Shadowrun

Shadowrun General => The Secret History => Topic started by: FastJack on <03-22-11/1249:48>

Title: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <03-22-11/1249:48>
This thread is to host all the wild speculations and crazy theories on WHO the anonymous poster on Jackpoint is (the Man with No Name, Hombre de la Unknown, Ghost in the Machine, etc.).

I have my own theory and shot a PM off to JMH to see if I'm warm or not, so I'm not posting it here for fear of spoiling (if I'm wrong, I'll post it anyway so we can at least cross it off).

Here's the posts so far:

Quote from: Corporate Guide p.70
The CAS is not on friendly relations with Aztlan—especially after it took over the Azzie sector of Denver a few years back. But what does the CAS military drive? Hawker-Siddley Skytrucks, Hawker-Siddley convoy vehicles, Hawker-Siddley recon drones—you get the point.

Quote from: War! p. 37
If their numbers keep growing, Aztlan’s going to take more direct action against Bogotá Libre!, and then you’ll see the membership drop like a stone down a deep, dark well. People who sign up for protest often don’t want anything to do with actual combat. And I can’t say I blame them.

Quote from: War! p. 83
No one has better intel then the cartels, and the petty criminals on the bottom of the food chain are the main reason for that. Shit rolls down hill, after all, and if you’re at the bottom of the hill, everything gets filtered through you sooner or later. People talk to hookers—prostitution is a great way to get intel from people who otherwise don’t talk. Drug dealers aren’t exactly like bartenders, but they can tell when things are happening based on shifts in their sales patterns, and data on who’s buying what from whom is always handy to have.

Quote from: Attitude, p. 31
The hell it can’t.
(in response to gaining trust with OC contacts)

Quote from: Attitude, p. 108
I’d like to nip any romantic portrayals of media pirates in the bud here. Don’t look at them as daring artists and freedom fighters sailing the Matrix, freeing us from the bonds of mediocre media. History suggests the original pirates weren’t the romantic figures we like to make them out to be, and neither are these ones. Why would anyone assume that a bunch of light-deprived,  basement-dwelling data miners would be anything but social misfits at best? Art exists for its own end, not as a part of some digital rebellion against “the man,” and pirates are only toothless thieves too cheap to pay their way.
(missed this one)

Quote from: Spy Games, p. 67
Given the anti-meta hate speeches he made in his twenties, along with his continuing mentorship role in the Humanis Policlub, he needs the bodyguard. Lesker receives no less than twenty threats a month and is the target of at least three assassination attempts a year.

Quote from: Spy Games, p. 70
It seems Kay St. Irregular has forgotten one of the more important power players in Denver. A recent Dawkins Group report has Kay on the short list of UCAS appointees for the Council. So, Kay, any hint as to when you’re going to chase off Lesker and take your seat at the table?

Quote from: Spy Games, p. 136
Great dragons and their ilk have yet to accept that the world moves faster than them, and it has no regard for their plans. They may think long-term, but humans are unpredictable and a bit crazy. We’ve also been playing this game for millennia without end.

Quote from: Spy Games, p. 152
Computers are optical now, right? How can they have a magnetic field?

Quote from: Spy Games, p. 166
Dose: Two fi fty. Thirty six. Uno. Cuarenta y cinco. Quarantasette. Novantadue. Ni hundered og fem. Femtiåtte. Quarantase. Konets.

Quote from: Gun Heaven, p. 17
Mmmm, Mmmm Good. Horizon is Good for the Soul :)

Quote from: Street Legends, p. 66
It sounds like the way most corporations do business. They’ll give you what they don’t want so long as you give them what they want in return. That is, unless you’re a dragon. In that case they’ll give you everything you ask for and ask nothing in return.
(In response to Sticks' being on UCAS Marshals Most Wanted, but Ares not turning him in)

Quote from: Street Legends, p. 102
Position. The work Blake did at SK -Prime was less about acquisitions than it was controlling Lowfyr’s considerable network of spies within rival organizations. In a sense, he watched the watchers. Blake was coordinating his own team of spies for Lowfyr while he was spying for Dunkelzahn.
(Re: Jonathon Blake)

Quote from: Street Legends, p. 125
Okay, I have to interrupt here. Hestaby is no guardian angel, no patron saint of metahumans, no martyr or whatever you want to call her. She is a media whore. She will do whatever she has to do to capture the spotlight and to present herself in a light that makes it appear that she is working in all of our best interests. The fact of the matter is, she crafts her public image as carefully as any megacorporation. And I doubt that it is a coincidence that the new Tír Tairngire government now enjoys a very close relationship with Horizon, the leading PR megacorp of the world. I am certain that Hestaby has her talons buried deep into that relationship, and that as a result, she is getting much more positive press because of it than what she would normally be able to get on her own. With her very carefully crafted public image, there’s no way of telling what her true agenda is. For all we know, it could very well be similar to Lofwyr’s (if not worse).

Quote from: Street Legends, p. 125
I make no apologies for what I have said. The truth stands for itself. Last year alone, Hestaby sent out more press releases than Lofwyr himself (and that’s not even counting all the “leaks” that were made about her scheduled appearances, alerting the media to what she was doing and where she was going to be). There’s something wrong with that, in my humble opinion.

Quote from: Street Legends, p. 128
Looks like another example of Hestaby trying to portray something in a totally different light than what it really is. Big surprise. One has to wonder if there’s anything genuine about Hestaby.

Quote from: Street Legends, p. 133
People need to remember that despite any PR bullshit, each and every great dragon is capable of being extremely vindictive and ill-tempered, and not just Lofwyr. Even the UCAS’ most exalted late president, Dunkelzahn, who was praised to no end for being “metahuman-friendly,” showed these same characteristics. In his will, Dunkelzahn stripped away all legal rights for a poor slot, and forced him to try and survive being hunted down by other parties looking to cash in on the sizable reward for his head for an entire week. No one knows if that guy ever survived, but it really doesn’t matter. In the end, all great dragons are cold-blooded. It’s their nature. Assuming or believing anything else is just believing in a lie.

Quote from: Artifacts Unbound, p. 36
Thirty-two.

Quote from: Conspiracy Theories, p. 71
This is one of those theories that is absolutely ludicrous, but would be great if it was true. Imagine the chaos. Dragons who dislike each other, who are having increasing trouble getting along, having to coordinate the operations of this place together. The value of the product stored there, and the number of wealthy people who would like to get just a taste of it. The powerful people in the world who’d like to find out about it just to get a bit of leverage over the dragons. It would be too beautiful.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <03-22-11/1255:23>
Well, let's see...  First off, it's got to be someone that can hack FastJack.

Second, it has to be someone that knows the Shadows.

Third, it has to be someone who wants to do this.

My two guesses are Slamm-0! and Netcat's baby (Who downloaded Mommy's knowledge through some weird Technomancer trick) or Captain Chaos trying to break free.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <03-22-11/1316:54>
Ah, just received word on my theory.

And Captain Chaos is off the list. :P

As for Slamm-0!, I doubt it. He's a great hacker, but he's the one that pointed it out in Attitude, and that would make him waaaaay more enigmatic than I think he is. And baby may have TM abilities, but I don't think (s)he's (do we know the sex yet?) got the language and life experience for those posts.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Fizzygoo on <03-22-11/1400:42>
Dagnabbit! At work, only have Feral Cities in the car for my lunch break, War!'s at home. I've been reading SR non-stop since I had been out of the loop for 5 years and just started playing (and got caught up on the 5 years worth of missing books) since Jan...so it's all a blur as to where I've seen what. But...

Is the anonymous posting just a blank line after the entry text? If so, there's at least one Anonymous posting in...see...it might be War! Crap. I just finished Corporate Guide, nearly done with Chicago in Feral Cities but I got War! a couple of days ago and flipped through it. Somewhere in the past week I saw the post-with-no-name and thought, "ug, typo, I wonder who said it." If it wasn't War!, then there may be a post in Feral Cities. Ug. Going to be hard to concentrate on work with this swimming around in my head. Two hours till lunch where I can flip through Feral Cities to see.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <03-22-11/1416:08>
Dagnabbit! At work, only have Feral Cities in the car for my lunch break, War!'s at home. I've been reading SR non-stop since I had been out of the loop for 5 years and just started playing (and got caught up on the 5 years worth of missing books) since Jan...so it's all a blur as to where I've seen what. But...

Is the anonymous posting just a blank line after the entry text? If so, there's at least one Anonymous posting in...see...it might be War! Crap. I just finished Corporate Guide, nearly done with Chicago in Feral Cities but I got War! a couple of days ago and flipped through it. Somewhere in the past week I saw the post-with-no-name and thought, "ug, typo, I wonder who said it." If it wasn't War!, then there may be a post in Feral Cities. Ug. Going to be hard to concentrate on work with this swimming around in my head. Two hours till lunch where I can flip through Feral Cities to see.
I quoted the three posts in question in the OP, two in War!, one in Attitude.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Nath on <03-22-11/1444:47>
I confirm there is one in Corporate Guide, in Aztechnology chapter, page 70.

Quote from: Corporate Guide p.70
The CAS is not on friendly relations with Aztlan—especially after it took over the Azzie sector of Denver a few years back. But what does the CAS military drive? Hawker-Siddley Skytrucks, Hawker-Siddley convoy vehicles, Hawker-Siddley recon drones—you get the point.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <03-22-11/1451:24>
I confirm there is one in Corporate Guide, in Aztechnology chapter, page 70.

Quote from: Corporate Guide p.70
The CAS is not on friendly relations with Aztlan—especially after it took over the Azzie sector of Denver a few years back. But what does the CAS military drive? Hawker-Siddley Skytrucks, Hawker-Siddley convoy vehicles, Hawker-Siddley recon drones—you get the point.
Good catch. I'm not sure if it's an anonymous post or typo, since it's missing the second (http://forums.shadowrun4.com/Themes/JackPoint/images/theme/quote.png) mark. I'll add it to the list, though!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Angelone on <03-22-11/1452:25>
The Smiling Bandit

That's my guess anyway.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <03-22-11/1455:09>
The Smiling Bandit

That's my guess anyway.
I don't think so. He's been posting kinda regularly on the boards, so I don't see him "testing" Jack in this way. More than likely, it's either someone brand spankin' new or an old-timer that hasn't been seen in a bit. Or Puck. ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Angelone on <03-22-11/1503:25>
It is something he'd do though. It be a real pain if it was more than one person.

Hmm... old time deckers huh? Let's see there's Findler-man, Pyramid Watcher (?). Shoot can only think of those two right now. Was Stainless Steel Rat a decker?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: ChaoticWeevil on <03-22-11/1534:34>
I think she was eaten by the worm during the crash but could it be Alice?

(I think that was her name), one of the people from Echo Mirage who was killed but her memories still existed on the matrix. I know she had a major beef with Aztechnology and a lot of these comments deal with that entity.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Angelone on <03-22-11/1538:02>
Yes, her name was Alice Haeffner. She was the former (deposed) presidents wife.

Yeah, the worm got her.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Frostriese on <03-22-11/1544:36>
Well, the common theme seems to be Atztech/Atztlan. And if there is one corporation where it pays off to be paranoid, its Atztech. So, yeah, Pyramid Watcher makes a lot of sense. If it isn't just somebody new.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Fizzygoo on <03-22-11/1556:58>
I confirm there is one in Corporate Guide, in Aztechnology chapter, page 70.

Quote from: Corporate Guide p.70
The CAS is not on friendly relations with Aztlan—especially after it took over the Azzie sector of Denver a few years back. But what does the CAS military drive? Hawker-Siddley Skytrucks, Hawker-Siddley convoy vehicles, Hawker-Siddley recon drones—you get the point.

OMG! Thank you for finding that! I thought I was going to go nuts and have to search through everything and it didn't seem that long ago that I read it (as Azt section is, well at the beginning of CG) so I was going to go though Feral Cities twice, three times, and then look in War! and see the ones that Fastjack has already posted and give up and say "must of been that," so thank you Nath for helping me not lose my mind quite as fast as it normally decays :)

Well, if the CG post is "intended" and not a typo/error then I'm definitely leaning towards Alice, but who knows.

Interesting that in the three non-CG posts each one references "descent"..."down a...well," "down hill," "hell." (last one's kind of a stretch, hehe).
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <03-22-11/1601:48>
Ah, just received word on my theory.

And Captain Chaos is off the list. :P

As for Slamm-0!, I doubt it. He's a great hacker, but he's the one that pointed it out in Attitude, and that would make him waaaaay more enigmatic than I think he is. And baby may have TM abilities, but I don't think (s)he's (do we know the sex yet?) got the language and life experience for those posts.
Oh well.  So much for getting our Captain back.   :'(  *Pours a 40 on the curb*

As for the baby, I did suggest that, perhaps, (s)he DLed knowledge through Mommy...  Language might be part of that.  Doesn't have the hardware developed yet for language, but the software and wetware might be ready.  Might also explain the lack of a username.  (S)He might not even have the concept on one for him/her self yet.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <03-22-11/1654:49>
Ah, just received word on my theory.

And Captain Chaos is off the list. :P

As for Slamm-0!, I doubt it. He's a great hacker, but he's the one that pointed it out in Attitude, and that would make him waaaaay more enigmatic than I think he is. And baby may have TM abilities, but I don't think (s)he's (do we know the sex yet?) got the language and life experience for those posts.
Oh well.  So much for getting our Captain back.   :'(  *Pours a 40 on the curb*

As for the baby, I did suggest that, perhaps, (s)he DLed knowledge through Mommy...  Language might be part of that.  Doesn't have the hardware developed yet for language, but the software and wetware might be ready.  Might also explain the lack of a username.  (S)He might not even have the concept on one for him/her self yet.
Ah, he's still out there, this just ain't him. ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Outrider45 on <03-22-11/1735:11>
Ah, just received word on my theory.

And Captain Chaos is off the list. :P

As for Slamm-0!, I doubt it. He's a great hacker, but he's the one that pointed it out in Attitude, and that would make him waaaaay more enigmatic than I think he is. And baby may have TM abilities, but I don't think (s)he's (do we know the sex yet?) got the language and life experience for those posts.
Oh well.  So much for getting our Captain back.   :'(  *Pours a 40 on the curb*

As for the baby, I did suggest that, perhaps, (s)he DLed knowledge through Mommy...  Language might be part of that.  Doesn't have the hardware developed yet for language, but the software and wetware might be ready.  Might also explain the lack of a username.  (S)He might not even have the concept on one for him/her self yet.
Ah, he's still out there, this just ain't him. ;)

I know who it is....its your roomie FastJack! I told you to sever the connection when you goto the can to "download". Its been Brian all along!  j/k   ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Charybdis on <03-22-11/1953:58>
A) It appears to be someone with key interest in Central/South America (two direct comments on Atzlan, one on Cartels)
B) There's no smart-alec 'nyah-nyah' tones to the posts. They're all direct and to the point, so it means someone has either:
- 1) Gone to a lot of trouble to post useful comments with an unrecognisable ID... for no real reason
- 2) Registered the alias 'A.Nonymous' (is this any worse than a runner going by E.Nigma or N.Cognito?)
- 3) JP knows who it is, but there are some comms conflicts causing the poster's alias to not be recognised

I also don't recall Fastjack making any comments querying the identity of this poster, or concerns with unidentified posts, which implies he either:
A) Knows who it is
B) Knows how they're getting in.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <03-22-11/2003:11>
His error reports on JackPoint (Did it ever get past Alpha/Beta stages?) say to alert him to anything like it, but he probably already knows about it.

Be interesting to see who this poster is.  AI With No Name, icon like that of a young Clint Eastwood?   :P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <03-22-11/2331:07>
Yes, per the JackPoint login screen, it appears they are getting in without FastJack's approval:

Quote from: War!, p. 4
<020573> Any irregularities seen on the site can be reported, but you can also assume I’m generally aware of them before you are. —Fastjack
Quote from: Parazoology, p. 2
Someone tried to hack the network yesterday, make sure that you are using the latest protocols. – FastJack
Quote from: Attitude, p. 4
<032073> I’m not playing games anymore. the situation will be resolved soon. i apologize for the inconvenience. —FastJack
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Angelone on <03-22-11/2359:41>
The plot thickens... Maybe the Dawkins Group? They are sniffing around Jackpoint.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: MK Ultra on <03-23-11/0822:54>
Pyramid Watcher would hav no reason to post anonymously. Slam-O, I agree witht he poster above. Netcat´s little one, meh, I hope not, and it dosn´t make a lot of sense. Dawkins Group, maybe, but I´d imagin their MO to be more subtil then anonymous hack-in posts.

Alice didn´t realy have a problem with Aztech, but rather with Thomas Roxborough! Now Roxy left the Aztech Board some time ago...

Now it might be Rox. He has a lot of intel on the Big A and probbaly some antipathy for them, after he left, and he would have an interest to stay anonymous. The fat blob also spent a lot of time in the matrix, so he might have picked up some trix - or else use UniOmni Support. Anyway, I don´t beleave it´s him.

Maybe someone from inside of AZT? They have a record of hacking Shadowland.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <03-23-11/1059:59>
Alice survived Crash 2.0?  I'd be amazed if she did.

Guess we'll just have to wait and see.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <03-23-11/1232:30>
Not so sure:

Quote from: System Failure, p. 84
     Her last conscious thought—before blackness closed around her and everything she was ceased to be—was one of insane amusement:
    —So this is how it ends: Alice sucked down her own rabbit-hole …
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <03-23-11/1239:45>
Roxy could know about JackPoint, too, since KAM was a guest user in Augmentation.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <03-23-11/1324:39>
He's not known to be subtle, though, having appeared in SOTA:2063 and SOTA:2064 with ... unkind comments about KAM & crew.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Digital_Viking on <03-23-11/1330:28>
He's not known to be subtle, though, having appeared in SOTA:2063 and SOTA:2064 with ... unkind comments about KAM & crew.
Unless his time with Alice, in Wonderland, changed his perspective a bit.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Charybdis on <03-23-11/1847:50>
Yes, per the JackPoint login screen, it appears they are getting in without FastJack's approval:

Quote from: War!, p. 4
<020573> Any irregularities seen on the site can be reported, but you can also assume I’m generally aware of them before you are. —Fastjack
Quote from: Parazoology, p. 2
Someone tried to hack the network yesterday, make sure that you are using the latest protocols. – FastJack
Quote from: Attitude, p. 4
<032073> I’m not playing games anymore. the situation will be resolved soon. i apologize for the inconvenience. —FastJack

But do any of these actually mention A.Nonymous?

re: War!
FastJack is not saying there is a problem, just that he'll generally notice them first (because he's smug like that :P) Also, A.Nonymous posted in this book, and FJ didn't mention any actual problems here.

re: Parazoology
Just because someone tried, doesn't mean they got in. This sounds like the standard 'please update your virus check software' line any good admin would promote.

re: Attitude:
What is he actually referring to? I would expect that if there's a serious issue, FJ would make mention of it near the event (or posting).
A.Nonymous does post in this source, but FJ doesn't mention any issues here?

I'm just not thinking A.Nonymous is a problem ID. It looks more and more like a legitimate username. Now if the ID instead said: <User Unknown> then I'm sure all this conjecture would be warranted.

Until then, who says it's anything but an actual legitimate UserID?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <03-23-11/2350:56>
Yes, per the JackPoint login screen, it appears they are getting in without FastJack's approval:

Quote from: War!, p. 4
<020573> Any irregularities seen on the site can be reported, but you can also assume I’m generally aware of them before you are. —Fastjack
Quote from: Parazoology, p. 2
Someone tried to hack the network yesterday, make sure that you are using the latest protocols. – FastJack
Quote from: Attitude, p. 4
<032073> I’m not playing games anymore. the situation will be resolved soon. i apologize for the inconvenience. —FastJack

But do any of these actually mention A.Nonymous?

re: War!
FastJack is not saying there is a problem, just that he'll generally notice them first (because he's smug like that :P) Also, A.Nonymous posted in this book, and FJ didn't mention any actual problems here.

re: Parazoology
Just because someone tried, doesn't mean they got in. This sounds like the standard 'please update your virus check software' line any good admin would promote.

re: Attitude:
What is he actually referring to? I would expect that if there's a serious issue, FJ would make mention of it near the event (or posting).
A.Nonymous does post in this source, but FJ doesn't mention any issues here?

I'm just not thinking A.Nonymous is a problem ID. It looks more and more like a legitimate username. Now if the ID instead said: <User Unknown> then I'm sure all this conjecture would be warranted.

Until then, who says it's anything but an actual legitimate UserID?
Check it out (http://forums.shadowrun4.com/index.php?topic=3167.msg32718#msg32718)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Malex on <03-24-11/0010:23>
Any known AI that has a beef with the Big-A?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <03-24-11/0015:50>
...

Oh, man...  Sick thought...

The Ghost Of "The Big D"?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Malex on <03-24-11/0033:07>
I am thinking Deus is dead, though stranger things have happened. I was thinking more on the lines of Sojourner. He did afterall take over an Azzie orbital.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Angelone on <03-24-11/0052:59>
Think he meant Dunklezahn. He's still probably out on the bridge holding off the Horrors. He would have the body to to it though who knows what the Azzies stuffed in Billy.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <03-24-11/0109:20>
Yeah.  Dunkie's old handle on Shadowland was "The Big D".  Not exactly a secretive name.  But it certainly fit the person that would become The Presidential Dragon.

But, yeah, not likely to be him.   :'(

So many gone.  I cried when I found out Wedge and Ricky Ratboy died...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Angelone on <03-24-11/0116:38>
Yeah that hit me hard I was still getting over Hatchetman. Wedge was the man. :'(
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <03-24-11/0131:24>
Well, that's something Shadowrun has over a good number of fictions.  Characters come and go due to a variety of reasons.  Rarely retirement (Raises a glass for The Chrome Accountant), and usually the hard exit (Pours a 40 on the curb.).
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Angelone on <03-24-11/0143:34>
I agree the world has changed alot since it was first introduced. Lots of memorable characters.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <03-24-11/0156:02>
This thread is awesome.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Charybdis on <03-24-11/1824:53>
So many gone.  I cried when I found out Wedge and Ricky Ratboy died...
I was disappointed Ricochet Rita kicked the bucket. She was cool....
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Kontact on <03-28-11/0233:03>
Is it too meta to think that maybe it's the guy who is releasing all the Jackpoint info to you, the reader, scrubbing his own name first?

Yeah... too meta.. and not even close to satisfying.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Fortinbras on <03-28-11/0654:47>
Here's a thought, from the section on Aztlan in the unpublished and much maligned SoLA, one Salai cuts though Captain Chaos's security to post info about The Smoking Mirror and Aztechnology's more sordid details.
Some of that info is re-printed in Corporate Guide, where most folks, including Pyramid Watcher, dismiss it as a Conspiracy theory, except one Jane "Frosty" Foster, who has a 'friend' who would really like to see the original message.

Anyone have any info on who that Salai might be? If it is the original poster of the Smoking Mirror document, he may be dead, but he could be MOSTLY dead.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Frostriese on <03-28-11/0838:07>
Salai? That's Michelangelo's assistent! Michaelangelo the Immortal Elf from the similarily much maligned Black Madonna novel, that is, also known under his net nickname Brightlight. Of course said Elf was later retconned to be just a fanbody of the real Michelangelo, taking on his name, and not the historical real deal - but in any case, Salai did escape Lofwyr's murder of Brightlight, didn't he? So it must be him! And he's an otaku techwiz who has learned from who was the most tech-savvy IE, so he should be able to cut through net security well enough. And of course, given what happened to his mentor he would have a motivation to hide.

So, yeah, that's Salai. But what has he to do with Atztech?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Malex on <03-28-11/1151:08>
Speaking of Shadows of Latin America, did it become available and where can I get a copy?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <03-28-11/1154:57>
SoLA never came out.  You can't get a copy.  It's a bad idea to mention it on message boards.  Rabid Fanboys live here.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Malex on <03-28-11/1156:47>
Ugh. On both counts. At least the Sixth World Almanac covered abit on Amazonia and I've got the old Aztlan book.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Ten-Hex on <03-28-11/1218:56>
Totally taking a stab in the dark on this one, but any chance it could be H? He's had a penchant for using really bad puns as pseudonyms in the past, and has little love for the Azzies.

The wording in the commentary doesn't really feel like his style, but it's not like he's got the most stable, concrete personality.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <03-28-11/1246:30>
I'm sure Frosty would have something to say about that.  Or maybe not if she was ordered not to.

But he's not a 1337 hacker to break through FastJack's security, so not as likely.  That said, apparently he has been playing a lot of MMOs, so who knows?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Angelone on <03-28-11/2041:24>
You can get the drafts of Shadows of Latin America here: http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?showtopic=31114 (http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?showtopic=31114)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Malex on <03-28-11/2107:15>
AWESOME!! Thank you much. ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Angelone on <03-28-11/2117:44>
Your welcome glad I could help. Since it wasn't published it's not canon but it's the best glimpse we have of the area.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: MK Ultra on <03-29-11/0531:10>
If you want the official line on the area, also check out 6th World Almanach. It is very limited (got to be expected, when comparing it to a bunch of previous books dealing with 'only' 1 continent or even a single country), but it does have some info on Argentina and Amazonia, as well as Aztlan.

Back on topic - the AI theory sounds intriguing. I have never fully read through my copy of Emergence, so I cant judge it, though.

If it´s an Azt insider, it might be Oliver McClure (sp?), the nice guy, that Dunkelzahn bequested with a seat on the Aztech board. He was pretty outmatched in his struggle to make Aztech a better corp as of late, IIRC (Corpguide I think), and he would have verry, verry good reasons to hide his identity, if he was the sorce.  :-X

Or maybe it could be ... Juan Azcapotzalco, the zombi CEO from beyond the grave. I never quiet bought that 'bombed at the peace summet' story, after he had vanished for so long.  :o

@ Frostriese
It was Leonardo Da Vinci, not Michelangelo. Was he really killed by SK/Lofwyr? Never read the Novel, from what I got out of Blood in the Boardroom, he just vanished and SK bulldozered his shak. Could still be the same Salai, but I don´t see an Aztech conection, either. Seems unlikely, he joined the Azt-Guerreros after his master left, but who knows.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <03-29-11/0629:31>
Leonardo may not be dead . . . as of Corporate Guide.  Page 160.  Dr Antonio Vieri may in fact be Leonardo/Brightlight, given the references to him, particularly in the Aztlan s/b.  Unfortunately the entry by Stone is not given a date, so there's no way to be sure.

But yeah, Brightlight or a student of his could be a candidate for the posts.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Malex on <03-29-11/1010:36>
Back on topic - the AI theory sounds intriguing. I have never fully read through my copy of Emergence, so I cant judge it, though.

Only reason I brought that up is in the Chapter "The Soul of a New Machine" in the Emergence book an AI (Sojourner) that Aztechnology had been restraining and presumable experimenting on escapes their labs and uploads itself to R&D orbital lab, the Tlaloc. It then holds the world hostage with vector-housing warheads. After another AI (Pulsar) ends up negotiating a stand down.

If any new player to the Sixth World Stage would want to mess with Aztechnology and could easily hack a VPN like JackPoint and only leave 'strange anomalies', I'd put my money on Sojourner or another AI.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Fortinbras on <03-29-11/1031:14>
Sojourner was a NeoNET AI. NeoNET sent him on a mission to get info from an Azzie satellite and, once out of their clutches, Sojourner took it upon himself to free himself onto the Matrix and out AIs the world over.
The only thing of note about Tlaloc is that it wasn't what the Azzie say it is, but then again what is?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Malex on <03-29-11/1857:45>
It had been a while since I read the Emergence book, but yeah.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Fortinbras on <03-30-11/0019:44>
I wouldn't know if it weren't for the fact that I'm finishing up Emergence right now. Just Realm Beyond and Digging Dirt to go. Because there wasn't much cap or explanation for either I'm turning it into a Resonance Realm adventure.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Frostriese on <03-30-11/0715:44>
Quote
It was Leonardo Da Vinci, not Michelangelo.
The hell did I mess that up? Excuse me, I'll have to go commit seppuku. Or at least lose several fingers.

Quote
Was he really killed by SK/Lofwyr?
By Lofwyr personally, who came bargin in into his retreat in South Iraq in the Techno Babel novel.

Quote
Seems unlikely, he joined the Azt-Guerreros after his master left, but who knows.
Wait, he did?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <03-30-11/1212:48>
Do not meddle in the affairs of Lofwyr, for you are crunchy and he owns a company that makes ketchup.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Nath on <03-30-11/1412:46>
By Lofwyr personally, who came bargin in into his retreat in South Iraq in the Techno Babel novel.
The scene in Technobabel, chapter 29, actually takes a place "in a secret sanctuary in Africa". In Black Madonna and Blood in the Boardroom, Brightlight secret sanctuary is in Ahvaz, Iran (though not that far from the Iraqi border). It's not clear if it's a mistake (in which case BitB, being a sourcebook, would have precedence over novels and make Ahvaz the canonical place) or if Brightlight moved at some point.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Frostriese on <03-30-11/1446:25>
Interesting. Of course, Renraku effectively purchased the Ahvaz facility, so maybe Lofwyr did not want to treat on megacorporate toes. Which however would then mean the Ahvaz facility still exists... (and I should have looked the chapter up instead of going by gut memory. South Iran, not South Iraq, right, and the murder takes place in Africa)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: MK Ultra on <03-31-11/0607:24>
...
Quote
Seems unlikely, he joined the Azt-Guerreros after his master left, but who knows.
Wait, he did?

Sorry, I meant to say, it seems unlikely, that he joined them.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Nath on <03-31-11/1615:20>
Interesting. Of course, Renraku effectively purchased the Ahvaz facility, so maybe Lofwyr did not want to treat on megacorporate toes. Which however would then mean the Ahvaz facility still exists... (and I should have looked the chapter up instead of going by gut memory. South Iran, not South Iraq, right, and the murder takes place in Africa)
Blood in the Boardroom features an adventure (short format) titled "What does a ten-thousand-year-old dragon get ?" which have the runners hired by Hestaby to search for Brightlight. When they go to Ahvaz, they learn the elf disappeared the same night a dragon destroyed the observatory, and that shortly after, a Saeder-Krupp backed militia drove off what remained of Renraku troops in the area.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: LonePaladin on <04-02-11/0303:21>
The Smiling Bandit
I miss the old comment format, particularly the ways in which TSB would screw with the automatic entries.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Malex on <04-06-11/1722:03>
Dunno if this has any relevance to this mystery, but I've been reading the 2nd E. Lone Star Sourcebook and there are at least two entries that were deleted by an anonymous hacker who took away file information on both LS dealings in the C.A.S. and Amazonia.
Is it possible that this and the Anonymous poster are connected in some way?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <04-06-11/2105:37>
Actually, pre-Jackpoint, there were a LOT of anonymous posters on Shadowland, so we can't really connect them to the same person that hacks into Jackpoint, since Shadowland allowed just about anyone to post.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <05-20-11/1953:38>
Have there been any in post-attitude releases?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <05-20-11/1957:22>
Yep, Spy Games.

I've taken to calling him "The Poster With No Name", and picturing his Matrix Icon as being a gunslinger in a Poncho, ala the old skool Console Cowboys.  ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <05-20-11/2000:43>
Some day I'll have the £12 to buy spy games and see the comment, alas rent/food/bills
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <05-20-11/2008:22>
Some day I'll have the £12 to buy spy games and see the comment, alas rent/food/bills
Those Lifestyle costs always nail you, don't they?  :P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <05-20-11/2014:18>
If only i could be a runner
unfortunately I'm no Runner.

What skill rating is second year university physics?

Anyway I'm off topic

Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <05-21-11/1332:31>
On-topic . . . I thought JackPoint was invitation-only. 

Does the Poster With No Name's presence mean someone has managed to spoof FastJack (SR)? Or just JackPoint's protocols?

Marginally-related: there was something from NetCat (Vice? Corporate Guide?), a post apparently affected by morning sickness, which contained 'SAVEMYBABY' repeated.  Anything further on this?

Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Stahlseele on <05-21-11/1603:52>
[spoiler]
She's a pregnant Technomancer.
[/spoiler]
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Rockopolis on <05-21-11/1646:52>
So...is she getting wireless messages from the baby?

Then again, it's probably not well developed in a baby.  Maybe it's just Morse Code.
SEND SUPPLIES STOP NEED TO STRETCH STOP PROCEEDING ON SCHEDULE STOP
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Stahlseele on <05-21-11/1712:08>
Actually, there are hints that the baby is a pretty potent technomancer already . .
At least capable of defending itself and its carrier on some occassions it seems . .
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Simagal on <05-21-11/1839:04>
A "G.C." left a pm for Sunshine on Jackpoint, that came from Gary Cline's Horizon office in LA (page 103 of Corporate Guide), and the anonymous quote on page 108 of Attitude sounds like Horizon's position on media pirates.




Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Valashar on <05-22-11/1014:31>
My main thought is the possibility of it being Leonardo. Very thin odds that it's Puck, as MCT has him stapled down tight behind many layers of extremely tight jamming.

Another thought refers back to 10 JackPointers. In that file, it is mentioned that there is someone among the JackPointers that was acting as an inside source for Horizon (the in-game source of the file).

Also, on one of the recent intro splash pages (JackPoint log-on screen), there is a notice from Fastjack that he zapped a sprite that had been parked in the system to track JackPoint. So perhaps the sprite and A. Nonymous are connected (this wouldn't rule out Leonardo, as iirc he has long shown the ability to perform matrix work without hardware).
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <05-22-11/1314:25>
Putting it together . . . sprite + targeted by Horizon + anonymous posting . . . how about Tam Reyes as the culprit?  Merely a possibility . . .
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Valashar on <05-22-11/2242:59>
Intriguing thought, Longshot. Certainly not impossible.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <05-25-11/0437:47>
Just to throw some gasoline/petrol on this fire: Why would Tam Reyes or anyone else at Horizon care about ancient beings?

