[cgibboney]

I really have no issues with this.

Where are the rules for creation?
The game will be probably be "Life Paths", so everyone will have 750 points to spend.

But if we go with Priority system, what then?

Also, what are the pro's and con's of this character to the rest of the team going to be.

[JudgeMonroe]

Vampire is a Positive Infected Quality, so check Run Faster starting on page 133. The rules here assume a Priority-based character generation.

In Priority, it's straightforward: they spend 37 Karma for the Vampire Quality (27 Base + 10 Non-human) and that's it. They can obtain negative qualities to balance up to 25 of that Karma spend in the usual way. They should not be allowed to buy any other Positive qualities (they are allowed to exceed the 25 Karma limit to buy Vampire, but this exhausts the budget).

In Life Modules, it's less straightforward. So they buy Elf (40) and some Magic score (30 + x). They buy Vampire (37) and go on through the Life Modules. Some of these may apply other Positive Qualities to the character, resulting in more Karma value of positive qualities than they should be allowed. I would simply ignore any Positive Qualities from Life Modules and apply Negative Qualities in the usual way. You could also make the player pay only 12 Karma for Vampire, assuming that through Life Modules they will "spend" the other 25 Karma on Positive Qualities they're forgoing in favor of the infection. Or you could allow Vampire to stack with any other Positive Qualities picked up in the process using the "Becoming Infected During Play" rules on page 134, but I suspect you'll end up with an overpowered character compared to the rest of the table.

[Tecumseh]

Note that only humans can become vampires. Elves can become:

Banshees (HMHVV Strain I)
Harvesters (HMHVV Strain II)
Ghouls (HMHVV Strain III)

Banshees are highly comparable to vampires, but they do cost more (32 karma instead of 27). Some other differences:

Banshees are vulnerable to silver. They have Paralyzing Howl as an optional power instead of Thermographic Vision. They don't have the same weakness to a lack of air, nor is their buoyancy reduced in water. Alcohol doesn't make them nauseous as quickly as it does a vampire.

Overall, very similar, but banshees are probably better on the whole, thus the additional cost. See pages 136-140 of Run Faster.

[Reaver]

For an idea of what HMHVV means in Shadowrun, I am going to quote an old post from Mirikon:

Here's the deal, being Infected sucks. For some, it sucks worse than others. Everyone suggesting it isn't a little slice of hell, shut up and sit down. Professor Mirikon's class is in session. Pick up your copy of Running Wild, and read pages 55-64. Then read Street Legends, 90-93. Finally, read Storm Front, pages 139-143. For homework,

Its important to keep in mind that anything infected by HMHVV generally has a bounty on its head, so the player may have to watch his back from his own team... (bounties range from 7500 to 50000. Depending on area, type of infected.)

They really are monsters. By this I mean they either need

A: meta-human flesh. So they are either hunting metahumans to get it, or making deals with hospitals and chop shops for left overs. (mmm tasty... Ms. Peters breast tumor!), and the diet requirement makes them lousy at dinner parties. (they get ill if they eat anything other then meta-human flesh)

B: Essence. Some infected lose essence at various rates, which means they have to drain it from other sources. (blood is the medium, not the nourishment). Which means, they are in 'essence' draining the very SOULS of their victims. (if you believe that essence = soul...or in souls for that matter). And when essence hits 0, the victim dies. (yes, they can take less then all a person's essence if they choose. But, essence doesn't come back! Once it gone, its gone*)


Lets be clear.. the Infected are not angsty tweens that sparkle in sunlight... They are monsters. And while Runners are not saints, and may be lacking in ethics so badly they give sociopaths a good name, but they generally don't like working with something that considers them "food"


Just saying.



*yes there is a gene therapy that can restore lost essence, but at its availability, cost and time for treatment, it might as not exist for most of the population.

[Hobbes]

For an idea of what HMHVV means in Shadowrun, I am going to quote an old post from Mirikon:
But, essence doesn't come back! Once it gone, its gone

Worth repeating.  No "Blood Dolls" or just grabbing a random homeless or hooker for a harmless little nibble.  You are inflicting permanent damage every day to someone just by existing. 

