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Adreneline pump... why?

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Angelone

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« on: <09-26-10/0833:47> »
I was looking through the bioware list and came across the adrenaline pump (SR4 pg 338), I seemed to remember it not being worthwhile to get and so I read it. All I can say is I was right, it's fairly nice statwise adding to agi, str, rea, and will, but the drawbacks don't make it worth it in my mind. The temporary duration I can get over. It's crash effect which is unresistable and the fact that it goes off so easily are what kills it for me.

Aside from kamakaze beserker types who would use this? I don't understand the draw of this piece of bioware.
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The_Gun_Nut

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« Reply #1 on: <09-26-10/0931:11> »
If you recall, Shadowrun combat tends to be over very, very quick.  The minimum duration of a rating 3 pump is 3 combat turns, with the average hovering around 10 or 11 combat turns.  Even with a rating 1 (min 1 turn, average 3~4 turns) the character will have a pretty good advantage against opponents for (essentially) the duration of combat.  And considering that the character will never suffer the penalties of Stun damage, he will never be knocked unconscious and has the best chance of escaping a terrible situation or turning a bad one to his team's favor.

Sure, he suffers the horrible headache and strain later, but who cares about later when you're alive to feel it?
There is no overkill.

Only "Open fire" and "I need to reload."

Angelone

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« Reply #2 on: <09-26-10/0946:05> »
If the stun doesn't send you into overflow and kill you just the same. My main concern with the stun is I recall stim patchs don't heal stun anymore. Am I wrong about that?
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Doc Chaos

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« Reply #3 on: <09-26-10/1105:38> »
If the stun doesn't send you into overflow and kill you just the same. My main concern with the stun is I recall stim patchs don't heal stun anymore. Am I wrong about that?

No. Stim Patches just give you temporary pain tolerance and one additional box of stun damage after their duration.
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The_Gun_Nut

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« Reply #4 on: <09-26-10/1302:14> »
Even if it pushes you into overflow, if you survived the encounter to get away to where someone can patch you up, then the pump did it's job and kept you and your team going.

Worry about consequences later, focus on the now.
There is no overkill.

Only "Open fire" and "I need to reload."

Kontact

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« Reply #5 on: <09-30-10/0150:58> »
Too expensive and too essence-intensive.
Adrenaline pumps are like cranial bombs with WaCkY ConsQuEncES!

The only reason you would have one in your head is if it was put there as punishment.

FastJack

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« Reply #6 on: <09-30-10/0754:04> »
I disagree. AS implants hve their uses as mentioned before. They aren't perfect, sure, but they are by no means detrimental to the runner.

Mäx

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« Reply #7 on: <09-30-10/0823:09> »
I disagree. AS implants hve their uses as mentioned before. They aren't perfect, sure, but they are by no means detrimental to the runner.
Your saying that possible 18S damage on top of what ever stun damage you took while it was active isn't detrimental.
I think we have very different definitions of that term, considering that amount of damage has a very real change of killing you right then and there.
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FastJack

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« Reply #8 on: <09-30-10/0857:32> »
I'm saying that it's not terrific, and has a chance of being really bad, but it is FAR from being a cranial bomb.

Prime Mover

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« Reply #9 on: <09-30-10/1015:39> »
I think it's the amount of unresisted drain that concerns people and honestly it seems excessive.  An average runner over the course of a combat in which he might need to use the gland will suffer some stun damage.  A level 3 pump activated twice on one mission suffers a minimum of 6 unresisted stun and an average of 18.  Most SR missions will leave you wounded, either your armor jack dropped damage to stun or something else took a few boxes.  So your basically for an average mission your paying 90K for suicide ware.

I think it's just a matter of common sense to lower the unresisted level of damage or allow a soak roll.
1.) 1 Unresisted box of stun per level of the pump.
2.) Resist 3S per level of pump.
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The_Gun_Nut

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« Reply #10 on: <09-30-10/1314:56> »
You mean a minimum of 3 and maximum of 18.  With an average of 10~11.
There is no overkill.

Only "Open fire" and "I need to reload."

Mäx

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« Reply #11 on: <09-30-10/1549:22> »
You mean a minimum of 3 and maximum of 18.  With an average of 10~11.
I think you missed the part about the pump activating twice.
"An it harm none, do what you will"

The_Gun_Nut

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« Reply #12 on: <09-30-10/2352:44> »
How would it activate twice in one combat?  It can't.  You have to wait an hour before it can activate again.  This precludes activating in the same combat.  Unless you are just really burning to play out 1200 combat rounds.  This gives some time to heal up between activations.

If the guy with the level 3 pump needs to ensure that the pump won't trigger again, there is a chemical that will neutralize the adrenaline release called MAO.  It will keep him from overdosing and potentially dying.  Or he can tranq himself to prevent activation in the first place.

Now, I wouldn't grab a rating 3 pump myself, but I can see those who might find it attractive.  The most I'd grab would be a rating 2.
There is no overkill.

Only "Open fire" and "I need to reload."

Critias

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« Reply #13 on: <09-30-10/2355:37> »
Unless you are just really burning to play out 1200 combat rounds. 
Sometimes there's just that many bad guys, I guess.   ;D

Kontact

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« Reply #14 on: <10-01-10/0440:48> »
How would it activate twice in one combat?  It can't.  You have to wait an hour before it can activate again.  This precludes activating in the same combat.  Unless you are just really burning to play out 1200 combat rounds.  This gives some time to heal up between activations.

He said one mission, not one combat.  You know, go to the place, whack some guys, get the info, follow the info to the mcguffin, whack some more guys, try to hand-off the mcguffin without Johnson boning you.

If the guy with the level 3 pump needs to ensure that the pump won't trigger again, there is a chemical that will neutralize the adrenaline release called MAO.  It will keep him from overdosing and potentially dying.  Or he can tranq himself to prevent activation in the first place.
There are no rules for that in SR4.  Which is one of the many reasons why you have to change the AP to make it not crap.

Now, I wouldn't grab a rating 3 pump myself, but I can see those who might find it attractive.  The most I'd grab would be a rating 2.

And that would cost you 1.5 points of Essence and a grip of cash in addition to making you take the equivalent of a gel round to the face every time you benefited from it.

Just pick up a drug habit.  It's safer, cheaper and won't cost you a shred of essence until you burn out.

Besides, the stats it increases, like agility and reaction are easy enough to hit aug max for any build who might want a pump and has money and essence to burn.  Strength too, but not too many people benefit heavily from strength.  So, basically, what you end up with is a piece of gear which hurts you in exchange for a temporary willpower boost.  Not a good look.
« Last Edit: <10-01-10/0454:13> by Kontact »