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ETA on Errata

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Michael Chandra

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« Reply #60 on: (10:18:59/10-17-13) »
Yeah, HE-grenades drop off real quick. Fragmentation are much more a problem. And the guy who is at point zero, or when multiple grenades are fired.

Agonar: The problem is it's not clear whether magic stacks with augmentations when it comes to things like stat-boosts. For a character aiming to combine different boosts on the same thing this can be quite important.
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Reaver

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« Reply #61 on: (16:20:19/10-17-13) »
I dunno, they state you can have a max boost of +4 to a stat... regardless of where is comes from...

I myself wouldn't care if it was a combo of the 2, as long as it did not exceed that total +4.
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Michael Chandra

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« Reply #62 on: (16:26:49/10-17-13) »
Yeah, you'd say that yes? But we still got claims that that only applies to augmentations. -_-
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Crunch

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« Reply #63 on: (16:32:29/10-17-13) »
It should be clear cut, but Aaron recently stated that the text in Wireless Reflexes uses Augmentation in a narrow sense to mean only Cybernetic and bioware enhancements. If that's the case then it opens up the rest of the book to some weird scenarios. Fortunately almost all of the adept powers specify that they are covered, but there are otherproblematic places. 

Reaver

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« Reply #64 on: (16:52:48/10-17-13) »
It should be clear cut, but Aaron recently stated that the text in Wireless Reflexes uses Augmentation in a narrow sense to mean only Cybernetic and bioware enhancements. If that's the case then it opens up the rest of the book to some weird scenarios. Fortunately almost all of the adept powers specify that they are covered, but there are otherproblematic places.

well,

Quote

Increase [Attribute]
(Essence)
Type: P Range: T
Duration: S Drain: F Ė 3
This spell increases an Attribute (natural or augmented)
on a voluntary subject. A version of this spell exists
for each Physical and Mental attribute, but not for
Special Attributes (Initiative, Edge, Essence, Magic, or
Resonance). The Force of the spell must equal or exceed
the (augmented) value of the Attribute being affected
.
The Attribute is increased by an amount equal to the hits
scored, up to the targetís augmented maximum (any hits
that would increase the Attribute beyond its augmented
maximum are ignored).
Each Attribute can only be affected
by a single Increase Attribute spell at a time.
Note that increasing an Attribute may affect other
derived statistics (Increase Reaction also affects Initiative,
for example, while Increase Body adds extra boxes
to the characterís Physical Condition Monitor for as long
as the spell lasts).

well, the Spell version DOES seem to break that +4 rule on further reading.... but should be noted that doing so could be extremely costly to the mage (the underlined part) so, casting "Increase Attribute (body)" on a troll with 12 body IS a force 12 spell.....
***(this statement is false, in my 3rd drunken read through by the spell description)
The adept ability is much more clear...

Quote
Attribute Boost
(Attribute)
Cost: 0.25 PP per level
Activation: Simple Action
You call upon inner strength to perform amazing physical
feats beyond their normal abilities. Attribute Boost must
be purchased for a specific Physical Attribute (Agility, Body,
Reaction, or Strength); separate Attribute Boost powers
may be bought for different attributes. This power cannot
be purchased for a Mental or Special Attribute.
When you activate this power, make a Magic + Attribute
Boost Rating Test. Each hit on this test boosts
your attribute rating by 1, up to your augmented Attribute
maximum
. This only affects your dice pools; your
Physical limit and Initiative ratings donít change with
Attribute Boost. The boost lasts for a number of Combat
Turns equal to twice the number of hits you get.
When the boost runs out, you take Drain equal to the
level of this power.

Quote

Improved
Physical Attribute
Cost: 1 PP per level
This power allows you to increase a physical attribute
(Body, Agility, Reaction, and Strength). This augments
your attribute, so your Physical limit may also increase
with the new Attribute rating. This power allows you to
exceed your natural Attribute maximum, up to your augmented
maximum.

So at the end of the day.... I guess it becomes a GM's call on how he wants to handle this and the rules do seem to contradict each other a bit....
***(The Spell does state that any extra hits that would push an attribute above augmented max is ignored)
« Last Edit: (17:13:47/10-17-13) by Reaver »
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Reaver

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« Reply #65 on: (16:57:52/10-17-13) »
I think it should be noted however, that: "What is good for the goose is good for the gander"

So if they REALLY want to try this little route to quick power, the GM is free to use the same on them...

So now they could be facing a Troll, with a body of 20.... and heavy security armor AND a panther assault "rifle".....


Makes their little munchkin argument seem weighted in the GMs favor....
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Michael Chandra

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« Reply #66 on: (17:03:40/10-17-13) »
"The NPCs can do it as well" hardly is a good argument against badly-written rules.

