Shadowrun
Shadowrun Play => Character creation and critique => Topic started by: theKernel on <11-06-10/1418:53>
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Need some help. Want him to be immersed and mainly a brute hacker, just to keep it simple you know?
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"Simple"? Okay, so no technomancy. . .
Hot-Sim VR, Stealth program as good as you can get, Exploit program as good as you can get.
Hacking 5 (or 6), specialize in exploit, Cybercombat 4, Electronics 4
You'd probably want some infiltration skills b/c a good GM's going to have some nodes you can only reach from behind corp sec. Buy the best comm-link you can and see if your GM will let you upgrade it (SR4A, pg. 222) before play.
That's the simple stuff, to my mind, I'm sure the more experienced guys are now going to explain what I've told you that's utterly wrong and will get you killed in 2.5 IP.
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That's the simple stuff, to my mind, I'm sure the more experienced guys are now going to explain what I've told you that's utterly wrong and will get you killed in 2.5 IP.
Nah... Sounds good to me too.
Just remember theKernel: Programs, Gear, and Skills are what makes a good hacker.
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Yea, attributes are fairly worthless to a VR hacker. As FJ said - programs, skills & gear.
Now, if you're talking a combat hacker who does all his cracking in "real time" via AR, then you're looking at a different build altogether. Still need the programs, skills & gear, but then you add in the need for extra gear to speed up your meat-body speeds and what not.
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if he is completly in the matrix does he need a comlink? im using unwired for the full immersion
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Yes, you do still need to pick up a commlink. You'll note that the "Full Immersion" lifestyle (Page 38, Unwired, for those wondering) doesn't specify signal (or wired connection), response, system, or firewall. These are defined by your commlink and the OS installed on it. Without them, you have no ability to act in the Matrix.
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Yes, you do still need to pick up a commlink. You'll note that the "Full Immersion" lifestyle (Page 38, Unwired, for those wondering) doesn't specify signal (or wired connection), response, system, or firewall. These are defined by your commlink and the OS installed on it. Without them, you have no ability to act in the Matrix.
Unless you're a technomancer.
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Correct, but see the original post & my comment in my first post (namely, "keep it simple").
So technomancers were ruled out from the get-go. :P
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ahh, well, fine then. lol - I see how you are!
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Thanks guys this really helps ;D
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Encephalon (2)
Cyberhand with Nanohive and neocortical nanites and pushed Transgenic treatment
Total of +6 dice to Matrix actions (or +3 when in combat as the nanites wont work for that)
also restricted gear for a rating 6 response module
Simsense booster Cyberware and Simsense accelerator Module for the commlink (total of 5 IP in matrix) one of those 2 requires restricted gear ... dont remember which
get 6 programs ... Exploit / stealth / attack / biofeedback filter / Armor and one other with the ergenomic option so that they dont count against your processor limit giving you a load out of 11 programs before response hits
also get an agent for assisting the hack on the fly attempts ....
also Codeslinger (hack on the fly) adds +2 dice to that operation
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Wraith, you clearly missed the "Keep it simple" caveat back at the beginning of the thread. . . :P
Seriously, new players should consider sticking to the core rulebook the first time they dive into Shadowrun. I know the old saw about how Russian mothers teach their children to swim (throw them in the river), but I imagine it leads to lots of dead kids.
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Encephalon (2)
Cyberhand with Nanohive and neocortical nanites and pushed Transgenic treatment
Total of +6 dice to Matrix actions (or +3 when in combat as the nanites wont work for that)
also restricted gear for a rating 6 response module
Simsense booster Cyberware and Simsense accelerator Module for the commlink (total of 5 IP in matrix) one of those 2 requires restricted gear ... dont remember which
get 6 programs ... Exploit / stealth / attack / biofeedback filter / Armor and one other with the ergenomic option so that they dont count against your processor limit giving you a load out of 11 programs before response hits
also get an agent for assisting the hack on the fly attempts ....
also Codeslinger (hack on the fly) adds +2 dice to that operation
Is this all doable as a 400BP character, cause I have none of the cyberhand, neohive, the neocortical, or the pushed transgenic treatment.. After doing the entire first Dawn book, I had enough cash to purchase the encelephon, I have the cheaper one of the simesense booster / accelerator (so I only have 4 IP)
I am wondering if I need to reroll my toon lol, I have earned like 33 Karma to date I think I purchased Cracking skillgroup to 5 with most of it..
