[Rockopolis]

Umm...I'm actually shifting away from using the hardmaxed Mentat, but even then, I still had a four in Intuition and a three in Willpower and Charisma.  And I think I accidentally included some Intuition Geneware in the original build.

[Glyph]

One of the things muddying the issue of how powerful a high Logic is, is that there are a lot of mental qualities (and adept powers) that don't really tie into the Logic rating.  Someone with analytical mind, photographic memory, and linguist may seem more intelligent, even if his Logic is only 3 or 4.  And adepts are even more so.  Someone with eidetic sense memory, linguistics, and multi-tasking will seem like a super-genius; he has perfect recall, can watch several trideo programs simultaneously, and learns new languages almost instantly.  And the annoying thing is, hard-maxing Logic means forgoing some of the other qualities that would fit a high Logic character.

[Longshot23]

How well does Logic the stat translate to IQ the rating?

Also, it makes a difference what the player has the character CHOOSE to know about - science/arts/legal/street/etc . . . .

[Xzylvador]

One of the things muddying the issue of how powerful a high Logic is, is that there are a lot of mental qualities (and adept powers) that don't really tie into the Logic rating.  Someone with analytical mind, photographic memory, and linguist may seem more intelligent, even if his Logic is only 3 or 4.  And adepts are even more so.  Someone with eidetic sense memory, linguistics, and multi-tasking will seem like a super-genius; he has perfect recall, can watch several trideo programs simultaneously, and learns new languages almost instantly.  And the annoying thing is, hard-maxing Logic means forgoing some of the other qualities that would fit a high Logic character.

I understand what you're saying, and see why you'd think that, but depending on the GM this isn't necessarily so.
Eidetic sense memory, multitasking: The logic 12 character can probably just buy enough hits to remember anything worth remembering, solve any puzzle or automatically succeed any concentration threshold for multitasking. Let's say 13 logic (incl. bonus to logic based tests) and 3 willpower: 16 dice can buy 4 hits, rolling is average 5+.
Learning languages wouldn't have the magical super boost, but there too the high logic character has a dicepool 3 or 4 times higher than any "normal" person.

Of course a lot depends on the GM; but that's the case for most of those tests anyways.

[Tsuzua]

One big thing about having such a high logic is that you have an extremely large dice pool even when defaulting on knowledge skills.  With a 13 logic, you're rolling 12 dice on any academic or professional knowledge skill.  That's as good as a high logic PhD (6 logic + 6 skill).  With some logic dice pool enhancers, you can buy the hits to know intricate knowledge of whatever topic. 

While I don't believe you're some sort of superhuman intelligence, you are a omnidisciplinary master.  You're more Reed Richards than Dr. Manhattan, crazy good and able to know whatever you need to know, but still recognizable to whatever experts in the field.  You won't know anything about life on the street or languages since those are intuition based but whatever. 

You also have an amazing resistance to mental addiction so have fun with BTLs.  If you're a member of a logic tradition, you can easily have a good drain check so you can enjoy high drain spells and summon high force spirits.  I'm playing a mind over matter base 11 logic 12 buffed gnome qabalah mystic adept right now and he's a blast to play.

[baronspam]

From a purely mechanical point of view, the thing to do with a super logic character would be to buy up most of the logic skills.  With even a one or two in the skill you would still have a dicepool that would exceed most "experts".  The one area that this would not work well would be matrix, as many hacking/online tasks end up being skill+program rather than skill+stat.  Still, you could have a full suite of mechanical/science/medical/technical skills.  You wouldn't be a hacker, but you would be able to build, repair, or patch up just about anything or anyone.  How well this would work in over the table play is very campaign dependant.  In combat/infultration heavy campaigns you are pretty much limited to opening the maglocks with Hardware and patching up the wounded.  ButiIf you have a good GM that takes the characters into consideration and makes sure there are things your character can do to contribute it should be a viable build. 

[neohelios]

Just skimming along the text, so maybe this has been mentioned, but if you look at history, you will see several examples of no matter how intelligent a person was (DaVinci and Tesla) the "technology interfaces and resources" of that time held many of these geniuses back from realizing their thoughts beyond diagrams and math--a mere shadow of the real thing.

