[two_fishes]

The day-to-day wearability of chameleon suits is niggling my brain. Is it viable to wear a chameleon suit under street clothes? It looks like it often gets described as a kind of body stocking, and its basic defense rating is the same as armor clothing, so it seems like the answer is yes? So, a street samurai could just wear it all the time, and strip down when they need to get stealthy?

Alternatively, how stretchy is a chameleon suit? Could you wear it over top of an armor jacket?

[Trigger Lynx]

I use Ghost in the Shell as reference. Yeah, it's concealable,  but you have to strip down when it's put iming use

[Michael Chandra]

It's a head-to-toe suit, so you can just wear it by itself, though that's noticable. If you're wearing something over it, you definitely need to strip to be able to get the benefits. And I think alternatively you could easily just put it over other gear. Just don't expect to cover up a FBA with it.

[Hobbes]

Yeah, a Chameleon suit is going to look like work out gear or similar to a causal observer.  D/L some fancy pattern or your favorite Urban Brawl team logos and have those running.  Toss on a coat or jacket for walking around.  Toss Jacket in trunk of car for Sneaky time.

Close inspection, aka, frisking will likely give up the game though.  So be careful if you're walking while Trog. 

[jman5000]

This was my game the OP is talking about

we have a sniper/decker and an adept who both have the Chameleon suit.  the decker was asking about putting the suit under her clothes.  I indicated that it would look like you had clothes under clothes - so that you would be slightly more bulky looking if someone was paying attention.

I used the concealability table on pg 246, and assessed the suite, while hidden under normal clothes as being "tuckable"  with a threshold of 2.  I maybe could have been a bit more forgiving in hindsight...

my assumption was this:  clothes are bulky no matter what, and the chameleon suit doesn't explicitly state it is "skin tight".  also the sensors take up some space.  however, fundamentally, my feeling was - if you have civvies on over top of the suit, there are still chances where you catch a glimpse of someones arm, or leg, or neck etc - which will, if observant, give away that there is a layer of clothes on under their normal clothes.

Too tough?

[Hobbes]

A chameleon suit can literally look like anything.  That's the point.  It can't have visible sensors or plates or whatever, because then it's not really doing its stealth thing.

So presuming out walking around you've got some kind of graphix on it, it will look like any other set of Sixth World Electrochomatic clothing.  Sure the ex-Navy Seal with a bunch of perception might spot it, but possibly not even then.  I'd let a pat down give the searcher a shot.  And obviously when you go Predator mode it's obvious. 

I mean, if your invisibility suit is flashing a giant AR Icon "HEY I'M AN ILLEGAL INVISIBILITY SUIT"  you should do something about that.  Otherwise, it looks like 75 Nuyen Electrochomatic Clothing that all the kids are wearing.

[Stainless Steel Devil Rat]

Naaah, my imagining is it's clearly a ninja sneak suit.  In my mind the best you can do to keep from being conspicuous is to either cover it up (because yeah, I say it IS skin tight) or modify it with an electrochromic feature so that it can take on the appearance of an athletic body sleeve.  Ruthenium isn't yet defined for 6we, so as far as I'm concerned it's not electrochromic mk II, but something that can only mimic ambient visual patterns in a general/vague sense.

[Hobbes]

Okay, have the hacker use an Edit file action and alter the feed to whatever it is you want to display.

"A head-to-toe suit with a ruthenium polymer
coating supported by a sensor suite, allowing it to
scan its surroundings and replicate the images at
the proper perspectives. "

It's clearly able to display whatever it's being told to.  Previous editions were able to do exactly as I said, go grab some random Urban brawl team logo and make it look like work out gear.  If I have to throw a hoodie on, that's cool too.

Really the question is do I have to wear so much other clothing to disgusted the Ninja suit that it's uncomfortable, and really no.  You need a hoodie and you're good to go.  The Predator effect isn't always on, that's silly.

[Stainless Steel Devil Rat]

Even if a Chameleon suit is able to replicate the effects of the electrochromic features (agreed that maybe it could, BUT it doesn't say it does), a bodysuit broadcasting the image of regular clothing is about as convincing as a tee-shirt tuxedo.

