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active skillsofts

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CyberT2000

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« on: (15:05:51/09-07-10) »
Hi,

In SR4a, the price of activelsofts is 10000 nuyen per Level. Isn't it a little too much  ? (it is more than X3 from SR4 to SR4A)

What is the reasonning behind this ?


Doc Chaos

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« Reply #1 on: (15:28:40/09-07-10) »
The prophecy says: Skills take lots of Karma and time to learn. Even with a limit to 4, cheap skillsoft would inevitably lead to that all cybered characters got themselves Skillwires rating 4 (not difficult) and outsorce all not so important skills to cheap skillsofts.

So, basically, its a gaming balance issue.
« Last Edit: (15:31:02/09-07-10) by Doc Chaos »
SR4A Limited Edition [german] - 0478/1100

CyberT2000

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« Reply #2 on: (16:24:07/09-07-10) »
But in the name of game balance, the skillwires became much less attractive.

In my group two characters were interested in skillwires but facing the price they choose not to take them.

At character creation : the price is correct (about half real skill cost but with a essence cost and skillwire system cost) but compared to skill groups it cost too much.

In game : 10000 nuyen per level is way too much even for well paid runners. Even a level 2 skill cost as much as the pay for several runs.

 


FastJack

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« Reply #3 on: (16:36:35/09-07-10) »
Well, to get a level 2 active skill from actually learning it costs 8 Karma, which is several runs as well.

Casazil

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« Reply #4 on: (16:45:37/09-07-10) »
Well, to get a level 2 active skill from actually learning it costs 8 Karma, which is several runs as well.

Not really even a low karma GM would probally give 4 karma a run. You at least get 1 for surviveing and 1 for doing the run 2 more in a run isn't not that much. My players average 6 to 8 a run, Missions pay at least 4 as much as 6 a run if done well.
"If at first you don't succeed blame someone else"
Joel "Casazil" Rogers
Catalyst Demo Team Shadowrun Special Agent #251
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/CasazilsShadowrun/

CyberT2000

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« Reply #5 on: (16:55:21/09-07-10) »
I agree with Casazil.

Another point : skillwires are (in my opinion) proposed for tech oriented characters (street sams, riggers, hackers...) and this type of characters needs money more than karma. The high cost makes skillwires an uninteresting choice for them.

It makes skillswires more interesting to magician/adept types (who needs more karma than money) that for cybered characters.

FastJack

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« Reply #6 on: (17:08:21/09-07-10) »
Yes, but even skill wires have their limits. The skills max out at 4 and the Skillwires themselves can only hold 2×rating levels of a skill, so they best Skillwire can hold 10 skill levels, which is two 4 level skills and one 2 level skill.

And chances are you're not going to be sammie that relies on skill wires to shoot guns or use unarmed combat...

Casazil

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« Reply #7 on: (17:10:24/09-07-10) »
Yes, but even skill wires have their limits. The skills max out at 4 and the Skillwires themselves can only hold 2×rating levels of a skill, so they best Skillwire can hold 10 skill levels, which is two 4 level skills and one 2 level skill.

And chances are you're not going to be sammie that relies on skill wires to shoot guns or use unarmed combat...

Is that true for the expert Skillwires system??
"If at first you don't succeed blame someone else"
Joel "Casazil" Rogers
Catalyst Demo Team Shadowrun Special Agent #251
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/CasazilsShadowrun/

Mooncrow

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« Reply #8 on: (17:18:40/09-07-10) »
Yes, but even skill wires have their limits. The skills max out at 4 and the Skillwires themselves can only hold 2×rating levels of a skill, so they best Skillwire can hold 10 skill levels, which is two 4 level skills and one 2 level skill.

And chances are you're not going to be sammie that relies on skill wires to shoot guns or use unarmed combat...

Is that true for the expert Skillwires system??

Yes.

They can hold in backup as many as you want though, but only rating x2 can be active.  Changing to a different skill takes a Simple Action.

Casazil

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« Reply #9 on: (17:31:53/09-07-10) »
Yes, but even skill wires have their limits. The skills max out at 4 and the Skillwires themselves can only hold 2×rating levels of a skill, so they best Skillwire can hold 10 skill levels, which is two 4 level skills and one 2 level skill.

And chances are you're not going to be sammie that relies on skill wires to shoot guns or use unarmed combat...

Is that true for the expert Skillwires system??

Yes.

They can hold in backup as many as you want though, but only rating x2 can be active.  Changing to a different skill takes a Simple Action.

Yeah so then it remains in my opinion then skillwires suck!  ;D
"If at first you don't succeed blame someone else"
Joel "Casazil" Rogers
Catalyst Demo Team Shadowrun Special Agent #251
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/CasazilsShadowrun/

Mooncrow

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« Reply #10 on: (17:59:56/09-07-10) »
Well, they are software, so there are other avenues of acquisition^^ 

But overall, I tend to agree, outside of a couple types of builds.  In my games I make them quite a bit cheaper, and they still only get used rarely.

Casazil

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« Reply #11 on: (18:03:03/09-07-10) »
I guess my problem is I like haveing the skills I once made a guy with 20 level 2 skills and mostly average attributes sure i rolled mostly 5 die but hey starting character that works.

A little karma later and I was smokein.
"If at first you don't succeed blame someone else"
Joel "Casazil" Rogers
Catalyst Demo Team Shadowrun Special Agent #251
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/CasazilsShadowrun/

FastJack

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« Reply #12 on: (18:22:08/09-07-10) »
Well, the skill wires are great for Cyberzombies, Cyborgs and Dolls.

Casazil

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« Reply #13 on: (18:49:07/09-07-10) »
Now see I have no interest in inrolling in the Dollhouse (loved that series) nor in being a Cyberzombie all magic things want to kill me character. Partail borg maybe but debateable and if I did I still want the skills screw hopeing i know it on chip.
"If at first you don't succeed blame someone else"
Joel "Casazil" Rogers
Catalyst Demo Team Shadowrun Special Agent #251
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/CasazilsShadowrun/

CyberT2000

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« Reply #14 on: (23:58:45/09-07-10) »
I'll probably make the active skillsoft cheaper (like 5000 nuyen per rank) in my campaign to make them more interesting.

will there be an official word on the topic ?