Shadowrun
Shadowrun General => Gear => Topic started by: PretzelCoatl on <01-17-17/1820:24>
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Hello, all,
I apologize if this is answered elsewhere; I can't find any relevant threads because "restricted" is so common. I'm also very sick and can't think well. So yeah, apologies in advance if this is super easy.
Question: I'm trying to figure out how to purchase restricted gear in game, that is, after character creation.
Exposition:
The relevant rules are on, I believe, pages 418 and 419. I would copy paste the text, but there's a lot, and I'm not sure if there are rules on posting that much text... basically, do I need to make that insanely difficult test just to buy nonlethal ammunition? It seems...hard. Stick-n-Shock ammunition has an availability of 6R, meaning I need 18 dice on average or 24 dice to buy hits to be guaranteed to find some. A katana has an availability of 9R, meaning I need 27 or 36! dice! For something I could buy in 2016 off the internet. Is this right? Is there a section I'm missing?
Thank you :)
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AVA is not a threshold but the number of dice a given piece of gear has as opposing pool to your check.
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The Availability is the opposed dice pool, not the threshold.
So using your example, someone looking to get Stick-n-Shock ammo needs to get more hits than the GM rolling 6 dice. So on average, you just need a Negotiation a little higher than the Availability. And even if you have less, you could eventually get lucky after several attempts.
As far as Restricted / Forbidden ratings go, they don't affect the roll to find the gear. It only matters when it comes to getting caught with possession of the item. Which could matter if you glitch the availability test.
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Ahhh, I see. Not a threshold. Opposed roll. That makes SO much more sense.
So items with availability "-" can be purchased at Kong Walmart. These are Standard items.
Items with an availability of 1 or higher I do an opposed test: Negotiation + Charisma [Social] against their Availability.
Legal (no letter code, but availability greater than zero), Restricted (r) and Forbidden (f) status has no interaction with purchasability at all? Solely with the possible repercussions?
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Yes. It's not any harder, mechanically, to get a Avail 6F item than an Avail 6 item. A good real life comparison is that in many places, drugs (that are completely illegal) are easier to find than say, a totally legal but rather obscure car part.
I also want to add that you don't need to beat the Availability on the opposed role. A tie still results in finding the item, just with it taking twice as long as listed. This means that even someone with 2 Negotiation and 3 CHA can have a reasonable chance at finding up to an 8 Availability item, if they get lucky. If your (or your Contact's) dice pool at least matches the Availability, then it's absolutely within reach to acquire.
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I've never understood the rules for availability, especially legal items. Considering all the megas want their stuff sold, shouldn't almost every legal item be a few clicks away? Transys Avalon ought to be listed on every search engine out there, instead of me having to go out into the physical market and speak with vendors. Every high-end phone today is still readily available, next to impossible to miss. And I doubt the megas would make it harder to shop in 2075.
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The default assumption is that you're SINless, so getting items, even perfectly legal ones, requires a little more work than heading down to the mall.
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Among the sample runners in Core, everyone but the decker and the smuggler has a SIN, fake or real. I'd say most runners worthy of the name has one.
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The default assumption is that you're SINless, so getting items, even perfectly legal ones, requires a little more work than heading down to the mall.
I don't think that quite explains it, since you can be a SINner, and have an air-tight fake SIN that you could be using for such a thing. Kong Walmart isn't going to run a super-extensive background check to break your R6 SIN. I doubt they would be able to, considering even a R6 (the best possible rating for SIN checking devices) would be unlikely to catch a R6 SIN most of the time. So... Yeah. The whole point of fake SINs is to be able to use them to do stuff you need to be a SINner to do.
However, considering the responses I've seen from previous writers in the past, that's probably what the official response would be, and the big holes in it wouldn't be explained.
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I think the only change to the availability rules should be to clarify what part of the test actually involves actually beating feet and looking, and how much of it is just waiting on delivery. Note that it calls the timing interval "delivery time" so Adamo's point of legal items being easily order-able could be perfectly valid. It's just that the item is more likely to be on back-order at higher availability. Just like ordering on the Internet now, not everything is available all the time.
So yeah, it just needs some clarification on how much of the duration for the availability test is the character actually out looking, vs just waiting on delivery.
For downtime in my game, I've been handling item-finding as an all-consuming activity, but maybe it shouldn't be... I've been running it as characters being busy for the whole time of the test interval, but thinking more on the concepts behind it, there should probably be circumstances where that isn't the case.
