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6th Edition in 2019?

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Shadowjack

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« Reply #30 on: (18:41:35/07-24-18) »
When 5E came out my first impression was that it was the best edition to date. There were some things that seemed strange but I was excited and paid them no attention. What ended up happening was my brother and I, the two GM's of our group, dove into the rules and started making campaigns, none of which got finished. This was perplexing to us and at the time we perceived it as a shift in interests, perhaps we just didn't have the motivation to GM anymore.

We later bought 5E D&D and the exact same thing happened, we had a great first impression and started making campaigns. The difference was that these campaigns, at first, lasted much longer than our SR 5E campaigns, but none of them were completed either. Eventually, I became so discouraged with D&D 5E that I could not make it past one session without quitting, there were just too many things that bothered me about the system.

We were very confused and again perceived this as us not enjoying GMing anymore, and we left at that and stopped playing. After checking out many systems many months later we found Fate Core. I went through my usual routine of a great first impression but when we got to the part of character creation where we had to create stunts we decided that we did not want to try the game, and we never did. At this point we were even more confused and felt deprived from our favorite hobby. My brother said "Let's play Shadowrun 4E" and I asked him why, he said "That's where we had our best campaigns and the motivation to GM." and then I realized that he was right, none of our awesome campaigns took place in 5E. We switched to 4E and immediately all our problems vanished, we were having a great time, we had the motivation back, everything was great, and still is.

However, I do care about 6E, I don't want to play only 4E forever. I believe this game can evolve, but I am worried that it will actually devolve instead. I just hope that when the time comes, CGL will reach out to the passionate fans of Shadowrun and work with us to make 6E the best it can be. I am very worried they will just announce it, sell it, and it will be crap, and that means I'll be playing 4E for 10 years or so. Anyway, this is just how things have been for my group and I.
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Michael Chandra

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« Reply #31 on: (12:25:59/07-25-18) »
Gm: "Look guys, if you walk around the city with F1 Sustaining Foci, you might walk into a BC and kill the spells."
Player: "No, the book says X so we will just avoid that!"
Not all should be explicitly written out without leeway.

Anyway, no SR6, let's hope for an errata'd edition. =)
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Iron Serpent Prince

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« Reply #32 on: (13:40:01/07-25-18) »
I would much rather see a "5.5", i.e. not a major change of rules but a clean up of smaller issues, a bit of re-balancing, improved presentation, etc.

The biggest problem with this sentiment, is that with all the work that has to go in to clean up smaller issues, and re-balancing, they might as well spend all that energy on a new edition.

It is much more efficient.

The sheer amount of poorly implemented rules is staggering if you start listing them.  Noise, Background Count, Device Rating, PANs, Deckers, Riggers, Technomancers....  And I'm only scratching the surface.

Mirikon

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« Reply #33 on: (23:35:38/07-25-18) »
I would much rather see a "5.5", i.e. not a major change of rules but a clean up of smaller issues, a bit of re-balancing, improved presentation, etc.

The biggest problem with this sentiment, is that with all the work that has to go in to clean up smaller issues, and re-balancing, they might as well spend all that energy on a new edition.

It is much more efficient.

The sheer amount of poorly implemented rules is staggering if you start listing them.  Noise, Background Count, Device Rating, PANs, Deckers, Riggers, Technomancers....  And I'm only scratching the surface.
Indeed. The fact that 5e has been out for this long and 1/3 of the game (the Matrix) is still completely screwed up, even after the Matrix book came out is telling.

They might still unfrag things, but 5 years is a good run for an edition of a tabletop RPG. If they started today, it'd be 6 or even 7 by the time the new edition came out. That's on par with every other edition of Shadowrun save 1e, which only lasted 3 years (1989-1992). 2e was '92-'98 (6 years), 3e was '98-'05 (7 years), 4e was '05-'13 (with 20a in the middle, for a total of 8 years). It is not unreasonable to be seeking a new edition when this one has lasted as long as it has in such an imperfect form.
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Reaver

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« Reply #34 on: (02:00:01/07-26-18) »
I would much rather see a "5.5", i.e. not a major change of rules but a clean up of smaller issues, a bit of re-balancing, improved presentation, etc.

The biggest problem with this sentiment, is that with all the work that has to go in to clean up smaller issues, and re-balancing, they might as well spend all that energy on a new edition.

It is much more efficient.

The sheer amount of poorly implemented rules is staggering if you start listing them.  Noise, Background Count, Device Rating, PANs, Deckers, Riggers, Technomancers....  And I'm only scratching the surface.
Indeed. The fact that 5e has been out for this long and 1/3 of the game (the Matrix) is still completely screwed up, even after the Matrix book came out is telling.

They might still unfrag things, but 5 years is a good run for an edition of a tabletop RPG. If they started today, it'd be 6 or even 7 by the time the new edition came out. That's on par with every other edition of Shadowrun save 1e, which only lasted 3 years (1989-1992). 2e was '92-'98 (6 years), 3e was '98-'05 (7 years), 4e was '05-'13 (with 20a in the middle, for a total of 8 years). It is not unreasonable to be seeking a new edition when this one has lasted as long as it has in such an imperfect form.

yea but the change from 1 to 2 was so small, that the books where inter changeable if you knew what to look for. The biggest was the removal of floating stage limits on weapons.
So if the entry in 1E said : Heavy pistol. Damage 9m(3). In 2e you read that as Heavy Pistol Damage 9m.

