[Ultra Violet]

Since WAR! there are now new Commlinks with new higher Ratings out of Pandora's Box. But what does this mean for the Game?
In many SR-Groups it wouldn't be available for PC, cause the GM doesn't allow it in his Game.
In other SR-Groups it will be available and some questions will come up!

1.) Do the commlink modifications that are mentioned as standard included in Milspec Commlinks, like Armor 5, Hardening 5 or Biometric Lock taking slots or is it like vehicle modifications and you got 4 slots left?

2.) Since the Milspec Commlinks could get Ratings up to 10, they are able to create UV-Node (see Unwired p. 171), and we have now prices and availabilities for UV-Nodes. And so it cracks a really big hole in the possibilities of PC and their actions. Imagining a programming action in an environment the PC has created, where the time is different and beneficial for the programmer, like in the description of UV-Nodes, an hour spent in a UV-Node could seem like 10 hours... dividing any programming time automatically by 10. And that is only one of many advantages...

3.) All other Systems and Nodes of the SR-World aren't that good, so any military hacker could hack the ZO and get rich over night or more over seconds... Do we need to upgrade every existing System, to get the old order again or do we have to live with it? Referring to upcoming books and adventures...

4.) Maybe it isn't that big of a deal, but the consequences of the Rating 10 Programs are also that normal PC can create or get such high ratings, and thanks to Program Options like Optimization it is possible to run a Program Rating 10 on a System 5 Link. And since self-written programs do not degenerate every hacker player will ask his GM for proging his one Rating 10 Progs.

Only some thoughts about the new fallen limits and their successions...

UV

[Mäx]

3.) All other Systems and Nodes of the SR-World aren't that good, so any military hacker could hack the ZO and get rich over night or more over seconds..

Actually stats for ZO aren't in any book, most likely exactly for this reason.
Really ZO has matrix ratings of "In your dreams".

4.) Maybe it isn't that big of a deal, but the consequences of the Rating 10 Programs are also that normal PC can create or get such high ratings, and thanks to Program Options like Optimization it is possible to run a Program Rating 10 on a System 5 Link. And since self-written programs do not degenerate every hacker player will ask his GM for proging his one Rating 10 Progs.

Yes they do, see Unwired page 109

[raggedhalo]

1.) Do the commlink modifications that are mentioned as standard included in Milspec Commlinks, like Armor 5, Hardening 5 or Biometric Lock taking slots or is it like vehicle modifications and you got 6 slots left?

Per Unwired, you get four slots for modifications.

[Ultra Violet]

@raggedhalo
6 or 4 is not the question, it's about the preset modifications, are they like vehicle modifications without any real slot cost or do they cost slot points, like usually?

@Mäx
Yes, I know that the stats on page 78-79 aren't the main system, but it is and will be still a problem.

Page 109? Could you please tell me the exact passage, because I couldn't find it?

[Mäx]

From under the heading Pirated Software
"In game terms, illegal and pirated software—and also programs
that a character has coded himself (p. 118)—degrade over
time, reflecting that the program is slowly becoming outdated.
Hacking and malware programs degrade at the rate of 1 rating
point per month; all other programs degrade 1 rating point per
2 months."

Also, i think trying to hack corporate court is the stupidest idea any PC could get, one just doesn't mess with GOD like that and expect to survive

[raggedhalo]

@raggedhalo
6 or 4 is not the question, it's about the preset modifications, are they like vehicle modifications without any real slot cost or do they cost slot points, like usually?

Well, with weapons and vehicles, anything mentioned in the item's description doesn't count against their modification limit.  Unwired says that commlinks follow similar rules, so I would rule that the preset modifications don't count against the limit.

[Chaemera]

3.) All other Systems and Nodes of the SR-World aren't that good, [...] Do we need to upgrade every existing System, to get the old order again or do we have to live with it? Referring to upcoming books and adventures...

I tend to agree that, at a minimum, if you use the information provided in War! for milspec electronics, there is now a brand new scale for the quality of systems. Before this publication, "Cutting Edge" technology was rating 6, possibly 7. Anything beyond that was "amazingly rare, GM-Fiat 'where did this come from'" gear to make the players wet themselves. Yes, it's price prohibitive, but given that MilSpec equipment lags private industry technology by approximately 5 years, that implies "Cutting Edge" is now Rating 12 (which we can safely assume the ZO has).