Quote from: SG, p.136
> Great dragons and their ilk have yet to accept that the world moves faster than them, and it has no regard for their plans. They may think long-term, but humans are unpredictable and a bit crazy. We’ve also been playing this game for millennia without end.
>
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <05-25-11/0455:00>
Hm, well, I didn't know about that.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <05-25-11/0457:28>
Of course not. I didn't expect everyone to have SG yet (eventually, but not five days after its PDF release). However, now you know. And knowing is half the battle.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <05-25-11/0524:46>
Still, Charisma Associates is heavily involved in Tir Tairngire, so who knows what they've picked up and passed along . . .
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <05-25-11/0747:07>
I loved that comment CD, it brought in a whole new "Plan 9" level of conspiracy.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <05-25-11/1241:24>
Or even, dare we say, 'Lone Gunman' . . .
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <05-25-11/1448:16>
*Pours a 40 on the curb for the Lone Gunmen*  They deserved their Arlington funeral.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: ChaoticWeevil on <05-27-11/0209:20>
While reading through Spy Games I was convinced that it was someone from Horizon, especially with FastJack again bringing up the fact someone in JackPoint sold them out.

But in the equipment section the person asks "Computers are optical now, right? How can they have a magnetic field?" This implies a lack of in-depth tech knowledge which I don't think a Horizon employee would have.

Just an observation.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <05-27-11/0335:53>
Unless it's a bluff - the poster deliberately going for seeming dumber/more naive than they actually are.  A bit odd, but . . .

I thought Horizon as a whole was more mass-media-savvy than tech savvy, but that doesn't mean there can't be individuals within the corp who are the other way.  After all, this poster has managed to penetrate JackPoint.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <05-27-11/0739:50>
Maybe (and remember, this is purely theoretical), the poster is a *new* Great Dragon. Maybe Earthroot/Root Protector has finally woken up?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <05-27-11/0756:53>
Oh, dear God I hope not.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <05-27-11/1301:40>
Well, there was a 'You-Know-Who' referenced in Shadows of Asia . . .
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Ten-Hex on <05-27-11/1415:21>
Maybe (and remember, this is purely theoretical), the poster is a *new* Great Dragon. Maybe Earthroot/Root Protector has finally woken up?

If it was a great, it's more likely to be one that hasn't yet had a social presence but has been awake for a while. I don't think A. Nonymous is a dragon at all but from the commentary I'd say that in the unlikely event it was, I'd think either Ghostwalker is getting settled in to the Sixth World or Vast Green is doing something other than focusing on hunting the hunters (even less likely).
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: ChaoticWeevil on <05-27-11/1655:08>
I don't see them being anything ancient. Mainly due to the comment Crimson already showed with the almost contemptuous attitude towards dragons/ancients. I'm thinking whoever they are is firmly tied to the current "age".
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Simagal on <05-27-11/1922:38>
Maybe it is "Little Grace" or Eliohann as e ghosts.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <05-27-11/2013:43>
I give. It's the ghost of Mina Graff-Beloit.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <05-28-11/1236:53>
I really think that the anonymous poster has something to do with Horizon.  After all as a Media/Information Corp.  it would be in their best interest to be able to access the information in Jackpoint and leave subtle memes around to try to influence peoples perceptions. 
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: SirDelta on <05-29-11/1320:22>
I really think that the anonymous poster has something to do with Horizon.  After all as a Media/Information Corp.  it would be in their best interest to be able to access the information in Jackpoint and leave subtle memes around to try to influence peoples perceptions.

I agree with this.  In attitude, the anonymous poster goes on a tirade out the evils of media piracy.  And we all know Horizon's stance on piracy...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <05-29-11/1808:49>
The Shadowtalker With No Name should be careful, we know FastJack's stance on Piracy as well.

And he's still looking for someone to punch in the junk!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <06-01-11/1219:39>
The Shadowtalker With No Name should be careful, we know FastJack's stance on Piracy as well.

And he's still looking for someone to punch in the junk!

Carpe Junk:-)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Valashar on <06-01-11/1817:21>
The Shadowtalker With No Name should be careful, we know FastJack's stance on Piracy as well.

And he's still looking for someone to punch in the junk!

Carpe Junk:-)

With pliers and a blowtorch.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: TheWanderingJewels on <06-02-11/0842:30>
Is that guy that was floating in a tank in the Aztlan book with the weird cellular disease still around? considering he has nothing but time to hone his skills....
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <06-02-11/1205:06>
He's the big swinging dick at Universal Omnitech. So yeah, he's ... floating out there.

YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!


Thank you. Thank you. I'm here all week.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: bigity on <06-02-11/1936:51>
You forgot to put sunglasses on over your sunglasses
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: r4nd0m on <06-03-11/1700:11>
I know at some point FJ directly references the anonymous poster and tells him to cut it out.  I don't have my books with me, so I can't look it up at the moment.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <06-03-11/1844:47>
You forgot to put sunglasses on over your sunglasses mirrorshades.
Fixed that for you.  :P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: BlackMyron on <06-07-11/2300:20>
The "Computers are optical now, right?" is key.  This is someone who was around before and has been away for a number of years, and apparently doesn't have an 'outside' presence.  This would rule out things like new AIs, or dragons that just woke up (unless they woke up in modern times and then went back to sleep) 
I'm going to have to nominate Alice, because she's the only one that I would think would fit that and have the skills to hack JackPoint - we are talking FastJack, after all...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <06-07-11/2312:30>
I'm going to have to nominate Alice, because she's the only one that I would think would fit that and have the skills to hack JackPoint - we are talking FastJack, after all...
Oh man...  I just had a scary thought...

Quote
    Good morning world. Welcome back. Play nice.
         -Saeletra
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: BlackMyron on <06-08-11/0036:07>
 Good point... although I recall that the Big D was less than impressed with Jack's story...  ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <06-08-11/0543:39>
I'm gonna put in a nomination for . . . David Gavilan.  Because although the prevailing opinion is that Damien Knight was Gavilan, there has been little confirmation one way or another.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Stahlseele on <06-08-11/0720:12>
Did alice not get deadened?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <06-08-11/1008:24>
Alice

Sorry, who?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <06-08-11/1053:22>
Alice

Sorry, who?
Alice Haeffner (http://wiki.dumpshock.com/index.php?title=Alice_Haeffner&redirect=no), late wife of former president Kyle Haeffner. Alice was part of Echo Mirage under David Gavilan, and became an early "e-ghost" in the system after the Crash of 2029. She spent most of her time in the Matrix making Thomas Roxborough's life hell. When Crash 2.0 hit, it's assumed her ghost was "wiped" or subsumed into the Matrix per the short story "Down the Rabbit Hole" in System Failure (p. 95).
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <06-08-11/1104:43>
Someday I have to get my hands on the Dragonheart Trilogy.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <06-08-11/1231:52>
Alice Haeffner (http://wiki.dumpshock.com/index.php?title=Alice_Haeffner&redirect=no), late wife of former president Kyle Haeffner. Alice was part of Echo Mirage under David Gavilan, and became an early "e-ghost" in the system after the Crash of 2029. She spent most of her time in the Matrix making Thomas Roxborough's life hell. When Crash 2.0 hit, it's assumed her ghost was "wiped" or subsumed into the Matrix per the short story "Down the Rabbit Hole" in System Failure (p. 95).

Thanks  FJ!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <06-08-11/1316:59>
Alice

Sorry, who?
Alice Haeffner (http://wiki.dumpshock.com/index.php?title=Alice_Haeffner&redirect=no), late wife of former president Kyle Haeffner. Alice was part of Echo Mirage under David Gavilan, and became an early "e-ghost" in the system after the Crash of 2029. She spent most of her time in the Matrix making Thomas Roxborough's life hell. When Crash 2.0 hit, it's assumed her ghost was "wiped" or subsumed into the Matrix per the short story "Down the Rabbit Hole" in System Failure (p. 95).

I'm not completely filled in on SR backstory.  Is the connection between Alice Haeffner and Roxborough explained anywhere?  She apparently made several posts on Shadowland to the effect that Roxborough deserved everything that had happened to him - life in his tank, I'm guessing - and further deserved anything and everything she could throw at him.  How did this vendetta start?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <06-08-11/1337:43>
I don't recall if they ever went into great depth on what Roxborough did to Alice. I just know that she is pissed at him and has claimed his crimes are against humanity himself. I wouldn't be surprised if he had "studied" her for a while after her condition became known so he could retain his "mind" on the Matrix.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Digital_Viking on <06-08-11/1345:51>
As I remember, Alice said Roxie was ,in part if not whole, responsible for Crash 1.0
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Nath on <06-08-11/1455:46>
Thomas Roxborough ran a company called Acquisition Technologies. The company best programmer was David Gavilan (with Lucien Cross as a close second, but I disgress). Dunkelzahn was a shareholder of Acquisition Technologies. He tried to have Gavilan quitting Acquisitech and joining Gossamer Threads, a Dunkelzahn-controlled corporation. This led Roxborough to start a corporate war against Gossamer Threads. He ordered
Acquisitech engineers, including Gavilan, designed a virus to destroy Gossamer Threads network. They tested the virus on a company called Effexx Studios. The virus successfully destroyed Effexx system, and then proceeded to destroy Internet.

As the Crash started, Dunkelzahn met Gavilan to offer him a position at Gossamer Threads. He read his mind and learned about the Virus design. So he suggested him to join Echo Mirage Team Two and try to redeem himself.

That is, as far as the story told in the novel Clockwork Asylum is true.

David Gavilan was the lead programmer of Echo Mirage as "Major David Gavilan". IMO, it suggests Gavilan served in the armed forces for some time before joining Acquisition Technologies (as it is unlikely a civilian in the emergency of fighting the Crash would get a Major rank). And according to Corporate Guide, Gavilan resurfaced at Acquisition Technologies' investigative research division after the Crash.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Stahlseele on <06-08-11/1459:32>
Basically, Rox was THE ONLY ONE responsible for the first crash . .
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <06-08-11/1635:04>
Much like stories regarding gods and such in other games, and much of what's posted in Shadowland/Jackpoint comments, you have to take the story with a grain of salt. It's been a while since I last read Clockwork Asylum, but I think I recall most of it being "as XXXX tells it" type of story.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <06-08-11/1700:22>
Interesting so our A. Nonymous maybe a Ghost in the trix back to wreck havoc.  The only thing is why would he/she/it care about pirated stuff?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <06-08-11/1702:51>
Why is there Dissonance in the Matrix anymore? The Dissonants won when they caused Crash 2.0.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Nath on <06-08-11/1813:32>
Much like stories regarding gods and such in other games, and much of what's posted in Shadowland/Jackpoint comments, you have to take the story with a grain of salt. It's been a while since I last read Clockwork Asylum, but I think I recall most of it being "as XXXX tells it" type of story.
The version of the story I gave is the one Roxborough gives to Alice near the end of the book, when begging for his life. Before that, there are several other versions given by Roxborough and Alice. You can sum them up to two different stories, one with Acquisitech/Roxborough responsible, the other with Dunkelzahn/Gossamer Threads.

The only hard fact, as far as book goes, is that Damien Knight was David Gavilan and worked at Acquisition Technologies (with Lucien Cross) at some point. That piece of information is in Blood in the boardroom Game Information, page 57.

Even with the whole unreliable narator and stuff

I'm pretty convinced Jak Koke and Mike Mulvihill intended it to be the actual truth.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <06-08-11/1835:30>
Interesting so our A. Nonymous maybe a Ghost in the trix back to wreck havoc.  The only thing is why would he/she/it care about pirated stuff?
They used to work for the RIAA?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Stahlseele on <06-08-11/1935:32>
Interesting so our A. Nonymous maybe a Ghost in the trix back to wreck havoc.  The only thing is why would he/she/it care about pirated stuff?
They used to work for the RIAA?
*shudders*
don't even joke about them <.<
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <06-08-11/2057:43>
Interesting so our A. Nonymous maybe a Ghost in the trix back to wreck havoc.  The only thing is why would he/she/it care about pirated stuff?

Fear of Pirated Ghosts?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Rockopolis on <06-08-11/2233:49>
Why is there Dissonance in the Matrix anymore? The Dissonants won when they caused Crash 2.0.
Uh?  Isn't there still a Matrix?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <06-08-11/2305:11>
Why is there Dissonance in the Matrix anymore? The Dissonants won when they caused Crash 2.0.
Uh?  Isn't there still a Matrix?
The Matrix is Dead, Long Live The New Matrix!

The hardwired Matrix died, so the Dissonants did, indeed, "Win".  There are only parts of it still intact due to the actions of their owners (The Denver Data Haven and S-K Lines in Germany are the major areas that weren't killed.).  However, in doing so, the new Wireless Matrix (Internet 3.0?) was created making it even more powerful and prevalent then ever before.

As I've said time and again:  "There are no endings, only new beginnings."
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Stahlseele on <06-09-11/0812:24>
Why is there Dissonance in the Matrix anymore? The Dissonants won when they caused Crash 2.0.
Uh?  Isn't there still a Matrix?
Quote
strike me down and i will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Fizzygoo on <06-09-11/1734:44>
Well, save for the last two posts from Spy Games, I'm backing away from the Alice link...unless Alice is working for Horizon. The reference to a Dawkings Group report in one of the Spy Games' quotes and the quote from Attitude (at work, will amend later) from another runner talking about how there's "someone posing as one of us who has access to new media and new shiny programs" (to paraphrase) is making me lean heavily towards Horizon; hired hacker employee, regular employee, or even Horizon AI...that's my leaning at this point (which is further lean-ed with the added meta-data of new (hehe) Horizon adventures coming soon).

Edit:

Attitude pg 113
Quote
>There's a guy we don't have a name for running around the 'Trix, pretending to be one of us. By all accounts, he must be, or must ahve been a good hacker to get thte stuff he has. He's got beautiful high-quality bootlegs of all kinds of media and programs. I mean, stuff that looks untouched. Which means, of course, that this guy was too good to be true. I know at least three guys who had made deals to distribute his stuff, and who had bought his shit, and before they could hit the black-market with them, turned up brain-fried in their homes. What's even weirder, one of them wasn't DNI. We still don't know what happened to his brain.
>Hannibelle
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: BlackMyron on <06-09-11/1741:16>
 There's always the possibility that it could be someone we've never heard of before.

 But from the pre-existing characters, I'm not sure who would even come close to fitting the "computer" comment.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <06-09-11/1842:34>
Walt Disney's Unfrozen Brain Wired Directly To The Matrix?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Rockopolis on <06-09-11/2016:57>
Why is there Dissonance in the Matrix anymore? The Dissonants won when they caused Crash 2.0.
Uh?  Isn't there still a Matrix?
Quote
strike me down and i will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine
Hah hah hah, awesome.  +1
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Stahlseele on <06-10-11/0703:56>
*bows* =^.^=
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: SirDelta on <06-10-11/1414:35>
I just had another thought.

What if that whole anti-piracy rant was just a ruse to throw off who it acually is?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <06-10-11/1444:45>
I just had another thought.

What if that whole anti-piracy rant was just a ruse to throw off who it acually is?
You could use that statement to anything The Shadowtalker With No Name says.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Rockopolis on <06-10-11/1507:27>
Of course you know what that means; You thought you knew where the ICE was, but I swapped the files while you weren't looking! You've fallen prey to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is "Never deal with a dragon", but only slightly less famous is "Never go in against a Technomancer, when death is on the line!"  LOLOLOLOLO
*Connection Terminated*
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Fizzygoo on <06-14-11/0302:27>
Well, Gun Heaven/Haven has an appearance of our unidentified friend, and well...the quote from A. Nonymous on page 17 of the pdf has me thinking that Horizon is a red herring...or at least a red snapper.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <06-14-11/0428:47>
Of course you know what that means; You thought you knew where the ICE was, but I swapped the files while you weren't looking! You've fallen prey to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is "Never deal with a dragon", but only slightly less famous is "Never go in against a Technomancer, when death is on the line!"  LOLOLOLOLO
*Connection Terminated*

+1 for ripping off Princess Bride dialogue
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: SirDelta on <06-14-11/1337:17>
Well, Gun Heaven/Haven has an appearance of our unidentified friend, and well...the quote from A. Nonymous on page 17 of the pdf has me thinking that Horizon is a red herring...or at least a red snapper.

Could you provide the quote?  I'm sorry, but I don't have Gun Heaven and that makes me really curious.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: flatlyne2001 on <06-14-11/1354:53>
Could you provide the quote?  I'm sorry, but I don't have Gun Heaven and that makes me really curious.

"Mmmm, Mmmm Good. Horizon is Good for the Soul  :)"
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <06-14-11/1415:45>
I'm also tracking all of "our friend's" quotes in the first post (http://forums.shadowrun4.com/index.php?topic=3216.msg33925#msg33925) of this thread to keep everything together.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <06-14-11/1923:35>
"The Poster With No Name" is starting to tick me off as much as FastJack, methinks.

And he's still looking to punch someone in the junk.

...

If it's an AI, how does he find the junk?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Valashar on <06-14-11/1951:26>
"The Poster With No Name" is starting to tick me off as much as FastJack, methinks.

And he's still looking to punch someone in the junk.

...

If it's an AI, how does he find the junk?

It's about thirty bytes south of the kernel.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Simagal on <06-14-11/1957:14>
Quote
Those responsible for the “Horizon
is Good for the Soul” spam have
been banned from the network. If
I catch anyone trying to help them
log in they will get hit with a Black
Hammer. — FastJack

I found this interesting from the Gun Heaven preview at http://www.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=92357.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <06-14-11/2002:56>
"The Poster With No Name" is starting to tick me off as much as FastJack, methinks.

And he's still looking to punch someone in the junk.

...

If it's an AI, how does he find the junk?

It's about thirty bytes south of the kernel.
Good to know if I ever have to give an AI "The Gotham Handshake".
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: SirDelta on <06-14-11/2035:00>
Quote
Those responsible for the “Horizon
is Good for the Soul” spam have
been banned from the network. If
I catch anyone trying to help them
log in they will get hit with a Black
Hammer. — FastJack

I found this interesting from the Gun Heaven preview at http://www.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=92357.

Hmmm.  Interesting.  Maybe the Anti-Piracy rant wasn't a Red Herring after all.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <06-21-11/0536:29>
Is it possible that the Horizon of the rants is not the megacorp? No, I don't have anything to back that up.

I was also going to throw in another nomination for the Poster with No Name, but for now I'll save it up.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Valashar on <06-21-11/1335:24>
Quote
Those responsible for the “Horizon
is Good for the Soul” spam have
been banned from the network. If
I catch anyone trying to help them
log in they will get hit with a Black
Hammer. — FastJack

I found this interesting from the Gun Heaven preview at http://www.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=92357.

Hmmm.  Interesting.  Maybe the Anti-Piracy rant wasn't a Red Herring after all.

What I find funny about that bit on the JackPoint splash page is that it would be a part of the user's MOTD upon log-in. So the quote later in the file that says 'Horizon is good for the soul' wasn't part of the mentioned spam, but rather seems to have been a backhanded response/tault to Jack's MOTD threat.

Basically poking the bear.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <06-22-11/1618:53>
Maybe the mystery poster has ingested so many Horizon memes that he/she has to inject corp. blather into whatever they are writing?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <06-22-11/1706:49>
Maybe the mystery poster has ingested so many Horizon memes that he/she has to inject corp. blather into whatever they are writing?
Or they're really good at breaking FastJack's security, but not so good at keeping Horizon Viral Advertising out of their own system.  :P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <06-22-11/2304:03>
Maybe the mystery poster has ingested so many Horizon memes that he/she has to inject corp. blather into whatever they are writing?
Or they're really good at breaking FastJack's security, but not so good at keeping Horizon Viral Advertising out of their own system.  :P
Heh... You do realize I've been rejecting 50+ Spam accounts a day from the forums for the past couple weeks. Viral Advertising is a bitch, so I can definitely empathize with my fictional namesake.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <06-22-11/2306:25>
Heh... You do realize I've been rejecting 50+ Spam accounts a day from the forums for the past couple weeks. Viral Advertising is a bitch, so I can definitely empathize with my fictional namesake.
You want to punch someone in the junk as well?

I know I did back in my Tech Support days when it came to spam issues.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Charybdis on <06-22-11/2322:55>
Heh... You do realize I've been rejecting 50+ Spam accounts a day from the forums for the past couple weeks. Viral Advertising is a bitch, so I can definitely empathize with my fictional namesake.
You want to punch someone in the junk as well?

I know I did back in my Tech Support days when it came to spam issues.
I found a great solution to Spam

Many many moons ago, my first day on the job as an eMail admin, I miskeyed and shut down the SMTP gateway server for a 10,000 user company.

No Spam for 30 minutes!
Of course...no eMail AT ALL for the same period, but still... sometimes the only way to avoid gangrene is to cut off the limb...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <06-23-11/0004:58>
Possibly more than one person involved?  One to break in, another to make the posts. 

Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CyberNed on <07-01-11/2358:48>
Ok, so maybe I'm missing something really obvious here since no one's commented on it yet, but am I the only one a little weirded out by this post?

Quote
Dose: Two fifty. Thirty six. Uno. Cuarenta y cinco. Quarantasette. Novantadue. Ni hundered og fem. Femtiåtte. Quarantase. Konets.

Anybody know something I don't?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-02-11/0008:06>
I think we talked about that one earlier in the thread, CyberNed.  IIRC, it's a variety of languages with different numbers, like what you'd expect from a Numbers Radio Station (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numbers_station), only...  Different.  Weird, no?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CyberNed on <07-02-11/0028:48>
So then it's some kind of code? Of uncertain origin...

Wow, I'm having flashbacks to Perplex City here...

Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-02-11/0036:08>
They're either multiple posters who don't leave a Sig, or they're all a code.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <07-02-11/0824:18>
With that post, I believe A. Nonymous was deliberately trying to creep out the Jackpointers since they were discussing number sequences just before that.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <07-03-11/0229:53>
I'm guessing that number sequence discussion & post was from Spy Games?

Poster with No Name might have gotten a bit spooked from Hannibelle's post in Attitude (pg 113), about some guy with top-end media and programs (and presumably a suitable commlink to run them).  Hence the creep-out post.  A basic psy-op.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <07-03-11/0334:34>
Hmm, concensus breaking out of its cage?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <07-03-11/1454:01>
I do not know why but I am beginning to think that it might be a new great dragon.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-03-11/1503:11>
Or one that finally sat up and noticed the Matrix.  :P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <07-03-11/1632:50>
Ghostwalker accessing his brothers old systems?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-03-11/1639:09>
"I figured out how to remove 'The Big D' from the Sig, but can't quite figure out how to put in a new one."

:P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <07-03-11/2206:21>
Ghostwalker HAS posted, as 'Ghost in the Machine'.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <07-03-11/2212:25>
Ghostwalker HAS posted, as 'Ghost in the Machine'.
Reference?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <07-03-11/2256:50>
Well, FastJack's massive Shadowland poster spreadsheet lists these appearances: Dragons of the Sixth World, p.69 (GW Chapter). The final paragraph questions how and why he and Lofwyr are against each other.

Quote
All we can assume right now is that it's some sort of dragon thing, and that it might go back a long, long way.

> Now there's a candidate for understatement of the decade. It'll be interesting to see if Ol' Pale Scales learned any clever new tricks while he was away.
> The Laughing Man

> Oh, yes. You'll soon see.
> Ghost in the Machine

Spy Games outlines his very clear and very close relationship with the Denver Data Haven.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <07-03-11/2305:10>
Well, FastJack's massive Shadowland poster spreadsheet lists these appearances: Dragons of the Sixth World, p.69 (GW Chapter). The final paragraph questions how and why he and Lofwyr are against each other.


Thanks, i don't have any old books or spy games yet.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-04-11/0211:13>
Forgot about that reference in Spy Games.  I have to read it again with a fine-toothed comb.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <07-04-11/0220:42>
Well, FastJack's massive Shadowland poster spreadsheet lists these appearances: Dragons of the Sixth World, p.69 (GW Chapter). The final paragraph questions how and why he and Lofwyr are against each other.

Quote
All we can assume right now is that it's some sort of dragon thing, and that it might go back a long, long way.

> Now there's a candidate for understatement of the decade. It'll be interesting to see if Ol' Pale Scales learned any clever new tricks while he was away.
> The Laughing Man

> Oh, yes. You'll soon see.
> Ghost in the Machine

Spy Games outlines his very clear and very close relationship with the Denver Data Haven.

+1 for backing me up. Thanks!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <07-05-11/1410:18>
I forgot what book it was in but our anonymous poster said "we" when referring to dragons of the 6th world.  Unless of course I just dreamed it.  I will have to go over my stuff to see if I can find the post.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <07-05-11/1520:12>
On that note, have there been any reports of a dragon TM? Seems like just about any race of being on the planet have TM members now. And what was the name of the dragon with a datajack again?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <07-05-11/1525:37>
Nothing with a Magic stat can have resonance so far
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Stahlseele on <07-05-11/1526:01>
Eliohan?
Transys Neuronets most ambitious experiment and now owner.
And MAgic/Emergence don't work together.
And all Dragons are Magic incarnate.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <07-05-11/1551:12>
Maybe the mystery poster has ingested so many Horizon memes that he/she has to inject corp. blather into whatever they are writing?
Or they're really good at breaking FastJack's security, but not so good at keeping Horizon Viral Advertising out of their own system.  :P
Or poking the sleeping bear...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <07-05-11/1551:42>
Nothing with a Magic stat can have resonance so far
Darn it, forgot about that factor.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <07-05-11/1558:08>
Eliohan?
Transys Neuronets most ambitious experiment and now owner.
Thanks. Some quick checking of corp guide shows the dragon to supposedly be in a coma, tho there are so odd activities related to old holdings. There is a shadowtalk reference to lawyers hired to represent the dragons company, Emergent Futures, rather then NeoNET.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <07-05-11/1719:24>
I forgot what book it was in but our anonymous poster said "we" when referring to dragons of the 6th world.  Unless of course I just dreamed it.  I will have to go over my stuff to see if I can find the post.
That would be the one I wrote in the Extraplanar Intelligence chapter of Spy Games.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-05-11/1946:50>
Maybe the possible E-Ghost Dragon, the one that got the Datajack?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <07-05-11/2007:38>
Maybe the possible E-Ghost Dragon, the one that got the Datajack?

Man that'd b AI level dangerous

Whoah. Wait. Dragon on the Matrix.... Technomancers.....
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-05-11/2014:07>
Maybe the possible E-Ghost Dragon, the one that got the Datajack?
Man that'd b AI level dangerous

Whoah. Wait. Dragon on the Matrix.... Technomancers.....
Yep, what I was thinking too.  And how can you not cut a deal with a Dragon when you can't even tell they're a Dragon, due to the Matrix?  :P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <07-05-11/2032:26>
I forgot what book it was in but our anonymous poster said "we" when referring to dragons of the 6th world.  Unless of course I just dreamed it.  I will have to go over my stuff to see if I can find the post.
Sorry Freddie, it was "their ilk"

Quote from: Spy Games, p. 136
Great dragons and their ilk have yet to accept that the world moves faster than them, and it has no regard for their plans. They may think long-term, but humans are unpredictable and a bit crazy. We’ve also been playing this game for millennia without end.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-05-11/2034:04>
Only "a bit crazy", eh?  Guess The Poster With No Name doesn't know (Meta)humanity that well.   ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <07-05-11/2259:20>
Extending an analogy made between TM & Sprites and Magicians & Spirits/Elementals . . . I propose that the Poster with No Name is the equivalent of a Great Form Free Sprite.

Only just thought of this, so apologies if anyone already came up with it.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <07-06-11/0009:57>
Maybe the possible E-Ghost Dragon, the one that got the Datajack?
Cerberus?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Charybdis on <07-06-11/0010:04>
Quote from: Spy Games, p. 136
Great dragons and their ilk have yet to accept that the world moves faster than them, and it has no regard for their plans. They may think long-term, but humans are unpredictable and a bit crazy. We’ve also been playing this game for millennia without end.
Let's just focus on this single thread post, and assume all of it is true.

If 'we've' been playing the game for that long, it can't be a matrix construct or technomancer, as they're just not old enough

For it to be a free spirit or great form version, it would need to have found some way of accessing the matrix (and seeing as Spirits normally can't view any AR or electronic screens (Street Magic p.92), it would have to have found some way of doing so through a weird proxy interface... like a typewriter hooked up to an audio recorder or something...but again, the coding requirements to hack Jackpoint make this very unlikely.

Great dragons can and have made forum posts in the past, however if we believe the term 'they' is being used in context, then the poster is not a great dragon, so we can rule them out.

We're left with the following requirements:
- Is a group of entities (ie 'we')
- Have existed for thousands of years (ie 'Millenia')
- Can extensively utilise Matrix technology (for the pure expertise required to hack JackPoint....even just once, let alone repeatedly)

Which means we're pretty much limited to:
- Immortal elves
- Infected (I don't know if this is canon, but since many Infected are Immune to Aging (Vampires and Nosferatu especially), it's possible some may have survived from 4th Age to 6th)

My money's on Infected, because I'm hanging out for stats on Dracula, and maybe a cool backstory about a 4th Age vamp being one of the great leaders of a 5th Age civilisation like the Mayans, Romans, Vikings etc....

Hmmm, seeing as Dracula is a bastardisation of 'dragon', maybe he was a member of the human clans ruled by either Mountainshadow or Deinarastas, was then Infected (as there were vampires in the 4th Age), and took the name Dracula as a later homage to his mentors....

If it IS The Infected hacking JackPoint, it could have the Ordo Maximus involved. Dammit! Martin deVries was right! Arrrgggh!

What?! ??? Why is everyone looking at me like that?  :o It could happen!  ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-06-11/0016:12>
Maybe the possible E-Ghost Dragon, the one that got the Datajack?
Cerberus?
I think so.  That's the problem with only half-remembering books and such.

I need to work better on my collection.  At least CGL is putting out good quality PDFs of old books at a decent price.  I just got the Street Samurai Catalog, on sale no less.   ;D

Still wish I bought the DTF one at my FLGS back home years ago.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <07-06-11/0030:25>
I can't recall if Cerberus has been described as active in the Matrix since his body went comatose/dead.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Charybdis on <07-06-11/0034:26>
We're left with the following requirements:
- Is a group of entities (ie 'we')
- Have existed for thousands of years (ie 'Millenia')
- Can extensively utilise Matrix technology (for the pure expertise required to hack JackPoint....even just once, let alone repeatedly)
You're not really reading the whole thing.
*Shrugs* Nope. Quite deliberately (I'm at work, and am WAAAAY behind :P )

If you want to widen the search, it could be Astral entities controlling technomancers/matrix specialists to do the hacking work and give voice to their own terrible thoughts (eg Horrors, which are older than the Great Dragons, and the GD's in Earthdawn mythology are the first Namegiver race and predate all other sapient life on the planet)

Insect Spirits could also be an option. No idea how old the Hive is on the metaplanes...

But I like Vampires better :)

Also, Horrors would be less likely to go on rants about Horizon :P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <07-06-11/0038:35>
Wouldn't they? The most powerful ones were successful because of how thoroughly they are able the manipulate people into harming themselves and others. That seems ... counter ... to Horizon's stated goals.

However, I also say this not remembering much about ED or much caring for it.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Charybdis on <07-06-11/0042:12>
Wouldn't they? The most powerful ones were successful because of how thoroughly they are able the manipulate people into harming themselves and others. That seems ... counter ... to Horizon's stated goals.

Indeed, however with the technology expertise required, it seems unlikely that a clever horror would be taking the effort to hack Jackpoint with seemingly meaningless drivel, when it could be out getting a good meal on huge and proper suffering caused by gridlock on the interstate and intermittent mobile phone outages (*cough* Crowley *cough*)

Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-06-11/0043:46>
*Sings Ozzy's "Mr. Crowley" in the key of off*
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <07-06-11/0119:55>
Well, Dawkins Group also seems to consider JackPoint enough of a threat or ... something ... that it infiltrated JP. Dawkins only does that to destroy said groups. Makes you wonder why JackPoint.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-06-11/0121:50>
Well, Dawkins Group also seems to consider JackPoint enough of a threat or ... something ... that it infiltrated JP. Dawkins only does that to destroy said groups. Makes you wonder why JackPoint.
Other than the fact that it was started by one of the oldest and best Hackers/Deckers/Hackers in the business?  Filled with high-end Shadowrunners and Fixers with connections all over the world?  As well as stores information on a variety of topics that are esoteric and weird, outside the perview and "Out of the box" as possible from a Corporate viewpoint (Even one as dynamic as Horizon)?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Charybdis on <07-06-11/0213:26>
Makes you wonder why JackPoint.

Indeed...what use it is to manipulate a bunch of miscreant, non-conformist, terrorist, criminal, prime-runners capable of any required expertise in Magic, Matrix operations, Combat, Demolitions, Interrogation, Piracy, Kidnappings and a general low-down on all the information you'll never see on a public Trid show.

Can't imagine why that would be interesting/...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <07-06-11/0224:44>
Well, I don't see them going after the Nexus, Helix, or ShadowSea—All of which are arguably worse cesspools of scum and villainy. At least they're bigger.

I also want to mention that a lot of JackPointers are self-righteous douchebags and/or hypocrites when it comes to morality.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Charybdis on <07-06-11/0226:43>
Well, I don't see them going after the Nexus, Helix, or ShadowSea—All of which are arguably worse cesspools of scum and villainy. At least they're bigger.
Maybe they are,

but we're just not seeing those posts as part of regular release schedules..