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Thanks, you guys rock! This is MUCH better than the other Shadowrun forum I found. :D
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The section for buying gear only calls for an availability test when buying off the books (Pg. 418 "To purchase an item off the books, make an Availability Test").
That implies that buying something on the books like a normal person (as opposed to a SINless violent criminal) would not require an availability test. My guess for that process? Just matrix search for at most a few hours, automatically find what you want, decide to buy it, have your SIN checked by a R1-R3 scanner, have your applicable license checked (if it's Restricted), the system ties the purchase to your SIN/License, ownership of the item is transferred to your persona, and the item is delivered to you as per the delivery time table.
In game-terms, I think that the combination of risking your fake SIN and licenses getting burned, along with possibly losing all money on credit accounts associated with that SIN, along with tying the item to the SIN (possibly your real one if you're a SINner), is an appropriate trade-off for skipping an availability test.
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Yea, Chicken is correct.
You can always buy items as a regular civilian IF you have the right permits for the item in question, AND a SIN (or a good fake!).
But that comes with a datatrail, questions, and possibly Law Enforcement! (If using a fake SIN).
Buying an item that doesn't come with those strings can be a lot harder... hence the availability test.
After all you may have a legal SIN and a firearms permit... but buying 10000 assault rifle ExEx rounds is going to raise eyebrows... best to do that away from prying eyes and snoopy cops :D
And of course some times, some items just are not available in a given area, much like real life.
I live in a large Canadian city, I have the money, yet try as I might I can not find a porche dealership within 300km of me :( Nor will they deliver to me :(
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hmmm that's one interpretation of the rules, but taking:
Availability is an abstract amalgamation of factors like rarity, legality, distribution issues, supply, demand, and so on.
and
Standard items with no Availability rating can be purchased at your local Kong-WalMart, Stuffer Shack, or Microdeck, or perhaps ordered online or picked up from
a vending machine.
Seem to make it pretty clear that only items without availability can be purchased without having to make a check.
Why else would "no availability" be explizitly stated if everything else could be bough without the checks too, simply by risking a data trail and maybe questions.
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My interpretation is that the data trails are so troublesome that you don't even want to bother with them, to the point that they didn't make any provisions in the rules for bothering with them. And honestly, that makes a bit of sense to me; any good shadowrunner will be buying everything they possibly can with credstick exchanges alone, and it's not just because they don't want a trail in case the SIN gets burned, but in case anyone is keeping an eye on the SIN for any purpose of their own. Whether it's just harmless advertisement or them trying to pin down where you sleep at night, you don't want the corps to get ANYTHING on you.
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Yeah, the two implicitly contradictory rules cited by Slipperychicken and Xexanoth are exactly why I don't know how this works. :)
On the one hand, the first rule (cited by Slipperychicken) seems to imply that you can buy anything you want as long as you don't mind it being tied to you.
On the other, the second rule seems to imply that ONLY zero-availability items are available in this fashion.
From what I can determine, the only HARD rules are that zero-availability items are available all the time with no restrictions, and that getting items off the books requires the aforementioned checks. There is no actual explicit rule on how to get items with an availability rating through the legal system (in my interpretation, which could well be flawed).
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Take a look at the "-" available items... many are what I call 'Vending machine' items, meaning you csn find them anywhere, anytime.
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My interpretation is that the data trails are so troublesome that you don't even want to bother with them, to the point that they didn't make any provisions in the rules for bothering with them. And honestly, that makes a bit of sense to me; any good shadowrunner will be buying everything they possibly can with credstick exchanges alone, and it's not just because they don't want a trail in case the SIN gets burned, but in case anyone is keeping an eye on the SIN for any purpose of their own. Whether it's just harmless advertisement or them trying to pin down where you sleep at night, you don't want the corps to get ANYTHING on you.
Arguments of "it's what a good Shadowrunner does" don't work when players have free will and the characters are not all assumed to be experienced runners.
But, regardless, you do still leave a data trail. That is part of what fake SINs are for; the books even mention that they accrue purchase history and the like. When arguing about this kind of stuff, you need to keep in mind that those exist and what they are used for.
If you could buy things without making Availability tests at the risk of having to replace your fake SIN (because it started to attract attention), the rules would mention this. That would be a huge part of purchasing things after creation, deciding "Do I need this rare thing bad enough to try and buy it legally and attract attention? Or can I see if one of my contacts has the skill to find one on the black market?". It wouldn't be something you had to infer, it would be explicitly mentioned.
