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6e Play/Stress Test

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Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #45 on: (12:50:35/09-03-19) »
...
Sovereign sends in his 2 service spirit, saying "Being as subtle as you can, scout out this building and report back to me how many floors it has, anything magically active you see or encounter, and the number of armed metahumans you see.". The spirit departs to do this.
...

I enjoy seeing idiosyncrasies such as these. Telling an armed person from an unarmed person via assensing isn't something I would have thought even possible.

I've always understood that from astral, a gun is essentially impossible to discern from a clipboard. In my understanding, all that you can tell from assensing a nonmagical item is what the bearer or owner feels, in an emotional sense, about the object.  And in either case, probably little to nothing, if it's corp-issued gear.  Your wedding ring or your locket with your mum's portrait inside it? You can't tell what specifically it is in a physical sense, but you MIGHT be able to reason it out based on the specific emotional importance it has to its wearer...
« Last Edit: (12:54:16/09-03-19) by Stainless Steel Devil Rat »
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, youíre fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #46 on: (14:29:44/09-03-19) »
I know these are well optimised characters. But does this seem to anyone else like an awful lot of power being channelled around for very little cost?

Not to me.  The 5e group I run with considers F6 spirits "low force" and routinely throw F12 combat spells for no drain.

This display didn't even raise my eyebrows.
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, youíre fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

Hobbes

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« Reply #47 on: (14:32:19/09-03-19) »
Did you all have fun, and was it a flavor of fun you'd like to do again?

penllawen

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« Reply #48 on: (14:46:24/09-03-19) »
I know these are well optimised characters. But does this seem to anyone else like an awful lot of power being channelled around for very little cost?

Not to me.  The 5e group I run with considers F6 spirits "low force" and routinely throw F12 combat spells for no drain.

This display didn't even raise my eyebrows.
Is that a good thing?

penllawen

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« Reply #49 on: (14:47:02/09-03-19) »
I enjoy seeing idiosyncrasies such as these. Telling an armed person from an unarmed person via assensing isn't something I would have thought even possible.

I've always understood that from astral, a gun is essentially impossible to discern from a clipboard.
SR5: "Objects that are neither magical nor living do not have an aura; they are featureless grey shadows of their physical form. They can, however, pick up impressions for a limited time from being in contact with living auras. A teddy bear in the Barrens might pick up a childís fear, a wedding ring its ownerís sense of love and joy, or a murder weapon an aura of rage."

Street Grimoire: "When discussing the nature of magic, itís also important to consider the nature of the astral plane. The astral is a confusing place to the untrained. Life illuminates and emotions color a grey and shadowy mirror of the physical world. When astral projecting, you do not hear the din of the physical world, nor can you read written words. Technological displays and holographic images donít exist even as shadows on the astral plane. All the lifeless objects in the physical world appear as dull and intangible shadows to astral forms, allowing them to easily pass through. Details on these objects (color, texture, smell) are almost impossible to understand; a bookís words are impossible to read, as is the context of the writing unless itís tied to some emotion that the character can perceive. All life has intangible auras that illuminate the astral world, while emotions can color them. Emotions can also color non-living objects if they have some significance to metahumanity (individually or as a whole). Within the silence, the magician can hear the crackle and hiss of mana being drawn into a spell or the subtle harmonies or cacophony of aspect ed mana as it flows through the astral plane."

A lot depends on your interpretation of what is meant by "grey shadows" and "grey and shadowy mirror". I think it's ultimately a bit ambiguous, perhaps intentionally so. My reading has always been closer to Lormyr's than yours, based mostly on "details on these objects (color, texture, smell) are almost impossible to understand" implying that non-details like, say, the shape of the object are possible to understand.

There's also questions about how much sense a spirit can make sense of technology when it looks at it, as opposed to an astrally active metahuman. Can they tell a pistol from a flashlight? Or a car from a helicopter? I tend towards "not often" on questions like this.

GuardDuty

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« Reply #50 on: (14:54:17/09-03-19) »
Now I have this vision of a spirit tiptoeing around, hiding in doorways and behind potted plants like a cartoon character, spying on the security because he needs to know how many armed guards there are, and he was told to be "as subtle as possible".

Hobbes

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« Reply #51 on: (15:00:41/09-03-19) »
Now I have this vision of a spirit tiptoeing around, hiding in doorways and behind potted plants like a cartoon character, spying on the security because he needs to know how many armed guards there are, and he was told to be "as subtle as possible".