Frankly, it continues to frustrate me that the idea of "MilSpec" is "super awesome". I work with this stuff daily, unless it's guns, ammo, and vehicles, then it's crap compared to what I can buy in a Wal-Mart. MilSpec spaghetti (yes, I've read the MilSpec for spaghetti) tastes bad, MilSpec computers run Windows 2000 more often then they run Windows XP. They probably won't run Windows 7 until the rest of the world is using Windows 10.

Couple that with the price tags... 10k per soldier to get his orders and GPS data sent to him? When I could buy a COTS (Commercial Off the Shelf) Hermes Ikon (3000 nuyen), with upgraded signal (500 nuyen), giving my guy 4/4 instead of 5/5 and pocketing savings of 6500 nuyen per soldier.

In an army of only 10k soldiers, that's 65,000,000 nuyen. I could buy 46 Aztechnology Cuanmitzli MBT's with those savings. Or equip every last soldier in my army with a FN SCAR-H3 battle rifle, with money left over (30 million, to be exact) to buy a couple dozen Mitsuhama Chinpira battle drones (476 of them, to be exact).

Other than a hacker, what soldier in my army needs a 5/5 commlink? Have them throw it in hidden mode, and put an Optimized Firewall 6 on it, you're soldiers are reasonably safe from hacking without getting into the ridiculous pricing of MilSpec hardware, too.

[Ultra Violet]

@Mäx
Not the court is the target more the bank or accounts and money... Sure you can upgrade the GOD guys as well. But the ZO was only an example, for the SR-World that was rooted at a maximum rating of 6, and is now critically endangered by the military hackers.

Another question:
5.) Is it right, that there are no Agents or IC programs with military ratings available? Only Common or Hacker Programs, or do they count toward or as one of them?

[Mäx]

but given that MilSpec equipment lags private industry technology by approximately 5 years.

That might be true today, but it sure as heck ain't true in the sixth world, where about half of the standing armed forces are owned by the said private industry.
The military will have the absolutely latest edge stuff that the labs can but out.

UV:
Targeting Corporate Court or targeting their bank is pretty much the same think, both of those are gonna get your ass fried by GOD.

[raben-aas]

For my campaign, I have decided to view things this way:

(1) Military ware is always advanced. Unless it is not.
I know that in RL, the military often has shitty tech and outdated computers. However, I like to think of military "new tech" as vastly superior, but of limited availability. Meaning: There are top-notch researchers and companies that are developing incredibly advanced military systems. Developing them doesn't mean that your army actually gets them! Prices for 5/5 or 10/10 milspec comlinks may be way off/not economical – and that is why the military usually don't run around with them (the people responsible for equipment would indeed rather upgrade armament or refit some old drones than equip soldiers with advanced hightech they don't need).

(2) SOTA advances.
So certains pools/ratings were limited to X, even for the military, in the main rulebook. Time has passed, WAR! is about new tech, too, so ... obviously someone figured out how to do even more advanced systems/programs/whatever. It happens all the time. Yes, the stuff is not really available (or was, at the in-game point of time the main rulebook was released), yes, now it is, yes, soon it will hit the mass market and trigger all kinds of upheaval in the tech (meaning: everyone's) world. I could gripe about it, or view it as a development "in development". Like, in Crash 2.0, you just "had" it (woosh, there it was, here's the new world). In Traveller, when Virus appeared, you were "right in the middle of it". And Virus broke a lot of rules.

I don't know if CGL is "heading" somewhere with the new tech. Maybe there will be more on that with Spy Games (I can certainly see how SPIES can use 10/10 comlinks , and seriously: if there are suddenly new tech items that are superior to anything that was before, this can actually TRIGGER a "spy game" like campaign/venue.

For the moment, I see the new stuff as-is. There are rumors about new tech of "the military" (whatever that means), maybe some of the big players in my campaign are gearing up, too, or are afraid about what the FBI/CIA-equivalent (state!) could use this stuff for (being a megacorp, I would worry, even though I'm soooo powerful). I would stock up on new com tech, I would hire new security experts, I would get that way-too-expensive dossier about "How to build a more advanced corporate intelligence bureau (CIB)" out of the virtual drawer of my black ops system, I would hire runners to check out if my main competitor (or that nosy federal cop that visited me earlier this month) have access to the new tech, and I would make damn sure that I mass-market the new tech before the competition does.

Regarding the rules, I am not THAT worried, as I will use the new tech as a plot device, and worry about the impact when my PCs actually get their hands on the tech.