[PiXeL01]

As long as GM agrees you can have a troll vampire if you like

Quote from RF p. 140
This quality is generally only taken by human characters, though it can be taken by non-humans at the gamemaster’s discretion. The vampire’s skin becomes paler, and their canine teeth more pronounced. Otherwise, theyappear very much as they did before they were Infected.

[kainite311]

I agree with Reaver. There seems to be a lot of white washing over just being HMHVV. From the permanent draining, to the inadvertent ability to infect others (read: teammates), to the general hostility and hatred of the general public, and the list goes on. I also hear a lot about "well they factored that in and the game relays that struggle... Usually not enough in my opinion (Hey I used makeup to blend in, to "I only eat bad guys... and everything in between) to justify living a fairly normal life (metaphorically speaking). Kinda like taking striking skin pigmentation and then the adept power melatonin control to look normal color (especially on a character designed to be a chameleon to begin with, there was no cost since they were taking the power anyways, but got free karma basically). The idea is always neat, but usually it ends up being a power grab...

[Tarislar]

Kinda like taking striking skin pigmentation and then the adept power melatonin control to look normal color (especially on a character designed to be a chameleon to begin with, there was no cost since they were taking the power anyways, but got free karma basically).

Note,  that shouldn't be possible.

Melanin Control is restricted to the normal skin tone range of meta-humanity.
So it can "tan" you, but its not going to cover up those BLUE, RED, & GREEN leopard splotches that area all over your body.
It might help you go from white to black to asian & back, but it won't fix your Greedo skin,  hehehe.

[Michael Chandra]

I would simply ignore any Positive Qualities from Life Modules and apply Negative Qualities in the usual way.

Not sure why you'd do that, since the karma costs are supposed to include any positive/negative qualities in the Module. And only afterwards does the limit matter if you want to buy extra qualities. If you're going to make the player forfeit 37 karma worth of positive qualities, they should at the very least actually get that karma back. And I don't think it's that breaking.
@OP: Keep in mind that Vampire faces disadvantages that go beyond just mechanics. An allergy against sunlight where they take 1P unresisted for every minute of exposure, and a -4 to all tests while exposed, is just the very start of their problems.

They cannot consume anything without getting nauseous. 1h you can cover up, but those 15 minutes after alcohol means that if the Johnson offers alcohol, you'll have to either deny it or bow out over 14 minutes to not show you're not feeling well. This will start leaving behind tracks over time, something the player AND the GM had better be prepared for!

The character will lose 1 Essence per lunar month (29.5 days, though you could just note it down as 4 weeks for easy bookkeeping), so they have to drain 1 Essence per 4 weeks from a victim. If you find a drug addict that's already burning out but not yet at 1- Essence, you can use them as an 'easy' target. Might pick the wrong target and accidentally kill them, if you didn't properly Assense them. Good luck leaving behind a body trail. And that's assuming you don't enthousiastically use Mist Form, each use of which will cost you 1 week of those 4. Use it 5x and I'm guessing you're down 1 Essence and have 3 weeks left before you lose another point. So you have to find proper victims, while keeping in mind essence holes ARE detectable through various means. That business man you decided to kidnap to drain a point from? Yeah that's gonna show up on his next medical exam.

In Essence (*snicker*), Infected isn't just about the mechanics, but also about the roleplaying and trying to not leave a trail. Just like Corporate SINs, I strongly recommend against it if the player and GM are not aligned to really play out the downsides, because otherwise it's either a ticking timebomb or a bad freebie.

[DigitalZombie]

Vampire is a Positive Infected Quality, so check Run Faster starting on page 133. The rules here assume a Priority-based character generation.

In Priority, it's straightforward: they spend 37 Karma for the Vampire Quality (27 Base + 10 Non-human) and that's it. They can obtain negative qualities to balance up to 25 of that Karma spend in the usual way. They should not be allowed to buy any other Positive qualities (they are allowed to exceed the 25 Karma limit to buy Vampire, but this exhausts the budget).

In Life Modules, it's less straightforward. So they buy Elf (40) and some Magic score (30 + x). They buy Vampire (37) and go on through the Life Modules.

