Shadowrun Play => Shadowrun: Anarchy => Topic started by: Lipe82 on <05-27-19/1450:09>

Title: Armor in Anarchy
Post by: Lipe82 on <05-27-19/1450:09>
Hey chummers, quick question about Armor, as its writing is rather confusing.
Please confirm if this is how it should work:

Basic armor is 9 circles; I get that.
Heavy Armor is 12 circles, and places a -1 modifier to ALL your skills.
Light Armor is 6 circles and adds a D6 to ONE SINGLE SKILL (to be defined by Player/GM into something that makes sense).

Also - is that a general rule? Or those are not modifiers but actualy Skill Points that you gain/lose during character creation?

Thanks in advance.
Title: Re: Armor in Anarchy
Post by: Carmody on <05-27-19/1841:20>
That's not how it works.
In fact the +/-1 to skill is only a balancing tool during character creation.
If you decide to start the game with a heavier armor, then you get one less skill point to compensate, at character creation.
On the other side, if you decide to go with a light armor, then you get one extra skill point to compensate, at character creation.

As it is only meant to balance the characters, there is no need for the extra point to be related to the armor.

Furthermore, if you decide for a given scene (eg. jet set gathering) not to wear your armor, you get no bonus for that (well, except the fact that people will consider you as a guest and not a bodyguard ;-) )
Title: Re: Armor in Anarchy
Post by: Lipe82 on <05-27-19/1907:05>
Awesome, many thanks!
Title: Re: Armor in Anarchy
Post by: Tecumseh on <06-26-19/1441:11>
Some alternative armor ideas.

Background: I'm not thrilled with Armor acting as additional hit points in Anarchy. Not only is it unrealistic, it also slows down gameplay because each and every armored goon is going to need 3+ attacks to chew up their armor and then their damage track.

Method 1 - Roll soak
Idea: The SR4-5 method. Roll Strength + Armor. Remaining damage goes to the condition monitor.
Pros: Established, reasonably balanced. One-shots potentially possible due to bad soak rolling.
Cons: Separate dodge and soak rolls = more rolling.

Method 2 - Armor auto-soaks
Idea: Armor soaks hits at a 3:1 ratio with no rolling. Armor rating 12 is now effectively Armor 4. Optional: armor degrades 1 point after each Physical (not Stun) attack until repaired.
Example: Armor 12 would now auto-soak 4 hits the first attack, 3 hits the second attack, 2 hits the third attack, then 1 hit the last attack. The remaining damage goes to the condition monitor.
Pros: Maintains the idea of armor degrading. Motivation to spend plot points on armor repair. No additional rolling required. Similar to the SR1-3 approach.
Cons: No opportunity to one-shot an opponent. Stacked auto-soaking could lead someone to be impervious (see Chrome Bison, p. 91, who would auto-soak 9 boxes per attack).

Method 3 - All attacks assumed to have Armor Avoidance
Idea: Base damage goes to armor, net hits go directly to damage track.
Pros: Established precedent. Getting wounds on the damage track will lead to negative modifiers sooner, which could then help end battles faster. The least invasive/radical change.
Cons: Invalidates the AA benefits of attacks that currently have it. One-shots are still impossible. Preserves some of the unrealistic ways that armor would degrade after meaningless attacks. (Twelve punches from Granny still wipe out your milspec suit.)

Method 4 - Armor adds to your dodge pool at a 3:1 ratio
Idea: You roll dodge + armor dice. Armor no longer soaks.
Pros: No additional rolling.
Cons: Makes dodging all but mandatory. That removes any gradation between "uninjured" and "almost dead".

Method 5 - Compare net hits on the attack vs. dodge and armor separately (but simultaneously)
Idea: Roll dice for dodge and armor at the same time. The results determine whether the damage goes to the armor or to the condition monitor.
If attack hits > dodge hits + armor hits, then armor doesn't soak and the damage goes straight to the condition monitor.
If attack hits > dodge hits but < dodge hits + armor hits then armor soaks.
If attack hits < dodge hits then attack misses.
Pros: Potential for one-shots vs. bad dodge/armor rolls. Realistic that most attacks would hit full body armor.
Cons: More rolling. Much more mental math to figure out where the attack connects. On average, most attacks will hit armor, so this is no faster than the current system.

Fully open to other ideas and feedback.
Title: Re: Armor in Anarchy
Post by: DarkEnergy on <08-25-19/1407:37>

I had an idea similar to your #4:

1.  Keep the Armor points.
2.  Armor adds +1/+2/+3 to defense for light/medium/heavy armor.
3.  Armor still provides the defense bonus even when all the armor points are gone.

I say "defense" because I would allow the player to roll the armor dice even if they couldn't dodge for some reason.  Armor still provides a benefit even when all the armor points were gone.

I only tried one session using that rule before the game broke up, but it seemed ok.
Title: Re: Armor in Anarchy
Post by: Tecumseh on <08-26-19/0055:25>
So, if I'm understanding things correctly, in this proposal armor works the way it does now but with the added dodging benefit?

It's not a bad idea but it's somewhat counter to my goal. My problem is usually, "This guy has 11 boxes on his condition monitor and 9 boxes on his armor so he's not going down until I deal 20 boxes of damage", which takes a long time, especially if there's a horde of grunts.

I still haven't found my perfect balance. One thing I've been doing, which is similar to my #3 option, is to allow players to spend a plot point to grant their attacks Armor Avoidance. Even if it doesn't allow for one-shots, it gives me better cover (as the GM) to have the weak-willed grunts retreat when they have 3-4 boxes of damage, which can now happen after one or two hits rather than needing to wait until their 9 boxes of armor are wiped out first.
Title: Re: Armor in Anarchy
Post by: DarkEnergy on <08-26-19/2054:07>
Oh, I noticed the combat drag due to NPC armor points as well. 

I am going to try giving only major/boss NPCs armor points.  Minions don't get armor points; just their condition monitor and the bonus defense dice.