Shadowrun

Shadowrun Play => Rules and such => Previous Editions => Topic started by: Aaron on <07-09-13/0938:24>

Title: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <07-09-13/0938:24>
We're putting together the FAQ for Shadowrun, 5th Edition. We've already been scraping questions from the various SR5 threads, but we could always use more questions, so if you have any questions about how the game works, please chime in!

While some questions might be answered in this thread, it's mainly for the collection of questions, so please bear with us if folks aren't able to answer right away.

And yeah, I know it's still a couple days from the PDF release, but this thread will still be open when it becomes available. Ditto for the dead tree version.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Automaton on <07-09-13/1539:22>
Yes I have one. It is stated that Persona are never smaller then an adult dwarf and never bigger then an adult troll.

Does this mean that the persona of children allways look like completely out of proportion equivalents of their real selve?
An 8 year old the size of an adult dwarf?

What about sentient critters? if the matrix recognices real people and packs them in an persona to identify them as such, will a cat technocritter with the natural ability to enter the matrix look like an antromorph bipedal cat the size of at least a an adult dwarf?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <07-09-13/1654:10>
Does this mean that the persona of children allways look like completely out of proportion equivalents of their real selve?
An 8 year old the size of an adult dwarf?

What about sentient critters? if the matrix recognices real people and packs them in an persona to identify them as such, will a cat technocritter with the natural ability to enter the matrix look like an antromorph bipedal cat the size of at least a an adult dwarf?

Yes, assuming the eight-year-old or technocritter is using an icon that looks like their physical forms. Users get to choose the sculpting of their own icons, or more likely buy them off the rack and customize them with built-in options. While I can't speak to technocritters, I have a strong suspicion that eight-year-olds will rarely use their own forms as their icons, partly for the same reason they're encouraged to not post pictures of themselves on public forums on the real Internet, but mostly because Batman. =i)

The iconography requirements are in the Matrix for both in-universe and game reasons. In the Sixth World the restrictions serve the same purpose that the W3C rules serve on the World Wide Web (which you are more than likely using now): usability. On this Web site, you know that the buttons on the top and bottom do something related to the text on them, that text that is underlined or in a different color than the rest is a link, and so forth. It's designed to make it easy to use, and it works so well that you probably spend no more time thinking about it while browsing than you do thinking about which end of a knife to grasp. It works the same for the CC's Matrix, too.

The game reason is because having to stop the game and roll dice to figure out the nature of every single icon you look at really slows the game down.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Automaton on <07-09-13/1700:59>
Great answer thank you! It cleared that right up for me. :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Nal0n on <07-10-13/1818:41>
Important Question here:
Will there be Drop Bears?  8)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mad Hamish on <07-11-13/0214:53>
Important Question here:
Will there be Drop Bears?  8)

You know Australians play Shadowrun to experience an Idyllic setting far safer than our own country.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Black on <07-11-13/0519:26>
Important Question here:
Will there be Drop Bears?  8)

You know Australians play Shadowrun to experience an Idyllic setting far safer than our own country.
So True!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Novocrane on <07-11-13/0712:56>
Are there plans to bookmark the pdf?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Patrick Goodman on <07-11-13/0917:48>
Important Question here:
Will there be Drop Bears?  8)
Not, I'm afraid, in the core book. But yes...yes, there will be Drop Bears.  8) (There is not an Evil GM smiley. I has a sad.)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DWC on <07-11-13/1018:15>
Are there plans to bookmark the pdf?

There must be, because all the reviewers talk about the bookmarks.  It looks like CGL sent DriveThru the wrong file.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Automaton on <07-11-13/1101:19>
I doubt that too, all of them have been so far. Why would anyone make the (very bad) choice not to bookmark it now.

I'll wait and see what the difference between the pdf I bought and downloaded earlier today, and the one that will be posted later today will be.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Timothy M. Patrick on <07-11-13/1109:31>
Looking for a clarification with use of simple actions in a single action phase.
I can use a simple action to reckless cast a spell; I can also use a simple action to fire a SS or SA single shoot.
So can I cast and shoot in the same action phase?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ariketh on <07-11-13/1154:54>
Looking for a clarification with use of simple actions in a single action phase.
I can use a simple action to reckless cast a spell; I can also use a simple action to fire a SS or SA single shoot.
So can I cast and shoot in the same action phase?

The rules seem clear, but I don't think that obviates the need for the question in the FAQ. From SR5 165: "... may not take any other attack actions in the same action phase."  So reckless cast levitate on self/ally, then shoot the BBG seems doable. Reckless cast fireball and shoot, not so much. But that is just my interpretation.

-Ariketh

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Automaton on <07-11-13/1344:14>
Its really simple "You can only take one attack action in an action phase"

Just stick to that, and you got the rule right.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DoomFrog on <07-11-13/1417:44>
I have 2 questions:

1) On pg 233, under PANs and WANs it says that a failed Sleaze action results in a device getting a mark on you, but not devices it is slaved too. Then on pg 236 it says that a failed Sleaze action results in a mark on you by the device and its owner. So if I am a decker and an enemy decker fails to Sleaze a device of mine that is slaved to my deck, do I the decker get a mark on them? Or do I only have a mark if I launch a matrix action through the device they attack?

2) On pg 293 the spell Control Thoughts and Mob Mind it says the caster must use a Standard Action to give commands. And on pg 238 the matrix action Control Device mentions that Standard and Complex actions require 3 marks. The question is are Standard actions the same as Complex actions?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <07-11-13/1659:11>
Is the Improved Ability power restricted by the skill limit (both at chargen and afterwards)? Or could an adept with Aptitude in, say, Blades, eventually raise the skill itself to 13, and get Improved Ability 7 (Blades) for an effective skill Rating of 20?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <07-11-13/1702:38>
1) On pg 233, under PANs and WANs it says that a failed Sleaze action results in a device getting a mark on you, but not devices it is slaved too. Then on pg 236 it says that a failed Sleaze action results in a mark on you by the device and its owner. So if I am a decker and an enemy decker fails to Sleaze a device of mine that is slaved to my deck, do I the decker get a mark on them? Or do I only have a mark if I launch a matrix action through the device they attack?
You would get a mark on the enemy decker.

Side note: a slaved device's master and its owner don't have to be one and the same.

Quote
2) On pg 293 the spell Control Thoughts and Mob Mind it says the caster must use a Standard Action to give commands. And on pg 238 the matrix action Control Device mentions that Standard and Complex actions require 3 marks. The question is are Standard actions the same as Complex actions?

Short answer: yes.

Long answer: Standard Actions used to be a thing in earlier versions of the game. When they were removed from the game, not all references to them were erased. I'll make sure both references are included in the errata. Thanks!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <07-11-13/1708:06>
Is the Improved Ability power restricted by the skill limit (both at chargen and afterwards)? Or could an adept with Aptitude in, say, Blades, eventually raise the skill itself to 13, and get Improved Ability 7 (Blades) for an effective skill Rating of 20?

Yep.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xzylvador on <07-11-13/1731:48>
Its really simple "You can only take one attack action in an action phase"

Just stick to that, and you got the rule right.

Sorry, but unless I'm missing something, that's not clear at all.
Is "Attack Action" a defined game term? Because I'm guessing not.
So casting levitate isn't an attack? But what If I use levitate to move a car over someone's head and then stop the sustain?
Building a magic wall isn't an attack... but maybe building it right in front of a fast moving vehicle or around a person in a Bad PlaceTM is pretty darned hostile.
There's plenty of non-attack utility spells that can be pretty harmful; leaving it up to the GM to figure out why you can float a car in the air and shoot a gun at the same time, but can't do that if you happen to be moving the floating the car into someone else isn't really good rule making, imo.

There's opposite examples too, by the way. Is an 'attack spell' used as a utility (say an ignite spell to light a candle, a destroy spell to open someone's cuffs or whatever) still an 'Attack Action'? But what if the candle was standing in a puddle of fuel? Heck, is firing a gun -always- an Attack Action? What if I just shoot in the air as a warning? Or like to light my BBQ with a flamer? Or rescue a bus full of orphans from suffocation by shooting the windows of their bus so the toxic vapors can escape the bus and they can breathe again?! Think of the children!! Etc etc etc.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <07-11-13/1742:09>
Is the Improved Ability power restricted by the skill limit (both at chargen and afterwards)? Or could an adept with Aptitude in, say, Blades, eventually raise the skill itself to 13, and get Improved Ability 7 (Blades) for an effective skill Rating of 20?
Yep.
Uh... is that a "Yep" to the first part of the question (your effective skill rating after the adept power's bonus cannot go beyond the skill limit)?

Different question: since the Mounts glossary says "Projectile weapons can only take accessories designed for them specifically", does that mean projectile weapons can't use external smartgun systems (which use a Top or Under mount), only internal?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: tangmcgame on <07-11-13/2100:09>
Not sure if this is the place for this, but:

1) Pg. 116.  Combat Mage is listed as Metatype: Human, but that picture is anything but.

2) Pg. 123.  Gunslinger Adept has the Adept Quality.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mad Hamish on <07-11-13/2357:50>
tangmcgame, I think you want the Errata thread
http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11363.msg212385;boardseen#new
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <07-12-13/0022:19>
Uh... is that a "Yep" to the first part of the question (your effective skill rating after the adept power's bonus cannot go beyond the skill limit)?

The level of Improved Attribute cannot be greater either your current skill level x 0.5 or your Magic rating. If you have a skill rating of 13 and a Magic rating of 7 or higher, you can have Improved Ability 7.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shinobi Killfist on <07-12-13/0051:17>
Not sure if this is the place for this, but:

1) Pg. 116.  Combat Mage is listed as Metatype: Human, but that picture is anything but.

2) Pg. 123.  Gunslinger Adept has the Adept Quality.

1.  Well he does have distinctive style.  :)  Those horns are glued on, and the tusks are fake to. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: tangmcgame on <07-12-13/0058:39>
tangmcgame, I think you want the Errata thread
http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11363.msg212385;boardseen#new

Thanks.  I'll repost it there where it belongs.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <07-12-13/0650:20>
Vehicles mention that if the modified DV does not exceed the Armor, the attack is a bust. Should that include the AP value for the armor value comparison? i.e. is this a rulechange in comparison to 4e, or an errata-required?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <07-12-13/0722:13>
Spirit summoning, p. 300. The test to summon a spirit is limited by the spirit Force.

It means that a skilled magician (Magic 5 & Summoning 5) can only get 1 hit when trying to summon a Force 1 spirit.
So there is 33% chances that the spirit also get a hit and the summoning is failed and there is 66% chances that the spirit gets no hit and the magician get only 1 service from a force 1 spirit.

Even worse, if the same magicien then decides to bind this Force 1 spirit, he can still only get 1 hit to his binding test, but the spirit has 44% of chances only to succed! (16/36 possibilities) and 56% to fail binding a force 1 spirit.

It seems very unlogical to me, it should be easier to summon a weaker spirit, not the other way around.
Did I miss something? is it an error? or is it the way it is intended to work and in that case I am curious about the explanation (be it in-game or game play reason, I can understand both)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <07-12-13/0737:50>
Firing modes p178:
SS vs SA: Why firing one bullet per action phase in SA mode generates some recoil while firing one bullet per action phase in CC mode does not? My feeling is that SS weapons are slower to chamber the next round, making them unable to perform semi-automatic burst, but why does it prevent recoil?

Long Burst: which weapons can perform Long Burst? I feel that this mode is available to BF weapons but I cannot find a where it is stated (or even if it is correct)

Bursts & Multiple attacks: It is stated for Semi-automatic burst, Burst Fire, Long Burst and Full-auto that one can take advantage of the Multiple Attacks Free Action to fire at multiple targets with the same burst. Can you please detail how it shall be done. Here is my understanding (and questions):
   - the dice pool is splitted
   - only 1 burst is fired (i.e. ammo consumption unchanged)
   - what is the defense modifier applied to the targets? (full modifier or the modifier is also splitted)
   - it is stated p. 196 that the total number of attacks you can make in a single Action Phase is limited to one-half the attacker's Combat skill. I assume in that case it is also limited by the number of bullets (obvious but not stated)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <07-12-13/0740:34>
Immunity refers to Hardened Armor for its working, then recaps it with a few shortened differences. I assume it works exactly like Hardened Armor but just to be sure:
1: Does Armor Piercing still apply against Immunity for determining whether a resistance test is required?
2: Does Armor Piercing still apply against Immunity for the automatic hits bonus on the resistance test?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <07-12-13/0756:04>
Surprise:
If a surprise test is failed, the character lose 10 initiative points and is considered surprised until his next action phase (p192).
If Bob (initiative 9) manages to suprise Bill (initiative 22), then Bill's initiative drops to 12 and Bill is considered surprised until his action phase at 12. Therefore, even if Bill is surprised, he can act before Bob.

Is it how surprise is intended to work, or shall the surprised character lose his next action phase (i.e. do nothing during his action phase and lose 10 initiative)?

In order to clarify my question, here is my understanding of how the rules work:
   - Beginning of fight: Bob (init 9) surprises Bill (init 22), Bill initiative is reduced to 12.
   - Action phase 1: Bill acts at 12, then Bob acts at 9
   - Action phase 2: Bill acts at 2, no more actions for poor Bob

Here is how I would have expected it to work:
   - Beginning of fight: Bob (init 9) surprises Bill (init 22)
   - Action phase 1: Bill does notihing at 22 because he is surprised, then Bob acts at 9
   - Action phase 2: Bill acts at 12, no more actions for poor Bob
   - Action phase 3: Bill acts at 2
--> Bill and Bob still get the same number of action phases, but Bob is able to take advantage of having surprised Bill
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <07-12-13/0805:40>
Interrupt actions
Quote from: SR5 p. 167
When a character uses an Interrupt Action, such as Full Defense, he takes an action out of turn, but only if he has enough Initiative Score left in the Combat Turn to pay the price for the action. Interrupt Actions occur outside the normal course of the Combat Turn and do not cost the character their Action Phase (unless they reduce their Initiative Score below 0 with their actions).
(emphasize mine)

From the first bolded text, I understand that it is only possible to use an interrupt action if the initiative score of the character is greater (or equal?) to the cost of the interrupt action.
However, the second bolded sentence assumes it is possible for the initiative to drop below 0.

what is the correct understanding?
   - only possible to use an interrupt action if current initiative > interrupt action cost
   - only possible to use an interrupt action if current initiative > 0
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <07-12-13/0843:58>
Do Counterspelling Dicepool Modifiers count on each Counterspelling, or only once on the Counterspelling+Modifiers pool that you then drain from whenever you spell-defend?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <07-12-13/0859:52>
Spirit summoning, p. 300. The test to summon a spirit is limited by the spirit Force.

[...]

It seems very unlogical to me, it should be easier to summon a weaker spirit, not the other way around.
Did I miss something? is it an error? or is it the way it is intended to work and in that case I am curious about the explanation (be it in-game or game play reason, I can understand both)
While seeming unlogical, it could be explained some way. And one can use Reagents to replace the limit for Summoning. It does surprise me that this option is not available for Binding, requiring Edge to break the limit.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Warmachinez on <07-12-13/0943:59>
I can'T see anywhere in the book if you fall unconsciouss once your stun monitor is filled. Has this consequence been removed?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <07-12-13/1004:33>
I'll answer what I'm able to here. Anything else I either missed or need to take some time to track down answers.

Vehicles mention that if the modified DV does not exceed the Armor, the attack is a bust. Should that include the AP value for the armor value comparison? i.e. is this a rulechange in comparison to 4e, or an errata-required?

AP always applies before the vehicle armor (or Hardened Armor power) threshold is checked.

Did I miss something? is it an error? or is it the way it is intended to work and in that case I am curious about the explanation (be it in-game or game play reason, I can understand both)

Low-Force spirits are less useful and weaker in the physical world than those with higher Force. Their connection to the physical plane is more fragile than that of a more robust spirit. They're also kinda weak-minded (Mental attributes of 1 and all).

If you'd like to change the limit on the summoning of your Force 1 spirit, you can either use Edge or reagents for the summoning.

Firing modes p178:
SS vs SA: Why firing one bullet per action phase in SA mode generates some recoil while firing one bullet per action phase in CC mode does not? My feeling is that SS weapons are slower to chamber the next round, making them unable to perform semi-automatic burst, but why does it prevent recoil?

Partly because you do have a bit of extra time to recover from the single point of recoil it generates, and partly because we thought SS weapon users deserved a break.

Is it how surprise is intended to work, or shall the surprised character lose his next action phase (i.e. do nothing during his action phase and lose 10 initiative)?

Yes. Really, really fast people still have the possibility of recovering from a surprise fast enough to take action first.

Do Counterspelling Dicepool Modifiers count on each Counterspelling, or only once on the Counterspelling+Modifiers pool that you then drain from whenever you spell-defend?

Would you please rephrase this question? I'm not sure what you're asking, but spell defense is on p. 294 if that's helpful at all.

I can'T see anywhere in the book if you fall unconsciouss once your stun monitor is filled. Has this consequence been removed?

Nope, it's still in there, just not as prominently as it probably should be. Page 100.

I'm still working on the other questions.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ricochet on <07-12-13/1017:34>
Just want to add in...thanks for answering questions.  That doesn't get said enough.  (We are usually busy screaming about an answer we don't like instead.)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Patrick Goodman on <07-12-13/1018:03>
1) Pg. 116.  Combat Mage is listed as Metatype: Human, but that picture is anything but.

