NEWS

Adept power: critical strike rating

  • 27 Replies
  • 9230 Views

Jeeves

  • *
  • Chummer
  • **
  • Posts: 143
« on: <09-15-10/1909:34> »
Is critical strike as an adept power capped at 6 like mystic armor, or at 3 like power throw? I've noticed that it's possible to make an adept who is capable of having these stats:

Strenth of 5, giving base damage for unarmed attacks 3S

Hardliner gloves, which bump it to 4P

Martial art of boxing which can give a +2DV for unarmed, bringing up to 6P

then, 6 ranks of criticall strike which bings it to 12P.


On side note, if i have a character with a rank 7 skill through aptitude, is it against the rules to increace it with the improved combat skill adept power?

I had a character, dubbed "fisticuffs", who had killing hands, 6 ranks in crit strike, and distance strike.

Unarmed combat was 7
improved with 1 rank of improved combat skill
agility was 5
+2 for specialization,
+2 more for his weapon focus, a pair of hardliner gloves,

so his dice pool was around 17 for unarmed combat, but with the set up and finishing move combo, he'd devastate an opponenet by rolling that twice.

Granted, his distance punches were weaker since the hardliner gloves couldn't provide a damage bonus, but still, I'm pretty sure that 6 ranks of crit strike might have been broken.



Mystic

  • *
  • Freelancer
  • Omae
  • ***
  • Posts: 982
  • Word Mercenary
« Reply #1 on: <09-15-10/1913:58> »
Thats why I never let them get that close if I can help it. 23 feet is my friend.

 8)
Bringing chaos, mayhem, and occasionally cookies to the Sixth World since 2052!

"Just because it's easy for you doesn't mean it can't be hard on your clients"-Rule 38, The Seventy Maxims of Maximally Effective Mercenaries, Schlock Mercenary.

Jeeves

  • *
  • Chummer
  • **
  • Posts: 143
« Reply #2 on: <09-15-10/1915:56> »
Right, but is the 6 ranks broken?

anotherJack

  • *
  • Omae
  • ***
  • Posts: 260
« Reply #3 on: <09-15-10/1922:33> »
No limit to critical strike but your magic attribute, as usual, and yes, you can increase your skill with the improved combat skill adept power, you can increase it up to 10 like this.
Nice build.
Me am french, me am not speaking good english, but me am trying to correct this.

Frankie the Fomori

  • *
  • Omae
  • ***
  • Posts: 309
« Reply #4 on: <09-15-10/2010:24> »
So talking about cheese, take an Ork (or tiger shapechanger) adept: Based off 500BP build
Strength: 4DV + Bone spikes (2DV) + Thorns (1DV) + Critical strike (6DV) + Martial arts (3DV)=16DV -1 penetration with a Attack Die pool of Skill (8 ) + agility (7) + Full offensive (2) - thorns (1)= 16

Side note: We do not allow Adepts to combine Hardliners with their critical strike; this avoids them then trying to make the gloves a weapon focus and it really getting silly. Also we do not allow the Spikes and thorns in our games....one or the other.

Body:------------------------8/9 [13]----() BP40
Agility:-----------------------6/7 [10]---(7) BP40
Reaction:-------------------5/6 [9]-----(8 ) BP 40
Strength:-------------------7/8 [12]---() BP 40
Charisma:-------------------2/5 [7]-----() BP 10
Intuition:-------------------5/6 [9]---------BP40
Logic:------------------------3/5 [7]--------BP20   
Willpower:------------------3/6 [9]--------BP 20
Magic----------------------- 6-------------- BP65
Edge-------------------------3--------------BP 20
Total race and atr.:BP 335

Initiative/pass: 10(13)/1(4)
Qualities:
Adept: 5BP
Martial Arts: 10 BP Muay thi (twice +2 DV), Wild kat (+1 DV)
Surge class 2: 10BP
    Meta genetic: exceptional attribute agility: BP 20
    Meta genetic: Bone spikes (+2 Unarmed DV) BP 5

