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Bastard sword

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psycho835

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« Reply #30 on: <08-16-15/0840:25> »
I got one word for ya: "Blam."
I got one for you: "spirits".

Wakshaani

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« Reply #31 on: <08-16-15/1012:58> »
I'll pitch in!

The general call that you should be somewhere between "Sword" and "Katana" is a good one, and there should be a modified statline depending on how you use it. Two hands is either greater control (Accuracy goes up) or greater power (damage goes up), depending on how you want to handle it.

As for the core stats, you want it to be *different* from a katana, so the two main options are to either A) trade Accuracy for damage or B) accuracy for armor-piercing. Damage is, IMHO, the better choice, which would later let you make armor-piercing weapons, like a mace or especially a spike/pickaxe, have a place.

The *easy* way is to say -1 Acc, +1 Dam, and call it a day. Probably drop the cost to about half-ish (5-600) and jack the availability by 4 since, as noted, Katana are *popular* and a bastard sword not so much.

You can add a "Two-handed" rule that would let you change the stats a bit in exchange for the penalty of tying up your other hand. +1 damage, or two more AP, for instance. Mind you, you'd probably want to go through and do a sort of universal rule for two-handed weapons. (Personally? Lower the Acc of all two-handed weapons by 2, then give them +2 acc when both hands are used. Thus, you can use a katana in one-hand, but it's more controllable with both. I'd be tempted to give a smaller bonus to certain other weapons (+1 for two-handing it) since, for instance, two-handing a pistol is much easier than one-handing it, even if it isn't *needed*, but, this might fall under the aiming rule or just "special effects" and storytelling.

...

I'm probably rambling now. Sorry about that.

Banjo

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« Reply #32 on: <08-21-15/1358:18> »
I just have to chime in here because I have an strong interest in HEMA and much of the information given here is mostly very wrong.

For the the Shadowrun weapon stats:
I would suggest just increasing the reach of the Katana by 1.  Partially reflecting the longer blade and partially the difference in fighting techniques.   Realistically there is no significant real difference between a Longsword and a Katana.
A sword is a sword, as discussed here : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stjTXl5lrtI
Not flashy but it is realistic.

Also the weapon the OP is referring to is a longsword NOT a bastard sword.  There is really no clear definition of a bastard sword but it SEEMS to be slightly smaller than a longsword and/or slightly larger than an arming sword.  The idea that a bastard a) exists as a distinct weapon and b) is bigger than a longsword is purely a contrivance of D&D.
Here is a good link to a discussion on sword types:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dk0GBKaMcgE and also:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwdg6lblKow

Basically:
An arming sword is clearly one handed, with a hilt that only fits one hand though you can use it by gripping the pommel. 
This is typically the traditional "sword."  Though called a longsword in D&D.
A Longsword has space for two hands on the hilt, though on some swords the bottom of 2nd hand wraps over the pommel (a bastard sword?)
A Bastard sword in D&D
A greatsword is a massive sword with space for three+ hands on the hilt but occasionally even this can be used one handed.

The Bastard sword in D&D is  the traditional Longsword.  And a longsword is intended to be used both one and two handed, it is not some special exotic skill, but part of the basic sword technique.  Also you wont break your wrist using a longsword one handed they are suppose to be used that way a fair bit.  Also you wont break your wrist using a Zweihander (or Montante) one handed either but unless your spearing with it you will lack control.   However theoretically you could use several Montante (great sword) techniques with one handed if you were desperate (say you had an injured arm.)
Montante in use: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYNy_drriXs

I'm going to have to say that I am not certain on the differences between Fiore dei Liberi and Kunst des Fechtens.  However as far as I can tell they both are simply national martial arts styles that cover a massive array of weaponry (or lack there of.)   The longsword styles are apparently the most popular by a far cry, thus obviously since they are using a longsword then both styles use one handed and two handed techniques.

Scholagladiatoria (Matt Easton) trains specifically in Fiore dei Liberi and often uses his longsword in one hand so take that for what it is worth.
Also this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1e_qJiNf8cw maybe worth a look as it shows the guard positions for Fiore, take note of the forward guard position that is why I say give longsword a better reach than katana.  Look how far out the engagement range is in that position.

PS: Apparently Fiore dei Liberi is a person that wrote fighting treatise on how to use every weapon of his era, the longswording techniques are simply the most popular.   Presumably he also wrote on sword and dagger techniques but I can't find examples of this.
PPS: Destreza is the Spanish version of the same.  So consider Fiore, Destreza and Kunst to be akin to the differences between karate, kempo, and taekwondo.

The Wyrm Ouroboros

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« Reply #33 on: <08-21-15/1434:10> »
Thank you for your reality czech, Banjo, but it should be noted that we like most communities being D&D influenced, and we not trying to re-create the Middle Ages, and Reality actually starting to define and conform to the D&D concepts, we're pretty much going to keep talking about long swords and bastard swords.
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psycho835

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« Reply #34 on: <08-21-15/1651:16> »
Actually, Banjo, I meant an actual bastard sword. I didn't know what blade length would be appropriate, so I assumed approx. 90 cm - what wikipedia* lists for shorter longswords. Add a hilt capable of accomodating two hands. Now, I've never actually had physical swords to compare lengths, but I think that's about 20 cm longer than katana - my reason for initially contemplating Reach 1/2. If I went for an actual longsword, I would've definitely gave it Reach 2, though I wouldn't be sure about other stats.

*Yeah, I know, wikipedia is not exactly the most reliable source of information for that kind of thing, but with the mentioned D&D-induced confusion about bastard swords I wouldn't be able to determine which site is legit and which is utter garbage. Ultimately, I decided to just wing it.
« Last Edit: <08-21-15/1705:11> by psycho835 »