Then IF the tech makes them all-powerful, I let them have fun. And if I have enough of it I'll either send some military badass commando after them or just flat out declare: "Meanwhile, the then-advanced military uberware has become mainstream, so actually your WAR!-rating10-ware is now rating-4".

If there IS a plan for the new tech (i.e. to open up the road to an overhaul of the matrix system), all the better (or worse. I'll decide that when I see what actually happens).

So, yeah. I could ignore all that strange new tech (I ignore A F*CKING LOT of SR, and always have! (anything Earthdawn and Uberdragon, mostly)), but this time I see some nice plots/missions popping up in my head, so I'm good to roll with that stuff (I'll skip Az/Am though, as my group has nothing to do with SouthAm. Maybe we'll to a connected run with/against Aztech, we'll see).

[Maelstrom]

My thoughts:

1.) Do the commlink modifications that are mentioned as standard included in Milspec Commlinks, like Armor 5, Hardening 5 or Biometric Lock taking slots or is it like vehicle modifications and you got 4 slots left?

They would be considered unmodified.  Improving the armor or hardening would use slots.

2.) Since the Milspec Commlinks could get Ratings up to 10, they are able to create UV-Node (see Unwired p. 171), and we have now prices and availabilities for UV-Nodes. And so it cracks a really big hole in the possibilities of PC and their actions. Imagining a programming action in an environment the PC has created, where the time is different and beneficial for the programmer, like in the description of UV-Nodes, an hour spent in a UV-Node could seem like 10 hours... dividing any programming time automatically by 10. And that is only one of many advantages...

Ratings 6+ are exotic; apply the 16+ threshold modifier and possibly additional modifiers for equipment/environment from SR4A.
You must have equipment capable of running the program you're writing, so you must first have the equipment, next you write the operating system, and then you can write new programs.

Optimization can't exceed R6, and shouldn’t apply during software creation as it is a modular add-on option.
You can't rush a job unless you're working it constantly (8+ hours a day, no other extracurricular activities).
UV Nodes are incompatible with Software Programming Environment.  UV subjective time is rumored, and no time benefits/detriments are stated.

3.) All other Systems and Nodes of the SR-World aren't that good, so any military hacker could hack the ZO and get rich over night or more over seconds... Do we need to upgrade every existing System, to get the old order again or do we have to live with it? Referring to upcoming books and adventures...

They can eventually get R7+ equipment and software, and wreak havoc with low rating systems.  They will leave very clear data trails – almost no one has R7+ equipment and a signal 7+ will be pretty easy to localize.  Positive die pool modifiers to track them down wouldn’t be inappropriate.  Word will get around quick that they have R7 stuff – people can rarely keep their mouths shut.  Friends and foes alike will be looking for a slice of the pie, and some may not ask nicely.

4.) Maybe it isn't that big of a deal, but the consequences of the Rating 10 Programs are also that normal PC can create or get such high ratings, and thanks to Program Options like Optimization it is possible to run a Program Rating 10 on a System 5 Link. And since self-written programs do not degenerate every hacker player will ask his GM for proging his one Rating 10 Progs.

As already mentioned, all programs degrade.

[Mäx]

They can eventually get R7+ equipment and software, and wreak havoc with low rating systems.  They will leave very clear data trails – almost no one has R7+ equipment and a signal 7+ will be pretty easy to localize.  Positive die pool modifiers to track them down wouldn’t be inappropriate.  Word will get around quick that they have R7 stuff – people can rarely keep their mouths shut.  Friends and foes alike will be looking for a slice of the pie, and some may not ask nicely.

Um no, rating 7 comlink can be had in chargen if your willing to pay thought the nose for it, if not it's quite easy to get and much cheaper in game.

[Maelstrom]

Um no, rating 7 comlink can be had in chargen if your willing to pay thought the nose for it, if not it's quite easy to get and much cheaper in game.

I presume this is from War.  If not, please let me know where this information can be found.

I suppose I should have said that I haven't read War.  My suggestions are how I handle it in my campaign.

[Mäx]

I presume this is from War.  If not, please let me know where this information can be found.

I suppose I should have said that I haven't read War.  My suggestions are how I handle it in my campaign.

That would have been smart when the topic is about the up to rating 10 comlinks included in that book

[Maelstrom]

I presume this is from War.  If not, please let me know where this information can be found.

I suppose I should have said that I haven't read War.  My suggestions are how I handle it in my campaign.

That would have been smart when the topic is about the up to rating 10 comlinks included in that book

Thanks for the flames.  I was answering the post as to how I would deal with the situation, nothing more.