Negative:
Geas: Daily ritual (your choice)       -10
(this is using advance rules were Geasa is linked to one power (Improved reflexes) and gains this power at .25 reduction)
In Debt: +20BP
Nano intolerance: +5BP
Meta genetic negative:
   Thorns: +10 BP (+1 DV and -1 all physical tests) [if you allow this with bone spikes]
Adept Powers:
Improved reflexes level 3 (cost 3)
Killing hands: (Cost .5)
Critical Strike: level 6 (cost 1.5)
Penetrating strike: Level 1 (cost .25)
Increased Attribute (agility) level 1 (cost .75)
Skills:
Unarmed combat: rank 6   24BP
           Martial Arts +2        2BP
Maneuvers:   Full offense  2 BP/finishing move  2BP

Some other skills Gear and Contacts=125 BP
« Last Edit: <09-15-10/2016:37> by Frankie the Fomori »

voydangel

  • *
  • Omae
  • ***
  • Posts: 537
  • SR GM since 1990. Damn I'm old.
« Reply #5 on: <09-15-10/2242:07> »
Is critical strike as an adept power capped at 6 like mystic armor, or at 3 like power throw?
RAW: "The maximum level an adept may have in any power is equal to the adepts magic attribute."
So, yes and no, the critical strike is capped like mystic armor, but the cap is not 6 (unless your magic attribute happens to be a 6).

I've noticed that it's possible to make an adept who is capable of having these stats:

Strenth of 5, giving base damage for unarmed attacks 3S

Hardliner gloves, which bump it to 4P

Martial art of boxing which can give a +2DV for unarmed, bringing up to 6P

then, 6 ranks of critical strike which brings it to 12P.
That looks about right.

On side note, if i have a character with a rank 7 skill through aptitude, is it against the rules to increase it with the improved combat skill adept power?
Yes, the maximum a skill can be modified to is 1.5 times the natural skill rating. So if you have a 7 in your skill, the maximum you can get it to with "improved ability" would be 10 (7 x 1.5 rounding down). (as noted by anotherJack).

I had a character, dubbed "fisticuffs", who had killing hands, 6 ranks in crit strike, and distance strike.

Unarmed combat was 7
improved with 1 rank of improved combat skill
agility was 5
+2 for specialization,
+2 more for his weapon focus, a pair of hardliner gloves,

so his dice pool was around 17 for unarmed combat, but with the set up and finishing move combo, he'd devastate an opponent by rolling that twice.

Granted, his distance punches were weaker since the hardliner gloves couldn't provide a damage bonus, but still, I'm pretty sure that 6 ranks of crit strike might have been broken.
Broken, yes. Illegal, no. =)
My tips for new GM's
Unless it is coming from an official source, RAI = "Rules As Imagined."
SR1+SR2+SR3++SR4++SR5+++h+b+++B+D382UBIE-RN---DSF-W+m+(o++)gm+MP

Jeeves

  • *
  • Chummer
  • **
  • Posts: 143
« Reply #6 on: <09-16-10/0955:45> »
Well, then, why was power throw capped at 3 ranks in the erratta for Street Magic?

Frankie the Fomori

  • *
  • Omae
  • ***
  • Posts: 309
« Reply #7 on: <09-16-10/1011:58> »
I know some of this has been said, but let’s put all information concerning adepts and there power level in one post.
Quote
Many adept powers may be purchased at a variable rating. The maximum level an adept may have in any power is equal to the adept’s Magic attribute. Page 195 4Ea

So we now have powers = Magic attribute. Your magic attribute can = 6+initiation

Now some of powers have a set cap that is written into their description: example would be penetrating strike = 3 max levels.

