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5E Alphastrike Sam/Infiltrator (Revels in Murder&Finishing Move)

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Tes

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« on: <09-19-19/1910:34> »
Hey guys,
since I get to play my first game of Shadowrun since about 15 years (must have been like 14 back then) this is the first time I get to embrace my inner min maxer to see if I can come up with something a tiny bit more interesting than the usual archetypes I've seen floating around.
Long story short I want a char built to last for a fun and hopefully long campaign. And I might need to carry a few guys who aren't all that familiar with Pen&Paper or Shadowrun's style of consequences for a simple minded murderhobo approach.
Can't shake the feeling that our GM isn't going to be squeamish about sending us on our merry wetwork way.
Good old down to earth mundane Sammy it is as the base for this cocktail.
The gang is going to be an egomaniac Raven Shaman off the streets, an ex Doc Wagon EMT who has a morbid fascination with creating and collecting Drugs without ever taking any and our designated Driver who loves his (300k) car very very much and somehow ended up loving Sniper Rifles and Chainsaws in between watching too many bad trids.
In comes Mehico, an ex Aztlan deserter stuck in between a rock and a hard place, on his 3rd continent (and counting) looking to find a place to start over.

So far so good for the yadda yadda part.
Here comes the interesting stuff:

Priorities
A - Attributes
B - Funds
C - Skills
D - Metatype (Human)
E - Magic (Mundane)

Name: "Mehico"
Metatype:  Human
Age:  29
Sex:  M
Height:  193
Weight:  105
Hair:  black
Eyes:  brown
Skin:  tanned I guess?
Street Cred:  0
Notoriety:  0
Public Awareness:  0
Composure:  5
Judge Intentions:  7
Memory:  6
Lift/Carry:  10
Lift/Carry Weight:  90 kg / 60 kg
Primary Arm:  Ambidextrous
Movement:  12/24 (2m/hit)
Swim:  5.5 (1m/hit) 
Nuyen:  1,337¥(total accident I swear)
Karma:  0
Career Karma:  0


Body:4
Agility:6 (7)
Reaction:5
Strength:5(6)
Charisma:2
Intuition:5
Logic:3
Willpower:3
Edge:5
Essence:3.02

Initiative:10 +1d6

Physical Limit:7
Mental Limit:5
Social Limit:4
Astral Limit:5

Automatics 6(7)
Sneaking 6
Unarmed Combat (Wildcat +2) 6(7)
Gymnastics 4
Etiquette* 2
Leadership* 2
Negotiation* 2
Electronic Warfare 1
First Aid 1
Locksmith 1
Palming 1
Perception 1
Running 1
Throwing Weapons AGI 1
Skillgroups: Influence 2

* bought with Karma
 

Knowledge Skills

Spanish: Aztlan Native
Corp: Aztechnology 2
Blackmarket: 2
Security Procedures(Aztlan +2) 2
Small Unit Tactics 2
German 1
English(Milspec +2) 1
History(Aztlan +2) 1
Sports(Pit Fighting +2) 1


Quality

Positive:
Revels in Murder  CF 56
Adrenaline Surge  RF 145
Ambidextrous  SR5 71

Negative:
Consummate Professional  AP 17
Day Job (10 hrs): Armed Courier  RF 154
Tough and Targeted  CF 60
Impassive  HT 191
 

Martial Arts

Wildcat RG 134
Counterstrike
Finishing Move 

Cyberware

Cybereyes 2 [0.24] Alphaware SR5 453
Flare Compensation, Image Link, Smartlink, Thermographic Vision, Vision Magnification; 
Datajack [0.08] Alphaware SR5 452
Universal Connector Cord (Meter)
Obvious Full Arm (AGI 9, STR 7, Physical 8) (Right) [1.25] Used SR5 456
Armor 3, Customized Agility 6, Customized Strength 6, Cyberarm Gyromount, Enhanced Agility 3, Enhanced Strength 1; 
Obvious Full Arm (AGI 9, STR 9, Physical 9) (Left) [1.25] Used SR5 456
Armor 3, Customized Agility 6, Customized Strength 6, Enhanced Agility 3, Enhanced Strength 3, Spurs; 
Reflex Recorder (Unarmed Combat) [0.08] Alphaware SR5 460
Reflex Recorder (Automatics) [0.08] Alphaware SR5 460

Armor

Armor Jacket 14 **  SR5 437
Attachable Gear Access; Gel Packs;
Helmet +2 **  SR5 438 