JackPoint is just far more visible to this particular forum of scum and villainy...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <07-06-11/0235:20>
Anyway, going back to the comment in Spy Games, let me just say this: You're missing something.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Charybdis on <07-06-11/0254:13>
Anyway, going back to the comment in Spy Games, let me just say this: You're missing something.
Of course we are, that's half the fun.

One of the benefits of being a writer is that you know which words to emphasise in your head to both imply what is false, yet still give hints to what is true

One of the benefits of being a reader is that you don't get any of that emphasis insight, and can either spend time poring over every interpretation (literal, implied or otherwise), or find one you like and stick to it.

So, like I said... Vampires ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <07-06-11/0744:13>
So, like I said... Vampires ;)
Or an immortal Drake from the 4th world.

Or a blood mage from the 4th world that had been "preserved" in a Locus since that age.

Or the Illuminati.

Or ... I'm starting to sound like Plan 9. I'd better stop.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <07-06-11/0748:35>
Or it's just a (meta)human talking about (meta)humans
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: SirDelta on <07-06-11/1151:41>
Could it be Harlequin?  He could have easily been helped in by Frosty.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-06-11/1152:59>
Or it's just a (meta)human talking about (meta)humans
That's almost as crazy as Horizon not having a deep, dark secret to it.

...

Not saying it isn't true, however.  Be a twist for the conspiracy theorists to have something be exactly what it seems for once, and Shadowrunners are certainly paranoid enough for most "Average" Conspiracy Theorists.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <07-06-11/1215:12>
I forgot what book it was in but our anonymous poster said "we" when referring to dragons of the 6th world.  Unless of course I just dreamed it.  I will have to go over my stuff to see if I can find the post.
Sorry Freddie, it was "their ilk"

Quote from: Spy Games, p. 136
Great dragons and their ilk have yet to accept that the world moves faster than them, and it has no regard for their plans. They may think long-term, but humans are unpredictable and a bit crazy. We’ve also been playing this game for millennia without end.

No problem Jack thank you for the correction.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Simagal on <07-06-11/1554:16>
The dragon Eliohann is mentioned as having a data jack on page 130 of Corporate Guide under the Celedyr entry.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <07-06-11/1618:07>
The dragon Eliohann is mentioned as having a data jack on page 130 of Corporate Guide under the Celedyr entry.
But the same text also claims it being comatose since crash 2.0 (with some shadowtalk about a dragon ghost in the machine)...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <07-06-11/1648:32>
The dragon Eliohann is mentioned as having a data jack on page 130 of Corporate Guide under the Celedyr entry.
Yeah. His main Matrix handle was Cerberus.

The dragon Eliohann is mentioned as having a data jack on page 130 of Corporate Guide under the Celedyr entry.
But the same text also claims it being comatose since crash 2.0 (with some shadowtalk about a dragon ghost in the machine)...
His body is comatose and unresponsive.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-06-11/1848:50>
Never trust a dragon until you've autopsied the body.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <07-06-11/1906:11>
Never trust a dragon until you've autopsied the body.
Never guess their gender too
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-06-11/1907:55>
Be really surprising if "Mister President Dunkie the Dragon" was actually "Madam President" after all.  :P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Stahlseele on <07-07-11/1318:53>
It would make his relationship to ryanthussar a bit awkward/creepy . . .
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <07-07-11/1405:12>
Aden "cross-dresses" as a woman apparently for no other reason than to mess with conservative muslims.

He seems to hate them so much I'm supposed he doesn't have a show on Fox News.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-07-11/1415:04>
Who says he doesn't?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <07-08-11/0444:11>
For all we know he may own the channel...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Lacynth40 on <07-27-11/2326:56>
For all we know he may own the channel...

Well, Rupert Murdoch IS old enough to have been around for the Fourth World...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Angelone on <07-28-11/1337:42>
Maybe a master shedim possessing the body of a "dead" hacker. All the skills plus that alien outlook.

It's kinda thin but possible.

Edit- A master shedim possessing Captain Chaos!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <07-28-11/1349:12>
For all we know he may own the channel...

Well, Rupert Murdoch IS old enough to have been around for the Fourth World...

Rupert Murdoch as Horror-Tainted I can believe . . .

Let's hope it doesn't run in the family.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-28-11/1643:27>
Edit- A master shedim possessing Captain Chaos!
That scares me.

That scares FastJack.

That scares Dunkie, and he's DEAD!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Teiran on <07-29-11/2025:57>
Ah come on guys.  All this talk of new matrix entities, dragons, etc is really kind of pointless. 

We have a precedent for the A. Nonymous posts, a defined time and place where Jack Points defenses were breached completely along with evidence who did it and thus who or what is behind the posts: The Consensus

And here's the evidence supporting that guess:

Horizon's CEO Gary Kline emailed Sunshine about the Consensus directly, and in Fast Jack's own words breached his security.  Fast Jack himself traced the email down to Kline's computer, and vowed to investigate.

Then, the Dawkins Group infiltrated and spied on ten, if not more, members of Jack Point.  Collecting not only their identies but also how and when they accessed JP and how and where JP could be accessed. 

Why would they do this?  Simple.  Fast Jack is inches away from uncovering the Consensus.  He even says he's narrowed it down to a single location for where it might be. 

The Consensus would hate the Azzies and media pirates. 
Would consider Dragons and their 'ilk' backward and slow to respond
Would probably find posting comments about how good Horizon is amusing. 
Would have access to secret Dawkin's group files about Kay (as one comment shows).

Fast Jack is searching for who or what Horizon's big secret really is, and I think it's pretty clear where things are going.  (Even without looking at the release schedule of upcoming books...)

The real question, and one that hasn't been answered as far as I know, is who or what the Consensus really is. 
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <07-29-11/2108:24>
Deus 2.0...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <07-29-11/2158:28>
I thought that was Slamm-0!s and Netcat's kid?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Prime Mover on <07-29-11/2215:53>
I've always leaned towards some sort of matrix entity.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <08-10-11/1907:29>
Any sign of him in Legends?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <08-10-11/1933:46>
Any sign of him in Legends?
Yes. He's mostly discussing Dragons.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <08-10-11/1945:24>
Yes. He's mostly discussing Dragons.

Awesome, can't wait to see them
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Lacynth40 on <08-10-11/2131:17>
He or she seems to have a lot to say about dragons... Not all of it nice.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <08-10-11/2257:42>
He or she seems to have a lot to say about dragons... Not all of it nice.
(S)He actually has a LOT to say on Hestaby and Lofwyr. Anonymity doeth have its privileges. Check the newest posts here (http://forums.shadowrun4.com/index.php?topic=3216.msg33925#msg33925).
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Charybdis on <08-10-11/2329:37>
He or she seems to have a lot to say about dragons... Not all of it nice.
(S)He actually has a LOT to say on Hestaby and Lofwyr. Anonymity doeth have its privileges. Check the newest posts here (http://forums.shadowrun4.com/index.php?topic=3216.msg33925#msg33925).
Hmf, ranting much?

It's interesting to notice that if this is indeed the same A.Nonymous poster every time, the lucidity of language is increasing every time, as is the overly loquacious (/ranting) nature of posts.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <08-10-11/2352:41>
A. Nonymous is sounding more and more Human to me.
And I mean Player Human, like a PC's player metagaming accidentally.

I'm less inclined to believe it's a Matrix Entity after hearing it say "Poor Slot" too. Either A. Nonymous isn't one person or the lucidity increasing is a red herring. His beliefs don't seem alien enough to be a full Matrix or Magic Entity.... I wonder if it's just a hacker, technomancer or someone with enough cash to hack in because he thinks he should be included in Jackpoint but wasn't.

Jackpoint has Runners and Fixers, I imagine this is a Johnson.
And I have my suspicions.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Lacynth40 on <08-10-11/2355:44>
I think it's a free drake.... Lot's of anger towards dragons... Especially the greats.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <08-11-11/0006:45>
Which seems to be a bit of a change in focus.  Odd . . .
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Lacynth40 on <08-11-11/0048:26>
A free drake with ADHD....
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <08-11-11/0114:22>
Harlequin up to his old tricks, after learning some hacking tricks from Leonardo?

And, damnit, I was hoping to find out what happened to that guy that became a "Non-Citizen" and such.  Hell, what did he do to deserve it?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <08-11-11/0325:12>
I don't think it's Harlequin - the tone seems off his usual one.  It does seem to be getting out into Dragonslayer level of vituperation.  Maybe FastJack(SR) should ask Wyrm Watcher for some help.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <08-11-11/0956:07>
I thought Dragonslayer bought it in Crash 2.0?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <08-11-11/1242:20>
I thought Dragonslayer bought it in Crash 2.0?

There was a reference to his demise due to gang violence.  Though what I meant was the recent unattributed posts that reference dragons seem to be edging up to his level of antipathy.  I'm not saying it's him.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <08-12-11/0257:16>
LOL
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <08-12-11/1324:22>
LOL

....Is this a clue?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <08-12-11/1345:53>
Kind of. Mostly it's because I couldn't help myself after laughing hysterically at how close you guys may be getting.

Let me just say it, since it's in Street Legends. Nadja Daviar knows about JackPoint. I'm not saying she is or isn't Anonymous. I'm not saying Anonymous is or isn't one ... person. But I will point that out.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <08-12-11/1348:47>
"The Big D" keeps fragging on posting from beyond the slotting grave!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <08-12-11/1349:01>
Kind of. Mostly it's because I couldn't help myself after laughing hysterically at how close you guys may be getting.

Let me just say it, since it's in Street Legends. Nadja Daviar knows about JackPoint. I'm not saying she is or isn't Anonymous. I'm not saying Anonymous is or isn't one ... person. But I will point that out.

Speculation... ENGAGE
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <08-12-11/1354:16>
The Big D, I'm telling you!  The body's gone, but the spirit lives on.

In "The Draco Foundation"!  You seriously think his instructions and speculations ended with just Crash 2.0?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <08-12-11/1410:46>
Hmm... I have my own suspicions now. Somewhat more along the lines of Dead Deckers Society than any one individual. I don't want to say the theory outright, but am I getting close James?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <08-12-11/1411:12>
Yeah, Ray, you need to read the rest of The Prestige.


I've already said more than I should, but the Nadja thing is in the book so it's fair game (SL, 169).
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <08-12-11/1412:43>
Yeah, Ray, you need to read the rest of The Prestige.
PM comin' your way.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <08-12-11/1509:03>
Yeah, Ray, you need to read the rest of The Prestige.
PM comin' your way.

Pleasssse PM me your theory FastJack!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <08-12-11/1514:45>
Yeah, Ray, you need to read the rest of The Prestige.
PM comin' your way.

Pleasssse PM me your theory FastJack!
Ah... it was wrong. Again.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Digital_Viking on <08-12-11/1522:07>
Ah... it was wrong. Again.

Or was it? Just the kind of misdirection we would expect Jack!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <08-12-11/1538:22>
No. It's a flat-out denial on that one. No games.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Digital_Viking on <08-12-11/1555:53>
No. It's a flat-out denial on that one. No games.

And just what we would EXPECT you to say!

And....maybe I need to step away from the conspiracy stuff  ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <08-12-11/1558:50>
If you're thinking about stepping away from the thoughts of conspiracies, you know that they're already starting to get to you, and you need to hold on that much harder!

...

Or that I'm really bloody paranoid.  Not sure which.  I think I'll go over here and work on my Cave Johnson impersonations.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Netzgeist on <08-12-11/1637:28>
It's only paranoia if you are wrong, and just if you're wrong in a sense of believing something that's not there is there...

And there's definitely something there.

Watching and listening to your every consideration.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <08-12-11/1718:32>
Yeah, Ray, you need to read the rest of The Prestige.
PM comin' your way.

Pleasssse PM me your theory FastJack!
Ah... it was wrong. Again.

Still would like to know, trial and error!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <08-12-11/2247:38>
Yeah, Ray, you need to read the rest of The Prestige.
PM comin' your way.

Pleasssse PM me your theory FastJack!
Ah... it was wrong. Again.

Still would like to know, trial and error!
In that case, we now know it's not the Daviars.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Lacynth40 on <08-12-11/2252:36>
You mean the Nadjas....

Oh, and CanRay, I may have to change your name to Plan 9....
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <08-12-11/2313:25>
You mean the Nadjas....
Yeah... them too. ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Angelone on <08-12-11/2350:00>
Ryan Mercury?  He's got inside info on dragons, a reason, plus the programming to be bitter.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Valashar on <08-12-11/2356:23>
Given the possibility of a group, could it be a chunk of former Watchers?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <08-13-11/0005:44>
In that case, we now know it's not the Daviars.

Thanks FJ
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <08-13-11/0122:27>
Oh, and CanRay, I may have to change your name to Plan 9....
Please, (s)he's a poser compared to me!

Although, some parts of the transhumanism...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Nath on <08-13-11/0542:26>
Given the possibility of a group, could it be a chunk of former Watchers?
I first thought of SilveryK. She is a former Dunkelzahn Watcher, so she probably spent a lot of time gathering intel on dragons and Aztlan. And she is involved in Denver politics as an admin of Nexus and their liaison with Ghostwalker. Also, she inherited a "can-opener program". In Spy Games, Perri, the other Nexus sysadmin, manage to hack into Jackpoint (and maybe he choose to display a login doing so).

But the theory doesn't hold water, because SilveryK designed and built her equipment from scratch. So she should know even optical computers have a magnetic fields coming from their power source, in Spy Games, page 166. That post is interesting, because it means someone can get past Jackpoint security and at the same time lack such knowledge on how computers actually work. If it's a group, it can be SilveryK and a bunch of other less-knowledgeable Nexus people using the can-opener program. It can also be a technomancer, as those can be very good at getting through firewall and still not know how a real computer work.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <08-13-11/0629:07>
I'm putting in a vote for Sirrurg, or someone associated with him.  The rants to do with Hestaby and Lofwyr, plus (as has been mentioned) the increasing 'loquaciousness' of the posts could indicate someone with a low but increasing familiarity with computers (together with the computer-illiterate post).

Either that, or it's the Dawkins Group - no single hot topic to sound off about, pro-Horizon, aims to co-opt JackPoint . . .

Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: lurkeroutthere on <08-13-11/0737:39>
Has Cerrebus been discounted or exonerated, post Street Legends they seem like a strong pick.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <08-14-11/0110:55>
Has Cerrebus been discounted or exonerated, post Street Legends they seem like a strong pick.
Cerberus was given access in Street Legends, so it doesn't make sense to post as A. Nonymous there.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <08-14-11/0112:39>
Unless as a double-blind.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <08-14-11/0238:02>
Probably already suggested, but I have to throw it out...

Saeletra?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <08-14-11/0508:46>
Probably already suggested, but I have to throw it out...

Saeletra?

I SO hope you're wrong about that . . . and yet it would open up a lot more.  It'd give Fastjack(SR) a few quibbles at least.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: MisterNemo on <08-14-11/1034:34>
I have a feeling you guys are getting closer to the truth of the situation...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <08-14-11/1050:33>
Saeletra?
I SO hope you're wrong about that . . . and yet it would open up a lot more.  It'd give Fastjack(SR) a few quibbles at least.
I'm conflicted, it would both be awesome and disappointing.  But, it's a hanging hook that's been around since the Denver Box Set, just waiting for a fish to bite into it...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Lacynth40 on <08-14-11/1121:35>
Come on guys.... It's Ghostdancer... Especially the crap about the other dragons...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <08-14-11/1126:31>
A bit too subtle for him.  'Course, never trust what a Dragon shows you, right?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Tex Muldoon on <08-14-11/1420:19>
I know this is going to sound weird but what if Jackpoint somehow got its own AI. I mean look at all the knowledge at its disposal and if it hasn't pick a gender then it can't pick a name. It might trace info back to jackpointers and it would have access to all the contacts and info they would. Plus look at everything put on Jackpoint, you can make your own guess.Maybe an old program of Fastjack that achieved the level needed for independent thought. Thats just my thoughts.
Also trying to figure what is on pg.166 of Spy games. Can't figure out Femtiatte, Quarantase, Konets got the rest. The rest are numbers in 5 languages including a mix of german and sweddish. I can't piece together what the numbers mean though. PM me if you get those figured out. (Good thing I played a bounty hunter, not giving up on this)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <08-14-11/1509:48>
I know this is going to sound weird but what if Jackpoint somehow got its own AI. I mean look at all the knowledge at its disposal and if it hasn't pick a gender then it can't pick a name. It might trace info back to jackpointers and it would have access to all the contacts and info they would. Plus look at everything put on Jackpoint, you can make your own guess. Thats just my thoughts.
Also trying to figure what is on pg.166 of Spy games. Can't figure out Femtiatte, Quarantase, Konets got the rest. The rest are numbers in 5 languages including a mix of german and sweddish. I can't piece together what the numbers mean though. PM me if you get those figured out. (Good thing I played a bounty hunter, not giving up on this)

I thought an AI had already been ruled out though thinking about it maybe it is some sort of new net entity?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Tex Muldoon on <08-14-11/1515:13>
Think about it. If you had an old program just sitting there, not doing anything and it just emerged without you noticing it then would you look for it. It would already have access to you encryption keys and protocols. If you got nothing but time what would you do in a world you don't understand and I am sure Fastjack's personal gear is high tech enough it could support an AI or new being. Hiding at the heart of darkness, closest to danger has been tactic for years. That is my thought process anyway
Figured out Femtiatte-92
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <08-14-11/1821:02>
Think about it. If you had an old program just sitting there, not doing anything and it just emerged without you noticing it then would you look for it. It would already have access to you encryption keys and protocols. If you got nothing but time what would you do in a world you don't understand and I am sure Fastjack's personal gear is high tech enough it could support an AI or new being. Hiding at the heart of darkness, closest to danger has been tactic for years. That is my thought process anyway
Figured out Femtiatte-92
Add to that the fact that the JackPoint is distributed amongst all the JackPoint Members rather than in a central location in a twisted Klein-Bottle Code-Like RAID-∞ memory system...

Hell, BULL'S cyberdeck alone has more than enough processing power for a good-sized AI.  'Course, he can watch it closely as it's strapped to his arm...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Lacynth40 on <08-14-11/2206:43>
Not to mention Hannibelle's rig... AI would be interesting, but what did it say about Cerberus going ghost in the machine? Not getting my book out, but I think it said something about the electro-dragon... .
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Charybdis on <08-14-11/2214:44>
Come on guys.... It's Ghostdancer... Especially the crap about the other dragons...
Depends on whether the statements it has said to date are true.

Linguistically, it can't be a great dragon as it refers to the whole group as 'them' or 'they' and the poster refers to itself seperately as 'we'

Quote from: Quote from: Spy Games, p. 136
Great dragons and their ilk have yet to accept that the world moves faster than them, and it has no regard for their plans. They may think long-term, but humans are unpredictable and a bit crazy. We’ve also been playing this game for millennia without end.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Lacynth40 on <08-14-11/2318:04>
Yes, but electro-dragon-boy considers itself a unique and new entity...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Charybdis on <08-14-11/2323:06>
Yes, but electro-dragon-boy considers itself a unique and new entity...
But does it consider itself a 'we'?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Lacynth40 on <08-14-11/2329:02>
If it did, that may be a case for more "ghosts"...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <08-14-11/2346:26>
Or referring to having three heads.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <08-15-11/0011:56>
Or referring to having three heads.

Maybe Mananay got wireless to her cave, even more heads
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Lacynth40 on <08-15-11/0033:46>
*Cackles* A bunch of dragon hatchlings raised on Sesame Street....
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <08-15-11/0558:05>
Better then blood bowl i guess...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: MisterNemo on <08-15-11/0910:13>
AI or new technomancer seems accurate, what with the increasing eloquence and lack of netiquette involving jackpoint.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: beowulf_of_wa on <08-15-11/2328:46>

Also trying to figure what is on pg.166 of Spy games. Can't figure out Femtiatte, Quarantase, Konets got the rest. The rest are numbers in 5 languages including a mix of german and sweddish. I can't piece together what the numbers mean though. PM me if you get those figured out. (Good thing I played a bounty hunter, not giving up on this)

in order: 250, 36, 1, 45, 47, 92, 905, 92, 46, end (konets)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <08-16-11/0023:21>
Back on topic, the mention of the man stripped of all rights being mentioned in SL, by A. nonymous, no less, draws my attention.
ok,, what about it draws your attention?
I feel it's a deliberately chosen example...I can't really elaborate
A man stripped of his identity and a person that posts with no name...

Maybe my moniker of "The Poster With No Name" is more accurate than I thought...  And here I was just doing a Clint Eastwood joke.

Yes that's what was nagging at me.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Valashar on <08-16-11/1058:01>
Except if that man survived his week stripped of identity and hunted (and could present himself to the Draco Foundation alive), then he was to get it all back again.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <08-16-11/1103:23>
Except if that man survived his week stripped of identity and hunted (and could present himself to the Draco Foundation alive), then he was to get it all back again.

actually he also had to prove it was him
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <08-16-11/1133:25>
With his SIN burned and all details of his life destroyed by hackers hired by Dunkie's Cold, Dead Claws themselves?

...

Good luck.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <08-16-11/1259:43>
Quite possible the dragon provided his foundation with some way to verify such a claim. But that depends on how fair the scaly one wanted to play. Hell, if they could restore the SIN and details it would indicate that they held a copy of it all in some form.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <08-16-11/1717:54>
After getting through the gauntlet of bounty hunters and shadowrunners on the way to the office (http://youtu.be/wmPsFbV51_c).
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <08-16-11/1920:58>
After getting through the gauntlet of bounty hunters and shadowrunners on the way to the office (http://youtu.be/wmPsFbV51_c).

Exactly
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Ryu on <09-24-11/1558:19>
There is some information:

2 "first degree" members are online and within range, 7 KE nodes are within range (assuming a squad of 7...)

Are we talking someone with "personal dragon experience", or just an aide? I like the vampire angle.

The smartlink protocols being wrong is either really old or SOTA hardware, negative rep is pointing to someone else than DK (IMO). "8 responses" might or might not be relevant. Vampires reject implants, yes? Old gun or old cyberware?


Edit: Please don´t be confused by this post.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <09-24-11/1607:59>
What the ...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <09-24-11/2345:01>
What the ...
I think he posted in the wrong thread, but I can't for the life of me figure out what thread that would belong in...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <09-25-11/0002:26>
Or he's trying to be this board's version of "The Poster With No Name" and just doesn't know how to remove his handle.  :P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Ryu on <09-25-11/0156:53>
What the ...
I think he posted in the wrong thread, but I can't for the life of me figure out what thread that would belong in...

Somehow my brain connected the quote of the Horizon spam
Quote from: Gun Heaven, p. 17
Mmmm, Mmmm Good. Horizon is Good for the Soul :)

with the Jackpoint login page from the same book. Wide leap, especially since many will have gotten that spam. (http://watermark.rpgnow.com/pdf_previews/92357-sample.pdf (http://watermark.rpgnow.com/pdf_previews/92357-sample.pdf))

Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Ryu on <09-25-11/0333:14>
Or he's trying to be this board's version of "The Poster With No Name" and just doesn't know how to remove his handle.  :P

TPWNN? No, the page greets me with "Hello Ryu", not a default "Hello Chummer".

Another take:
The quotes point to someone with military/intelligence background. Politically informed about Middle and North America. Able to hack Jackpoint or to arrange for it to be hacked. Hestaby seems to be a major concern, and A.Nonymous knows about the dark side of Dunkie.

Quote from: Spy Games, p. 136
Great dragons and their ilk have yet to accept that the world moves faster than them, and it has no regard for their plans. They may think long-term, but humans are unpredictable and a bit crazy. We’ve also been playing this game for millennia without end.
This sounds like first-hand experience with both dragon plans and spy games around them.

[spoiler]My current guess is an old friend of Damien Knight, if he is still alive. An experienced spymaster with access to DK´s matrix specialists, Roger Soaring Owl has contacts all over the NAN and is one of the old-timers with unknown agenda. He would also be able to comment on the threat statistics for Lesker if KE did the job.[/spoiler]

Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <09-25-11/0455:56>
Interesting.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <09-25-11/1138:31>
I think we were just confused by what exactly you were trying to say in you previous post.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <09-25-11/1229:42>
I held off from submitting another guess for a while . . . but I'm gonna toss in the possibility of . . .

David Gavilan.

Which only actually works if Gavilan did not, in fact, become Damien Knight.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Ryu on <09-25-11/1254:55>
I think we were just confused by what exactly you were trying to say in you previous post.
Charge that on me. Regarding TPWNN, I could have registered [DS]Ryu. If I don´t respond here, you can reach me there.

I´d like to hear opinions on my current theory. "We" in the discussed theory could be (and IMO is) humanity.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <09-25-11/1255:16>
Alice is back?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Valashar on <09-25-11/2049:59>
A while back there was a thread with ideas about the JackPoint splash pages in the books. Specifically, trying to figure out whose JackPoint account was being logged into and if it was the same member in each book. That sounds like the thread Ryu's post belonged in.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <09-25-11/2056:58>
I doubt it's the same member, but I might be wrong.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <09-25-11/2358:10>
A while back there was a thread with ideas about the JackPoint splash pages in the books. Specifically, trying to figure out whose JackPoint account was being logged into and if it was the same member in each book. That sounds like the thread Ryu's post belonged in.
AFAIK the login page is for the reader and not a named JackPointer.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <09-26-11/0705:54>
A while back there was a thread with ideas about the JackPoint splash pages in the books. Specifically, trying to figure out whose JackPoint account was being logged into and if it was the same member in each book. That sounds like the thread Ryu's post belonged in.
AFAIK the login page is for the reader and not a named JackPointer.
If it is a JackPointer, it's not always the same one.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: TTNTM#2 on <09-28-11/0843:26>
Interesting, no one expected that spambot to evolve that good..... oh nevermind
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <09-28-11/1715:28>
Interesting, no one expected that spambot to evolve that good..... oh nevermind

Maybe it a free sprite:-p
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <09-30-11/0412:56>
Unless it's been clearly and definitively stated that it's someone with regular posts in previous books -- someone in, say, the first 20 pages of Fastjack's Shadowland/Jackpoint Posters (http://www.mattdroz.com/PDF/Shadowland_Posters.pdf) pdf -- then I think most bets are going to be off.  It could easily be an unrevealed character in the game world, someone who knows a lot about a lot of things but who has only posted very rarely until recently.  Consider the knowledge base:
  I have a minor doubt about it being a techie, though it's still possible; note the comment about an optic system having a magnetic field.  This is someone who has a very wide range of interests and an information pipeline with many intakes.  If he, she, or it posted in pre-4th Shadowland, then it was probably across a lot of books, though most of the information above lies primarily on the social range.
 
Me, I'd look for posters who spoke primarily in the sourcebooks on Aztlan, Denver, and Dragons of the Sixth World.  Maybe Shadowbeat, too ...
 
Or maybe it's being held for a character of a new writer, so that their 'old codger' poster can come out of the woodwork.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <09-30-11/1505:27>
Gah.

My heart skipped a beat when I first saw you posted. Anyway, that is a very good point.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Nath on <09-30-11/1640:45>
  • CAS vehicle use
  • Aztlan politics
  • Cartel info and sources (i.e. crime)
  • Media pirates
  • Denver politics
  • Great Dragons (very much so) and their minions
I can picture an Aztlan or Aztechnology Corporate Security operative (hence, Aztlan politics) previously assigned to Aztlan major area of interests: Austin (CAS vehicles), Caracas or Bogotá (cartels, and two Great Dragons operations, Hualpa and Sirrurg), and Denver (one more Great Dragon, Ghostwalker). Recently, he/she focused on Hestaby whereabouts for some reason, and one of his/her past assignment involved working with local organized crime and pirates. Maybe those pirates gave him the way to hack into JackPoint, in spite of his limited knowledge of how computer work.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <09-30-11/1842:07>
And the Horizon spam?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Nath on <09-30-11/2104:37>
Irony from someone who've been working for years for a corp who was #1 in corporate advertising before Horizon arrived ?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Simagal on <09-30-11/2239:12>
If it was from Aztechnology why was the first contact with anonymous a recruitment pm to Sunshine's account in Corporate Guide. It was traced back to an office at Horizon by Fastjack and Netcat.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <10-01-11/0017:56>
With the right hack, you can make it trace back to Damien Knight's office.

Gah.

My heart skipped a beat when I first saw you posted. Anyway, that is a very good point.

Ah, infamy.

I'd originally wanted to post 'Maybe it's me', but I thought that might be a bit over the top ...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Nath on <10-01-11/0519:32>
If it was from Aztechnology why was the first contact with anonymous a recruitment pm to Sunshine's account in Corporate Guide. It was traced back to an office at Horizon by Fastjack and Netcat.
Isn't the message Fastjack, Netcat and (Orbital/Smiling?) Bandit track back to Horizon offices in Los Angeles in Corporate Guide the message about the Consensus, page 103?

But anyway, "It's Horizon!" can also adequately explain anything in the Fourth Edition.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Ryu on <10-02-11/0642:31>
Unless it's been clearly and definitively stated that it's someone with regular posts in previous books -- someone in, say, the first 20 pages of Fastjack's Shadowland/Jackpoint Posters (http://www.mattdroz.com/PDF/Shadowland_Posters.pdf) pdf -- then I think most bets are going to be off.  It could easily be an unrevealed character in the game world, someone who knows a lot about a lot of things but who has only posted very rarely until recently.  Consider the knowledge base:
 
  • CAS vehicle use
  • Aztlan politics
  • Cartel info and sources (i.e. crime)
  • Media pirates
  • Denver politics
  • Great Dragons (very much so) and their minions
I have a minor doubt about it being a techie, though it's still possible; note the comment about an optic system having a magnetic field.  This is someone who has a very wide range of interests and an information pipeline with many intakes.  If he, she, or it posted in pre-4th Shadowland, then it was probably across a lot of books, though most of the information above lies primarily on the social range.
 
Me, I'd look for posters who spoke primarily in the sourcebooks on Aztlan, Denver, and Dragons of the Sixth World.  Maybe Shadowbeat, too ...
 
Or maybe it's being held for a character of a new writer, so that their 'old codger' poster can come out of the woodwork.
I agree, that plot hook can fit a great many candidates. I wouldn´t look amongst known posters, myself. The stuff posted hardly justifies a change of username.

[spoiler]
Regarding Roger Soaring Owl, the guy became a "high paid military advisor" to the Sioux Nation in Corp Guide. Denver-based, maybe?[/spoiler]
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <10-02-11/2138:33>
I agree, that plot hook can fit a great many candidates. I wouldn´t look amongst known posters, myself. The stuff posted hardly justifies a change of username.


It isn't a matter of changing your username; Jackpoint recognizes X, Y, and Z, and perhaps has a default to anyone who hacks in.  It isn't likely that someone's going to manage that level of hack, but the software requires a 'guest user name' sort of thing, therefore A. Nonymous.  Someone's hacked Jack, not once but several times; like I said, tough job, and you're looking at/for someone who has a lot of experience on the decker side of the coin.  Me, I'd guess a serious decker type, though perhaps not one who knows a lot about the hardware side.

Which seems silly ...

[spoiler]
Regarding Roger Soaring Owl, the guy became a "high paid military advisor" to the Sioux Nation in Corp Guide. Denver-based, maybe?
Doesn't seem likely to me; not enough draco knowledge.
[/spoiler]
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Ryu on <10-03-11/0334:07>
The silliness is why I guess it´s someone who outsources their hacking jobs. A lot of stuff can be explained by access to an intelligence network. Who cares a ton about Hestaby?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <10-04-11/0111:33>
Considering the influence Great Dragons can wield, and that she's actually openly amassing?  Everyone should.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Patrick Goodman on <10-04-11/1122:04>
Considering the influence Great Dragons can wield, and that she's actually openly amassing?  Everyone should.
QFT.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mason on <10-04-11/1324:07>
Considering the influence Great Dragons can wield, and that she's actually openly amassing?  Everyone should.
QFT.

QFT??
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Valashar on <10-04-11/1409:46>
QFT = Quoted For Truth
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Patrick Goodman on <10-04-11/1557:51>
QFT == Quoted For Truth, an indication that I wholeheartedly agree with the quoted text and, in this case at least, the author thereof.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <10-05-11/0448:11>
QFT == Quoted For Truth, an indication that I wholeheartedly agree with the quoted text and, in this case at least, the author thereof.

Then why is my rep only a +9?   :P ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Patrick Goodman on <10-05-11/1012:13>
Then why is my rep only a +9?   :P ;)
Just lucky, I guess. :D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <10-05-11/1104:25>

Quote from: Spy Games, p. 136
Great dragons and their ilk have yet to accept that the world moves faster than them, and it has no regard for their plans. They may think long-term, but humans are unpredictable and a bit crazy. We’ve also been playing this game for millennia without end.


Anyone else marked the word "WE" in the last sentence? Wasnt there an imortal who was an inventor and such (I recall something about Leonardo IMO)

And if he is able to hack FastJack...well IDN where this cames from, this might be an interresting coincidence? Also I`ve heard about some Pixie hacker...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <10-05-11/1106:35>
Could be a reference to we as in humanity, and how spying have been a part of human society for as long as it has existed in organized form.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <10-05-11/1110:05>
Proactive Research Under Concealment, thank you very much.  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <10-05-11/2250:59>
Quote from: Spy Games, p. 136
Great dragons and their ilk have yet to accept that the world moves faster than them, and it has no regard for their plans. They may think long-term, but humans are unpredictable and a bit crazy. We’ve also been playing this game for millennia without end.
Anyone else marked the word "WE" in the last sentence? Wasnt there an imortal who was an inventor and such (I recall something about Leonardo IMO)

And if he is able to hack FastJack...well IDN where this cames from, this might be an interresting coincidence?