Essentially.  "...subtle as possible..." implies using the Stealth skill to sneak around just in case there is Astral observers.  Stealth/Sneaking totally works in the Astral and hiding behind things is generally the way to accomplish it.

Hobbes

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« Reply #52 on: (15:14:35/09-03-19) »
I know these are well optimised characters. But does this seem to anyone else like an awful lot of power being channelled around for very little cost?

Not to me.  The 5e group I run with considers F6 spirits "low force" and routinely throw F12 combat spells for no drain.

This display didn't even raise my eyebrows.
Is that a good thing?

Depends on the table expectations.  If the GM and players are all expecting it, all good.  Session 0 is important. 

Personally I expect Mages to pull off that kind of display regularly.  I also expect most mundane characters to try and pull off Anticipate frequently, while rocking 18 dice in their chosen specialty. 

Lormyr

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« Reply #53 on: (15:19:03/09-03-19) »
I know these are well optimised characters. But does this seem to anyone else like an awful lot of power being channelled around for very little cost?

The PCs didn't particularly roll hot, either. Most of those rolls are around the 33% statistical average, so it wasn't merely good luck. They burned some reagents to get there, but they don't cost much.

I have some strong thoughts on this that I will touch on once I finish typing the full recap. In part two I think it will become very obvious what I plan to say before I get to it.

Collateral is extremely awesome/unprofessional (delete as appropriate for the pink mohawkness of your table.) I can neither confirm nor deny his possible appearance as a future NPC in my campaign.

The moment I saw that character's name and how many grenades were on his sheet I knew we were going to be deep into Pink Mohawkville.

astral assensing and armed stuff

I largely agree with you, at least as far as 6e since it doesn't have the section that penllawen quoted from 5e below. This was Shaun's way of learning if there were any weapon foci present on anyone, and how many.

Not to me.  The 5e group I run with considers F6 spirits "low force" and routinely throw F12 combat spells for no drain.

This display didn't even raise my eyebrows.

These guys are the same in 5e. In 6e, soaking drain from spirits is easy, but managing to get services on oversummoned one's is surprisingly tough. Revenant's struggle just to get 3 with net at magic rating was real.

None of them built combat mages this time either, you just have Collateral instead. Grenades are far more dangerous than aoe combat spells out of chargen though, with the sole exception of vs. spirits.

Essentially.  "...subtle as possible..." implies using the Stealth skill to sneak around just in case there is Astral observers.  Stealth/Sneaking totally works in the Astral and hiding behind things is generally the way to accomplish it.

Hobbes gets it.

Did you all have fun, and was it a flavor of fun you'd like to do again?

Allow me to address this once I finish typing up the recap.

penllawen

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« Reply #54 on: (15:55:53/09-03-19) »
Personally I expect Mages to pull off that kind of display regularly.  I also expect most mundane characters to try and pull off Anticipate frequently, while rocking 18 dice in their chosen specialty.
And now your GM has put +6-10 dice on all the NPCs and what has it got you in the end?

Hobbes

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« Reply #55 on: (16:40:32/09-03-19) »
Personally I expect Mages to pull off that kind of display regularly.  I also expect most mundane characters to try and pull off Anticipate frequently, while rocking 18 dice in their chosen specialty.
And now your GM has put +6-10 dice on all the NPCs and what has it got you in the end?

18 Dice is it's own reward.  And yes, sometimes the result of an optimized table is higher dice pool NPCs and higher thresholds.  Do it myself as a GM occasionally.  "Just roll more dice" is certainly a part of a Shadowrun GM's toolkit.

Shinobi Killfist

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« Reply #56 on: (17:08:04/09-03-19) »
...
Sovereign sends in his 2 service spirit, saying "Being as subtle as you can, scout out this building and report back to me how many floors it has, anything magically active you see or encounter, and the number of armed metahumans you see.". The spirit departs to do this.
...

I enjoy seeing idiosyncrasies such as these. Telling an armed person from an unarmed person via assensing isn't something I would have thought even possible.

I've always understood that from astral, a gun is essentially impossible to discern from a clipboard. In my understanding, all that you can tell from assensing a nonmagical item is what the bearer or owner feels, in an emotional sense, about the object.  And in either case, probably little to nothing, if it's corp-issued gear.  Your wedding ring or your locket with your mum's portrait inside it? You can't tell what specifically it is in a physical sense, but you MIGHT be able to reason it out based on the specific emotional importance it has to its wearer...

