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Does some armor also help with soak?

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Moonrunner

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« Reply #15 on: (20:38:21/09-11-19) »
AR: actually it's 20, Bone Density 4 is +3 AR not +2
DR: only Body+Armor+Dermal Deposits, Bone Density does not provide Defence Rating from my reading (although I wish they used "soaking" instead of "resisting", resisting damage is not a thing in the rules)
DV: correct
Soak: correct (for physical damage, just 3 for other damage)

(the errata talks about changing the DV values for bone density not "damage resist")

Bone Density 4 got errated to +2 DV.
« Last Edit: (20:40:01/09-11-19) by Moonrunner »

sigfriedmcwild

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« Reply #16 on: (20:57:17/09-11-19) »
Yes, +2DV, the AR bonus is +3

The table from the pdf with that errata baked in it
Code: [Select]
bone density ratings
RATING DV AR
1     +1 +1
2     +1 +2
3     +2 +2
4     +2 +3

Shinobi Killfist

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« Reply #17 on: (21:15:29/09-11-19) »
So given it takes a strength of 3 to match a katanas damage and strength+reaction+3 will get past 10 fast the dream of the Katana wielding street sam isnt alive here as well.


Edit to clarify this was in response to the bone density comments and was assuming a sam has that for the 3 strength calculations
« Last Edit: (00:15:13/09-12-19) by Shinobi Killfist »

sigfriedmcwild

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« Reply #18 on: (22:39:35/09-11-19) »
Without augmentations of some form it takes a str of 7 to get unarmed DV of 4, a troll will do it with str 5 thanks to the dermal deposits

Moonrunner

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« Reply #19 on: (22:43:01/09-11-19) »
Can you all please help me to calculate my final dice pools? I just want to ensure I am correct.

ATTRIBUTES:

BODY: 3
AGILITY: 7 (11)
REACTION: 5 (8)
STRENGTH: 5 (9)
WILLPOWER: 3
LOGIC: 2
INTUITION: 5
CHARISMA: 2
EDGE: 2
ESSENCE: 0.31
MAGIC: 1 (2)

CLOSE COMBAT: 6 (UNARMED) (8*)

DICE POOLS

ATTACK RATING (AR) [UNARMED] REACTION (8) + STRENGTH (9) + BONE DENSITY (3) = 20
DEFENSE RATING (DR) BODY (3) + ARMOR VEST (3) + DERMAL DEPOSITS (1) = 7
DAMAGE VALUE (DV) [UNARMED] STRENGTH <rounded up> (5) + DERMAL DEPOSITS (1) + BONE DENSITY (2) + 2 levels of CRITICAL STRIKE (2) = 10
SOAK ROLL BODY (3) + BONE DENSITY (4) = 7
ATTACK ROLL [UNARMED] CLOSE COMBAT (UNARMED) (8) + AGILITY (11) = 19
DEFENSE ROLL REACTION (8) + INTUITION (5) = 13

Note: All the smile emojis ae actually the number eight.  I am trying to see where to turn this option off.

« Last Edit: (22:50:52/09-11-19) by Moonrunner »

sigfriedmcwild

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« Reply #20 on: (23:02:55/09-11-19) »
So breaking it down you have:
Attributes A for 32 points
Skills ?
Resources ?
Magic D
Metatype C? for Elf and 9 points?

Dermal Deposits bought as a quality?

Some things that stand out:
- I'm not sure if you have spent all your adjustment points (I see 2 spent? 1 for edge 2 and 1 for magic 2)
- You have magic 2 but also an essence of 0.31, getting essence that low would have reduced your magic by 6... (I know the rules don't say your magic cap drops when you lose essence, but have you checked with your gm? And then are you spending your adjustment points to raise magic after getting cybered up? Again check it's going to fly with your gm)
- You need at least magic priority C to get Critical Strike 2, buying up magic with adjustment points does not give you power points

You pool calculations look right though

I have to ask though: why are you making an adept? with the amount of Bioware you are throwing in I'm not sure it's worth going for the magic side of things

Shinobi Killfist

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« Reply #21 on: (00:11:56/09-12-19) »
Without augmentations of some form it takes a str of 7 to get unarmed DV of 4, a troll will do it with str 5 thanks to the dermal deposits

Yeah.  But I cant conceive of a street sam not taking bone density style ware. Its the only way to get more soak. Maybe at char gen they might pass because delta is pretty affordable just availability 7 so out of char gen limits.

I never got any bone enhancements increasing the damage like they do. Its been weird since they showed up. They are just built in brass knucks. Though no idea why they help you soak vs bullets but hey its tradition.

Moonrunner

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« Reply #22 on: (00:44:11/09-12-19) »
So breaking it down you have:
Attributes A for 32 points
Skills ?
Resources ?
Magic D
Metatype C? for Elf and 9 points?

Dermal Deposits bought as a quality?