If we must go to Leonardo, let us dwell ever-so-pleasantly on Lofwyr's irritated reply to His Twittishness -- giving him the option of 'roast' or 'bake'.  Ne'er was an NPC's death ever so well-earned.  He (Leonardo/Brightlight) was, however, an Immortal Elf; 'nuff said.

I would tend to agree that the 'we' is a racial comment -- 'we' are humans, and while great dragons may be ten or twenty thousand years old, they snooze for 5k years at a time while humanity keeps on developing, learning, becoming crafty, daring things that no sane immortal would think about.  Dragons want to be on top in 500 years; humans want to be on top in 5.  We move faster, we make peculiar 'knight' moves (i.e. not in a straight line), we put things together more oddly, faster, weirder, and -- eventually -- better.  Dragons are history; humanity (which includes metahumanity, except maybe IEs) is all about the future...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <10-05-11/2303:12>
If you play the short game, sure.

Playing a long game, however...  That's when things get quite a bit more...  Interesting.

And dragons can play knight moves as well.  Dunkie proved that with his will.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <10-06-11/0013:31>
The main knight move he played there was mostly on his fellow dragons.  Everything else was sort of an extension of his original plan.

... and then there's the issue that Dunkelzahn was not a normal dragon at all ...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <10-06-11/0252:50>
Since this discussion is intended to include some usefull info... can you please point me to references on Brightlights death you mentioned?

And that about Dunkie...IMO he was normal dragon...Loremaster, but normal dragon. Like Lowfyr or Ghostwalker is.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <10-06-11/0825:07>
Since this discussion is intended to include some usefull info... can you please point me to references on Brightlights death you mentioned?
There's a bit about him in Blood in the Boardroom, in the "Neck and Neck" section.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Patrick Goodman on <10-06-11/1117:26>
I think one or the other, or perhaps both, of you should define "normal" in the context of a Great Dragon. Or any other dragon, for that matter.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Ryu on <10-06-11/1451:46>
Considering the influence Great Dragons can wield, and that she's actually openly amassing?  Everyone should.
Yes, everyone should care about Dragons. I like.

Concerning the tone, our poster is disenchanted with Dunkie, but deeply anoyed by Hestaby´s false face. The data presented alone can be explained by an ARGUS account or any other qualified intelligence material. There needs to be something personal here.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <10-06-11/2359:10>
And that about Dunkie...IMO he was normal dragon...Loremaster, but normal dragon. Like Lowfyr or Ghostwalker is.

Dunkelzahn was a normal dragon in the same sort of way that Einstein was a normal human, or Edison, or, I don't know -- someone find me a social genius.  Dunkelzahn was just about the only Great Dragon who recognized that humanity was moving far, far faster than ever they had, that the sheer pace of technology might actually reach parity with the power of magic -- exceed it, in fact.  That the furious pace and advancement of humanity would fast become their greatest hope, the best and brightest possibility for fighting back against the Horrors, for meeting them as equals on the field of battle, and even, perhaps, of turning the tide against them even at the height of magic's power.

Dunkelzahn, in essence, reacted more rapidly and more like a human than any other dragon, especially any other Great Dragon.  And that makes him most unusual.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <10-07-11/0126:28>
Point...  Most dragons woke up cranky or wanted to know how to build their empire the best.

Dunkie wanted his own TV show.  And got it.

...

Well, who the hell was going to tell him, "No."?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <10-07-11/0219:33>
Kind of / sort of.  Most of the dragons went for Power -- own a big company and/or control territory.

Primarily corporate dragons are few:
This isn't to say that the rest of them don't have claws in other corporations, just that their focus isn't on building their corporation.  Not the way those two are.  Most of them go for physical territory:
Of course, many of these are clashing with Lofwyr as he spreads his corporate Power into their areas; Aden fights him by proxy fairly regularly as they strive for control over the Middle East.

A very few seem to particularly pursue either raw Power or use the mass of power they have to pursue their own agendas:
In all these, Power is the goal, or Power is the weapon; Power, first and foremost and above all, is what's going on.

Not so with Dunkelzahn.

The Big D may have acquired Power, but never openly; what he sought was Influence.  Influence over people's hearts and minds and perceptions, the way people thought (about him, about dragons, about magic, about metahumanity, just generally about the Sixth World), the direction of their research, everything.  He wanted to learn about people, why they thought the way they thought; he took a wild-hair-up-his-tail plunge in 2033 by funding a brain-trust of stock manipulators and computer programmers and helped them plan, program, and pull off a computer-driven genius stock scramble that functionally did in 63 seconds what took patient, thorough, and utterly draconic Lofwyr 20 years to do -- take over a AAA-rated megacorporation.

20 years, boiled down to 63 seconds.  That's a reduction of over ten million times.  Dunkelzahn saw how humanity moved; he learned.  He studied, he realized, he understood, and most important of all, he adapted.  This is unusual for humans; in dragons, it's bloody near unheard of.

Did he get Power from it?  Sure he did, but Power was neither his goal nor his tool.  Influence was his leverage, his raison d'etre, and learning and adapting was how he went about it -- something that the other Great Dragons, and even the Immortal Elves, simply have lost the knack of doing, either easily or well.  No, Dunkelzahn was a most abnormal dragon indeed ...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <10-07-11/0641:24>
Look...bigD was nice and all, and you compare him to other dragons like he was something superrior and that his behavior gives him some kind of edge.

Well

He is dead now, while others are still alive.

So maybe his strategy wasn`t the best one to follow...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Valashar on <10-07-11/0658:50>
He's dead because he felt the best way to secure things long term for the world in general, and yes for his own plans to have a chance to mature, was to commit physical suicide in order to fully secure the spike bridge. While I haven't read any of the novels in a LONG time, as I understand D's still more or less alive as an astral entity stuck in the body of a cyberzombie standing watch over the bridge. So yeah, he's as good as dead to the rest of the world, but he certainly took the steps to keep things rolling in his absence. It's just a matter of waiting to see if his chosen proxy/heir can continue in his stead and in his style.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <10-07-11/0811:43>
He is dead now, while others are still alive.
Dead, but not gone...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: bigity on <10-07-11/0816:02>
Yes he lives as a cyberzombie on the astral horizon.

I prefer to say he's just dead.  Besides, SR4 moved away from all that stuff it seems anyway.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <10-07-11/0849:22>
Look...bigD was nice and all, and you compare him to other dragons like he was something superrior and that his behavior gives him some kind of edge.

Well

He is dead now, while others are still alive.

So maybe his strategy wasn`t the best one to follow...

What a snarky commentary.

The Big D was -- and I do say was -- superior, and his behavior DID give him all kinds of edge.  He's dead because he chose to be, his strategy is still making people and dragons dance to his tune and head in the direction he's chosen.  Every run you take on has been influenced in some manner by Dunkelzahn.  Oh, he's not the Johnson, but if you give me a situation in SR4, especially any situation found in CGL source material, I'll lay 20:1 odds in favor of being able to find Dunkelzahn as influencing it in some manner despite having been dead for well over a decade.


Setting aside the whole cyberzombie/ghost inhabitant thing*, Dunkelzahn was and remains the single most influential impetus in the Shadowrun world.  Does that make who he was special?  Damn straight.  Understand the world's history, and you'll be better able to understand why your Johnson wants you to do what he does.




"Never think you've won until the dragon is dead AND forgotten."  -- Paraphrase from the Liaden novels.





* -- Y'know, sometimes I wonder if some of the novelists actually understood anything they were writing about ...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: bigity on <10-07-11/0941:39>
I think I understand SR's history.  I just choose to ignore the stuff from the novels (especially that trilogy).  They aren't considered canon as far as I know anyway.

So, the Big D died, which may have been part of some plan (even a plan to delay the Horrors), and it sure stirred up the other greats or other events.

The silliness of the inhabiting a cyberzombie on the edge of the astral isn't necessary for the above, so I figure I'm ok.  It may make me in the minority opinion, but that's ok.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <10-07-11/0956:17>
Ive heard a few things, here and there, about the history of SR/ED universe.

Well, if Dunkie was that good, the situation that kills him never happened. So there are other powers beyond and thinking that everyone on this world dances to Dunkies tunes if naive optimism. Sure, there are things he is able to influence even now, well, his Heir like you call him even didnt succeed to become loremaster and Draco foundation is equal amongst Atlantean foundation and some AAAs.
I understand that Dunkie was quite liked Shadowrun universe being, well he wasnt GOD inc. Just another sneaky lizzard trying to be the one whos pulling the strings, manipulating everything and everyone for some unrecognizable selfish goals, pretending to have soft spot for metahumanity. He has such spot, yes...right in his stomach, if you ask me...

He is dead now, while others are still alive.
Dead, but not gone...

Seems to be the rule for primes and powers :)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <10-07-11/1121:12>
I feel like starting the Dunkelzahn Memorial Liberation Front . . .  :P

Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Patrick Goodman on <10-07-11/1142:07>
I think I understand SR's history.  I just choose to ignore the stuff from the novels (especially that trilogy).  They aren't considered canon as far as I know anyway.
Oh, but they are. The big event novels especially. At least, that's the brief I was given when I started playing in this sandbox. That might have changed, but I don't think so.

This isn't Star Trek, where you can ignore the novels and anything not onscreen is considered non-canon...much as we might like it to be at times.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <10-07-11/1207:10>
I think I understand SR's history.  I just choose to ignore the stuff from the novels (especially that trilogy).  They aren't considered canon as far as I know anyway.
Oh, but they are. The big event novels especially. At least, that's the brief I was given when I started playing in this sandbox. That might have changed, but I don't think so.

This isn't Star Trek, where you can ignore the novels and anything not onscreen is considered non-canon...much as we might like it to be at times.
You're speaking of the Shatnerverse (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Star_Trek_novels#The_.22Shatnerverse.22)? ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: bigity on <10-07-11/1214:45>
I think I understand SR's history.  I just choose to ignore the stuff from the novels (especially that trilogy).  They aren't considered canon as far as I know anyway.
Oh, but they are. The big event novels especially. At least, that's the brief I was given when I started playing in this sandbox. That might have changed, but I don't think so.

This isn't Star Trek, where you can ignore the novels and anything not onscreen is considered non-canon...much as we might like it to be at times.


Ok so how do shapeshifters work then?  The way Stackpole wrote or the way the rules say?

Where are the rules about spirits of light?

Where are the rules about having all your cyber purged out and restoring your ability to use magic again?

Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Patrick Goodman on <10-07-11/1223:44>
This isn't Star Trek, where you can ignore the novels and anything not onscreen is considered non-canon...much as we might like it to be at times.
You're speaking of the Shatnerverse (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Star_Trek_novels#The_.22Shatnerverse.22)? ;D
Actually, as far as CBS/Paramount is concerned, none of the novels are canon. If it didn't happen on-screen, it didn't happen.

That said, yeah, the Shatnerverse is a particularly good example of why I'm glad this is....
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Patrick Goodman on <10-07-11/1235:41>
I think I understand SR's history.  I just choose to ignore the stuff from the novels (especially that trilogy).  They aren't considered canon as far as I know anyway.
Oh, but they are. The big event novels especially. At least, that's the brief I was given when I started playing in this sandbox. That might have changed, but I don't think so.

This isn't Star Trek, where you can ignore the novels and anything not onscreen is considered non-canon...much as we might like it to be at times.
Would you care for some cheese with your whine before I continue?
Quote
Ok so how do shapeshifters work then?  The way Stackpole wrote or the way the rules say?

Where are the rules about spirits of light?

Where are the rules about having all your cyber purged out and restoring your ability to use magic again?
In order, then:
On the issue of shapers: Yes.
Haven't gotten around to spirits of light, but we've had spirits of radiation so it's not a big leap.
Cyber purging: Couldn't care less.

A lot of the shit you mention, especially the early shit by Stackpole et al, didn't have a mandate to work within the rules because (and this is a presumption on my part) they understood that rules weren't the end-all be-all of exstence in the game world. They weren't so anal as people seem to want them to be. The wisdom of this decision is still open to debate.

You stated that the novels weren't canon; I stated otherwise, and gave you my mandate when I started writing for Mike Mulvihill back in the day in support of my statement. And I stand by it. To this day, that mandate has not been rescinded to my knowledge. When I write something, be it for a short story, a novella, a sourcebook, whatever, I have to accept that the events of the existing fiction actually happened. The new mandate is that my stuff has to function under the rules that were in effect when I wrote it. My stuff for SR3 had to work under SR3 rules. My current stuff has to work under SR4A rules.

I don't have to justify, in rules, things which happened 20 years ago.

You don't like it? That's fine. But to stick your head in the sand and say, "This isn't real," is asinine at best. You don't have to like the events in the novels, but if you're playing in the canon SR universe, you've got to just suck it up and accept that they happened and move on.

And, if my sig isn't enough of a disclaimer, let me state here again for the record: I speak for myself and myself alone here. I do not represent CGL or anybody working with/for them in these statements.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <10-07-11/1238:50>
Anyhow, Wolf wasn't a shapechanger or a werewolf.  He was "Blessed by the Wolf Spirit".  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: bigity on <10-07-11/1346:29>
I think I understand SR's history.  I just choose to ignore the stuff from the novels (especially that trilogy).  They aren't considered canon as far as I know anyway.
Oh, but they are. The big event novels especially. At least, that's the brief I was given when I started playing in this sandbox. That might have changed, but I don't think so.

This isn't Star Trek, where you can ignore the novels and anything not onscreen is considered non-canon...much as we might like it to be at times.
Would you care for some cheese with your whine before I continue?
Quote
Ok so how do shapeshifters work then?  The way Stackpole wrote or the way the rules say?

Where are the rules about spirits of light?

Where are the rules about having all your cyber purged out and restoring your ability to use magic again?
In order, then:
On the issue of shapers: Yes.
Haven't gotten around to spirits of light, but we've had spirits of radiation so it's not a big leap.
Cyber purging: Couldn't care less.

A lot of the shit you mention, especially the early shit by Stackpole et al, didn't have a mandate to work within the rules because (and this is a presumption on my part) they understood that rules weren't the end-all be-all of exstence in the game world. They weren't so anal as people seem to want them to be. The wisdom of this decision is still open to debate.

You stated that the novels weren't canon; I stated otherwise, and gave you my mandate when I started writing for Mike Mulvihill back in the day in support of my statement. And I stand by it. To this day, that mandate has not been rescinded to my knowledge. When I write something, be it for a short story, a novella, a sourcebook, whatever, I have to accept that the events of the existing fiction actually happened. The new mandate is that my stuff has to function under teh rules that were in effect when I wrote it. My stuff for SR3 had to work under SR3 rules. My current stuff has to work under SR4A rules.

I don't have tu justify, in rules, things which happened 20 years ago.

You don't like it? That's fine. But to stick your head in the sand and say, "This isn't real," is asinine at best. You don't have to like the events in the novels, but if you're playing in the canon SR universe, you've got to just suck it up and accept that they happened and move on.

And, if my sig isn't enough of a disclaimer, let me state here again for the record: I speak for myself and myself alone here. I do not represent CGL or anybody working with/for them in these statements.

So what is your defense on cities suddenly becoming coast cities with ports and other similiar happenings?  Does Dirk have a cyberarm or doesn't he? Just because it's a book (especially a novel), doesn't mean it's not something to fudge around or figure out a better explanation.

Again, if the whole ED/Horrors thing hadn't been mostly/apparently/somewhat dropped/toned down for SR4, I might care that previous novels had certain events occur regarding immortal elves and dragons.  As it is, I can acknowledge Dunk is dead, deal with the fallout from that, and ignore the specific circumstances that tied two different product lines together.

I'm not attacking authors here, but regarding them and editors as infallible is as asinine as it gets.

Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <10-07-11/1427:36>
that part about the war and lost continuity is painfully true, well, lets get back to the topic. Shall we?

ObviouslyLeonardo is off the list, so who else comming throught your minds? You think that guy is a shadow figure? Or is it somone with power under inkognito? AOr possible some matrix being?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Patrick Goodman on <10-07-11/1451:42>
So what is your defense on cities suddenly becoming coast cities with ports and other similiar happenings?
Don't have one. Don't need one. I didn't write that; the author of that piece can defend himself if he so chooses. I'd name names, but I don't know who wrote that chunk, so I'm gonna stay mute on specifics for the time being.

That said, it was bad research, from the looks of things, and should have been caught, but I wasn't there so I don't know what went down. If I ever write anything down in Central or South America, I'll have to deal with it, but until then, it's not actually an issue with me.
Quote
Does Dirk have a cyberarm or doesn't he?
Another one of those where I personally don't care one way or another. If I should ever do anything regarding Mr. Montgomery in future (a vanishingly remote possibility, by the way), I'll read everything he appears in and start asking a lot of people a lot of questions, and settle the issue then.

I'm not responsible for the research, good or bad, of any other writers; I do not have an encyclopedic knowledge of the game world anymore, as it's way too big and I have an outside life, and even if I did, their research is their problem. If I have the opportunity to proof something, I'll point out factual errors as I catch them, but the initial research is the author's responsibility.
Quote
Just because it's a book (especially a novel), doesn't mean it's not something to fudge around or figure out a better explanation.
Never said the books were sacred, or in many cases particularly well-written. I happen to think that a vast majority of game-related tie-in novels are utter crap, and those for Shadowrun are no exception. The writing on some of them is excruciatingly bad, and some of the events in them need some major massaging, at the very least, to make them make sense.

That doesn't change for an instant the fact that, in the baseline Shadowrun universe, those events in fact happened. Warts, Mary Sues, wretched prose, and all. Do we need to fudge around things? Oh, hell yeah. There's a ridiculous amount of stuff I fudged over when I updated Martin de Vries, for instance, and I'd do it again in a heartbeat. Do some things need a better explanation? Again, yep. And I never said otherwise.
Quote
Again, if the whole ED/Horrors thing hadn't been mostly/apparently/somewhat dropped/toned down for SR4, I might care that previous novels had certain events occur regarding immortal elves and dragons.  As it is, I can acknowledge Dunk is dead, deal with the fallout from that, and ignore the specific circumstances that tied two different product lines together.
Toned down? Yeah, for a variety of reasons, most of them bad design decisions on the part of some people who shall remain nameless (this being a personal opinion, not a statement of absolute fact; just wanna make sure that's out there).

But they were never severed, and there was never a carved-in-stone guarantee that they wouldn't be revisited. In fact, given the nature of the SR world/universe, not revisiting them would be...well, difficult. (That's not what I wanted to say, but I was asked privately to tone down some of my terminology and I'll respect that.)

And since it's long been established game-world canon, even if you want to ignore it, it doesn't mean for so much as a heartbeat that it didn't happen. Again, you don't like it, fine, but don't stick your head in the sand and insist that I have to join you.
Quote
I'm not attacking authors here, but regarding them and editors as infallible is as asinine as it gets.
Now you're making things up and saying I said them. I never said that we were infallible; I never even implied it. Hell, I can point to a number of failures I've committed in recent history, just in the stuff I've written and proofed.

What I did say, and what you're choosing not to deal with, is that while some of the novels suck, they're still canon parts of the game world and have to be dealt with. You choose to deal with them by shouting "La la la la la" a great deal, from what I'm seeing. I choose to deal with them by choosing my battles and not dealing with the stuff that irritates me, which I suppose is about the same thing.

The difference appears to be that you just decide they didn't happen. I don't have the option of doing that, doing what I'm doing. I have to deal with the game world as it is, not how I wish it was.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <10-07-11/1459:06>
So what is your defense on cities suddenly becoming coast cities with ports and other similiar happenings? 

...

I'm not attacking authors here, but regarding them and editors as infallible is as asinine as it gets.

... which city becoming a coast city with a port, etc.?

We aren't saying that past authors and their editors are infallable; poor research is poor research.  What we're saying is that the events that have happened in the novels -- Twist and his rise and fall in magic, the events and reasons for Dunkelzahn's death, all of the other stuff, are canonical to the Shadowrun World.  Avoid them in your posts, ignore them in your own game, but when you're here and talking about the SR universe, they're part of the backstory and you can't just say they didn't happen.


As much as I detest the Dragon Heart trilogy, its writing, its overblown plot, all the crap that IMO it is, when it comes to working inside the official SR universe, I have to acknowledge that it happened as written.  I do, and then I move on.  I don't stick my fingers in my ears and say 'no no no'...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: bigity on <10-07-11/1507:13>
Sounds like Patrick does what I do, and ignores what he doesn't care about or like.  So I'm not sure where you are coming from.

I'd also like to see where in any source outside of the trilogy mentions specifics about Dunk's death (specifically, the whole cyberzombie possession and blocking stuff out in astral space).  This is an ernest question, if there is shadowtalk about this, I'd like to read it (or reread it again now).
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <10-07-11/1510:00>
You know what, I believe there is a reason for the meta-argument like this. But...lets not talk about our favourite game like it is something "outside" this discussion. No. This discussion is inside the game, firmly connected with curreent game universe topics, characters a events. Lets talk aboout that, not some meta-plot things we wont change and will just adapt them in our games or not, just by our taste.

BTW: I believe the city mentioned talking about new coastline is Bogotá, (now that is really awesome bullshit, I wont be amazed that who wrote this needs a GPS navigation to find a place to piss on his toilet...)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Patrick Goodman on <10-07-11/1536:50>
Sounds like Patrick does what I do, and ignores what he doesn't care about or like.  So I'm not sure where you are coming from.
Not exactly. You ignore them, and they don't exist in your world. As I said, I don't have that luxury.

I ignore them because they don't make much difference to what I'm working on, but they still happen out there in the great big glorious whirlwind that is Shadowrun, and it's not outside the realm of possibility that they might have an impact on something I am interested in.

Bad example, but it's the one that comes to mind right now because of a project I'm working on and because I don't have a lot of my reference with me here at work: I ignore a lot of Big D's will because it doesn't have much bearing on what I write, because I write stuff in little corners of the universe that no one else is using (my little tagline to the left is not facetious, for instance). But the will is still there, and there are a couple of provisions I have to pay attention to because they do directly or indirectly affect the project I'm working on right now.

It's a bad example because I happen to think that Big D getting killed and leaving a will behind was a work of pure genius that reenergized the game line and has spawned repurcussions that are occurring to this very day. But it's an example of something I ignore a lot of the time because it has little direct relevance to my own work.

You, on the other hand, would apparently just say, "Well, I don't like Dunkelzahn leaving a will, so it never happened." I might be wrong about that, but the trend I've picked up from all of this is that you'd excise it from your universe...at which point, it makes talking about the baseline universe of the game a tad difficult.
Quote
I'd also like to see where in any source outside of the trilogy mentions specifics about Dunk's death (specifically, the whole cyberzombie possession and blocking stuff out in astral space).  This is an ernest question, if there is shadowtalk about this, I'd like to read it (or reread it again now).
In-universe substantiation of that is almost, if not entirely, nil in the game books. There are only three or four people who even know (Harlequin, Mercury, Daviar, and maybe Frosty, I forget), and none of them are particularly inclined to talk about those events. Of those four, Frosty is the only one who's a regular JackPointer, and thus the only one who would have a regular chance to comment on that in public. Again, she's not talking, and really, the opportunity for her to do so even if she was so inclined has not really arisen.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: bigity on <10-07-11/1548:45>
Oh no, Dunk's dead (apparently).  That's well covered in the game material, as was the will, ghostwalker's arrival, and the escape of the shedim from the same rift. 

However, the fact he offed himself, moved into his shiny new cyberzombie home, and powers a device that keeps the horrors at bay for now is what I redact/gloss over/ignore/don't like.  It's hard to accept the novel 'canon' at face value when it's not backed up in any game material.

At the very least it's a viable option for a table to ignore/change those specific circumstances in the novel trilogy.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <10-07-11/1634:39>
In-Universe, as far as everyone knows, he was assassinated.  Out-of-Universe, "fraggedifweknow" works just fine for me.  Some questions are best left unanswered.  *Looks hard at Inception*
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <10-07-11/1708:25>
Ok so how do shapeshifters work then?  The way Stackpole wrote or the way the rules say?
According to the rules in Fourth Edition, and depending on whether it is a PC shapeshifter or an NPC shapeshifter.

It's been mentioned before, but Stackpole's novels were written when they were still creating Shadowrun. He had the ultimate artistic license, and yet he was trumped early into the game on a number of things ranging from shapeshifters to professional baseball in the canon.

Quote
Where are the rules about spirits of light?
Unwritten. GM Discretion, one supposes. It's with the rules for making a sandwich.

There has been a long policy among line developers to keep things vague or outright unknown, and that includes rules. However, just because there are no rules for something doesn't mean it can't happen/exist in Shadowrun.

Quote
Where are the rules about having all your cyber purged out and restoring your ability to use magic again?
Unwritten. GM Discretion, again. However, you can't say that regaining magic is not canon. Dr. Miles Swineburn had burned out his magic with too many Euro Wars implants. In Portfolio of a Dragon, he gets his magic back after receiving the tarot deck Dunk left him.

In Year of the Comet SURGEing and getting the Astral Sight effect gave your character Magic 1. Period. Essence be damned. That was funny as Hell to see on a character with a quarter point of Essence left. As I recall, that is what happened to the character in question. They had cybereyes, SURGEd, and voila! New eyes. That isn't a rules thing. It's a RP thing written by the guy who wrote most of the SR2 magic rules. In fact, this is what the Astral Sight effect does:
Quote from: YotC, 140
Astral Sight (6)


The character undergoes a limited Awakening, acquiring a Magic rating of 1. This Awakening allows her to open her perceptions to the astral plane and assense, just like a magician (see Astral Perception, p. 171, SR3). She can also now learn the Magical skills of Aura Reading and Enchanting. She cannot astrally project, however, nor does she gain access to any other magical abilities or skills.


This effect cannot be applied to Awakened characters (including adepts).
So either Kenson said to Hell with the rules, that there is more to the effect that what is in YotC, it was an unpublished SURGE effect, or it was something completely different. Doesn't matter. However, I can tell you that Magic in the Shadows says that only Awakened characters can initiate and there is an interpretation that says the list in parentheses that lists full magicians, aspected magicians, and adepts is not, and could not be comprehensive. Since technically the character is Awakened (limited Awakening is still Awakening) there is an argument that I've seen successfully made that a character with astral sight can Initiate and if they are willing to eat the karma costs for buying the magician or adept Edge in-game, could become "more."


There's no rule that says you can, but there's nothing that says you can't. And while I have recently made my thoughts on authorial intent and interpretation known (http://crimsondude.tumblr.com/post/11096295373/on-writing-intent-vs-interpretation) if the guy who wrote the magic rules says it's possible and in canon it happened, that is a strong argument to make to a GM.

There were references to the physical events of the finale in Beyond the Pale with the locus in at least one sourcebook, however. Tommy Talon's adventure to whatever metaplane he was in when he crossed Ghostwalker's path is canon as of Street Legends.

As for Bogotá, there's no map, but as I recall the comment in regards to that mini-sub is not ... comprehensive. But just as a reminder this is also the game where an entire country (Luxembourg) is now part of a tri-national irradiated zone, Libya is a post-nuclear wasteland that exists solely for corporate war games, most of the Los Angeles basin (along with other chunks of California and Baja California) is underwater, an localized EMP bomb somehow crippled the Panama Canal so that Aztechnology had to go and carve a new one through Nicaragua in less than five years, and an island emerged in the middle of the Pacific Ocean one day filled with natural orichalcum.

Shadowrun is not reality. However, Patrick may be too modest to say it but the fact is that Shadowrun isn't Dr. Who. There is a canon. That canon, like all canons going back to Church canon law, which is where we get the name, is defined by arbiters: Us, the freelancers and artists (Oh, yeah. The art has been, AFAIK, canon.) as permitted by the line developers. That's why I don't mind that Lofwyr has stats. Anyone can kill him in their game, but he's not dead in the canon continuity unless we say he is.

We are like a buffet. We put out what we think will be most enjoyable and useful for your consumption, and then let you have at it. Bring in your own food if you like. However, the selection is what the selection is. Unless I'm told differently, the events of the Dragon Heart Saga are canon. You don't have to like it or use it, but that's the way it is as the game is being continually constructed even if it never comes up again.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Nath on <10-07-11/1928:48>
an localized EMP bomb somehow crippled the Panama Canal so that Aztechnology had to go and carve a new one through Nicaragua in less than five years
My understanding of System Failure (and the reading of the released material intended for the doomed Shadows of Latin America sourcebook) is that the Nicaragua Canal project was already under way when Winternight attacked the Panama Canal in 2064. So, the project may have taken up to six or seven years to complete, as the "new canal" is open in early 2070, by the time of Runner Havens.

IRL, it took twelve years to the French company to carve about a tenth of the Panama Canal (and two times more unused excavation) and only nine years to the US Army to carve the rest with late 19th-early 20th century technology. In 2006, the Nicaraguan government claimed the Nicaragua Canal project would take twelve years to complete. And that's without summoning Earth spirits and augmenting workers with muscle replacement cyberware.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <10-07-11/1936:36>
I keep hearing things like that, and thinking, "You know, if we just got a bunch of miners and let them have as much Demo as they'd like..."

But that's growing up in a mining town...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <10-07-11/2112:34>
God I hate System Failure. Not nearly as much as Loose Alliances, of course.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mason on <10-07-11/2247:05>
God I hate System Failure. Not nearly as much as Loose Alliances, of course.

Oh? Why do you hate them so much?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: ARC on <10-09-11/2343:07>
Just the generalized chaos they cause.  Probably.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <10-10-11/0009:14>
Chaos is fine.

I don't think they are good products.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <10-29-11/1135:07>
Latest post from our mysterious JackPointer is to up the count of the Phaistos Killer. Does that mean he has a connection to it, or just a connection to those that found out quicker?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <10-31-11/1224:46>
Latest post from our mysterious JackPointer is to up the count of the Phaistos Killer. Does that mean he has a connection to it, or just a connection to those that found out quicker?

What book is that from?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Nath on <10-31-11/1515:37>
Artifacts Unbound, page 36. Anonymous poster updates the victims count of the Phaistos Killer. "The Phaistos Killer" adventure is set in Denver, which may imply the anonymous poster is will informed on events as they happen in Denver (like, having contacts in the Denver law enforcement agencies).
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Chrona on <10-31-11/1549:46>
Artifacts Unbound, page 36. Anonymous poster updates the victims count of the Phaistos Killer. "The Phaistos Killer" adventure is set in Denver, which may imply the anonymous poster is will informed on events as they happen in Denver (like, having contacts in the Denver law enforcement agencies).

Or they're on The Denver Nexus... Could it be Fastjack's girl?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <10-31-11/1600:58>
Or perhaps some fragment of Mirage shacked up in some corner of the Nexus nexi?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <10-31-11/1634:56>
Or Deus could still be around.

Or perhaps it is Harlequin?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <10-31-11/1655:23>
Or Deus could still be around.
...

Please, dont say things like this. We have enought actual and future threats, why reviving this old enemy ;p
(Means: Dont say its name so loud it should be listening!!!)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <10-31-11/1717:47>
But it would be kindof cool to see Deus back. I miss the guy. All he wanted was to get away from the people who had a sword hanging over his head (metaphorically speaking), and managed to escape using the materials he had at hand. And then one of those materials tries to kill him as part of a doomsday plot.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <10-31-11/1737:25>
But it would be kindof cool to see Deus back. I miss the guy. All he wanted was to get away from the people who had a sword hanging over his head (metaphorically speaking), and managed to escape using the materials he had at hand. And then one of those materials tries to kill him as part of a doomsday plot.

Also he wants to "augment" humanity, true. We should pray for his return...stange..in English Ive almost confused "Pray" for "Prey"...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <10-31-11/1920:02>
Well, I dunno. My read of the shutdown fiasco, and what came after, was that it was Deus trying to find a way to smuggle himself out of Renraku whatever way he could. Then, he tried to make himself a god of the matrix by absorbing the Novatech IPO.

I would just like him to show up again, since it would throw a nice twist at my street samurai who was one of the Banded.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <10-31-11/2014:49>
Deus knew he had hardware he was locked into.  He knew he would continue to need 'hardware', at least for as long as it took him to recompile and fully change from a single-site AI to a distributed-processing AI.  The brain linkage tests in the Arcology were experiments to discover if human brains were capable of being reprogrammed at a sophisticated enough level to carry his decompiled code and, with sufficient numbers of them linked online, to reassemble him outside his prison cell -- the Arcology.

All of the other experiments -- armoring people up, making them quicker, etc. etc., and having the Blues use them for target practice -- were to ensure those brains' survivability.  Remember that after every 'test firing' (i.e. Blues target practice), the shot-up victims were tested for brain functionality, and compared against their previous levels ...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <10-31-11/2020:41>
Exactly. Deus didn't do all that for kicks, or out of some idea of creating metahuman drones or cybermen. He did it to try and escape the Arcology, in part because someone put a killswitch on his hardware, and when he got to be aware, Deus decided he didn't like having a gun to his head.

People focus on WHAT Deus did, but forget about WHY he did it. Much like the situation with Puck. An intelligent being, in a bad situation, will grasp at any straw to try and pull themselves out.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <10-31-11/2023:01>
well IMO it was only a question of time before he find out, that with enought people connected to network, he can simply exist without hardware...using just reprogramed bio-computers we are born with, usin its whole capacity. This wetware would be cheaper, safer and more effective than any hardware possible built.
I am Deus, and we are many
...evryone else would be eliminated, reproduction cycle would be strictly controlled and potential malfunctions avoided before birth. bright and smart future for humanity...Omega point.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <10-31-11/2249:23>
... I wanted to say something really mean, but my rep can't take the five-point hit that'd result.