Hmm Ive always read it as: the cost for being infected doesnt count towards your positive qualities at all.  So you could still choose positive qualites as long as you also chose some negatives for karma.

I dont think you need to buy a magic score in life modules (only if you choose to be a magician/adept etc).

So the cost would just be 40 for elf and 37 for vampire /32 banshee. * edit. Whoops forgot that he wanted a mage:) then yes you are correct

Personally I think the infected works best when the whole group is infected. Then you can all be an ordo maximus group, or work for tamanous etc.

Remember that the infected arent undead in Shadowrun, so you would need to digest blood/flesh/bone on a daily basis, and once in a while you need to suck some soul too.

If the player wants cyber/bioware you need to pay extra close attention to the rules- at minimum make sure he doesnt pick up regeneration later.

I agree with Reaver. There seems to be a lot of white washing over just being HMHVV. From the permanent draining, to the inadvertent ability to infect others (read: teammates), to the general hostility and hatred of the general public, and the list goes on.

Personally thats WHY I think they are cool. I also dont see alot of "white washing" .  I want to play a ghoul/vampire etc. BECAUSE he freaked out when he turned and ate the brains of his wife and kids. Its cool (for the player not the character) that every night he has to decide if he should give up, or eat someone again.

But again, they often work best in pure infected groups, as everyones goals are a bit more aligned, and nightly routines.

[JudgeMonroe]

Hmm Ive always read it as: the cost for being infected doesnt count towards your positive qualities at all.  So you could still choose positive qualites as long as you also chose some negatives for karma.

You can read it differently but what the rule says is that the limit does not apply to the infected quality. It does not say that the infected quality doesn't apply to the limit. The rules in every respect treat the infected quality the same as any other Positive Quality except the note that you can exceed the 25 Karma purchase limit, that's it. Otherwise the result is that Human Vampire characters start with as much as 52 Karma worth of Positive Qualities, which is absurd. If Infected Qualities worked this way, it would not have been necessary to note the applicability of the limit at all and they would be purchased straight-up like SURGE. In contrast to Infected Qualities, Metagenic Qualities work out of their own Karma Pool with no interaction with other Qualities.

[JudgeMonroe]

I would simply ignore any Positive Qualities from Life Modules and apply Negative Qualities in the usual way.

Not sure why you'd do that, since the karma costs are supposed to include any positive/negative qualities in the Module. And only afterwards does the limit matter if you want to buy extra qualities. If you're going to make the player forfeit 37 karma worth of positive qualities, they should at the very least actually get that karma back. And I don't think it's that breaking.

The problem to solve is that there isn't a Life Module that grants any Infected Qualities, so either you end up with too many Positive Qualities or you don't get any opportunity to buy an infected quality. The simplest approach is just "don't use Life Modules with Infected Qualities" (don't use Life Modules at all, since they suck). I probably would prefer the second option I mentioned: add up the Karma value of Positive Qualities granted by Modules (or assume 25 if you're generous), forfeit them, and pay the difference to acquire the Infected Quality, because you're right that they should get the "karma back".

[Glyph]

Vampire mages are not fun to play this edition.  If they don't drain enough Essense, they face Magic loss (technically they spend Karma to "reconnect" to the "inaccessible" point of Magic - they still lose it and have to pay Karma to get it back).  Drain too much, and they get addicted to it.

[Reaver]

also note: Regeneration does NOT work on drain... (just in case that wasn't already clear)

AND,

Dark terrors introduces a host of new qualities and powers for infected characters... you know, to make them even more frightening.

[Overbyte]

Just my two cents..
I find people that want to play a "Vampire Elf Mage" think they are playing D&D.
Shadowrun is not that.

As others have noted, Vampires have a HUGE number of issues, ranging from serious problems in sunlight to essence loss (which is particularly bad for a mage). It's one thing to be in a game and get bitten and then turn into one and play out all the problems that come with it, it's quite another to wanna come out of the gate with (as one poster put it - a "power grab") and be an "all powerful" vampire from the get go.
They are so difficult to play in a "normal" setting that you'd have to work around all the issues all the time and then there really is no downside.

Be an elf.. sure.. be a mage.. sure.. but don't be a vampire IMO.