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Rigger 5 Errata

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Wakshaani

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« Reply #195 on: (09:33:31/01-14-16) »
Correction, it is significantly different stats.

                     HANDL SPEED ACCEL BODY ARM PILOT SENS SEATS AVAIL COST
P.77 version: 4/4       4            2           24     14        6           7.        9.       18R 225,000•
Table: Rhino 4/4         4.          2.        17         18.    4.             4.       9         18R 225,000•

Not only is there a drop in body by 7, but pilot by 2 (6 is kinda high) and sensors by 3 (7 is extremely high). While armor went up by 4, that doesn't make up for the massive loss to body. So Wak, which is correct and then please fix it in your errata/printing if you can.

In this instance, the chart is correct, not the original section. (Not sure why that change didn't get in, but the chart adjustments were the very final thing adjusted. Which is also why the shifted columns weren't caught, I do believe!)

(Not my chapter, by the by, I just happened to see that alteration when it went in!)

Wakshaani

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« Reply #196 on: (09:45:13/01-14-16) »
Thanks for the clarification Herr.

So Wak did you post the fixed drone stats somewhere?

Some, but not all. I haven't heard back if certain things were intended or not, and I don't like jumping the gun and stating something without going upstairs. I can talk about soem stuff *I* did, but talking about *other* stuff, I'm more careful about. Not telepathic, despite a love of tuna fish. :D

Which ones, in particular, do you have questions about? I'll do what I can!

Wakshaani

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« Reply #197 on: (09:58:09/01-14-16) »
@Wakshaani, this is how you generate tables using forumcode (quote my post if you want to see details; you can also find tons of BBCode table generators online):
(snip)

Bless you! That's gonna come in tres handy! Now to figure out what to call it as  a save file so I can call it up later. Hmm...

Wakshaani

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« Reply #198 on: (10:03:02/01-14-16) »
This thread also brought up the question about underbarrel grenade launchers (and underbarrel weapons in general). Why are these specified on the Standard size mount (3 MP)? Does an Ares Alpha need both a Large (4 MP, assault rifle) and a Standard (3 MP, under-barrel grenade launcher) mount, for a total of 7MP? Or is it something else entirely.

The intent was to use it as a stand-alone weapon system, since it's not as good as a full-sized grenade launcher. The assault weapon 'oversight' is a fumble, since it creates a class of "obviously superior" weapon loads which is bad, but, the mechanics don't take it into effect. So, officially, the Alpha takes 4 MP as any other assault rifle does. *un*officially, if you wanted to houserule it to require 5 MP, I, for one, wouldn't complain. (That would make it consume more than a normal AR, but less than a heavy weapon, which would seem to be a fair compromise.)


adzling

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« Reply #199 on: (10:19:30/01-14-16) »
Just trying to find out if you had created a doc/ post/ something somewhere that compiles all the correct drone stats.

+ I'm sure others have noted it but the tables at the back of the book contradict the description for pricing for Realistic mod to drones (they don't match at all).
Any idea which one is correct?

thanks for being so engaged and responsive ;-)

Thanks for the clarification Herr.

So Wak did you post the fixed drone stats somewhere?

Some, but not all. I haven't heard back if certain things were intended or not, and I don't like jumping the gun and stating something without going upstairs. I can talk about soem stuff *I* did, but talking about *other* stuff, I'm more careful about. Not telepathic, despite a love of tuna fish. :D

Which ones, in particular, do you have questions about? I'll do what I can!

adzling

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« Reply #200 on: (11:06:20/01-14-16) »
Here's another question Wak.

Page 124/125 talks about expanded ammunition bays and how now drone weapons only have the default capacity of the weapon (i.e. on clip/ mag etc) unless you expand it.

Sooo
1). does that mean that if you put an AK-98 on a drone that it uses the same physical clip as the non-drone mounted weapon?
2). how about expanded / larger capacity clips from Hard Targets, no go?
3). What about weapons that can take clips or belts, for example an LMG like the Stoner? When placed on a drone does it use belt feed by default?
4). If the answer to the above question is yes and you "expand" it's ammo capacity does that take one or two mod points (I would expect only one mod point as it already has a belt feed mechanism)?

thanks

Rift_0f_Bladz

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« Reply #201 on: (13:54:55/01-14-16) »
Correction, it is significantly different stats.

                     HANDL SPEED ACCEL BODY ARM PILOT SENS SEATS AVAIL COST
P.77 version: 4/4       4            2           24     14        6           7.        9.       18R 225,000•
Table: Rhino 4/4         4.          2.        17         18.    4.             4.       9         18R 225,000•

Not only is there a drop in body by 7, but pilot by 2 (6 is kinda high) and sensors by 3 (7 is extremely high). While armor went up by 4, that doesn't make up for the massive loss to body. So Wak, which is correct and then please fix it in your errata/printing if you can.