1.  Well he does have distinctive style.  :)  Those horns are glued on, and the tusks are fake to.
Distinctive Style (Troll Poser), Physical Mask spell.

At least that's what I put in the proposed errata. :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ricochet on <07-12-13/1202:11>
Pretty sure I know this one, but want to make sure.

If your essence goes down (due to bio/cyberware) dropping your magic rating below half your number of spells, do you lose spells?

Example: Mage Priority C
Magic 3
Spells 5
Taking a datajack drops magic to 2.  You can't purchase spells over 2xmagic rating.  Does the character lose a spell (only getting 4) or is this rule intended to only prevent buying additional spells.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: tangmcgame on <07-12-13/1218:19>
Asked this on Dumpshock, too.

Do Sorcery or Enchanting Aspected Magicians get their Magic x2 spells/rituals/preparations for free or is that just the max they can start with?

Rereading the entry, it appears they don't get these spells for free since the same bullet point is made for Magicians, which begs the question why be a Sorcery or Enchanting Aspected Magician at all?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ricochet on <07-12-13/1247:20>
Asked this on Dumpshock, too.

Do Sorcery or Enchanting Aspected Magicians get their Magic x2 spells/rituals/preparations for free or is that just the max they can start with?

Rereading the entry, it appears they don't get these spells for free since the same bullet point is made for Magicians, which begs the question why be a Sorcery or Enchanting Aspected Magician at all?

This was a flaw I actually pointed out recently.  Being an aspected mage actually penalizes for taking power limitations at priority C.  (At priority B, aspected magicians are equal to magicians at least in terms of the karma value of their bonuses.)  At priority D, obviously there isn't a comparison.  The obvious conclusion however is that nobody should ever play an aspected magician except at priority D, unless you are going to be a conjurer, and even that is debatable.  (Of course, then there is the question of why you would ever want to be a magician instead of a mystic adept, since Mystic Adept > Magician > Aspect).

I was planning to play an aspected sorcerer as my missions character, until I saw I could make the same character as a magician, ignore the fact I could summon or go astral, and I actually am a better sorcerer.  I went mage instead, even though I'll still play him as a sorcerer.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: GiraffeShaman on <07-12-13/1306:05>
If someone has already jumped into a rigged device, you can't attempt to jump in until he vacates. (Pg. 241)  Can you force him to vacate via cybercombat and the like? Just jumping around to what interests me, so this may be an obvious question.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: tangmcgame on <07-12-13/1337:07>
Asked this on Dumpshock, too.

Do Sorcery or Enchanting Aspected Magicians get their Magic x2 spells/rituals/preparations for free or is that just the max they can start with?

Rereading the entry, it appears they don't get these spells for free since the same bullet point is made for Magicians, which begs the question why be a Sorcery or Enchanting Aspected Magician at all?

This was a flaw I actually pointed out recently.  Being an aspected mage actually penalizes for taking power limitations at priority C.  (At priority B, aspected magicians are equal to magicians at least in terms of the karma value of their bonuses.)  At priority D, obviously there isn't a comparison.  The obvious conclusion however is that nobody should ever play an aspected magician except at priority D, unless you are going to be a conjurer, and even that is debatable.  (Of course, then there is the question of why you would ever want to be a magician instead of a mystic adept, since Mystic Adept > Magician > Aspect).

I was planning to play an aspected sorcerer as my missions character, until I saw I could make the same character as a magician, ignore the fact I could summon or go astral, and I actually am a better sorcerer.  I went mage instead, even though I'll still play him as a sorcerer.

Well, an equal karma expenditure doesn't mean equal efficacy.  If I buy Magician at priority B then I have everything I need to play that Magician effectively.  Sure, I can't do everything, but I've got some skills, spells, and a Magic trait.  It works "out of the box."  On top of that, it's not terribly difficult to bump Magic with special attribute points, and increasing regular skills is a far simpler task than raising group skills unless you're sporting a very high priority in Skills (which probably isn't likely with an Awakened character, though definitely possible) AND you can't specialize them except with karma.

Given everything else the Aspected Mage gives up, on top of the fact that it's costing you identical priority to a full Mage, I feel like it needs some pretty serious attention (at both B and C priority).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: lightknight on <07-12-13/1341:32>
How do I purchase upgrades for Pilot rating for vehicles/drones.  Will it be the same cost as Agent software a la 4E?  Was it intentionally left out of the book for later supplement?  Did I miss a reference in some paragraph stating as much?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: GiraffeShaman on <07-12-13/1405:33>
The Sneak program makes you immune to the physical location part of demiGOD convergence (but not the other parts of convergence) while it is running. (pg. 246) What about the Track program? Can this negate this feature of Sneak? And if so, don't demiGOD use it at times?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Veggiesama on <07-12-13/1501:11>
Street Cred / Notoriety / Public Awareness

On p140, the table shows Street Cred as a positive dice pool modifier on social tests. On p372, Street Cred is applied as a positive Limit Modifier on certain social tests. Which is it, or is it both?

Notoriety has rules for how to raise it and reduce it, but there is no explanation for how it's used. Negative dice pool mod or limit mod, or both?

Public Awareness has a table showing what the ratings mean, but no rules for how it might be used in a dice roll (if at all). Also, I remember SR4 had some kind of formula for determining Public Awareness (wasn't it like (Street Cred + Notoriety) / 3 or something?), but no such formula is here. Is gaining public awareness now left entirely up to GM fiat?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <07-12-13/1553:22>
If someone has already jumped into a rigged device, you can't attempt to jump in until he vacates. (Pg. 241)  Can you force him to vacate via cybercombat and the like? Just jumping around to what interests me, so this may be an obvious question.

Yes. There are actually several options when it comes to getting a jumped-in rigger out of a vehicle or drone.

How do I purchase upgrades for Pilot rating for vehicles/drones.  Will it be the same cost as Agent software a la 4E?  Was it intentionally left out of the book for later supplement?  Did I miss a reference in some paragraph stating as much?

Indeed, that has been left for a later source book.

The Sneak program makes you immune to the physical location part of demiGOD convergence (but not the other parts of convergence) while it is running. (pg. 246) What about the Track program? Can this negate this feature of Sneak? And if so, don't demiGOD use it at times?

The answers to your three questions are, in order, no, nope, and that's why. =i)

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: GiraffeShaman on <07-12-13/1705:54>
GOD and GMen questions and a Grid question based on something that has come up at the other place.

1. Is GOD automated? Do they HAVE to boot the decker off, or could they say choose not to? One reason might be to give physical security time to nab the decker, such as BK at the bank who is quite close.

2. Do demiGODS or other off host security have a way to track a Decker who has the Sneak program up? How would they go about it and who would be involved?

3. Is it the most secure place to put a host on the Public Grid? (Due to the -2 modifier) If so, why don't the corps put their hosts there? Might they put black sites there for that reason?

4. How do G-Men track deckers down who have logged off? I'm sure this will be discussed in the Matrix book, but I'd like something to go off in the meantime for these types of situations. I'm interesting in Matrix methods and rules only. I'm aware they might use off Matrix means. Also, are they more likely to throw more resources into hunting a decker who hit a target on the Megacorp grids?

5. Are there any free floating patrolling spiders out there outside hosts? Does anything beyond GOD attempt to keep hacker gangs and vandals in line and the like?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <07-12-13/1909:58>
A question on the proper splitting of dice pools for the multiple attack free action.

If Bob the troll has a pistols+agility pool of 10 dice and is using multiple attack to fire at two gangers with an Ares Predator in each hand. Ganger 1 is at medium range, ganger 2 is at Long  range and there is light fog. Bob does not have ambidexterity. Is the proper split.

A) 10  -1(Medium Range) - 2 (Long Range) -1 Fog -2 (Using Off Hand) =4 Dice and then split.
B) 10 -1 Fog= 9 Dice, split and then apply range and hand penalties to each pool seperately.
C) 10 -1 Fog -2 Off Hand= 7 Dice and then apply range penalties seperately.

A is how I currently read the rule, but either B or C could make sense.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ulysse Argos on <07-13-13/0047:05>
I have a question, about Weapons, in the Gear Chapter.

Some Weapons have one Accuracy value, while others have two value, like 6 (8).

I didn't found why these two value, so can someone explain this to me ? Thanks.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <07-13-13/0048:22>
I have a question, about Weapons, in the Gear Chapter.

Some Weapons have one Accuracy value, while others have two value, like 6 (8).

I didn't found why these two value, so can someone explain this to me ? Thanks.

I believe it means the weapon has a built in accessory that modifies the limit, like a smartlink or laser sight.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ulysse Argos on <07-13-13/0218:21>

I believe it means the weapon has a built in accessory that modifies the limit, like a smartlink or laser sight.

Ok, yes, thank you :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ulysse Argos on <07-13-13/0251:37>
Hey, i have some others questions :

- can a magician select a Ritual like Spells, in Character Creation ?

- why not Shapechange spell in the rules ? Maybe it is not the most useful spell of Shadowrun, but it was fun.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Thufar_Hawat on <07-13-13/0820:44>
Firing modes p178:
SS vs SA: Why firing one bullet per action phase in SA mode generates some recoil while firing one bullet per action phase in CC mode does not? My feeling is that SS weapons are slower to chamber the next round, making them unable to perform semi-automatic burst, but why does it prevent recoil?

Long Burst: which weapons can perform Long Burst? I feel that this mode is available to BF weapons but I cannot find a where it is stated (or even if it is correct)

Bursts & Multiple attacks: It is stated for Semi-automatic burst, Burst Fire, Long Burst and Full-auto that one can take advantage of the Multiple Attacks Free Action to fire at multiple targets with the same burst. Can you please detail how it shall be done. Here is my understanding (and questions):
   - the dice pool is splitted
   - only 1 burst is fired (i.e. ammo consumption unchanged)
   - what is the defense modifier applied to the targets? (full modifier or the modifier is also splitted)
   - it is stated p. 196 that the total number of attacks you can make in a single Action Phase is limited to one-half the attacker's Combat skill. I assume in that case it is also limited by the number of bullets (obvious but not stated)

But also under the rules on pg196, its states that "this action represents both attacking multiple times from a single melee weapon and attacking with two different weapons (melee or firearms)". This contradicts the burst fire rules that state you can do multiple attacks with a single firearm.

Would be nice to tidy up the auto fire rules and multiple targets in general and give better examples as right now it seems a bit of a mess.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: r4nd0m on <07-13-13/0923:20>
Addiction Tests p414
"Every time you use an addictive substance during (11
— Addiction Rating) weeks in a row, you need to make an
Addiction Test. The clock on this keeps ticking even if you
skip a week, but every week you go without indulging
reduces the Addiction Threshold by 1 (it returns to normal
when you use again). If the threshold hits 0, you’re off the
hook until you use the substance again. This means that
substances with high Addiction ratings (like kamikaze)
could get you hooked in a single dose."

So I take Kamikaze.  I assume i have to make an immediate addiction test, even though that isn't spelled out.  I pass at threshold 3.  Do I have to test the next week at a 2?  The week after at a 1?  Or do I only test at the lower threshold if I take it again?  If so then the threshold resetting when I take it seems weird.  Since it's a Rating 9, does that mean I only have to worry about it for (11-9 = ) 2 weeks?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shinobi Killfist on <07-13-13/1046:50>
Attacks like shock gloves, and touch spells.  Can I punch with them?  This was handled in a Faq in SR4, but I dont see it spelled out in 5e so it seems up in the air again.  Would this be a multi-attack if you can, how does that work in the case of the spell based attack?

Touch based indirect spells such as knockout, how does that work?  If I touched him he didn't really dodge it, does he get another reaction+intuition test to now dodge the spellcasting test, or do they eat the full damage?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: GiraffeShaman on <07-13-13/2345:54>
Can you Initiate at character creation?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sipowitz on <07-14-13/0105:07>
Theses may have been asked somewhere else but I'll ask here.

Cash Reward says to calculate the highest dice pool of on any npc who will be directly opposing the players.  What happens if the players were able to bypass that particular npc?  Going to extremes seems like a run can net you aroundish 47k
Karma: doesn't the chart encourage players to antagonise every situation?  You get 2 karma for 'surviving the situation'.  Is 'surviving the situation' just shorthand?  Does this mean just surviving the whole run?  Is karma really low per run, i.e. surviving 2, completing all objectives 2, npc dp/6, +/- 2 depending on run type something like 3-11/run?
I'm not getting how much karma is supposed to be given out
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <07-14-13/0355:45>
Can you Initiate at character creation?

Definitely a good question. After all, there is enough karma there for one Initiate grade (two if one takes maximum Negative Qualities).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <07-14-13/0439:01>
Not a rules question, but definately something that should be in the FAQ:

Why was there no history section like in previous editions? And can we expect the history in a future book, for new people to the game
who do not have the benefit of Grognards to bring them up to speed?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <07-14-13/0538:55>
Rules Clarification
In  a case where someone left their Corp in good standing, but were effectively let go due to politics(Example: Worked for Lone Star
in Seattle when the contract was handed to Knight Errant. Lone Star released said character to Knight Errant in the transition, and Knight
Errant decided not to retain the character because firing some Metahumans would make Brackhaven happy), do they have a National
SIN, or Corporate Limited SIN? I.E. Once you have a Corporate Limited SIN, if you leave the company, do you revert to the National SIN
or are you still considered a "citizen" of the Corp you formerly worked for?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ricochet on <07-14-13/0746:12>
Do SINners really pay their taxes on their illegal Shadowrun money?  Something just seems off about that.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: r4nd0m on <07-14-13/0757:44>
If they're smart they do.  Look up Al Capone...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <07-14-13/0913:46>
Do SINners really pay their taxes on their illegal Shadowrun money?  Something just seems off about that.

It makes me think a job of a Fixer now includes money laundering...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ricochet on <07-14-13/0915:26>
Capone failed to submit tax returns at all.  Had he filed returns on "legal" income, and covered up the illegal stuff, he probably would never have been convicted.

I'm just not sure putting down that you made 50k killing execs is a good data trail to hand over.

If you are getting paid in certified cred sticks, good luck to the corp trying to trace the money trail anyway.  Especially since you likely were doing all your work under various fake SINS.

I understand the play balance for the karma, but the mechanic itself seems wonky.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <07-14-13/0932:57>
Capone failed to submit tax returns at all.  Had he filed returns on "legal" income, and covered up the illegal stuff, he probably would never have been convicted.

I'm just not sure putting down that you made 50k killing execs is a good data trail to hand over.

If you are getting paid in certified cred sticks, good luck to the corp trying to trace the money trail anyway.  Especially since you likely were doing all your work under various fake SINS.

I understand the play balance for the karma, but the mechanic itself seems wonky.

We can assume two things: 1) If you take a job for the Corp you have the SIN with, they know who you are, and so, you should pay them that
tax income. 2) Your lifestyle expenses and docwagon contracts and any vehicles you drive under your legitimate SIN are known expenses, and,
thus, you can assume that those are values that will be taxed.

We can also guess one thing: Do you want to risk the advantages that come with a SIN for forgetting to pay your taxes? I would believe that any runner is going to have their Fixer launder some of the money for them, so they can have a tax trail of "legitimate" income, and so...they will pay some taxes, just not ALL the taxes they should..
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Basic on <07-14-13/1308:07>
Why is it that no SS and SA are now the same ?

I mean why can't a character fire two shots with a SA gun in the same action phase rather then having to use that SA burst ?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <07-14-13/1332:09>
Why is it that no SS and SA are now the same ?

I mean why can't a character fire two shots with a SA gun in the same action phase rather then having to use that SA burst ?

They're not the same. SS doesn't track cumulative recoil, while SA gives the option of an SA burst. They are in fact completely distinct.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: GiraffeShaman on <07-14-13/1612:49>
1. Public Awareness Pg. 372. Can you buy points off like with Noteriety? Do you get another point for committing a similar action? ie you fight HTR teams on two separate occasions. It seems like a runner's career could be ended rather fast using these rules as they are written, with no way to remove it, and if the same action can get multiple points. But maybe that was the intention.

2. Noteriety. Any suggestions for how to use it? The problem is there is no general guideline given, unlike Public Awareness which has a handy chart. I'm thinking they don't want us using 4th edition Noteriety rules, since they didn't include them.

I like how reputation was done by the way. It doesn't get too overwhelming like it does as a pool modifier.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <07-14-13/1621:07>
Why is it that no SS and SA are now the same ?

I mean why can't a character fire two shots with a SA gun in the same action phase rather then having to use that SA burst ?

...  The SA burst IS firing two shots (same effective action consumption, even).  There is no attacking twice in a pass in SR5, plain and simple.  It's not that they can't fire twice, it's that the effect of doing so is different.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Madman on <07-14-13/1708:41>
Question about Cyberware and Bioware Essence costs.

Do you still half the value of the lower item? If I have 4 points of cyberware, and 3 points of bioware, do I still only pay 1.5 for the bioware, for a total 5.5 essence loss, or is that now a total of 7 points, and impossible to do?

I've looked and looked, and now I'm wondering if this is how they've nerfed cyber characters.   :'(
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <07-14-13/1741:13>
Question about Cyberware and Bioware Essence costs.

Do you still half the value of the lower item? If I have 4 points of cyberware, and 3 points of bioware, do I still only pay 1.5 for the bioware, for a total 5.5 essence loss, or is that now a total of 7 points, and impossible to do?

