[Bluetooth]

So the bow in Arsenal does Str min +1. Now I vaguely recall seeing somewhere that somebody said the bow had been changed. Is the change or  is the some errata I need to find?

[Demerzel]

I think that is the new version. I believe they used to be directly based on strength not just like many melee weapons which led to some very ICBM-like troll archers. And now since you can't get rating greater than 6 the best bows are 8P.

[rasmusnicolaj]

Not that I think bows are weak damage weapons, they are rather slow compared to firearms, but that is kind of right too.
What I don't get, is that they have a relative low upper limit on their damage. With the technological progress in 2072 and with strange and wonderful new materials it should be possible to make a bow more effective than that.

I have tried to pull an 80 pound yew bow and that was hard and I couldn't take a steady shot. And I have used a 70 pound modern compound bow without difficulty.
So why can't the huge troll get a bow build for his size and strength??

Rasmus

[The Wyrm Ouroboros]

Material science limits high-tech bows to a maximum Strength rating of 12. The maximum Damage Value an arrow fired from the bow can inflict is equal to the bow’s rating x1.5.

IOW, trolls can.  You may not be able to get it at game start, but considering its availability (a flat 2) and cost (Rating x 100¥), you should be able to jander down to your nearest sporting-goods store and pick one up tout de suite.

Check the forums for discussion on how truly nasty bows can be -- including debates over the use of the 'multiple impact' software out of War! with it.

[rasmusnicolaj]

Thanks.
I don't know why but I had gotten into my head, that bows where caped at 8.

And true you can make grenade spam with MRSI from War.

Rasmus

[Mäx]

I don't know why but I had gotten into my head, that bows where caped at 8.

Cos they are, Wyrm has an outdated version of the book.

[The Wyrm Ouroboros]

Can you quote it for us, please, Mäx?

[NotPotato]

Quoted from SR4A (third printing) page 316

Material science limits high-tech bows to a maximum Strength rating of 8.

I guess he means this. Previous printings capped it at Strength rating 12. Damage code is still (Str Min +2)P.

That's a bit of a bummer.

[Medicineman]

German Arsenal (errattaed) Bows are limited to STR 8 so max Damage is 10K (11K with explosive Arrows)


HokaHey
Medicineman

[JustADude]

German Arsenal (errattaed) Bows are limited to STR 8 so max Damage is 10K (11K with explosive Arrows)

I still think that's a bunch of BS. They could, with modern materials and methods, build a Bow that would require Strength 8 to fire properly^*. It wouldn't be cheap, but they could do it. They just don't bother, since it would be unusable by anyone on earth. In 2070, with all the other advances in material science, there's no way in hell they couldn't do better.

That nerfed cap is nothing more than someone dumping haterade all over Troll Archers because a vocal minority got a bug up their ass and decided to bitch about it.

^*Hell, they were making cart-mounted ballista, which are just huge crossbows, that could probably do better than that centuries ago, and we've come a long way since rope and lumber.

[ArkangelWinter]

Truth is, and those if you who bow-hunt know this, a skilled archer of any strength can drop some very large, tough targets. But an average user, like your typical non-English Medieval bowmen or even your typical Native American, not so much. They're following the age old principle that one arrow will take the fight out of a guy, and he'll probably bleed to death later.

Edited a typo

[JustADude]

They're following the age old principle that one arrow will take the fight out of a guy, and he'll probably bleed to death later.

Except there's no "bleed-out" mechanic in the game. Plus, their stated reason for having a cap to begin with is the mechanical and structural limits of constructing the bows... which is the same reason they gave when the cap was 12.

Admittedly, at 10P a Str-8 Bow is, converting at the standard rate of -3AP = +1 DV, only slightly less powerful than a Barrett. However, the fact that an ICBA (Inter-City-Block-Archer) has to take 2-3 actions to fire one shot more than makes up for that in my opinion.

[Mäx]

I still think that's a bunch of BS. They could, with modern materials and methods, build a Bow that would require Strength 8 to fire properly^*. It wouldn't be cheap, but they could do it. They just don't bother, since it would be unusable by anyone on earth. In 2070, with all the other advances in material science, there's no way in hell they couldn't do better.

That nerfed cap is nothing more than someone dumping haterade all over Troll Archers because a vocal minority got a bug up their ass and decided to bitch about it.

A strengt 8 bow does same damage as a god damm assault cannon, that nerf is absolutely justified.
As bow's that do more damage then tank cannons make absolutely no sense what so ever, but yes i kinda agree that the strength limit is stupid, they should have just changed the damage code to half strength + x.

[All4BigGuns]

They're following the age old principle that one arrow will take the fight out of a guy, and he'll probably bleed to death later.

Except there's no "bleed-out" mechanic in the game.

Well, unless you reach Physical Damage Overflow. I believe you "bleed out" until you're stabilized at that point. Then again, nerf bows like that, and how likely is a bow going to put you into overflow?

[ArkangelWinter]

I was giving that as a justification for low bow damage; net hits/archer skill is where the damage really comes from if you want to represent real-world bows