In this instance, the chart is correct, not the original section. (Not sure why that change didn't get in, but the chart adjustments were the very final thing adjusted. Which is also why the shifted columns weren't caught, I do believe!)

(Not my chapter, by the by, I just happened to see that alteration when it went in!)

Poop! To the body drop, but no complaints on sensors and pilot drops. Odd that for both body and armor the best is the non-mil/sec based RoadMaster.
Turned in a live tox-shaman for 1 mil • (split 4 ways) and helped kill another one. But piss off the other 3... Oophs, looks like more money down the road for me. B)

Malevolence

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« Reply #202 on: (17:13:36/01-14-16) »

Wakshaani, your updated stats drop the Crawler from a small drone to a Mini drone, with a rather dramatic reduction to the drone's body (3->1), making it much more limited in terms of what it could mount. The core version could mount an assault rifle, the updated version can mount up to a light pistol, or a machine pistol if you downgrade another stat. There is no other suitable body 3 small drone to replace it - you might be able to gut a Shamus or MCT Tunneler to get close, but even then the addition of Gecko Grips would put you over in points.

The Crawler's traditionally been a Mini drone over the past few editions. I'm not certain why it got enlarged for SR core, but I wanted to put it back where it's supposed to be. You can grab one of the MCT Seven for a drone with 3 mod points, if you need a lil' gunny sidekick. They're fragile (Bod 2 base, modified to 1(3), but handy for modders. (Man, I have a lot of thread to catch up on!)
I still can't load them with both an assault rifle and gecko tips. I suppose that the main problem is that mounting an AR now takes 4 mod points instead of 3. The useful use case with the bod 3 Crawler was that I could drop Bod to 2 for 2(4), then drop another stat to get 5 total mod points. Add 3 armor for 0 mod points and then 4 for the "large" mount and 1 for gecko tips. The end result is a flexible vehicle defense/offense system that has a soak of 8 dice (rather than 2). I just like the idea of a pair of these walking along the outside of an Ares Roadmaster, using the van for cover while returning fire on pursuers.


On an unrelated note, the Matilda has a body of 8 with no parenthetic value. Does it have 8 mod points or some lesser value?
Speech Thought Matrix/Text Astral

Wakshaani

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« Reply #203 on: (17:29:12/01-14-16) »
... It shouldn't. D'oh.

adzling

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« Reply #204 on: (10:56:20/01-15-16) »
A little birdy on another random thread on the internets told me that a drone can now run up to a number of Autosoft's equal to it's Pilot Rating.

That's a big change, I wonder why it didn't make it into the actual written rules in Rigger 5.0?

See here:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Shadowrun/comments/40q7dn/rigger_5_pg127_massive_stealth_nerf/cyxycjp

Wakshaani

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« Reply #205 on: (16:55:00/01-15-16) »
Looks like it got squeezed out by the Pilot chart. Something else for teh errata.

(From the original writing)
***
The Pilot program determines the Rating of the drone as a whole, serves as the primary source of attributes for skill tests, serves as a cap on the highest rating Autosoft the drone can run, and more. Is there any reason that itís in such high demand? Civilian Pilot programs are generally rating 2 (or, rarely, 1), restricted security Pilots are 3-4, while military-grade Pilots (5-6) are forbidden for general use. Cost and availability is shown on the chart below:

RATING   AVAIL   COST
1      4   100$
2      -   400$
3      8R   1800$
4      12R   3200$
5      16F   10,000$
6      24F   20,000$

(Due to advancements in Pilot programs, a Pilot may now operate as many Autosofts as its Rating, rather than half its Rating (rounded up) as per SR5. )
***

I had to go check to find that out! I was *wondering* why no one was talking about this! It's an important thing!

falar

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« Reply #206 on: (17:02:11/01-15-16) »
Could it have been intentionally removed? I could see that being the case if the line editor wanted to keep that rule as it was.

I like it better, because it makes drones able to rock 8 dice on almost anything you'd normally expect from them because a Pilot 4 and 4 Autosofts is really all that you need to cover most things. A combat drone can do with Maneuver, Targeting, SmartSoft and probably Electronic Warfare.

Jack_Spade

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« Reply #207 on: (17:17:25/01-15-16) »
Why is it harder to get a Pilot 1 than a Pilot 2  ???
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falar

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« Reply #208 on: (17:19:33/01-15-16) »
Why is it harder to find a basic cell phone than a smartphone?

Jack_Spade

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« Reply #209 on: (17:40:53/01-15-16) »
Is it? There seem to be a lot of them around...
Incidentally its the same with pilots - vehicles seem to have 1 as a baseline.
talk think matrix

To strive, to seek, to find and not to yield
Revenant Kynos Isaint Rex