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Can you put an agent on a commlink?

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Senko

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« Reply #15 on: <06-18-15/1528:44> »
But don't all the common devices (drones, commlink, decks, rccs, hosts) already have the ability to run personas anyway?

Herr Brackhaus

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« Reply #16 on: <06-18-15/1642:33> »
But don't all the common devices (drones, commlink, decks, rccs, hosts) already have the ability to run personas anyway?
Hosts are not devices that can be modified, so scratch that off the list.
Drones likely do not; you cannot base your persona on a vehicle (including drones) unless it has rigger adaption and you have a control rig. The combination of the two allows a character to jump in, thus subsuming the vehicle icon by the riggers persona. At least, that's how I understand it.

Commlimks, RCCs, and decks, absolutely. If you want to form a persona on anything else, like a toaster, a smartgun system, an RFID tag, or even your own wired reflexes, then the device needs the persona modification.

Senko

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« Reply #17 on: <06-18-15/2038:54> »
I think I've got a misunderstanding somewhere in how these personas work need to get back to you when I have access to the books and time to look over them.

I_AM_ZHOUL!!!

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« Reply #18 on: <06-19-15/0144:37> »
I think I've got a misunderstanding somewhere in how these personas work need to get back to you when I have access to the books and time to look over them.

If after you reread the rules if it is still confusing.... I'mnot sure the Designers understand how Personas work. Or there are 3 separate people who have 3 separate ideas about how they work and each one of them wrote a different part of the chapter without ever talking with each other.  :o :o :o

Prætus

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« Reply #19 on: <06-21-15/1333:09> »

Hosts are not devices that can be modified, so scratch that off the list.
Drones likely do not; you cannot base your persona on a vehicle (including drones) unless it has rigger adaption and you have a control rig. The combination of the two allows a character to jump in, thus subsuming the vehicle icon by the riggers persona. At least, that's how I understand it.


That sounds right; A persona is usually based on a commlink, cyberdeck, or rigged vehicle or drone.  There are other devices a persona might be able to be based upon, but I think that's there mostly for security spiders operating on a host.

I think SR5 may suffer somewhat from the "too man cooks" expression.

Xenon

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« Reply #20 on: <06-21-15/1453:00> »
A Rigger can also base his persona on his RCC.

SR5 p. 266 Matrix Damage
...If you used your commlink or rigger command console to enter VR before jumping in, your commlink or RCC (respectively) is the target of Matrix damage to your persona. If you’re directly connected to the vehicle you’re jumped into, the vehicle takes the Matrix damage.




A Rigger that base his persona on his RCC will using attributes of the RCC. If he then jump in (via the matrix or via direct cable from the RCC; This would be the Jump Into Rigged Device Matrix Action) then the vehicle/drone device icon will be submerged into the persona based on the RCC. the merged icon will use RCC ratings and any matrix damage taken will be "soaked" by the RCC, not the vehicle/drone. The rigger can have two different looks, his normal persona and another appearance when jumped in; changing appearance is a data processing matrix action.

A rigger can also base his persona directly on a vehicle (via wireless or via wire from his control rig; this would be the non-matrix action Rigger Jump In). In this case he jump in directly without first forming a matrix persona. The Icon will keep Vehicle/Drone Device Icon ratings and any matrix damage taken will be "soaked" by the vehicle/drone, not the control rig. In this case you probably keep the appearance of the original vehicle/drone device icon but changing appearance is just a data processing matrix action away.

Rooks

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« Reply #21 on: <06-22-15/0254:38> »
Right and RIggers are pretty much screwed against deckers as the rigger nor the drones have a sleaze attribute to run silent or an attack attribute just fire wall and data processing

Xenon

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« Reply #22 on: <06-22-15/0322:19> »
Thought DT changed that ;)

Triskavanski

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« Reply #23 on: <06-22-15/0330:04> »
Not really. It did allow you to add one point of sleeze. Then take off two points of matrix life for another point of sleeze
Concepts are great, but implementation sucks. Why not improve it?