How presumptuous would we be to think of the Shadowrun world as the absolute highest point in technology?

I think it would be fair to consider a character with a super-high logic to be limited in faculty likewise.  Knowledge-based skills, and photographic memory not-with-standing, of course.

[Charybdis]

Just skimming along the text, so maybe this has been mentioned, but if you look at history, you will see several examples of no matter how intelligent a person was (DaVinci and Tesla) the "technology interfaces and resources" of that time held many of these geniuses back from realizing their thoughts beyond diagrams and math--a mere shadow of the real thing.

How presumptuous would we be to think of the Shadowrun world as the absolute highest point in technology?

I think it would be fair to consider a character with a super-high logic to be limited in faculty likewise.  Knowledge-based skills, and photographic memory not-with-standing, of course.

A) You're absolutely right. Even in the world of shadowrun, there will be technological limitations. However, as with these geniuses in the past, this Logic 12'ish PC could be the one to make the technological leaps forward. Seriously, such a PC is likely to be headhunted if word got out just how clever they were.

B) I disagree that a super-high logic PC needs to be in any way limited by faculty. From a PC-Balance perspective, you just can't get 10's in all your mental attributes, so while other mental abilities will be diminshed by comparison, they can still be well above average (4-5's). So I wouldn't call these limited at all...

[neohelios]

However, as with these geniuses in the past, this Logic 12'ish PC could be the one to make the technological leaps forward.

Ah, yes, but WHO has the TIME? ...or the inclination!

Thanks for the constructive feedback!

[Rockopolis]

Good points.
On the other hand, knowsofts and datasofts are affordable, and if I can get my hands on some desktop forges or nanoforges, I can create the technology interfaces and resources needed.  I can build things for which the science to develop them does not yet exist...
Perhaps this thread would have been better titled "What Couldn't You do with 13 Logic?"

[Charybdis]

Good points.
On the other hand, knowsofts and datasofts are affordable, and if I can get my hands on some desktop forges or nanoforges, I can create the technology interfaces and resources needed.  I can build things for which the science to develop them does not yet exist...
Perhaps this thread would have been better titled "What Couldn't You do with 13 Logic?"

I don't have my books handy, but can you tell me if Skillwires can give technical skills?

If so, imagine an absolute genius with a bank of Technical Skillsofts.... seriously, any Corp would kill to get this guy.... Instant genius for any R&D project....

[Rockopolis]

Yeah, Active Skillsofts (with Skillwires) do give technical skills.  It does seem odd that your own (giga-genius) Logic would be added to that, though.  Maybe you're patching it on the fly?
A Knowsoft doesn't require 'wires, but it's still preprogrammed.

This character might just do best with Datasofts?

[Rockopolis]

You could chop someone into ribbons.  With your Mind!  And a sword.

The Really Sharp Sword, a Rank II Weapon Focus Monofilament Sword deals (STR/2 +3)P damage.  It has -3 AP and a reach of one.
I believe I'm rolling...11(AgilityLogic)+1(Personalized Grip)+2(Weapon Focus)=13 Dice+(1Reach)+1(Psyche)=15 Dice.  On my character it's only 4P base damage.
The Really Sharp Sword indeed.  Still, I believe if you need to use it, you probably screwed up really really badly somewhere along the way.  Speaking of screwing up badly, I think I roll 12 Dice on a full defense, which doesn't seem too shabby.

I guess the style would be...what, poking them in that glaringly obvious hole in their defenses?  Stabbing them in the pressure point that makes their head explode?

By the way, I bet with 13 Logic you could think of a better, hopefully punny name for the sword, like Razor Wit or something.

[Rockopolis]

Okay, now it's getting to be seriously crazy, but fazzamar pointed out I could hit 15 as a Pixie.
Dunklezhan's ghostly corpse, pixies are a far greater threat than I'd thought!  I've got to
Pixies are harmless and friendly.  The Red Cap Killer is just an urban legend tying together a string of unrelated unfortunate accidents.

[Makki]

but you need Deltaware Cerebralboosters for Critters...Have a look at Vampires and Nosferatu. They should be about the same.