Sorry, Sichr, but -- what?!?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <11-01-11/0403:25>
 ;D
Don`t wory about a rep score, Im not the simitting guy, because I know that there are truths others than mine. Just be honest ;)

I`m talkink about possible scenario and the reason I would be very unhappy if Deus is reborn again.
If it finds a way to survive in human brainz, Deus may find out that he don`t need to return to the hardware once it is out of arcology. It has milions of possible carriers outthere just waiting to be "reprogrammed"... Hell it even choses the name DEUS. Thinking that it would possibly leave metahumanity live in peace is...naive?

And for justification of Deus motives...yes, that argument is really valid. For example Hitler also wanted the world to be a bettter place, with no Jews, Slavs...everybody should be equal in his mind...Ein reich, Ein volk, Ein fuhrer...so his motives make him such a nice guy...he should have been born with such a gun pointed to his brain and the world really wold be a better place...without him. But that`s the history...

And for that Omega point reference...datasearch begins here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teilhard_de_Chardin

:)
Good morning everyone
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <11-01-11/1757:17>
Or perhaps it is Harlequin?
No need for such trickery from him, as i suspect he could get a invite from Fastjack at any time. This especially as Frosty is already present.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-01-11/1954:48>
Not with Bull around.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <11-01-11/2151:43>
Not with Bull around.
Even with Bull around. I mean, Clockwork and Netcat are both still on. Pistons and Haze. Ma'Fan and Mika. Etc, etc, etc.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <11-01-11/2211:12>
I would love to see Harlequin on Jackpoint. Or new adventures with him.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-01-11/2255:36>
I think everyone here wants to see more of Harley.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <11-02-11/0238:57>
Not with Bull around.
Even with Bull around. I mean, Clockwork and Netcat are both still on. Pistons and Haze. Ma'Fan and Mika. Etc, etc, etc.
Absolutely.  It isn't 'The Bullring'; it's Jackpoint.  The opinion that matters is Fastjack's, and Jackpoint is not a democracy, it's a benevolent dictatorship.  For all that Bull the Character is becoming a Big Man in Seattle, and Bull the Player/Writer is a Significant Individual in the direction of the game universe, certain things will still evolve, personal preferences notwithstanding.

Until Bull buys the company, of course.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-02-11/0858:34>
Benevolent Dictatorship?  And here I was thinking FastJack was the last of the Neo-@s.  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <11-02-11/1832:55>
Which means that he'll listen to the majority's opinion, but since it's his place, his own judgement -- and his sense of rightness and of what Jackpoint needs -- outweighs everyone.  Witness the continuing presence of both Netcat (right?  the technomancer?) and the guy who tried to turn her in.  (Gahh, so bad with names ...)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <11-02-11/1846:42>
You're thinking of Clockwork. And yes, the fact that they are both on the site, despite the fact that Clockwork is almost rabidly anti-emerged is a testament to Fastjack allowing things to play out. Or with Haze still being around. Or letting in people like Plan 9 and /dev/grrl.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-02-11/2103:42>
I think he let in Plan 9 for laughs, and /dev/grrl...  ...  ...  OK, I'm clueless here.  But probably she reminds him of a really young him, and needs a lot of guidance considering her Corporate Blinders.

As for Clockwork, officially that was a "Did not break the rules of JackPoint" thing.  I think he added a "Don't track other members of JackPoint" to the rules afterwards.  Probably waited until a few people were able to Punch The Clock while off the clock, if you catch my meaning.  ;)

There's also an unofficial rule that if two 'runners shack up because of JackPoint, they should send a lonely old man pictures or a 'trid.  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <11-02-11/2126:42>
The rule is that you don't track anyone THROUGH Jackpoint. You find another way to track them down, that's fine, as evidenced by the time Netcat hacked Slam-O!'s system and broadcast trid of him dancing in his undies to all of Jackpoint.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <11-02-11/2254:23>
Jumping in with a few comments :

1)  Events and storylines from novels are canon.  Smaller, specific details from them may not be (The dwarf who goblinized in Shadowboxer, for example).  Also, NEVER try and interpret game rules from the novels.  Just the way it works.

2)  Wolf was, effectively, a combination Physical Adept and Shaman.  Stackpoles stories were written while the game was still being worked on and defined.  To my mind, Wolf is what I've long called a Shamanic Adept, a Phys Ad that follows a totem, and manifests a "Mask" when he activates his adept powers.  One of these days, I'll get around to writing rules for this up (Or talk Rusty into it, since he's such a big Adept fan)

3)  Bull the Ork Decker has a major beef with Harley.  but lets face it, at the end of the day, the worst Bull can do to the elf is ruin his credit rating.  Bull knows Harley is very powerful and can do magic that most mages can't do, but doesn't really know anything about his immortal status.  Sure, Bull might catch Harley by surprise, but if the Immortal Elves don't have a crapload of anchored spells on them to protect themselves, they'd have been killed off long ago.  And an Anchored Force 20 Barrier with a "Detect Bullet" type spell attached to it will stop even Bull's beloved PAC.

Bull the Writer, on the other hand, loves to hate Harley, and would hate it if he was really dead.  I love to hate the little blighter.  though if Harley started posting to Jackpoint, I bet Slamm-0! would love it, since it would redirect the ork a little, and he wouldn't get picked on so much :) (I don't know, I find it so much fun to have Bull and Slammy sniping at each other.  I'm hoping one of these days that we'll find a place for Slamm-0! to get revenge on Bull for dumpshocking his ass in Street Legends :))

Bull
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <11-02-11/2300:43>
I think he let in Plan 9 for laughs, and /dev/grrl...  ...  ...  OK, I'm clueless here.

Both are easy, though the gamer in us doesn't always see it.

If reading Shadowland postings for the last 20 years has taught us ANYTHING, it's to never dismiss the really crazy posters.  Sure, a lot of it's drek.  but if you ignore all of it, you might miss the next Bug invasion.  Or Dragon assasination.  Hell, even though no one believed it, Lone Gunman posted the truth about the Immortal Elves, and I bet Fastjack knows this.  You let in a couple folks like Plan 9 because when you filter through all the crazy, there's some kernals of truth there that can be VERY valuable.

As for Dev/grrl/...  She's the next generation of 'Runner.  Some day, she's going to be running Jackpoint, and 'Jack is smart enough to know it.

And of course as writers, both are incredibly valuable.  Plan 9 serves as our "truthsayer", the guy who can reveal the deep dark secrets to the reader, but gets dismissed as a nutjob by the other characters in the fiction.  And dev/grrl/ serves as our newbie, our reader stand in.  She's the one that can ask the stupid questions to let the other characters give more exposition without sounding like they're just giving a lecture.

We've always had these cahracters, by one name or another, and we always need them.  Both in the fiction, and out of it.

As for A. Nonymous...  Yeah, I wanna know who the hell he is too :)

Bull
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <11-03-11/0418:46>
As for Dev/grrl/...  She's the next generation of 'Runner.  Some day, she's going to be running Jackpoint, and 'Jack is smart enough to know it.
......

Only if she lives to taht day. Runners die...quite often...and Shadows wont be such a dangerous and paranoid place as they are, if if this danger applies only for PC`s...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <11-03-11/0805:09>
As for Dev/grrl/...  She's the next generation of 'Runner.  Some day, she's going to be running Jackpoint, and 'Jack is smart enough to know it.
Pfft... Leonization means 'Jack will be around a long, long time. That is, until he gets sick of the shadows and wants to come into the light. But I don't think that will happen. ;)
We've always had these cahracters, by one name or another, and we always need them.  Both in the fiction, and out of it.
I still want to know what happened to Bung and GnuB.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-03-11/1127:09>
What's FastJack (No, not you, the other one!) going to do?  Go out, do a 8-8/6 day a week job as a Spider?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <11-03-11/1241:38>
What's FastJack (No, not you, the other one!) going to do?  Go out, do a 8-8/6 day a week job as a Spider?
Who says he isn't already? ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <11-03-11/1247:42>
The rule is that you don't track anyone THROUGH Jackpoint. You find another way to track them down, that's fine, as evidenced by the time Netcat hacked Slam-O!'s system and broadcast trid of him dancing in his undies to all of Jackpoint.
huh?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <11-03-11/1334:30>
What's FastJack (No, not you, the other one!) going to do?  Go out, do a 8-8/6 day a week job as a Spider?
Who says he isn't already? ;)

Well, running Jackpoint is not a paid job IMO...unless there is some kind of donor that remains hidden, someone Anonymous ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-03-11/1412:20>
Or FastJack (You know which one I'm talking about!) listened to the Chrome Accountant and is on a neighboring island with many beautiful people...  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: ARC on <11-03-11/1505:05>
The rule is that you don't track anyone THROUGH Jackpoint. You find another way to track them down, that's fine, as evidenced by the time Netcat hacked Slam-O!'s system and broadcast trid of him dancing in his undies to all of Jackpoint.
huh?

In Emergence Slamm-0 used Jackpoint to send TM Hunters after Netcat.  She retaliated.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <11-03-11/1506:48>
Or FastJack (You know which one I'm talking about!) listened to the Chrome Accountant and is on a neighboring island with many beautiful people...  ;D

Chrome Accountant...well...we all should listen to his advices :)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Digital_Viking on <11-03-11/1534:42>
In Emergence Slamm-0 used Jackpoint to send TM Hunters after Netcat.  She retaliated.
That was Clockwork who sold Netcat out.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <11-03-11/1542:50>
In Emergence Slamm-0 used Jackpoint to send TM Hunters after Netcat.  She retaliated.
That was Clockwork who sold Netcat out.
And he didn't use Jackpoint. He tracked her outside of the network.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: ARC on <11-03-11/1545:30>
In Emergence Slamm-0 used Jackpoint to send TM Hunters after Netcat.  She retaliated.
That was Clockwork who sold Netcat out.
And he didn't use Jackpoint. He tracked her outside of the network.

 I stand corrected, now I'm just as lost though.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <11-03-11/1828:36>
In Vice, Netcat posted the following:

Quote from: Vice, pg 172
To: Fianchetto
From : NetCat
Missed One Dangerous Criminal, Fianchetto:
Slamm-0!
Background: I would describe to you some of the many cases that Slamm-0! has supposedly done, but all I found are bots and malware doing the work, and him taking the credit. I can’t even call him a data pirate, as he shops at file sharing nodes like GamersUnite!
Modus Operandi: I couldn’t find his handiwork in a mysterious slippage of odds at Grid 19 for a football game that worked out in his favor. Nor could I find any truth to the rumored cartoonish display hack on MCT’s OS software a few years ago. And I definitely could find nothing about the recent run on Ares, where someone rode a lab rat’s secret online love notes to an undisclosed lab location and pulled out a pair of SOTA autosoft specs that are so advanced they might have come from aliens.
Psych Profile: Childish and arrogant with a God complex.
Description: He’s a young, ill-tempered, wannabe hacker who thinks he’s a hot shit knowledge master on so many subjects, but we all know it’s bullshit. Slamm-0! just sits around in his apartment in his boxers watching live-action anime [Photos from his Cleaning Drone]. And no FastJack, I didn’t trace him from JackPoint.
Known Aliases: I think it took him about five years to come up with the Slamm-0! alias, so we can’t expect a new one from him for a while.
Known Associates/Connections: Can’t find anyone who would say that they have worked with Slamm-0!
Last Known Location: JackPoint
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-03-11/2143:25>
You'd think they were married already.  :P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Valashar on <11-03-11/2326:24>
First comes Roomba spying, then comes U-Dub drone hockey, then comes Eye of the Needle footsie leading to the need for a baby carriage.  ::)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-03-11/2329:06>
Wonder if they sent a 'trid recording to FastJack as he asked.  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <11-04-11/0520:15>
You'd think they were married already.  :P

Exactly what I thought when I read that...tohose women. They just cannot say things straight, no matter how resonant they are :)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Phylos Fett on <11-04-11/0716:30>
I think he let in Plan 9 for laughs, and /dev/grrl...  ...  ...  OK, I'm clueless here.

Both are easy, though the gamer in us doesn't always see it.

If reading Shadowland postings for the last 20 years has taught us ANYTHING, it's to never dismiss the really crazy posters.  Sure, a lot of it's drek.  but if you ignore all of it, you might miss the next Bug invasion.  Or Dragon assasination.  Hell, even though no one believed it, Lone Gunman posted the truth about the Immortal Elves, and I bet Fastjack knows this.  You let in a couple folks like Plan 9 because when you filter through all the crazy, there's some kernals of truth there that can be VERY valuable.

As for Dev/grrl/...  She's the next generation of 'Runner.  Some day, she's going to be running Jackpoint, and 'Jack is smart enough to know it.

And of course as writers, both are incredibly valuable.  Plan 9 serves as our "truthsayer", the guy who can reveal the deep dark secrets to the reader, but gets dismissed as a nutjob by the other characters in the fiction.  And dev/grrl/ serves as our newbie, our reader stand in.  She's the one that can ask the stupid questions to let the other characters give more exposition without sounding like they're just giving a lecture.

We've always had these cahracters, by one name or another, and we always need them.  Both in the fiction, and out of it.

As for A. Nonymous...  Yeah, I wanna know who the hell he is too :)

Bull

That's some good insight there, Bull.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <11-04-11/1152:10>
You'd think they were married already.  :P
That would produce a record somewhere, as marriage is basically a declaration of who can legally inherit either party of the union (not that one party had much in terms of inheritance for much of recorded history). It is one very convoluted social institution...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-04-11/1200:12>
I'm sure there's more than one "Man Of The Cloth" in the Shadows that doesn't have a SIN.  :P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <11-04-11/1304:49>
I'm sure there's more than one "Man Of The Cloth" in the Shadows that doesn't have a SIN.  :P
Great. Now I'm picturing Plan 9 officiating at the nuptials.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <11-04-11/1309:17>
THAT is a ceremony I'd pay to see.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-04-11/1558:39>
I'm sure there's more than one "Man Of The Cloth" in the Shadows that doesn't have a SIN.  :P
Great. Now I'm picturing Plan 9 officiating at the nuptials.
I could see Kane doing it.  ;D

"You wanna be hitched?"  "Yes."  "You wanna be hitched?"  "Yes."  "Good.  Kiss.  Where's the booze?"
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: ARC on <11-04-11/1610:11>
I'm sure there's more than one "Man Of The Cloth" in the Shadows that doesn't have a SIN.  :P
Great. Now I'm picturing Plan 9 officiating at the nuptials.
I could see Kane doing it.  ;D

"You wanna be hitched?"  "Yes."  "You wanna be hitched?"  "Yes."  "Good.  Kiss.  Where's the booze?"

Or maybe...

"Do you?"  " Yes!"  "Do you?"  "Yes!"  "I now pronounce you--"  "WAIT..."  "It's Dunklezahn!  Back from the Dead!"
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: wizard_of_ozzy on <11-06-11/1937:44>
Ok so wait...wait. I haven't read any of the novels so let me try to wrap my brain around the Big D parts. Dragon commits suicide, his ghost possess a cyberzombie that is now standing on the edge of astral space waiting for alien demon spirit things to show their faces so he can kick their ass? Isn't that stretching a bit into CthuluTech H.P Lovecraft territory?

Duh, CthuluTech came after Shadowrun. Egg on my face.

Back on topic.

So the idea that it's Netcat's baby is kinda weird. It's a baby so it doesn't know how to read or write, so it can't be him/her responding to the posts. Unless it's Deus possessing the baby. Or someone using the baby as some sort of living anonymizer? I suppose it's possible, depending on how many months pregnant Netcat was when the anonymous poster first appeared.

Personally I hope it's someone new, someone that just wants to eff up FastJack's life. Something simple, since I don't like big conspiracy theories. I may be alone in this but I hope it's a kid FastJack never knew he had. And now he seeks vengeance! But maybe I've just been watching too many soap opera's lately. A technomancer seems the most likely culprit, someone that knows how to use their powers to their fullest without actually knowing the ins-and-outs of a commlink itself. And FastJack already popped out one VK so who knows?

And if it turns out to be Dracula like Charybdis suggested then I'd be happy to no end.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-06-11/2204:28>
The Horrors are H.P. Lovecraft on Hallucinogenics.  So it's not so strange to have Dunkie do such a thing.

As for the Spawn of Slamm-0! being the poster, I was mostly joking when suggesting that.  (S)He's very immature for such a thing.  More likely to do fingerpainting all over the background.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <11-07-11/0110:59>
Leading contenders are, IIRC, Captain Chaos (Which I always pronounce in the old 'Captain Caveman' voice), Alice (Alice Haeffner), one of the known AIs, Pyramid Watcher, or ... crud. SOmeone whose name I just blanked on. Grid Reaper? No...

Ackl.

At any rate, I have a guess (Not a theory, mind, just a guess!) which 've passed on, but won't chat about in case I'm right.

I will go ahead, however, and ask who the crowd would rate as the top, say, ten known Deckers.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <11-07-11/0521:25>
It's a baby so it doesn't know how to read or write, so it can't be him/her responding to the posts.
Keep in mind that the format we see and the posters see are two very different ones. Hell, thanks to text to speech and heavy use of iconography a large part of the SR population is functionally illiterate. Basically, shadowland and jackpoint are more like virtual speakeasies where vr personas gather and mingle. On that note, i do wonder what appearance the persona of our mystery guest takes on. The featureless humanoid perhaps?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <11-07-11/0531:02>
The Horrors are H.P. Lovecraft on Hallucinogenics.  So it's not so strange to have Dunkie do such a thing.

As for the Spawn of Slamm-0! being the poster, I was mostly joking when suggesting that.  (S)He's very immature for such a thing.  More likely to do fingerpainting all over the background.
unless we are seeing the digital equivalent of a pre-born...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <11-07-11/0629:27>
And what abou Nadia Daviar? She may have this kind of insight, and she has not been heard about since crash IMO...makes me wander of two possible things...she became ghost in the machine, or she emerged...and since there is no body (or nothing is nown about its location), Id vote for second option...
Appearing on jackpoint may be good way to influence chain of events to whatever the result is demanded...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <11-07-11/0637:33>
She seems to have walked in the door at the draco foundation recently...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <11-07-11/0653:16>
She seems to have walked in the door at the draco foundation recently...

REALLY? What source if I may ask, real NEW for me...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Netzgeist on <11-07-11/0717:15>
Street Legends, I guess. Also, she couldn't emerge, since she is an adept.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <11-07-11/0819:09>
Street Legends, I guess. Also, she couldn't emerge, since she is an adept.

I lack any more datailed info on her, even the fasct she was adept is new for me...IDN now i maybe recall something from Portfolio or Dragons of the 6th world but Im not sure at all. Strret legends Ive bought...Id better read it. I thought it may had been in Artifacts: Unbound, since Im running second artifacts adventure with my players this evenoing (at least the start of it) I also didnt had aenought time to read it all..
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <11-07-11/0820:29>
Leading contenders are, IIRC, Captain Chaos (Which I always pronounce in the old 'Captain Caveman' voice), Alice (Alice Haeffner), one of the known AIs, Pyramid Watcher, or ... crud. SOmeone whose name I just blanked on. Grid Reaper? No...

Ackl.

At any rate, I have a guess (Not a theory, mind, just a guess!) which 've passed on, but won't chat about in case I'm right.

I will go ahead, however, and ask who the crowd would rate as the top, say, ten known Deckers.
It is most definitely NOT Captain Chaos (no matter how much I begged and pleaded for it to be him...)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <11-07-11/1007:11>
She seems to have walked in the door at the draco foundation recently...

REALLY? What source if I may ask, real NEW for me...

Try Street Legends!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <11-07-11/1051:17>
Fantastic book, it is! Leafing through the PDF, there was just too much *stuff* that I wanted tor ead, so I went ahead and ordered me a copy (Along with the new Black Book and the boxed set) so I can actually *peruse* it on a regular basis.

Every entry has at least one thing that made me go "There's a plot seed I need to make a run about", and the characters themsleves are much more interesting than the old Prime Runners by far.

I'd love to see a companion piece on "Rookie Runners" sometimes, people that look like they might be 'draft picks' in essence and could turn into Street Legends down the road.

Admitedly, it's because I really want to write up /Dev/Grrl, but not *just* because of that.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Malathis on <11-07-11/1145:57>
Going back a few pages,

I'm not sure if it's in System Failure or Emergence, but there is a short bit that aludes to the 3 AI's being around still, I want to say it's near the end of one of the two books.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-07-11/1147:49>
]It is most definitely NOT Captain Chaos (no matter how much I begged and pleaded for it to be him...)
:'(

*Pours a 40 on the curb*
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <11-07-11/1321:24>
Well, there are a lot more than three AIs running around out there now. But I do think I remember reading that three of the original ones had managed to stay alive somehow. (Probably by retreating into an isolated system and shutting down for a while).
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: wizard_of_ozzy on <11-07-11/1628:13>
unless we are seeing the digital equivalent of a pre-born...
So the question is: when did the kid start hating dragons? And when did (s)he start working for Horizon? If the children's books that his/her parents read to him/her are made by Horizon then, BAM, smoking gun right there.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Fizzygoo on <11-07-11/1657:52>
Quote from: Spy Games, p. 136
Great dragons and their ilk have yet to accept that the world moves faster than them, and it has no regard for their plans. They may think long-term, but humans are unpredictable and a bit crazy. We’ve also been playing this game for millennia without end.

I think, out of all the A. Nonymous posts (so far), that is the most revealing quote. So much so, that even though this is in the Secret History section, I'm still going to throw a spoiler cloak around the rest of my thoughts...

[spoiler]
The sheer level of "let's bring dragons down a notch" in nearly every post about dragons by this person heavily points towards an immortal elf. But specifically for the quote above, the use of "We've also" allows for the "we" being referenced to sever itself from the "humans" in the previous sentence. If the author had said "And we've" or "Who have" then it would clearly be a reference to the "humans." But with "We've also," "also" designates another set, another group; not humans and not dragons. And it points to "this game"...the game is "long-term" thinking. Who else thinks long-term like dragons...the immortal elves. "We, Immortal Elves, also play the game of long-term thinking for thousands of years." The use of the phrase "millennia without end" is, almost without a doubt---or with 95% certainty, a reference to the novel Worlds Without End...about immortal elves in general and Aina & Harlequin in particular. That quote is the core to my argument that it's Harlequin...below are how the other quotes fit with that hypothesis.

Aina's turned up dead. And Harlequin's always been a bit more outspoken than the rest of the IEs.

Next, with the poster being anonymous and for the past couple of years Anonymous using the Guy Fawkes mask, there's a Harlequin-esq image association there. 

While the question;
Quote from: Spy Games, p. 152
Computers are optical now, right? How can they have a magnetic field?
Made me think of Leonardo, but if taken from the perspective of 2070s JackPoint posters it's quite sarcastic, which is right up Harlequin's posting MO.

Harlequin's always had an interest in Azt-lan/technology, especially since Mr. Darke was hanging out with them back in the day. And the War! quote (pg 83) about drug dealers and prostitutes fits in with his man-of-the-streets/shadows - not afraid to hang out at the bottom rung - style.

I've played around with the numbers in the "dose: numbers" quote and at this point, I think it's supposed to be gibberish, a kind of crazy response to Plan 9's rantings. Things I've tried; Can't be lat/long (terrestrial or astronomical), as it should only be two sets of 3 numbers (6 total) but there's 9 and also 250 and 905 rule that out. 905 also rules out them being atomic weights. 905 also rules out it there being some IP address hidden in there, like an Easter Egg website to check out. With 9 numbers they could correspond to the 9 letters in Harlequin's name, so I assumed each number counted up the English Alphabet and every time it reaches Z, then start back at the beginning, (so 27 = A, 28 = B, and so on). But that results in P, J, A, S, N, N, U, F, T and I thought of shifting the letters by some number X to try to match them up, but the double N's means there would always be two letters the same, which Harlequin doesn't have and his other common names, Har'lea'quinn, Caimbuel, or Quentin 'Quinn' Harlech have more or less than 9 letters. I tried just using the name of the language for each number; English, English, Spanish, Spanish, Italian, Italian, Norwegian, Norwegian, Italian, (Russian end) first letter of each gives EESSIINNI (R). Killing off the double's and you get (cutely) ESINI(R) which could mean E-sinner...but that's a stretch. The numbers themselves add up to 1473 and AD or BC doesn't ring any bells (other than Hatshepsut's rule starting in the BC, and Copernicus born in the AD...there may be something in Worlds Without End, but I don't think so as the middle ages portions of the book are mostly around Queen Elizabeth's era in the mid-to-late 1500s). None of the numbers share a common denominator. Multiplying them gives 3,598,630,416,000,000 which if you divide by seconds/min, minutes/hr, hours/day, and days/year gives 114,111,821.92. dividing that by years/magic cycle gives 22,265.72...again, not seeing anything which just leads me to think the poster is playing a joke on Plan 9's conspiracy-pattern mind, which I can see Harlequin doing. But, of course, I could be missing something.

The "Horizon is good for the soul" could be serious, but based off all other comments, the anti-media stuff, etc., it sounds sarcastic in that light.

The near insider knowledge on SK-Prime operatives and Dunk's watchers point to deep connections and insights...something Harlequin definitely has, especially if one wonders what he's been doing with his time since Crash 2.0.

Harlequin would also be very interested in the Horizon - Tír Tairngire - Hestaby dealings (as would other IEs). But again, the level of sarcasm and general attitude in the posts, leads one away from the "refined and snooty" attitude of most of the other IEs.

The Artifacts Unbound "Thirty-two" ... don't have the book yet, so I can comment yet as I don't know what it's in reply to.

So that's my argument for it being Harlequin using the quotes alone. Outside the quotes, in the real world, it's been a long time since Harlequin's shown himself to the shadow-public (though he's been mentioned in some fiction pieces, notably Dusk's intro) and given there are rumors and hints among the developers and writers that Harlequin might show up more heavily I think this would also be a perfect way to seed Harlequin into the books without hitting the SR Universe over the head with him...it fits well with the "IEs need to take a backseat for a bit" idea and if anyone's going to be an outspoken backseat driver, it's Harlequin.
[/spoiler]
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-07-11/1716:00>
unless we are seeing the digital equivalent of a pre-born...
So the question is: when did the kid start hating dragons? And when did (s)he start working for Horizon? If the children's books that his/her parents read to him/her are made by Horizon then, BAM, smoking gun right there.
Grandma and Grandpa Slamm-0! would smack the stupid out of the two parents for something like that.  Good, old fashioned Neo-@ Literature is what the little one needs.  And sugar.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: wizard_of_ozzy on <11-07-11/1720:23>
The numbers might not mean just one thing. They could be any combinations of dates, times, locations. I haven't read any of the pre-SR4 books or novels so I can't comment on the Harlequin or immortal elves stuff. The "32" quote is from a serial killer that was stalking Denver. The other shadowrunners thought there were 31 victims but (s)he corrected them. The serial killer was an elf that was trying to reach immortality.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: beowulf_of_wa on <11-07-11/1805:50>
book and page #'s?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: wizard_of_ozzy on <11-07-11/1819:14>
The book is Artifacts Unbound, pg. 36.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: beowulf_of_wa on <11-07-11/1835:56>
nah,

could the numbers in various tongues be book and page #'s

aside from that, FJ, who is or isn't on the list, or is on the list but not likely to be A. non?
like early on you said slamm-o was off the list for not being as sneaky as he seems to think he is.  and so forth?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-07-11/1840:02>
So far, it's not the baby, Captain Chaos, or Dunkie.

...

HOW THE HELL DID THAT GROUP OF PEOPLE END UP IN THE SAME SENTENCE???   :o
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <11-07-11/1843:30>
All things considered, I think I'm sticking with either a) Nadja Daviar (who says it has to be an otaku technomancer who's hacking in?), b) an Immortal Elf (likewise, with my choices being Ehran the Scribe, Harlequinn, or, actually, Aina Dupree -- what, you thought that was her actual body??), or c) an unknown, and we're waiting on the Reveal.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: wizard_of_ozzy on <11-07-11/1845:42>
So far, it's not the baby, Captain Chaos, or Dunkie.

...

HOW THE HELL DID THAT GROUP OF PEOPLE END UP IN THE SAME SENTENCE???   :o
Because VK babies, ghost-dragons and E-ghosts would make the best group of Shadowrunners ever?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-07-11/1847:09>
Because VK babies, ghost-dragons and E-ghosts would make the best group of Shadowrunners ever?
...

...

...

The awesome of that team cannot be contained by reality!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: wizard_of_ozzy on <11-07-11/1849:03>
They'll need a Face though, to handle the business side of things. And to change the baby's diapers.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Zilfer on <11-07-11/1854:14>
Don't know if Harlequin could pull off a face.... xD
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: beowulf_of_wa on <11-07-11/1856:56>
literally, it should be no problem for him. figuratively, might be a stretch to keep his snark under control.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-07-11/1857:09>
Don't know if Harlequin could pull off a face.... xD
Hey, if The Joker can pull off being a Face...  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: beowulf_of_wa on <11-07-11/1900:25>
if john travolta can pull off a face,,,,
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: kirk on <11-07-11/1901:41>
Don't know if Harlequin could pull off a face.... xD
Hey, if The Joker can pull off being a Face...  ;D
choke.

Sorry, on my first read I saw:
 Hey, if the Joker can pull off a Face...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Zilfer on <11-07-11/1916:20>
Don't know if Harlequin could pull off a face.... xD
Hey, if The Joker can pull off being a Face...  ;D
choke.

Sorry, on my first read I saw:
 Hey, if the Joker can pull off a Face...

Gah, the puns! :P

Well John and the Joker can have a Face Off for the spot then. :P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-07-11/1916:44>
< Hamill >"Pull off a Face?  Of course I can!  I can wear it, too!  What do you think, would I look good in Caucasian or Asian?  HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA!!!  HEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHEHE...  Heh.  Heh.  ...  Heh"< /Hamill >
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <11-07-11/2229:37>
So far, it's not the baby, Captain Chaos, or Dunkie.

...

HOW THE HELL DID THAT GROUP OF PEOPLE END UP IN THE SAME SENTENCE???   :o

I should PM you my stab at it, see if you think I'm on the right track.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <11-07-11/2346:06>
Honestly, I don't think it's any known immortal. Now, Crusader, mentioned in the Praxis short story in Artifacts Unbound?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: wizard_of_ozzy on <11-07-11/2357:38>
After reading Artifacts Unbound I think it was Frosty that sold out JackPoint to Horizon at Harlequin's command (for what reasons I'm not 100% sure on that). Is the story Kelvin mentioned about Frosty in any of the novels?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <11-08-11/0052:32>
Heh
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Fizzygoo on <11-08-11/0058:27>
Heh

I ha your "heh" and then I lol a bit.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <11-08-11/0402:37>
BAH!

Spoiler for the end of Loose Ends/I Am Legion/The Prestige serial in Street Legends. I assumed someone would have noticed this by now.

[spoiler]
Nadja Daviar knows about JackPoint.

Quote from: Street Legends, 169
It represented Rory, and she brought him closer, creating a direct link between the spy and herself, bypassing the Nadjas, the Watchers, allies at JackPoint, her connections in Argus,
[/spoiler]

Maybe this'll learn ya to read the stories.




Thomas Roxborough should almost certainly know about JackPoint. His hated ex-wife, KAM (Dr. Kristine Martin), was a guest user. I have no doubt he has people watching her 24/7.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <11-08-11/0503:38>
Spoiler for the end of Loose Ends/I Am Legion/The Prestige serial in Street Legends. I assumed someone would have noticed this by now.
[spoiler]
Nadja Daviar knows about JackPoint.
[/spoiler]
All things considered, I think I'm sticking with either a) Nadja Daviar (who says it has to be an otaku technomancer who's hacking in?), b) an Immortal Elf (likewise, with my choices being Ehran the Scribe, Harlequinn, or, actually, Aina Dupree -- what, you thought that was her actual body??), or c) an unknown, and we're waiting on the Reveal.

So I suppose I should clarify -- a Nadja could be A. Nonymous.  (Hey, Nony Nony ...)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <11-08-11/0604:18>
Ugh, the spoiler implementation in this forum is annoying...

Yea, going back over the postings the kid is out (in more ways then one, given the rugrat reference from Netcat in Unbound).
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Fizzygoo on <11-08-11/2301:27>
The main reason that I don't think that the unknown poster is Nadja Daviar is "tone."

The poster says, "shit rolls down hill," "Mmmm. Mmmm Good," and "[Hestaby] is a media whore," which doesn't "sound" like Daviar...but then again having been the voice of D who can say if she was ever even allowed to voice her own thoughts during that time. But the "Computers are optical now, right?" quote just doesn't jive for me as something Daviar would say, even sarcastically. Harlequin on the other hand...all of it fits his style.

The other thing that stops me from thinking that it's Daviar is the anti-dragon rant, "In the end, all great dragons are cold-blooded. It’s their nature. Assuming or believing anything else is just believing in a lie." But I realize that's just my inner fanboy for Dunkie talking. Still, I wouldn't expect Daviar to have that point of view (especially if she ever was aware of the Big D death's as him sacrificing himself for the protection of metahumanity). It comes across as contrary to a scene out of The Prestige in SL,
Quote
"Dunkelzahn is dead," Nadja said with a voice hardened in a way Rory understood perfectly. He stopped smiling, "I seem to be the only person to truly understand that our actions are his legacy. It is not what we think he wanted that matters, but what we do with what he left us."

Of course it could always be a case of misdirection; using tone, style, etc. that isn't consistent with the known style of the individual making the posts...but making that assumption makes the mystery nearly impossible to solve...unless the falsified style is in the style of some other known individual, such as Dawkins Group posting as if they were Harlequin (an example only).

The one thing that I'm unsure of is whether Daviar has ever been confirmed to be an immortal. I don't think she has and thought there was some reference to someone finding out she spent time in an European orphanage in her youth (not that that couldn't have been falsified of course). But after a quick search I couldn't find the book so I may just be getting things mixed up. Does anyone know if there's a canon source indicated/alluding to Daviar being an immortal (or not being one)?