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Senko

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« Reply #24 on: <06-22-15/0512:28> »
Not really. It did allow you to add one point of sleeze. Then take off two points of matrix life for another point of sleeze

You can also lower an attribute to raise another e.g. Add sleeze 1 then drop data processing to raise it.

Top Dog

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« Reply #25 on: <06-22-15/0526:50> »
Not really. It did allow you to add one point of sleeze. Then take off two points of matrix life for another point of sleeze

You can also lower an attribute to raise another e.g. Add sleeze 1 then drop data processing to raise it.
Why would you? Using "Add a Matrix Attribute" adds Sleaze at 1 without dropping DP at all. Granted, Modify might be cheaper, but not by a lot. Besides, that's assuming you can do that at all - I don't think you can raise Sleaze with Modify if you don't actually have it yet, but YMMV.

Remember, you can't use Modify after Add - you can only use Increase after Add.

Xenon

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« Reply #26 on: <06-22-15/0630:23> »
Cant attach a stealth dongle to a RCC...?

Doesnt matter; Rigger can also base his persona on a commlink, attach a stealth dongle and slave the drone to the commlink.

Riggers don't really need an attack rating unless you also get cybercombat (but just like TMs can be Hacker and Rigger at the same time - so can a rigger/decker; just take a rather huge investment.... in Resources, Skills and Essence).



Triskavanski

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« Reply #27 on: <06-22-15/0842:46> »
Nope, can't put the dongle on a RCC, because it is for comlinks. Something about how Riggers shouldn't be allowed to do anything with marks.
Concepts are great, but implementation sucks. Why not improve it?

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I_AM_ZHOUL!!!

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« Reply #28 on: <06-22-15/1408:11> »
Cant attach a stealth dongle to a RCC...?

Doesnt matter; Rigger can also base his persona on a commlink, attach a stealth dongle and slave the drone to the commlink.

Riggers don't really need an attack rating unless you also get cybercombat (but just like TMs can be Hacker and Rigger at the same time - so can a rigger/decker; just take a rather huge investment.... in Resources, Skills and Essence).

My reading of the RCC says you can use Dongles with them.  It says that the "RCC... has all the features of a commlink...", so that's like saying that a truck has all the features of a car but can't use a turbo. If it has all the same features then it has all the same hardware & software to do everything a commlink can do. It just also happens to have a whole bunch of additional features as well.

Herr Brackhaus

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« Reply #29 on: <06-22-15/1552:08> »
Xenon, Zhoul
Kincaid has explicitly stated that commlink dongles are not compatible with cyberdecks.

I should once again point out that I'm not on the rules team and I'm very much on the lower end of the freelancer totem pole.  I don't have the authority to make rulings--I just hang out here more often than other freelancers.  Sometimes I can communicate the decisions of others (like KS freebies for Life Modules), but often I'm just expressing my own take on an issue.  Exactly what my own take on an issue is largely depends on my involvement with its creation--I can talk all day with you about GI/GO since I wrote that.  I can't really speak to the echoes since I didn't write that and I don't want to misrepresent someone else's work by accident.

Now, having said all that, the idea of dongles on something other than a commlink has been nixed from above.  That doesn't preclude to possibility to riggers getting some sort of functional equivalent come Rigger 5 (I have no idea--that's a pure guess on my part), but the idea that you can get a 4/5/5/6 RCC for about 100,000 nuyen less than roughly equivalent cyberdeck makes me nervous about how the costing all plays out.  Personally, I'm not against riggers getting a way to mark.  What I wouldn't want to see is a riggers getting a way to mark that suddenly makes an iconic piece of gear (cyberdecks) somehow obsolete.  Cool toys are awesome.  Cool toys that make someone else feel crappy about their own cool toys are less awesome.

It's not your job to worry about ripple effects when it comes to rules, so if you want the rigger at your table to mark, toss him a dongle (that somehow sounds dirty) and call it a day.  I've got houserules too--the only time I play strict core is when I'm in Missions.
« Last Edit: <06-22-15/1556:02> by Herr Brackhaus »