I've looked and looked, and now I'm wondering if this is how they've nerfed cyber characters.   :'(


That rule has indeed been removed, but it's important to note that Bioware essence costs have been reduced.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Madman on <07-14-13/1801:14>
Question about Cyberware and Bioware Essence costs.

Do you still half the value of the lower item? If I have 4 points of cyberware, and 3 points of bioware, do I still only pay 1.5 for the bioware, for a total 5.5 essence loss, or is that now a total of 7 points, and impossible to do?

I've looked and looked, and now I'm wondering if this is how they've nerfed cyber characters.   :'(


That rule has indeed been removed, but it's important to note that Bioware essence costs have been reduced.


Actually, being new here, I'd hate to point out that you're wrong, but the essence cost of Bioware is all the same.

The monetary costs have changed on most items, some costing as much as 3 or 4 times as much as 4th edition. Very few items (bone density augmentation, orthoskin, platelet factories to name a few) have been reduced in cost, but generally everything is way more expensive.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: khaine1969 on <07-14-13/1908:12>
I see the above entry stating that the pilot upgrade and other vehicle goodies are being saved for another release, however it does talk about autosofts in the section on riggers implying they are available. It states they can be purchased from level 1-6, however no prices are given in the rigger section or the gear listing.
Sssooo...how much are they?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <07-14-13/2044:11>
P. 141/142, "Using Leadership" :
How long does the potential Initiative bonuses from the complex action "Rally" last. Until the next combat turn as per the "Changing Initiative" rules on P160, or until combat ends as there is no duration stated, or something else?

Martin
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mad Hamish on <07-14-13/2056:11>
Actually, being new here, I'd hate to point out that you're wrong, but the essence cost of Bioware is all the same.

The monetary costs have changed on most items, some costing as much as 3 or 4 times as much as 4th edition. Very few items (bone density augmentation, orthoskin, platelet factories to name a few) have been reduced in cost, but generally everything is way more expensive.

The ones that have gone up a lot in price were probably pretty underpriced in 4th ed though (Suprathyroid, Muscle Toner, Muscle Augmentation etc) 
With the reductions in multipliers for higher grades it should be possible to have more augments at higher grades so it might at least come close to making up for the loss of 1/2 essence cost on the lower of bio & cyber.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Elizara Dane on <07-14-13/2058:55>
Do SINners really pay their taxes on their illegal Shadowrun money?  Something just seems off about that.

Our group always played it like the SINner was living "off the grid". As in you paid cert. cred for all your lifestyle and you keep all your purchases under your SIN strictly legal and mundane unless you feel like living dangerously. Of course, the characters would also have Fake SINs as well because buying a gun legally then using that gun in illegal activity might not be the best idea. Also, if runs got messy or we had close encounters with law enforcement the GM would take into make some discreet rolls to see is the SINning character would be identified. Depending on the severity of the infraction the offending character would have to spend a little cash moving across town in a hurry or "lying low" and be unplayable for a run or two.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <07-14-13/2100:16>
Question about Cyberware and Bioware Essence costs.

Do you still half the value of the lower item? If I have 4 points of cyberware, and 3 points of bioware, do I still only pay 1.5 for the bioware, for a total 5.5 essence loss, or is that now a total of 7 points, and impossible to do?

I've looked and looked, and now I'm wondering if this is how they've nerfed cyber characters.   :'(


That rule has indeed been removed, but it's important to note that Bioware essence costs have been reduced.


Actually, being new here, I'd hate to point out that you're wrong, but the essence cost of Bioware is all the same.

The monetary costs have changed on most items, some costing as much as 3 or 4 times as much as 4th edition. Very few items (bone density augmentation, orthoskin, platelet factories to name a few) have been reduced in cost, but generally everything is way more expensive.

Actually, I have to admit that on that one I hadn't taken the time to compare for myself, and was going off someone else's comments.  Still, it has to be noted that Delta grade has a MUCH smaller cost multiplier, so other than a sensible increase on the "must haves" (putting them into a more difficult to reach point for adepts and mages), most things became a lot cheaper to get in the better grades.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ricochet on <07-14-13/2113:38>
Do SINners really pay their taxes on their illegal Shadowrun money?  Something just seems off about that.

Our group always played it like the SINner was living "off the grid". As in you paid cert. cred for all your lifestyle and you keep all your purchases under your SIN strictly legal and mundane unless you feel like living dangerously. Of course, the characters would also have Fake SINs as well because buying a gun legally then using that gun in illegal activity might not be the best idea. Also, if runs got messy or we had close encounters with law enforcement the GM would take into make some discreet rolls to see is the SINning character would be identified. Depending on the severity of the infraction the offending character would have to spend a little cash moving across town in a hurry or "lying low" and be unplayable for a run or two.

As a game balance, we likely will use "taxes" as extra costs of covering up, laundering, etc.  Although then you have the issue of why it's 20% for a Limited Corp SINner and 10% for a born corp SINner.  The person in the system all their life would have the bigger trail to cover.  We'll still follow to keep the mechanics of the qualities as written, but it takes some glossing over the fluff to make sense of it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: GiraffeShaman on <07-14-13/2116:33>
Am I reading movement right? I can take all my movement on my first Action Phase? So if I have 3 Agility and I'm running, I can cover 12 meters in the 3 second Combat Turn. I can do all that in my first Action Phase? Or are we back to the crazy dividing up movement over the Turn?

Also, I can purposely divide up movement? Perhaps I for some reason don't want to be qualified as sprinting or running yet, but I want to get my full movement out of the whole 3 Seconds, so I decide to only move 6 meters for now, then do 6 later in the Combat Turn. Is that legal?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Dinendae on <07-14-13/2243:34>
I think I'm pretty sure of the answer, but just to clarify: Special Attribute Points (gained when assigning a higher priority level to metatype) cannot be used to increase power points for a Mystic Adept, correct?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ricochet on <07-15-13/0027:21>
I think I'm pretty sure of the answer, but just to clarify: Special Attribute Points (gained when assigning a higher priority level to metatype) cannot be used to increase power points for a Mystic Adept, correct?

No they can't.  The only stated uses are for magic rating, resonance, or edge.  And mystic adepts don't get power points for magic rating.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: khaine1969 on <07-15-13/0105:27>
Ok here's another rigger related question (still waiting for the answer to the first one) on page 269 it says RCCs can utilize programs like a cyberdeck (altho they're not comparable with each other), but the gear chart for the RCCs does not say how many programs each model can run at a time.
Soooo. How many programs..not autosofts with sharing...can each model run?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <07-15-13/0338:37>
Thanks for your answer Aaron (well, it was on page 3 but I did not reconnect since  ;)).
It is appreciated, even if I do not buy your explanation about the limit on summoning/binding (at least I know this is intended).
Is there any chance to get answer for the other questions:

Quote from: Carmody
Interrupt actions
Quote from: SR5 p. 167
When a character uses an Interrupt Action, such as Full Defense, he takes an action out of turn, but only if he has enough Initiative Score left in the Combat Turn to pay the price for the action. Interrupt Actions occur outside the normal course of the Combat Turn and do not cost the character their Action Phase (unless they reduce their Initiative Score below 0 with their actions).
(emphasize mine)

From the first bolded text, I understand that it is only possible to use an interrupt action if the initiative score of the character is greater (or equal?) to the cost of the interrupt action.
However, the second bolded sentence assumes it is possible for the initiative to drop below 0.

what is the correct understanding?
   - only possible to use an interrupt action if current initiative > interrupt action cost
   - only possible to use an interrupt action if current initiative > 0
Long Burst: which weapons can perform Long Burst? I feel that this mode is available to BF weapons but I cannot find a where it is stated (or even if it is correct)

Bursts & Multiple attacks: It is stated for Semi-automatic burst, Burst Fire, Long Burst and Full-auto that one can take advantage of the Multiple Attacks Free Action to fire at multiple targets with the same burst. Can you please detail how it shall be done. Here is my understanding (and questions):
   - the dice pool is splitted
   - only 1 burst is fired (i.e. ammo consumption unchanged)
   - what is the defense modifier applied to the targets? (full modifier or the modifier is also splitted)
   - it is stated p. 196 that the total number of attacks you can make in a single Action Phase is limited to one-half the attacker's Combat skill. I assume in that case it is also limited by the number of bullets (obvious but not stated)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Thufar_Hawat on <07-15-13/0420:19>
Also on pg196 it states that multiple attacks can only be used with two firearms, contradicting the SA/burst/full auto fire rules.

Thanks for your answer Aaron (well, it was on page 3 but I did not reconnect since  ;)).
It is appreciated, even if I do not buy your explanation about the limit on summoning/binding (at least I know this is intended).
Is there any chance to get answer for the other questions:

Quote from: Carmody
Interrupt actions
Quote from: SR5 p. 167
When a character uses an Interrupt Action, such as Full Defense, he takes an action out of turn, but only if he has enough Initiative Score left in the Combat Turn to pay the price for the action. Interrupt Actions occur outside the normal course of the Combat Turn and do not cost the character their Action Phase (unless they reduce their Initiative Score below 0 with their actions).
(emphasize mine)

From the first bolded text, I understand that it is only possible to use an interrupt action if the initiative score of the character is greater (or equal?) to the cost of the interrupt action.
However, the second bolded sentence assumes it is possible for the initiative to drop below 0.

what is the correct understanding?
   - only possible to use an interrupt action if current initiative > interrupt action cost
   - only possible to use an interrupt action if current initiative > 0
Long Burst: which weapons can perform Long Burst? I feel that this mode is available to BF weapons but I cannot find a where it is stated (or even if it is correct)

Bursts & Multiple attacks: It is stated for Semi-automatic burst, Burst Fire, Long Burst and Full-auto that one can take advantage of the Multiple Attacks Free Action to fire at multiple targets with the same burst. Can you please detail how it shall be done. Here is my understanding (and questions):
   - the dice pool is splitted
   - only 1 burst is fired (i.e. ammo consumption unchanged)
   - what is the defense modifier applied to the targets? (full modifier or the modifier is also splitted)
   - it is stated p. 196 that the total number of attacks you can make in a single Action Phase is limited to one-half the attacker's Combat skill. I assume in that case it is also limited by the number of bullets (obvious but not stated)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: quindraco on <07-15-13/0950:11>
Its really simple "You can only take one attack action in an action phase"

Just stick to that, and you got the rule right.

Have we worked out what an attack action is yet?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Deverash on <07-15-13/1035:46>
How do you cast an touch spell, say, Death Touch?

It's a Complex (or Simple if cast recklessly) to cast the spell, then another  Complex for the unarmed attack to touch someone.  How does that work?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shinobi Killfist on <07-15-13/1359:00>
How do you cast an touch spell, say, Death Touch?

It's a Complex (or Simple if cast recklessly) to cast the spell, then another  Complex for the unarmed attack to touch someone.  How does that work?

Indirect touch is even more confusing. Do they get 2 dodge tests one for the unarmed and one for the spell discharge?  Can you punch? Can you punch as a split pool multi attack. How do you split 2 different pools? 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Traumaron on <07-15-13/1521:59>
Surprise:
If a surprise test is failed, the character lose 10 initiative points and is considered surprised until his next action phase (p192).
If Bob (initiative 9) manages to suprise Bill (initiative 22), then Bill's initiative drops to 12 and Bill is considered surprised until his action phase at 12. Therefore, even if Bill is surprised, he can act before Bob.

Is it how surprise is intended to work, or shall the surprised character lose his next action phase (i.e. do nothing during his action phase and lose 10 initiative)?

In order to clarify my question, here is my understanding of how the rules work:
   - Beginning of fight: Bob (init 9) surprises Bill (init 22), Bill initiative is reduced to 12.
   - Action phase 1: Bill acts at 12, then Bob acts at 9
   - Action phase 2: Bill acts at 2, no more actions for poor Bob

Here is how I would have expected it to work:
   - Beginning of fight: Bob (init 9) surprises Bill (init 22)
   - Action phase 1: Bill does notihing at 22 because he is surprised, then Bob acts at 9
   - Action phase 2: Bill acts at 12, no more actions for poor Bob
   - Action phase 3: Bill acts at 2
--> Bill and Bob still get the same number of action phases, but Bob is able to take advantage of having surprised Bill

First off all of the participants in the surprise take a Surprise Test of Reaction + Intuition (3).  If they were alerted they get +3 dice pool.  Once you determine who passes and doesn't, those who don't pass  get a -10 initiative and are considered surprised until their next Action Phase.  A surprised character doesn't get their Defense Test when attacked.  Beyond that they go in initiative order.

So in you example: Bill and Bob meet in an alley.  Maybe Bob succeeds on his Perception roll and hears Bill  Bob gets +3 dice since he was aware Bill was coming.  Bob passes his Surprise Test and Bill Fails.  Bill gets -10 initiative and can't make his Defense Test until his next Action Phase.

Action Phase 1: Bill goes on 12 and attacks Bob  (clears the loss of Defense Test) then Bob goes on 9.
Action Phase 2: Bill goes on 2.  Bob is at -1 so cant act.

If Bob had a 13 initiative it would go like this:
Action Phase 1: Bob goes on 13 and attacks Bill.  Bill gets no Defense Test since he is surprised.  Bill Goes on 12
Action Phase 2: Bob goes on 3 and attacks Bill.  Bob gets his Defense Test since he is no longer surprised.  Bill goes on 2.

In an Ambush situation, if the Ambusher is aware of the movements of the Ambushed, he is never surprised.  If he is not aware of the movements he gets +6 dice.  There is a paragraph that sums this up:

pg. 193 - "Note that if an ambushed character manages to come through the Initiative roll with a higher score than those that set the ambush, they can get the drop on their ambushes and act first"

So, it pays to have high reaction/intuition.  Even if you are "surprised" or ambushed you the likelihood you will fail the Surprise Test is pretty low with the +3 or +6 dice.

I think this is correct :)

 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <07-15-13/1554:52>
Thanks Traumaron, this one has already been confirmed by Aaron  ;)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Traumaron on <07-15-13/1801:23>
Thanks Traumaron, this one has already been confirmed by Aaron  ;)

Ahh I didn't see it.  No worries  :P
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <07-15-13/2246:50>
When making an Alchemical Preparation of a Sustained Spell:
Is there a duration, or is the preparation sustained like normal?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shade on <07-15-13/2259:50>
Page 306:

"it lasts for (Potency) minutes (or in
the case of a permanent spell until it becomes permanent)."
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <07-16-13/0215:07>
Page 306:

"it lasts for (Potency) minutes (or in
the case of a permanent spell until it becomes permanent)."

Gods..I feel stupid for missing that...then again, there is ALOT of stuff to digest. I missed seeing the Programs number on the
Cyberdeck chart the first five times I looked at it..and i was *LOOKING* for that information..
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-16-13/0307:34>
Will Wired Reflexes Cyberware (or Improved Reflexes Adept Power, or Increase Reflexes Spell etc.) give you initiative while hacking in Augmented Reality?

On "Cracking the Matrix Spine" on p.231 the User Modes Table imply that you have your Physical Initiative and Physical Initiative Dice while hacking from Augmented Reality.
- If this is correct, will that not make improved reflex 3 physical adepts potentially the fastest hackers in the game?

However on "Step Eight: Final Calculations" on p.101 in the Final Calculations Table they imply that there might be a difference between "[Physical] Initiative" (which "Add appropriate attribute and Initiative Dice bonuses") and "Matrix AR Initiative".
- but if so, what happens to your initiative when you switch back n fourth between your meat body and your AR matrix operations...??


A followup on that. What is Technomancer initiative in AR? on p.251 it says:
Quote
You use your Mental and Matrix attributes when calculating your Initiative, and your Initiative Dice use the normal rules for AR or hot-sim VR use.
The text make it sound as if we actually don't use Reaction (which is a physical attribute) + Intuition when calculating Initiative used in AR??

I assume that the intention of the sentence was this:
Quote
Initiative and Initiative Dice while in AR follow normal [physical] Initiative rules. Initiative and Initiative Dice while in VR follow Matrix VR Initiative (Hot Sim) rules.




Regards
Xenon
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-16-13/1038:49>
Semi-automatic vs Single Shot

I don't understand why when you fire a semi automatic weapon at the same rate of fire as a single shot weapon the semi automatic weapon adds recoil every action phase you fire it (progressive recoil) while the single shot weapon does not. If anything a single shot weapon would have more recoil when you fire it at the same rate of fire as a semi automatic weapon (as single fire weapons might come with bigger caliber / heavier bullets).

So with a STR of 6 and using a Colt Government 2066 semi automatic heavy pistol I would have 3 points of RC making the first shot unaffected as well as the 2nd shot and 3rd shot . But then something happens.  My 4th shot in this firefight  will get a -1 progressive recoil modifier and from there it will only get worse with an additional -1 per bullet i fire. My 6th bullet will have -3 on the roll due to progressive recoil even though I only fired it at single shot rate of fire.

If I instead had used a Ruger Super Warhawk single shot heavy pistol that not only deal more damage per shot it have also more armor penetration; I would never get any progress recoil modifier. Even if i only have STR 1 and fire one shot every action phase.

Is this really intended??


Would it not make more sense if instead of getting 1 free point anytime you start firing you now instead get 1 free point every action phase?

That way you don't build any recoil with single shot or semi automatic weapons (unless you use semi-automatic bursts) and you still build 1 point of progressive recoil if you dual wield or 2 points of progressive recoil if you use Semi-Automatic Burst or Burst Fire, 5 points of progressive recoil for Long Burst and simple action Full Auto and 9 points of progressive recoil if you fire complex action FA.