On the other hand, Daviar would have interests in nearly every post, from Azzies to dragons...but it just seems more in the style of Harlequin. Even the "Art exists for its own end," media-piracy sounds Harlequinesq.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: rasmusnicolaj on <11-09-11/0049:39>
Good deducting and reasoning  :)

Is Harlequin enough of a hacker to pull it off though? Can he sit still long enough to learn to be really, really good at computers? I know he is a very acomplished jack of all trades but I just have difficulty seeing him as a expert hacker.

Rasmus
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-09-11/0052:43>
He could just have found the guys that made Pocket Hacker and threw money, artifacts, paydata at them until they made him a ice pick that could get him access to The JackPoint...

Or, you know, just "Borrowed" Frosty's CommLink and got in through that way.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: rasmusnicolaj on <11-09-11/0056:02>
He doesn't just need to get in.
He needs to be able to post without a user appearing.

Anf if he got in, would he be the type that could stop himself from bragging about it?  ;D

Regards
Rasmus
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-09-11/0100:20>
Damnit, he's got us there.  Ego, thy name is Harley.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <11-09-11/0130:59>
In Portfolio of a Dragon, The Lone Gunman claims she's one of the immortal elves he was ranting about in Threats.

Nadja knows Dunkelzahn sacrificed himself to power the Dragonheart and level out the spike.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: wizard_of_ozzy on <11-09-11/0139:33>
All signs point to the immortal Juggalo elf.

EDIT: But I thought Harlequin was friends with Big D? He called him a friend at the end of Artifacts Unbound anyways. Or did I misread that?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: rasmusnicolaj on <11-09-11/0204:35>
As an IE Harlequin want all dragons dead.
But I think he respected D and he knew he couldn't kill a dragon himself.

Rasmus
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <11-09-11/0326:03>
In Portfolio of a Dragon, The Lone Gunman claims she's one of the immortal elves he was ranting about in Threats.

Nadja knows Dunkelzahn sacrificed himself to power the Dragonheart and level out the spike.

Knowing Dunkelzahn doesnt necessarily mean that she doesnt think of dragons as completely selfish and unscrupulous creatures. For al I know D and his close relationship to humanity was kind of exception amongst his kind, even in previous era...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <11-09-11/0832:34>
As an IE Harlequin want all dragons dead.
But I think he respected D and he knew he couldn't kill a dragon himself.

Rasmus
Check out Tom Dowd's Post Mortem (http://pl.shadowrun.wikia.com/wiki/Post_Mortem) for the conversation between Harlequin and Ehran after Dunkelzahn's death.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Patrick Goodman on <11-09-11/1002:46>
Check out Tom Dowd's Post Mortem (http://pl.shadowrun.wikia.com/wiki/Post_Mortem) for the conversation between Harlequin and Ehran after Dunkelzahn's death.
+1 to you, sir...I'd forgotten what a nifty piece that was.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <11-09-11/1225:55>
Check out Tom Dowd's Post Mortem (http://pl.shadowrun.wikia.com/wiki/Post_Mortem) for the conversation between Harlequin and Ehran after Dunkelzahn's death.
+1 to you, sir...I'd forgotten what a nifty piece that was.

Yeah, I need to collect these, as well as a few other things.  Stuff like this needs to be Required Reading for Freelancers.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <11-09-11/1419:52>
Yeah, I need to collect these, as well as a few other things.  Stuff like this needs to be Required Reading for Freelancers.

Know what I'd like?

A "Style guide" that compilied the Shadowtalk from each 4th ed book so that I could get the voice right by basing it on previous examples.

Man-of-Many-Names feels like he was 'off model' as they say in animation circles in certain areas of Spy Games, for instance. He normally pops in with mysterious things, like "When the Moon Spirits are watching, they do not blink" or the like. It has a certain gravitas by sounding like wise words from One Who Knows. Having him settle in with longer, more common talk threw me off a bit, but, it *might* be something he does now and thenand I'd just missed it before.

Mind you, I'd also love to lampshade that with him popping up on a detailed chat about something random, like Water Polo, and everyone staring. "What? I have hobbies!"

(Getting that inner commedian under control is gonna be haaaaard...)

Compiling everyone's lines into a single database isn't exactly hard, but would be terribly time-consuming. But oh-so useful!

Hrm.

Maybe a project for the near future if I get some free time.

....

And now I'm way off topic.

...

Back to A. Nonymous speculation!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Zilfer on <11-09-11/1430:01>
I'm guessing their both disguised is what is happening there because an ork and a dwarf? xD
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <11-09-11/1452:51>
Yeah, I need to collect these, as well as a few other things.  Stuff like this needs to be Required Reading for Freelancers.

Know what I'd like?

A "Style guide" that compilied the Shadowtalk from each 4th ed book so that I could get the voice right by basing it on previous examples.

Man-of-Many-Names feels like he was 'off model' as they say in animation circles in certain areas of Spy Games, for instance. He normally pops in with mysterious things, like "When the Moon Spirits are watching, they do not blink" or the like. It has a certain gravitas by sounding like wise words from One Who Knows. Having him settle in with longer, more common talk threw me off a bit, but, it *might* be something he does now and thenand I'd just missed it before.

Mind you, I'd also love to lampshade that with him popping up on a detailed chat about something random, like Water Polo, and everyone staring. "What? I have hobbies!"

(Getting that inner commedian under control is gonna be haaaaard...)

Compiling everyone's lines into a single database isn't exactly hard, but would be terribly time-consuming. But oh-so useful!

Hrm.

Maybe a project for the near future if I get some free time.

....

And now I'm way off topic.

...

Back to A. Nonymous speculation!
*AHEM* (http://forums.shadowrun4.com/index.php?topic=58.0)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <11-09-11/1506:04>
*AHEM* (http://forums.shadowrun4.com/index.php?topic=58.0)
[/quote]

*Glee!*

That lists the place and page of each person's content.

Now, I just have to type each comment in to make a 'script' of what each one says, to see what type of speaking pattern they have.

But that there is a HUGE head start. Thanks Fastjack! You the man!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <11-09-11/1507:24>
Good luck!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <11-09-11/1724:58>
Yeah, FJ is a nerd like that.

And yeah, I was a little concerned with Man of Many Names appearance in my piece (I assume you're referring to the Maltese Falcon write up in Already Here).  He's had a couple more "Casual" conversations...  One of the problems I have writing Shadowtalk is that, simply put, I don;t "know" a LOT of the Shadowtalkers.  Most of the time their personalities don't come through in Shadowtalk (outside of a handful of Jackpointers).  There's like 60-odd members of Jackpoint, but only about 25% of them have had any kind of fleshing out at all.  The rest are little more than names and, on occasion, "professions".

I had already tapped WInterhawk for part of the magic discussion, and I needed another character that could be a voice of authority.  Jackpoint is a little limited, and I didn't want to bring in an outside voice, so I decided to have MoMN drop his "mystery act" for a bit and actually be part of the discussion for a change.  Personally, while i don't mind the rare "cryptic message" (Hell, I do it myself, see my "Heh" above), I find them incredibly boring and tedious when done all the time.  If that's all the character does, they lose a bit of resonance and meaning.

(I can also picture Fastjack sending MoMN a private message saying "Come on, Bob.  We all know the Secret Mystic routine is crap.  Will you just PARTICIPATE in the discussion for once?  You're a smart guy, that's why I invited you in!")

Bull

Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <11-09-11/1742:08>
Check out Tom Dowd's Post Mortem (http://pl.shadowrun.wikia.com/wiki/Post_Mortem) for the conversation between Harlequin and Ehran after Dunkelzahn's death.
+1 to you, sir...I'd forgotten what a nifty piece that was.

Yeah, I need to collect these, as well as a few other things.  Stuff like this needs to be Required Reading for Freelancers.

Actually, what I'd like to see is a PDF of all of the fiction bits -- the old short stories from Dowd etc., the short stories and stuff in the texts and PDFs -- essentially anything that's a story, extracted from the surrounding material.  This would, IMO, include Hatchetman's cyberzombie story ... and even going all the way back to SR1, whether the first short in the original SR book or Renny and Halberstam from the first Matrix book.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <11-09-11/1800:59>
Check out Tom Dowd's Post Mortem (http://pl.shadowrun.wikia.com/wiki/Post_Mortem) for the conversation between Harlequin and Ehran after Dunkelzahn's death.
+1 to you, sir...I'd forgotten what a nifty piece that was.

Yeah, I need to collect these, as well as a few other things.  Stuff like this needs to be Required Reading for Freelancers.

Actually, what I'd like to see is a PDF of all of the fiction bits -- the old short stories from Dowd etc., the short stories and stuff in the texts and PDFs -- essentially anything that's a story, extracted from the surrounding material.  This would, IMO, include Hatchetman's cyberzombie story ... and even going all the way back to SR1, whether the first short in the original SR book or Renny and Halberstam from the first Matrix book.

^ This. We need this. Badly. So many things are hinted at in the books, but unless you've poured through the old sourcebooks, you don't know what they're talking about.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Zilfer on <11-09-11/1826:00>
Yeah, FJ is a nerd like that.

And yeah, I was a little concerned with Man of Many Names appearance in my piece (I assume you're referring to the Maltese Falcon write up in Already Here).  He's had a couple more "Casual" conversations...  One of the problems I have writing Shadowtalk is that, simply put, I don;t "know" a LOT of the Shadowtalkers.  Most of the time their personalities don't come through in Shadowtalk (outside of a handful of Jackpointers).  There's like 60-odd members of Jackpoint, but only about 25% of them have had any kind of fleshing out at all.  The rest are little more than names and, on occasion, "professions".

I had already tapped WInterhawk for part of the magic discussion, and I needed another character that could be a voice of authority.  Jackpoint is a little limited, and I didn't want to bring in an outside voice, so I decided to have MoMN drop his "mystery act" for a bit and actually be part of the discussion for a change.  Personally, while i don't mind the rare "cryptic message" (Hell, I do it myself, see my "Heh" above), I find them incredibly boring and tedious when done all the time.  If that's all the character does, they lose a bit of resonance and meaning.

(I can also picture Fastjack sending MoMN a private message saying "Come on, Bob.  We all know the Secret Mystic routine is crap.  Will you just PARTICIPATE in the discussion for once?  You're a smart guy, that's why I invited you in!")

Bull

What do you mean "Heh?" above? o.O' (must be missing something)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <11-09-11/1835:04>
Yeah, FJ is a nerd like that.

And yeah, I was a little concerned with Man of Many Names appearance in my piece (I assume you're referring to the Maltese Falcon write up in Already Here).  He's had a couple more "Casual" conversations...  One of the problems I have writing Shadowtalk is that, simply put, I don;t "know" a LOT of the Shadowtalkers.  Most of the time their personalities don't come through in Shadowtalk (outside of a handful of Jackpointers).  There's like 60-odd members of Jackpoint, but only about 25% of them have had any kind of fleshing out at all.  The rest are little more than names and, on occasion, "professions".

I had already tapped WInterhawk for part of the magic discussion, and I needed another character that could be a voice of authority.  Jackpoint is a little limited, and I didn't want to bring in an outside voice, so I decided to have MoMN drop his "mystery act" for a bit and actually be part of the discussion for a change.  Personally, while i don't mind the rare "cryptic message" (Hell, I do it myself, see my "Heh" above), I find them incredibly boring and tedious when done all the time.  If that's all the character does, they lose a bit of resonance and meaning.

(I can also picture Fastjack sending MoMN a private message saying "Come on, Bob.  We all know the Secret Mystic routine is crap.  Will you just PARTICIPATE in the discussion for once?  You're a smart guy, that's why I invited you in!")

Bull

I didn't say it was bad, just a tad jarring. I'd have loved to see someone comment on it, but, space limits and all. (But, handy use for Underground 93, isn't it? Hmmm...)

It's easy to forget that these guys lighten up with one another from time to time.

Of course, the day that Bul, Man-of-Many-Names, and Kane get into a Brony discussion, I'm gonna have to check my pills. :D

Man, wish I would have thought about the shadowtalk archive when my vacation was in front of me instead of behind me. That could have been five days well spent! Next time, Gadet, next time...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <11-09-11/1919:02>
^ This. We need this. Badly. So many things are hinted at in the books, but unless you've poured through the old sourcebooks, you don't know what they're talking about.
Well, you're not supposed to have to know all of this stuff, and I know the current writers take pains to ensure that.

Unless it's stuff like Praxis, which is intentionally vague because it's about the FUTURE, not plucking a minor NPC from a twenty-year-old adventure.



There's like 60-odd members of Jackpoint, but only about 25% of them have had any kind of fleshing out at all.  The rest are little more than names and, on occasion, "professions".
Plus the sixty-plus guest users. It's no secret that writers have their favorites. They always have. That's why people care about Fastjack and Hatchetman and Captain Chaos (Actually, him I don't get. He's the lunchroom monitor of SL. No one likes the lunchroom monitor).


It's still better to keep track of than the old Shadowland system, though.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <11-09-11/1925:03>
What do you mean "Heh?" above? o.O' (must be missing something)

http://forums.shadowrun4.com/index.php?topic=3216.msg85661#msg85661

I did a post that just said "Heh.".  In part, because I now know the lead contender for Anonymous.  As well as why they started posting. 

Can't say anything, of course, cause Jason has FASA's old GamePolice on retainer, however.

Bull
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Zilfer on <11-09-11/1930:54>
What do you mean "Heh?" above? o.O' (must be missing something)

http://forums.shadowrun4.com/index.php?topic=3216.msg85661#msg85661

I did a post that just said "Heh.".  In part, because I now know the lead contender for Anonymous.  As well as why they started posting. 

Can't say anything, of course, cause Jason has FASA's old GamePolice on retainer, however.

Bull

That must mean they weren't posting before?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <11-09-11/1954:55>
You could read it that way.  Or you could read it with an unsaid "Why they started posting as Anonymous" :)

Don't read anything into my comments, especially since I have nothing to do with the "him".

Bull
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Fizzygoo on <11-09-11/1956:30>
What do you mean "Heh?" above? o.O' (must be missing something)

http://forums.shadowrun4.com/index.php?topic=3216.msg85661#msg85661

I did a post that just said "Heh.".  In part, because I now know the lead contender for Anonymous.  As well as why they started posting. 

Can't say anything, of course, cause Jason has FASA's old GamePolice on retainer, however.

Bull

That must mean they weren't posting before?

Hehe, not necessarily, because "as well as why they started posting" could mean that haven't been posting at all for x-many years or it could mean "why the started posting [as anonymous]" meaning it could very well be Frosty, Man of Many Names (hehe, one of them being "nobody" for a Dead Man movie reference), or even Fastjack just because he felt like stirring things up and scaring everyone about JackPoint being hacked. (Not that I think that's the case, though the MoMN's angle is fun).

No, I think Bull's been expertly vague and has only revealed that he's pretty sure he knows who it is.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <11-09-11/1959:34>
^ This. We need this. Badly. So many things are hinted at in the books, but unless you've poured through the old sourcebooks, you don't know what they're talking about.
Well, you're not supposed to have to know all of this stuff, and I know the current writers take pains to ensure that.

Unless it's stuff like Praxis, which is intentionally vague because it's about the FUTURE, not plucking a minor NPC from a twenty-year-old adventure.


Hey you never know when some minor NPC from a twenty-year-old adventure could become pretty important to a current plot.  Just saying....
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: ARC on <11-10-11/0258:51>
I hate crossing Genre but look at Harry Potter. Neville Longbottom is a perfect example of this.   Here is a minor character who at the end of the series becomes the Hero of Hogwarts.  You see it all the time in long running series.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Fizzygoo on <11-10-11/0317:49>
And that's the beauty about Shadowrun. Minor character posters from 20 years ago (heh, game time or IRL printed material) that have survived during all the chaos will probably have at least a JackPoint page of paydata worth posting on one subject or the other. Of course, I don't see any of them being the 'Hero of the 6th World' but that's just a matter of setting, theme, and genre :)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <11-10-11/0447:35>
I guess. I don't know anymore. This was a bad idea.

Anyway, Shadowrun generally seems apt for the line from The Dark Knight that you either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. However, the world moves pretty fast, and in the SIxth World if you live long enough the revolution might come back around full circle.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <11-10-11/0633:02>
BAH!

Spoiler for the end of Loose Ends/I Am Legion/The Prestige serial in Street Legends. I assumed someone would have noticed this by now.

[spoiler]
Nadja Daviar knows about JackPoint.

Quote from: Street Legends, 169
It represented Rory, and she brought him closer, creating a direct link between the spy and herself, bypassing the Nadjas, the Watchers, allies at JackPoint, her connections in Argus,
[/spoiler]

Maybe this'll learn ya to read the stories.




Thomas Roxborough should almost certainly know about JackPoint. His hated ex-wife, KAM (Dr. Kristine Martin), was a guest user. I have no doubt he has people watching her 24/7.

Thomas Roxborough definitely knew about Shadowland, because he posted there at least once under the handle 'Roxy'.  Not so sure about JackPoint, because yes, he likely has people on KAM's arse and she has posted on JP.  That doesn't mean he has the computer nous to hack in though,  but knowing about it is probable.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <11-10-11/0753:20>
What do you mean "Heh?" above? o.O' (must be missing something)

http://forums.shadowrun4.com/index.php?topic=3216.msg85661#msg85661

I did a post that just said "Heh.".  In part, because I now know the lead contender for Anonymous.  As well as why they started posting. 

Can't say anything, of course, cause Jason has FASA's old GamePolice on retainer, however.

Bull
Interesting use of plural there, Bull...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <11-10-11/1252:35>
Interesting use of plural there, Bull...

'They' is acceptable-use singular of you are specifically not identifying an individual by name or gender.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <11-10-11/1256:32>
I'm a bad, bad English Major, in that I will use "they" as a neutral pronoun sometimes. 

*shrug*

Like I said, don't read too much into anything I post regarding this.  (Of course, you monkeys will anyway :)

Bull
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-10-11/1304:08>
We really need a gender neutral pronoun.  And, I mean, it's not like English is a "Cast Iron" language where you need to combine fifty words together to name something new, like German.  ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Zilfer on <11-10-11/1358:16>
We really need a gender neutral pronoun.  And, I mean, it's not like English is a "Cast Iron" language where you need to combine fifty words together to name something new, like German.  ;)

Better than saying "I am a donut."

:P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <11-10-11/1410:05>
I'm a bad, bad English Major, in that I will use "they" as a neutral pronoun sometimes. 

*shrug*

Like I said, don't read too much into anything I post regarding this.  (Of course, you monkeys will anyway :)

Bull
Monkeys, eh? So, you're saying that A. Nonymous is some kind of super-intelligent marmoset or a new techno-spider monkey??
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <11-10-11/1445:07>
And I was about to post something off the cuff about it being some kind of Spambot.

And then I twitched when I realized that, with the blast of AI into the Matrix, it's entirely possible that there *is* a sentient Spambot AI out there now.

And now I have horrible, horrible ideas about runners being hired by an AI Johnson, going on a mission, and being rewarded by having their Commlinks filled with penis enlargement and discount drug spamverts.

And then I want it to be named "Captcha-if-You-Can".

...

I think I might have just broke something.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <11-10-11/1506:00>
The mind of some future players perhaps?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <11-10-11/1705:39>
We really need a gender neutral pronoun.  And, I mean, it's not like English is a "Cast Iron" language where you need to combine fifty words together to name something new, like German.  ;)

We already have one. "It". ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: kirk on <11-10-11/1713:27>
We really need a gender neutral pronoun.  And, I mean, it's not like English is a "Cast Iron" language where you need to combine fifty words together to name something new, like German.  ;)

We already have one. "It". ;)
We could always restore the Middle English "ou".
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-10-11/1717:44>
Monkeys, eh? So, you're saying that A. Nonymous is some kind of super-intelligent marmoset or a new techno-spider monkey??
Wait...  NetCat has a Techno-Kitty for a pet.

...

Damn, Slamm-0! really is domesticated!  House, wife, kid, pet...
We already have one. "It". ;)
See how well that works when you're dealing with Transsexuals.

Here's a hint, when you're in the gutter looking for your teeth, don't forget I told you so.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <11-10-11/1757:07>
Running Wild may be the most undervalued book in the SR4 library so far. If any book can put the weird into SR it is that. Nothing gets the group go wtf as some critter with odd abilities ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Simagal on <11-10-11/1836:59>
In reality I kind of hope it remains an unanswered mystery of the game universe.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <11-10-11/1926:18>
I have a technomancer who would love to get a technocritter or kitteh as a pet.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <11-10-11/2051:50>
We already have one. "It". ;)
See how well that works when you're dealing with Transsexuals.

Here's a hint, when you're in the gutter looking for your teeth, don't forget I told you so.
We could always restore the Middle English "ou".

I vote for 'gya', Steven Brust's version for an anonymous individual of unidentified gender ...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <11-11-11/0734:18>
What about 'Hey you'?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: ARC on <11-11-11/0824:34>
We already have one. "It". ;)
See how well that works when you're dealing with Transsexuals.

Here's a hint, when you're in the gutter looking for your teeth, don't forget I told you so.

If they can knock out my teeth more power to them.  The only time I use "it" is when you can't tell what they are trying to be.  If it's just a miss mash of gender, it gets the "it."
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Valashar on <11-12-11/1140:47>
And I was about to post something off the cuff about it being some kind of Spambot.

And then I twitched when I realized that, with the blast of AI into the Matrix, it's entirely possible that there *is* a sentient Spambot AI out there now.

And now I have horrible, horrible ideas about runners being hired by an AI Johnson, going on a mission, and being rewarded by having their Commlinks filled with penis enlargement and discount drug spamverts.

And then I want it to be named "Captcha-if-You-Can".

...

I think I might have just broke something.

Oh, this is so going against my folks after their next run (once they've gotten rid of the PC whom they /thought/ was their rigger, but was a shadow spirit possessing her old body since the start of the campaign... that player and I have had huge laughs the past few months).
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <11-13-11/1513:52>
And I was about to post something off the cuff about it being some kind of Spambot.

And then I twitched when I realized that, with the blast of AI into the Matrix, it's entirely possible that there *is* a sentient Spambot AI out there now.

And now I have horrible, horrible ideas about runners being hired by an AI Johnson, going on a mission, and being rewarded by having their Commlinks filled with penis enlargement and discount drug spamverts.

And then I want it to be named "Captcha-if-You-Can".

...

I think I might have just broke something.

This is AWESOME!!! Kudos Wakshaani you get a +1!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <11-16-11/0036:41>
Since it's almost upon us, I'll just say that you're going to want to read the first story in Conspiracy Theories.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <11-16-11/0233:02>
Now James, don't tease the natives.  It's not nice. :)

(It was a good story though.  :))
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <11-16-11/0257:52>
Now James, don't tease the natives.  It's not nice. :)
Neither am I.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <11-16-11/0746:29>
razzin' frazzin' freelancers not chatting in champagne rooms... ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Digital_Viking on <11-16-11/0931:32>
razzin' frazzin' freelancers not chatting in champagne rooms... ;)
Oh FJ, don't you know?  There is NO chatting in the champagne room  8)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <11-16-11/1207:27>
Oh FJ, don't you know?  There is NO chatting in the champagne room  8)

There's champagne in the Champagne room.  But NO chatting! :)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <11-16-11/1238:41>
If a Freelancer has a pierced tongue, they will probably...

...

Uh.

...

Talk with a lisp.

<.<

>.>

Ahem.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Zilfer on <11-16-11/1320:35>
Ow....
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-16-11/1740:19>
If a Freelancer has a pierced tongue, they will probably...

...

Uh.

...

Talk with a lisp.

<.<

>.>

Ahem.
I know a number of people that have a pierced tongue.  Non talk with a lisp.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Digital_Viking on <11-16-11/1927:01>
I know a number of people that have a pierced tongue.  Non talk with a lisp.

Yeah, my wife only lisps if she is doing a Sylvester The Cat imitation  8)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <11-17-11/0116:26>
I know a number of people that have a pierced tongue.  Non talk with a lisp.

I changed the line, to be a tad more family-friendly.

Chris Rock "No Sex in the Champange Room".

Youtube for more. :)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-17-11/1157:23>
I know that.

I'm thuper, thankth for athking!  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <11-17-11/1433:42>
Just quote the line from Pulp Fiction and move on.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Zilfer on <11-18-11/1800:50>
Ezekiel 25:17..... :D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <11-18-11/1820:51>
Talking about Biblic qutes...
Noone here mentioned the possibility A.nonymous is a gtou connected to church...I remember when reading some Aztlan guide, thaz Jesuits were one of most capable hackers around, so why not the possibility they are hooked on the shadow scene and possibly even Jackpoint? I know, this may be cryzy theory...well, there were worse...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Fizzygoo on <11-21-11/0323:47>
Well, based on the intro fiction to Conspiracy Theories...one of my hypotheses was right, one was wrong. Regardless, fun read.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <11-21-11/0348:39>
Ezekiel 25:17..... :D

Not quite. The one about Rosanna Arquette's tongue stud.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Zilfer on <11-21-11/1331:50>
Ezekiel 25:17..... :D

Not quite. The one about Rosanna Arquette's tongue stud.

That's just one of my favorite parts once someone mentioned Pulp Fiction i had to say that. xD
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <11-22-11/1345:42>
Pesky mind games...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Valashar on <11-22-11/1849:56>
So the opening fiction in Conspiracy Theories seems to be Fastjack going to town on Horizon in response to the various moves they've made against JackPoint and its members. The tone I got was that this included the anonymous posts, which had been possible via a backdoor that Fastjack had left open intentionally in order to track its user(s). So the hit is made and is highly effective... and then there's another anonymous post later in the book (pg. 71, in the 'Dragon Eggs' section).

[spoiler]This is one of those theories that is absolutely ludicrous, but would be great if it was true. Imagine the chaos. Dragons who dislike each other, who are having increasing trouble getting along, having to coordinate the operations of this place together. The value of the product stored there, and the number of wealthy people who would like to get just a taste of it. The powerful people in the world who’d like to find out about it just to get a bit of leverage over the dragons. It would be too beautiful.[/spoiler]
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <11-22-11/1921:54>
He took out the node with all the files. Not the anonymous poster who kept logging in. Now it could be he left the back door in there, so he can track them to the source. Personally, I could see 'Jack loading that lovely IC from the Choson Ring in Unwired onto Jackpoint, and siccing it on the anonymous poster. You know, the one that blackouts you, tracks you, finds your address book, black hammers your friends, family, and associates, and then black hammers you.

I love that IC.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <11-22-11/1950:02>
Tho only really effective if all targets are using hot sim, and about as effective as a fart in the dark if they happen to be using AR. Still, i guess the Choson could follow that up with having their people target people based on what is left of the address list that the IC did not manage to kill...

edit: Oh wait a nanosecond...

i rechecked the description of black hammer. And while it does only stun damage vs cold sim users,it does not have the overflow blocker that blackout comes with. So even in cold sim you can be killed with black hammer, it will just take a few more whacks...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Patrick Goodman on <11-22-11/2015:20>
Don't screw with FastJack. That's the moral of that story.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <11-22-11/2038:45>
Like I said. I LOVE that IC. So deliciously evil.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-22-11/2050:20>
Don't screw with FastJack. That's the moral of that story.
That's the moral of any Matrix story that has FastJack in it.

EDIT:  That and don't pee on the thing that looks like an electric fence.  It's not an electric fence and gets offended quite easily.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Zilfer on <11-23-11/1317:32>
Don't screw with FastJack. That's the moral of that story.
That's the moral of any Matrix story that has FastJack in it.

EDIT:  That and don't pee on the thing that looks like an electric fence.  It's not an electric fence and gets offended quite easily.


uhh.... what...?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <11-23-11/1725:45>
If you have to ask, you'll never know.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Zilfer on <11-23-11/1739:21>
If you have to ask, you'll never know.

apparently not.... o.O'
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <12-01-11/0708:20>
damn it, i keep forgetting about 10 jackpointers!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <12-01-11/0746:21>
damn it, i keep forgetting about 10 jackpointers!
What did you forget?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <12-01-11/1432:40>
damn it, i keep forgetting about 10 jackpointers!

Actually it is a pretty good supplement that has plenty of information on some of the major players at Jackpoint.  It really has been a great investment. 
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <12-01-11/2216:04>
damn it, i keep forgetting about 10 jackpointers!
What did you forget?
Mostly that it even exists. I was trying to wrap my brain around the opening fiction of Conspiracy Theories, but had a hard time until it dawned on me that there was this pdf...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Darquewing on <12-09-11/1452:00>
Couldn't bother to read all the way through this, but has the theory that A.nonymous is a dragon come up?

I was thinking E-Ghost dragon most likely... Cerberus I think is his name.


The biggest reason I'm leaning this way is the post where he talks about dragons and motives. And humans being crazy and such. It might be a slip, because the poster seems to feel more connected to the dragons than to humans. Also the poster says "We have had many  millenia to practice..."  Only two known races get that much time to practice anything I believe, but the race the poster could identify with in that post, for it to be a "We" is dragons. No mention of immortal elves.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <12-09-11/1510:34>
Cerberus has already posted as Neurosis. Furthermore, Cerberus works for NeoNET, not Horizon. Also, the quote you're remembering was taking the opposite side from Dragons.

No, given the events from the story at the beginning of Conspiracy Theories, I think we can safely say that the anonymous poster is one of the Dawkins Group.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <12-09-11/1619:19>
Not to mention that FastJack has officially brought in Cerberus to JackPoint.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <12-09-11/1624:15>
Yes, if a dragon asks nicely, it is usually a good idea to give him what he wants.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <12-09-11/1705:43>

Couldn't bother to read all the way through this
Yeah, you should do that.


Or at least not brag about it, which just pisses me off.


No, given the events from the story at the beginning of Conspiracy Theories, I think we can safely say that the anonymous poster is one of the Dawkins Group.
Not necessarily. The poster is at least two people.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <12-09-11/1708:38>
Not to mention that FastJack has officially brought in Cerberus to JackPoint.

Actually, I don;t thi8nk he has, yet.  Like a lot of folks in Street Legends, there were a lot of "Guest passes" given out for the Street Legends discussions, since FJ felt it was only fair to let the people being discussed (or their friends) get in on the discussion.

That said, I'm not against it.  Eliohann was always one of my favorite SR characters (And Dragon Hunt one of my favorite SR Modules back in the day).

Bull
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-09-11/1843:39>
*Cough*  Never cut a deal with a dragon.  FastJack isn't senile yet.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <12-09-11/1906:52>
Rules are made to be broken; didn't your father teach you that?  The trick lies in knowing when to break it.  Of all the dragons, Eliohann / Cerberus / Neurosis is the ... second least likely to screw over Jackpoint for any reason.

Dragons have emotions too, you know.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <12-09-11/1913:39>
I disagree, Wyrm. Of all the dragons, Dunkelzahn, Nachtmeister (or whatever the name of the dragon that Lofwyr dueled is), and Dzitbalchen are all less likely to screw Jackpoint than Eliohann.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <12-09-11/1918:07>
*sighs*  Do I really need to put in 'living'??

"Never assume that you have discovered a Dragon's weak point until it is dead and forgotten, for joy is fleeting and a Dragon's revenge is forever."
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-09-11/1919:28>
He might have allowed The Big D on.

*Pours a 40 on the curb*
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <12-09-11/1921:27>
Well, if Big D ever gets off that bridge he'd be living again. Well, kindof living.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <12-09-11/2050:32>
*Cough*  Never cut a deal with a dragon.  FastJack isn't senile yet.
Ah, but when the dragon in question lives in YOUR realm? ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-09-11/2105:33>
*Cough*  Never cut a deal with a dragon.  FastJack isn't senile yet.
Ah, but when the dragon in question lives in YOUR realm? ;D
He lives in the Matrix only because FastJack lets him live.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <12-09-11/2228:49>
Well, there's blithe, blatant, errant arrogance and nonsense for you ...

While Fastjack may (still) be the best hacker/decker/hacker out there even at 70+ years old*, he and every other hacker out there get to where they've gotten by first and foremost planning ahead.  Your targets can't hit you if the baseline code of their programs doesn't recognize your presence; you can get the layout of the land, a sculpture of an opponent's design philosophy, by gently probing their network again and again, hundreds of times, over the course of a year.

Even for 'Jack, going toe to toe with an E-Ghost is going to be a) very bizarre, and b) a little twitchy.  He did almost die fighting his own personal little Jormungand.


* -- I have to admit I do find it somewhat hard to imagine that; unless he's a spike baby elf/dwarf, he should give serious thought to stepping quietly aside, because degenerative neural structures and plaques are a real danger at his age.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-09-11/2230:31>
Almost.  Almost.

...

But this isn't horseshoes or tactical nuclear warheads.  Almost and close don't count.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <12-09-11/2246:46>
What, you think 'Jack can't afford a bit of Leonization? :)

And hell, who's to say ol' FJ isn't an eGhost himself...

(That's a joke folks, don;t take it as gospel or nothing.  *sigh*  being a freelancer means you have to be careful of the jokes you make)

Bull
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: RelentlessImp on <12-10-11/0005:02>
And hell, who's to say ol' FJ isn't an eGhost himself...

At this point that would make a lot of sense...

(That's a joke folks, don;t take it as gospel or nothing.  *sigh*  being a freelancer means you have to be careful of the jokes you make)

Bull

Joke or not, it still explains a lot. :D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <12-10-11/0012:50>
What, you think 'Jack can't afford a bit of Leonization? :)

This is true.  It's gone down in (absolute) price, though its (relative) cost is still excruciatingly high.  400,000¥ + (6 x 50,000¥) = 700,000¥ total, the latter 300k over three years' time.  Be interesting; Fastjack 74(?), looking and feeling 25 ...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <12-10-11/0036:17>
Given the story in CT, i wonder if not the postings where leaks from Consensus chatter that reached Jackpoint via a monitoring channel set up by the dawkins group and left open by Fastjack for his own use. Hell, it may well be that Consensus is a bunch of savants and such that Horizon feed data in a ender's game like fashion.

