[All4BigGuns]

Hmm, interesting. I just looked up Innate Spell again, and it appears you are right. I always thought you pulled from the summoner's spell list, but apparently it can be any spell. Curiouser and curiouser.

Seems you are correct. That makes it a very good trick.

Also remember that I was in no way talking about the Innate Spell power. Merely that a Spirit of Man has the Spellcasting skill regardless of whether it has that optional power, so it needs spells to be able to utilize it.

[MijRai]

Here's the problem with that, however. 
Page 304, under Spirit of Man Optional Powers. 
Fear, Innate Spell (any one spell known by
the summoner; Force is limited to spirit’s
Magic),

A spirit may have the skill to use a spell, but it doesn't have any unless the conjurer can give it some by summoning it at a high enough Force. 

[8-bit]

Hmm, interesting. I just looked up Innate Spell again, and it appears you are right. I always thought you pulled from the summoner's spell list, but apparently it can be any spell. Curiouser and curiouser.

Seems you are correct. That makes it a very good trick.

Also remember that I was in no way talking about the Innate Spell power. Merely that a Spirit of Man has the Spellcasting skill regardless of whether it has that optional power, so it needs spells to be able to utilize it.

They don't get spells normally, they need the Innate Spell optional power. However, the Spellcasting skill is required to have the optional power.

Innate Spell
Type: As spell
Action: Complex
Range: As spell
Duration: As spell

This power allows the critter to instinctively cast a single, specific spell. To use this power effectively, the critter has to have the Spellcasting skill. Innate Spells are chosen from the list of spells cast by magicians, and magicians can oppose them with the Counterspelling skill as normal. Innate Spells also produce Drain as normal, and suffer a –2 penalty for sustaining. Critters and Spirits resist Drain with either Intuition or Charisma, at the gamemaster’s discretion.

They wouldn't get spells by RAW or RAI, IMO; as that's the entire point of Innate Spell: to give them a spell.

Here's the problem with that, however. 
Page 304, under Spirit of Man Optional Powers. 
Fear, Innate Spell (any one spell known by
the summoner; Force is limited to spirit’s
Magic),

A spirit may have the skill to use a spell, but it doesn't have any unless the conjurer can give it some by summoning it at a high enough Force. 

See above. Unless it's an error in the book, they seem to able to pull any single spell they want.

[pixiesunbelle]

I said Channeling, not Centering. That Aspected Conjuror is starting off with a much more efficient means of buffing EVERY physical attribute along with gaining a slew of other stuff from channeling a spirit. Not to mention that he could have a second spirit on standby to cast and sustain a maxed out Increase Reflexes on himself. All in all, he's kicking the dog poo out of a 200 Karma Street Sam already.

I realize that. I was just saying that it had nothing to do with what I was trying to accomplish as a Magician. Honestly, I know nothing about Aspected Magician so I have no clue what they get.

I really don't see how a grade 1 initiate is much more powerful than some of the positive qualities, really. You can't improve your Magic, just the cap.

[Kiirnodel]

Innate Spell
Type: As spell
Action: Complex
Range: As spell
Duration: As spell

This power allows the critter to instinctively cast a single, specific spell. To use this power effectively, the critter has to have the Spellcasting skill. Innate Spells are chosen from the list of spells cast by magicians, and magicians can oppose them with the Counterspelling skill as normal. Innate Spells also produce Drain as normal, and suffer a –2 penalty for sustaining. Critters and Spirits resist Drain with either Intuition or Charisma, at the gamemaster’s discretion.

They wouldn't get spells by RAW or RAI, IMO; as that's the entire point of Innate Spell: to give them a spell.

Here's the problem with that, however. 
Page 304, under Spirit of Man Optional Powers. 
Fear, Innate Spell (any one spell known by
the summoner; Force is limited to spirit’s
Magic),

A spirit may have the skill to use a spell, but it doesn't have any unless the conjurer can give it some by summoning it at a high enough Force. 

See above. Unless it's an error in the book, they seem to able to pull any single spell they want.

Innate Spell indicates that the critter (in this case, Spirit) gets a specific spell. Usually, this is indicated in the critter's stats. For instance, the Gremlin in the Aetherology has: "Innate Spell (Alter Memory)." Unless the critter says so, they don't get to pick just any spell for the Innate Spell power. Each critter lists which spell they get.

So for a Spirit of Man, they get "any one spell known by the summoner." So yes, this means an Aspected Conjurer is at a slight disadvantage for the purpose of the Innate Spells from a Spirit of Man, as they can't know any spells.

[prismite]

Interesting conversation.

Here's the problem with that, however. 
Page 304, under Spirit of Man Optional Powers. 
Fear, Innate Spell (any one spell known by
the summoner; Force is limited to spirit’s
Magic),

This seems pretty clear that the spirit of man (in this example, at least) can only choose from the spell list of the summoner. I just dont see a different way of reading it. Did I miss something?

Plus, A4BG's idea of having a spirit maintain a spell is for all points, spirit slavery. It wont take long before you start earning negative 'relationship' (for lack of a better word) with that spirit type. Sure, it will work on a mission, but the longer you force a spirit to do that, and the more frequent you use it ... you're going to be pissing off lots of entities.

[Glyph]

Aspected magicians seem to be suboptimal all around.  Sorcerers get burned because they don't get free spells.

[Lucean]

It's specific versus general. The Critter Power Innate Spell is the general rule. The rule for Spirits of Man getting only a spell known by the conjurer is the specific exception.

[Lighthouse]

I thought your limit was X2 your magic even after character gen.

[v8johnny]

So, someone with Magic rating A get 10 spells for free, but is that spread throughout spells, rituals and prepararions, or does the magician gets 10 of each (which would be awesome)?
I'll be playing my first game soon, and this thread helped me with lots of things, but now i have this newb question xD

[Kiirnodel]

You get 10 total, but you can spend karma to get more. You are also limited by your skill in the number you can know at creation. I believe it was up to double skill rating in number.

[ShadowcatX]

This thread is 3 years old, they don't care about our input.

[Kiirnodel]

This thread is 3 years old, they don't care about our input.

True, but v8johnny just asked a question today, so I answered it...

[v8johnny]

You get 10 total, but you can spend karma to get more. You are also limited by your skill in the number you can know at creation. I believe it was up to double skill rating in number.

Thanks a lot, Kiirnodel ^^