Chameleon Suit  9 **  SR5 437
Chemical Seal; Thermal Damping 3; 
 
Form-Fitting Body Armor  8 **  RG 65
Concealability; Concealed Pocket; Custom Fit; Faraday Pocket; 

Mortimer of London: Argentum Coat 12/+4 **  RG 58
Concealability; Custom Fit (Stack); 

Mortimer of London: Berwick Suit  9 **  RG 58
Concealability; Custom Fit;
 
Total of equipped single highest armor and accessories 22   


Weapons
Ares Alpha SR5 428
Flashlight, Infrared; Foregrip; Gas-Vent 3 System; Improved Range Finder; Personalized Grip; Shock Pad; Sling; Smartgun System, Internal; Spare Clip; 
(optional, normally swapped for Foregrip) Under:Ares Alpha Grenade Launcher SR5 428


Ingram Smartgun SR5 427
Chameleon Coating (Rifle); Custom Look; Gas-Vent 2 System; Gecko Grip; Smartgun System, Internal; Sound Suppressor; Trigger Removal; 

Ingram Smartgun SR5 427
Chameleon Coating (Rifle); Custom Look; Gas-Vent 2 System; Gecko Grip; Smartgun System, Internal; Sound Suppressor; Trigger Removal; 

Spurs 12P -2 SR5 458

Fake SIN "Alfredo Rodriguez" 4 SR5 442
Certified Credstick, Silver
Certified Credstick, Standard ×10
Fake License rating 4(Automatics)
Fake License rating 4(Cyberware)
Fake License rating 4(Drivers License)
Fake License rating 4(Armed Courier License)
Fake License rating 4(Concealed Carry)
 
Ammo Kit
Ammo: APDS (Assault Rifles) - 84 SR5 434
Ammo: Explosive Rounds (Submachine Guns) - 60 SR5 434
Ammo: Gel Rounds (Submachine Guns) - 240 SR5 434
Ammo: Gel Rounds (Assault Rifles) - 210 SR5 434
Ammo: Regular Ammo (Assault Rifles) - 210 SR5 434
Ammo: Regular Ammo (Submachine Guns) - 240 SR5 434
Grenade: High Explosive - 5 SR5 435
Hard-Shell Briefcase 1 1 RG 196
OPs Kit
Autopicker 6 1 SR5 447
CS/Tear Gas - 5 SR5 409

OPs Kit
Gecko Tape Gloves - 1 SR5 449
Glue Solvent - 5 SR5 448
Grenade: Gas - 5 SR5 435
Grenade: Paint - 5 RG 102
Grenade: Smoke - 5 SR5 435
Hard-Shell Briefcase 1 1 RG 196
Headjammer 6 1 SR5 441
Hold-Fast Adhesive Spray - 5 RG 104
Jammer, Area 4 1 SR5 441
Keycard Copier 6 1 SR5 447
Maglock Passkey 3 1 SR5 448
 

OPs Kit 2
Medkit 6 1 SR5 450
Medkit Supplies - 2 SR5 450
Miniwelder - 1 SR5 448
Miniwelder Fuel Canister - 2 SR5 448
Rapelling Gloves - 1 SR5 449
Restraint, Containment Manacles - 1 SR5 447
Standard Tags - 100 SR5 440
Stealth Tags - 10 SR5 440
Subvocal Mic - 5 SR5 439
Tag Eraser - 1 SR5 441
White Noise Generator 6 1 SR5 441
 
other Gear

Commlink R6 SR5 438


Vehicles

Honda Spirit (Subcompact) SR5 463
Sensor Array Rating 2

Lifestyle

Low 2,200¥ 1 Month  SR5 369
Obscure/Difficult to Find; Extra Secure; Grid Subscription (Public Grid); 


Contacts

Street Doc 2 1
Fixer 1 2

Pets

Ronny   1 1
Metatype:  Meltdown Sprite (long story - I keep feeding it toasters though)
 

The char as is pretty much resolves about sneaking up as long as possible, hopefully getting the job done without combat.
But if push comes to shove he can be a one man army given the element of surprise. Opening from an ambush with an Edge Boosted (Rerolls/or Limit break) Revels in Murder should refund instantly dropping one opponent with Automatics or Close Combat. Adrenaline Surge and Ini 11+ means I get to act first (even if I screw up my Surprise check and end up at Ini 1).