In 6e that might be the answer. The magic section is pretty lite on details for the astral world. Every other edition Iíd say it leaned more towards objects were black and white or in a greyscale but still discernible. The novels 1e-3e era it was very much just black and white vs color. People knew they were waking down a corridor, could see desks, or food stands etc and what they lacked in color they might pick up in emotional content.

Personally I think early editions have it right or better I guess Iíd say. Itís less evocative to me to just make everything shadowy masses. So if it changes to shadowy masses Iíd say itís a negative setting change for no rule convenience.

Lormyr

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« Reply #57 on: (17:09:48/09-03-19) »
Part 2, which is all I will have time to finish today. The last part should be ready in a day or two.

Scene 8: Having fun storming the castle

The lobby of the ward sports a bland aesthetic, a large front desk, and two wings (east and west) behind maglocked metal doors and gates. Three cameras in the lobby alone lets the team know that they should expect that literally everything they are doing is being monitored.

Sovereign alerts me that he will begin astrally perceiving, and assensing every non-combat round as they move through the place until he tells me otherwise. I tell him heard, and I'll address him further if/when it becomes relevant.

Lockdown swiftly puts a round in each camera, destroying them.

Subtlety no longer a concern, Cage tells Collateral he'll handle the door. Cage's player asks me if I am willing to allow bone density 4 to be a "specialized" door breaking "weapon", and I say sure, reasoning that the augmentation is similar to a hammer in both implementation and use and that allowing it will both be fun for him and at best save him 1 round of bashing doors. Cage grabs a hold of the east metal door with the maglock, and deftly rips the entire thing from its hinges and out of the frame [5 hits on 13 dice = 15P damage vs. the door's structure rating of 11]. Tossing the busted, twisted metal to the ground, he proceeds to grab a hold of the metal gate, wrenching the lock in half as he tears it from the latch and pushes it into the wall as well [9!? hits on 13 dice = 19P damage vs. the gate's structure rating of 13].

The team falls in line 10 meters behind the two trolls and heads down the east wing. 2 more cameras in this hallway, both of which are treated to a round from Lockdown. As they pass the cells, and they are definitely cells, of the mentally ill patients in the ward the team is greeted to all manner of interactions from incoherent gibbering and blank catatonic stares to pleas for help from their individual demons and pleas for help from Dr. Ruiz and his staff. The team stops for a minute to talk to a particularly lucid elven woman, from whom they are told the following:

- There is a basement level under the ward made of strange stone, guarded by warriors with animal pelts wielding clubs with broken glass or sharp rocks in them, where the Dr. and his staff perform unearthly rituals. Patients die down below, and the staff offers blood, or prayers, or something far more sinister to unknown forces.

- A few weeks ago, the staff contacted something, and that something got loose. It killed staff and patients alike, and broke into the upper ward from the levels below. They could hear its whispers in their minds, promising an end, and the comforts of the void. It drove some of the patients completely howling mad, some into gibbering fear, and others still into reverence of the entity. The carnage of combat was heard off and on for over an hour before heavy military personnel arrived and managed to contain whatever happened.

She begs them to release her and the other patients, but the team is conflicted. They aren't eager to see anyone else die in this hell hole but also can't be sure that releasing the clearly disturbed people of the ward won't end up causing a worse fate.

As they debate this, a group of six human orderly's, wearing white uniforms and brandishing stun batons, comes running down the hallway towards the team (I used the Sons of Sauran Brute template, pg. 205, removing the light pistol, knucks, and firearms skill and replacing them with a stun baton). One look at the manifested spirits, obviously cybered, assault rifle toting, grenade brandishing, clearly means business group causes the orderlys to come to a screeching halt halfway down the hall. Sovereign takes one look at them and calmly says "For the low, low price of that maglock keycard on your belt there, we didn't see you, and you didn't see us. Pretty good deal!", to which the orderly's nod vigorously, drops his keycard, and runs out of the building (I didn't make him roll; he got a give me).

The team promises the elf they will come back to help once the threats are neutralized, and continues down the corridor to another maglocked door and gate. Sovereign swipes his way through with the orderly's keycard, and the team continues down the hall. At this point Sovereign's previous astral perception declaration comes into play as he witnesses what appears to be three Force 6 spirits of water coming towards the group, only these spirits are crimson in color. As literally everyone on the team lacks knowledge skills, no one has the slightest clue what that could mean, and as the blood spirits (I used water spirits, just re-skinned for thematics) manifest, the team braces themselves for a real fight.

