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Street Lethal - New toys, few gems

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CanRay

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« Reply #30 on: (14:27:49/06-26-18) »
Time for a bit of gear analysis - as always imho and ymmv:

Krime Bill: variable reach and concealability otherwise identical to a normal pole arm (+)
Krime Reaver: Cheap multipurpose weapon. Would have potential if the Knob would do stun damage. As it is, there is no reason to use the Knob. The high AP option is only useful against hardened armor targets, and even there only marginal (0)
Krime Shiv: Shitty multitool with a blade less effective than a combat knife. Reach makes it somewhat competitive (0)
Krime Gloves: Knucks option is worse then real knucks, stun option is adequat, price is competitive but nothing impressive (0)
Krime Stun Lance: High reach, damage, low costs but bad ACC and Exotic Melee Skill makes this a weapon best suited for drones and vehicles with articulated arms, for everyone else the Maul Stun Staff is the better option (0)
Krime Trollbow: Bad ACC and damage as blade, as bow it's far worse in every aspect then the normal bow. Trash! (---)
Krime Tingler: Worse then a Defiance EX despite higher base damage (-)
Krime Happiness: Garbage. Only interesting on fire support drones that can use sensor targeting (-)
Krime Boom: Cheap FA shotgun, but hard to get. At 12F Ava would be a real gem, but as it is you are better of getting an Auto Assault later on (0)
Krime Whammy: Gimmicky weapon with no redeeming qualities compared to a solid shotgun with melee mods (-)
MINIGUNKRIME TRIPLE SERIES: The Troll version is interesting - after that, even the Krime Happiness is better. (0)

Krime Pack: Pink Mohawk games will love these... (+)
KRIME STUN-O-NET: Underbarrel Stunstaff with slightly higher damage then a glove (+)

Krime is pretty much the poster child for Pink Mohawk, Style-Over-Substance, Gimmicky things built to Troll Size, entirely based on "Rule Of Cool" and so on.  And cheaply made at that, which is why the stats suck.

Also, the Krime Whammy isn't supposed to be used like a shotgun, it's supposed to be used like a warhammer, which then sets off the shotgun shell on impact for even further damage.  So, yeah, it is the best "door breaching tool" on the market.   ;D
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Nephilim

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« Reply #31 on: (17:38:48/06-26-18) »
Honestly, the Krime stuff always struck me as being like Ork tech from 40k, but without the WAAAGH! to back it up and make it functional/useful. Some definite thought went into making it though. And the concept of a Troll in Milspec with a Krimepack shoulder firing an M2 is pretty awesome...

Jack_Spade

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« Reply #32 on: (17:39:47/06-26-18) »
@CanRay

that might have been the intention for the Krime Whammy, but it isn't represented in the rules as such: Damage isn't added from melee and shotgun. Only the fact that the bullets aren't counted as penetrating weapons gives some credence to the tool's intended function. Not to mention: While you make a melee attack, you can't fire since you need a complex action and a simple action. If you could at least SA Burst with the thing for a double tap with additional damage, then the recoil compensation would make sense...
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Marcus

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« Reply #33 on: (18:32:30/06-26-18) »
Sure Krime gear is larger then life certainly. Starting with the Krime Canon, these are weapons that pack big damage numbers with the intent for them to be used by trolls. It's a expansion of what trolls are, Larger then life, Super Strong, Super tough, but not very accurate. The fact is though you can make those weapons work, if that what you want to do. Sure it takes some modifications and some work arounds. But like the Combat Axe, a weapon with huge damage value, but terrible accuracy, just keep in mind accuracy is just another word for limit, and everyone know limits can be broken. It only takes one hit your damage is big enough.

Street lethal saw the release lots of new weapons, i think maybe 4-5 will see regular table use. But that's ok, SR has always been about that sort of thing. Sure Guardian is the most popular Pistol, but even so not everyone packs one. Sure the Macuahuitl is now just another name for a sword. But the SR System has never super simulationist, and that's just fine.  Many of these weapons can fit very interesting character concepts. Sure only a couple are systematically strong, but that's fine.
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« Reply #34 on: (19:22:22/06-26-18) »
How is the Big Whammy supposed to work ?  I know we have the writer floating around somewhere.
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CanRay

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« Reply #35 on: (21:06:05/06-26-18) »
How is the Big Whammy supposed to work ?  I know we have the writer floating around somewhere.
You load up the four barrels with whatever shotgun load you prefer.  As this is a Krime Weapon and Pink Mohawk as frag, this is likely Explosive Rounds of some type.

