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SR6 Protecting your WiFi-Gear

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Alrician

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« on: <11-11-20/0450:15> »
How do you protect your WiFi-enabled equipment without a hacker? The commlinks offer a maximum of Firewall 1, which is only 2 resistance dice against hacking attempts. Have I overlooked something or do I have to come up with a house rules?

Xenon

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« Reply #1 on: <11-11-20/0631:07> »
...a maximum of Firewall 1, which is only 2 resistance dice against hacking attempts.
Hacking attempts are typically opposed with the Willpower of the owner + Firewall of the network. Not firewall x 2

And really good commlinks have a D/F array of 3/1 which mean you can have a Data Processing of 1 and a Firewall of 3.

Alrician

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« Reply #2 on: <11-11-20/0706:03> »
The normal runner will not have a living persona and will probably roll the firewall twice. I had overlooked the exchange of attributes. Even so, 6 dice (2x F3) appear very low with the most expensive comm link. I am thinking of allowing a program that gives Firewall + 2.

Michael Chandra

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« Reply #3 on: <11-11-20/0726:03> »
You're right that even the most expensive commlink doesn't even get close to what a Cyberjack offers, but that is intentional: That way, a decker adds a lot of value. Of course players tend not to run into enemy deckers that much, Spiders play defense, offensive hackers are rare as opposition.

That being said, the creator of the Matrix rules has decided the values are too low, so they added a separate houserule-suggestion table here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1DYgYXlKQ5XUG_3R4aDbaTTcm5XeYfdjf6Kqlop1J72k (just search for Avalon).
How am I not part of the forum?? O_O I am both active and angry!

Alrician

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« Reply #4 on: <11-11-20/0803:42> »
Thanks for the link! Unfortunately, it makes the low-level cyberjacks obsolete, I don't yet know how to handle that.

Banshee

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« Reply #5 on: <11-11-20/0850:13> »
The normal runner will not have a living persona and will probably roll the firewall twice. I had overlooked the exchange of attributes. Even so, 6 dice (2x F3) appear very low with the most expensive comm link. I am thinking of allowing a program that gives Firewall + 2.

There is no requirement for a runner to have a persona, you still get to use your Willpower plus the device firewall
Robert "Banshee" Volbrecht
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Former RPG Lead Agent
Catalyst Demo Team

Banshee

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« Reply #6 on: <11-11-20/0855:19> »
Thanks for the link! Unfortunately, it makes the low-level cyberjacks obsolete, I don't yet know how to handle that.

Well even at rating 1 a cyberjack has advantages over a commlink ... see increased initiative and edge use.
Robert "Banshee" Volbrecht
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Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #7 on: <11-11-20/0951:31> »
How do you protect your WiFi-enabled equipment without a hacker? The commlinks offer a maximum of Firewall 1, which is only 2 resistance dice against hacking attempts. Have I overlooked something or do I have to come up with a house rules?

Within the rules:

Daisy chain commlinks.  Daisy chain the frag out of your PAN.
Example:
Commlink A has Commlinks B, C, and D slaved to it.
Commlink B has Commlink E, and 1 protected Device slaved to it.
Commlink C has Commlink F, and another protected device slaved to it.
Commlink D has Commlinks G and H slaved to it.
etc etc etc.  Hugely complicated and massively inefficient, but totally within the rules.

Also note that even if you're going to have a decker run matrix overwatch for the team, you still have to massively daisychain in order to get everyone's gear all into one PAN.

House Rules option:
Ignore the limit on the number of devices a single commlink/Cyberjack can protect.  Neat, simple, efficient!
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, you’re fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

Xenon

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« Reply #8 on: <11-11-20/1249:16> »
The normal runner will not have a living persona and will probably roll the firewall twice.
To oppose a Probe attempt on your PAN you typically roll Willpower + Firewall.
To oppose a Backdoor Entry attempt on your PAN you roll Willpower + Firewall.
To oppose a Brute Force attempt on your PAN you roll Willpower + Firewall.

This goes for all runners.
No matter if they are using a commlink, a cyberdeck+cyberjack, a RCC or a Living Persona.


Unfortunately, it makes the low-level cyberjacks obsolete, I don't yet know how to handle that.
From the same document that MC just linked (ctrl-F cyberjacks)
The table on Page 177 is the correct table for Cyberjacks, not Page 284.
The Matrix Init Bonus for cyberjacks is the extra dice you get when in VR.



House Rules option:
Ignore the limit on the number of devices a single commlink/Cyberjack can protect.
The 'networked' option that is presented in the document that MC just linked is also fixing this issue (ctrl-F networked).
« Last Edit: <11-11-20/1255:35> by Xenon »

Alrician

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« Reply #9 on: <11-12-20/0545:27> »
To oppose a Probe attempt on your PAN you typically roll Willpower + Firewall.
To oppose a Backdoor Entry attempt on your PAN you roll Willpower + Firewall.
To oppose a Brute Force attempt on your PAN you roll Willpower + Firewall.

