[fougerec99]

I see reference to Unarmed Damage being Str/2 but I can't actually find that listed anywhere.  Is it actually stated (and if so on which page).

I'm not sure if it was just my tired eyes missing it or if it's legitimately not mentioned.

[Michael Chandra]

It's missing. Check my change blindness thread.

[R Villiers]

"If the attack is successful, the attacker does their unarmed combat damage (Strength/2, rounded up) plus net hits." page 111.

[FastJack]

"If the attack is successful, the attacker does their unarmed combat damage (Strength/2, rounded up) plus net hits." page 111.

Those are specifically for the Grapple rules. Ideally, it's the same when you're punching someone outside a Grapple, but it's not official yet.

[Stainless Steel Devil Rat]

what exactly is the DV for unarmed damage is very much being hammered out once and for all.

[markelphoenix]

I mean, given that Dermal Deposit of Trolls list [str/2+1]P, along with Grapple damage code for unarmed, strongly implies Str/2 S is default Unarmed damage.

[Stainless Steel Devil Rat]

I mean, given that Dermal Deposit of Trolls list [str/2+1]P, along with Grapple damage code for unarmed, strongly implies Str/2 S is default Unarmed damage.

Indeed it does.

[penllawen]

what exactly is the DV for unarmed damage is very much being hammered out once and for all.

Argh!

With all due respect to the hard-working errata team [1], and intending for the criticism here to be pointed directly at Catalyst... There were $200 special edition CRBs on sale at GenCon. People, presumably, bought them. Two hundred dollars! Is it not a bit bloody late to still be changing details as basic as the DV for unarmed damage?!

I feel like more than half the criticism threads here end up with someone from the errata team tapping their nose and saying "don't worry, we know, it's gonna get fixed." And on one level that's good. But these are not small changes. These are not reword-for-clarity, or oops-the-page-reflow-dropped-a-table, or oh-that-quality-is-imbalanced. These are big, sweeping, rewrite-a-chunk-of-that-subsystem changes. Or small changes to very fundamental values that underpin big chunks of the game.

At what point do we ask Catalyst "why are you even selling this thing right now?"

[1] Who are hard-working heroes. I am well aware they got access to the docs really late and have been scrambling to catch up ever since.

[fougerec99]

I feel like more than half the criticism threads here end up with someone from the errata team tapping their nose and saying "don't worry, we know, it's gonna get fixed." And on one level that's good. But these are not small changes. These are not reword-for-clarity, or oops-the-page-reflow-dropped-a-table, or oh-that-quality-is-imbalanced. These are big, sweeping, rewrite-a-chunk-of-that-subsystem changes. Or small changes to very fundamental values that underpin big chunks of the game.

That's what has me questioning my desire to support the game past the core book.  I can understand, even if I don't like, design changes.  I can understand a few typos here or there.  I can't fathom how any company can release a game that's missing core information that absolutely should have been caught.  If this edition was someone's first introduction to SR then it's a pretty poor one.

[Shinobi Killfist]

I feel like more than half the criticism threads here end up with someone from the errata team tapping their nose and saying "don't worry, we know, it's gonna get fixed." And on one level that's good. But these are not small changes. These are not reword-for-clarity, or oops-the-page-reflow-dropped-a-table, or oh-that-quality-is-imbalanced. These are big, sweeping, rewrite-a-chunk-of-that-subsystem changes. Or small changes to very fundamental values that underpin big chunks of the game.

That's what has me questioning my desire to support the game past the core book.  I can understand, even if I don't like, design changes.  I can understand a few typos here or there.  I can't fathom how any company can release a game that's missing core information that absolutely should have been caught.  If this edition was someone's first introduction to SR then it's a pretty poor one.

Also while the errata team is working hard on this stuff aren’t they potentially subject to the same issues that made the initial um draft. By being just another echo chamber. If you are going to go through the process of rewriting large chunks of the rules maybe open it up to the community.

[dezmont]

At a certain point the question also becomes 'are the errata team essentially writing another draft and deserve credit and pay as such."

[fougerec99]

Also while the errata team is working hard on this stuff aren’t they potentially subject to the same issues that made the initial um draft. By being just another echo chamber. If you are going to go through the process of rewriting large chunks of the rules maybe open it up to the community.

I think part of the reason why D&D 5E worked as well as it did out of the gate was because there where thousands of playtesters and I don't recall being under an NDA for it either.  It was, basically, crowdsourced playtesting and it paid off for them.

SR6 smacks of limited resources, time crunch and likely an editorial mandate relating to page count.  It feels half baked and rushed.

[Typhus]

At what point do we ask Catalyst "why are you even selling this thing right now?"

A week or so ago, at least.  The same company that already made this choice is not going to spontaneously develop ethics. 

For those who feel motivated to defend this edition, I suggest you get some copy pasta cooked up, because the conversations you are having this week will be happening over and over for most of at least the first year of this run. This is your life now. 

Good luck.

[penllawen]

I think part of the reason why D&D 5E worked as well as it did out of the gate was because there where thousands of playtesters and I don't recall being under an NDA for it either.  It was, basically, crowdsourced playtesting and it paid off for them.

Imagine how different the tone and content of the current conversations would be if the exact same 6e ruleset had dropped (without finalised art/layout) at GenCon as an open playtest beta edition, with a robust process for gathering feedback, leading up to a final release at GenCon 2020. Hell, price it at $10 and tie that into the feedback system to reduce noise and recoup some expenses now instead of deferring all revenue a year.

[Lormyr]

SSD's response leads me to believe the damage calculation will be changed. Spidey sense is tingling and what not.