We roll Initiative, and have the following order: Collateral (32 on 5d6+15), Revenant (28 on 3d6+18), Cage (25 on 4d6+13), Sovereign (23 on 3d6+12), blood spirits (22 on 2d6+14), Revenant's water spirit (21 on 2d6+14), Sovereign's air spirit (20 on 2d6+16), Lockdown (15 on 3d6+9).

Collateral asks how far down the hallway the blood spirits manifested, and I tell him 12 meters from Cage and Revenant, 22 meters from you. He shrugs, looks at the team and says "You knew this was coming!" and uses a major action to throw a previously readied grenade. All three blood spirits use the Avoid Incoming action, while Collateral secretly writes down his target location, and I secretly write down the direction the spirits move. We reveal to his target being ground zero on the center spirit, and the spirits moving towards the group. Neither side gains edge [10 AR vs. 12 DR], and Collateral makes his attack roll, landing the grenade exactly where he wished [7 hits on 20 dice for throwing, rolling an 8 on 2d6 for scatter minus 9 for his net hits and near range]. The three spirits roll to see how much distance they make with their Avoid Incoming action, making it a measly 1, 2, and 2 meters from their previous position [1, 2, and 2 hits on 7 dice; 13 dice for Agility + Athletics for Avoid Incoming - 6 dodge penalty for ground zero target]. Each of the three spirits takes a second minor action to take the Hit the Dirt action, reducing their incoming damage by -2. This places all three spirits within the "close" (1-3 meters) range of the explosion, resulting in an incoming 10P each (12 for range, -2 hit the dirt). The spirits take 1P, 2P, and 1P damage from the explosion [3 hits, 2 hits, and 3 hits on 6 dice for soak, adjusted by an additional -6 damage for immunity to normal weapons].

All of Collateral, Lockdown, Sovereign, and the team's spirits are outside of the 20 meter explosion radius, but Cage and Revenant are not. Cage does some quick math and realizes he'd need 9 hits on 14 dice to clear the blast radius, so simply decides to use a minor action for Hit the Dirt instead of Avoid Incoming. Revenant knows he has no chance, and Hits the Dirt as well, resulting in both looking down an incoming 6P (8 - 2 for hitting the dirt) for near range. Both gain a point of Edge [AR 10 vs. DR 17 and 18], and Cage ends up taking 1P damage [5 hits on 12 dice for soak], and Revenant 1P damage [5 hits on 13 dice for soak].

Collateral asks Cage and Revenant if they are good for another blast, they give a thumbs up, and Collateral uses his second major action to throw his off-hand readied grenade. This time the spirits can't move, and Collateral successfully places the grenade squarely on the back on the center blood spirit [8 hits on 20 dice for throwing, rolling a 5 on 2d6 for scatter minus 10 for his net hits and near range]. All three spirits face down 14P damage (16 - 2 for hitting the dirt), and take 7P, 6P, and 5P from the second explosion [1 hits, 2 hits, and 3 hits on 6 dice for soak, adjusted by an additional -6 damage for immunity to normal weapons].

Once again, both Cage and Revenant deal with 6P, and both gain a second point of Edge. Cage suffers 1P [5 hits on 12 dice for soak after spending 2 edge to turn a 4 into a 5], and Revenant takes no damage [6 hits on 13 dice after spending 2 edge to turn a 4 into a 5]. We end Collateral's turn with Cage at 2P damage, Revenant at 1P damage, and the spirits having taken 8, 8, and 6 damage.

On Revenant's turn he takes a second minor action to stand up, and his major action for full defense.

On Cage's turn, he takes his second minor action to stand up, a third minor action to move 10 meters adjacent to the least damaged spirit, and a major action to stomp in it's head with his big, trollish boot. Already at his Edge gain cap for the turn, his overwhelming AR of 21 goes to complete waste, and he successfully hits the prone spirit for 13P [7 hits on 18 dice for close combat vs. 4 hits on 10 dice for defense (-4 for wound penalty and prone). The spirit takes 5P from the attack 9 [2 hits on 6 dice for soak, adjusted by an additional -6 damage for immunity to normal weapons], and is destroyed.

Sovereign uses a minor action to move 10 meters adjacent to Revenant, and then a major action to banish one of the remaining spirits. He successfully removes the last 2 remaining services, causing the spirit to depart [5 hits on 13 dice vs. 3 hits on 10 dice (-2 for wound penalty)]. He takes no drain from doing so [7 hits on 22 dice for drain vs. 6 from x2 spirit's hits].

The final blood spirit spends a third minor action to stand, and a major action to use elemental attack on Cage, missing. [5 hits on 11 dice (-2 from wound penalty] vs. 5 hits on 13 dice].

