NEWS

6th World Box Set Play Experience

  • 114 Replies
  • 3339 Views

adzling

  • *
  • Prime Runner
  • *****
  • Posts: 3143
  • Telling it like it is
    • Building Better Security
« Reply #30 on: (18:34:01/06-25-19) »
Yeah it's the absurdist stuff that ends up rotting the game as rules lawyers get hold of them.

In a setting that's meant to be gritty and dangerous it ends up turning it into MiB where you can get eaten by a 50 meter long alien monster and bust out the side of it's rib-cage emerging with no ill effects or injuries then pick up your cricket hold-out and vaporize half a city block while your team-mate standing nearby holding the massive gun wonders WTF?

That makes for a fun camp movie romp but results in extremely shallow game play imho.


AJCarrington

  • *
  • Global Moderator
  • Prime Runner
  • *****
  • Posts: 3080
« Reply #31 on: (19:08:28/06-25-19) »
I wonder if there are ďdialsĒ around Edge to help convey different campaign styles? For example, less given out for grittier campaigns vs more for cinematic ones.

adzling

  • *
  • Prime Runner
  • *****
  • Posts: 3143
  • Telling it like it is
    • Building Better Security
« Reply #32 on: (19:34:08/06-25-19) »
you would have to replace the highly abstracted edge mechanic with something more related to reality.

Something like taking a negative modifier for shooting at someone at long range, or in the dark, or while running.

You know, stuff that is connected to reality and that you can guess at if you have common sense.

Shinobi Killfist

  • *
  • Ace Runner
  • ****
  • Posts: 1982
« Reply #33 on: (19:41:08/06-25-19) »
I wonder if there are ďdialsĒ around Edge to help convey different campaign styles? For example, less given out for grittier campaigns vs more for cinematic ones.

I think my only issue with edge is itís used as a replacement for core mechanics as opposed to a supplement. I donít mind how it seems to be gained and used but it doesnít work for replacing a modifier and itís odd that itís only really opposed tests as Iím assuming the slippery ledge you are walking on doesnít get a edge to use to make you fall as opposed to just having a threshold of 3 instead of 1 for the non slippery ledge.

Shinobi Killfist

  • *
  • Ace Runner
  • ****
  • Posts: 1982
« Reply #34 on: (19:44:32/06-25-19) »
you would have to replace the highly abstracted edge mechanic with something more related to reality.

Something like taking a negative modifier for shooting at someone at long range, or in the dark, or while running.

You know, stuff that is connected to reality and that you can guess at if you have common sense.

I think a threshold system could work. Your threshold to hit a target is opposed test result minimum 1. Situational modifiers can add to that result. So I roll 2 hits on my defense test. But itís long range, long range is a+2 modifier. So they need 4 hits to hit me. Your dice pool never changes which seems to be a current goal and the number of hits changes like it always does anyways.

AJCarrington

  • *
  • Global Moderator
  • Prime Runner
  • *****
  • Posts: 3080
« Reply #35 on: (20:03:55/06-25-19) »
Thanks guys, appreciate the comments and suggestions. Guessing Iím going to have to see how the rules actually play/with the group and then figure out what we do to tweak/adjust.

TheWizurd

  • *
  • Newb
  • *
  • Posts: 20
« Reply #36 on: (12:34:11/06-26-19) »
Thatís pretty much what I predicted would happen, it would devolve into a game of edge begging.

I wouldn't call it edge "begging" by any means. The most you can get per round is two anyhow. I was generally rewarding 1 per round and that is with little experience doing it.

Perhaps I misspoke. I would call it more an attempt to figure out the new Edge rules as a group. For instance a player would ask," I do I get an edge for that awesome move I just made." Generally I would go with it. I want the game to be exciting and fun.

I would also say that finding cover is much more important in 6e. At least between two high powered PCs.

your own words bely your response:
"They were always trying to figure out ways to get edge and convince me to give it to them for various reasons."

Zed Kylan

  • *
  • Newb
  • *
  • Posts: 2
  • Doors and Corners
« Reply #37 on: (19:41:04/06-26-19) »
Please note that I'm not trying to change your mind/opinion/feelings about the new Edge stuff. Just voicing my feelings about it.
The new, highly abstracted edge mechanic means it's all about how to game the system to cough up edge.
The avoiding a negative penalty here and  finding a positive bonus there is all about how to game the system to cough up enough points to increase successes.
Quote
That works great for boardgames and the like where the abstraction is built in, but not for RPGs where reality trumps cool.
With the new edge mechanic srun is now entirely within the Pink Mohawk school of play, which is fine for many folks but flies completely in the face of my table's interests and indeed the history of srun.
While, I can see where you're coming from, we've obviously been playing with different groups! lol. Many times I've seen games come to a screeching halt as players hunt for every bonus they can get even if the end results isn't "realistic." It's STILL bonus hunting.