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Encephalon (2)
Cyberhand with Nanohive and neocortical nanites and pushed Transgenic treatment
Total of +6 dice to Matrix actions (or +3 when in combat as the nanites wont work for that)
also restricted gear for a rating 6 response module
Simsense booster Cyberware and Simsense accelerator Module for the commlink (total of 5 IP in matrix) one of those 2 requires restricted gear ... dont remember which
get 6 programs ... Exploit / stealth / attack / biofeedback filter / Armor and one other with the ergenomic option so that they dont count against your processor limit giving you a load out of 11 programs before response hits
also get an agent for assisting the hack on the fly attempts ....
also Codeslinger (hack on the fly) adds +2 dice to that operation
Is this all doable as a 400BP character, cause I have none of the cyberhand, neohive, the neocortical, or the pushed transgenic treatment.. After doing the entire first Dawn book, I had enough cash to purchase the encelephon, I have the cheaper one of the simesense booster / accelerator (so I only have 4 IP)
I am wondering if I need to reroll my toon lol, I have earned like 33 Karma to date I think I purchased Cracking skillgroup to 5 with most of it..
That's the simple stuff, to my mind, I'm sure the more experienced guys are now going to explain what I've told you that's utterly wrong and will get you killed in 2.5 IP.
Nah... Sounds good to me too.
Just remember theKernel: Programs, Gear, and Skills are what makes a good hacker.
Any hacker out of the box SHOULD have 50 BPs in gear at creation, for 250,000 nuyen. You can use as much of that as you want on attribute boosters like Muscle Replacement to keep you alive during shootouts and you use the rest on tech.
R1 Nanohive for 10k and Neocortical Nanites for 15k are a steal for +3 to all Logic linked skills. PuSHeD is 15k for +1 to all logic linked skills. Second Hand (just don't ask the doctor where he got it from :P) Encephalon R2 would be 37.5k for +2 to Logic Linked skilltests, and a bonus +1 to VR Matrix tests. Those 3 things combined give +6 (+7 in VR) to every skill in the Cracking AND Electronics skillgroups and only cost a measly 77.5k or about 15 BPs. So you COULD have Electronics 4 or you could have Electronics 2 and enough BPs to afford all this stuff. It's a pretty easy trade off. That doesn't even add the + Logic skills drugs out there.
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Holy Smokes, I need to look at my toon lol, I bought every program at 6, I managed to spend my way through my 250K lol..
Can anyone purchase 2md hand cyber or do you need GM permission, I think our borg'ish character would have loved to save some $ buy 2nd hand
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Second hand Cyberware rules can be found in Augmentation, 1.2 Essence multiplier for 50% cost.
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Bah who needs all that silly essence, doesn't do me any good...
I thought hte 2nd hand stuff was optional, I am still very new at SR, and I have literally like 2 feet of books to read and only limited time to read them
Yes I bought every SR 4 book by catalyst, even though I don't GM at this point.. of course I can barely get through the stuff I need to understand, let alone cheat by reading the modules..
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Bah who needs all that silly essence, doesn't do me any good...
Then don't go whinig when your shaman won't be able to heal you...
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What is a shamen, Magic is a fairy tale.
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Yeah. And healing is a lie. As is the cake...
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Sure looks tasty, though.
if the healing mage can't suck up -5 to the dicepool something went wrong already ;)
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Guys, like I said, siiiimple and no one has touched on the full immersion thing
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Guys, like I said, siiiimple and no one has touched on the full immersion thing
Full immersion is purely a lifestyle which means you pay out the ass to never actually be on the scene of the run.
This lifestyle is for those who wish to live in a virtual environment all their waking lives. These people have literally left the meat behind and exist only as their digital personae. They trust the care of their bodies to medical professionals, who keep them on elective life support. Hydration, oxygenation, nutrition, excretion, muscle toning, and every other aspect of long-term care are handled by drones or trained personnel, all while the client interacts with the rest of the world via VR or by jumping into drones. A character with this lifestyle also enjoys the benefits of the Hospitalized lifestyle, but must still cover extra costs for treatment or surgery.
Cost: 30,000¥ a month
So, if you're not netting 30k a month, you'll soon be out of your VR only life and stuck running in the meat. Also, weren't you the one to complain about your GM disliking the Matrix (http://forums.shadowrun4.com/index.php?topic=1390.0)? This seems a very bad choice on your part if this is the case. Sure, he's gonna try learning the rules, but still.
Long and short, the only thing people should consider leaving out of their advice to you )as relates to full-immersion) is bits on surviving in the meat. Everything else they've said is valid. You still need a commlink, with a pile of good programs. And some serious bio/nano/cyber ware wouldn't hurt you, either.
On the other hand, full-immersion means that any time your team goes high-sec, they'll have to string out toasters to keep you involved in the run, since a good high-sec area will be isolated from the wider Matrix. This leaves you tenuously (at best) connected to the game. Frankly, full immersion is a bad idea for a new player, with a new GM (who is uncomfortable with the Matrix rules), in many running situations.
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Haha ;Dthat waaaas me but this is more of a idea than a plan. But that is a good point on the immersion, dumb idea to go down that road. If anone would be willing to photocopy their hacker so I could see all this augmenttation written down (nanos and stuff) I would apreciate it. I just need to see it lol.