And they changed how you calculated your dice pools, in the player's favor...

so really, 1e to 3e or 9 years. 
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Mirikon

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« Reply #35 on: (14:07:48/07-26-18) »
Point being, the 6 or 7 that 5E would be when 6E came out if they started working on it today would still be par for the course. So it is completely reasonable to start speaking of things we'd wish to see in 6E.
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Reaver

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« Reply #36 on: (14:38:12/07-26-18) »
Usually, an edition change happens after all the sourcebooks come out....
Usually within 6 months of the Rigger book. (How zi used to time edition changes!).
They broke the mold with 5e... so maybe look for an edition change announcment when the Techno book comes out...
Where am I going? And why am I in a hand basket ???

Remember: You can't fix Stupid. But you can beat on it with a 2x4 until it smartens up! Or dies.

Mirikon

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« Reply #37 on: (13:48:22/07-28-18) »
Usually, an edition change happens after all the sourcebooks come out....
Usually within 6 months of the Rigger book. (How zi used to time edition changes!).
They broke the mold with 5e... so maybe look for an edition change announcment when the Techno book comes out...
Cue announcement that Kill Code will be at Gencon...
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HP15BS

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« Reply #38 on: (11:39:01/08-03-18) »
Yeah, the noise and bgc rules in particular are really annoying, and I'd be content doing away with them entirely.

In fact, I recommend it -- Noise doesn't even make sense!
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Mirikon

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« Reply #39 on: (13:47:10/08-03-18) »
Yeah, the noise and bgc rules in particular are really annoying, and I'd be content doing away with them entirely.

In fact, I recommend it -- Noise doesn't even make sense!
Indeed. Signal strength made sense, and was a good limiting factor. Spam zones and other things imposing penalties made sense. Just generic 'Noise' is... yeah.
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wraith

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« Reply #40 on: (10:43:38/08-14-18) »
I'll be honest, I'm hoping that 6e will be under a different rightsholder.

CGL may be trying, but the glacial pace of releases and continual issues in editing, rules design, and continuity do not seem to be improving.

Beta

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« Reply #41 on: (11:02:43/08-14-18) »
Wait, glacial rate of releases?  How many releases do you expect in a year?
Jawsey  --
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Iron Serpent Prince

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« Reply #42 on: (11:16:57/08-14-18) »
I can't speak for @wraith, but I'm still waiting for a Core book errata after 3 years.*  I'm (technically) still waiting for the Technomancer special material that is so desperately needed, also after 3 years.

*Not that I want the Core errata so much, but because I'm waiting for the Rigger 5 errata that is needed terribly.

If that isn't a glacial release schedule, I want a little of what your havin'.  :P

Beta

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« Reply #43 on: (12:47:27/08-14-18) »
I can't speak for @wraith, but I'm still waiting for a Core book errata after 3 years.*  I'm (technically) still waiting for the Technomancer special material that is so desperately needed, also after 3 years.

*Not that I want the Core errata so much, but because I'm waiting for the Rigger 5 errata that is needed terribly.

If that isn't a glacial release schedule, I want a little of what your havin'.  :P

I would call that more an issue of release quality (both in terms of "the content that people want" and "well planned, written, and edited, and any errata addressed quickly")

In terms of quantity, not counting missions, stories, non-SR-rules products, or tarot decks, we've recently had:
2018
-so far:
   -  two rules supplements:  Street Lethal, and in limited quantities Kill Code
   - one setting supplement: Shadows in Focus: Morocco
   - one adventure:Toxic Alleys
- likely
   - Better than bad, a city book for Morocco, possibly something else by the end of year?

2017:
   - Three rule (ish) supplements: Forbidden Arcana, The Complete Trog, Dark Terrors
   - One setting supplement:  Book of the Lost
   - one adventure Ripping Reality

2016:
   - Two rules supplements: Cutting Aces,  Howling Shadows, 
   - Five setting supplements: Shadows in Focus: Metropole, Court of Shadows, Seattle Boxed Set, Shadows in Focus: San Francisco, Market Panic
   - Two adventures: False Flag, Serrated Edge

Definitely slowed down from 2016, but on the order of a couple of rules supplements, a couple of setting supplements, and an adventure or two (plus missions, novels, Anarchy, etc) doesn't seem all that glacial to me.  I guess our expectations may differ on how frequently material should come out.
Jawsey  --
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Iron Serpent Prince

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« Reply #44 on: (13:08:06/08-14-18) »
I would call that more an issue of release quality (both in terms of "the content that people want" and "well planned, written, and edited, and any errata addressed quickly")

That is a very fair point.

I admit I tend to block out content I don't find useful (clarification note:  I'm not declaring it as not useful, I'm talking about to me).

As just a small sample, I can hardly call Street Lethal a rules supplement because all I remember of rules in there is the unnecessarily added Mixed Unit Tactics.