Plus, I wouldn't place srun in the same pool as Realistic RPGs. It's super fun, no doubt. But once a Street Sam starts running around like the Flash on Meth while the Elf Mage is lobbing fireballs at a Dragon's Lair Guards, ... er... Yeah. I'm no longer getting realistic. It's definitely on the Science Fantasy end of the spectrum.

However, I will concede that it IS possible to play it more realistically, but outta the box, it ain't. Squinting, I can see where the new edge thing may make that harder. I'll reserve judgement until I see the actual rules.

Hephaestus

  • *
  • Newb
  • *
  • Posts: 68
  • "Milk Run" is a mighty weird way to spell TPK
« Reply #38 on: (21:28:07/06-26-19) »
I wouldn't place srun in the same pool as Realistic RPGs. It's super fun, no doubt. But once a Street Sam starts running around like the Flash on Meth while the Elf Mage is lobbing fireballs at a Dragon's Lair Guards, ... er... Yeah. I'm no longer getting realistic. It's definitely on the Science Fantasy end of the spectrum.

I think the issue I have isn't so much Realism as much as Relativism. The game itself is a sandbox of might, magic, guns, tech, spygames, and shoot'em ups, but that doesn't mean all things are equal. I agree that melee damage shouldn't be a straight statted DV. If an unaugmented STR 2 gnome swings a baseball bat at someone's head with all their might, it still shouldn't do nearly as much damage as  STR 9 troll playing Tee Ball with your brain case.

As an aside, I also think the prevalence of "save up for the big toys" in 5E is more a failure of GMs to make heavily restricted weapons/spells/tech unattainable dreams. You want that availability 24F Thunderstruck? You and every other runner, but unless you happen to be Damien Knight's personal fluffer in your off time, you probably won't get one. And if you do, how long will you hold on to it? Anyone who sees you use it is going to know its some hot drek, and they will have to weigh how much your life is worth at that point.

Singularity

  • *
  • Chummer
  • **
  • Posts: 115
« Reply #39 on: (21:47:16/06-26-19) »
Which completely misses the core concept of cyberpunk / dystopian worlds, they are gritty and dangerous. It's hard to have a gritty, dangerous setting without some semblance of reality.

I'm going to have to disagree with this: Gritty/dangerous ≠ realistic. Gritty/dangerous/cyberpunk/dystopian are all elements of the setting, while realism is influenced by the rules themselves; you don't need realistic rules to shape a dark, gritty world. A well run Ravenloft campaign in D&D can get every bit as dark and dystopian as any cyberpunk game, and no one can honestly call D&D's rules realistic. It's up to the GM (and to some degree the game's setting) to set the tone of the game, and a skilled GM can set that dark, gritty tone, or change it completely, to suit their gaming group's needs.

Moonshine Fox

  • *
  • Omae
  • ***
  • Posts: 548
  • Proudly serving our dragon overlords
« Reply #40 on: (21:59:46/06-26-19) »
Ghost, you ever want some heavy gritty and dangerous, check out some Dark Heresy. Donít get more grimdark then that.

Singularity

  • *
  • Chummer
  • **
  • Posts: 115
« Reply #41 on: (22:04:13/06-26-19) »
Ghost, you ever want some heavy gritty and dangerous, check out some Dark Heresy. Donít get more grimdark then that.

Definitely! Of course GW went so over the top with the grimdark that it reached a level of absurdity, but still...

incrdbil

  • *
  • Chummer
  • **
  • Posts: 180
« Reply #42 on: (23:49:44/06-26-19) »
rules wise, I probably will be sticking with 5e, barring some major errata/revisions. But I certainly will keep grabbing the setting/adventure books. there's always stuff to use, and just because you dont utilize the latest version of the rules doesn't mean you aren't supporting the game.

dim

  • *
  • Newb
  • *
  • Posts: 4
« Reply #43 on: (04:44:37/06-27-19) »
This might be a bit controversial for a first post.

But what people here write how 6th world play will surely look like reminds me a lot of the discussions on 5e D&D on other boards, where people said this would surely be the downfall of everything that was good in 3.5 and 4e.

I'm skeptical too, when it comes to soaking and e.g. knowledge skills.
It's way too early imho, to deduce how the new edition will play out, based solely on the few things we know and learned from streamers who have a version of the CRB.

5th edition was the first edition of Shadowrun I got to actually play, so it is very dear to my heart.
But inferring a less realistic playstyle from what we know about the new edition is a bit much.

Anyhow: Happy to be on board for the ride until we get the new edition!

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

  • *
  • Errata Team
  • Ace Runner
  • ***
  • Posts: 1928
« Reply #44 on: (04:51:33/06-27-19) »
This might be a bit controversial for a first post...

Anyhow: Happy to be on board for the ride until we get the new edition!

You know, I've been thinking about this, and replying to your post is an excellent time to say it:

Love or hate, like or dislike, whatever one thinks about sixth edition we all have to agree there's been more voices here on the forum than in quite a while.  6e has ginned up interest in Shadowrun, and that's only a good thing.

Welcome to the forum dim! And I hope you find 6e to your liking, but If not I hope you keep playing 5e!
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, youíre fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.