Is it a good houserule? Oh sure! Flesh it out a bit (to determine the exact changes and when to roll to see if your SIN has burned for each purchase) and it would be a great houserule. But it's definitely not how the base game works, as there's no way such a thing wouldn't be spelled out if it was intentionally an option. It's just too big of a difference.
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I have to admit I rather like slippery chicken and reavers reading of it. Lets say I'm a fully licenced mage with a nice day job earning me 120k for basically sitting in a building somewhere playing games and watching the trid because I've retired for running and gone legit with a nice little reward as thanks for something I did. Hence the luxury job package.
Now I want a new Nixdorf Sekretar its legal so I just pop online and order one it shows up the next day and I'm down the purchase price. Alternatively I don't want this comlink linked to my name and details just in case so I need to buy it from the black/gray market. This takes time and I have to hunt around not just to find the comlink I want but to ensure I wont be leaving a datatrail leading to my purchase under my bug out identity. The second example requires me to make the check because its not as simple as going online and hitting order because any site doing that is either a scam or asking to be hit by the local law enforcement instead I must look, I must bargain and only then can I buy. Even if its just buying a prepaid one under my fake ID I still need to find somewhere physical to pay with a credstick and provide the fake details for it.
Now we move up a bit I want to buy the Sony CIY-720. Its restricted so I can't just pop online and buy it as I don't have the right licences. So I need to do courses, I need to take tests, I need to be registered and only then can I buy one leaving a great big arrow pointing at me owning it. I don't really want that so I'm needing to do the check again. Only this time its even harder because I'm not just buying an item that's legal but untraceable rather I'm buying one that ilelegal ownwership can get you into trouble for. That means its not just a matter of finding the nearest dealer accepting cash I'm probably going to need a referal "Yeah there wont be trouble she's not a cop.", I need to physically meet in some out of the way place, I'll need to be careful its not a trap for me. All much more complicated.
Finally we have the F items. Doesn't matter what I do I'm only getting those if its issued directly for me as an employee of some major corp/government not something I could buy ever in my legal identity because I don't do that kind of work. So I need to find some way of aquiring them which will be less "I know a guy" and more "I know a shipment we need 10 men to run the play and steal some of those guns. Its risky and if we're caught we'll be handcuffed and shot in the back of the head while resisting arrest but if all goes according to plan we'll never need to run another job again."
At least that's how I see it.
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hmmm that's one interpretation of the rules, but taking:
Availability is an abstract amalgamation of factors like rarity, legality, distribution issues, supply, demand, and so on.
and
Standard items with no Availability rating can be purchased at your local Kong-WalMart, Stuffer Shack, or Microdeck, or perhaps ordered online or picked up from
a vending machine.
Seem to make it pretty clear that only items without availability can be purchased without having to make a check.
Why else would "no availability" be explizitly stated if everything else could be bough without the checks too, simply by risking a data trail and maybe questions.
In 2017 I can find shotguns, armored trucks, laptop components, and assault rifles for sale with a single search query. After jumping through any relevant legal hoops, I could have those things shipped to my home without even communicating with a human. That is clearly not a process that invokes my personal magnetism or ability to negotiate.
I have not seen anything in shadowrun lore to indicate that purchasing such things legally would be any more difficult than it is today.
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Lore wise nothing prevents that,
But from the gameplay point there aren't any rules for it, and it would completely break "availabilty" as any item would be availability 0 when bought legally.
Availability is mostly there for game balance, so that a character can't just simply get everything he wants without having the right contacts.
As Adamo pointed out for some items it doesn't even make that much sense to have an availability rating in the first place, if you look at the lore.
So make some house rules if you want to do it.
But it's definitely not how the base game works, as there's no way such a thing wouldn't be spelled out if it was intentionally an option. It's just too big of a difference.
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In 2017 I can find shotguns, armored trucks, laptop components, and assault rifles for sale with a single search query. After jumping through any relevant legal hoops, I could have those things shipped to my home without even communicating with a human. That is clearly not a process that invokes my personal magnetism or ability to negotiate.
I have not seen anything in shadowrun lore to indicate that purchasing such things legally would be any more difficult than it is today.
But Shadowrun isn't set in our 2017, its set in a 2078 (9?) where so much has changed, where supply is strictly controlled to prevent the masses from rising up, where the Corporations can and will ensure that just because a thing is legal doesn't mean its available to the average Joe on the street.
