: 12   DV: 4P   AP: -   RC: 0
Grenade: Flash-Bang
   Pool: 9   DV: 6S (10m Radius)   AP: -3   RC: 0
Grenade: Fragmentation
   Pool: 9   DV: 12P(f) (-1/m)   AP: +5   RC: 0
HK 227-X
   +Gas-Vent 2 System
   +Guncam
   +Red Dot Sight
   +Sling
   +Sound Suppressor
   +Stock
   +Underbarrel Weight
   +Flashlight, Low-Light
   +Smartgun System
   +Smartgun System
   +Sound Suppressor
   Pool: 16   DV: 5P   AP: -   RC: 4
Morrissey Alta
   +Flashlight, Low-Light
   +Guncam
   +Silencer
   +Smartgun System, Internal
   +Laser Sight
   Pool: 13   DV: 5P   AP: -1   RC: 0
Shock Hand
   Pool: 8   DV: 6S(e)   AP: -half   RC: 0
Unarmed Attack
   Pool: 8   DV: 2S   AP: -   RC: 0

== Commlink ==
Disposable Commlink (1, 2, 2, 3)
   +Renraku Ichi
   +Skinlink
   +Subvocal Microphone
Singularity Battle Buddy (6, 3, 3, 6)
   +Biometric Lock
   +Hardening Rating 5
   +Armor Case Rating 5
   +Iris Orb
   +Empathy Software Rating 4
   +Fake License (All his gear) Rating 4
   +Fake SIN (some dude) Rating 6
   +FTL Matrixware Power Suite [Analyze 3, Browse 4, Command 2, Edit 4, Purge 4, Scan 2]
   +Lie Detection Software Rating 4
   +Micro-Transceiver Rating 6
   +Tacsoft Rating 4
   +Telematics Infrastructure Rating 4
   +Virtual Person

== Gear ==
Ammo: High-Power Rounds (Submachine Guns) x60
Ammo: High-Power Rounds (Heavy Pistols) x40
Ammo: Regular Ammo (Submachine Guns) x150
Ammo: Regular Ammo (Heavy Pistols) x100
Ammo: Regular Ammo (Light Pistols) x60
Ammo: Stick-n-Shock (Submachine Guns) x90
Ammo: Stick-n-Shock (Heavy Pistols) x40
Ammo: Stick-n-Shock (Light Pistols) x30
Backpack x2
Concealable Holster x2
Flashlight
Gecko Tape Gloves
Goggles Rating 4
GPS
Grenade: Flash-Bang x2
Grenade: Fragmentation x2
Handheld Sensor
   +Cyberware Scanner Rating 3
   +Jammer, Area Rating 3
   +MAD Scanner Rating 3
   +Non-Linear Junction Detector Rating 4
   +Radio Signal Scanner Rating 6
   +Skinlink
   +Tag Eraser
   +White Noise Generator Rating 4
Lockpick Set
Medkit Rating 1
Micro Sensor
   +Atmosphere Sensor Rating 3
   +Barometric
   +Geiger Counter
   +Laser Range Finder
   +Motion Sensor
   +Skinlink
Micro Sensor
   +Radar Rating 3
   +Ultrawideband Radar Rating 1
   +Skinlink
   +Sonar, Passive Rating 1
   +Spatial Recognizer
   +Ultrasound
Nanotattoos Rating 3 x3
Plasteel Restraints
Respirator Rating 4
Sensor Tags x20
Stealth Tags x40
Stimulant Patch Rating 6 x7
Survival Kit
Tranq Patch Rating 8 x4
Trauma Patch x6

== Vehicles ==
BMW Blitzen 2050 (Combat Bike)
   +Anti-Theft
   +Armor, Concealed Rating 3
   +Complete Skinlink
   +Motorcycle Gyro Stabilization
   +Obsolescent
   +Off-Road Suspension
   +Rigger Adaptation
   +Vehicle Sensor
Ford-Canada Bison (RV)
   +Additional Fuel Tank
   +Amenities, Middle
   +Anti-Theft
   +Armor, Normal Rating 4
   +Chameleon Coating
   +Gun Port
   +Improved Economy
   +Morphing License Plate
   +Obsolete
   +Off-Road Suspension
   +Off-Road Tires Rating 6
   +Spoof Chip
   +Medical Station Rating 3
   +Tool Kit (auto)
   +Vehicle Sensor[/spoiler]

Longshot23

  • *
  • Omae
  • ***
  • Posts: 952
« Reply #1 on: <02-19-13/0840:22> »
Munchkin.