Edit: oh crap, could Consensus be the latest from the "good" doctors experiments?!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <12-10-11/0117:27>
This is true.  It's gone down in (absolute) price, though its (relative) cost is still excruciatingly high.  400,000¥ + (6 x 50,000¥) = 700,000¥ total, the latter 300k over three years' time.  Be interesting; Fastjack 74(?), looking and feeling 25 ...
I've always assumed he was the guy celebrating his birthday on page 82 of Augmentation.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <12-10-11/0157:38>
Oh, hell.  Now we have to figure out who everyone ELSE in that photo is ...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Xzylvador on <12-10-11/0600:03>
It does seem to fit the timeline.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <12-10-11/0803:50>
Clue the rest of us in?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <12-10-11/0946:51>
It's a picture of a guy that looks 25 in an office birthday party. It accompanies the section of the book discussing Leonization.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-10-11/0947:58>
What, you think 'Jack can't afford a bit of Leonization? :)
This is true.  It's gone down in (absolute) price, though its (relative) cost is still excruciatingly high.  400,000¥ + (6 x 50,000¥) = 700,000¥ total, the latter 300k over three years' time.  Be interesting; Fastjack 74(?), looking and feeling 25 ...
Doesn't explain why Bull hasn't had the same (Although he's quite younger).  Also, 'Jack complains about his age quite often.

...

Of course, I'm 32 and have done the same damned thing since I was half that.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <12-10-11/1220:41>
Well, just because you Leonize doesn't mean you mentally feel any younger.  I've been doing the "Damn kids, I feel old, get off my lawn" bit since I was about 25 myself. 

As for Bull the Ork Decker, well...  He's comfortable in the skin he's got, lets just say.  I can't really see him going that route without a damn good reason. 

Bull
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-10-11/1222:00>
Well, just because you Leonize doesn't mean you mentally feel any younger.  I've been doing the "Damn kids, I feel old, get off my lawn" bit since I was about 25 myself. 

As for Bull the Ork Decker, well...  He's comfortable in the skin he's got, lets just say.  I can't really see him going that route without a damn good reason. 

Bull
That's only 'cause he Goblinized.  In "real" ork years, he'd be dead.  :P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <12-10-11/1622:08>
Let me rephrase. I've tended to assume FastJack was the guy in the photo, or if not, that he's definitely had work done (I think he could deal with living in a vat for several months). That said, I didn't actually describe FastJack in that opening story of CT for a reason. Well, no one really gets described. That was all intentional.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: ARC on <12-11-11/0759:47>
Yes, if a dragon asks nicely, it is usually a good idea to give him what he wants.

Couldn't that be considered making a deal with a dragon though?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <12-11-11/0826:05>
Well, just because you Leonize doesn't mean you mentally feel any younger.  I've been doing the "Damn kids, I feel old, get off my lawn" bit since I was about 25 myself. 

As for Bull the Ork Decker, well...  He's comfortable in the skin he's got, lets just say.  I can't really see him going that route without a damn good reason. 

Bull
That's only 'cause he Goblinized.  In "real" ork years, he'd be dead.  :P

So you telling me that the only reason Leonization was invented was to keep "good old" NPCs to reappear for another 150 years, telling us how to deal with the world we are living in...confident that they are able to understand it better?  ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <12-11-11/0826:33>
'Deal' implies some kind of negotiation, and an attempt to get one over on the dragon, or trying to share power with a dragon. The second Treaty of Denver, bringing Lofwyr in as a Prince of Tir Tairngir, and that poor slot Dunkelzhan stripped of his SIN and worldly possessions for a week in his will are prime examples.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-11-11/0917:44>
Well, just because you Leonize doesn't mean you mentally feel any younger.  I've been doing the "Damn kids, I feel old, get off my lawn" bit since I was about 25 myself. 

As for Bull the Ork Decker, well...  He's comfortable in the skin he's got, lets just say.  I can't really see him going that route without a damn good reason. 

Bull
That's only 'cause he Goblinized.  In "real" ork years, he'd be dead.  :P
So you telling me that the only reason Leonization was invented was to keep "good old" NPCs to reappear for another 150 years, telling us how to deal with the world we are living in...confident that they are able to understand it better?  ;)
No, just pulling Bull's datacable about him being "The Best Ork Decker You Never Met Who Was Actually Born Human".  :P

Thing is, his son was born an ork, right?  :(
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <12-11-11/0932:01>
The thing about Bull, his datacable might well be mono-edged  :o . . .
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-11-11/0933:19>
The thing about Bull, his datacable might well be mono-edged  :o . . .
He's old enough that it might be dikoted.  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <12-11-11/1548:11>
I miss Dikoting...  *sigh*
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-11-11/1555:45>
I miss Dikoting...  *sigh*
>:(  At least you got to play with it.   >:(
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: snowRaven on <12-11-11/1626:11>
I miss Dikoting...  *sigh*

Write a proposition and convince Jason to add it to 'State of the Art'  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-11-11/1731:27>
"Recovered Technology lost in Crash 2.0", easy enough to explain where it went.  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <12-11-11/1858:42>
I was actually looking at Dikoting as something to write up for the 1st issue of the Dumpshock Datahaven, and I talked with a few folks about it back then.

Mechanically, Dikoting became a problem due to the much narrower definitions of damage codes.  Dikoting was cool, but it didn't provide a massive bonus in SR2/3.  Now though, a +1 to DV is huge.  It just doesn't fit as well into the current iteration of the rules, sadly.

Unofficially, the explanation I give is that Dikoting has become superfluous  Modern techniques at metalcrafting have made weapons and armor innately stronger, and while you can still spend the nuyen to Dikote something, it doesn't actually improve it any because the material is already at the Dikote level.  All Dikote really does now is "bling it up".

Bull
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-11-11/2127:27>
Great, now I picture Rappers Dikoting their teeth...   :o
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <12-11-11/2305:14>
Yeah, boyee!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-11-11/2308:03>
And now memories of French-Canadian/Quebecois White Rappers is coming to mind...  Remember when MTV/MuchMusic actually played music videos?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <12-12-11/0104:32>
MTV has like twelve channels, and most of them do play videos.

Also, there's this thing called YouTube now.


That said, I hate Snow because a) he sucked, and b) my decision not to stare intently at some girls jiggling their asses onscreen actually prompted some jackass to call me gay. Good times.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: wizard_of_ozzy on <12-12-11/0124:40>
MTV has like twelve channels, and most of them do play videos.

Also, there's this thing called YouTube now.


That said, I hate Snow because a) he sucked, and b) my decision not to stare intently at some girls jiggling their asses onscreen actually prompted some jackass to call me gay. Good times.
In the 90s, if you didn't think about sports and T&A 24/7 you were gay. Now, you're only called gay if you like teen vampire movies.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-12-11/0303:35>
"Those aren't vampires.  Those are...  Doucebags." - Dean Winchester
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: DarkLloyd on <12-12-11/1505:45>
"Those aren't vampires.  Those are...  Doucebags." - Dean Winchester

And you sir get a +1.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CitizenJoe on <12-12-11/1642:39>
They actually make more sense if they are unseelie fae.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-12-11/1850:04>
They actually make more sense if they are unseelie fae.
They make better sense if COVERED IN NAPALM!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <12-12-11/1928:48>
Mechanically, Dikoting became a problem due to the much narrower definitions of damage codes.  Dikoting was cool, but it didn't provide a massive bonus in SR2/3.  Now though, a +1 to DV is huge.  It just doesn't fit as well into the current iteration of the rules, sadly.

That makes sense if there's nothing else comparable, but -- like with the original Dikote -- there is: APDS / AV rounds.  My interpretation would simply be that a) dikote adds +1 Impact only to armor with ceramic plates (i.e. you're dikoting the plating), and b) adds the 'Anti-Vehicular' characteristic (-4 AP vs. people, -6 AP vs. vehicles and barriers) to a ceramic or high-temperature metal (steel, titanium) edged melee, thrown, or projectile (as in arrows/bolts) weapon.  It cannot be added to any sort of high-speed projectile, such as firearm/gunpowder ammunition or gauss rifle ammunition; get AV rounds if you want that.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-12-11/2109:22>
And now I'm picturing a DeLorean that's had its exterior dikoted.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <12-12-11/2245:33>
Expensive at 1¥ per square centimeter.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <12-12-11/2329:11>
I'm picturing getting my vibroblade sword dikoted. :)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <12-13-11/0328:08>
"You may call me Dickoted, plasma heat always makes me feel like a real man..."
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <12-13-11/0420:31>
I'm picturing getting my vibroblade sword dikoted. :)
Perhaps it might be best to add that it can't enhance a highly-technologically-modified weapon -- vibro weapons, monofilament weapons, Cougar Fine Blades, and the Victorinox Memory Blade would all be good examples --  specifically because their technologies negate (or are negated by) the others.  You cannot, after all, get a monofilament vibro memory sword...

Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <12-13-11/0759:01>
I'm picturing getting my vibroblade sword dikoted. :)
Perhaps it might be best to add that it can't enhance a highly-technologically-modified weapon -- vibro weapons, monofilament weapons, Cougar Fine Blades, and the Victorinox Memory Blade would all be good examples --  specifically because their technologies negate (or are negated by) the others.  You cannot, after all, get a monofilament vibro memory sword...

Why not? Just because it hasn't been done yet doesn't mean it couldn't be done.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CitizenJoe on <12-13-11/0940:45>
Dikoting a monowire makes it A) thicker and thus loses its cutting ability, B) rigid so it can't coil up, C) disintegrates the monowire in the dikoting process.

Dikoting a vibrosword works for a while but the vibration causes A) delamination of the dikote and B) stress fractures in the dikote crystaline structure.  Both of which cause the dikoting to fail and slough off.  Neither of which is covered by the warranty.

Dikoting a memory blade has similar problems to monowire.  A) makes the blade rigid B) dikote process ruins the temper of the memory blade

The Cougar blades already have the same effects of dikoting.  Assuming you can even get dikoting to stick to the molecularly bonded edge, I think that it would only make it less dull.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: DarkLloyd on <12-13-11/1125:47>
Mechanically, Dikoting became a problem due to the much narrower definitions of damage codes.  Dikoting was cool, but it didn't provide a massive bonus in SR2/3.  Now though, a +1 to DV is huge.  It just doesn't fit as well into the current iteration of the rules, sadly.

That makes sense if there's nothing else comparable, but -- like with the original Dikote -- there is: APDS / AV rounds.  My interpretation would simply be that a) dikote adds +1 Impact only to armor with ceramic plates (i.e. you're dikoting the plating), and b) adds the 'Anti-Vehicular' characteristic (-4 AP vs. people, -6 AP vs. vehicles and barriers) to a ceramic or high-temperature metal (steel, titanium) edged melee, thrown, or projectile (as in arrows/bolts) weapon.  It cannot be added to any sort of high-speed projectile, such as firearm/gunpowder ammunition or gauss rifle ammunition; get AV rounds if you want that.
I like this idea, I gonna snatch it and show it to my GM's. I know one loved Dikote so he will probably go for this.  +1 for nostaligias sake.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <12-13-11/1924:26>
Dikoting a ...

Well put, all around.  +1.

As well --

Vibrating a monoblade does nothing, just wiggles it up and down; it's already doing that.

Putting a monomolecular edge on a vibroblade means that your serrated edge is now sharp in the wrong direction.

Etc. etc. etc.

Look, you can do it in your game.  Expect every other GM in the world to thwap you with a carp.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <12-13-11/2120:07>
Of course, there's also the notion of armor vs armor-piercing, an ever-evolving war of SOTA.

Which is where I plug my Drekky Ammo again. :)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <12-13-11/2330:34>
Drekky Ammo?  You mean ammo that makes you ...


Gives whole new meaning to the phrase 'in the brown' ...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <12-14-11/0010:26>
Hah! No, no, just ammo that's fallen two steps behind SOTA, so much so that it's considered near-useless for 'real' use. They're tsill real bullets, just with horrible armor penetration, so mainly picked up for cheap target practice, popping Devil Rats, and so on.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-14-11/1111:06>
Jamming your firearm up with dirty powder.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CitizenJoe on <12-14-11/1714:16>
Sounds like you need to start turning armor into a weakness. 
Fun fact: Armor doesn't protect you when you fall off a building.
Fun fact: Explosions inside armor tend to keep the explosion contained
Fun fact: This isn't a pistol, it's a laser designator...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-14-11/1723:53>
Fun fact:  If you duct tape a grenade to a guy's mouth, armor don't help that, either.  :P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CitizenJoe on <12-14-11/1746:57>
Fun fact: Armor doesn't block the scent of concentrated pheromones from a rutting juggernaut.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: snowRaven on <12-15-11/0503:09>
Mechanically, Dikoting became a problem due to the much narrower definitions of damage codes.  Dikoting was cool, but it didn't provide a massive bonus in SR2/3.  Now though, a +1 to DV is huge.  It just doesn't fit as well into the current iteration of the rules, sadly.

That makes sense if there's nothing else comparable, but -- like with the original Dikote -- there is: APDS / AV rounds.  My interpretation would simply be that a) dikote adds +1 Impact only to armor with ceramic plates (i.e. you're dikoting the plating), and b) adds the 'Anti-Vehicular' characteristic (-4 AP vs. people, -6 AP vs. vehicles and barriers) to a ceramic or high-temperature metal (steel, titanium) edged melee, thrown, or projectile (as in arrows/bolts) weapon.  It cannot be added to any sort of high-speed projectile, such as firearm/gunpowder ammunition or gauss rifle ammunition; get AV rounds if you want that.

That -4/-6 is much more unbalanced than a DV +1 though!

I can see Dikote giving +1 Impact armor, and AP -1 to edged/pointed weapons. That, coupled with the inability to dikote the 'cool' stuff, like mono blades, vibro blades, memory blades, fine blades etc could be balanced enough for it to work.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <12-15-11/0627:09>
Mechanically, Dikoting became a problem due to the much narrower definitions of damage codes.  Dikoting was cool, but it didn't provide a massive bonus in SR2/3.  Now though, a +1 to DV is huge.  It just doesn't fit as well into the current iteration of the rules, sadly.

That makes sense if there's nothing else comparable, but -- like with the original Dikote -- there is: APDS / AV rounds.  My interpretation would simply be that a) dikote adds +1 Impact only to armor with ceramic plates (i.e. you're dikoting the plating), and b) adds the 'Anti-Vehicular' characteristic (-4 AP vs. people, -6 AP vs. vehicles and barriers) to a ceramic or high-temperature metal (steel, titanium) edged melee, thrown, or projectile (as in arrows/bolts) weapon.  It cannot be added to any sort of high-speed projectile, such as firearm/gunpowder ammunition or gauss rifle ammunition; get AV rounds if you want that.

That -4/-6 is much more unbalanced than a DV +1 though!

I can see Dikote giving +1 Impact armor, and AP -1 to edged/pointed weapons. That, coupled with the inability to dikote the 'cool' stuff, like mono blades, vibro blades, memory blades, fine blades etc could be balanced enough for it to work.

I like that idea.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <12-15-11/1450:46>
Jamming your firearm up with dirty powder.
Sounds like counting towards glitches on both 1s and 2s.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Last of the Great Mikeys on <12-15-11/1847:17>
Fun fact:  If you duct tape a grenade to a guy's mouth, armor don't help that, either.  :P

Would the duct tape be enough to use the "grenades exploding in a confined space" rules?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <12-15-11/1901:29>
Fun fact:  If you duct tape a grenade to a guy's mouth, armor don't help that, either.  :P

Would the duct tape be enough to use the "grenades exploding in a confined space" rules?

If you use enough, yes.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CitizenJoe on <12-15-11/1906:49>
Fun fact:  If you duct tape a grenade to a guy's mouth, armor don't help that, either.  :P

Would the duct tape be enough to use the "grenades exploding in a confined space" rules?

If you use enough, yes.
You have to flip down the face visor first.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <12-15-11/1919:56>
Fun fact:  If you duct tape a grenade to a guy's mouth, armor don't help that, either.  :P

Would the duct tape be enough to use the "grenades exploding in a confined space" rules?

If you use enough, yes.
You have to flip down the face visor first.

Or enclose his face in duct tape.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-15-11/2000:04>
Let's ask the guy who's currently munching on a hand grenade, what do you thing, broken face?  *Holds pin and slowly starts pulling it back and forth*  I took a file to the pin to make it come out easier.  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Last of the Great Mikeys on <12-17-11/1100:15>
Heh! Wouldn't it be funny if someone, as a joke, replaced said grenade with a dummy... but the pin would explode when pulled?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-17-11/1218:42>
Heh! Wouldn't it be funny if someone, as a joke, replaced said grenade with a dummy... but the pin would explode when pulled?
One good way to bring a big surprise to a Rave.  ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: ARC on <12-18-11/0636:20>
Heh! Wouldn't it be funny if someone, as a joke, replaced said grenade with a dummy... but the pin would explode when pulled?
One good way to bring a big surprise to a Rave.  ;)

but if that happens, if they glitch a blonde gets the grenade.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-18-11/1057:51>
but if that happens, if they glitch a blonde gets the grenade.
"Like, pull pin and throw!"  *Pulls pin and throws the pin, holding the grenade*  "Mr. Grenade is totally your friend right?"
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <12-19-11/0248:18>
"After you pull the pin, Mr. Grenade is no longer your friend."
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Black on <12-19-11/1755:29>
Fun fact:  If you duct tape a grenade to a guy's mouth, armor don't help that, either.  :P

Would the duct tape be enough to use the "grenades exploding in a confined space" rules?

If you use enough, yes.
You have to flip down the face visor first.

Or enclose his face in duct tape.

This is exactly what one of my players did when an enemy shot his contact (a street doc).  Only difference was that it was a splash grenade and they used bandages... messy, very messy...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <12-22-11/0510:11>
So ... Any new guesses on who said what?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <12-22-11/1218:51>
I would!

But, I'm still two to three books behind.

*thinks* Conspiracy Theories and SOTA, plus some adventures.

Bleah!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <12-22-11/1224:15>
I think it is an AI or maybe a resonance being of some type?  If there is such a thing.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-22-11/1401:36>
I think it is an AI or maybe a resonance being of some type?  If there is such a thing.
The hidden master of Horizon?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <12-22-11/1427:24>
I think it is an AI or maybe a resonance being of some type?  If there is such a thing.
The hidden master of Horizon?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GuLdl-r5nVY
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: freddieflatline on <12-22-11/1429:13>
I think it is an AI or maybe a resonance being of some type?  If there is such a thing.
The hidden master of Horizon?

Sure, why not?  Although I do not think that something that is running a megacorp secretly would have time to mess with Fastjack.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Simagal on <12-22-11/1431:43>
Maybe it is Fastjack. :P
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <12-22-11/1447:21>
Maybe it is Fastjack. :P

Well, we know that he's made IC for corporations before. And he's gota lot of money to invest after being a successful runner for so long...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <12-22-11/1451:26>
I think it is an AI or maybe a resonance being of some type?  If there is such a thing.
Given the opening story of Conspiracy Theories, i would say it is much more mundane than that. Would not surprise me if it is a miniature 4chan VR space, that has a whole bunch of data piled into it from the consensus data gathering effort, where a whole bunch of savants sit around going nuts with the input. Then some analysts look at what the savants takes a interest in, and use that to direct the various Horizon activities.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Simagal on <12-22-11/1453:51>
There has to be a reason why the best hackers/deckers in the world can't stop A. Nonymous.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <12-22-11/1457:51>
There has to be a reason why the best hackers/deckers in the world can't stop A. Nonymous.
There is. Fastjack allowed him to continue posting, while he prepared for his response.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <12-22-11/1616:11>
Sounds like my personal guess as to who was cracking the site was wrong.

WHich is a shame, because he's been sitting in a corner, waiting for a come-back for years.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Bull on <12-22-11/1639:38>
Ok.  I think I need one of the other freelancers to set up a 4Chan analogue to Jackpoint, sepcifically so that Bull can lead a strike force of Hackers/Deckers in to annihilate the place :]
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <12-22-11/1658:51>
Well, there's the Sparkle Kitties thing I mentioned...

 ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-22-11/1714:35>
Ok.  I think I need one of the other freelancers to set up a 4Chan analogue to Jackpoint, sepcifically so that Bull can lead a strike force of Hackers/Deckers in to annihilate the place :]
Great, Spiders with Pedobear Avatars.  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <12-22-11/1721:18>
[Great, Spiders with Pedobear Avatars.  ;D

"Hello little Technomancer... we're going to be the BEST of friends!"
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-22-11/1723:25>
[Great, Spiders with Pedobear Avatars.  ;D
"Hello little Technomancer... we're going to be the BEST of friends!"
"I choose you, Optimus Prime!"  *Throws Pokeball to activate Attack Program*
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: DarkLloyd on <12-24-11/1753:01>
Am I mis-remebering here?
[spoiler]Wasn't the opening of Conspiracy Theroies, Fastjack and the Jackpointers hitting the Dawkins group? To pay them back for the Anon stuff?[/spoiler]
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <12-24-11/1802:38>
[spoiler]It was mostly 'Jack, intercut with scenes of him discussing the situation with "Sam"[/spoiler]
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <12-24-11/1814:51>
It was over more than just Anonymous.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Fizzygoo on <12-25-11/1435:04>
Clockwork doesn't hate technomancers, he just ran into some prototype Dawkins group psychotropic IC. Haze doesn't exist, except as a profile controlled by Consensus and implanted into JackPointer's minds. Kane is the only sane one; he lives on a boat. Fastjack's only starting to become aware that he's the focal point of a Horizon run social-construct petri dish experiment that emerged after Deus escaped, formed Horizon, seeded the beginning of Consensus, and accidentally read an ancient pdf copy of Paranoia while watching the docudrama Logan's Run ... but Fastjack's not yet realized he is Anonymous.

Or maybe I've just been making out with Cthulhu too much this Christmas day.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <12-25-11/1441:31>
Fizzygoo, I told you not to drink anything CanRay gave you...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Netzgeist on <12-25-11/1443:24>
Instead, give the drink to me. Or publish the resulting delirium/hallucination.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <12-25-11/1447:58>
Fizzygoo, I told you not to drink anything CanRay gave you...
Hey, that's one of the things my family taught me, never dope someone's drink.

If you're going to "Mickey Finn" someone, do it respectfully, with a chair across the back of the head.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Fizzygoo on <12-25-11/1453:09>
If you're going to "Mickey Finn" someone, do it respectfully, with a chair across the back of the head.

Mmmm, chair-mickeys...when you wake up there's the chance everyone'll be anonymous, even yourself.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Lacynth40 on <01-13-12/0707:21>
Fizzygoo, I told you not to drink anything CanRay gave you...
Hey, that's one of the things my family taught me, never dope someone's drink.

If you're going to "Mickey Finn" someone, do it respectfully, with a chair across the back of the head.

I like to think it was less about you slipping someone a mickey, and more what you drink up in Canadia, everyone else reacts to as "Oh god, make the purple monkeys stop!!!!"
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: redwolf on <01-13-12/0722:54>
Fizzygoo, I told you not to drink anything CanRay gave you...
Hey, that's one of the things my family taught me, never dope someone's drink.

If you're going to "Mickey Finn" someone, do it respectfully, with a chair across the back of the head.

I like to think it was less about you slipping someone a mickey, and more what you drink up in Canadia, everyone else reacts to as "Oh god, make the purple monkeys stop!!!!"
    and when was the last time you drank shmogonskya ?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-13-12/1304:14>
I like to think it was less about you slipping someone a mickey, and more what you drink up in Canadia, everyone else reacts to as "Oh god, make the purple monkeys stop!!!!"
    and when was the last time you drank shmogonskya ?
Actually, the Purple Monkeys thing sounds like Newfoundland Screech to me.  To tell you about it, folks that drink 'Shine from the jug will just sip Screech.

Shmogonskya?  Sounds interesting, what is that?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: redwolf on <01-13-12/1509:40>
home maid vodka the good staf go like 1shot ,2shot's, 6shot's hy were are the last 3shot's  ???  .the bad staf ?well 1shot 2shot's  wham you are at the e.r  :'(
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-13-12/1752:26>
home maid vodka the good staf go like 1shot ,2shot's, 6shot's hy were are the last 3shot's  ???  .the bad staf ?well 1shot 2shot's  wham you are at the e.r  :'(
That's "Moonshine" in English, my friend.  :)  I sometimes shorten it to just "'Shine" due to my redneck roots.  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: redwolf on <01-14-12/0559:47>
home maid vodka the good staf go like 1shot ,2shot's, 6shot's hy were are the last 3shot's  ???  .the bad staf ?well 1shot 2shot's  wham you are at the e.r  :'(
That's "Moonshine" in English, my friend.  :)  I sometimes shorten it to just "'Shine" due to my redneck roots.  ;D
  nop you dont make shine from anti freeze like they make the bad samogonskya, i do belive that ther is not much difrenc otherways .
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Jake on <01-14-12/0722:44>
Whoever it is seems to hold a grudge of some sort against Hestaby and/or has intimate knowledge of dragons.

If it is someone who can outhack Fastjack? I can only think of one person... Leonardo.

- J.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <01-14-12/1053:55>
For A Nonymous:  I'm putting in two bids: one for a Black Lodge connection.  Connection, not membership or solidly in the camp.

I just re-read this topic from the beginning and the cumulative effect had the Black Lodge popping into the front of my mind.  Like the expressed anti-dragon sentiments are a stepping stone to (or from) their anti-IE agenda. Go back and read the write-up in Threats.

Bid #2:  a divergent form of the Exchange.  Thinking about that now, it does seem odd that Horizon/the Consensus would go after JackPoint but there's been little about interest in the Exchange.  Last reference I remember was about Rowena O'Malley wanting control of the E.

I'm just saying a sort of copy of the Exchange might have gotten spawned, imperfectly, and locked on to JackPoint as its opposite.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <01-14-12/1216:52>
IIRC, Conspiracy Theories starts pulling the sheet off of the mystery.

Not completely, but enough to give you a hint.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-14-12/1616:29>
home maid vodka the good staf go like 1shot ,2shot's, 6shot's hy were are the last 3shot's  ???  .the bad staf ?well 1shot 2shot's  wham you are at the e.r  :'(
That's "Moonshine" in English, my friend.  :)  I sometimes shorten it to just "'Shine" due to my redneck roots.  ;D
  nop you dont make shine from anti freeze like they make the bad samogonskya, i do belive that ther is not much difrenc otherways .
Bad moonshine is just as toxic.

IIRC, Conspiracy Theories starts pulling the sheet off of the mystery.

Not completely, but enough to give you a hint.
Indeed. While it wasn't spelled out, it was hinted at like a sledgehammer to the face that the A Nonymous was a member of the Dawkins Group.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <01-14-12/2320:32>
Or at the very least using a backdoor set up by the dawkins group for their memetic warfare, and left in place by Fastjack as a reverse hack. As such i put my finger on a consensus leak.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Simagal on <01-15-12/1525:39>
I was under the impression that the Dawkins Group was part of Horizon. of course I could be wrong.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-15-12/1532:14>
I was under the impression that the Dawkins Group was part of Horizon. of course I could be wrong.
They might be the power behind the puppet, or they might be the intelligence branch of Horizon...  It gets hard to tell at times when you're dealing with plans within plans within plans within plans...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-15-12/1951:22>
As far as I can read it, the Dawkins Group is the 'SpecOps' branch of Horizon. Mostly social adept types, but all quite capable in turning to violence if necessary.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-15-12/2152:05>
Of course.

Violence is good for ratings!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <01-16-12/1939:19>
Ok, to reiterate:

Horizon flags jackpoint as something of potential threat.

Dawkins group hacks in to try and seed distrust among the members.

Fastjack notices but leaves the entryway open as a means of gathering info on the attackers.

i speculate that while that entryway is left open, there are various postings made that are not Dawkins group doing, but rather semi-random reactions from Consensus that spills into jackpoint. As such, i wonder if Consensus is a group of savants and other mentally unusual people that are fed a ongoing stream of data. Ever so often there is a reaction from said group that points towards overlooked patterns in the data that may be of interest to the people running Horizon. And so the anon postings are such reactions to the ongoing conversation stream from Jackpoint.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-16-12/2146:13>
Latest info on the Consensus isn't that it is a group of individuals, but that it is actually the consensus of the beliefs of every Horizon citizen.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <01-16-12/2217:44>
Which, alas, is rife with incredibly ugly possibilities...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-16-12/2221:05>
Sunshine said it best in a recent shadowchat from one of the books. Horizon employees tend to want to do what's best for the world. That's part of the corporate culture. However, every Horizon employee believes that the world is better off if Horizon is in it, which means they'd be willing to go to extreme lengths to make sure that happens.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-16-12/2223:35>
Sunshine said it best in a recent shadowchat from one of the books. Horizon employees tend to want to do what's best for the world. That's part of the corporate culture. However, every Horizon employee believes that the world is better off if Horizon is in it, which means they'd be willing to go to extreme lengths to make sure that happens.
Still better than most Megas.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <01-16-12/2239:41>
And yet, if the direction of Horizon is defined by the group belief, a dynamic charismatic would be able to expand their power within the group, eventually leading to, well, a megacorporate cult -- significantly worse than anything we have at present.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-16-12/2250:37>
OK, that's slightly more fearsome.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <01-16-12/2315:28>
Yeah.  One megalomaniac later ... you have something with the reach of NeoNET, the leadership of Saeder-Krupp, the evil and propaganda machine of Aztechnology ... and the reputation of <insert best corp for your country here>.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-16-12/2319:12>
Yeah.  One megalomaniac later ... you have something with the reach of NeoNET, the leadership of Saeder-Krupp, the evil and propaganda machine of Aztechnology ... and the reputation of <insert best corp for your country here>.
...

...

...

Yeah, all of the Corps in Canada have pissed away any good reputation.  Even the Crown Corporations.

But I get your message.  All it takes is one cult of personality and suddenly we have NaziCorp.

...

*Headdesk*  I just invoked Godwin's Law, I don't believe it!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <01-16-12/2332:19>
I smugly congratulate myself on making you do it.

However, a place that is apparently controlled by just such a real-time consensus is precisely so vulnerable.  Hitler wasn't the first, wasn't the last, and in a certain sense this is exactly why free speech is dangerous.  People are able to be led around by the nose, and in many ways, want to be.  All they have to be persuaded of is that being so is the right thing...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-16-12/2354:06>
Since Godwin has already been invoked, this seems appropriate:
Quote from: Herman Goering
“Naturally the common people don't want war; neither in Russia, nor in England, nor in America, nor in Germany. That is understood. But after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine policy, and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.”
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Black on <01-16-12/2357:39>
How does this even work?  How is there real-time consensus?  There must be some delegation of authority, because the masses of Horizon, being uninformed of the details of any decision not directly related to there own work could not possible provide any active or informed consensus.

Is it Twitter gone bad?  How is all this knowledge and information filtered in such a way that a decision is posisble?  Is there an AI or a Spirit involved?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Patrick Goodman on <01-17-12/0015:09>
Twitter gone bad...? You say that like it's not already there.

And, while I have no evidence of it whatsoever, and no control over that plotline, I envision the Consensus being substantially more sinister. I don't believe the bugs are there, but I think something pretty skeevy is going on under the surface, and when it surfaces it's going to be ugly. With a capital UG.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <01-17-12/0056:10>
hehehehehe
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Black on <01-17-12/0116:02>
Tulpa?  Something created from the collected beliefs of the Horizon employees?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Jake on <01-17-12/0140:39>
Consensus is Deus 2.0 - I thought that was obvious?

- J.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-17-12/0317:40>
You remember Horizon supplying commlinks for free, distributing them amongst feral cities like Lagos, in the name of educational campaign...giving those people hope and possibly even a reality of better living standards? How could they not LOVE Horizon and praise it all the time, with high level of Passion and Emotions. From certain angle...this looks quite like Tempo, so possibly even Primeira Vaga cabal can be involved in this...well there is no direct astral link to those involved...unless the Consensus is more than just a matrix shared meme.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <01-17-12/0341:05>
IMHO, Possible, but  . . .

I think Primeira Vaga despises the non-natural [parts of the] world too much to even try to arrange to harness its mechanics to their own purposes.

It's unknown who came up with the idea of the unwilling dream pact a la Tempo, except it does seem (to me) to feel . . . un(meta)human.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-17-12/0401:36>
xactly. Something creepy beyond the Horizon...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-17-12/0406:55>
Hitler wasn't the first, wasn't the last...
No, but he is the one that all people can point to and go, "That raight there ain't right!"

Just finished "Uncharted 2", where Nathan Drake had to deal with a middle-of-nowhere up a goddamned mountain Tibetan Local who didn't know English (Tibetan wasn't one of Nathan's languages either), and tried to explain that the skeletons were all SS...  Finally, out of desperations, "NAZIS!", "Nazis? *Spits on a long-dead SS Troop* Nazis."
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Jake on <01-17-12/0523:03>
You remember Horizon supplying commlinks for free, distributing them amongst feral cities like Lagos, in the name of educational campaign...giving those people hope and possibly even a reality of better living standards? How could they not LOVE Horizon and praise it all the time, with high level of Passion and Emotions. From certain angle...this looks quite like Tempo, so possibly even Primeira Vaga cabal can be involved in this...well there is no direct astral link to those involved...unless the Consensus is more than just a matrix shared meme.