Sovereign's air spirit spends a minor action to move 10 meters adjacent to Sovereign, and a major action to use elemental attack on the blood spirit, hitting for 7P [5 hits on 15 dice vs. 4 hits on 12 dice (-2 wound penalty]. The blood spirit takes 5P electricity damage, dying. [2 hits on 6 dice for soak].

The immediate threat over, Revenant casts heal on himself, buying 3 hits and buying the 3 drain. Sovereign casts heal on Cage, restoring 1 CM [6 hits on 14 dice - 5 for terrible essence]. Collateral readies two more grenades with a cowboy-like holler, saying to the trolls "You boys soak shrapnel like a hilltop hooker soaks blow! Remind me to get you boys a drink later!". Revenant frowns, Cage replies "I LIKE BRATWURST!", Lockdown face palms, and the team moves on in their previously stated formation.

Scene 9: With regards from Dr. Ruiz

The team continues down hallways of cells and patients in the throws of madness, Lockdown putting a round into every camera they encounter, Sovereign getting through 1 more set of doors worth of use from their keycard before the security spider changes the access codes, at which point Cage resumes ripping doors and gates out of walls.

Sovereign's spirit returns, reporting that it found no active magic on the first floor and no objects it can certainly identify as weapons. In the lower level it encountered 6 magically active individuals stronger than it, each with a magical weapon, and a ward that led further inward that it could not penetrate. The entire place with soaked with insanity, sorrow, and fear. Sovereign sighs and informs the group. Most of them are ponderous, except for Collateral who cheerfully exclaims he has 27 explosives left, and continues onward undaunted.

After several more hallways, and more jazz for Lockdown and Revenant, the team enters what appears to be a second lobby, with a downward leading stairway behind a security door. Hiding in the lobby are 6 Aztechnology Leopard Guard (I used the Renraku Red Samurai template on pg. 208). They are very well hidden with their teamwork Stealth test at 7 hits. As the team is coming down the hall just before entering the room I have them make visual perception tests. Only Revenant succeeds [8 hits on 16 dice], noticing some shifting shadows and a boot lace sticking out from the corner of a desk. Revenant quickly waves the group back, and lowers his hand as a sign for them to take cover, which they do as best as possible in the hallway (poorly; cover I). He walks into the room about 1/5 of the way in, clears his throat, and says "I see your bootlace, douchebag. Pull yours balls out of your purses and lets do this.", in an attempt to taunt them.

Rolling Initiative, we get the following order: Collateral (33 on 5d6+15), Revenant (30 on 3d6+18), Cage (26 on 4d6+13), Leopard Guard (23 on 3d6+10), Sovereign (22 on 3d6+12), Sovereign's air spirit (21 on 2d6+16), Revenant's water spirit (20 on 2d6+14), Lockdown (17 on 3d6+9).

Collateral, Cage, and Sovereign each buy 3 hits on their surprise test to avoid surprise from the enemies they can't see, while poor Lockdown is surprised (2 hits on 8 dice).

Collateral delays.

Revenant uses a minor action to walk another 7 meters into the room, putting him about halfway into the 20 meter room, and a major action for full defense.

Cage delays.

The 6 Leopard Guard, weapons already set to BF and readied, rise from their cover (Cover III), using a minor action and major action to fire on the cocky and incredibly scrawny troll. They spend 4 of their 7 team edge to pre-edge their attack roll, to which Revenant responds with spending a minor action to Dodge. Revenant gains a point of edge [14 AR (12 + 4 grunts - 4 BF vs. DR 18), and the 5 grunt grouped Leopard Guard, much to their disbelief, miss entirely [11 hits on 25 pre-edged dice vs. 13 hits on 35 dice]. The 6th guard, seeing what happens when bullets are shot at the skinny troll, fires on the surprised Lockdown 30 meters away. Lockdown gains a point of edge [AR 8 (12 -4 BF) vs. DR 12], and Lockdown is successfully hit for 6P [5 hits on 16 dice for firearms after losing 1 hit to a forced re-roll from edge vs. 4 hits on 13 dice (12 + Cover I) for defense], taking 2P damage [4 hits on 10 dice for soak].