I'd suggest trying to plug this character [attempt] into HeroLabs SR and see what comes back.  Just on a read-through, there are some serious gear availability issues and under-skilling.  I'd like to think the player is testing the boundaries, but it is possible that they think this is a PC worth playing.

mtfeeney = Baron

  • *
  • Ace Runner
  • ****
  • Posts: 1389
  • I love crunchy numbers
« Reply #2 on: <02-19-13/0845:30> »
Nice commlink and synaptic booster...
Remember, you don't have to kill the vehicle to stop it, just kill the guy driving it.

The Wyrm Ouroboros

  • *
  • Prime Runner
  • *****
  • Posts: 4470
  • I Have Taken All Shadowrun To Be My Province
« Reply #3 on: <02-19-13/0848:27> »
Soooo ... what's the question?  Should you allow it?  Obviously no.  Tell him he needs to build a character with the standard rules, and that this one doesn't fit that description.
Pananagutan & End/Line

Old As McBean, Twice As Mean
"Oh, gee - it's Go-Frag-Yourself-O'Clock."
New Wyrm!! Now with Twice the Bastard!!

Laés is ... I forget. -PiXeL01
Play the game. Don't try to win it.

Caimbuel

  • *
  • Newb
  • *
  • Posts: 20
« Reply #4 on: <02-19-13/0853:41> »
Soooo ... what's the question?  Should you allow it?  Obviously no.  Tell him he needs to build a character with the standard rules, and that this one doesn't fit that description.

No question about it. I've already audited it and sent my findings to the GM taking over. its really his decision, but I highly doubt this character will pass. I just wanted to show others and get a feel for their thoughts to make sure I wasn't making an unfair judgement on it.

Shadowjack

  • *
  • Errata Team
  • Ace Runner
  • ***
  • Posts: 1061
« Reply #5 on: <02-19-13/0856:15> »
I think he probably over looked some of the character creation rules. I wouldn't be too quick to conclude he's intentionally cheating :P
Show me your wallet and I'll show you a man with 20 fingers.

Makki

  • *
  • Omae
  • ***
  • Posts: 566
« Reply #6 on: <02-19-13/0933:08> »
Soooo ... what's the question?  Should you allow it?  Obviously no.  Tell him he needs to build a character with the standard rules, and that this one doesn't fit that description.

No question about it. I've already audited it and sent my findings to the GM taking over. its really his decision, but I highly doubt this character will pass. I just wanted to show others and get a feel for their thoughts to make sure I wasn't making an unfair judgement on it.

if built with chummer, then the program itself will point out all creation "mistakes" once you click on "Mark character as creatred"

Neurosis

  • *
  • Chummer
  • **
  • Posts: 200
  • ain't no rest for the wicked
« Reply #7 on: <02-19-13/1447:48> »
Ah, I see he took the "I'll take one of EVERYTHING" approach to Cyberware/high-tech gear. : )
~"Pirates and bankrobbers, not lawyers and CEOs
Stockbrokers ain't no heroes!"~

***
Devon Oratz//CGL Freelancer
My Blog: tarotAmerican
My RPGs: endTransmission.

I_V_Saur

  • *
  • Chummer
  • **
  • Posts: 244
« Reply #8 on: <02-19-13/1716:27> »
So, it's both out of whack, and under-optimized.

I don't honestly think this player knows exactly what they're doing. Could be a bit fresh to Char gen, especially if they've never been walked through what to do and what NOT to do especially. If their last few GMs have either made their sheets, or just fixed them up without much comment, assuming he was just being a cheese, then it could legitimately be that he has no clue that he's screwing around.

The skills especially speak to inexperience. 3 says to me 'This is a skill I think I'll use two or three times, but when I do use it, I don't want to die.' while 4 says 'less important than my firearms/hacking, but I really don't want to screw this up.'. 1 and 2 say to me 'Uh, what if I need this? And this? Ooh!'

When it comes to gear, he knows how it works. It could be that he doesn't add the numbers up right.

emsquared

  • *
  • Ace Runner
  • ****
  • Posts: 1029
  • Super Perfundo
« Reply #9 on: <02-19-13/1755:55> »
Pretty funny that for all the chrome, this character still sucks - hard.

RHat

  • *
  • Prime Runner
  • *****
  • Posts: 6317
« Reply #10 on: <02-19-13/1819:08> »
And then there's the ammo he can't even use, the gun with 2 smartgun systems and a red dot sight (he can only get use of 1 of the 3), and other such problems.
"Speech"
Thoughts
Matrix <<Text>> "Speech"
Spirits and Sprites

I_V_Saur

  • *
  • Chummer
  • **
  • Posts: 244
« Reply #11 on: <02-19-13/1939:08> »
Yeah, I still don't have Cyber memorized. Didn't catch that all right away.