Actually, is it really intended that gas vent only compensate for the first 1-3 bullets and then they pretty much stop working and does nothing at all to every single bullet after the initial few...? Would it not make sense that gas vents of 2070+ would reduce the overall kick for all bullets...?

Could even see a scenario where no weapons cause any negative progressive recoil as long as you got enough strength and got enough recoil compensation in the forms of gas vent systems and stock etc. to reduce all the recoil from all bullets fired in an action phase. That only unmitigated recoil each action phase would carry over to the next. Where recoil compensation would "reset" each action phase (or at least every combat turn??). This could probably cut the "1 free point anytime you start firing".
- If not everyone will start to modify even light semi-automatic pistols with max rank(?!) gas vent systems. Just for shooting a single shot every action phase and not even use semi-automatic burst fire at all.


Thoughts on that?


Regards
Xenon
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kadvis on <07-16-13/1411:34>
AREA Combat Spells question.

I haven't seen anyone else ask this question, so maybe I'm just dense. But I really don't understand how indirect area combat spells work.

"Area indirect spells travel from the magician to the point of detonation and then go boom. The test is like that for grenades (p. 181): a Spellcasting + Magic [Force] (3) Test with scatter of 2D6
meters. Unlike grenades, you get to add your net hits on this test to the Damage Value of the spell, but only if you beat the threshold; otherwise the spell still detonates, but the hits are used to reduce scatter by one meter per hit.." pg 283.

Now I would think this means that if cast Fireball force 5 with and get  3 hits everyone in the area resists 5P -5AP with body + armor + fire resist, while if I get 1 hit  the spells scatters a few meters and everyone in the new area resists 5P -5AP with body + armor + fire resist. But in the side bar example on the same page the mage casts a force 7 Blast and gets 5 hits then the gangers roll reaction + intuition lowing his net hits and then resist damage with body+armor.  (the example doesn't mention anything about scatter or the threshold).

These seemingly conflicting rules leave me with several questions.

First off I am assuming that the caster only makes one roll to cast the spell.

1. Is the sidebar just wrong?
2. Is the rules text wrong?
3. Do these both some how work together?   If so, do the threshold dice count as hits for damage? ie. If a Mage gets 6 hits on a force 6 fireball  and the Ganger gets 3 hits on reaction + intuition does the ganger have to resist 9P (3 net hits) or  6P (0 net hits after threshold)?
4. What happens if the Ganger spends edge a gets 10 hits, does he have to resist 6P or is he now resisting 2P or 0P depending on how the threshold works?
5. Is everything I said wrong an it works some other way that I'm not getting?

Side note -- I have similar questions about defending against thrown grenades -- Basically is there any defense against a wireless/motion sense thrown grenade or do I just have to soak on average 10P AP -2  if anybody tries to throw a grenade at my feat even if they get 0 successes?

Thanks

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: GiraffeShaman on <07-16-13/1417:55>
Quote
I don't understand why when you fire a semi automatic weapon at the same rate of fire as a single shot weapon the semi automatic weapon adds recoil every action phase you fire it (progressive recoil) while the single shot weapon does not. If anything a single shot weapon would have more recoil when you fire it at the same rate of fire as a semi automatic weapon (as single fire weapons might come with bigger caliber / heavier bullets).
We were told specifically that this was a bone tossed to SS users. I think Aaron posted that, but I may have the wrong staff member's name.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Raiden on <07-16-13/1725:07>
So my warhawk got a boost.. awesome
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-16-13/1731:30>
Quote
I don't understand why when you fire a semi automatic weapon at the same rate of fire as a single shot weapon the semi automatic weapon adds recoil every action phase you fire it (progressive recoil) while the single shot weapon does not. If anything a single shot weapon would have more recoil when you fire it at the same rate of fire as a semi automatic weapon (as single fire weapons might come with bigger caliber / heavier bullets).
We were told specifically that this was a bone tossed to SS users. I think Aaron posted that, but I may have the wrong staff member's name.
WTB a single shot heavy pistol that have BF mode ;)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <07-16-13/1813:48>
AREA Combat Spells question.

I haven't seen anyone else ask this question, so maybe I'm just dense. But I really don't understand how indirect area combat spells work.

"Area indirect spells travel from the magician to the point of detonation and then go boom. The test is like that for grenades (p. 181): a Spellcasting + Magic [Force] (3) Test with scatter of 2D6
meters. Unlike grenades, you get to add your net hits on this test to the Damage Value of the spell, but only if you beat the threshold; otherwise the spell still detonates, but the hits are used to reduce scatter by one meter per hit.." pg 283.

Now I would think this means that if cast Fireball force 5 with and get  3 hits everyone in the area resists 5P -5AP with body + armor + fire resist, while if I get 1 hit  the spells scatters a few meters and everyone in the new area resists 5P -5AP with body + armor + fire resist. But in the side bar example on the same page the mage casts a force 7 Blast and gets 5 hits then the gangers roll reaction + intuition lowing his net hits and then resist damage with body+armor.  (the example doesn't mention anything about scatter or the threshold).

These seemingly conflicting rules leave me with several questions.

First off I am assuming that the caster only makes one roll to cast the spell.

1. Is the sidebar just wrong?
2. Is the rules text wrong?
3. Do these both some how work together?   If so, do the threshold dice count as hits for damage? ie. If a Mage gets 6 hits on a force 6 fireball  and the Ganger gets 3 hits on reaction + intuition does the ganger have to resist 9P (3 net hits) or  6P (0 net hits after threshold)?
4. What happens if the Ganger spends edge a gets 10 hits, does he have to resist 6P or is he now resisting 2P or 0P depending on how the threshold works?
5. Is everything I said wrong an it works some other way that I'm not getting?

Side note -- I have similar questions about defending against thrown grenades -- Basically is there any defense against a wireless/motion sense thrown grenade or do I just have to soak on average 10P AP -2  if anybody tries to throw a grenade at my feat even if they get 0 successes?

Thanks

OK...here is how I understand things:

You roll your spellcasting test. If it was something other then an Indirect Combat Spell, then it would work as the main
rules  text. However, the Indirect Combat Spells rule trumps the Area Effect Spells rule(since the Area Effect Spells is
more general, and specific trumps general). So, for Indirect Combat Spells, you do the whole thing with the targets
rolling their Reaction+Intuition, and take the appropriate damage. The targets of the spell roll their body+armor because..
the spell is Indirect.

I am guessing it works like this because: Direct Combat Spells, Mass Mood, etc, etc don't have a directly visible effect
tied with their creation, and the caster can be off in their point of targeting, while Indirect Area spells have some sort of
precursor to the effect the Mage can use to adjust the point of detonation.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Genesis 137 on <07-16-13/2356:03>
I haven't seen anywhere on the 5th ed. book that sound suppressors/silencers be used at the same time with gas vent systems as it was in previous editions. Is this an oversight from the book or now you can have your gas vent system working when firing an suppressed weapon?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: inca1980 on <07-17-13/0019:03>
Two questions:
1. How do you handle multiple attacks with two different types of firearms that use two different dice pools?  Say I have a pistol in one hand and an SMG in the other (assume i'm ambidextrous).  Let's say my pistol skill is 3 and my automatics skill is 5 and my agility is 4.  So if it's my Action phase, I use a free to get Multiplie Attacks, then I use a simple to fire a Burst with my SMG (say I have RC 3).  Would I roll two attacks: the pistol with dicepool 7 and the SMG with the dicepool 9?  From the Multiple Attacks section it seems that you're always splitting dicepools to fire two different weapons or multiple times with the same weapon.

2.  If I take an Aim Simple action, does the Multiple Attacks Free Action destroy it even though it's basically part of the aimed attack? 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-17-13/0230:20>
1. How do you handle multiple attacks with two different types of firearms that use two different dice pools?
Smallest pool is used for both attacks. Uncompensated recoil stack.

2.  If I take an Aim Simple action, does the Multiple Attacks Free Action destroy it even though it's basically part of the aimed attack?
The multiple attack free action must be combined with an attack action, but free actions during your action phase does not need to come as your first action...
- So i suppose you can use an aim simple action (or a ready weapon simple action) and then call a multiple attack free action if you still have a free action to spend - and combine it with a simple attack action.

I wonder if you can use a simple quickdraw action and then call a attack multiple attack free action followed by an attack action (since the attack action must follow "immediately" after the quickdraw...)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: inca1980 on <07-17-13/0256:45>
That's the fourth edition rule, what page do you find it in SR5?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <07-17-13/0307:33>
I wonder if you can use a simple quickdraw action and then call a attack multiple attack free action followed by an attack action (since the attack action must follow "immediately" after the quickdraw...)

Let us go through the following simple test here:
Does the quickdraw action result in an attack? Yes. Thus it counts as an attack.
What is the exact wording on the attacks prohibition in fire semi-auto? "but may not
take any other attack actions in the same Action Phase."
This does not have a stipulation of "further attack actions" but says "other attack actions."
This means that no, you may not use the "Fire Semi-Auto" action if you used the "Quickdraw"
action.

Now, I could be wrong..but this is how I interpret the rules.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-17-13/0329:02>
That's the fourth edition rule, what page do you find it in SR5?
1)

I can't seem to find a reference about using the smaller dice pool. This might be a SR4 rule only, in that case i stand corrected (but it kinda make sense and will be fast to calculate during combat; the other option would be to calculate each pool individually but with all modifiers combined - and then split both pools individually and alternate which target(s) that get hit by which pool. You also need to make a judgement on the max number of attacks you can do).

p.196
Quote
Multiple Attacks
Characters sometimes want to really put on the hurting in a single Action Phase and can choose to attack more than once in a single Action Phase by using the Multiple Attacks Free Action. This action represents both attacking multiple times from a single melee weapon and attacking with two different weapons (firearms or melee). The attacker’s dice pool is calculated with all modifiers (Wound, Environmental, Situational, and the full recoil of all attacks if it’s a ranged attack) and then split as evenly as possible between all attacks, and each attack is handled separately. (Keep in mind as the dice pool gets smaller the chances of a glitch rise.) Edge spent on this test adds into the pool before it is divided.
The total number of attacks you can make in a single Action Phase is limited to one-half the attacker’s Combat Skill.

2)

p.163
Quote
Free Actions
Free Actions are relatively simple, nearly automatic actions that require little effort to accomplish. Examples are saying a word, dropping an object, gesturing, or walking. A character may take one Free Action during his own Action Phase or at some later point in the Initiative Pass. A character may only take a Free Action prior to his first Action Phase in the Initiative Pass if they are not surprised (see Surprise, p. 192). Only one Free Action is normally allowed per Initiative Pass, but multiple Free Actions could be allowed by the gamemaster if the situation seems reasonable (dropping an object and speaking a phrase). Free Actions generally require no Success Test, though special circumstances may warrant one.

p.164
Quote
Multiple Attacks
A character may use a Free Action to attack multiple targets in a single action (see Multiple Attacks, p. 196) by splitting their dice pool. This action must be combined with a Fire Weapon Action, Throw Weapon Action, Melee Attack Action, Reckless Spellcasting, or Cast Spell Action.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <07-17-13/0343:21>
Xenon, you are confusing Attacks with Attack Actions. You may only do one Attack Action. However, that Attack Actions can
do multiple attacks by splitting the dice pool.  If you do Quickdraw, that action involves making the Weapon Skill+ Reaction
(3) test, and then attacking with the weapon in the same action. That makes its an attack action. If you cannot do the
Multiple Attacks with a Quickdraw action, then you just have to do the Ready Weapon Simple action, followed by an Fire
(Semi-auto/Burst-fire) action enhanced with the Multiple Attacks action.

If you want to use the Fire (whatever) action, you cannot make any other attack actions in that Initiative Pass. Meaning before
or after.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-17-13/0415:18>
My question was if you can combine the multiple attack free action with the quickdraw simple attack action.

I am aware that you cannot do two attack actions in an action phase. My question was not if i could do a quickdraw attack action and then do another attack action (with or without the multiple attacks free action).

- The quickdraw simple attack action let you draw a pistol and, as i read it, fire whatever firemode your pistol currently use. As a single action - so no complex 10 bullet full auto from your TMP machinepistol - but you could quickdraw your ruger super warhawk and combine it with a fire single shot as one simple attack action. Or your browning ultrapower and combine it with a fire semi automatic or fire semi automatic burst as one simple attack action. Or your slivergun and combine it with a fire burst fire as one simple attack action.

- The multiattack free action let you attack multiple targets when you combine it with a fire semi automatic burst-, fire burst fire- and fire full auto- attack action.


...If you cannot do the Multiple Attacks with a Quickdraw action...
So the answer to my question is that since Multiple Attacks free action does not allow for the Quick Draw Action (because it is not listed together with only Fire Weapon Action, Throw Weapon Action, Melee Attack Action, Reckless Spellcasting, or Cast Spell Action) you cannot use it together with the Quick Draw action.

With the Quick Draw Action you can still draw two weapons and fire them both, but since the Multiple Attack free action is not valid for the quick draw action so you can only fire both weapons on  the same target (with split pools - according to Quick Draw rules).

Thanks for helping me see things a bit more clearly :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: inca1980 on <07-17-13/1010:39>
Question:  on pg. 136 where it describes using Stealth Skills it does not say that a limit is applied to Sneaking + Intuition nor the opposed roll.  Other skill descriptions explicitly state the limits involved and I can't find anything in the Skills section nor the section on limits to suggest to me that Sneaking + Intuition vs. Perception + Intuition has a limit. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-17-13/1025:33>
Question:  on pg. 136 where it describes using Stealth Skills it does not say that a limit is applied to Sneaking + Intuition nor the opposed roll.  Other skill descriptions explicitly state the limits involved and I can't find anything in the Skills section nor the section on limits to suggest to me that Sneaking + Intuition vs. Perception + Intuition has a limit.

Perception + Intuition [Mental] vs Sneaking + Agility

Quote
USING PERCEPTION
Perception Tests are for any situation involving basic senses (sight, hearing, smell, touch, or taste) where you’re looking for something that isn’t obvious. Your gamemaster might call for you to make one, or you can call for a Perception Test by taking an Observe in Detail Simple Action to get a handle on what’s going down around you. Making the threshold on a Perception + Intuition [Mental] Test indicates that you’ve noticed something subtle or important (or both)—net hits determine how much detail you get. If someone is deliberately trying to hide from you, they’ll oppose your test with their own skill (Using Stealth Skills, p. 136).

edit. but you are right, i cant see any text about what limit he should use if he use Sneaking + Intuition instead of Perception, but since this is a perception test - just with another skill - and the attribute still being Intuition i think it is safe to say that it will be limited by [Mental]

Sneaking + Intuition [Mental] vs Sneaking + Agility

Agreed. Would not hurt if the text was more clear on this...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <07-17-13/1842:31>
I'm sorry I haven't been keeping up with answers, folks. I have been copying down all the questions to be distilled into a FAQ to be answered and posted through more official channels than just me. Thanks for bearing with me.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <07-18-13/0802:08>
Page 94 says the chargen limit for gear is Availability 12 and a device rating of 6 - however, on page 418, it says the chargen limit for gear is Availability 12 and a rating of 6. Given that the gear chapter makes a distinction between gear ratings and device ratings, which page is wrong? Because bows can have a rating of up to 10 without exceeding Availability 12, and the same applies for foam explosives, but in both cases, this is not a device rating, just gear rating, and the archetypes include a rating 7 and rating 8 bow (although to be fair, one character has rating 5 fake SINs and Licenses, which would be Availability 15, so there's already at least one mistake in there).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RelentlessImp on <07-18-13/0926:44>
So, since the release of SR5, people I've talked to have been slightly confused by the rules, the layout, and just outright missing certain very important lines in the rules text because... well, I'm not really sure why. Is it the font? Size? Or are they just trying to hurry through? Well, whatever the case, I've decided to put together a little document highlighting things I've found people are commonly missing, from talking to friends and reading threads. So I present to you the Rules Clarification document; everyone's free to contribute.

Character Generation
Choose Your Metatype
Skills
Spend Your Resources
Spend Your Leftover Karma

The Matrix
Complex Forms

More to come as rules questions pop up.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ariketh on <07-18-13/1323:09>
Page 94 says the chargen limit for gear is Availability 12 and a device rating of 6 - however, on page 418, it says the chargen limit for gear is Availability 12 and a rating of 6. Given that the gear chapter makes a distinction between gear ratings and device ratings, which page is wrong? Because bows can have a rating of up to 10 without exceeding Availability 12, and the same applies for foam explosives, but in both cases, this is not a device rating, just gear rating, and the archetypes include a rating 7 and rating 8 bow (although to be fair, one character has rating 5 fake SINs and Licenses, which would be Availability 15, so there's already at least one mistake in there).

I'm going to go with page 418 being wrong incomplete. I'm guessing a word was just dropped during editing.

Why? Page 98 repeats the limitations from page 94. (Right hand, top of the column on page 98 if you were wondering). On page 64 when discussing the alternate gameplay, both gear restrictions clearly mention device rating. So you have 3 (or 4 if you count each alternate gameplay entry separate) entries that refer to device rating limits and only one reference to a rating limit.

And think about this: The primary source of character creation limitations should be the character creation chapter. The 3 (or 4) entries that mention device rating limits are all in the character creation chapter. The errant entry is in the gear chapter; which focuses on gear before and after character creation. So page 418 is hardly a primary source for character creation.