Its just not feasible to extrapolate from what we can or can't do today. Try and put such thoughts aside, and instead put yourself into the mindset of simply trying to survive under the yoke of the Megas.
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In 2017 I can find shotguns, armored trucks, laptop components, and assault rifles for sale with a single search query. After jumping through any relevant legal hoops, I could have those things shipped to my home without even communicating with a human. That is clearly not a process that invokes my personal magnetism or ability to negotiate.
I have not seen anything in shadowrun lore to indicate that purchasing such things legally would be any more difficult than it is today.
But Shadowrun isn't set in our 2017, its set in a 2078 (9?) where so much has changed, where supply is strictly controlled to prevent the masses from rising up, where the Corporations can and will ensure that just because a thing is legal doesn't mean its available to the average Joe on the street.
Its just not feasible to extrapolate from what we can or can't do today. Try and put such thoughts aside, and instead put yourself into the mindset of simply trying to survive under the yoke of the Megas.
I'll consider it if I see anything in the lore to support the idea. Most of what I've seen in the rulebooks, especially run&gun and gun h(e)aven, suggests a thriving arms industry that shamelessly markets its wares to any yahoo with a license and some nuyen.
Also, "The Corporations" includes suppliers like Ares, which make their money by selling weapons, ammunition, and accessories to wageslaves and gangers alike.
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No, Ares survives by selling to Militaries, law enforcement, other mega corps, and governments.
The above don"t buy a single weapon, they buy crates of weapons!
The average ganger doesn't have the thousands of ¥¥ needed to buy an Ares weapon new. He has hundreds, which gets him a stolen or used weapon bought from a pawn shop or grey market dealer. (Its doubtful that ganger has a SIN to order from Ares directly anyways).
The private arms side of weapons sales has always been the smallest part of any weapon producer. (Even today).
Remmington's public sales account for less then 20% of their revenue: that accounts for both the hunting, collectors, personal defense markets. Their military supply contracts are where they make their money....
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Is there any reason why Contacts with Thermographic and Low-light vision would have availability 16? Lorewise that is. Same thing with Ebony Credstick. Or a Cyberskull. Etc.
These are perfectly legal items that don't exactly pose much of a threat, not niche enough to be unlisted on corporate websites. The corps want to sell and earn money. Why make them less accessible?
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Is there any reason why Contacts with Thermographic and Low-light vision would have availability 16? Lorewise that is. Same thing with Ebony Credstick. Or a Cyberskull. Etc.
These are perfectly legal items that don't exactly pose much of a threat, not niche enough to be unlisted on corporate websites. The corps want to sell and earn money. Why make them less accessible?
Because demand just isn't that high, so why bother manufacturing an overstock of goods only a few people might want. That leads to making a loss.
How many people want or need an ebony credstick in a world of wireless payment?
Why make contacts with both Thermographic AND Low-Light?
What proportion of a population will want to replace their skull outside of major accident damage?
Accessibility reflects the scarcity of supply, not just the hoops one must jump through to buy things.
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Also worth considering that the default availabilities are for the default setting. (aka Seattle) If you go anywhere else (say ... Neo Tokyo) you can expect differences.
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Also worth considering that the default availabilities are for the default setting. (aka Seattle) If you go anywhere else (say ... Neo Tokyo) you can expect differences.
Expect HUGE differences! Can't remember the 4e book, they said for England change the availability code of all firearms to (F). Meaning all guns are not legal for civilian ownership.
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The Shadows in Focus: Sioux book has an entire section about the different availability for various items in the Sioux Nation.
And I actually spotted something that is pertinent directly to this topic: "anyone with a valid hunting license can purchase chameleon suits as if they were only Availability 10 (not Restricted)."
It outright says that having a valid license lets you purchase it legally, but still notes the availability as being 10. This heavily implies that you would still roll against the availability to determine delivery time.
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@Sterling
Scarcity still wouldn't keep legal items from being indexed online, would it?
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@Sterling
Scarcity still wouldn't keep legal items from being indexed online, would it?
Remember that you don't have a global internet in Shadowrun, it's a collection of local matrices, so if the item you're looking for is out of stock with the suppliers on that particular matrix I can see it being removed from any index.
Imagine trying to get hold of the latest gadget on the day of release after the manufacturer has deliberately withheld stock to push up demand. It's a legal item, but you just try and get hold of it for next day delivery.
