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Transportation for Characters without a vehicle

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RickDeckard

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« Reply #15 on: (15:39:39/01-26-19) »
Skateboard and an electro-magnet with a retracable cord for hooking onto cars =)

kyoto kid

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« Reply #16 on: (23:59:45/01-28-19) »
...as to such conveyances as skateboards, rollerblades, and bicycles, I have not been able to find anywhere what kind of modifiers they would grant and what skill they would require. I guess running would be a reasonable skill for rollerblades/skates but for a bicycle or skateboard where mechanics or gravity are involved, what would you use?

To get around needing a vehicle to travel to a meet, a Face character of mine in Missions had a Loyalty 4 Connection 3 Taxi Driver contact.  He was also great for legwork.

Of course I now can't get this vision of my character Leela in her Medium Milspec with a Onotari Interceptor strapped across her back pedalling her way to a meet in the CZ on of those mountain bikes with the really big tyres (fortunately she has a tricked out GMC Universe).
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Hobbes

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« Reply #17 on: (07:45:22/01-29-19) »
...as to such conveyances as skateboards, rollerblades, and bicycles, I have not been able to find anywhere what kind of modifiers they would grant and what skill they would require. I guess running would be a reasonable skill for rollerblades/skates but for a bicycle or skateboard where mechanics or gravity are involved, what would you use?



Google maps for calculating non-combat time when using a Bike for transportation.  Just get a ballpark estimate.  In Combat a Bike is just a vehicle, call it Acceleration 1, Speed 3, cheap bike call it handling of 2, good bike up to 4.  And a good bike would have a Pilot and Sensor ratings.  A Cheap bike would probably be a throwback.  Mountain Bikes of course would have Off Road Suspension... ect, ect.  Toss in some occasional Fatigue tests for long rides.  And probably some Social Modifiers after the ride if they don't have a way of getting cleaned up and changed.

If combat skateboarding ever comes up, this is a good problem to have.  Cyberskates from Chrome Flesh p. 88 would work well enough.

Lots of GM fiat involved as to how much terrain and weather is going to matter. 

RickDeckard

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« Reply #18 on: (07:59:02/01-29-19) »
...as to such conveyances as skateboards, rollerblades, and bicycles, I have not been able to find anywhere what kind of modifiers they would grant and what skill they would require. I guess running would be a reasonable skill for rollerblades/skates but for a bicycle or skateboard where mechanics or gravity are involved, what would you use?

To get around needing a vehicle to travel to a meet, a Face character of mine in Missions had a Loyalty 4 Connection 3 Taxi Driver contact.  He was also great for legwork.

Of course I now can't get this vision of my character Leela in her Medium Milspec with a Onotari Interceptor strapped across her back pedalling her way to a meet in the CZ on of those mountain bikes with the really big tyres (fortunately she has a tricked out GMC Universe).

If you feel the need to roll for regular transportation (I don't) then I'd say this probably falls under Gymnastics.

SmilinIrish

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« Reply #19 on: (12:04:28/02-03-19) »
Happy to see this discussion involve movement power.  I've never conceived of my runner using the spirit movement power to be the flash and run all over town.  I've only ever tried using it to get my low agility dwarf's abysmal movement rate to equal everyone else's when the SHTF.  Anyone (Michael?) see a problem with using it in this fashion? 

I've also assumed that you have some control over the multiplier.  Says you can multiply rate by the force of the spirit.  Can you choose to multiply by a lesser value?  A person can walk as slowly as they want.  So if its a straight mulitplier, with no adjustment, couldn't the person just walk slower so the multiplier doesn't matter?  If the mage regularly does this for themself, I believe he would be used to adjusting.  Using it on the Rigger's vehicle for the first time, or on your extraction target for the first time, seems like fumbles are possible. 

Thoughts?

And to answer OP, I see my low resource mage character using the cheap fake SIN and taking a bus or cab.  That way the movement can't be tracked by his good SIN.  I haven't played missions, so its not a problem for the character to figure out every time there is a run.  We are a constant team.  So the guys with bikes ride their bikes, my mage and the monkey dwarf ridge with the rigger.

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Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #20 on: (13:02:53/02-03-19) »
Even in missions you can often end up with the same characters over and over.  My Chicago campaign decker played fairly often with a troll close combat adept who didn't own his own vehicle.  It became a recurring joke that he'd ride in my Americar's "rumble seat"... the trunk!

Hobbes

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« Reply #21 on: (14:16:53/02-03-19) »
Happy to see this discussion involve movement power.  I've never conceived of my runner using the spirit movement power to be the flash and run all over town.  I've only ever tried using it to get my low agility dwarf's abysmal movement rate to equal everyone else's when the SHTF.  Anyone (Michael?) see a problem with using it in this fashion? 

I've also assumed that you have some control over the multiplier.  Says you can multiply rate by the force of the spirit.  Can you choose to multiply by a lesser value?  A person can walk as slowly as they want.  So if its a straight mulitplier, with no adjustment, couldn't the person just walk slower so the multiplier doesn't matter?  If the mage regularly does this for themself, I believe he would be used to adjusting.  Using it on the Rigger's vehicle for the first time, or on your extraction target for the first time, seems like fumbles are possible. 

Thoughts?



The movement power isn't some comically uncontrolled "first time with Superspeed" thing.  If you only want to move 50 meters, you do.

GMs shouldn't have an issue with using the Movement power to make a character run faster.  Movement power gets abusive when you use it to accelerate your Nissan Jackrabbit to Mach 2.  Don't do that.

Also good for getting the heck out of Dodge, Shapechange, Wreck [Wall], and the creative wizards omni-tool Trid Phantasm. 