You then hit the target with the warhammer, which sets off one of the barrels.  You do the melee damage and shotgun damage at the same time.  You repeat as needed with the other three rounds in the other barrels.

Officially, it is designed for door breaching.  Officially.  Wink wink, nod nod.
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PiXeL01

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« Reply #36 on: (21:37:53/06-26-18) »
Sounds awesome but that would conflict with the official ruling than you can only Exposed a target to one single course of damage per phrase, so it would either be melee or shotgun, not both on flesh targets at least.
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CanRay

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« Reply #37 on: (22:05:08/06-26-18) »
Sounds awesome but that would conflict with the official ruling than you can only Exposed a target to one single course of damage per phrase, so it would either be melee or shotgun, not both on flesh targets at least.
Which is why it is officially for breaching doors.   ;D
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Finstersang

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« Reply #38 on: (06:53:25/06-28-18) »
'Bout a week ago, this was my first verdict for SL:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Shadowrun/comments/8rwrjh/street_lethal_is_live/e0xscvz/

I since have started to grow fond of the new fluff, esp. Corpsec. As a GM, you can definetly take someting from Street Lethal.

But the original sentiment stands: It just piles up more and more stuff that fewer and fewer players will ever use. It seems to me that at no point in the design process, anyone made an assesment on what the game as a whole would actually benefit from. 50 pages of new guns with stats marginally differing from the existing ones (besides Core, we already have Run&Gun, Hard Targets, Gun Haven 3 and some german sourcebooks) surely won´t do the trick.

This game needs an update, not stuff. Combat is by far not the worst part of SR5*, but it would have made for a good start: Identifiy some of the problems (example: No good use for medium-sized weapons, as large guns are much more powerfull and only pistols can be conceiled reliably), implement a solution (example: Higher penalties for large guns when engaged in Close Combat or in a cramped spot, mandatory ready weapon for sniper rifles after running...), move on to the next issue. And then you pile up the stuff. Frankly, I like stuff. But it has to be piled up on a solid foundation. 

Also, where´s the street in Street Lethal? With that title, you´d expect gangs, close combat (including a well deserved MA buff), improvised weapons, Drugs... I do like the actual scope of the book, but the title seems misleading.

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Mirikon

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« Reply #39 on: (01:01:03/06-29-18) »
I agree that Street Lethal has some nice thematic things, but most of it is dross. It isn't bad, per se, but a lot of the stuff is just not good.
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Hobbes

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« Reply #40 on: (10:20:16/06-29-18) »
It's a lot of Niche stuff, but really, what else you going to do for more gear/weapon porn?  You either have powercreep via sourcebook escalation (Rifts was the king of that btw....) , or you tinker around with things that only appeal to a few character types. 

Most characters will find something in there for them.  Black Trenchcoat characters get limited MAD proof and higher concealability type weapons at char gen.  High Damage Low Accuracy weapons work out fine for Edgenomancers, Adepts, and folks that like to split their dice pools.  Couple of the Positive qualities are gold for most Street Samurai.  So on and so forth.  Pretty much every character will find something in there that works out for them.

I do wish there were some more Martial Arts and Armor options.  I'd really like to see a plethora of Armor and + Armor options opened up for higher STR characters.

Krime Armor!   You know you want it. 

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« Reply #41 on: (10:40:08/06-29-18) »
Avoiding powercreep was literally the main thrust of my pitch for the gun chapter.  I wanted to get away from the "one gun to rule them all" situation that's existed across editions in SR.  Totally agree about the need for more armor options.
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« Reply #42 on: (11:28:58/06-29-18) »
Is it wrong that I kind of miss the damage codes from 1st edition where each gun increased damage differently (e.g., you might need 3 hits to up the damage for one gun, but only 1 hit for another)? 
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« Reply #43 on: (13:32:48/06-29-18) »
Is it wrong that I kind of miss the damage codes from 1st edition where each gun increased damage differently (e.g., you might need 3 hits to up the damage for one gun, but only 1 hit for another)?

It probably wasn't worth saving, but I did love the quirkiness of that, and was really disappointed when I read 2nd edition and they'd taken it out.
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Jack_Spade

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« Reply #44 on: (17:26:25/06-29-18) »
There is power creep and then there is adding useful stuff.
This would have been a great opportunity to add some more tools of the soldier/mercenary trade:
Starting with parachutes, going over military vehicles (there hasn't been a tank or a tank weapon statted since WAR!), over improvised weapons and guerilla warfare (build&repair rules could use some love with some good examples), combat armor (and no, that power armor is a joke) as well as some toys for electronic warfare that riggers, deckers and technos can actually use and isn't just experimental tech.
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