[inca1980]

I agree that especially with AOE effects, SR really does NEED a map to determine damage and prevent arguing.  I was just saying that I like keeping the map as an abstract thing....as if it were an ARO or something and then I use images and pictures that I scour the internet for (cuz i can't draw) to really set the stage.  So what ends up happening is that I usually need to mold my maps to fit the picture i've presented.  Hence my maps have to be pretty sketched out on a grid to keep distances exact. 

[John Schmidt]

Minis, maps, and terrain have limitations. If I put in a lot of time on some scenery for a climatic battle and then the players skirt around that...I have to fight the urge to lead them back to that location. It is the 'I built this damn thing and by all the powers that be you will go there so I can set it out on the table' factor. As GM's it is easy to fall in love with a NPC, miniature, map, trap, or any number of items that you feel the compulsion to bring it into play...in spite of the player's actions.

Back on topic though, if an abstract map works for you then so be it. There are some people, like myself, that collect, covert, and paint miniatures which serves to add another level of enjoyment to the process. Scenery that I build for Shadowrun will often end up being recycled for near future/modern wargames (which is why I stick with 28mm scale these days) and when my shelves are full, sold off on eBay. Others, not so much, which is equally fine by me. 8-)

[Fizzygoo]

Since it is VERY difficult (for me, both financially and practically) to get my hands on any Shadowrun minis - or cyberpunk related ones - I was going to use sticky-backed magnet sheets and paste pictures of shadowrunners to it in lieu of using miniatures.

The issue is that I really don't want to sift through images one at a time saving and cropping the ones I want (I'll do it, but I would rather avoid it if possible). Does anyone know of a place where I could get some decent quality pics for this kind of use?

Many Thanks,

Arkangel

Are you GMing or running as a player? As a player, yeah, I'd want the best possible image to use in going your route and the previous suggestions for online images are good. As a GM though, I want fast and easy (which is why I try to always get some modern-style mini's when I make it to the game stores). So instead of looking for "images," I'd go with "icons," on cardstock. Like modifying military icons (http://www.armchairgeneral.com/wordpress/wp-content/images/unitsymbols.jpg), and you can personalize specific pieces with images you find (of course, it kind of gives away the named NPCs vs. grunts that way). The only issue is the time it takes to cut them out. Which tends to annoy me.

Other quick and easy options:
coins, chess/checker pieces, (and many people's favorite) Legos. One of my personal favorites is non-sticky/non-messy modeling clay as I can quickly make something to scale that resembles the basic shape needed while spilling out some flavor text or I can take a day, sculpt it, cook it, and have it mostly-forever (made a Ford-Canadian Bison (no image...it broke ) once and a wagon cart that my wizard always tended to hide under http://www.fizzygoo.com/Minis/cart_right.jpg). Not to mention you can quickly poke it (un-cooked) with a toothpick to represent every bullet it's taking .

Like John Schmidt points out, there's always the chance that the player's won't interact with the set and/or NPCs...which is why I prefer the quick and easy route. But that also has it's limitations as for years I had to put up with players commenting on my draw the map fast style as "hey, look, the Drunken-architect designed this building too." I would love to have each run with custom terrain, minis, etc. But time, time, time...le ug.

[LonePaladin]

Here's the cheap-ass route I take.

• Tools: If you're wanting your standard one-inch-wide minis, my first recommendation is going to a hobby store and buying a one-inch-wide punch, the type used for scrapbooking. One of these punches will probably run you about $7, and allow you to punch out a circular chunk of paper or cardstock quickly. If you're making more than about five or six 'budget minis' at a go, this will be your best investment.
• Material: I've found that heavy cardstock tends to work best for the somewhat disposable route, or the things that you want to mass-produce without a large investment. Don't go to office-supply stores to buy the stuff, though -- they charge about twice what you'd pay at a big-outlet chain, like Wal-Mart. (I can buy a full pack of 110-weight paper, 150 sheets, for about $4 at WM; the same would probably cost me $7-8 at an office store.) If you're wanting something heavier, go with poster-board, but I'd only recommend that for pieces that are going to see a lot of use.
• Images: This is a case of personal preference. Do Google image searches for whatever you're looking for -- don't include the word "Shadowrun" unless a regular search isn't turning up what you want. (For example, you may have to use it when searching for trolls, 'cause SR trolls have a unique look.) Run these pictures through TokenTool to turn them into nice little circles, possibly with a colored border.
• Printing: Fire up Word (or the equivalent in OpenOffice). You'll be using this to put all your tokens on one page. Bring the page margins down to about half an inch, so you have more room for figs. Create a one-inch circle, then edit it. One of the options will be to put an image inside this circle; pick that, and put in the picture you saved. Repeat with all the tokens you want to make. (You can also make bigger circles, if you want bigger critters; there's no real guideline on this, though. I'd recommend making troll tokens 1.5-2" wide, to emphasize how big they are.)

[Little D]

Hey there.

As far as minis go...  Yeah, having a decent collection will probably cost several hundred dollars.  If you really want one, the only suggestion I can offer up is buying some old Star Wars mini collection / bundle on ebay.  I got mine for a little under 100$ CAN (this was about six years ago), and i have several hundred minis to choose from.  Granted, there will be a short while in which every player will want to wield a lightsaber.  But other then that, there are enough alien species to fill up a bar scene, and you always use the stormtroopers as rent-a-cop / corpsec units.

And a good foldable battle mat is around 15$.  Add a dozen bucks for different colored markers (make sure that they are WASHABLE), and you'll be able to doodle anything on your map on the spot, and then wipe it off afterwards.  Just make sure not to press down on the markers too hard, or it'll leave a permanent stain.

Trust me.  -_-

[James McMurray]

As far as minis go...  Yeah, having a decent collection will probably cost several hundred dollars.  If you really want one, the only suggestion I can offer up is buying some old Star Wars mini collection / bundle on ebay.  I got mine for a little under 100$ CAN (this was about six years ago), and i have several hundred minis to choose from.  Granted, there will be a short while in which every player will want to wield a lightsaber.  But other then that, there are enough alien species to fill up a bar scene, and you always use the stormtroopers as rent-a-cop / corpsec units.

We use the star wars minis for the most part. The clone and storm troopers are great for all sorts of grunts. And Jar Jar makes an awesome mini for a toxic spirit of man.

And a good foldable battle mat is around 15$.  Add a dozen bucks for different colored markers (make sure that they are WASHABLE), and you'll be able to doodle anything on your map on the spot, and then wipe it off afterwards.  Just make sure not to press down on the markers too hard, or it'll leave a permanent stain.

Also, depending on the quality of the matt and the markers, you'll probably want to make sure you don't put the mat away without washing it. Some of them will stain if left for too long, especially if you're using red or purple.

[baronspam]

We use the star wars minis for the most part. The clone and storm troopers are great for all sorts of grunts. And Jar Jar makes an awesome mini for a toxic spirit of man.

[

LMOA, good ol' Jar Jar.  I needed that laugh.