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@Sterling
Scarcity still wouldn't keep legal items from being indexed online, would it?
Remember that you don't have a global internet in Shadowrun, it's a collection of local matrices, so if the item you're looking for is out of stock with the suppliers on that particular matrix I can see it being removed from any index.
There is a global internet, it's the public grid. Googling still exists, as in page 222 of the core book. There are also other global grids. Plus you can see and visit any host from literally anywhere in the world, from any grid. If you really want an HK-227 submachine gun, and for some reason can't find one with two seconds of googling (which is pretty preposterous IMO), then you can just go to a Heckler & Koch host that will happily direct you a product listing and encourage you to buy it along with all the accessories, ammo, advertisements, and subscriptions your budget can hold. That is exactly what the corps want to happen.
If an item is out of stock, the supplier would still lists it, but with some red text reading "out of stock". And then you can probably just contact them and ask "Hey I really want that R6 bug scanner, can I like preorder it or something so I get it when it's back in stock?", and they will be delighted to let you buy it as soon as they get more. Or chances are you can literally go to the next link that comes up on google and find someone who still has some for sale.
I guess if you're looking for a truly obscure item, then a matrix search test might be appropriate to locate an online listing. But if an individual or organization is on the matrix actively attempting to sell this thing, then that vendor is going to make it as easy as possible for you to find their wares. I'd call it threshold 1 matrix search, and include any applicable penalties (-1 for "intricate/specialized", -2 for obscure, -2 for on another grid).
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@Sterling
Scarcity still wouldn't keep legal items from being indexed online, would it?
Remember that you don't have a global internet in Shadowrun, it's a collection of local matrices, so if the item you're looking for is out of stock with the suppliers on that particular matrix I can see it being removed from any index.
There is a global internet, it's the public grid. Googling still exists, as in page 222 of the core book. There are also other global grids. Plus you can see and visit any host from literally anywhere in the world, from any grid. If you really want an HK-227 submachine gun, and for some reason can't find one with two seconds of googling (which is pretty preposterous IMO), then you can just go to a Heckler & Koch host that will happily direct you a product listing and encourage you to buy it along with all the accessories, ammo, advertisements, and subscriptions your budget can hold. That is exactly what the corps want to happen.
If an item is out of stock, the supplier would still lists it, but with some red text reading "out of stock". And then you can probably just contact them and ask "Hey I really want that R6 bug scanner, can I like preorder it or something so I get it when it's back in stock?", and they will be delighted to let you buy it as soon as they get more. Or chances are you can literally go to the next link that comes up on google and find someone who still has some for sale.
I guess if you're looking for a truly obscure item, then a matrix search test might be appropriate to locate an online listing. But if an individual or organization is on the matrix actively attempting to sell this thing, then that vendor is going to make it as easy as possible for you to find their wares. I'd call it threshold 1 matrix search, and include any applicable penalties (-1 for "intricate/specialized", -2 for obscure, -2 for on another grid).
I think we have differing interpretations of what a Public Grid is. I've taken the information on p. 220 to mean that you will always have access to a grid, one that is provided by "underfunded non-profits, outdated satellites, and the occasional good Samaritan who’s willing to share a wireless access point or two". Yes, you can hop onto the Public Grid from anywhere in the world, but that doesn't mean you have access to every Host, indeed it's specifically mentioned there are Hosts who do not allow Public Grid Connections.
If there are Hosts that detect you're on a Public Grid and so refuse to allow a connection, they won't return a response on a "Google" search, will they?
As for Megacorporations actively looking to sell their goods, it's highly unlikely you buy from the Megacorporation in the first place. If you want a Nuke-It Burrito you buy it from your local Stuffer Shack, not Aztechnology. If you want an HK227 you look for Weapons World, not Saeder-Krupp. And if you're using Ares' Global Grid it won't list the HK227 at all, but will return a listing for the Sigma-3 instead.
This is how I've interpreted the Matrix, and I fully accept it may not have been the intent, but it works. If you want to go with the internet existing prior to 2012 and then being maintained through the various crashes then go for it, it's your game.
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The Shadows in Focus: Sioux book has an entire section about the different availability for various items in the Sioux Nation.
And I actually spotted something that is pertinent directly to this topic: "anyone with a valid hunting license can purchase chameleon suits as if they were only Availability 10 (not Restricted)."