That said, it's a good question.

-Ariketh
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Novocrane on <07-18-13/2142:17>
Quote
Cyberskulls and –torsos are included in the “cyberlimbs” category, though they are in fact shells rather than full replacements (or actual limbs).

Do skulls and torsos count as limbs for tests that require "the coordination of several limbs"? (do they have their own strength and agility?)

Quote
Cyberlimbs cannot hold any bioware, nor any cyber-implants that take up Essence rather than Capacity.

Do skull replacements disallow everything from cybereyes to voice modulators that has no capacity rating? Does bodyware force an equivalent list for torsos? Are full body replacements entirely unable to take essence-based cyberware or bioware?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <07-19-13/0836:53>
Sprinting example, p162: "He also gains the defensive benefits of Running Modifiers, specifically Sprinting (–4)"

The running modifiers p. 162 are not listed as part of the situationnal modifiers p. 176 (it is therefore easy to overlook it)
Furthermore, the bonus to defense when running (p. 190) is not listed in the running modifiers p. 162.
I assume both modifiers apply when firing at a running character: malus to attack and bonus to defense. Can you confirm?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-19-13/1044:22>
Firearm modes, attacking multiple targets and dual wielding


The rules for multiple targets with burst firearms seem a bit... lacking.



1) Trying to figure out which combinations that are valid with different firearm fire modes. So far my list look like this:

Code: [Select]
Type  One hand attack             Action  Pool  Shots Dodge Notes
====  =========================== ======= ===== ===== ===== ==============================
Melee Melee Attack                Complex Full   N/A   -0   
Melee Melee Multi Attack          Complex Split  N/A    ?   Max skill/2 targets
SS    Single Shot                 Simple  Full    1    -0   No recoil
SA    Semi-Automatic              Simple  Full    1    -0 
SA    Semi-Automatic Burst        Complex Full    3    -2   
SA    Semi-Automatic Multi Burst  Complex Split   3     ?   Max skill/2 targets
BF    Burst Fire                  Simple  Full    3    -2   
BF    Long Burst                  Complex Full    6    -5   
BF    Long Multi Burst            Complex Split   6     ?   Max skill/2 targets
FA    Simple Full Auto            Simple  Full    6    -5   
FA    Simple Multi Full Auto      Complex Split   6     ?   Max skill/2 targets
FA    Complex Full Auto           Complex Full   10    -9   
FA    Complex Multi Full Auto     Complex Split  10     ?   Max skill/2 targets
FA    Suppressive Fire            Turn    Full   20    -0   Reaction+Edge to dodge

Code: [Select]
Type  Dual wield attack           Action  Pool  Shots Dodge Notes
====  =========================== ======= ===== ===== ===== ==============================
Melee Melee Attack                Complex Split  N/A   -0   Hit target twice
SS    Single Shot                 Simple  Split  1+1   -0   Hit target twice, recoil apply
SA    Semi-Automatic              Simple  Split  1+1   -0   Hit target twice
SA    Semi-Automatic Burst        Simple  Split  3+3   -2   Hit target twice
BF    Burst                       Simple  Split  3+3   -5   Hit target twice
BF    Long Burst                  Complex Split  6+6   -5   Hit target twice
FA    Full Auto                   Simple  Split  6+6   -5   Hit target twice
FA    Long Full Auto              Complex Split 10+10  -9   Hit target twice

Question: Is the above list correct, so far...?


2) You get number of bullets -1 as dodge modifier when someone use burst or full auto attack against you (-0 for 1 bullet simple action single shot or simple action semi-automatic, -2 dodge for 3 bullets complex action semi-automatic burst or simple action burst fire, -5 for 6 bullet complex action long burst or simple action full auto and -9 for 10 bullets complex action full auto)

Question: What is the dodge modifier when attacker use the "attack multiple targets"-free action to hit up to skill / 2 targets?


3) Rules state you can attack skill/2 targets when you take a multiattack free action together with a fire-mode that fire 3,6 or 10 bullets. With a theoretical skill of 13 this would mean I could attack up to 7 targets.

Question: Is it possible to attack up to 7 targets with a Semi-Automatic Burst complex action that only fire 3 bullets...?



4) Rules state that you can attack the same target twice if you dual wield, but I can't see anything explicit if you can or can not attack attack multiple targets while you dual wield two firearms.

Question: Can you attack multiple targets if you dual wield?
- And if so, do you attack each target twice? Do you split your pool again...?


5) Dual wield give you the option to attack a single target twice. It also give you the option to only use one of your two wielded weapons. I can't find any rules about getting lower recoil compensation when you dual wield but only use one of the weapons compared of holding only one weapon with support from two hands.

Question: When you dual wield firearms, would it not make sense that you get the STR/4 recoil compensation split between both weapons...?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <07-19-13/1303:19>
When raising Attributes with the leftover Karma, do increases provide you with free points for Knowledge/Language Skills or Contacts? So if I take 5 Intuition and 1 Logic, then use 25 karma to raise Logic to 3, do I get (5+1)*2 or (5+3)*2 Knowledge/Language points?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-19-13/1333:18>
When raising Attributes with the leftover Karma, do increases provide you with free points for Knowledge/Language Skills or Contacts? So if I take 5 Intuition and 1 Logic, then use 25 karma to raise Logic to 3, do I get (5+1)*2 or (5+3)*2 Knowledge/Language points?
Pretty sure it does not.

Reason for that is that in SR5, unlike SR4, you need to develop your character step by step. Step 2 assign your attributes. You must spend all attributes in this step. You cannot save any attributes. The attributes give you points for knowledge and language skill that you spend in step 5. In step 5 you must spend all your knowledge and language points. You cannot save any points.
- Unlikely that spending karma in step 7 will give you more points to spend in step 5...

But it isn't explicit mentioned in the rule book. Good question for the FAQ.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ricochet on <07-19-13/1423:06>
We know there are some basic exceptions to the steps though.  For example, aptitude gets taken out of order so that you can take a 7th point in a skill at the skill phase, even though aptitude technically shouldn't be selected by the steps until the karma phase.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-19-13/1426:00>
Qualities (like Aptitude) are  Step 4
Skills are Step 5
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <07-19-13/1429:06>
When raising Attributes with the leftover Karma, do increases provide you with free points for Knowledge/Language Skills or Contacts? So if I take 5 Intuition and 1 Logic, then use 25 karma to raise Logic to 3, do I get (5+1)*2 or (5+3)*2 Knowledge/Language points?
Pretty sure it does not.

Reason for that is that in SR5, unlike SR4, you need to develop your character step by step. Step 2 assign your attributes. You must spend all attributes in this step. You cannot save any attributes. The attributes give you points for knowledge and language skill that you spend in step 5. In step 5 you must spend all your knowledge and language points. You cannot save any points.
- Unlikely that spending karma in step 7 will give you more points to spend in step 5...

But it isn't explicit mentioned in the rule book. Good question for the FAQ.

By using your strange logic, one would not be allowed to go ahead and get the gear they want before doing anything else (a common tactic--from what I've seen--in all editions of the game to help one determine just how much in Resources they actually need to spend for).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <07-19-13/1430:16>
Qualities (like Aptitude) are  Step 4
Skills are Step 5
But attributes are Step 2, so a strict order would require you to spend 25-55 Karma (depending on your normal max) in Step 7 if you take Exceptional Attribute and want to start with the Exceptional attribute hardcapped, instead of a single Attribute Point.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Elizara Dane on <07-19-13/1454:27>
Qualities (like Aptitude) are  Step 4
Skills are Step 5
But attributes are Step 2, so a strict order would require you to spend 25-55 Karma (depending on your normal max) in Step 7 if you take Exceptional Attribute and want to start with the Exceptional attribute hardcapped, instead of a single Attribute Point.

I was asking myself the question of if the priority allocations steps are all "you spend these points now or never, then go to next step" then I realized that you choose magic or resonance after choosing metatype and the rules state that special point garnered from metatype choice may be spent on Edge, Magic or Resonance (the latter two having not had their step and thus don't exist on the character). Then, on P.66 "...(the player may purchase either Lucky or Exceptional Attribute, but not both). Even if one of these qualities is purchased, the player must still spend the attribute points/Karma to raise the attribute to that new limit. With Exceptional Attribute, you can end up with a maximum Magic or Resonance rating of 7 when starting the game (before initiation or submersion)". Again, a rule that references spending points out of phase.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-19-13/1512:34>
Some points need to be spend before you move on (physical attributes, mental attributes, skill points... might be more)

Some points do not (special attributes might one example (you just need to spend it before chargen is over but does not HAVE to spend it during step 2), karma can carry over to after chargen, some of unspent money can flow over as starting cash... might be more)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Elizara Dane on <07-19-13/1542:46>
Some points need to be spend before you move on (physical attributes, mental attributes, skill points... might be more)

Some points do not (special attributes might one example (you just need to spend it before chargen is over but does not HAVE to spend it during step 2), karma can carry over to after chargen, some of unspent money can flow over as starting cash... might be more)

P.66 "A character must spend all attribute points during character creation". There is mention that these points have to be spent in a particular phase of creation.

P.88 "All skill and skill group points must be spent at the time of character creation."

It looks like points are all fluid up until the character hits the table. This makes some sense because raising a stat from, lets say 6, to a 7 is prohibitively expensive karma-wise.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-19-13/1550:31>
..mm
if so, then we might be back to the original question
will spending karma on logic at end of chargen raise your number of points for knowledge skills ;)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Elizara Dane on <07-19-13/1601:01>
..mm
if so, then we might be back to the original question
will spending karma on logic at end of chargen raise your number of points for knowledge skills ;)

Based on the evidence I would have to vote yes. It looks like all pools of points are fluid up until the moment a characters first game starts. Of course, one could just as easily say "I lower X stat by 1 and raise Logic by 1 using my points allocated to my attribute pool" then go raise X stat with karma instead  ;D
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <07-19-13/1727:47>
Action phase (p. 163): it is stated that if a character does not cover the whole declared distance the movement penalties still apply. Does the movement bonuses to defense still apply also?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ghoulfodder on <07-19-13/2018:03>
When raising Attributes with the leftover Karma, do increases provide you with free points for Knowledge/Language Skills or Contacts? So if I take 5 Intuition and 1 Logic, then use 25 karma to raise Logic to 3, do I get (5+1)*2 or (5+3)*2 Knowledge/Language points?
Pretty sure it does not.

Reason for that is that in SR5, unlike SR4, you need to develop your character step by step. Step 2 assign your attributes. You must spend all attributes in this step. You cannot save any attributes. The attributes give you points for knowledge and language skill that you spend in step 5. In step 5 you must spend all your knowledge and language points. You cannot save any points.
- Unlikely that spending karma in step 7 will give you more points to spend in step 5...

But it isn't explicit mentioned in the rule book. Good question for the FAQ.

By using your strange logic, one would not be allowed to go ahead and get the gear they want before doing anything else (a common tactic--from what I've seen--in all editions of the game to help one determine just how much in Resources they actually need to spend for).

You can plan it obviously, but it's pretty clear the intent is you follow the process step by step for what you can do. Working out free skill points for Knowledge skills and allocating them comes before finishing touches. Therefore it's logical that  raising your Logic or Intuition with Karma doesn't affect your free skill points.

Either way it's hardly game breaking though, so if you wanna raise it and get your extra couple of skill points I don't see why you shouldn't just go ahead and knock yourself out, providing your GM and the rest of the players don't have a problem with it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <07-19-13/2114:07>
Biggest counterexample in the book for this "you must build your character 1 Step at a time, in that specific order" theory: Rob gives his character 11 Strength in Step 2 because he plans to take the Exceptional Attribute (Strength) Positive Quality in Step 4. And no, the "the gamemaster has given Rob permission to take this quality at character creation" bit doesn't mean the GM allowed him to sequence-break: it's there because the description of Exceptional Attribute states it requires express GM permission.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Typhus on <07-21-13/0252:21>
Here's ones I struggled to find at first with the chargen section:

 - You also get Cha X 3 in more Karma just for contacts, but you can't spend it elsewhere
 - You can only max one stat at chargen
 - Knowledge skills are (INT + LOG) x 2 in free Knowledge Skill points.
 - Max of +4 on cyber boosts to any one attribute with gear
 - You only get one attack action per pass, Simple or otherwise.
 
Neat stuff:

* Cold damage can be used to outright shatter armor.
* There are no limits on defense checks or soak rolls.
* Mana Bolt/Stun Bolt are no longer king of casting.  I recommend Control Actions/Thoughts so far as the Go-To Troll Stopper spells now.

Things I am finding pretty silly:

* Trauma patches are somehow wireless. Somehow it releases chemicals *better* that way?
--Fun fact: If it's online, that also means you can hack a trauma patch, if you wanted to.  Or at least brick it. 
* Area spells use Grenade scatter rules to land instead of hitting where you aimed them now.

Things that would have helped:

* A picture that illustrates how grids, hosts, icons and systems and personas, etc. all come together.  Even one would have been great.  All that text and not one single image of what it looks like to be on a grid.  Oversight?
 
* A master character creation chart.  Every rule in one place on one page. 

* All chargen rules broken out in tables or highlighted somehow.  Compare to the older 1 and 2e rulebooks to see my point.  A similar feel to the pages would have been well received. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <07-21-13/0513:26>
- Max of +4 on cyber boosts to any one attribute with gear
Intended: Max of +4 on any attribute from any source unless explicitly stated otherwise (Wireless Wired Reflexes + Reaction Enhancers).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-21-13/0519:02>
Defense checks that include a skill still have limit. For example of you use Dodge you add gymnastics dice but also get a physical limit.

+4 to attributes is not limited to cyber boosts. It is an universal limit to augment attributes (drugs, magic, powers...) that can be ignored of a boost explicit state so. Like reaction enhancers vs wired reflexes.
edit. as Michael already said
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: FastJack on <07-21-13/1201:18>
I approve of this thread. It shall be sticky.

*NOTE* If you post in this thread, it's to list a clarification of a rule ONLY (and preferably with a link to said clarification like Imp did). This is NOT a place for questions (see the Errata/FAQ threads).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: khaine1969 on <07-21-13/1634:54>
Defense checks that include a skill still have limit. For example of you use Dodge you add gymnastics dice but also get a physical limit.

+4 to attributes is not limited to cyber boosts. It is an universal limit to augment attributes (drugs, magic, powers...) that can be ignored of a boost explicit state so. Like reaction enhancers vs wired reflexes.
edit. as Michael already said
the first topic is not a clarification, and I'm pretty sure is dead wrong anyway..
Consider this example
I have reflexes 5 and intuition 5 and some one shoots as me...I roll 10 defense dice and can keep all of them, but if your statement is true and I chose to dodge and add my gymnastics dice, not only do I take a -5 hit on my initiative, but the hits are now limited by physical meaning I get to keep less? I seriously doubt that is how that's intended to work.
This is the problem with an open thread allowing any member to "clarify" the rules, if they're wrong or don't know what they're talking about, then it misleads and confuses everyone. It should be left to questions, that are then answered by the devs and people who count as an official ruling
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Typhus on <07-21-13/1908:36>
I had the idea right in my head, just worded it inaccurately.  Was up too late.  Thanks for clarifying.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <07-21-13/2023:11>
the first topic is not a clarification, and I'm pretty sure is dead wrong anyway..


It's correct. See p 191 and 192 under Active Defenses. The text spells it out clearly. When adding a skill to your defense roll you add the appropriate limit. Whether you would rather roll fewer dice with no limit or more dice with the physical limit is a tactical choice.

Quote
Dodge
Any character, armed or unarmed, looking for a quick,
short-term boost to his melee defense can use a Dodge
Interrupt Action against an attack at any point in a Combat
Turn, so long as the character is not surprised (see
Surprise, p. 192). A Dodge action allows the character
to roll Reaction + Intuition + Gymnastics [Physical]
as
his Defense test. Note that since a skill is introduced to
the Defense Test, a limit is introduced as well.
This boost only deducts 5 from his Initiative Score,
but it only lasts for a single Defense Test.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: khaine1969 on <07-22-13/0007:26>
one of us had to be wrong...just illustrates my point...clarifications to the rules should not be posted by just anybody who cares to throw in their 2 cents, it should be left to those who can make official rulings.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: mtfeeney = Baron on <07-22-13/0054:19>
The people with that power don't post here.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <07-22-13/0354:24>
From the discussion thread on "best guns in SR5," Does an internal Smartgun system count as an
"accessory" for limits on what guns can have?(as in, can a Hold Out Pistol have an Internal Smartgun
System put on it?)

Also: this thread really should be stickied if iot is really being used to generate the Official FAQ.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <07-22-13/0744:29>
Regarding Attribute Boost: It says the boosted stat only applies to dicepools, not to your Physical limit and Initiative ratings. This list is not exhaustive on what it lists, leading to a few questions.

Q: Is Attribute Boost meant to only apply to dicepools period, or is it meant to not apply to your Physical Limit and Initiative Ratings period? In other words, is what it affects the limiting factor, or what it does not affect?

To illustrate:
Body: Does Attribute Boost let you get temporary extra hitboxes?
Strength: Does Damage Value increase, or does a melee fighter always have to depend on Improved Physical Attribute to reach his maximum damage?
Strength: What about Carrying Limits? Can you use Attribute Boost to temporarily raise your lifting/above/carrying baseline (Strength x 15/5/10 kg) or does it only boost the test-dice on being able to handle more than the baseline?