Collateral undelays, using a major action to throw the first grenade more than 30 meters towards the end of the room the Leopard Guard and Revenant are in. The LG use a second minor action to avoid incoming, leaving their cover and running towards the team. The LG group gain an edge from the attack [AR 10 vs. DR 16]. The first two, who were at ground zero range, both make it a measly 3 meters forward and fall prone [3 hits on 8 dice (14 - 6 dodge penalty for ground zero), taking 7P and 8P damage (3 hits and 2 hits on 5 dice for soak vs. 10P (12 - 2 free prone with 3+ hits on avoid incoming)]. The remaining four make it 4 meters, 5 meters, 5 meters, and 6 meters forward, all within 2 meters of Revenant, and fall prone [4 hits, 5 hits, 5 hits, and 6 hits on 12 dice (14 - 2 near range)], taking 5P, 4P, 4P, and 1P damage [1 hit, 2 hits, 2 hits, and 5 hits! on 5 dice for soak vs. 6P]. Revenant uses his third minor action to Hit the Dirt, gains a second point of edge from this attack [AR 10 vs. DR 18], and takes no damage from the near range explosion [6 hits on 13 dice for soak  vs. 6P].

Collateral sees the sea of "elite" military forces within arms reach of Revenant, gives the troll a pleading look, who sighs dramatically and shrugs his acceptance. Collateral squees with glee, and uses a second major action to throw his second readied grenade 3 meters to the left of Revenant, on top of two prone guards. Collateral cannot miss [13!? wtf lol hits on 20 dice, he doesn't even need to roll scatter], the LG team gain a second point of edge [AR 10 vs. DR 16], Revenant does not because he has already gained 2 this round, and the two guards at ground zero cannot possibly survive the 14P damage and erupt in a shower of gore. At close range, Revenant takes 3P damage (7 hits on 13 dice for soak after spending 2 edge to turn a 4 into a 5 vs. 10P], and the two LG take 7P and 8P [3 hits and 2 hits on 5 dice for soak vs. 10P], which is sufficient to end both with their damage from the previous grenade. The remaining two guards towards the back of the room, at near range, take another 4P and 3P damage [2 hits and 3 hits on 5 soak after using edge to turn a 4 into a 5 vs. 6P], also resulting in their deaths from their previous damage.

Collateral hoots and hollers around, readying another pair of grenades and hugs Revenant with the grenades in his hands, who casts heal on himself, buying 3 hits on spellcasting and the 3 drain to repair all of his damage. Meanwhile, Sovereign casts heal on Lockdown, restoring 1 CM [6 hits on 14 dice for spellcasting - 5 for terrible essence].

Though this security door is far sturdier (structure rating 16), Cage still makes short work of it after three thunderous blows, and the team descends several flights of stairs into the depths below.

Shinobi Killfist

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« Reply #58 on: (17:22:01/09-03-19) »

Revenant games the system like a boss. ...

So to summarise across the mage's pre-run prep, we have (across two characters):
  • Revenant: 5x buff spells, all resulting in +4 to the stat, total of 3 boxes of Stun, no sustain penalties
  • Revenant: 4x spirit summon attempts (all Force 6), 1 box of Stun damage in total
  • Sovereign: 3x buff spells, all resulting in +4 to the stat, no Stun damage
  • Sovereign: 3x spirit summons (all Force 6), no Stun damage

...and Revenant heals all his Stun damage easily before the actual run starts.

I know these are well optimised characters. But does this seem to anyone else like an awful lot of power being channelled around for very little cost?

The PCs didn't particularly roll hot, either. Most of those rolls are around the 33% statistical average, so it wasn't merely good luck. They burned some reagents to get there, but they don't cost much.



How much people optimize or game a system is a table thing. And on some level Iíd say needed. Do players have to play dumb to make things fair. The rules represent how the world works so to speak. So of humming showtunes means you get 100 automatic successes you canít blame people for humming showtunes.

One type of character like mages being able to game the system more can be a rule issue. Personally I think 6e missed a opportunity to get rid of or seriously nerf the ability to permanently sustain spells, focusses in general and get spirits under control power wise. They nerfed some spells youíd want to sustain which I think is the wrong track. Nerf sustaining and stacking not the spell itself. Donít be surprised if a mage starts off with 20 dice is summoning air spirits or something and consistently summons for 8/9 spirits in many campaigns. 6 magic+ 6 conjuring specialization summoning mentor spirit and rating 4 focus all easily obtainable out of the gates.

penllawen

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« Reply #59 on: (18:16:50/09-03-19) »
One type of character like mages being able to game the system more can be a rule issue. Personally I think 6e missed a opportunity to get rid of or seriously nerf the ability to permanently sustain spells, focusses in general and get spirits under control power wise.
I agree completely.