Guy has no clue how to make characters right - but has a very solid concept of WHO he wants to play, I'd say. Sit him aside, walk him through every step, explain the math, the pros and cons, the restrictions, etc. Time consuming, but I do it for all of my players who aren't familiar with the system of the week. Means that you can vet decisions before they even become an issue, and even leave a 'pocket' of BP to add in a few surprises. (I've actually given two of my players Qualities that they don't know about, but dropped the hint that it could happen to any of their sheets.)

Caimbuel

  • *
  • Newb
  • *
  • Posts: 20
« Reply #12 on: <02-19-13/2028:32> »
So I had some time to go over it more in detail and i'm listing what I sent to the new GM. Now as far as I can tell this was done in Chummer, which means he had to have clicked ignore character creation rules in order for this to have been built, or perhaps he hasnt set this character to "complete" and not having spent BP on Nuyen. The other GM is letting the player know that its not flying, and that he will have to politely remake and not ignore character creation rules.

[spoiler]Character (Discrepancies)
Attributes do not add up correctly under 400 build point rules.  Max is 200 BP on stats, he spent 230 on Attributes (no real big issue, but rules are rules)
On skills: 268 build points spent, so far the total on just attributes and skills is 522 BP.
On Armor: Helmet is Availability 14, total cost 4900 for armor
On Weapons: HK227-X Red Dot Sight and Smartgun does not stack, cant use Suppressor and Silencer at the same time
Morrissey Alta cannot use Laser Sight and Smartgun together, does not stack. Total for Weapons 6865
Total spent for weapons and armor: 11,765
Cyberware/BioWare: This is where it gets outright ridiculous. Muscle Augmentation 3 (betaware) illegal, availability 15R, Muscle Toner 3 (Beta) availability 15R, Pain Editor (illegal, availability 18), Synaptic Booster 3 (Availability 18, also costs 240,000 Nuyen) meaning he spent 777,000 + nuyen on Ware ALONE.
Vehicles:  Nothing huge to note, though it cost 102,810 Nuyen for both with all listed upgrades.
Commlinks: Another 'headscratch' moment, he bought a Disposable, which is cool then decided to buy the Singularity Battle Buddy (avail 24, illegal), rating 6 Fake Sin (illegal, 18 avail), Tacsoft (illegal, avail 20) another 50,000 Nuyen on JUST the commlinks alone.
Ammo: High power rounds (illegal, 20 avail), Handheld Sensor (too many sensors by 1 on it), Micro Sensors (can only hold one thing, overloaded them with things.), Tranq patches (rating 8? 16 Avail, illegal)
Total Nuyen required at creation to build this character: 960,059 Nuyen, considering that you cannot possible spend more than 250,000 Nuyen at character creation, OR the fact that hes currently at 522 BP BEFORE using any for money. He has overspent by 710,095 (Umm, wha???)
Now, lets assume I spend the appropriate number of BP, ignoring the 50 limit on Nuyen restriction. His BP cost comes out to 715 BP. (Double Whaaa???).
Now, I thought maybe he created the character, then gave himself Karma to keep up with the party as is? (Why he did this is beyond me) but I checked and he hasn’t earned any Karma for the character nor spent any, so this is all still fresh Character Generation.
Unless you are planning to allow EVERYONE to run a 715 BP build, allowing up to 24 Availability and no restrictions on how much can be spent on stats and such, then you should tell him to remake under the rules of character creation.[/spoiler]
« Last Edit: <02-19-13/2030:16> by Caimbuel »

All4BigGuns

  • *
  • Prime Runner
  • *****
  • Posts: 7531
« Reply #13 on: <02-19-13/2034:39> »
Yeah...sounds to me like a newbie who just said "I want this, and this, and this, and this <keeps going on like that a while>".
(SR5) Homebrew Archetypes

Tangled Currents (Persistent): 33 Karma, 60,000 nuyen

RHat

  • *
  • Prime Runner
  • *****
  • Posts: 6317
« Reply #14 on: <02-19-13/2040:15> »
If he is joining an existing party, he should be given X amount of Karma and Y amount of nuyen by the GM to be at the same level.  Needing to make a new character shouldn't mean you're drastically behind everyone else.  And possibly be permitted a small number of items up to a certain availability above standard.
"Speech"
Thoughts
Matrix <<Text>> "Speech"
Spirits and Sprites

 

Register