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Ixal

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« Reply #1095 on: (15:03:14/11-23-18) »
For those with a copy, how exactly does the anti-magic armor mod and tattoo work mechanically?

I think mundanes needed something to help shield against magic, so I am not opposed to the concept on general principal.

Basically the armor mod adds die to the normal spell defense/resist per rating. Tattoos do the same but are capped by rating and only affect hostile spells, not beneficial ones.

Lormyr

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« Reply #1096 on: (15:10:53/11-23-18) »
Max rating 6?

I think that is pretty acceptable if so. Is there detriments for the magically active that use them?
« Last Edit: (15:12:33/11-23-18) by Lormyr »

Ixal

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« Reply #1097 on: (15:19:42/11-23-18) »
Max rating 6?

I think that is pretty acceptable if so. Is there detriments for the magically active that use them?

Max 6 and they do not mix with awakened characters at all, giving a dicepool penalty for everything related magic and also reduce the force or anything sustained.

When we are talking rules, we also have:

- A toxin that shuts of magic. Not only a penalty but a complete inability to cast, astrally perceive, etc.
- A slightly cheaper version of beta cyberware which is always obvious and loses its wireless capabilities (as if people will miss that...)
- Spells that strips abilities from spirits and dual natured critters
- Adept powers that switches an attribute with their magic or adds that to damage
- Adepts being able to use Elemental Body without rolling for drain and instead take low unresisted damage each turn
- Ability for technomancer to go cold-sim

« Last Edit: (15:42:21/11-23-18) by Ixal »

Marcus

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« Reply #1098 on: (15:50:59/11-23-18) »
There is a cyberware option as well.
That's really not the strongest thing in there. Several very strong TM advantages Hair trigger, Instinctive hack, Several just straight very strong advantages and disadvantages. (Got quadriplegic back, shoot first don't ask questions, Special modifications a new weapon in the war for the perfect gun.

The adept power State of Purity is no kidding. You could make that DV something hella serious.
Mystic Aptitude is also strong.

If it makes it in, everyone new favorite 20 point flaw Dead Sin.

Everyone is a winner in this book except maybe spell casters.

I also like the hooding run table, but I suspect I will be in the minority on that one.
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Ixal

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« Reply #1099 on: (15:57:47/11-23-18) »
If it makes it in, everyone new favorite 20 point flaw Dead Sin.

It is in.
Thought that Corporate SIN is nice?

With Dead SIN you get a Rating 3 fake SIN and 4 fake licenses. The horror, right? Good thing that you also get 20 karma as compensation.
It has some downsides though like having to pay back the karma if the SIN gets burned, but why would you ever use it?
« Last Edit: (16:29:48/11-23-18) by Ixal »

Lormyr

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« Reply #1100 on: (17:47:02/11-23-18) »
Interesting, thanks Ixal.

I like that mundanes were given additional options for magic resistance. I do wish it came at more of a cost than just nuyen, but overall, the game is definitely better off with it present. Magic is still king.

The magic removing toxin I am less keen on. What is the power rating on it to resist?

Ixal

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« Reply #1101 on: (17:53:48/11-23-18) »
Interesting, thanks Ixal.

I like that mundanes were given additional options for magic resistance. I do wish it came at more of a cost than just nuyen, but overall, the game is definitely better off with it present. Magic is still king.

The magic removing toxin I am less keen on. What is the power rating on it to resist?

Injection 12, lasts for at least 1 hour if not resisted.

Lormyr

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« Reply #1102 on: (18:00:29/11-23-18) »
That is quite savage. ultimately I suppose that losing your magic for an hour is not worse than just getting knocked unconscious by power rating 15 nacrojet. I guess I just don't particularly like the concept of a toxin that just takes magic away.

Ixal

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« Reply #1103 on: (18:05:30/11-23-18) »
That is quite savage. ultimately I suppose that losing your magic for an hour is not worse than just getting knocked unconscious by power rating 15 nacrojet. I guess I just don't particularly like the concept of a toxin that just takes magic away.
One hour minimum. Most players will look at 4-6 hours unless they are rather powerful.
« Last Edit: (18:19:41/11-23-18) by Ixal »

Lormyr

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« Reply #1104 on: (18:13:07/11-23-18) »
Oh, hour minimum! I missed that part. That is pretty ridiculous then.

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #1105 on: (18:14:32/11-23-18) »
That is quite savage. ultimately I suppose that losing your magic for an hour is not worse than just getting knocked unconscious by power rating 15 nacrojet. I guess I just don't particularly like the concept of a toxin that just takes magic away.

I disagree... mainly on the grounds that Shadowrun is in effect Magicrun.  Anything that nerfs spellcasters is good news in my (hateful) book!

But on a more serious note... with viable anti-magic tools, it's less mandatory that someone (or everyone) plays a magician.  Being able to beat spirits without throwing your own, bigger spirits at them is good for the game.
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, you’re fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

Ixal

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« Reply #1106 on: (18:23:47/11-23-18) »
That is quite savage. ultimately I suppose that losing your magic for an hour is not worse than just getting knocked unconscious by power rating 15 nacrojet. I guess I just don't particularly like the concept of a toxin that just takes magic away.

I disagree... mainly on the grounds that Shadowrun is in effect Magicrun.  Anything that nerfs spellcasters is good news in my (hateful) book!

But on a more serious note... with viable anti-magic tools, it's less mandatory that someone (or everyone) plays a magician.  Being able to beat spirits without throwing your own, bigger spirits at them is good for the game.

Everyone just looks at its uses against spirits, but the problematic parts start when you use it against normal awakened, infected or dual natured critters which become way to easy to defeat thanks to this toxin.
On the other side, Gama-Scopolamine is also an instant knockout.
« Last Edit: (18:28:27/11-23-18) by Ixal »

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #1107 on: (18:35:27/11-23-18) »
Everyone just looks at its uses against spirits, but the problematic parts start when you use it against normal awakened, infected or dual natured critters which become way to easy to defeat thanks to this toxin.
On the other side, Gama-Scopolamine is also an instant knockout.

I don't have the book yet so I'm not able to speak on the technicals...

But things like Hellhounds and Ghouls already can be dealt with without having a mage along.  Knocking them out with one go with a new toxin isn't any more broken than knocking them out with one full auto burst from a machine gun afterall...

But spirits (and to an extent, enemy mages) required a mage on your own team to be able to prevail.  If that dynamic changes, it's good for the game.
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, you’re fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

Beta

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« Reply #1108 on: (19:13:39/11-23-18) »
I kind of disagree that something that can take away the entire point of your character is good for the game. 

I agree that magic is powerful and that ways to moderate it can be good -- but having:  either missed/resisted OR everything you are good at has gone away, that doesn't seem like fun gameplay to me (especially given that it makes sense for every moderately professional security service to have this) 

Granted to people who hate mages perhaps there is entertainment in seeing mage players sad?  But if you have reached that state I think your group may have other issues?
« Last Edit: (19:59:49/11-23-18) by Beta »
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Lormyr

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« Reply #1109 on: (19:27:08/11-23-18) »
Beta summed up my thoughts as well. I agree that magic is significantly stronger than most other character options long term (mainly due to it having no upward cap, and its incredible versatility). There are much better ways to address that than to remove someone's archetype from their character though.