Here comes a question I haven't found any good answers to - How does Finishing Move fit in there in terms of Initiative cost?
I've read up on it and people seem to love to hate it (and I get why, pretty bad Martial Arts Perk without Revels in Murder).
With the RIM refund and 20 dice on a possible CC opener
>Cyberarm AGI 9+Unarmed(8)+Reflexrekorder+Charge/other stuff = 18-20+ dice with 12P -2AP Spurs<
Finishing Move allows for a pretty much guranteed second Attack with another 20+ dice, that should lead to instant takedown of even a pretty tanky Troll Sam before he gets to act (refunding the Edge cost).
But how do the -10 Initiative work if I have less then 10 (i.e. after a failed Ambush roll, leaving me at Ini 1).
Interrupt actions like full defense are pretty clear that you need to be able to pay the cost with your remaining Initiative as Budget.
Finishing Move has no such clause, it appears to be a "frontloaded" extra Initiative pass (which is possible with 1 ini left) at the cost of 1 Edge.

Since my Initiative is pretty low in the beginning (sans drugs), FM+RIM circumvents the usual need for a Sam to get some sort of Initiative enhancement at least in the first combat round.
If the opener is a regular attack (i.e. fully compensated automatic salvo), the same question applies to my second Initative round. I'd start with 1-6 Initiative and could (theoretically) make that 20 by using Finishing Move (putting me at a virtual -14/-19 at the end of the Combat round).
GM doesn't mind (since it's melee only and doesn't contradict any rules) are you guys aware of anything that would make declaring a -20 Initiative Attack Action illegal at 1 remaining Initiative?
Delaying my action or in the following Combat Round, Counterstrike allows to riposte off the full Initiative budget, and then pulling off the -20 Initiative Finishing Move with a single digit Initiative budget.

This is very much a thought experiment, the char is pretty likely to take some drugs along the way or get some Ware to push his Initiative anyway.
However this doesn't change that the character games his Advantages and Martial Arts to replicate the effects of some very expensive upgrades.
Other than that I'm pretty happy Mehico didn't end up being a complete munchkin and is at least somewhat able to exist in society. So he has that going for him. Long term he has a lot of room to grow. Eventually going for a full cyberlimb suite, learning how to threaten people (to avoid having to clean the Spurs all the time), and maybe dream about some R3 synaptic Boosters.
« Last Edit: <09-19-19/1912:07> by Tes »

Tecumseh

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« Reply #1 on: <09-19-19/2020:23> »
Ultimately this is up to your GM. Some people would categorize Finishing Move as an Interrupt Action that requires you to have the necessary Initiative to pay for it. I personally would not require that, but that's based less on the rules and more on my own sense of balance.

(Personally, I'm not sure why interrupt actions require you to have the full amount of initiative to pay for them. I figure if you can take a full Complex+Free, or Simple+Simple+Free, with 1 initiative remaining, then you should also be able to execute an interrupt action with 1 initiative remaining.)

The character is good. I have a similar PC. Acknowledging in advance that it's a thought experiment, here are a few thoughts:

If you don't want to turn to drugs, you have enough Edge to use Blitz (rolling 5d6) if things make it to the second combat turn.

You say you bought those R2 skills with karma, but don't you mean the Skill Group points from chargen? Did you buy some of the R1 skills with karma instead?

Consider the Jack of All Trades quality, and purchasing some of those Rating 1 skills after game play starts.

You have skills linked to Charisma but not Logic. As such, I'd make Charisma 3 and Logic 2 rather than the other way around. That's up to you though.

Depending on how you spent your chargen karma, I'd consider dropping Logic to 1 and buying it to 2 with 10 karma. (This presumes you take the Charisma 3 advice.) That saves you an attribute point. Now put that into Charisma and boost those capabilities even more. 6 dice won't make you the face, but add Edge 5 and you're suddenly respectable. Given that most social interactions only need one or two rolls (maybe Etiquette and Negotiation), they're great for Edge, since each roll is disproportionately important to the outcome of the social encounter (compared to combat, when there are tons of rolls all over the place before things are resolved).

Are you sure you want the Cyberarm Gyromount? It takes up a lot of capacity. You could switch it for a cyber SMG and always be 'armed' (hurr hurr hurr). It's not the best SMG but it's good to have a trick up your sleeve (hurr hurr) and to appear unarmed even when you're not. Maybe you want the gyromount to be going Full Auto with the Ingram, which is fine if that's the goal. Just giving you some additional ideas.