This goes for all runners.
No matter if they are using a commlink, a cyberdeck+cyberjack, a RCC or a Living Persona.

I would disagree politely and conditionally. At least the publications are not clear on this topic: I agree with you, the description of the matrix actions "Brute force" and "Backdoor entry" lists willpower. The official cheat sheet publication (at least in German) lists Willpower / Firewall + Firewall as a defense against these actions. The Corerulebook states, that people who have a living persona use willpower in this case, from which I conclude that those who do not do so just roll the firewall twice.

But it is not clearly regulated, the later published cheat sheet could be seen as an errata, but is not officially described so.

But it sounds more logical to me. Why should my willpower help defend my commlink? Especially when it is lying on the table in the kitchen while I'm in the shower.


From the same document that MC just linked (ctrl-F cyberjacks)
The table on Page 177 is the correct table for Cyberjacks, not Page 284.
The Matrix Init Bonus for cyberjacks is the extra dice you get when in VR.



House Rules option:
Ignore the limit on the number of devices a single commlink/Cyberjack can protect.
The 'networked' option that is presented in the document that MC just linked is also fixing this issue (ctrl-F networked).

Many thanks to everyone for the advice. I apologize for just looking shortly at the document yesterday.

Banshee

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« Reply #10 on: <11-12-20/1014:10> »
To oppose a Probe attempt on your PAN you typically roll Willpower + Firewall.
To oppose a Backdoor Entry attempt on your PAN you roll Willpower + Firewall.
To oppose a Brute Force attempt on your PAN you roll Willpower + Firewall.

This goes for all runners.
No matter if they are using a commlink, a cyberdeck+cyberjack, a RCC or a Living Persona.

I would disagree politely and conditionally. At least the publications are not clear on this topic: I agree with you, the description of the matrix actions "Brute force" and "Backdoor entry" lists willpower. The official cheat sheet publication (at least in German) lists Willpower / Firewall + Firewall as a defense against these actions. The Core rulebook states, that people who have a living persona use willpower in this case, from which I conclude that those who do not do so just roll the firewall twice.

But it is not clearly regulated, the later published cheat sheet could be seen as an errata, but is not officially described so.

But it sounds more logical to me. Why should my willpower help defend my commlink? Especially when it is lying on the table in the kitchen while I'm in the shower.


below is what I wrote in the CRB

From Pg 179 ... Matrix actions . bolded part is my emphasis
Quote
Where two different dice pools are listed, such as “Intuition + Firewall or Sleaze + Firewall,” personas with Mental attributes use the pool with those attributes. Drones use their Pilot Rating in place of the Mental Attribute. A persona actively defending for a device or host can use the other pool with the device or host attributes.

note just says persona not living persona, only technomancers have a living persona and even then is just a specialized type of persona, so we are talking just the baseline persona. ALL PAN's create personas when they access the matrix, therefore even your basic street sam with just a commlink gets to use their willpower to defend with. ONLY unattended devices and/or devices not connected to a PAN do not have this option and must rely on firewall alone.

now as for the logic behind it, well we needed it to fit within parameters of the established game system so we left it as it has been in previous editions that Willpower represents your characters ability to maintain security protocols. You will also note that I say
Quote
A persona actively defending for a device or host can use the other pool with the device or host attributes.
... so if the firewall is better than your willpower you can choose to use it instead ... this represents just using the "factory settings".
Robert "Banshee" Volbrecht
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Former RPG Lead Agent
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Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #11 on: <11-12-20/1045:45> »
Do you always download each security patch as they come available, or do you put them off?  Low willpower characters habitually click the "Not Now" button.  They're also prone to dismissing alerts that warn of possible hacking in progress.

RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, you’re fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

Alrician

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« Reply #12 on: <11-12-20/1506:52> »
You convinced me! I assume "Persona with mental attributes" are all living beings in the matrix?

Michael Chandra

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« Reply #13 on: <11-12-20/1537:30> »
A Host needs a Spider actively taking care of it to use mental attributes, right? Unattended by a Spider it only uses its Firewall?

(... Holy crap just got an awesome idea with runners discovering a Host is way too tough and realising the Host became an AI by itself. O,O Foundation woke up.)
How am I not part of the forum?? O_O I am both active and angry!

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #14 on: <11-12-20/1559:40> »
If a host has no on duty spider, then it rolls 0 dice for mental stats. You don't sub in firewall.

Secure hosts require spiders on duty around the clock in this edition.

Of course, If you know where the spider physically is, then putting some knockout mickey in his soykaf becomes an attractive pre-hack preporatory action...
« Last Edit: <11-12-20/1602:48> by Stainless Steel Devil Rat »
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, you’re fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.