[Longshot23]

Well, if you could deal with my being a bit flighty at times, I assume that you'd like it. I collaborate with my players on a lot of things, and the one thing that was great about having a lot of time to spend on a single game is that it gives a lot of opportunity for creative turns and alterations as the game/campaign went on.

That said, my official policy is to try and kill the PCs. However, that never actually happened, but it's come close. And of course that ended up with a new revenge-based run after the PCs recovered.

Flighty as in whimsical?  That works.  Actually I meant in regard to knowledge that you have and players do not, but are trying to operate as per that knowledge anyway.  Yeah, I know, you could say that about any game world.

Most of what I know about spook & law tradecraft I've gotten from novels (I like Tom Clancy's take on it all), although I have done some reading about it as non-fiction.

[Crimsondude]

Flighty as in I'd stop posting just in my games for up to two weeks at a time. Not because I got stuck. I just didn't want to play GM.

But as far as knowledge goes, yeah I've heard that I can be a pain in the ass about that because I have developed some pretty deep backstories or whatever and my players have hit me up in the OOC sections and asked "WTF are you talking about?" But it's usually not a problem with tradecraft and IRL information being applied. That comes from everything I write about being connected, and what other people see is at best about 10% of my writing output. So I'll refer to something forgetting that it's in my storage bin (the big 60+ gallon ones they sell at Wal-Mart, BTW) handwritten in some notebook.

SL was/is all about collaboration and I'd frequently comment on new or interesting things that would likely find their way into a game. But my players were also pretty clever and know a lot of this stuff as well. Everyone here can probably guess that Critias is a really smart and clever dude. Well, the people I gamed with were all like him. One is literally scary smart. I am by far the dumbest of the dozen or so people I regularly gamed with when it comes to rules. Which is why I make up for it in extensive character studies even though I am still fairly well-versed in the rules. But I wasn't the one who figured out the math of SR3 and 4 dice mechanics and charted the statistical analysis.

But that's a good question. I learned better of it over time, but I still do it on occasion. I know that was a problem when I'd submit fiction to Tisoz's contests on DS that they got pretty arcane. Luckily I've run all my stuff by Critias first since we are working on the same project, and I've toned it way the Hell down. But knowing a lot about RL espionage helps provide a framework for ideas of what to write when I've been working on SG. I used to complain about some writers chasing the past and incorporating modern day zeitgeist into SR that's outdated by publication, and so I strive not to do that. But having the knowledge is ostensibly supposed to help me pick out patterns and ideas that I can apply to the SR world where, for example, Matrix 1.0 was in no way supposed to look anything like the Internet. And that goes back to the whole Grant Morrison comment about accepting fiction as fiction.

That said, I'm sure I'll get slammed when SG comes out for a couple of things that may hem too close to current day events though I am consciously trying not to. It happens. But I'm trying to affect different aspects than just "CIA and FBI hate each other because J. Edgar Hoover wanted to run all American espionage-foreign and domestic."

[lonewolf23k]

Hi.  This thread made me join this forum, so kudos to the original poster.

I like the idea of making Superheroic types in the world of Shadowrun; sure, it's a dark, bleak world of Grey vs Grey morality, but isn't it at the Darkest of Times that there's a Call for Heroes?  I could see a small "Superhero Culture" developping in the low-rent neighborhoods by desperate would-be heroes wanting to clean up their neighborhoods.  It would start small at first, with a mental case pulling a Don Juan Quichote, but he could spark imitators, and before anyone knows it, there's a growing subculture of "Unionsuit-Wearing Heroes" (to coin the classic term) spreading across the UCAS and CSA. 

And that would just get Japan's Cosplayer community to start producing "Kamen Rider" wannabe heroes...

[The Cat]

Hi.  This thread made me join this forum, so kudos to the original poster.

I like the idea of making Superheroic types in the world of Shadowrun; sure, it's a dark, bleak world of Grey vs Grey morality, but isn't it at the Darkest of Times that there's a Call for Heroes?  I could see a small "Superhero Culture" developping in the low-rent neighborhoods by desperate would-be heroes wanting to clean up their neighborhoods.  It would start small at first, with a mental case pulling a Don Juan Quichote, but he could spark imitators, and before anyone knows it, there's a growing subculture of "Unionsuit-Wearing Heroes" (to coin the classic term) spreading across the UCAS and CSA. 

And that would just get Japan's Cosplayer community to start producing "Kamen Rider" wannabe heroes...

You don't really need an "in-game only" reason for it.  There are Superheroes in Seattle right now under the name of the Rain City Movement, plus some not affiliated with the group (http://www.nwcn.com/news/Real-Life-Superheroes-Hit-Seattle-Streets-109317779.html).  Many are part of a national superhero movement (http://www.reallifesuperheroes.com/).  All you really have to do is take these guys and toss in magic, shadow-technology, cybernetics, bioware and genetech.

[The_Gun_Nut]

And just like real life, the SR guys probably are rare and low key.  Else they would have a short life span.

[Kontact]

This thread gives me the impression that many of you don't really know what high-concept means.

Actually, now that I think about it, I don't think anyone really knows what high-concept means...

[Doc Chaos]

That was a pretty interesting read, thanks for that Kontact!

[Longshot23]

This thread gives me the impression that many of you don't really know what high-concept means.

Actually, now that I think about it, I don't think anyone really knows what high-concept means...

Whoa, that link was incredibly useful.  Thanks a lot for that.

[Crimsondude]

I'll just say flat out that I use the comic book definition as best exemplified by the Twitter hashtag #coremarveluniverse that led to this article and can be summed up as one or two-sentence descriptions of utter batshit insanity masking what is actually something amazing.

[Longshot23]

I have to say this, in this thread.

DEATH TO THE EVIL OVERLORD RULES!!!

Ah, that's better.

[Crimsondude]

Hate to necropost, but I felt it was worth mentioning. Saw this on Twitter this morning:

@bencnn Ben Wedemen It took just four days for protesters to push Mubarak govt to the brink of the abyss. FOUR DAYS. #Jan25 #Egypt

Everytime I see someone talk about impossible or improbable in SR, I will point them to this tweet.

[Frostriese]

Heh. Where are your Shadowrun-honed cynism skills? It are not so much the protestors themselves, but most likely the military letting the protestors riot. The military could bloodily end the whole thing in a matter of hours. However, they most likely want get rid of the Mubaraks, so that they can then appoint his successor (just as they did Mubarak and his two predecessors), instead of a dynastic succession by Mubarak jr. Nothing is impossible, really, but there are usually very good reasons for anything happening in the background - we just dont always know the background. Translated into fictional worlds I guess that means that the authors should at least have a rough grasp of the background dynamics, even if it isnt revealed to the players. But it does ensure some internal consistency.

Oh, and as for Evo and Horizon mentioned earlier in the thread: I never liked them especially because they are all "good guys". I dont like it. There is after all a reason why megacorps usually arent that. Though, I guess Horizon is simply an example of how a megacorp with a Reputation 12 rating looks like, heh.

[Crimsondude]

I grew up and realized that if I continued living with that much cynicism I was effectively living like I ate a bullet when I was twelve.

[Frostriese]

Eh, there's a difference between the personal level and news-level events. I don't think everybody is only out to make profit, but OTOH there is a lot of shit going on in the world, and after all Egypt is a dictatorship established some decades ago by the military...

Anyway, my point in regards to the subdiscussion was that there always are internal dynamics, even if they are maybe not known. There must always be some internal coherence, and too unrealistic events might destroy that coherence.

[Kontact]

Not every army sees the populace as their enemy.

It takes a lot to get a soldier to fire on his own people.