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Vehicle Movement rates

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MWillner

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« on: <03-23-14/1918:12> »
I may have missed the discussion; if so, sorry for the repetition.

Anyway, on page 202 of the core book, under the Section Vehicle Combat, subsection Movement Rate, the second sentence (starting "The driver of the vehicle can..." makes no sense to me. Either the word "or" has been incorrectly added or there is missing text.


Namikaze

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« Reply #1 on: <03-23-14/2237:31> »
I read it as the "or" is a typo.  Remove the "or" and the sentence makes sense.
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MWillner

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« Reply #2 on: <03-29-14/1534:17> »
"The driver of the vehicle can adjust her movement rate with the required action to control the vehicle during her Action Phase but chooses the movement rate at the beginning of each Combat Turn instead of moving by Initiative Pass." - Shadowrun 5, page 202

I still am not sure what the above sentence (without the "or") means. What is the difference between "adjusting her movement rate" and "chooses the movement rate" .

For example:
You are travelling in your Toyota Gopher, going at a sedate 50 kph (about 42 M per CT, just into the running rate for a Speed 4 vehicle like the Gopher). Suddenly a go-gang appears in your rear view mirror, and you decide you need to pick up the pace to your top speed of 80 M per CT (about 96 kph).

The combat sequence starts and  initiatives are rolled. It is the beginning of the Combat Turn (CT).

What is the sequence of events to increase your speed?

On another note, why did the Toyota Marketing Department name a truck after a small, slow, fossorial animal. Jackrabbit I can see. If you are going for the cute market maybe the Bunny. But Gopher??


Michael Chandra

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« Reply #3 on: <03-30-14/0451:08> »
Quite simple: You officially adjust the movement rate during your action, but have to declare at the start of your Combat Turn what your movement for that CT will be, just like how you must declare at the start of your Action Phase what your personal movement would be in a normal fight. So no adjusting each IP, just adjusting each CT.
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MWillner

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« Reply #4 on: <03-30-14/0958:13> »
Thank you. Now it makes sense. (I still don't get Gopher, though).

Michael Chandra

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« Reply #5 on: <03-30-14/1530:37> »
If you wanted to accelerate, that works fine. If, however, you're going at Speed 4 and want to lose speed fast, your Acceleration is 2 so you can only drop 2 levels in a single CT, so would be going at Speed 2 and the CT after that you could hit zero.
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ImaginalDisc

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« Reply #6 on: <03-31-14/0934:35> »
If you wanted to accelerate, that works fine. If, however, you're going at Speed 4 and want to lose speed fast, your Acceleration is 2 so you can only drop 2 levels in a single CT, so would be going at Speed 2 and the CT after that you could hit zero.

Let's say you have a drone in combat. Let's say it's speed 3, acceleration 2 and you're fighting with it in a crowded cubical farm. Can the drone stop on a dime? Does it need to make handling tests to turn 90 degrees past the water cooler?


Michael Chandra

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« Reply #7 on: <03-31-14/0954:04> »
If it operates at Speed 2, its walk rate would be 10m and its run rate 20m per CT, right? However, I wouldn't treat drones as vehicles when it comes to normal combat, they're supposed to be just like people in combat. Speed only makes sense when it comes to vehicle chases.
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Namikaze

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« Reply #8 on: <03-31-14/1059:10> »
If it operates at Speed 2, its walk rate would be 10m and its run rate 20m per CT, right? However, I wouldn't treat drones as vehicles when it comes to normal combat, they're supposed to be just like people in combat. Speed only makes sense when it comes to vehicle chases.

Agreed - a drone is generally accepted to be MUCH lighter weight, which would give it a LOT more agility.
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ImaginalDisc

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« Reply #9 on: <03-31-14/1100:27> »
If it operates at Speed 2, its walk rate would be 10m and its run rate 20m per CT, right? However, I wouldn't treat drones as vehicles when it comes to normal combat, they're supposed to be just like people in combat. Speed only makes sense when it comes to vehicle chases.

I am comfortable assuming that drones in combat with people should use more reasonable people-scale rules, but what is fair? Should they move Speed X2 meters walk and Speed X4 run or should it be enhanced? Hellhounds are much faster than that. Why can't a SOTA combat drone be as fast as a big dog? Speed x4 and Speed x6 run?

JackVII

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« Reply #10 on: <03-31-14/1205:57> »
If it operates at Speed 2, its walk rate would be 10m and its run rate 20m per CT, right? However, I wouldn't treat drones as vehicles when it comes to normal combat, they're supposed to be just like people in combat. Speed only makes sense when it comes to vehicle chases.

I am comfortable assuming that drones in combat with people should use more reasonable people-scale rules, but what is fair? Should they move Speed X2 meters walk and Speed X4 run or should it be enhanced? Hellhounds are much faster than that. Why can't a SOTA combat drone be as fast as a big dog? Speed x4 and Speed x6 run?
All of the listed drones other than the Kanmusi operate at a speed of at least 3, which translates to a walking rate of 20 and a running rate of 40. They can easily outdistance a hellhound. (I personally think the Kanmushi's speed is kind of ludicrous, probably should be a 1).
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ImaginalDisc

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« Reply #11 on: <03-31-14/1440:30> »
If it operates at Speed 2, its walk rate would be 10m and its run rate 20m per CT, right? However, I wouldn't treat drones as vehicles when it comes to normal combat, they're supposed to be just like people in combat. Speed only makes sense when it comes to vehicle chases.

I am comfortable assuming that drones in combat with people should use more reasonable people-scale rules, but what is fair? Should they move Speed X2 meters walk and Speed X4 run or should it be enhanced? Hellhounds are much faster than that. Why can't a SOTA combat drone be as fast as a big dog? Speed x4 and Speed x6 run?
All of the listed drones other than the Kanmusi operate at a speed of at least 3, which translates to a walking rate of 20 and a running rate of 40. They can easily outdistance a hellhound. (I personally think the Kanmushi's speed is kind of ludicrous, probably should be a 1).

OK, I know those references are correct, but I think there's some inconsistency. If in person-to-drone combat we should waive the normal acceleration rules and let drones speed up, slow down, and turn on a dime, why would we also let them be as fast as a regular vehicle?

Shouldn't being as nimble as a person make drones somewhat slower than other vehicles when in combat?

Namikaze

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« Reply #12 on: <03-31-14/1654:44> »
I think the difference is that when you're looking at drones as combatants in person-to-person combat, they move really fast.  When you use them in vehicle-to-vehicle combat, they move just as fast, but with a lot more agility.

Personally, I think the stats are off for drones - the changes between vehicle and personal combat mean that drones act differently in each (even if the differences are relatively slight).  Vehicle speed should be increased (or decreased) and the chart for vehicle speeds should be expanded to allow for more variation.
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