Some things that stand out:
- I'm not sure if you have spent all your adjustment points (I see 2 spent? 1 for edge 2 and 1 for magic 2)
- You have magic 2 but also an essence of 0.31, getting essence that low would have reduced your magic by 6... (I know the rules don't say your magic cap drops when you lose essence, but have you checked with your gm? And then are you spending your adjustment points to raise magic after getting cybered up? Again check it's going to fly with your gm)
- You need at least magic priority C to get Critical Strike 2, buying up magic with adjustment points does not give you power points

You pool calculations look right though

I have to ask though: why are you making an adept? with the amount of Bioware you are throwing in I'm not sure it's worth going for the magic side of things


Hobbes created the character for me.  Here is what he wrote for it:

"
Metatype   E
Attributes   A
Skills   C
Magic   D
Resources   B

   
S   5 (9)
A   7 (11)
R   5 (8  )
B   3  (+4 to Soak)
I   5
L   2
C   2
W   3
Magic 1
Essence 0.31
Edge 2

                     Karma
Close Combat   6   
Stealth          4   
Perception          5   
Athletics           5   
Engineering   1    5
Con                   1    5
Influence           1    5
Outdoors           1    5
     
Specializations     
Archery               5
Acting               5
Unarmed               5
Visual               5

Other Karma spends
Magic +1               5
Qualities               4
Nuyen               1
   Total:                50


Qualities
Dermal Deposits      12
Mentor Spirit, Thunderbird      10
Impaired Logic  2      -16
Addiction 1 Week      -2

Adept Powers   
Critical Strike   Thunderbird
Critical Strike   1 PP

Augment   
Bone Density   4  alpha
Muscle Replace   4  Used
Synap   3  Used

50,500 Nuyen remaining.  2 Knowledge skills remain.

7 DV Unarmed Damage, with 19 Dice.  Should be one-shotting most stuff.  Could pick up 2 more Karma from Negative Qualities if you want.

For a Katana user dump Str and Dermal Deposits, put the attribute points into Body and Charisma.  You lose a point of DV, but you're still scary."

sigfriedmcwild

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« Reply #23 on: (01:40:22/09-12-19) »
Aaaah, I see.. the full numbers make sense

Strictly legal by RAW, but I'm pretty sure there's a couple of things that are not quite in the spirit.
Specifically under RAW the following things happen:
Pick magic D, this gives you 1 magic and 1 power point.
Drop essence to 0.31, this causes you to lose 6 magic, however the adept section can be interpreted as you not losing the power point. Also in previous editions this would have dropped your magic cap to 0, it's unclear if the fact this is not mentioned in sr6 is an oversight or deliberate
Buy Magic 1 with karma, it's unclear if this actually gives you a power point during character creation...

The stats you posted above are correct, other than the magic score which should be 1 not 2. I would really check this character with your gm before playing though

Or your could drop the magic part completely, and find yourself with some extra attribute points. All you lose is the 2 points of DV from Critical Strike (but you are still hitting as hard as panther xxl)

Michael Chandra

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« Reply #24 on: (02:28:01/09-12-19) »
Note that Hobbes is following 'if step 3 impacts step 4, and you can take a quality to make your attribute point or skill point expense legal, then obviously you can do chargen in any random order'.

Which I do not follow and not many GMs will. So even if we do not get burnout rules for Adepts, chargen order is FIRST karma, THEN Gear. So your adept would have to buy magic back in-game, again using the lack of burnout rules. You cannot buy the point back in chargen.

(Heck, under the 'any order' rule you could spend karma on a skill or attribute then points. Good luck trying to convince your GM of that.)
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Moonrunner

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« Reply #25 on: (02:39:47/09-12-19) »
Note that Hobbes is following 'if step 3 impacts step 4, and you can take a quality to make your attribute point or skill point expense legal, then obviously you can do chargen in any random order'.

Which I do not follow and not many GMs will. So even if we do not get burnout rules for Adepts, chargen order is FIRST karma, THEN Gear. So your adept would have to buy magic back in-game, again using the lack of burnout rules. You cannot buy the point back in chargen.

(Heck, under the 'any order' rule you could spend karma on a skill or attribute then points. Good luck trying to convince your GM of that.)

I am not sure I'm following all you are saying here.

sigfriedmcwild

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« Reply #26 on: (02:44:52/09-12-19) »
He's saying that the karma spend used to buy magic up from 0 to 1 by RAW happens before the bioware is bought. But before bioware is bought you already have 1 magic so you can't buy 1 point for 5 karma and even if you did, you would lose it as soon as you start buying all the bioware.

Which circles back to: it's probably not worth it to invest in magic at all, if you drop that the character is perfectly fine and legal under any reading of the rules.

Michael Chandra

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« Reply #27 on: (03:45:53/09-12-19) »
That yes. You're better off just playing a Street Sam.
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