I hope this clears up any questions concerning adept powers and there level max rank.

voydangel

  • *
  • Omae
  • ***
  • Posts: 537
  • SR GM since 1990. Damn I'm old.
« Reply #8 on: <09-16-10/1139:21> »
Yes, some powers are capped directly in the description, like "improved reflexes", and apparently "power throw". So I guess the proper wording would be:

"Unless stated otherwise, the maximum level an adept may have in any power is equal to the adepts magic attribute."

Hope that helps.
My tips for new GM's
Unless it is coming from an official source, RAI = "Rules As Imagined."
SR1+SR2+SR3++SR4++SR5+++h+b+++B+D382UBIE-RN---DSF-W+m+(o++)gm+MP

Shinobi Killfist

  • *
  • Prime Runner
  • *****
  • Posts: 2623
« Reply #9 on: <09-16-10/1326:34> »
I do not find it to be inherently broken.  You can break it sure, but you can break a lot of things in this game, like any open build game.  Look at gun modification for awesome ways to break things.  Overall though melee combat is just weaker so no it generally is not broken.  Even with distance strike you are not as good off as a ranged attack.  Sure it works like one, but it is a range of magic meters, or basically melee.  It still is a complex action meanwhile the guy with the SMG is pumping out a long burst and short burst, or a full burst, or suppressive fire, all of which are just as potent in their own ways.  And did my SMG spend 3.5 PPs of his magic to be that awesome nope.  And is this worse than a force 9 stun ball taking out a room, of unresisted power bolts blowing up citymasters if you stack up enough dice for combat spells. (6 magic+6spellcasting+2 mentor+2specilization+4power focus bought with restricted gear)=20 dice for combat spells.  Does that make combat spells broken(I happen to think they are but for different reasons) or does that mean someone worked the system to break the game. 

The main problem with melee combat IMO, is that unless it is your focus it is borderline useless, and if it is your focus you need to be a decent player and try not to break the game. 

Frankie the Fomori

  • *
  • Omae
  • ***
  • Posts: 309
« Reply #10 on: <09-16-10/2045:40> »
I think it comes down to what the overall PC looks like, if i have a PC with a Die pool of 20+ die for combat but nothing else on his sheet is a mini/max PC. But if you work a PC where he is more balanced in terms of gaming option but still has the high combat die pool would be considered a specialist

Machiavelli

  • *
  • Newb
  • *
  • Posts: 21
« Reply #11 on: <09-19-10/0350:31> »
Everybody that spents 3 of his possibly 6 power points to get his melee damage that high, has earned it. 3 points for this power means 3 less points for more important things.

Casazil

  • *
  • Omae
  • ***
  • Posts: 602
  • There can be only one!
    • Casazil's Shadowrun
« Reply #12 on: <09-19-10/0400:38> »
Crit strike is only a .25 power so level 6 is only 1.5 not 3

And If I remember right the gloves don't add. It's either your adept power doing damage or your gloves not both.
"If at first you don't succeed blame someone else"
Joel "Casazil" Rogers
Catalyst Demo Team Shadowrun Special Agent #251
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/CasazilsShadowrun/

Machiavelli

  • *
  • Newb
  • *
  • Posts: 21
« Reply #13 on: <09-19-10/0420:31> »
For the first argument you are completely right. My math is weak in the morning.^^ But i disagree why they don´t stack with hardliner gloves. You simply strike harder, this stacks with nearly everything except shock-gloves.

Casazil

  • *
  • Omae
  • ***
  • Posts: 602
  • There can be only one!
    • Casazil's Shadowrun
« Reply #14 on: <09-19-10/0425:20> »
Well it was either another Missions GM that said it to me, Or a player said something to me about another player, Or My friend Magus (on the fourms here) who is a dam good rules lawyer told me this so..........

I'll look another time for now I'm just pokeing around and seeing what there is to read after fixing my new character I posted on here it's a bit late to be digging in books for me  ;D
"If at first you don't succeed blame someone else"
Joel "Casazil" Rogers
Catalyst Demo Team Shadowrun Special Agent #251
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/CasazilsShadowrun/