Alphaware is good for the datajack, because it doesn't increase the cost that much, but it's not a good value for the reflex recorders. You save 0.02 Essence but it costs you ¥2,800, which values each full point of Essence at ¥140,000. Unless you're specifically trying to keep your Essence above 3, which it doesn't sound like from your commentary, then it's better to save the nuyen and bank it for additional 'ware.

Tes

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« Reply #2 on: <09-20-19/1130:57> »
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Ultimately this is up to your GM. Some people would categorize Finishing Move as an Interrupt Action that requires you to have the necessary Initiative to pay for it. I personally would not require that, but that's based less on the rules and more on my own sense of balance.

(Personally, I'm not sure why interrupt actions require you to have the full amount of initiative to pay for them. I figure if you can take a full Complex+Free, or Simple+Simple+Free, with 1 initiative remaining, then you should also be able to execute an interrupt action with 1 initiative remaining.)
Yeah not going down that rabbit hole. It's never mentioned as an interrupt action and has to be single target against the same target, more like a single "double tap" action than anything else.
Normally you pay dearly for frontloading that second attack... the build just really abuses the mechanics that make Finishing Move so bad/niche in the first place.
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If you don't want to turn to drugs, you have enough Edge to use Blitz (rolling 5d6) if things make it to the second combat turn.
Thing is the char doesn't really need to do any drugs or blow his Edge on Initiative aside from a real emergency. 5 Edge is enough to to not run out even if you use some rerolls on something that ends up surviving a burst from one of the Ingrams or on attacks that don't qualify for RIM refunds (Unaware victims, Critters, Drones etc).
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Depending on how you spent your chargen karma, I'd consider dropping Logic to 1 and buying it to 2 with 10 karma. (This presumes you take the Charisma 3 advice.) That saves you an attribute point. Now put that into Charisma and boost those capabilities even more. 6 dice won't make you the face, but add Edge 5 and you're suddenly respectable. Given that most social interactions only need one or two rolls (maybe Etiquette and Negotiation), they're great for Edge, since each roll is disproportionately important to the outcome of the social encounter (compared to combat, when there are tons of rolls all over the place before things are resolved)..
Had considered it but Logic will supplement the breaking and entering part better in the long run - CHA is actually raised with Karma already. Using the available modifiers for Intimidation, custom look Ingram and down the line a Specialisation into Intimidation, together with Fullbody/SWAT Armor should go a long way into making at least Gangers and Civilians go away.
If I screw up an Intimidation it's a case of "oh boy, here I go killing again" (or moderate use of nonlethal force). Screwing up on a maglock and triggering an alarm seems more costly in comparison.
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Are you sure you want the Cyberarm Gyromount? It takes up a lot of capacity. You could switch it for a cyber SMG and always be 'armed' (hurr hurr hurr). It's not the best SMG but it's good to have a trick up your sleeve (hurr hurr) and to appear unarmed even when you're not. Maybe you want the gyromount to be going Full Auto with the Ingram, which is fine if that's the goal. Just giving you some additional ideas.
The Gyromount took some very careful consideration. Would have loved to have an implanted Shockhand instead for example. In the end I always have the highly illegal Spur, which is going to be the most useful weapon anyway in case Ware gets me into trouble. Since legality wasn't an issue the Gyro allows to compensate the full Recoil of a full 10 round Assault Rifle burst with the Alpha to drop multiple Gangers in one burst. Being able to split your pool reliably with Automatics, RIM and rerolls against soft targets is one of the things I really like about this build. Having effective dicepools of >30 thanks to rerolls on top of the mitigated RNG factor really makes this work.
An implanted SMG could not be drawn while sneaking around. Chameleon coated Ingrams can be at the ready, on top of being somewhat hard to hear with Integrated Suppressor and Electronic Firing.
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Alphaware is good for the datajack, because it doesn't increase the cost that much, but it's not a good value for the reflex recorders. You save 0.02 Essence but it costs you ¥2,800, which values each full point of Essence at ¥140,000. Unless you're specifically trying to keep your Essence above 3, which it doesn't sound like from your commentary, then it's better to save the nuyen and bank it for additional 'ware.
I hear ya. The arms are used grade to make them fit into the budget and to get access to R3 Armor 3 each. They'll most likely be replaced down the line.
The rest is meant to be kept, and since the aim is probably going to be 5 Limbs+Partial Skull+R3 Synaptic Boosters Essence is tight even if I pick up Cybercompatibility and Adapsin along the line.  ;D