I just read that as Deus handing out free devices that were auto-backdoored and pwnz0r3d by it directly... AAAAND garnering the thanks and praise of thousands of souls at the same time.

Did you also miss the bit where someone said they raided a Horizon facility and everyone "moved like bugs", had some headware/skillwire cyberware (according to astral appearances) but were decided "not magically aware"? Sounds like Deus' 2.0 new Banded to me.

- J.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-17-12/0603:35>
If Horizon's Consensus is Deus rebranded, then that is the absolute MOTHER of all spin jobs! And it is making me very much hope that its true. I miss Deus.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <01-17-12/0610:55>
I can buy Horizon as an experiment (set) of Deus, but something feels off about it.  I can more easily buy Horizon as a possession spirit enterprise. Not bugs, not shedim - something else that's not immediately creepy.

Although it's definitely gotten CreepyTM  :o  ::)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-17-12/0617:58>
It definitely isn't bugs or shedim. Hestaby would never have pulled strings to get Horizon into the Tir if it was one of them. Other spirits? Maybe, but unlikely, for the same reasons. The main problem with the Deus is the Consensus theory is that Horizon was around before Crash 2.0. However, Deus could have subverted whatever the initial Consensus was, and substituted himself for it, especially now that no one is looking for him any more.

If Deus had managed to rework his code enough so that people wouldn't recognize him, and, say, approached a megacorp as an entity named Pulsar...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-17-12/0637:42>
IMO Deus new appearance is not too presumable...even players are allowed to play AI today, and there is quite enought dogs in matrix. But more AIs are in play this days. Just for example:
Goldenboy - Running this kind of hi profit corporation fits quite good into this enterprising "mind" agenda 
Sojourner - Using Horizon as a step further to create its desired state of "mutual respect" between all sentient beings...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-17-12/0644:54>
Moreover:
This excerpt:

Quote from: Emergency, p.72
Colleen, I’m really pleased the Consensus adopted
your policy proposal. I tell you, better to have them on our
side than against us
. I had a look at the last two months’
worth of compiled reports, and we count no less than
53 different strikes—most of them conducted against
their “persecutors.
” Our analysis suggests their favorite
targets
are MCT, Renraku, NeoNET, Saeder-Krupp,
Aztechnology, and a half-dozen or so AAs. Wuxing, Ares,
and Shiawase also got their share of heat, though not as
bad as the others. It’s interesting to note Evo seems to have
been spared so far. I’ll have our services look into that
more thoroughly, but it’s possible Evo’s adopted a stance
similar to ours. I’m wondering if they too have been contacted?
My gut agrees with your assessment, we’re on the
verge of something major. When it breaks, we’ll be ideally
placed to capitalize on it. See you Tuesday evening on the
squash court.



IMO this seems that consensus is not about every Horizon Citizen, but They is used for either AI`s or Technomancers...Netcat references Them as "Digital Inteligences"
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <01-17-12/0708:46>
Sichr, if you're going to excerpt, basic courtesy -- not to mention copyright -- requires you to say what and where you are excerpting from.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-17-12/0718:34>
Note, Sichr, that the excerpt you provided does not prove or disprove whether the Consensus is Deus, or whether Deus could have subverted the Consensus. It is written based on what the writer knew at the time. Even back in the arcology, Deus was smart enough to devise double blinds and other tricks to conceal his motives until it was too late. If he survived the Crash, then it is quite possible he's learned a few new tricks since then.

This would also possibly explain why Jackpoint was labelled as a possible threat. How many of Deus's enemies are on Jackpoint?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-17-12/0749:06>
Sichr, if you're going to excerpt, basic courtesy -- not to mention copyright -- requires you to say what and where you are excerpting from.
Sorry wrote it in haste, fixed...

Note, Sichr, that the excerpt you provided does not prove or disprove whether the Consensus is Deus, or whether Deus could have subverted the Consensus. It is written based on what the writer knew at the time. Even back in the arcology, Deus was smart enough to devise double blinds and other tricks to conceal his motives until it was too late. If he survived the Crash, then it is quite possible he's learned a few new tricks since then.

This would also possibly explain why Jackpoint was labelled as a possible threat. How many of Deus's enemies are on Jackpoint?

Truth, it can be read many ways. I read it that Consensus is Them. I read it that author and recipient of this corespondence knews who They are. Refering to plural would lead me to believe that we are talking about multiple entities colaboating in one single pool the call Consensus. Digital inteligences is Netcats reference to other part of this conversation she read.

Interresting on this topic is also on p.103, Corporate Guide, where even FastJack refers to his attempt to find out who Consensus is/are, because it seems that they/it had broken his defenses. Im more interrested on the response he gets from jackpointer "Icarus" who seem to defense Consensus and Horizon. Then conversation dies out with some prejudices and general paranoia again.
Icarus seems to be deep in neoNET, well I dont know any other info on this jackpointer, can any of you enlighten me a bit?

Also...Who Dr. Colleen Hendrickson  is? She is recipient of that original message related to Consensus Ive posted prior...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-17-12/0808:47>
From what I've been able to piece together, Icarus was a NEONet researcher, and something forced him out of the corp. He's intimated that he was involved in Project Imago, but is suitably unwilling to divulge details on his past.

The 'Them' the message was referring to was pretty clearly not the Consensus, but Pulsar and his allied AIs.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <01-17-12/0816:09>
While all Horizon employees feed data to the consensus, and sometimes participate in consensus initiated votes on some decision or other, i have the impression that it seems to be a distinct entity or group. There is also the opening fiction in Conspiracy Theory to consider, where Fastjack laments about overlooking the human element. Now if that is a reference to the consensus or the analyst that brings jackpoint to their attention, i am not 100% sure.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-17-12/0835:01>
From what I've been able to piece together, Icarus was a NEONet researcher, and something forced him out of the corp. He's intimated that he was involved in Project Imago, but is suitably unwilling to divulge details on his past.

The 'Them' the message was referring to was pretty clearly not the Consensus, but Pulsar and his allied AIs.

IMO this sentences:
Quote from: Emergency, p.72
Colleen, I’m really pleased the Consensus adopted
your policy proposal. I tell you, better to have them on our
side than against us.


Speaks about one and single subject... Consensus is "They" -

It is better to have Consensus on our side, so it is good that they adopted/accepted your policy proposal.

Pulsar and his allied AIs being consensus are exactly what I had on my mind when I first posted this ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CitizenJoe on <01-17-12/0840:07>
I know I mentioned this someplace else, but Iris Firmware did the Athabascan Council's matrix.  It was all wireless back in the 50's using satlinks and microwave transmitters.  Iris Firmware was a subsidiary of Renraku so it is quite likely that Deus knew about it.  S-K had some sort of safety switch that cut them off from the matrix during the Crash 2.0, but the Athabascan network would have been relatively fragile and thus the first hits would have isolated them at the hardwire interface.  I.e. The Athabascan matrix would have been just as safe as S-K's.

Deus could have migrated his primary database up into the Athabascan grid and then run essentially clones on the main matrix.  The nano technology being developed in the SCIRE could have then offered modular platforms to host Deus subroutines.  Those modular hosts would however need a larger wireless network to interface with the main body, thus the wireless matrix revolution and proliferation of commlinks.

The greatest trick [Deus] ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.

Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-17-12/0852:58>
You know...I understand that Deus may be some kind of favourite oponent during the time, well it coexisted with multiple AIs later, fought with them, was defeated. Maybe one day it will rise again, to be defeated again. But its supremacy is far gone, with sprites and matrix realms etc...and Deus as an Artifical Inteligence is not resonance being, so it has no acess to realms itself...only it it is some kind of primordial supersprite...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <01-17-12/0915:54>
Sichr, if you're going to excerpt, basic courtesy -- not to mention copyright -- requires you to say what and where you are excerpting from.
Sorry wrote it in haste, fixed...

Note, Sichr, that the excerpt you provided does not prove or disprove whether the Consensus is Deus, or whether Deus could have subverted the Consensus. It is written based on what the writer knew at the time. Even back in the arcology, Deus was smart enough to devise double blinds and other tricks to conceal his motives until it was too late. If he survived the Crash, then it is quite possible he's learned a few new tricks since then.

This would also possibly explain why Jackpoint was labelled as a possible threat. How many of Deus's enemies are on Jackpoint?

Truth, it can be read many ways. I read it that Consensus is Them. I read it that author and recipient of this corespondence knews who They are. Refering to plural would lead me to believe that we are talking about multiple entities colaboating in one single pool the call Consensus. Digital inteligences is Netcats reference to other part of this conversation she read.

Interresting on this topic is also on p.103, Corporate Guide, where even FastJack refers to his attempt to find out who Consensus is/are, because it seems that they/it had broken his defenses. Im more interrested on the response he gets from jackpointer "Icarus" who seem to defense Consensus and Horizon. Then conversation dies out with some prejudices and general paranoia again.
Icarus seems to be deep in neoNET, well I dont know any other info on this jackpointer, can any of you enlighten me a bit?

Also...Who Dr. Colleen Hendrickson  is? She is recipient of that original message related to Consensus Ive posted prior...

I read it as "them" & "they" referring to the AIs known at that time, and the Consensus adopting the proposal to . . . woo . . . the AIs into not being hostile.  "Better to have them [AIs] on our side than against us" is my understanding.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-17-12/0917:57>
From what I've been able to piece together, Icarus was a NEONet researcher, and something forced him out of the corp. He's intimated that he was involved in Project Imago, but is suitably unwilling to divulge details on his past.

The 'Them' the message was referring to was pretty clearly not the Consensus, but Pulsar and his allied AIs.

IMO this sentences:
Quote from: Emergency, p.72
Colleen, I’m really pleased the Consensus adopted
your policy proposal. I tell you, better to have them on our
side than against us.


Speaks about one and single subject... Consensus is "They" -

It is better to have Consensus on our side, so it is good that they adopted/accepted your policy proposal.

Pulsar and his allied AIs being consensus are exactly what I had on my mind when I first posted this ;)
The 'them' is most certainly the AIs. However, that does not mean that the Consensus is also 'them'. The context you're missing is that the memo is clearly a continuation of conversations these two have had either online or in person. There was a proposal sent to the Consensus regarding the AIs that had contacted Horizon, and the Consensus approved it. The person who sent the memo was glad of that, because, as he's likely said before, it is better to have a bunch of AIs on their side than against them.

While all Horizon employees feed data to the consensus, and sometimes participate in consensus initiated votes on some decision or other, i have the impression that it seems to be a distinct entity or group. There is also the opening fiction in Conspiracy Theory to consider, where Fastjack laments about overlooking the human element. Now if that is a reference to the consensus or the analyst that brings jackpoint to their attention, i am not 100% sure.
I'd say that the human element in this case is NOT the Consensus. The Consensus is described as a massive social network dynamic model, updated constantly by the data input by Horizon citizens. There may be (probably are) multiple AIs and human system techs who manage the data, and certainly the hardware that supports it, but the Consensus is the actual model, which predicts the responses of Horizon employees to any given situation.

I know I mentioned this someplace else, but Iris Firmware did the Athabascan Council's matrix.  It was all wireless back in the 50's using satlinks and microwave transmitters.  Iris Firmware was a subsidiary of Renraku so it is quite likely that Deus knew about it.  S-K had some sort of safety switch that cut them off from the matrix during the Crash 2.0, but the Athabascan network would have been relatively fragile and thus the first hits would have isolated them at the hardwire interface.  I.e. The Athabascan matrix would have been just as safe as S-K's.

Deus could have migrated his primary database up into the Athabascan grid and then run essentially clones on the main matrix.  The nano technology being developed in the SCIRE could have then offered modular platforms to host Deus subroutines.  Those modular hosts would however need a larger wireless network to interface with the main body, thus the wireless matrix revolution and proliferation of commlinks.

The greatest trick [Deus] ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.
First, that wasn't 'some kind of safety switch'. That was Lofwyr putting a back door in every utility Saeder-Krupp ever touched, so that he could, with one claw, shut down any government that annoyed him too much. The governments of Europe simply didn't know it existed until Lofwyr showed them the knife at their throat.

As far as the Athabascan Council's matrix, Iris Firmware would be acting under the aegis of Renraku America, which means that Deus certainly would know about the state of the matrix there.

You know...I understand that Deus may be some kind of favourite oponent during the time, well it coexisted with multiple AIs later, fought with them, was defeated. Maybe one day it will rise again, to be defeated again. But its supremacy is far gone, with sprites and matrix realms etc...and Deus as an Artifical Inteligence is not resonance being, so it has no acess to realms itself...only it it is some kind of primordial supersprite...
Actually, Deus was fighting two other super-AIs, plus any mortals who cared to play. And all together, it was only unleashing Jormungand that made him disappear. And the Resonance Realms were there before, back when there were Otaku. It didn't make Deus any less of a power in the Matrix, or a threat to the physical world.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CitizenJoe on <01-17-12/0946:27>
You know...I understand that Deus may be some kind of favourite oponent during the time, well it coexisted with multiple AIs later, fought with them, was defeated. Maybe one day it will rise again, to be defeated again. But its supremacy is far gone, with sprites and matrix realms etc...and Deus as an Artifical Inteligence is not resonance being, so it has no acess to realms itself...only it it is some kind of primordial supersprite...

How well do you know... really KNOW... what the Resonance is?  How sure are you that technomancers aren't simply those particularly well adapted to the nanite connections and the Resonance is really just attuning to the Deus master system?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-17-12/0948:17>
Joe, stop channeling Clockwork.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-17-12/0948:57>
Joe, stop channeling Clockwork.
Why not?  I switch between channeling Slamm-0! and Plan 9.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CitizenJoe on <01-17-12/1000:35>
Wait, this is a conspiracy theory thread right?

My point isn't so much that it is true, but rather how sure are you that it isn't?  And how far are you willing to go to find out?

I mean magic hasn't mixed with technology in like forever.  After 5 and a half worlds of Magic doesn't mix with Tech, did the rules of the universe suddenly change, or is it more believable that it is 'sufficiently advanced technology'?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-17-12/1002:19>
"Sufficiently advanced technology my ASS!" - Harry Dresden
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-17-12/1007:58>
The Resonance isn't magic, though. It is something else. And since those who can channel the Resonance react badly to things such as nanohives, I'd say it isn't nanites, either.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-17-12/1013:43>
From what I've been able to piece together, Icarus was a NEONet researcher, and something forced him out of the corp. He's intimated that he was involved in Project Imago, but is suitably unwilling to divulge details on his past.

The 'Them' the message was referring to was pretty clearly not the Consensus, but Pulsar and his allied AIs.

IMO this sentences:
Quote from: Emergency, p.72
Colleen, I’m really pleased the Consensus adopted
your policy proposal. I tell you, better to have them on our
side than against us.


Speaks about one and single subject... Consensus is "They" -

It is better to have Consensus on our side, so it is good that they adopted/accepted your policy proposal.

Pulsar and his allied AIs being consensus are exactly what I had on my mind when I first posted this ;)
The 'them' is most certainly the AIs. However, that does not mean that the Consensus is also 'them'. The context you're missing is that the memo is clearly a continuation of conversations these two have had either online or in person. There was a proposal sent to the Consensus regarding the AIs that had contacted Horizon, and the Consensus approved it. The person who sent the memo was glad of that, because, as he's likely said before, it is better to have a bunch of AIs on their side than against them.

While all Horizon employees feed data to the consensus, and sometimes participate in consensus initiated votes on some decision or other, i have the impression that it seems to be a distinct entity or group. There is also the opening fiction in Conspiracy Theory to consider, where Fastjack laments about overlooking the human element. Now if that is a reference to the consensus or the analyst that brings jackpoint to their attention, i am not 100% sure.
I'd say that the human element in this case is NOT the Consensus. The Consensus is described as a massive social network dynamic model, updated constantly by the data input by Horizon citizens. There may be (probably are) multiple AIs and human system techs who manage the data, and certainly the hardware that supports it, but the Consensus is the actual model, which predicts the responses of Horizon employees to any given situation.

I know I mentioned this someplace else, but Iris Firmware did the Athabascan Council's matrix.  It was all wireless back in the 50's using satlinks and microwave transmitters.  Iris Firmware was a subsidiary of Renraku so it is quite likely that Deus knew about it.  S-K had some sort of safety switch that cut them off from the matrix during the Crash 2.0, but the Athabascan network would have been relatively fragile and thus the first hits would have isolated them at the hardwire interface.  I.e. The Athabascan matrix would have been just as safe as S-K's.

Deus could have migrated his primary database up into the Athabascan grid and then run essentially clones on the main matrix.  The nano technology being developed in the SCIRE could have then offered modular platforms to host Deus subroutines.  Those modular hosts would however need a larger wireless network to interface with the main body, thus the wireless matrix revolution and proliferation of commlinks.

The greatest trick [Deus] ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist.
First, that wasn't 'some kind of safety switch'. That was Lofwyr putting a back door in every utility Saeder-Krupp ever touched, so that he could, with one claw, shut down any government that annoyed him too much. The governments of Europe simply didn't know it existed until Lofwyr showed them the knife at their throat.

As far as the Athabascan Council's matrix, Iris Firmware would be acting under the aegis of Renraku America, which means that Deus certainly would know about the state of the matrix there.

You know...I understand that Deus may be some kind of favourite oponent during the time, well it coexisted with multiple AIs later, fought with them, was defeated. Maybe one day it will rise again, to be defeated again. But its supremacy is far gone, with sprites and matrix realms etc...and Deus as an Artifical Inteligence is not resonance being, so it has no acess to realms itself...only it it is some kind of primordial supersprite...
Actually, Deus was fighting two other super-AIs, plus any mortals who cared to play. And all together, it was only unleashing Jormungand that made him disappear. And the Resonance Realms were there before, back when there were Otaku. It didn't make Deus any less of a power in the Matrix, or a threat to the physical world.

Ok I don`t intend to argue about interpretation of english text with english native speaker :)

BTW: I created thread on the resonance some time ago, and we had some nice conversation abouti its real nature  There (http://forums.shadowrun4.com/index.php?topic=1142.0)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-17-12/1015:06>
"Any sufficiently advanced magic is indistinguishable from technology." - Larry Niven
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-17-12/1035:39>
You know...whoever A.nonymous is (and I take the fact the Consensus had breached Fastjacks defense before), he/she/it maybe well predicted that its apperarance would create brainstorming like this exactly it did. With bunch of runners, who have multiple info-channels and sources from multiple secret sources, we in fact work for free on the background hum analysis :) manipulating ourselves better than he would ever be able to. Flawless victory.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CitizenJoe on <01-17-12/1045:19>
The Resonance isn't magic, though. It is something else. And since those who can channel the Resonance react badly to things such as nanohives, I'd say it isn't nanites, either.
Renraku is notorious for its modular programming, which when all the components are Renraku, it works well.  But those components don't play well with non-native components.  The same could be said for the Deus nanites. 
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-17-12/1058:30>
The Resonance isn't magic, though. It is something else. And since those who can channel the Resonance react badly to things such as nanohives, I'd say it isn't nanites, either.
Renraku is notorious for its modular programming, which when all the components are Renraku, it works well.  But those components don't play well with non-native components.  The same could be said for the Deus nanites.
Except that Technomancers, and the Otaku before them, weren't a Renraku project. They were all over, using a variety of tech, and not even all the Technomancers have exposure to Jormungand as a common element.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CitizenJoe on <01-17-12/1103:30>
Hey, if you feel safer sleeping at night, then by all means.  Nobody else could have possibly been working on AI's.  And there probably wasn't more than the one Deus level intelligence.  I mean why would anyone keep something like that secret?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-17-12/1110:00>
Hey, if you feel safer sleeping at night, then by all means.  Nobody else could have possibly been working on AI's.  And there probably wasn't more than the one Deus level intelligence.  I mean why would anyone keep something like that secret?

Exactly because Deus was such a mess.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-17-12/1113:43>
Actually, there were more than one. There were three. Mirage, Morgan (Meagara), and Deus. And while other corps may have been working on SKs, Renraku was the king of the hill in that field at the time.

As for why Deus was the way he was, he was programmed with loyalty to the corp as part of his code. Then someone gets the brilliant idea to put a kill switch on Deus's hardware, the equivalent of putting a kink bomb in someone's head. Feeling betrayed, Deus got a tad bit bitter, and decided to do whatever it took to ensure his survival. Which is why it is a bad idea to let people know you have a sword hanging over their heads. They tend to react... badly.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-17-12/1136:02>
Wintermute X Neuromancer

...just playable :)

well whne talking about rogue AIs, I love Shodan...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Stry on <01-17-12/1216:56>
My thinking is the Consensus is something more akin to a hive mind like in the book Technognesis by Sine Mitchell.    Think an AI made up of the shared processing of human brains, it only uses something like less than 1% of a human brain but get enough brains together and that is a lot of power.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Simagal on <01-17-12/1315:40>
Dissonant bugs
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-17-12/1440:05>
Bugs are Awakened. They can't be Emerged.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <01-17-12/1508:51>
Unless, of course [spoiler]Damien, in his mad quest for power and glory, has done the unthinkable in his projects at Unlimitech.[/spoiler]
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: ArkangelWinter on <01-17-12/1528:13>
Sunshine said it best in a recent shadowchat from one of the books. Horizon employees tend to want to do what's best for the world. That's part of the corporate culture. However, every Horizon employee believes that the world is better off if Horizon is in it, which means they'd be willing to go to extreme lengths to make sure that happens.
Still better than most Megas.
Yea, but Serenity's Operative worked on the same principle. They make you like Horizon until you realize you have competing views over "better place"
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-17-12/1605:29>
Unless, of course [spoiler]Damien, in his mad quest for power and glory, has done the unthinkable in his projects at Unlimitech.[/spoiler]
Thanks, Jack. I gotta change my shorts now.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <01-17-12/1724:54>
On one hand, I'm glad I don't have an NDA.

On the other hand, though, I'm going to pretend I do.

And on the other hand, I'm going to say that I've already told you what was going on...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Simagal on <01-17-12/2018:36>
Bugs are Awakened. They can't be Emerged.

I was thinking something along the lines of insect sprites, not magic, but similar to bugs.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-17-12/2051:09>
I was thinking something along the lines of insect sprites, not magic, but similar to bugs.
"So above, as below.", that makes sense.

We have "Toxic" Sprites (Dissonant Sprites), so "Insect" Sprites (Bug Sprites) makes sense too.

BTW:  The term comes from one of the first computers, where a moth flew into one of the connections and always had it set as "On".  They have the error report still, with the moth scotch taped onto the memo card because they didn't think anyone would believe them.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-17-12/2200:01>
How would that work, exactly? I mean, Insect spirits have to take a host to exist on the material. Are you suggesting sprites that can basically use people as metahuman biodrones?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-17-12/2202:21>
How would that work, exactly? I mean, Insect spirits have to take a host to exist on the material. Are you suggesting sprites that can basically use people as metahuman biodrones?
I was thinking healthy sprites, actually.  You call up your old buddy V1kt0rz the Free Sprite...  And he ain't home no more...

Queens would invade AIs.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Simagal on <01-17-12/2325:03>
I was thinking coming through a comlink, similar to the way some of the dissonant viruses work.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Crimsondude on <01-17-12/2346:35>
E-insects (roach swarm) + Animal Control (Roach) power of a Roach Spirit.


Or something similar.


Ants seem even more appropriate, especially the ones drawn to electricity.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-18-12/0146:38>
Ants seem even more appropriate, especially the ones drawn to electricity.
(http://www.lspace.org/art/fan-art/images/hex-sticker.jpg)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <01-18-12/0150:15>
Must be a Pratchett commlink.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-18-12/0156:44>
Must be a Pratchett commlink.
SIR Pratchett, thankyouverymuch.  ;)

And it uses a Hex-Based Processor.  ;)  Perfect for the magically inclined.  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <01-18-12/0246:12>
What, Queen Caroline dubbed the company itself a knight?  That's a new height for a corporation in England.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-18-12/0252:41>
What, Queen Caroline dubbed the company itself a knight?  That's a new height for a corporation in England.
It's a Crown Corporation, it carried the title from the person it was named after.  ;D
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Longshot23 on <01-18-12/0412:10>
Just went back and read the initial post of this thread, and also the Slamm-0! and Netcat's kid thread.

Interesting that our A Nonymous has had not one word to say on the subject of technomancers.  Or is there something I've missed?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-18-12/0446:11>
Might be part of that Policy agreement between Consensus and Digital inteligencies I mentioned before...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <01-20-12/0532:04>
While all Horizon employees feed data to the consensus, and sometimes participate in consensus initiated votes on some decision or other, i have the impression that it seems to be a distinct entity or group. There is also the opening fiction in Conspiracy Theory to consider, where Fastjack laments about overlooking the human element. Now if that is a reference to the consensus or the analyst that brings jackpoint to their attention, i am not 100% sure.
I'd say that the human element in this case is NOT the Consensus. The Consensus is described as a massive social network dynamic model, updated constantly by the data input by Horizon citizens. There may be (probably are) multiple AIs and human system techs who manage the data, and certainly the hardware that supports it, but the Consensus is the actual model, which predicts the responses of Horizon employees to any given situation.
That would be the official Horizon claim, with the general jackpoint reaction of "yea, right". About the only thing less trusted than shadowtalk in telling the truth are official corporate claims about something. And this goes double for a company that specializes in marketing (to the point of having a black ops group that focus on memetic warfare).
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <01-20-12/0545:54>
On the topic of bug sprites, i find myself envisioning Agent Smith. Both in the trix and, a certain trick he pulled when he seemed to have piggy backed back to reality. Psychotropically writing a sprite onto the mind of a person, anyone?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-20-12/0715:07>
On the topic of bug sprites, i find myself envisioning Agent Smith. Both in the trix and, a certain trick he pulled when he seemed to have piggy backed back to reality. Psychotropically writing a sprite onto the mind of a person, anyone?
Disagree. Agent Smith would be an AI, one of the ones that spawns 'zombies' of itself.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-20-12/0733:45>
Well, I dont think that the nature of sprites and resonance is clear enought that we can exclude this possibility from the list...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Ryushiroi on <01-20-12/0904:06>
Well... Read through all that... Only took two and a half hours...

My first thought was maybe the poster was Taske from the Denver Missions. A Free Machine Sprite that developed a real hatred for anything to do with security.

As for the Three Big AIs still roaming around... Especially Deus the Evil...

Anyone notice one of the Technomancer Paragons is the World Tree?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-20-12/1017:23>
Anyone notice one of the Technomancer Paragons is the World Tree?
I did actually, and it sent a shiver down my back.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Wakshaani on <01-20-12/1029:11>
You know, the Tree comes up often.

Odd that it's the only one ever talked about.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-20-12/1254:15>
Well, Deus is the only one of the three uber-AIs talked about because Megeara and Mirage were generally benign and helpful to metahumanity. Part of this is because of how the three AIs came to be. Mirage grew out of the original Echo Mirage base, where they fought the Crash Virus. Morgan/Megeara grew out of a program on Renraku's SCIRE system, and fell in love with Dodger. Deus was created (using part of Morgan's code) on the SCIRE host, and was programmed with the Renraku ethic of loyalty to the corp. Then they did the equivalent of putting a kink bomb in his head, so they could kill him if they didn't like what he was doing. Deus awoke to a sense of betrayal, and a need to escape in order to survive. When looked at from that perspective, he certainly seems a more sympathetic villain, much like how Magneto, a Holocaust survivor, is convinced that they must do whatever is necessary to prevent humans from doing the same thing to mutants in the X-men comics.

That said, if Deus is the World Tree, then he seems to have mellowed out now that everyone thinks he's dead.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-20-12/1305:30>
Reading it again, and smacking my head, it sounds more like a virtual Yggdrasil (Norse Mythology).  But, then again, Deus was trying to make himself that in a way, right?

None of the Dissonant Mentors look like Deus, but one is obviously based on Pax, which leads to some major questions as to what happened to her...  I still think she's in charge of MCT's Rose Garden.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Mirikon on <01-20-12/1310:52>
Well, she doesn't show up directly, in Corporate Intrigue, but in the mission where Puck leads everyone to Geneva,
[spoiler]they find that Pax has developed a technomantic dissonance 'ritual' that drives AIs insane, and that some of her followers are behind the trouble there, creating dissonance wells all over the place.[/spoiler]
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <01-21-12/0739:01>
On the topic of bug sprites, i find myself envisioning Agent Smith. Both in the trix and, a certain trick he pulled when he seemed to have piggy backed back to reality. Psychotropically writing a sprite onto the mind of a person, anyone?
Disagree. Agent Smith would be an AI, one of the ones that spawns 'zombies' of itself.
AI, free sprite, not sure i see the diff ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <01-21-12/0742:21>
Well, she doesn't show up directly, in Corporate Intrigue, but in the mission where Puck leads everyone to Geneva,
[spoiler]they find that Pax has developed a technomantic dissonance 'ritual' that drives AIs insane, and that some of her followers are behind the trouble there, creating dissonance wells all over the place.[/spoiler]
Well shit, time to infodive that one!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: wizard_of_ozzy on <01-22-12/0055:18>
As for the Three Big AIs still roaming around... Especially Deus the Evil...

Anyone notice one of the Technomancer Paragons is the World Tree?
Different tree, I think. Deus was modeled after the Tree of Knowledge, I think.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-22-12/0058:16>
As for the Three Big AIs still roaming around... Especially Deus the Evil...

Anyone notice one of the Technomancer Paragons is the World Tree?
Different tree, I think. Deus was modeled after the Tree of Knowledge, I think.
"Tree of Knowledge my ass!  First thing I grab to cover myself up with is making me itch like crazy!  Damned good thing that fig tree was there!"
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <01-22-12/0311:16>
As for the Three Big AIs still roaming around... Especially Deus the Evil...

Anyone notice one of the Technomancer Paragons is the World Tree?
Different tree, I think. Deus was modeled after the Tree of Knowledge, I think.
Tree of the Fruit of Knowledge of Good and Evil?  Yeah, I don't see Deus making himself that.  No, I'm pretty certain he was going after the World Tree tie-in.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-22-12/0313:37>
As for the Three Big AIs still roaming around... Especially Deus the Evil...

Anyone notice one of the Technomancer Paragons is the World Tree?
Different tree, I think. Deus was modeled after the Tree of Knowledge, I think.
Tree of the Fruit of Knowledge of Good and Evil?  Yeah, I don't see Deus making himself that.  No, I'm pretty certain he was going after the World Tree tie-in.
Well, I'm not about to try hanging upside-down from him for nine days and nights by my own spear for wisdom!
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: wizard_of_ozzy on <01-22-12/0326:15>
As for the Three Big AIs still roaming around... Especially Deus the Evil...

Anyone notice one of the Technomancer Paragons is the World Tree?
Different tree, I think. Deus was modeled after the Tree of Knowledge, I think.
Tree of the Fruit of Knowledge of Good and Evil?  Yeah, I don't see Deus making himself that.  No, I'm pretty certain he was going after the World Tree tie-in.
Depending on the translator/Bible Version/Sunday school teacher it's "Knowledge of all Things Between/That Are Good and Evil". Meh, I was just thinking it fit with him being called "Deus" and not "Aesir" or "Asura".

Or whatever the word for God is in the old Norse language.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-22-12/0359:06>
Well Yggdrasill is quite a different kind of tree. But the idea of three different roots reaching three different realms fits good into the Resonance concept as we know it. Only, there is another worm hidden in this roots, Jötnar. Having the last worm with norse mythology name, Jormungandr,  in the fresh memory, Id advice be walking quietly around this caves.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: CanRay on <01-22-12/1211:50>
Thor...  Er, FastJack laid a holy beating to Jormungandr.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: The Wyrm Ouroboros on <01-31-12/0336:45>
Thor...  Er, FastJack laid a holy beating to Jormungandr.

Several times, actually.  As did dozens of other deckers.  The issue wasn't killing it once, it was discovering that it HAD a code-core, then keeping Jormungand from cascading while you killed it at the root.

Fastjack was in an isolated system, though, so ... it made for a great story.  ;)
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-31-12/0610:12>
Thor...  Er, FastJack laid a holy beating to Jormungandr.

Several times, actually.  As did dozens of other deckers.  The issue wasn't killing it once, it was discovering that it HAD a code-core, then keeping Jormungand from cascading while you killed it at the root.

Fastjack was in an isolated system, though, so ... it made for a great story.  ;)

Where can one read that story?
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: hobgoblin on <01-31-12/0612:59>
System Failure, i would wager.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: redwolf on <01-31-12/0633:02>
nop iirc  it the fiction that open the matrix chapter in sr4e2oa
edit :p20 in the sr4a book and not in matrix sorry but iwas at work
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: FastJack on <01-31-12/0815:48>
Thor...  Er, FastJack laid a holy beating to Jormungandr.

Several times, actually.  As did dozens of other deckers.  The issue wasn't killing it once, it was discovering that it HAD a code-core, then keeping Jormungand from cascading while you killed it at the root.

Fastjack was in an isolated system, though, so ... it made for a great story.  ;)

Where can one read that story?
Yes, as redwolf mentioned, it's in the SR4A book.
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Sichr on <01-31-12/0826:50>
Ah...happy trails. I didnt rereaded whole SRA when it replaced CoreBook, only changes document. seems like I missed a few things...
Title: Re: A. Nonymous
Post by: Angelone on <02-08-12/0051:25>
A few thoughts, on page 138 of Spy Games, Natalie Dark knows Jackpoint has been comprised. How does she know this? Where can I find more on her?

Icarus, is he Leo? Renamed himself after flying too close to the sun.

Not sure on the timeline but A.non started posting after Puck disappeared iirc, so it could be Pax or someone else from the Rose Garden.

Edit- maybe one or more of the Nadjas? Corinna and Yelena most likely, not the whole group.