----------------------------------------

Counterspelling Foci: These add their Force to your spell defense pool. The rules also state only one focus may add its Force to a dicepool for any given test. Spell Defense, however, is a pool that can be divided over multiple tests.

Q: How does having multiple counterspelling foci types active work for Spell Defense?

Detailed scenario:
Say I have Counterspelling 4, a Counterspelling Focus (Manipulation) Force 3 and a Counterspelling Focus (Combat) Force 2. There's now multiple possible explanations for Spell Defense.
1: Each Focus applies extra dice to the Spell Defense only to be used against type X magic.
1a: Foci of the same type can all be added but you cannot use more than one of each on the same defense test.
2: I must, when forming my Spell Defense pool, determine which of the Foci to add to it.
3: I must, when using my Spell Defense pool, determine whether to add dice from one of the Foci, thus limiting my Spell Defense pool to only get a boost from that Focus this Combat Turn.

Say a Manabolt is tossed at my Street Samurai. I cover him with 3 Counterspelling dice. In case 1 my Pool is now (4-1)+3m+(2-2)c = 3+3m. In case 2 I'd have to determine in advance which of the two to use, so would either have 1 die left + 3 dice against manipulation, or 3 dice left. In case 3 I could add the Combat Focus now and have 3 left, or not add it and have 1 left (+ the option to add one of the foci next time).

If multiple Foci can be added and only 1 can add to each test, we get the interesting case where I might be allowed to add 2 Foci of the same type and use 2 Counterspelling Foci (Combat) Force 2. I could use Focus A against the manabolt and add 1 die from my general spell defense pool, leaving me with 3 dice + the second anti-combat focus unused this Combat Turn. I would not be allowed to add dice from the second focus because I can only add dice from 1 Focus to each test.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: FastJack on <07-22-13/0805:52>
one of us had to be wrong...just illustrates my point...clarifications to the rules should not be posted by just anybody who cares to throw in their 2 cents, it should be left to those who can make official rulings.
I'm glad Michael Chandra broke off the discussion to the other thread (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11786.msg217291#msg217291). If you feel it needs discussion, don't post it here, but discuss it elsewhere. This thread will be for posts that have a source to back them up. In the case of the adding gymnastics imposes a limit, there is a source to back it up, so it's good.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <07-22-13/0946:47>
How does defense against grenades work?
Bull stated here (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11290.msg208685#msg208685) that there is no defense roll against grenades.
The rules as I understand them (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11789.0) explain that there is some defense roll.
It needs to be clarified, and eventually errated
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: GiraffeShaman on <07-22-13/2103:51>
From another thread, it seems like this is an important one, as it seems to confirm you get defense against grenades...

Page 189 Shadowrun 5th Edition

Defense Modifier Table:  Targeted by area-effect attack –2

This defense modifier makes it should like you can use defense against an area effect attack.

(It's also on pg. 190)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: lonewolf1210 on <07-23-13/0510:35>
I asked this question in 2 other threads, and noone has been able to answer it, although I believe it is quite important:

- Does a rigger who is jumped into a drone and fires a mounted weapon which has smartlink get the boni from smartlink?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <07-23-13/0913:33>
If a GM lets you Substitute a Stealth skill for Perception, what Limit is used? Still [Mental]?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: quindraco on <07-23-13/0923:05>
Pn page 445, Audio Enhancements are listed as having a maximum rating of 3.  On page 444, Vision Enhancements do not list a maximum rating.  Do they have a maximum rating?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Unahim on <07-23-13/0939:03>
Is Submersion intended to have a cost of 10 x (rating x 3), while Initiation is 10 + (rating x 3)? That seems kinda steep.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <07-23-13/1200:38>
When an edged diceroll results in, or is accompanied by, a secondary test, are you unable to edge the second test?

For example, if I cast a Spell with Edge, can I edge the Drain Resistance test? When I edge and still roll a critical glitch with Explosive rounds, am I uncapable of edging the resulting damage soak test? If I summon a Sprite/Spirit with the help of Edge, can I then Edge the Fading/Drain test?

Related: If you multicast, are you allowed to Edge only 1 of the Drain tests?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <07-23-13/1229:12>
Long list of required clarification regarding firing modes, sorry if some of them have already been asked:

The information is spread over many sections and some points remains unclear to me (maybe I missed somthing). I would greatly appreciate if Catalyst could confirm my understanding on the following points and fill the holes:

- SS weapons:
            - can fire 1 round per Simple Action, maximum 1 attack action per Action phase (p. 165 & 178). no cumulative recoil (p. 176).
            - It is possible to use Multiple Attacks free action to fire 2 SS weapons in a single Simple Action (by spliting the dice pool)  if the character have one SS weapon readied in each hand (p. 165 & 178). In that case cumulative recoil applies (p. 176).
   
- SA weapons:
            - can fire 1 round per Simple Action, maximum 1 attack action per Action phase (p. 165 & 178). cumulative recoil applies (p. 175)
            - It is possible to use Multiple Attacks free action to fire 2 SA weapons in a single Simple Action (by spliting the dice pool) if the character have one SA weapon readied in each hand (p. 165 & 179).
            - SA weapons can also fire 1 semi-automatic burst (3 rounds) in one Complex Action (p. 167 & 179).
            - Semi-automatic bursts can take advantage of the Multiple Attacks Free Action to fire at multiple targets with the same burst (p. 167 & 179). Note that p. 167 this ability is limited to short and medium range, whereas no such limitation is stated p. 179. Does the range limitation applies? How does shooting several targets with a single burst work? (maximum number of targets, number of bullets, defense modifier...)
            - A character who has one readied SA weapon in each hand can use Multiple Attacks Free Action to fire a semi-automatic burst with each weapon (p. 167). in p. 179 the description of semi-automatic bursts does not list this option, whereas it is done for SA mode just above. Is this option possible? How does it combine with shooting several targets with a single burst?

- BF weapons:
            - can fire 3 rounds in a Simple Action, maximum 1 attack action per Action phase (p. 165 & 179)
            - It is possible to use Multiple Attacks free action to fire 2 BF weapons in a single Simple Action (by spliting the dice pool) if the character have one BF weapon readied in each hand (p. 165). in p. 179 the description of Burst Fire does not list this option, whereas it is done for SA mode just above. Is this option possible? How does it combine with shooting several targets with a single burst?
            - BF weapons can take advantage of the Multiple Attacks Free Action to fire at multiple targets with the same burst (p. 179). Note that p. 165 this ability is not listed. Does this ability exist? Does the range limitation of SA-burst applies? How does shooting several targets with a single burst work? (maximum number of targets, number of bullets, defense modifier...)

- Long Burst:
            - the description p. 179 seems to indicate that this is a second firing mode for BF weapons. (just quickly firing in Burst Fire mode). Can you confirm? if not can you elaborate?
            - Long bursts can take advantage of the Multiple Attacks Free Action to fire at multiple targets with the same burst (p. 167 & 179). Note that p. 167 this ability is limited to short and medium range, whereas no such limitation is stated p. 179. Does the range limitation applies? How does shooting several targets with a single burst work? (maximum number of targets, number of bullets, defense modifier...)
            - A character who has one readied LB weapon in each hand can use Multiple Attacks Free Action to fire a semi-automatic burst with each weapon (p. 167). in p. 179 the description of semi-automatic bursts does not list this option, whereas it is done for SA mode just above. Is this option possible? How does it combine with shooting several targets with a single burst?

- Full Auto weapons:
            - can fire 6 bullets in a Simple Action, maximum 1 attack action per Action phase (p. 165 & 179)
            - It is possible to use Multiple Attacks free action to fire 2 FA weapons in a single Simple Action (by spliting the dice pool) if the character have one FA weapon readied in each hand (p. 165). in p. 179 the description of FA does not list this option, whereas it is done for SA mode just above. Is this option possible? How does it combine with shooting several targets with a single burst?
            - FA weapons can take advantage of the Multiple Attacks Free Action to fire at multiple targets with the same burst with a Simple Action (p. 179). Note that p. 165 this ability is not listed. Does this ability exist? Does the range limitation of SA-burst applies? How does shooting several targets with a single burst work? (maximum number of targets, number of bullets, defense modifier...)
            - FA weapons can fire 10 bullets in a Complex Action (p. 167 & 179)
            - It is possible to use Multiple Attacks free action to fire 2 FA weapons in a single Complex Action (by spliting the dice pool) if the character have one FA weapon readied in each hand (p. 167). in p. 179 the description of FA does not list this option, whereas it is done for SA mode just above. Is this option possible? How does it combine with shooting several targets with a single burst?
            - FA weapons can take advantage of the Multiple Attacks Free Action to fire at multiple targets with the same burst with a Complex Action (p. 179). Note that p. 167 this ability is not listed. Does this ability exist? Does the range limitation of SA-burst applies? How does shooting several targets with a single burst work? (maximum number of targets, number of bullets, defense modifier...)

- Supressive Fire: The description p. 179 seems to mean that only FA weapons can perform suppressive fire (which was also the case in SR4) but it is not stated clearly. Can you please confirm this assumption?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ghoulfodder on <07-23-13/1305:33>
Biggest counterexample in the book for this "you must build your character 1 Step at a time, in that specific order" theory: Rob gives his character 11 Strength in Step 2 because he plans to take the Exceptional Attribute (Strength) Positive Quality in Step 4. And no, the "the gamemaster has given Rob permission to take this quality at character creation" bit doesn't mean the GM allowed him to sequence-break: it's there because the description of Exceptional Attribute states it requires express GM permission.
Having re-read it the other day I'd like to retract and revise my opinion.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: FastJack on <07-23-13/1331:37>
From the Clarifications thread:

Quote from: Daedalus
Here is one we came across during gameplay last weekend.
Paralyzing howl effects a rigger jumped into his drone (riggers meat body was in range of the howl). Can he still operate the drone? All of his matrix attributes are still above 0.
If he was not jumped in already, could he do so?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: FastJack on <07-23-13/1334:12>
As stated before, questions should go to the FAQ (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11514.0;topicseen) thread. I moved Daedalus' question there, but future questions will simply be removed from this thread.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <07-23-13/1837:09>
Here is one:
If you use more Reagents  then Force in the making of an Alchemical Preparation, can your final potency exceed the Force
of the spell prepared? (By strict reading of RAW, this is the case, since the drams of reagents you use replaces the Force
for the Limits, and the preparation roll is opposed Alchemy+magic[Force/drams of reagents] vs the Force of the Spell being
prepared, net hits becoming the Potency of the preparation)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <07-23-13/2356:35>
This one I can answer on the quick:

Here is one:
If you use more Reagents  then Force in the making of an Alchemical Preparation, can your final potency exceed the Force
of the spell prepared? (By strict reading of RAW, this is the case, since the drams of reagents you use replaces the Force
for the Limits, and the preparation roll is opposed Alchemy+magic[Force/drams of reagents] vs the Force of the Spell being
prepared, net hits becoming the Potency of the preparation)

Yes, it's possible to end up with a preparation with a Potency higher than Force by spending reagents.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Typhus on <07-24-13/0050:14>
Why does an off-hand task equate to the same degree of difficulty reflected by suffering 6 boxes of damage?
-2 dice for off-handedness?  My hand is slightly less dexterous, not shattered.  What gives? 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Redwulfe on <07-24-13/0105:12>
Not probably that big of a deal and don't know if this has been said yet either. Encumbrance rules use the weight of the equipment verses your carrying capacity but I don't see weight listed for anything except explosives. GM is just making stuff up right now but thought it would be nice to have on the tables or in the book.

Red
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: quindraco on <07-24-13/1140:28>
What does addiction rating actually do?

Page 414 says you take an addiction test every time you take an addictive substance during 11-Addiction Rating weeks in a row, but also says that substances with a high rating can get you hooked in a single dose.  Assuming, then, that you take a test on the first dose, let's look at Kamikaze (rating 9, meaning 2 weeks).  You'd roll a test on first taking it, then if you went 3 weeks before taking it again, you'd roll again, because no rule says you don't.  But you also roll if you take it a second time immediately.  So when does addiction rating actually come into play or affect gameplay?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <07-24-13/1203:38>
What does addiction rating actually do?

Page 414 says you take an addiction test every time you take an addictive substance during 11-Addiction Rating weeks in a row, but also says that substances with a high rating can get you hooked in a single dose.  Assuming, then, that you take a test on the first dose, let's look at Kamikaze (rating 9, meaning 2 weeks).  You'd roll a test on first taking it, then if you went 3 weeks before taking it again, you'd roll again, because no rule says you don't.  But you also roll if you take it a second time immediately.  So when does addiction rating actually come into play or affect gameplay?
I posted my interpretation of this in a different topic (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11594.msg214573#msg214573): by "in a single dose", they mean that with a high enough Addiction Rating (specifically, if Addiction Rating + Addiction Threshold >= 11), the Threshold won't go down to 0 before you're supposed to do your first test, so even if you only use it once, you'll have to do an Addiction Test at some point, and therefore risk becoming addicted. Nothing in the rules suggests you have to make an Addiction Test immediately.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Elizara Dane on <07-24-13/1213:04>
Why does an off-hand task equate to the same degree of difficulty reflected by suffering 6 boxes of damage?
-2 dice for off-handedness?  My hand is slightly less dexterous, not shattered.  What gives?

The -2 really represents "my offhand is much less trained and I lack the proper coordination to properly perform actions that would otherwise be completely second nature to my dominant hand". This makes sense because a fully enabled smart link device can show you where to point and thus alleviate your lack of skill with a total modifier of -0 while your main hand benefits more because you've trained with it.

Likewise, when you do get to the -2 due to injury your main hand is now shaky because you've been fragging shot and the offhand is now both uncoordinated and in pain and is represented by -4.

TL;DR: Wound modifiers are a general way of explaining injury in a fictional setting. Talk to anyone that has been shot (with or without protection) and most will tell you they wouldn't be shooting let alone standing afterwards.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <07-26-13/0003:55>
p 298 Circle of Healing

Is any health spell considered a "healing spell" for purposes of Circle of healing or only spells that heal damage? if the more restrictive definition is correct would spells that cure disease be considered "healing spells."
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Psikerlord on <07-26-13/0037:34>
I'm sorry I haven't been keeping up with answers, folks. I have been copying down all the questions to be distilled into a FAQ to be answered and posted through more official channels than just me. Thanks for bearing with me.
We appreciate all your hard work Aaron  :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Psikerlord on <07-26-13/0049:26>
Can i just throw this out there... currently grenades seem pretty damn deadly. If there is no defence roll, only a soak damage roll, could the devs consider slipping something into the interrupt "active defence" actions that helps mitigate grenades and spell AoE damage?

Eg: "Incoming!"
Interrupt action. -5 initiative. An AoE is about to hit and you dive out of harms way like a boss. Gain gymnastics or willpower or something to your soak roll for the AoE damage.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: quindraco on <07-26-13/0109:20>
What does addiction rating actually do?

Page 414 says you take an addiction test every time you take an addictive substance during 11-Addiction Rating weeks in a row, but also says that substances with a high rating can get you hooked in a single dose.  Assuming, then, that you take a test on the first dose, let's look at Kamikaze (rating 9, meaning 2 weeks).  You'd roll a test on first taking it, then if you went 3 weeks before taking it again, you'd roll again, because no rule says you don't.  But you also roll if you take it a second time immediately.  So when does addiction rating actually come into play or affect gameplay?
I posted my interpretation of this in a different topic (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11594.msg214573#msg214573): by "in a single dose", they mean that with a high enough Addiction Rating (specifically, if Addiction Rating + Addiction Threshold >= 11), the Threshold won't go down to 0 before you're supposed to do your first test, so even if you only use it once, you'll have to do an Addiction Test at some point, and therefore risk becoming addicted. Nothing in the rules suggests you have to make an Addiction Test immediately.

If you don't take it immediately, when would you take it?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <07-26-13/0850:38>
What does addiction rating actually do?

Page 414 says you take an addiction test every time you take an addictive substance during 11-Addiction Rating weeks in a row, but also says that substances with a high rating can get you hooked in a single dose.  Assuming, then, that you take a test on the first dose, let's look at Kamikaze (rating 9, meaning 2 weeks).  You'd roll a test on first taking it, then if you went 3 weeks before taking it again, you'd roll again, because no rule says you don't.  But you also roll if you take it a second time immediately.  So when does addiction rating actually come into play or affect gameplay?
I posted my interpretation of this in a different topic (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11594.msg214573#msg214573): by "in a single dose", they mean that with a high enough Addiction Rating (specifically, if Addiction Rating + Addiction Threshold >= 11), the Threshold won't go down to 0 before you're supposed to do your first test, so even if you only use it once, you'll have to do an Addiction Test at some point, and therefore risk becoming addicted. Nothing in the rules suggests you have to make an Addiction Test immediately.
If you don't take it immediately, when would you take it?
At the end of a week, where the time you used the drug for the first time counts as somewhere in week 1 (start, end, middle - depending on what your GM rules, I guess). The rules say you have to test when "you use an addictive substance during (11 — Addiction Rating) weeks in a row" (emphasis mine).
Actually, I posted a step-by-step guide in the Rules forum (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11865.msg218628#msg218628) yesterday, which I hope explains things properly.