It outright says that having a valid license lets you purchase it legally, but still notes the availability as being 10. This heavily implies that you would still roll against the availability to determine delivery time.
It's also worth noting that the restrictions and legality of guns change in the Sioux nation too: open carrying Light and Heavy pistols is completely legal, and the pistols themselves don't even require a license. Concealed carry and hold-out pistols, however, are forbidden. Semi-automatic longarms are available with a license, but only for home defense and hunting. Automatics are completely illegal unless you're military or corpsec, which is a wise move in my opinion, because let's face it, how often are automatics used against anything other than people?
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The 'Automatic weapons for Duck Hunting Association' takes offense to your comment....
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No offense meant. That said, it sounds like those fellows could give me some very enlightening statistics about how often automatics are used on anything other than people.
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I know if I were allowed and able, I'd settle on using automatic rifles to deal with the local Canadian Goose infestation. (in lieu of proximity air-burst shells anyway)
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Careful. Those geese are the master of stealth ambush attack!
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Air-burst shells are too inaccurate for counter-geese action; what you really want is trained birds of prey or drones that do the same job.
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Air-burst shells are too inaccurate for counter-geese action; what you really want is trained birds of prey or drones that do the same job.
I'm looking to sweep out large volumes at once. And catharsis. All the catharsis.
Microwave radar pulse is another option for Goose Popcorn Explosion.
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Air-burst shells are too inaccurate for counter-geese action; what you really want is trained birds of prey or drones that do the same job.
I'm looking to sweep out large volumes at once. And catharsis. All the catharsis.
Microwave radar pulse is another option for Goose Popcorn Explosion.
Claymore. Instant paté. Plus big bangs.
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I can easily see automatic firearms for home defense in Shadowrun. For one, there's all the gangers and organized crime. Secondly, there's all those scary paracritters a semi-automatic weapon can't adequately bring down. I'd say automatic firearms have a secure niche in the 'pest control' department, depending on what one classifies as pest (such as ghouls).
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Silly boy!!!!
Since when has laws been about "comon Sense"?
I can just as easily see Corp Arcoblocks saying "No automatics" for a long list of liberal insanities ("semi-autos keep crime down" - "less bystanders hit with stray rounds" "automatics are Racist!!"-<insert anti gun agenda>).
That - and they can limit the incoming fire during 'high stress times" (like some wageslave wigging out and going postal.... if all your citizens can own are light pistols, then Security only needs <X> protection. Or when a division gets purged, and that Arcoblock evicted.
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Claymore. Instant paté. Plus big bangs.
Claymore Mines? Hmm. I might reserve that for their nests.
But when a flock rolls by, I want to take them all out, in the sky at once.
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Roto-drone with mono-whips attached to the propeller? ;D
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This is just going to become a repeat of the emu war isn't it?
Oh well, time to get the Popcorn.
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Not really, the average Canadian can defeat several geese in combat while armed with only a hockey stick, it's just that they, you know, fly away before you can get them all. Also you'll inevitably end up stepping in goose shit if you try to engage them at close range.
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This is just going to become a repeat of the emu war isn't it?
I wasn't expecting a newb question on something so incredibly BASIC and integral to the functioning of the game to be so...contentious and differently understood. o.o
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I think we have differing interpretations of what a Public Grid is. I've taken the information on p. 220 to mean that you will always have access to a grid, one that is provided by "underfunded non-profits, outdated satellites, and the occasional good Samaritan who’s willing to share a wireless access point or two". Yes, you can hop onto the Public Grid from anywhere in the world, but that doesn't mean you have access to every Host, indeed it's specifically mentioned there are Hosts who do not allow Public Grid Connections.
If there are Hosts that detect you're on a Public Grid and so refuse to allow a connection, they won't return a response on a "Google" search, will they?
As for Megacorporations actively looking to sell their goods, it's highly unlikely you buy from the Megacorporation in the first place. If you want a Nuke-It Burrito you buy it from your local Stuffer Shack, not Aztechnology. If you want an HK227 you look for Weapons World, not Saeder-Krupp. And if you're using Ares' Global Grid it won't list the HK227 at all, but will return a listing for the Sigma-3 instead.
This is how I've interpreted the Matrix, and I fully accept it may not have been the intent, but it works. If you want to go with the internet existing prior to 2012 and then being maintained through the various crashes then go for it, it's your game.
