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(SR6) Attack and Defence Value

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mrchrislackey

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« on: <08-09-19/0904:54> »
I just played the box set with my regular group. And we had a lot of problems, but mostly a good time.

One thing we couldn't get our head around was Attack & Defence Values. This seemed to us to be very unnecessary. Is there a reason to have it other than to give out Edge?  And if that's it, why not base it on dice pools? Why have this extra step?

By the end of the game, we just ignored it and I handed out edge based on pools and circumstances and player narration.

Magic worked really well. I love the new version of it. Had a few setting questions, dealing with what tech could and couldn't do. Shadowrun is a very complicated setting.

Michael Chandra

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« Reply #1 on: <08-09-19/0916:59> »
AR vs DR basically gives Armor a point other than its modifications. In previous editions it was included in your soak rolls while weapons had Armor Piercing and Recoil, they moved all of that into AR vs DR, which means less variations in damage taken and simpler math.

I strongly recommend against using dicepools for AR vs DR instead. That way you're just making the better party even better, rather than giving a benefit to the person tactical enough to bring the right toys to the situation. Even if I have a massive dicepool, if I use a gun at a bad range the opponent should get some form of benefit, not me. And by ignoring AR vs DR, you're risking that gear will become incredibly unbalanced since they're stats heavily included in their balance.
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mrchrislackey

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« Reply #2 on: <08-09-19/1008:58> »
So you're not supposed to roll pools? I got the impression die rolls were based off your skill and attribute? Or you're saying, change the rules?

Banshee

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« Reply #3 on: <08-09-19/1032:02> »
no, you use AR and DR to determine edge distribution then you roll your dice pools to determine outcome
Robert "Banshee" Volbrecht
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Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #4 on: <08-09-19/1035:45> »
I just played the box set with my regular group. And we had a lot of problems, but mostly a good time.

Welcome to Shadowrun! I've been a fan for all of the 30 years it's been around, and here's to hoping you have the same kind of fun I've had with it!

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One thing we couldn't get our head around was Attack & Defence Values. This seemed to us to be very unnecessary. Is there a reason to have it other than to give out Edge?  And if that's it, why not base it on dice pools? Why have this extra step?

At the end of the day, yes the AR to DR relationship is about edge.  However, if you ditch that in place of awarding edge based on dice pools alone, then nothing much matters other than dice pool size.

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By the end of the game, we just ignored it and I handed out edge based on pools and circumstances and player narration.

I, like MC above, don't recommend replacing dice pools with AR/DR for edge gain mechanic... but a RPG is about having fun. And in addition to AR/DR edge is also supposed to be awarded based on tactics and circumstances, so all in all you're not doing anything WRONG.  Especially if everyone had fun!

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Magic worked really well. I love the new version of it. Had a few setting questions, dealing with what tech could and couldn't do. Shadowrun is a very complicated setting.

Indeed it is.  Places like this forum are a great resource for asking questions. There are always people eager to help!
Also remember that the beginner box isn't the "full" rules system.. it's designed to give you a taste of how it works.  Rules-wise, it's about 80% of the game really.  The most important stuff is there, but there's much more to dig into in the core rulebook.  The core rulebook also has more setting exposition as well.

 

RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, you’re fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

Michael Chandra

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« Reply #5 on: <08-09-19/1124:28> »
Stainless is right that in the end, your table should do what it enjoys. Just keep in mind that you're cutting off a lot of the balance of gear, so you may need to make some patches later on.

If you have any questions, feel free to ask. Unfortunately sometimes change blindness occurs, so for new people certain sections can end up confusing. And even then it's a big book, so confusion can always happen anyway.
How am I not part of the forum?? O_O I am both active and angry!