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SR6 Character Creation question

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MTCE

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« on: (19:16:19/08-14-19) »
I realize many of the posters here don't actually have the SR6 CRB yet. Those of you who do, however, perhaps can answer this question. Step 4 Spend Customization Karma (pg 66) seems pretty specific that the 50 bonus Karma can ONLY be spent on Attributes, Skills, and extra nuyen for Gear. Yet the character advancement chart on the next page includes Karma costs for new specializations, spells/complex forms, and Initiation/Submersion. Can you buy such things with the bonus Karma or not? I think no but (naturally) my players want to burn down the city right out of the gate because they're drekheads.

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #1 on: (19:30:20/08-14-19) »
I'm of the persuasion that step 4 gives an exhaustive list of things that karma may be spent on: attributes, skills, qualities, and resources.  So, no spells. No bonding foci. No initiating. Such things are covered by the character advancement section that follows the steps for character generation, and the steps of character generation never give access to that section.
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, youíre fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

Hephaestus

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« Reply #2 on: (21:42:02/08-14-19) »
I don't think the intention was to be ONLY for those things, or it would have been explicitly stated. It doesn't really matter if the skill/attribute points come from priority or karma, they get used the same way.

And since things like Exotic Weapon forced Specializations exist, and any character can walk out of chargen with an Ares Alpha or a Yamaha Raiden that requires that skill to not blow yourself up with.

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #3 on: (21:49:16/08-14-19) »
See, that's the thing: It WAS explicitly stated.

Step 4 only allows those 4 things.  No other character generation step says "oh, and you can also spend karma on the stuff in the Character Advancement section, too".
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, youíre fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

KatoHearts

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« Reply #4 on: (22:47:36/08-14-19) »
There's no limit on carrying karma over from gen or anything that says you lose unspent karma. So do it after gen I guess. Additionally, the example characters, such as the mage's spell list, don't line up with what's possible in chargen currently so it's just not clear. Either the archetypes are flawed or the chargen system is.
« Last Edit: (03:12:50/08-15-19) by KatoHearts »

Michael Chandra

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« Reply #5 on: (23:43:13/08-14-19) »
There's a very good chance the list is exhaustive. In SR5 it was too so no Initiation in chargen, only in full character advancement after your first run.
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markelphoenix

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« Reply #6 on: (08:09:01/08-15-19) »
From what I've been hearing on CharGen, sounds like it's a bit off. Unless I am mistaken, Rank A Magic is 4 Magic, which gives 8 Spells, and no way to get more Spells in Chargen....

FastJack

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« Reply #7 on: (08:10:17/08-15-19) »
I know that's being discussed in Errata, my own feelings are that if you up magic in CharGen, it ups spells/power points. We'll see how it shakes out.

Michael Chandra

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« Reply #8 on: (08:11:41/08-15-19) »
For PP I'd like that but I do like your magic priority hurts you as a mage or mystic.
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kr3wZ

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« Reply #9 on: (14:08:40/08-15-19) »
I have a question regarding Qualities at CharGen.  It states that you can have a max of 6, and your bonus karma can't go over 20.  No mention of what happens with the karma you spent.

Then in the next section about spending karma at CharGen, it mentions you get 50 bonus karma to spend on other stuff.

I'm just assuming the deficit of karma (if any) after the first part comes out of that 50 bonus you get for the next step?

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #10 on: (14:26:35/08-15-19) »
The way I see it:

You identify the qualities you want in step 3.

You pay for them in step 4. (and step 4 is where you get your up-to-20 bonus karma from negative qualities, as well)

It makes easy sense that way.
« Last Edit: (14:31:45/08-15-19) by Stainless Steel Devil Rat »
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, youíre fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

kr3wZ

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« Reply #11 on: (14:30:46/08-15-19) »
Quote
It makes easy sense that way.

It does, and that's how I read it at first.  Only after creating another character did I realize it never mentioned specifically what happens with the Karma if you come out with a negative amount.

Shinobi Killfist

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« Reply #12 on: (14:38:57/08-15-19) »
From how itís been described the keep net 20 makes sense to me. What I donít get is why they would limit where you can spend it if they allow you to save it. Is it really that big of a issue to have to wait until after your first run before you get 4 spells or whatever.

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #13 on: (14:44:43/08-15-19) »
From how itís been described the keep net 20 makes sense to me. What I donít get is why they would limit where you can spend it if they allow you to save it. Is it really that big of a issue to have to wait until after your first run before you get 4 spells or whatever.

Speaking to opinion:

I like that the magic priority selection has real bite... if you can't spend karma on spells you can't just pick Magic D and spend a bunch of karma to shore it up to match what someone who picked A will have.

That being said: my opinion isn't a formal ruling.
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, youíre fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

Michael Chandra

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« Reply #14 on: (14:48:27/08-15-19) »
Quote
It makes easy sense that way.

It does, and that's how I read it at first.  Only after creating another character did I realize it never mentioned specifically what happens with the Karma if you come out with a negative amount.
There is a rule example hinting negatives help get more customisation karma but you're right the section is suffering from change blindness that makes it tricky for new people. Intent is that the net bonus/cost carries over into the 50.
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