Actually, I have a different question: with Focus Addiction, the you can have as much as [Magic x 5] Force worth of foci bonded (spread over at most [Magic] different foci), which means it's entirely possible for the "total Force of all active foci" to be 11 or higher. At that point, how often do you really make the tests? Just every single week (so you assume the Addiction Rating caps at 10)?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-26-13/0927:00>
(Don't think the first magic rating worth of force focus count towards addiction)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: quindraco on <07-26-13/1019:33>
What does addiction rating actually do?

Page 414 says you take an addiction test every time you take an addictive substance during 11-Addiction Rating weeks in a row, but also says that substances with a high rating can get you hooked in a single dose.  Assuming, then, that you take a test on the first dose, let's look at Kamikaze (rating 9, meaning 2 weeks).  You'd roll a test on first taking it, then if you went 3 weeks before taking it again, you'd roll again, because no rule says you don't.  But you also roll if you take it a second time immediately.  So when does addiction rating actually come into play or affect gameplay?
I posted my interpretation of this in a different topic (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11594.msg214573#msg214573): by "in a single dose", they mean that with a high enough Addiction Rating (specifically, if Addiction Rating + Addiction Threshold >= 11), the Threshold won't go down to 0 before you're supposed to do your first test, so even if you only use it once, you'll have to do an Addiction Test at some point, and therefore risk becoming addicted. Nothing in the rules suggests you have to make an Addiction Test immediately.
If you don't take it immediately, when would you take it?
At the end of a week, where the time you used the drug for the first time counts as somewhere in week 1 (start, end, middle - depending on what your GM rules, I guess). The rules say you have to test when "you use an addictive substance during (11 — Addiction Rating) weeks in a row" (emphasis mine).
Actually, I posted a step-by-step guide in the Rules forum (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11865.msg218628#msg218628) yesterday, which I hope explains things properly.

Actually, I have a different question: with Focus Addiction, the you can have as much as [Magic x 5] Force worth of foci bonded (spread over at most [Magic] different foci), which means it's entirely possible for the "total Force of all active foci" to be 11 or higher. At that point, how often do you really make the tests? Just every single week (so you assume the Addiction Rating caps at 10)?

That's an interesting interpretation, but makes several assumptions where I don't see the rules basis - for example, when you fail an addiction test, moving up to the next addiction level, I don't see any rules basis for dropping the process until the next dose.  That's just an example; your process is readily understandable and I can see where you're coming from, but I see a number of house rules in place, and I was hoping to find out what was intended by the devs.

Another question, since we're discussing foci:  unlike other drugs, your focus addiction can easily have a different addiction rating on a minute by minute basis.  How do you resolve it?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <07-26-13/1048:29>
That's an interesting interpretation, but makes several assumptions where I don't see the rules basis - for example, when you fail an addiction test, moving up to the next addiction level, I don't see any rules basis for dropping the process until the next dose.  That's just an example; your process is readily understandable and I can see where you're coming from, but I see a number of house rules in place, and I was hoping to find out what was intended by the devs.
I can see why you might think my assumption that if you fail the Addiction Test and get (more) hooked, you don't have to make another until you use again, is a "house rule", but "a number of" house rules? Please explain in the other topic.

As for your Focus Addiction Rating: just use the highest used.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: trunglefever on <07-26-13/1926:31>
My friend is converting a rigger from 4E to 5E and for autosofts, it says "A drone has a number of slots to use for autosofts and cyberprograms equal to half its Device Rating, rounded up." The only area that is listed that has a drone device rating is on p.421 that lists drones as rating 2.

Is there any other page that includes this information or are all drones just...average?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Typhus on <07-27-13/0000:31>
Why does an off-hand task equate to the same degree of difficulty reflected by suffering 6 boxes of damage?
-2 dice for off-handedness?  My hand is slightly less dexterous, not shattered.  What gives?

The -2 really represents "my offhand is much less trained and I lack the proper coordination to properly perform actions that would otherwise be completely second nature to my dominant hand". This makes sense because a fully enabled smart link device can show you where to point and thus alleviate your lack of skill with a total modifier of -0 while your main hand benefits more because you've trained with it.

Likewise, when you do get to the -2 due to injury your main hand is now shaky because you've been fragging shot and the offhand is now both uncoordinated and in pain and is represented by -4.

TL;DR: Wound modifiers are a general way of explaining injury in a fictional setting. Talk to anyone that has been shot (with or without protection) and most will tell you they wouldn't be shooting let alone standing afterwards.

Sorry, friend, you missed my point entirely.  My question is about why the degree of penalty is the same as 6 boxes of damage, when reality doesn't match that degree of difficulty by comparison.  Incidentally, I have played rpgs for about 20 years, and am familiar with all the obvious concepts. I agree that if anything, damage mods should come up to reflect reality better.  They kept the damage mods the same as in 1e, but the dice pools they effect have doubled.  Needs a tweak I think.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <07-27-13/0026:40>
My friend is converting a rigger from 4E to 5E and for autosofts, it says "A drone has a number of slots to use for autosofts and cyberprograms equal to half its Device Rating, rounded up." The only area that is listed that has a drone device rating is on p.421 that lists drones as rating 2.

Is there any other page that includes this information or are all drones just...average?

If your drone is armed, you can probably convince your GM that your drone is a security or even military device, bumping the DR up to 3 or 4.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <07-27-13/1505:36>
p309 Would the Adept power attribute boost add to unarmed damage if applied to Strength?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-27-13/1623:03>
Customization of Cyberlimbs
Can be used to increase basic cyberlimbs to match (but not exceed) your STR and/or AGI
p.456 You can have your cyberlimb tailored and customized to your frame and musculature

If your STR and/or AGI exceed natural maximum (from other cyberware, exceptional attribute quality, adept powers etc.)
- then you can still only customize basic cyberlimb up to your natural maximum for that attribute.
p.456 If either of your limb’s attributes are increased beyond your natural maximum for that attribute, you can’t use the cyberlimb

Trolls (and to some extent Orks) buying customized cyberlimbs at chargen might need to verify that total availability from base cyberlimb and customization does not exceed 12 (table on p.457)

You can enhance your cyberlimb beyond the customization to your frame and musculature and even beyond your natural maximum. This is done with cyberlimb enhancements (1-3 ranks each, they cost capacity and nuyen. Table on p.457)

The 3rd rank of armor have availability 15 (so you can only get max +2 enhanced armor per cyberlimb during chargen).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <07-27-13/1908:45>
p309 Would the Adept power attribute boost add to unarmed damage if applied to Strength?
Nothing. It only adds dice to dice pools involving Strength.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-27-13/1921:21>
p.456 Customization of cyberlimb state that: Should this be read as;

A) You can improve your cyberlimb to [but not beyond] your value for that attribute
- and not beyond your natural maximum for that attribute
(in case your value for that attribute is augmented beyond natural maximum with for example exceptional attribute)

or

B) You can improve your cyberlimb to [but not beyond] your natural maximum for that attribute
(the first sentence and your value for that attribute having no impact at all on how much you can customize the cyberlimb).



Points for A)
"You can have your cyberlimb tailored and customized to your frame and musculature" is not the same as "You can have your cyberlimb tailored and customized beyond your frame and musculature" nor is it the same as "You can have your cyberlimb tailored and customized to your maximum natural frame and musculature".


Points for B)
Street Samurai Archetype have a strength 11 cyberlimb but he only got 5 strength (implying custom cyberlimb beyond 5, all the way up to maximum natural of 8, followed by +3 enhancement).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-27-13/1929:53>
Buying back Magic rating

If i have 5 Magic (max magic 6 and essence 6.0) and install a data jack, then I will get 4 Magic (max magic 5).

In SR4 it would cost 25 Karma to get up from 4 Magic to 5 Magic (max magic 5).
However, in SR5 I can't find a rule for this. Have it changed.....?

Will it cost me:

A) 25 Karma

or

B) 30 Karma
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Raiden on <07-28-13/0034:27>
Shock gloves. first questions, do you receive the +2 for touch attacks with them? if so, or if not more likely, if I -punch- someone, why can I not do my STR damage then the stun damage? I still HIT them with a punch, + the stun. same for any stun baton.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <07-28-13/0039:18>
Shock gloves. first questions, do you receive the +2 for touch attacks with them? if so, or if not more likely, if I -punch- someone, why can I not do my STR damage then the stun damage? I still HIT them with a punch, + the stun. same for any stun baton.

Well, for one thing, trying to double dip on damage like that would, by most definitions, cross the border into munchkinism.  Secondly, shockgloves and stun batons are built to be less-lethal weapons - they're specifically designed to AVOID the kind of injury that would deal Physical damage.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Raiden on <07-28-13/0043:11>
Shock gloves. first questions, do you receive the +2 for touch attacks with them? if so, or if not more likely, if I -punch- someone, why can I not do my STR damage then the stun damage? I still HIT them with a punch, + the stun. same for any stun baton.

Well, for one thing, trying to double dip on damage like that would, by most definitions, cross the border into munchkinism.  Secondly, shockgloves and stun batons are built to be less-lethal weapons - they're specifically designed to AVOID the kind of injury that would deal Physical damage.

Ok, not trying to get it, just asking, common sense states it would still have the power of the punch behind it. main thing is do they get the +2 for touch attacks. If you have to actually -hit- them then my second question holds more sway.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <07-28-13/0055:10>
Sure, the force of the punch is there, but given the insulation in place so that the gloves don't shock the hell out of YOU, it's not gonna do a great job of transferring to the opponent.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: The Madadh on <07-28-13/0927:11>
Can the benefits of Image Magnification be explicitly explained? In the gear section it refers you (incorrectly) to pg 177 (should be 178), wherein the description of using Image Magnification refers you to the gear section. Am I just missing it?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <07-28-13/0956:16>
Can the benefits of Image Magnification be explicitly explained? In the gear section it refers you (incorrectly) to pg 177 (should be 178), wherein the description of using Image Magnification refers you to the gear section. Am I just missing it?

It reduces the range conditions by one category, as stated in the environmental compensation table p. 175
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-28-13/1021:47>
Can the benefits of Image Magnification be explicitly explained? In the gear section it refers you (incorrectly) to pg 177 (should be 178), wherein the description of using Image Magnification refers you to the gear section. Am I just missing it?

It reduces the range conditions by one category, as stated in the environmental compensation table p. 175
(and cost you a simple Take Aim action as per p.166 and the example on p.176).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: lonewolf1210 on <07-29-13/0855:44>
Since cultivated bioware must be made for each recipient specifically, you cannot buy "used" cutlivated bioware.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <07-30-13/0708:25>
With Cyberlimbs, does your Augmented Maximum limit their effectiveness in play? E.g., if you have 5 natural Strength and a Cyberlimb with 11 Strength, do you use 11 or 5+4=9, meaning you won't unlock their full potential until you raise your natural Strength to 7?

Edit: When a gas is both Inhalation and Contact (e.g. Pepper Punch), what protection, if any, does a Gas Mask provide if you only have a Gas Mask? Does it provide Immunity, reduce the effect or not help at all? And what happens if you combine a Gas Mask with Chemical Protection against such a gas?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <07-30-13/0746:09>
As I understand it if you are playing missions this is fine, it doesn't say this is errata...
The Missions FAQ is trying to get the most important errata in there before the errata themselves are released. Developers have stated several times that only the lifestyle increases of +100% and +20% are meant to be the case. It's not in the rules yet, but it has been stated that it should have been and likely it will be.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: quindraco on <07-30-13/0959:04>
Page 310:  Kinesics adds +1 to resist assensing and truthfulness tests.  Assensing has no listed resist, and I don't know what a truthfulness test is - the power ALSO applies to resisting Judge Intent, separately, so that can't be it.  How do these two aspects of Kinesics come up in practice?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: The Madadh on <07-30-13/1333:35>
Can the benefits of Image Magnification be explicitly explained? In the gear section it refers you (incorrectly) to pg 177 (should be 178), wherein the description of using Image Magnification refers you to the gear section. Am I just missing it?

It reduces the range conditions by one category, as stated in the environmental compensation table p. 175

There it is. Thanks.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Palladion on <07-31-13/0006:29>
Quote
Unconsciousness: When all of the available boxes in a track (Physical or Stun) are filled in, the character immediately falls unconscious and drops to the ground. If the Stun track is filled in, the character is merely knocked out. If the Physical track is filled in, however, the character is near death and will die unless stabilized.

There is no explicit reference to this in the Combat or Damage sections, but several implied references, SR5 100,137, 460, etc., as well as the Quick-Start Rules 12 (quoted above).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <07-31-13/0650:00>
Adepts can take a Power Point as metamagic-replacement at Initiation, and can take Qi Foci. Can Mystic Adepts?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: lightknight on <07-31-13/0946:38>
My friend is converting a rigger from 4E to 5E and for autosofts, it says "A drone has a number of slots to use for autosofts and cyberprograms equal to half its Device Rating, rounded up." The only area that is listed that has a drone device rating is on p.421 that lists drones as rating 2.

Is there any other page that includes this information or are all drones just...average?

pg. 269 "The Device Rating of a drone is the same as its Pilot
Rating, meaning all of its Matrix attributes are equal to
the Pilot Rating."


Wouldn't it have been nifty if they had given us a way to increase pilot ratings in the main book.  As is, I hope your rigger friend likes the many weak drone army method of rigging, or has the ability to resist a lot of biofeedback when all the drones get blowed up real good with him rigging.  My latest SR char is a rigger and I consider my 4E character unconvertible to 5e as it stands.  I could do it, but it wouldn't be the same char in personality, equipment, etc.  I've progressed through the stages anger, sadness, acceptance.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: The Masked Ferret on <07-31-13/1011:52>
Wouldn't it have been nifty if they had given us a way to increase pilot ratings in the main book.  As is, I hope your rigger friend likes the many weak drone army method of rigging, or has the ability to resist a lot of biofeedback when all the drones get blowed up real good with him rigging.  My latest SR char is a rigger and I consider my 4E character unconvertible to 5e as it stands.  I could do it, but it wouldn't be the same char in personality, equipment, etc.  I've progressed through the stages anger, sadness, acceptance.

So that means that you are on the 'Waiting for Rigger book to come out' stage?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <07-31-13/1409:51>
Availability rules:

Is it really intended, that you have to seriously invest into bonus-dice for your fixer, when trying to get new gear?
The example fixer has a Dicepool of 14 for Negotiation, which means, that he can't even reliably get a 6R item, not even speaking of 12R, what you can start with.

Does every character now need a fixer that is an elven social adept with maximized skill, improved ability (negotiation) to even have the chance for some of those nice 18R+ stuff?

To explain: Availability tests are success tests with the availability as threshold and not extended, like in 4E.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <07-31-13/1414:38>
Availability rules:

Is it really intended, that you have to seriously invest into bonus-dice for your fixer, when trying to get new gear?
The example fixer has a Dicepool of 14 for Negotiation, which means, that he can't even reliably get a 6R item, not even speaking of 12R, what you can start with.

Does every character now need a fixer that is an elven social adept with maximized skill, improved ability (negotiation) to even have the chance for some of those nice 18R+ stuff?

To explain: Availability tests are success tests with the availability as threshold and not extended, like in 4E.

As an opposed roll availability tests have no threshold. 14 dice will reliably beat 6 dice in an opposed test.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Palladion on <07-31-13/1426:02>
Availability rules:

Is it really intended, that you have to seriously invest into bonus-dice for your fixer, when trying to get new gear?
The example fixer has a Dicepool of 14 for Negotiation, which means, that he can't even reliably get a 6R item, not even speaking of 12R, what you can start with.

Does every character now need a fixer that is an elven social adept with maximized skill, improved ability (negotiation) to even have the chance for some of those nice 18R+ stuff?

To explain: Availability tests are success tests with the availability as threshold and not extended, like in 4E.

Contacts use Connection as bonus dice for Swag tests, "...they're better at it than you are..." (SR5 388).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <07-31-13/1431:54>
Edited for dumbness ...

So I even wrote "opposed test" without realizing the whole thing ...
Ok, that makes my social adept capable of organizing stuff for the group again, without spending PP on negotiation.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <07-31-13/1433:12>
To explain: Availability tests are success tests with the availability as threshold and not extended, like in 4E.

As an opposed roll availability tests have no threshold. 14 dice will reliably beat 6 dice in an opposed test.

I am noticing that alot of people, myself included initially, are making this error, Crunch.

To explain to everyone, and hope this really does get put in the FAQ to clear up this glaring miconception by people:
Step 1) The Fixer/character rolls the dice for their test(Charisma+Negotiation[+Fixer's Connection level if a Fixer])
Step 2) The GM Rolls a number of dice equal to the items availability.
Step 3) Compare the number of hits. If Step 1 has more hits then Step 2, you get the item.

That is what an Opposed Test means.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <07-31-13/1434:56>
So we have a new contradiction.

Hardly new, and it may not be a contradiction. As written Connection will act as a bonust to both limit and die pool. 

The part you seem to be missing is that AVAILABILITY NO LONGER ACTS AS A THRESHOLD. It's an opposed pool versus pool roll.

Slipped by a calmer explanation.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Palladion on <07-31-13/1444:03>
Hardly new, and it may not be a contradiction. As written Connection will act as a bonust to both limit and die pool. 

The part you seem to be missing is that AVAILABILITY NO LONGER ACTS AS A THRESHOLD. It's an opposed pool versus pool roll.

Slipped by a calmer explanation.