Of course, YMMV

[Hobbes]

Underarmor, Spandex, Leggings, call it what you will, but it's fairly common everyday stuff.

Like I said, throw on a jacket/hoodie/lined coat/whatever and you're good to go.

I really doubt you can tell a Chameleon suit apart from an Urban Explorer Jumpsuit without a pat down.  Possibly not even then.

Is "Athletic Wear" appropriate for all occasions?  No.  Can you meet a Johnson at a soycafe shop?  Sure, blend right in.  But if its black tie required you're probably needing specific attire anyway.

[Sir Ludwig]

Like SSDR, I have always thought of the Cameleon suit as tight and form fitting (future spandex/spanks).  The thought process behind it, how does the suit know what to project on baggy clothing, meaning the fabric isn’t in the location that its directly in front of the background and would give a offset appreciate like looking through water.  It’s being tight (like future spandex/spanks) I would think it could be warn under regular clothing/gear but would have to take all that off to get the benefit. 

However, I am with Hobbes in that I would think you could cast whatever you want on the suit.  Like the Halloween Morphsuits you see. 

Regards,
Sir Ludwig

[jman5000]

so here's where I'm at with my group regarding this suit.

- its skintight, so you can wear it under your civvies.  you basically just have to get out of your civvies to use it once a need arises.
- its noticeable, but the concealability threshold I gave it was too harsh.  now, it'll be more like a 4 to spot it - as the neck, or sleeves, or ankle etc slip and show that there is a suite under the clothes - also, a general patdown (like this!), would "discover" it right away.
- my ignorance in SR lore may be impeding me here, but I don't see this as a suite that "morphs" into any design, but instead, its a digital skintight Ghillie Suit.  the key text I'm using to justify this is: "allowing it to scan its surroundings and replicate the images at the proper perspectives."  So, you can look like a brick wall, a shrub, or a dirt mound - but you can't look like a Nike branded street wearing punk by simply commanding it to emulate this look

[Banshee]

so here's where I'm at with my group regarding this suit.

- its skintight, so you can wear it under your civvies.  you basically just have to get out of your civvies to use it once a need arises.
- its noticeable, but the concealability threshold I gave it was too harsh.  now, it'll be more like a 4 to spot it - as the neck, or sleeves, or ankle etc slip and show that there is a suite under the clothes - also, a general patdown (like this!), would "discover" it right away.
- my ignorance in SR lore may be impeding me here, but I don't see this as a suite that "morphs" into any design, but instead, its a digital skintight Ghillie Suit.  the key text I'm using to justify this is: "allowing it to scan its surroundings and replicate the images at the proper perspectives."  So, you can look like a brick wall, a shrub, or a dirt mound - but you can't look like a Nike branded street wearing punk by simply commanding it to emulate this look

One note I think I would add in your case is that it can be worn on it's own and still look like a plain solid color skintight jump suit by not activating it's chameleon properties. Throw some accessories on it that can he easily ditched and you're not too odd looking for most casual situations.

[Hobbes]

Armor changes in general are no big deal.  Keep the objectionable stuff in a bag in the trunk of the car and change into them as needed.  If your table enjoys these little details and logistic challenges, rock on.

Previous editions of Shadowrun have had specific armor sets meant to be worn under clothes, I'm sure 6th edition will get around to re-printing them for you.  Older editions even had concealability rules for Armor, which is what you're basically house ruling.  5th Edition dropped Armor Concealability.

[Shinobi Killfist]

A chameleon suit can literally look like anything.  That's the point.  It can't have visible sensors or plates or whatever, because then it's not really doing its stealth thing.

So presuming out walking around you've got some kind of graphix on it, it will look like any other set of Sixth World Electrochomatic clothing.  Sure the ex-Navy Seal with a bunch of perception might spot it, but possibly not even then.  I'd let a pat down give the searcher a shot.  And obviously when you go Predator mode it's obvious. 

I mean, if your invisibility suit is flashing a giant AR Icon "HEY I'M AN ILLEGAL INVISIBILITY SUIT"  you should do something about that.  Otherwise, it looks like 75 Nuyen Electrochomatic Clothing that all the kids are wearing.

This is how it should be at least. I think it should pretty much work like a tech version of the mask spell with some limits on the visual bulk of the worn clothing.