Increase Attribute respects augmented maximum by the way.
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Reaver

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« Reply #67 on: (17:10:55/10-17-13) »
I REALLY got to stop drinking in the morning.... (but, Beer and Cornflakes is SOOOOOO good!!!!)


just changed my post 2 posts up (where I quoted the spells/abilities)

there was an interesting line in there I missed my first 3 readings (why can't I read both things I am seeing clearly?!?!? or yea... beer)

There seems to be a limitation on the spell as well that caps it to augmented Max.... and any more hits are ignored by the spell.... So to me, that would suggest using edge (which normally allows more hit then the limiter) would be wasted as THAT is as strong/fast/etc as the body can get.


Where am I going? And why am I in a hand basket ???

Remember: You can't fix Stupid. But you can beat on it with a 2x4 until it smartens up! Or dies.

Michael Chandra

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« Reply #68 on: (17:18:19/10-17-13) »
True, if all boosts except drugs are augmentations or mention following augmented maximum, then only Possession (if it doesn't mention it once it becomes available) and drugs can bypass it. And cyberlimbs, of course, but those have a price.

Initiative, on the other hand...
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Reaver

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« Reply #69 on: (17:36:37/10-17-13) »
True, if all boosts except drugs are augmentations or mention following augmented maximum, then only Possession (if it doesn't mention it once it becomes available) and drugs can bypass it. And cyberlimbs, of course, but those have a price.

Initiative, on the other hand...


Am I missing something?

Quote

Increase Reflexes
(Essence)
Type: P Range: T
Duration: S Drain: F
This spell increases the initiative of a subject. Each hit
rolled on the Spellcasting Test adds +1 to the targetís Initiative,
and every two hits adds one Initiative Die. A character
can only be affected by a single Increase Reflexes spell at
a time, and the maximum Initiative Dice anyone can have
is +5D6.


It seems quite clear....
the MAX dice you can get from any combination of tech and magic is 5d6.....

Each hit rolled adds +1 to initiative
2 hits give +1 dice...

So if a mage SUPER overcasts and edges the roll AND gets 15 hits, the spell gives:
+15 to initiative
+ 4d6 (or LESS given the starting initiative dice of the subject)
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Crunch

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« Reply #70 on: (17:39:17/10-17-13) »
The question raised by Aaron's reading of the text in Wired Reflexes is whether, for instance, you can stack Wired 1, Nitro and Increased Reflexes to achieve +5D6.

Reaver

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« Reply #71 on: (17:59:38/10-17-13) »
The question raised by Aaron's reading of the text in Wired Reflexes is whether, for instance, you can stack Wired 1, Nitro and Increased Reflexes to achieve +5D6.

.
..
...
.....

I can see it.

The mage is risking drain on the spell,

the Buffie is risking addiction on the Nitro, and paid essence and money to get the wired reflexes 1...

AND it is still capped at 5d6, regardless of the number of hits by the mage, or the number of doses of Nitro (factoring in addiction levels)


And again: "good for the goose good for the gander"....

If this becomes the Modus operandi for that player, letting him tangle with an NPC that uses the same trick might be a good object lesion for him... (the player would still probably win... but suddenly he will realize that the bad guys can do that too).


After all, nothing stops the entire NPC team from focus firing on him to bring him down, seeing as he is now a bigger threat then the rest of the team due to his speed (arguably next to the mage) and with the way initiative works now, it's not like he is going to get off multiple attacks before anyone else goes. Sure he will probably go first.... but not 2 or 3 times before the opposition has a chance to respond.
Where am I going? And why am I in a hand basket ???

Remember: You can't fix Stupid. But you can beat on it with a 2x4 until it smartens up! Or dies.

Dangersaurus

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« Reply #72 on: (18:47:46/10-17-13) »
So... back on topic. Is there any ETA on the errata?

martinchaen

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« Reply #73 on: (18:50:57/10-17-13) »
Dangersaurus; you keep asking, as if that is somehow magically going to get the errata here faster. I'm fairly confident that CGL will announce an errata document here and elsewhere, so repeatedly "pushing the elevator button" won't make things happen more quickly.

Take a page from Blizzard; the errata will be here "soon".
Quote
Copyright 2004-2013 Blizzard Entertainment, Inc. All rights reserved. "Soon" does not imply any particular date, time, decade, century, or millennia in the past, present, and certainly not the future. "Soon" shall make no contract or warranty between Blizzard Entertainment and the end user. "Soon" will arrive some day, Blizzard does guarantee that "soon" will be here before the end of time. Maybe. Do not make plans based on "soon" as Blizzard will not be liable for any misuse, use, or even casual glancing at "soon."

Dangersaurus

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« Reply #74 on: (18:55:51/10-17-13) »
I'll ask it every time this thread steers off topic, sorry if that offends your sense of decorum.