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6th - Shotguns

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Ajax

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« Reply #30 on: (20:13:31/10-29-19) »
Great insight, guys. To clarify my concern though, if you deployed a bipod/tripod at 40 meters and fired from a stationary position in a firefight, wouldn't you just get shot down in seconds? The bonuses provided from a mechanical standpoint are excellent but I'm having a hard time understanding it immersion-wise. I picture bipods and tripods as being used from "safe" positions, not out in the open at ranges where pistols can shoot the user down (in-game).

Fire-and-Maneuver, bounding overwatch, leapfrogging, and other small unit tactics work quite well in Shadowrun. The basic idea is that if you need to move through a space while being shot at (or you expect to be shot at soon) only half of your group should move and the other half should be shooting.

A combat round in Shadowrun is only meant to represent a few seconds of time, with everyone constantly doing stuff simultaneously and not just politely waiting their turn. So Samurai Sam might sprint forward, drawing his katana and his machine pistol; Molly McMercenary takes a knee behind a crate, steadying her shotgun’s bipod on it, and throws some lead downrange, hopefully suppressing the enemy; and Dickie Decker dives behind hard cover and starts hacking.

Three-ish seconds later, Sam has taken cover behind a forklift, so he throws a suppressive burst towards the enemy; Molly stands up and sprints closer to the enemy, reloading her shotgun as she runs...

Now, ideally, if you have to take a long range shot you’re doing it with long range weapon (or you have a stupendously high dice pool). But even a crappy weapon used by a guy with a tiny dice pool can contribute: every die you roll has a “6” on it, right?
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Shadowjack

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« Reply #31 on: (21:52:22/10-29-19) »
Great example. I guess I'm picturing the combat slightly incorrectly, I was under the impression you plant the bipod and then hold the position. I didn't realize bipods and tripods were utilized while on the move as well.
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Ajax

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« Reply #32 on: (22:14:27/10-29-19) »
Great example. I guess I'm picturing the combat slightly incorrectly, I was under the impression you plant the bipod and then hold the position. I didn't realize bipods and tripods were utilized while on the move as well.

Tripods, not so much, mostly because those tend only to be used (in real life) on crew-served weapons, for example a M2HB heavy machine gun. One man will carry the weapon, another will carry the tripod, and somebody else hauls ammo for it... you’re looking at approximately 130-150 lbs. all told.  You don’t fire these things on the move.

But then again, our armed forces have a distinct lack of Trolls.
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Shadowjack

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« Reply #33 on: (06:46:38/10-30-19) »
My character is a troll with 8 strength :D Bipods are for being prone or sitting, tripods are for kneeling or sitting. In Shadowrun, I picture bipods as better if you're holding a position and tripods being better if you're somewhat mobile. I've been considering homebrewing an underbarrel weight that provides 1 AR since I'm pretty sure that's what it'll do in the combat book.Then maybe I can bring a bipod for times when I'm holding a position.
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Ajax

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« Reply #34 on: (11:23:23/10-30-19) »
You’ve got the bipod/tripod relationship backwards. A bipod is small and light, it’s best if you plan to be on the move a lot; a tripod is large and bulky, it’s best if you’re going to be holding a position.

That’s why you’ll see modern soldiers with bipods on their assault rifles, carbines, and squad automatic weapons and only see tripods on heavy machine guns and the like.
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Shadowjack

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« Reply #35 on: (12:03:29/10-30-19) »
According to the book though, bipods are used when prone or sitting, tripods are used when sitting or kneeling. While prone and at a distance, you get a nice boost to AR and some defense dice.
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Ajax

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« Reply #36 on: (13:36:21/10-30-19) »
This would not be the first time Shadowrun got things muddled in their firearms terminology. We've been waiting for thirty years for them to figure out that "clips" aren't what they think they are...
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Michael Chandra

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« Reply #37 on: (14:06:43/10-30-19) »
They figured that out ages ago. It's already been addressed in-universe even. Get with the times, oldtimers.
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Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #38 on: (14:19:56/10-30-19) »
This would not be the first time Shadowrun got things muddled in their firearms terminology. We've been waiting for thirty years for them to figure out that "clips" aren't what they think they are...

In the fictional Sixth World, the english language has diverged and "clip" formally DOES mean what we mean in the real world when we say "magazine".
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, you’re fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

Ajax

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« Reply #39 on: (15:09:32/10-30-19) »
Bah! Kids today with their cyberjacks and augmented reality... and what the drek is an “omae” anyway?! In my day, chummer, we had to share one cyberdeck between six ‘runners and we liked it! We had to drive our Yamaha Rapiers from Tacoma to Downtown — in acid rain! — Uphill!
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FastJack

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« Reply #40 on: (15:56:01/10-30-19) »
Listen, don't make me close this thread. You all know the rules–"NO DISCUSSING CLIPS/MAGAZINES!"

CanRay

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« Reply #41 on: (00:05:48/11-03-19) »


Should have brought Shotguns.
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