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Back on Page 1, someone chimed in with tons of stuff to get in detail, I am new, and I made notes..
That build has more matrix dice then I do by 3 or 4 dice, and I have earned like 36 karma or something... I am going to remake a hacker, not my hacker per say since I have been playing him a couple months now, but next time someone in my group wants a hacker I will have this guy done..
IE read the post everything on page one is spelled out, I wish I had this info 2-3 months ago.
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Back on Page 1, someone chimed in with tons of stuff to get in detail, I am new, and I made notes..
That build has more matrix dice then I do by 3 or 4 dice, and I have earned like 36 karma or something... I am going to remake a hacker, not my hacker per say since I have been playing him a couple months now, but next time someone in my group wants a hacker I will have this guy done..
IE read the post everything on page one is spelled out, I wish I had this info 2-3 months ago.
In the mean time, just pick up a drug habit.
Overdrive (X-cyte)
Duration: (10 – Body) hours, minimum 1 hour
Effect: +1 Reaction, +1 to all Logic-linked skills
From the steamy jungle pharmacopoeia of Latin America
comes a central nervous stimulant with sizzle. At the end of this
drug’s duration, users suffer 8S damage (unresisted). Aside from
a few brain damaged hacker junkies who complain that overdrive
causes nosebleeds, most users of the so-called “hacker drug” report
few side effects other than a pleasant tingling across the forebrain
and the sudden crash. Certain long-term users who seem more
profoundly affected by overdrive have exhibited signs of psychosis,
but the true long-term effects of the drug are unknown.
or, if you're an offsite/full immersion/rigger cocoon type:
Trance (Toadstone, Zuvembie Powder)
Duration: (6 – Body) hours, minimum 1 hour
Effect: +1 Intuition, +2 to all Logic-linked skills, Paralysis (see below)
A paralytic neurotoxin secreted by an Awakened Latin
American tree frog, trance is oft en erroneously sold as an opiate.
Popular with hackers, magicians, and other professions that don’t
require excessive movement, trance causes paralysis and a speeding
up of the higher brain functions (treat as a Toxin Resistance Test
with a Power of 10, a Speed of 1 minute, and the Duration listed
above; see Paralysis, p. 245, SR4). At the end of the duration, users
remain paralyzed for an equivalent duration. This paralysis only
affects voluntary muscle groups; breathing and other autonomous
functions are not affected.
But cheap, used nanohives aren't particularly hard to find. Just hard to fit essence-wise without a cyberlimb.
PuSHeD is easy and cheap enough. A rating 1 Encephalon is also a relatively small expense for a well worked hacker.
You'll be throwing fistfulls of dice in no time at all.
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I don't get the attraction to the Full Immersion Lifestyle. It just makes things harder on your team and, without a decent background, you looking like a lazy mooch. For me, it would just take some of the fun out of it anyway. Cracking a system while bullets ping off the walls and your team bogs down CorpSec always seemed like half the attraction for playing a hacker to me.
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I don't get the attraction to the Full Immersion Lifestyle. It just makes things harder on your team and, without a decent background, you looking like a lazy mooch. For me, it would just take some of the fun out of it anyway. Cracking a system while bullets ping off the walls and your team bogs down CorpSec always seemed like half the attraction for playing a hacker to me.
Not to mention the kinda heavy-handed advice they give GM's about secure facilities: protect the critical systems by separating them from the wider matrix, thus denying the ability for anyone to connect without being physically present. Not that I object to that advice, it's common sense and standard security for anything involving state/corporate secrets.
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Indeed. And there's also the problem of vulnerability that Full Immersion leaves you with. Your meat is really damn vulnerable with that Lifestyle. You'd have make damn sure to fork over a lot of nuyen for really good security. Otherwise you could suddenly go quiet mid-run as some Corp squad backtracks you to your place, or even some wannabe street hood breaks in, and caps your ass. Personally, I like having the option to run away.
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I don't get the attraction to the Full Immersion Lifestyle. It just makes things harder on your team and, without a decent background, you looking like a lazy mooch. For me, it would just take some of the fun out of it anyway. Cracking a system while bullets ping off the walls and your team bogs down CorpSec always seemed like half the attraction for playing a hacker to me.
Not to mention the kinda heavy-handed advice they give GM's about secure facilities: protect the critical systems by separating them from the wider matrix, thus denying the ability for anyone to connect without being physically present. Not that I object to that advice, it's common sense and standard security for anything involving state/corporate secrets.
Well, physically present means someone has to be physically present. If its the hacker, its simple. Otherwise someone else has to link in and (probably with a sat link) fight their way through any sort of ECM to be a conduit node for the 'Runner. Decker-In-A-Box isn't a new concept but in 2072 the corps are ready for it.