Shinobi Killfist

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« Reply #22 on: (15:15:39/02-03-19) »
A dodge scoot isn't that pricey, it seems a good way to go for the low budget runner.  you can bring it into your low lifestyle apartment. Squatters I usually tell the player to go back to the drawing board.

Movement power the domain of air spirits used to be anything under the open air which made them the premier movement power based spirit.  But back in the day i never saw people summoning force 9 spirits though. It was more force 3-4 usually which was still stupid applied to vehicles but not much crazier than a street sam running when on foot. Honestly while the movement power in particular needs a rewrite the whole spirit summoning thing does as well, its too easy to get force 9+ which then means you are relying on the GM to background count balance things. The design should be for them to be balanced at the core with things like background count thrown in for occasional flavor, to add a extra challenge etc. 

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #23 on: (15:31:02/02-03-19) »
Yeah, increasing the movement multiplier by F/3, or even by an exponentially decreasing force curve would be a great way to hot-fix the movement power.

That or geographically limit the applicability. "Yeah I'm a Spirit of Man? What of it? My domain ended at 6th street. My Movement power doesn't work east of that..."

Shinobi Killfist

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« Reply #24 on: (15:39:24/02-03-19) »
Yeah, increasing the movement multiplier by F/3, or even by an exponentially decreasing force curve would be a great way to hot-fix the movement power.

That or geographically limit the applicability. "Yeah I'm a Spirit of Man? What of it? My domain ended at 6th street. My Movement power doesn't work east of that..."

I always thought a flat extra meters of movement per combat turn would suffice. Like for the purposes of movement your agility is increased by the spirits force or just, X extra meters per force. And maybe not allow it on vehicles.  Don't get me wrong BMX bandit is entertaining and all so its kind of amusing to have super speed from a spirit, but its one extra really powerful trick on top of their already ludicrous abilities.

Hobbes

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« Reply #25 on: (16:03:02/02-03-19) »
A dodge scoot isn't that pricey, it seems a good way to go for the low budget runner.  you can bring it into your low lifestyle apartment. Squatters I usually tell the player to go back to the drawing board.



Renault Fun-One or the Horizon Double Revolution are the cheapest enclosed vehicles. 

Squatter?  "You walk out of the coffin hotel, out of Nuyen and wondering what overpass you'll be sleeping under tonight when your commlink lights up with your Fixers number.  About friggen time...."

"You've been sleeping on your girlfriends couch for the past couple weeks... well, ex-girlfriend.  And its starting to get awkward, especially last night when she brought her new boyfriend home.  Better start making some calls if you want to find your own place."

"You wake up with a jump as the Lone Star beat cop bangs on your Ford Americar's window.  Last nights takeout containers go spilling off your chest onto the floor.  The cop gives you the move along signal, no more Free Parking here chummer."

ect, ect, ect.

Starting Shadowrun characters are going to be missing something, somewhere.  Either a piece of gear, or some skill, some attribute at 1, or something.  Its only an issue if it goes on for multiple runs.  Just make sure the player knows your expectations as a GM.

kyoto kid

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« Reply #26 on: (17:50:26/02-03-19) »
Even in missions you can often end up with the same characters over and over.  My Chicago campaign decker played fairly often with a troll close combat adept who didn't own his own vehicle.  It became a recurring joke that he'd ride in my Americar's "rumble seat"... the trunk!
...if you've run a character in a number of missions, most of the time yes, there likely will be someone will be in the group who has a vehicle that one's character has done a run with before.  Starting a new character however (like my Decker, Violet), that isn't the case.

When the funds are there, it's good to get something to gt around with even in missions, as well as pick up a few ranks in Pilot Ground Vehicle just in case.  I've been on a few runs where none of the characters previously met each other, and getting to a meet in the CZ was tricky for some (taxis usually stay on the other side of the wall, they'll drop you near a gate but then you are on your own).
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Wenlocke

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« Reply #27 on: (18:46:51/02-03-19) »
My main issue with vehicles is utility. Specifically, what can I carry and how obviously? I can't see any objective measure of cargo capacity in the books, unless I'm missing it, so having to rely on the description and type can be a bit hit and miss.
e.g. Its fairly obvious that a crotch-rocket style racing bike pretty much you have you and anything in your pockets, on straps, or on a strap-on bag. One of the big hogs you could possibly have back or side boxes, but no idea from a rules pov whether that's small box  or large box level. Even with cars it's a problem. Does a given car have room to hide a body in the boot? It's not clear.

Basically what's the 5th ed equivalent of Cargo Factor
« Last Edit: (18:55:40/02-03-19) by Wenlocke »
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Hobbes

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« Reply #28 on: (22:17:02/02-03-19) »
My main issue with vehicles is utility. Specifically, what can I carry and how obviously? I can't see any objective measure of cargo capacity in the books, unless I'm missing it, so having to rely on the description and type can be a bit hit and miss.


All GM fiat. Trying to figure out how much stuff you can fit in vehicle isn't worth the hundreds of pages of weight and volume stats.  And it brings a entirely new meaning to stacking rules.  Just no. 

Rifles don't fit on Bikes without being seen.  But you can put 'em in a duffel bag and strap it to the back.  Two pages of gear on a Dodge Scoot, no.  Handful of items that would fit in a Carry on bag?  Whatever, carry on. 

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #29 on: (22:19:23/02-03-19) »
Bear in mind that earlier editions DID have a mechanic for tracking vehicles' internal volume.  And they were nightmares to adjudicate.

We're better off simply leaving such questions completely to GM discretion.
« Last Edit: (22:22:01/02-03-19) by Stainless Steel Devil Rat »