I meant that the public grid is a close enough analogue to the modern global internet for the purposes of doing business online. It's a vehicle for commerce that anyone can access, where any commodity, including deadly assault weapons and armored vehicles, are just a few clicks away.
As for the hosts that refuse public grid connections: Those are hosts that are so high-class that they refuse just about everybody who spends less than ¥50-60k annually on their lifestyle (i.e. only middle and higher can get in). A club selling embellished hunting weapons might do that to stroke the egos of its members, but it just doesn't make economic sense for a vendor hawking cheap AKs and bullets.
I'm starting to think that the writers didn't include rules for legitimate purchases because they didn't foresee that as a use-case. They envisioned a runner walking into a convenience store or dealership to buy something (items of availability "-" fill that niche) and they imagined runners navigating the grey/black markets for illegal items (in which case the availability rules make perfect sense), but they just didn't cover a runner simply typing "buy assault rifles" into an online search-bar and hitting enter.
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I meant that the public grid is a close enough analogue to the modern global internet for the purposes of doing business online. It's a vehicle for commerce that anyone can access, where any commodity, including deadly assault weapons and armored vehicles, are just a few clicks away.
As for the hosts that refuse public grid connections: Those are hosts that are so high-class that they refuse just about everybody who spends less than ¥50-60k annually on their lifestyle (i.e. only middle and higher can get in). A club selling embellished hunting weapons might do that to stroke the egos of its members, but it just doesn't make economic sense for a vendor hawking cheap AKs and bullets.
Ah, see, but neither the corps nor the national government want anyone selling guns, bullets and who knows what else to the SINless and/or licenseless, and especially not to people with fake SINs and licenses. If you openly and obviously sell weapons and ammo without SIN and license checks, the cybercops will take you down within a week. So if AKs&APDS wants to set an online shop, they have two choices: either they check SINs and licenses with every purchase, or they make themselves hard to find on the Matrix.
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Yes and there certainly is no such thing as a Crime Mall in Puyallup Barrens either...
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-1dRUy1XEoao/TZK-9GscRsI/AAAAAAAAAVA/OBRnk-ECl-E/s1600/crime_mall.png)
...Well Drek...
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Yeah, the availability rules make more sense if you think of them as "how to buy things without the risk of burning your fake SIN or getting busted by the cops in one fashion or another" instead of just "how to buy things".
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Crime Mall
This is amazing. I love the idea of arms dealers paying off Lone Star enough to operate a crime mall.
Ah, see, but neither the corps nor the national government want anyone selling guns, bullets and who knows what else to the SINless and/or licenseless, and especially not to people with fake SINs and licenses. If you openly and obviously sell weapons and ammo without SIN and license checks, the cybercops will take you down within a week. So if AKs&APDS wants to set an online shop, they have two choices: either they check SINs and licenses with every purchase, or they make themselves hard to find on the Matrix.
That's more or less the process I outlined in the first page of the thread, minus the idea of clandestine matrix sites full of illegal weapons and gear.
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This is amazing. I love the idea of arms dealers paying off Lone Star enough to operate a crime mall.
This is has happened in one of my games.
My players got in good with Lone Star, who started operating an underground vigilante net, mainly through the Ork Brotherhood.
Effectively, the runners were "Shadow-Deputized", and in exchange for their "community service", Lone Star let them operate a Shadowrunner Club, named "Painkiller".
Their team became the Club Painkiller Crew.
It was built over the front for an illicit (off-the-books) cyberclinic that formerly belonged to Renraku. (and oh boy, the small street war that raged over that coup; Renraku was NOT happy)
Upstairs was a "legitimate" bar and entertainment scene with regular gigs and occasional premium "real" food cook-offs.
But downstairs, and in the back, was where the real deals went down.
The back rooms (insulated against all manner of sensors, and thickly armored) were used for the many Mr. Johnsons of Seattle and abroad to come out and meet on "Neutral Ground".
Everything else in the back and first basement was effectively a "Farmer's Market" style black market. They had gun runners, drug pushers, talisleggers, tech-heads and all other manner of smuggler goods moving in and out on a semi-regular basis. Lone Star turned a blind eye in exchange for 10% cut and details on what was moving in bulk.
It was really funny playing Shadowrun Returns and visiting the Seamstress Union; because it was almost note-for-note what I had in my game for years prior to that game's release.
Alas, it was not to last forever. Painkiller closed its doors forever when Knight Errant scored the lucrative Seattle contract; terminating the protection gig and forcing the team to disband.