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I don't get the attraction to the Full Immersion Lifestyle. It just makes things harder on your team and, without a decent background, you looking like a lazy mooch. For me, it would just take some of the fun out of it anyway. Cracking a system while bullets ping off the walls and your team bogs down CorpSec always seemed like half the attraction for playing a hacker to me.
Not to mention the kinda heavy-handed advice they give GM's about secure facilities: protect the critical systems by separating them from the wider matrix, thus denying the ability for anyone to connect without being physically present. Not that I object to that advice, it's common sense and standard security for anything involving state/corporate secrets.
Well, physically present means someone has to be physically present. If its the hacker, its simple. Otherwise someone else has to link in and (probably with a sat link) fight their way through any sort of ECM to be a conduit node for the 'Runner. Decker-In-A-Box isn't a new concept but in 2072 the corps are ready for it.
If I'm going to take the time and have a facility that is isolated from the matrix, I'm going to make sure the walls absorb any satellite uplink. They're gonna need to find a way to physically jack in, then uncoil a fi-op line out into the less secure area and hook up the satellite uplink there. Or bring a hell of a lot of toasters to string out the door. . .
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I can see lots of borderline situations. To take some modern examples, Langley and Fort Meade (CIA and NSA respectively) most likely have areas that are exactly as you describe. Basically the computers exists in a giant Faraday cage to keep signals on the correct side. Nothing in or out unless you bring a thumb drive. On the other end there are many fairly unimportant computers on wireless networks or the Internet that can be accessed from basically anywhere. There's a large middle ground, though. I'd like to think that my local hospital doesn't have my records on an Intenret accessible computer (they probably do, but play along for the example). On the other hand, they probably trust the security staff to keep people out and aren't too worried about someone with a tetherable cell phone breaking in and opening a pipe to the 'net.
Having said that, the idea of Usda and CI running down a hall full of security trying to unspool an extension cord is pretty funny.
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Having said that, the idea of Usda and CI running down a hall full of security trying to unspool an extension cord is pretty funny.
Isn't it just the funniest?
I can honestly say, having worked in some of the "secure" environments for engineering work, if it's cheap enough and doesn't require a lot of maintenance (a couple layers of lead paint would kill most commlink signal ratings), they'll install it for anything worth over about 10k (modern US currency, translate as you see fit). If it's worth a million or more, they'll take it a few steps farther. If a government is involved, then they'll do exactly what they are contractually obligated to do, and not a dime more. After all, if they meet the contracted security requirements, damages from things that security didn't prevent are 100% insurance money.
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And remember, that Corporations are a lot more paranoid and far-sighted than any government. It's their own money, not taxpayers.
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And remember, that Corporations are a lot more paranoid and far-sighted than any government. It's their own money, not taxpayers.
Or corporations only care about the quarterly report and will happily slaughter their own long term prospects to make sure the Board gets that extra bonus. I pretty much go with the "security is the minimum necessary to get insurance to cover losses" for anything with a value of less than priceless or unique.
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You forget about the middle corp caste, whose lives depend on those 'disposable' projects. They will do whatever it gets, to both keep their job, and get it done. They're a lot more ambitious than the high-ups, because there's more for them to gain...
An ambitious Security Chief will make his facility as impervious to intrusion, as it gets, whatever means neccesary...
A Spider will use his contats and illegally beef up his facility's home network.
A Corporate Mage will use his own resources to keep intruders at bay, not only what the corp approves.
All of them get scolded, if they succeed. Then they get 'demoted' to another post... But surprisingly one with more perspectives and better paycheck. The corp in question might officialy not approve their methods, but it will reward their success.
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To take some modern examples, Langley and Fort Meade (CIA and NSA respectively) most likely have areas that are exactly as you describe. Basically the computers exists in a giant Faraday cage to keep signals on the correct side. Nothing in or out unless you bring a thumb drive.
Thumb drives in Langley? You're funny.
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Hey, it worked for Tom Cruise! ;D
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It also is working quite well for WikiLeaks...
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Don't forget your wi-fi inhibiting wallet: http://www.skymall.com/shopping/detail.htm?pid=203265750&c=10940 (http://www.skymall.com/shopping/detail.htm?pid=203265750&c=10940)
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Don't forget your wi-fi inhibiting wallet: http://www.skymall.com/shopping/detail.htm?pid=203265750&c=10940 (http://www.skymall.com/shopping/detail.htm?pid=203265750&c=10940)
That's something I'd actually consider buying, especially as Convention time approaches.
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I'd rather have this:
http://www.skymall.com/shopping/detail.htm?pid=203174643&c=10900 (http://www.skymall.com/shopping/detail.htm?pid=203174643&c=10900)
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I'd rather keep of the crowds, and stay frosty. :P