[Phylos Fett]

I was flicking through the BBB (as you do) looking for something else (as you do) and I noticed the "Item Counterfeit -20% Cost Adjustment" on the Street Cost table. Does anyone use Counterfeit Gear in their game? Allow characters to buy Counterfeit Gear at a 20% cheaper price? If so, what kind of downside is there to buying this kind of gear?

As soon as I saw this, my mind went to the Aries Predator IV for 280¥, for some reason...

[CanRay]

Actually, my group ended up paying 20% more for a counterfeit microdrone crawler due to the rush in needing it, and all the instructions, and the AR feed from it, were in Chinese. 

But, yeah, if you're buying a knock-off, expect to have issues with it.  And, if it's a "decent" enough knock-off that you don't realize it is and call tech support for help:  "I'm sorry, sir, but if you had bought that item from a REPUTABLE dealer, we'd be able to support you with an ACTUAL Ares Predator IV.  Might I suggest our affiliates at Weapon World or Ares Shop-Mart for your future self-defense needs?  I do, however, wish you luck in that firefight that I can hear over the call.  But as you're an unsupported customer, I must now disconnect this chat."

[Crash_00]

I use it for clothing, art, and such but not really actual runner gear.

If I were to use it for runner gear, I'd probably either have it degrade faster or under perform what its supposed to and I wouldn't let the runner/player know how its doing unless they actual did the work in game to figure it out or it was blatantly obvious.

[Phylos Fett]

I was thinking that a 20% penalty of some sort would be a good starting place. If it was something obvious like 20% reduction in ammo capacity, the character is going to notice right away that the Aries is not the Ares because it has 12 (c) not 15 (c) (which might not phase them - how often do characters reload, anyway?), but if it was a DV reduction (the Arez doing 4P instead of the Ares 5P), they shouldn't notice (not like they know what the NPCs roll to soak). Or maybe a reduction in range. Or that the smartlink actually takes space for modification purposes (or has less space).

[CanRay]

Or there's no updates for the software ever.  Or it's in Chinese or Korean or Hungarian or some other language none of the group knows.  Or the frame cracks when used extensively (Like your typical firefight).  Or it's actually better than the brand name production model, but doesn't have the expensive brand name price attached to it.

[Phylos Fett]

Or there's no updates for the software ever.  Or it's in Chinese or Korean or Hungarian or some other language none of the group knows.  Or the frame cracks when used extensively (Like your typical firefight).  Or it's actually better than the brand name production model, but doesn't have the expensive brand name price attached to it.

I'd probably try to avoid that last one, but that's just me.

[Crash_00]

Or it's in Chinese or Korean or Hungarian or some other language none of the group knows

Reminds me of an episode of Human Target where one of the guys cracks open the case to a rocket launcher, starts putting it together, and realizes that all the instructions on how to fire it are complete gibberish to him.

Or it's actually better than the brand name production model, but doesn't have the expensive brand name price attached to it.

I actually let my runners buy "off-brand" gear at a 10% discount, but its a pain finding anything for it. Availability goes up by 4 for all legal accessories and by 8 for all restricted and forbidden accessories. This makes finding simple things like clips much more complicated than normal.

I was thinking that a 20% penalty of some sort would be a good starting place. If it was something obvious like 20% reduction in ammo capacity, the character is going to notice right away that the Aries is not the Ares because it has 12 (c) not 15 (c) (which might not phase them - how often do characters reload, anyway?), but if it was a DV reduction (the Arez doing 4P instead of the Ares 5P), they shouldn't notice (not like they know what the NPCs roll to soak). Or maybe a reduction in range. Or that the smartlink actually takes space for modification purposes (or has less space).

List of possiblities:
-Always treated as one range increment further away unless point blank (Bad Sights)
-Weapon breaks/destroyed on glitch/critical glitch (Shoddy Construction)
-Weapon deals one less DV than normal (Bad Design)
-Semi-Auto Fire takes up an extra free action each turn (Poor Cycling)
-Weapon has and extra point of recoil (not compensation) each phase (Lighter Materials)

[CanRay]

Or it's actually better than the brand name production model, but doesn't have the expensive brand name price attached to it.

I'd probably try to avoid that last one, but that's just me.

They exist.  It'd be wrong of me not to point them out.

Speaker Cables and CAT-5 and CAT-6 Cables are prime examples of no-name brands that work just as well, and sometimes better, than overpriced name brand items.

[Phylos Fett]

Or it's actually better than the brand name production model, but doesn't have the expensive brand name price attached to it.

I'd probably try to avoid that last one, but that's just me.

They exist.  It'd be wrong of me not to point them out.

Speaker Cables and CAT-5 and CAT-6 Cables are prime examples of no-name brands that work just as well, and sometimes better, than overpriced name brand items.

True, but these aren't counterfeit - they are a no-name brand, not a brand pretending to be the named brand.

[Phylos Fett]

List of possiblities:
-Always treated as one range increment further away unless point blank (Bad Sights)
-Weapon breaks/destroyed on glitch/critical glitch (Shoddy Construction)
-Weapon deals one less DV than normal (Bad Design)
-Semi-Auto Fire takes up an extra free action each turn (Poor Cycling)
-Weapon has and extra point of recoil (not compensation) each phase (Lighter Materials)

Not bad ideas.

[The Wyrm Ouroboros]

Use the Gremlin suggestions, too.  Decrease the number of 1s necessary to glitch, make the glitch worse.  It jams if it fires long bursts or FA.  The armor's impact plates become fragile at -5 degrees C or below ...

[Mason]

This reminds me of the plastisteel brand (Plastisteel-7?) that turns to goo if you spray a catalyst on it...

[Phylos Fett]

This reminds me of the plastisteel brand (Plastisteel-7?) that turns to goo if you spray a catalyst on it...

I remember that fondly - the PCs I was GMing for were always on the look out for those walls...

[Phylos Fett]

Use the Gremlin suggestions, too.  Decrease the number of 1s necessary to glitch, make the glitch worse.  It jams if it fires long bursts or FA.  The armor's impact plates become fragile at -5 degrees C or below ...

The Gremlins idea is not bad.

[Xzylvador]

Gremlins wouldn't be much of a problem for a gun adept or streetsam with 20 dice though. Odds of ever having a drawback for cheaping out are incredibly low.