As Crunch said: Opposed Test Negotiation + Charisma (+ Connection) [Social (+ Connection)] vs. Availability (as a dice pool roll).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <07-31-13/1641:20>
In the Called shot section (p. 195) the description of Shake Up gives two examples where the target is not hit: "These shots
represent the intentional shot past the ear or skipping rounds off the ground"
and then the rule wise description of the effect clearly states that the normal damages apply...
Is it a mistake or only poorly choosen examples?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ImaginalDisc on <08-01-13/0157:38>
OK, this has to have bee asked already, but I don't see clear errata.

What the hell is up with Trolls. Dwarfs, and the high cost of living?

Page 94 says:

Quote
When a character factors in racial modifiers for gear
costs (trolls have a 50 percent gear and Lifestyle cost
increase, dwarfs have a 10 percent increase in gear
costs)

The chart on page 66 says:

Quote
Dwarf Racial: +2 dice for pathogen and toxin resistance, +20% increased Lifestyle cost

And:

Quote
Troll Racial: Thermographic Vision, +1 Reach, +1 dermal armor, +100% increased Lifestyle costs

Aside from having obviously forgotten about dwarf themosence, what's the final word of God on lifestyle/gear cost increases by metatype? Gear cost increases add up very quickly in regards to bioware and cyberware.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-01-13/0639:15>
Thermographic Visions should be added to Page 66, for the rest page 66 is the only correct source. All others are remnants from different versions that writers have confirmed as obsolete.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-01-13/0746:46>
+ Connection dice is likely an error, submitted to the Errata topic and asked for the Missions FAQ.

-------------

The various sources for extra Initiative dice state they cannot be combined with other technological or magical increases to Initiative. Only Wired Reflexes, Synaptic Boosters and Reaction Enhancers state they are incompatible with augmentations boosting Reaction.

Q: Does this mean that the Increased Reflexes Spell and Improved Reflexes Adept Power work fine together with the Increase Reaction Spell and Improved Reaction Adept Power?
Q: If so, does the extra Reaction from these other sources still provide an extra Initiative, meaning that you simply do not get extra bonus dice but can still get higher Initiative from compatible stat-increasing sources?
Q: Is it intended that Synaptic Boosters do not combine with Suprathyroid Gland*, capping Bioware Reaction boosts to +3 rather than +4? Or are they simply meant not to stack with magical/drug/cyberware increases?
Q: Do drugs count as a Technological increase to Initiative, meaning their bonus Initiative dice do not stack with magical Initiative dice sources?

*: At 140k and 0.7 essence, while letting you get Muscle Toner and Augmentation at 1 level less, the Suprathyroid Gland effectively costs 77k, 0.3 essence and +25% Lifestyle costs for 1 Body and 1 Reaction.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-01-13/0806:14>
Q: Does this mean that the Increased Reflexes Spell and Improved Reflexes Adept Power work fine together with the Increase Reaction Spell and Improved Reaction Adept Power?
I don't see why they shouldn't.
(but you can't use it to exceed the +4 augmentation limit for attributes)

On the same note;
Adrenaline Boost give initiative.
Wired Reflexes and Improved Reflexes both state they can't be combined with other technological or magical increases to initiative. The description for the spell Increase Reflexes does not explicit say this.

Q: Does this mean a Mystic Adept can combine both Adrenaline Boost Adept Power and Increase Reflexes spell?
(as long as you don't exceed a total of 5d6 as this is the limit for initiative dice)


Q: Do drugs count as a Technological increase to Initiative, meaning their bonus Initiative dice do not stack with magical Initiative dice sources?
Even if "Drugs" would count as Technological" (i doubt that, unless maybe it was some sort of nanobot drug), it would still stack(*) with the Increase the Reflexes spell - as the Increase Reflexes spell seem to stack with drugs, technological and even magic (as long as the magic is not another application of the Increase Reflexes spell).

(*)as long as you don't exceed a total of 5d6 as this is the limit for initiative dice.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ImaginalDisc on <08-01-13/2250:18>
Thermographic Visions should be added to Page 66, for the rest page 66 is the only correct source. All others are remnants from different versions that writers have confirmed as obsolete.

Just to be clear, that means neither dwarfs nor trolls pay extra for gear?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-02-13/0558:55>
Correct. All they pay is additional Lifestyle costs.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-02-13/0808:02>
Q: If you cast a Force X spell and break the limit with Edge or Reagents, scoring Y hits, can a Force X sustaining Focus maintain it or should it be Force Y? If the second, can you drop some hits in case you rolled too many? e.g. you roll 8 hits and want to use a Force 6 Sustaining Focus, can you drop 2 hits, still suffer Physical Drain if your Magic is less than 8, but keep it in the Focus?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <08-02-13/1744:50>
Vehicle crashes rules (p. 201) states that in case of crash, the passengers must resist damages equal to the vehicle Body.
Does it mean that if a GMC Banshee (body 20) crashes against a Jackrabbit (body 8), the passengers of the Banshee will face 20P damages wheras the passengers of the Ford will only face 8P damage?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <08-02-13/1823:34>
Does the Multiple Attacks free action allow you to attack one target twice in a single action phase, or is it always applied as attacking multiple targets at the same time?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-02-13/2017:12>
Q: How much does it cost to repair?

Q: Can you use Alchemy to put spells (activating on touch) on ammunition, e.g. grenades, bullets and throwing knives?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MagusRogue on <08-02-13/2055:10>
Posted this one over on the Shadowrun boards as potential errata, but was suggested to add to FAQ instead, so posting here (even though I think it's way off and wrong).

pg. 251, Threading, second paragraph, last line, reads "You can choose a Level up to three times your Resonance rating." I'm thinking this needs to be two times your Resonance rating." for one, going up to 3 times is insta-glib on yourself. Also, it flies in the face of other set traditions in the magic and stuff. Magic spells can only have a Level up to Magic x 2, Summoning Spirits is Magic x 2. Other limits (when multiplied) are x 2. Heck, even later on on page 254, Compiling a Sprite has a level limit of Resonance x 2. So, I'm thinking a Threading Level max of Resonance x 3 is both error and overkill, to be honest.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ImaginalDisc on <08-02-13/2359:18>
Correct. All they pay is additional Lifestyle costs.
[/quote

Thanks. :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-03-13/0006:07>
Q: If you cast a Force X spell and break the limit with Edge or Reagents, scoring Y hits, can a Force X sustaining Focus maintain it or should it be Force Y? If the second, can you drop some hits in case you rolled too many? e.g. you roll 8 hits and want to use a Force 6 Sustaining Focus, can you drop 2 hits, still suffer Physical Drain if your Magic is less than 8, but keep it in the Focus?

Force X.

Vehicle crashes rules (p. 201) states that in case of crash, the passengers must resist damages equal to the vehicle Body.
Does it mean that if a GMC Banshee (body 20) crashes against a Jackrabbit (body 8), the passengers of the Banshee will face 20P damages wheras the passengers of the Ford will only face 8P damage?

I'll check on this and either post the answer here or try to get it into the official FAQ.

Does the Multiple Attacks free action allow you to attack one target twice in a single action phase, or is it always applied as attacking multiple targets at the same time?

Multiple targets at the same time, not one target twice.

Q: How much does it cost to repair?

That's a good question that isn't covered by the core rules. Check with your GM. If you'd like a suggestion, my personal advice would be that the cost would be the number of boxes of damage you're fixing divided by the total number of boxes on the Condition Monitor, then multiplied by the price of the thing you're fixing.

Quote
Q: Can you use Alchemy to put spells (activating on touch) on ammunition, e.g. grenades, bullets and throwing knives?

Yes, but there's an errata in the pipe that specifies that damaging a lynchpin also destroys the preparation. Firing a bullet out of a gun would mess up your preparation, but the knives might work.

Posted this one over on the Shadowrun boards as potential errata, but was suggested to add to FAQ instead, so posting here (even though I think it's way off and wrong).

pg. 251, Threading, second paragraph, last line, reads "You can choose a Level up to three times your Resonance rating." I'm thinking this needs to be two times your Resonance rating." for one, going up to 3 times is insta-glib on yourself. Also, it flies in the face of other set traditions in the magic and stuff. Magic spells can only have a Level up to Magic x 2, Summoning Spirits is Magic x 2. Other limits (when multiplied) are x 2. Heck, even later on on page 254, Compiling a Sprite has a level limit of Resonance x 2. So, I'm thinking a Threading Level max of Resonance x 3 is both error and overkill, to be honest.

Threading may be similar to spellcasting, but it's not the same thing. Between Patrick and I, we'll make sure this gets brought up in the internal errata discussion.



Thanks everyone! Keep on asking questions as you think of them!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MacAnu on <08-03-13/0011:08>
If a technomancer performs a Resonance action, do normal people in the Matrix who can see the technomancer's persona know that he did something (like twitchy fingers and incantations for mages)?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: KarmaInferno on <08-03-13/0017:03>
The gear chart for missiles on pg435 indicates they act as Rockets except with higher Availability and additional cost for the Sensor. However, nowhere in the rocket/missile section of the Combat chapter (pg181) does it indicate how to use that Sensor, or how missiles differ from rockets at all.

There's some stuff on Sensor Targeting on page 184, but it seems to be for vehicles. Are you also supposed to roll an Sensor Targeting test when firing man-portable missiles, using those vehicle rules?



-k
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MagusRogue on <08-03-13/0026:05>
Posted this one over on the Shadowrun boards as potential errata, but was suggested to add to FAQ instead, so posting here (even though I think it's way off and wrong).

pg. 251, Threading, second paragraph, last line, reads "You can choose a Level up to three times your Resonance rating." I'm thinking this needs to be two times your Resonance rating." for one, going up to 3 times is insta-glib on yourself. Also, it flies in the face of other set traditions in the magic and stuff. Magic spells can only have a Level up to Magic x 2, Summoning Spirits is Magic x 2. Other limits (when multiplied) are x 2. Heck, even later on on page 254, Compiling a Sprite has a level limit of Resonance x 2. So, I'm thinking a Threading Level max of Resonance x 3 is both error and overkill, to be honest.

Threading may be similar to spellcasting, but it's not the same thing. Between Patrick and I, we'll make sure this gets brought up in the internal errata discussion.

Thanks Aaron!!! Yeah I understand its not the same thing, but the Limits should still remain the same. Besides, this potentially breaks the game, as I could cast a Level 18 Data Spike while running a Biofeedback Echo and kill... well, most anyone, and all it takes is one Submersion. Even without the Echo, that's an insane limit, one that's definately and EASILY obtainable by starting pcs, and far more than other limits by far. Yeah sure then I get to be rolling with 18P damage from Fading.... and that's another thing as well. If the Level limit is Resonance x 3, but the Physical marker is Resonance (like Magic), then thats going to have serious self-fragging capabilities.... Just wanted you guys to seriously think this one over, as Resonance x 3 is incredibly excessive.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Novocrane on <08-03-13/0300:57>
How do Sensor Arrays and the Sensor Function slots within them work? Should the number of slots equal the rating of the array?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-03-13/0311:03>
Does the Multiple Attacks free action allow you to attack one target twice in a single action phase, or is it always applied as attacking multiple targets at the same time?

Multiple targets at the same time, not one target twice.

If it always applies as attacking multiple targets, then how do you explain throwing weapons...?

Quote
Throw Weapon p.166
A character may throw a ready throwing weapon (see Ready Weapon, p. 165) by taking a Simple Action. The character may not take any other attack actions in the same Action Phase. Multiple readied throwing weapons can be thrown at a target within Short or Medium range by adding a Multiple Attacks Free Action (see Multiple Attacks, p. 196).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-03-13/0343:46>
The Wireless Bonus rule state that all devices need to be wireless ON, meshed into your wireless personal area network and have access to the Matrix as a whole.

Q: Can there be a case when you need access to DNI to take advantage of a wireless bonus?
Q: Can there be a case when you need access to AR to take advantage of a wireless bonus?

http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11881.msg221529#msg221529
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-03-13/0406:34>
In this thread http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11992.0 we more or less came to the conclusion that the only fire mode that let you attack multiple enemies with a single firearm are SA-Burst, Long-BF and FA in Suppressive Fire.

Q: Can you confirm that to hit multiple targets with FA-mode you need to use Suppressive Fire?
(that you can not use Simple FA or Complex FA to attack multiple targets - unless you dual wield).

Q: Can you confirm that to hit multiple targets with BF-mode you need to use Long-BF
(that you can not use BF [that spit out 3 bullets in 0.1 - 0.2 seconds] to attack multiple targets - unless you dual wield).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-03-13/0417:04>
In the Dual Wield thread  http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11965.0 we still have a few questions left unanswered

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-03-13/0850:31>
Does the Multiple Attacks free action allow you to attack one target twice in a single action phase, or is it always applied as attacking multiple targets at the same time?

Multiple targets at the same time, not one target twice.

If it always applies as attacking multiple targets, then how do you explain throwing weapons...?


My guess is that it's a special rule that applies to throwing weapons, since the rule you quoted is in the section on throwing weapons and not in the general rule for multiple attacks. I'll check with Da Boss to make sure, though.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-03-13/0853:01>
Q: How much does it cost to repair?
That's a good question that isn't covered by the core rules. Check with your GM. If you'd like a suggestion, my personal advice would be that the cost would be the number of boxes of damage you're fixing divided by the total number of boxes on the Condition Monitor, then multiplied by the price of the thing you're fixing.
That's a slightly harsh change (even if not official) compared to 4th edition: in SR4A+Arsenal, where vehicles had (8 + Body/2) boxes (so that's 16 for a Bulldog, 10 for a Large drone), repairing cost 1% of the base price per box - compared to that, this is basically x4 to x5 for the heaviest vehicles, x10 or more for the drones. While I do admit it seemed a bit strange that things with less Body were less expensive to repair (compared to their base price) when 100% wrecked , paying about 26 days of a Low Lifestyle to fix a single point of damage to your Bulldog (instead of about 5), or about 40 days to fix a single point of damage to your Steel Lynx (instead of about 4), seems a bit too harsh.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-03-13/0901:10>
If a technomancer performs a Resonance action, do normal people in the Matrix who can see the technomancer's persona know that he did something (like twitchy fingers and incantations for mages)?

Good question. The rules don't at all noticing technomancy. I imagine that the Matrix doesn't know how to render technomancy, but whether that makes it more subtle or more obvious is a question for your GM. We probably won't know for certain until the Matrix source book is released.

The gear chart for missiles on pg435 indicates they act as Rockets except with higher Availability and additional cost for the Sensor. However, nowhere in the rocket/missile section of the Combat chapter (pg181) does it indicate how to use that Sensor, or how missiles differ from rockets at all.

There's some stuff on Sensor Targeting on page 184, but it seems to be for vehicles. Are you also supposed to roll an Sensor Targeting test when firing man-portable missiles, using those vehicle rules?

You can use Sensor targeting when firing a missile.


Threading may be similar to spellcasting, but it's not the same thing. Between Patrick and I, we'll make sure this gets brought up in the internal errata discussion.

Thanks Aaron!!! Yeah I understand its not the same thing, but the Limits should still remain the same. Besides, this potentially breaks the game, as I could cast a Level 18 Data Spike while running a Biofeedback Echo and kill... well, most anyone, and all it takes is one Submersion. Even without the Echo, that's an insane limit, one that's definately and EASILY obtainable by starting pcs, and far more than other limits by far. Yeah sure then I get to be rolling with 18P damage from Fading.... and that's another thing as well. If the Level limit is Resonance x 3, but the Physical marker is Resonance (like Magic), then thats going to have serious self-fragging capabilities.... Just wanted you guys to seriously think this one over, as Resonance x 3 is incredibly excessive.

Forgive me for pointing this out, but technomacners can't "cast" Data Spike. Data Spike is a Matrix Action. I think you're thinking of Resonance Spike, and Level doesn't factor into the effect of that complex form except as a limit. Also, the Biofeedback Echo acts as a program, and the rules don't allow for programs to affect complex forms. Until there's a complex form for biofeedback damage, you don't have to worry.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-03-13/0916:43>
How do Sensor Arrays and the Sensor Function slots within them work? Should the number of slots equal the rating of the array?

The sensor array housing can hold up to eight sensors, each of which have the rating of the sensor array (p. 445).

The Wireless Bonus rule state that all devices need to be wireless ON, meshed into your wireless personal area network and have access to the Matrix as a whole.

Q: Can there be a case when you need access to DNI to take advantage of a wireless bonus?
Q: Can there be a case when you need access to AR to take advantage of a wireless bonus?

Devices don't need to be meshed into your personal area network to have their wireless bonuses. They just need to be "meshed," a Sixth World slang term meaning "connected to the Matrix" (p. 216). So the answers to your questions are no and no, respectively.

[spoiler]
Sidenote: I've been finding that, for the most part among those who have posted about the Matrix rules, the better one understood the SR4 Matrix rules, the harder a time one has understanding the SR5 Matrix rules. Since this is probably due to the number of concepts that were not carried over from one edition to the next, I think we did a disservice to some players. If I could travel back in time, I'd add a sidebar that said something like "WARNING: forget everything you know about the SR4 Matrix rules. It won't help."
[/spoiler]

In this thread http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11992.0 we more or less came to the conclusion that the only fire mode that let you attack multiple enemies with a single firearm are SA-Burst, Long-BF and FA in Suppressive Fire.

Q: Can you confirm that to hit multiple targets with FA-mode you need to use Suppressive Fire?
(that you can not use Simple FA or Complex FA to attack multiple targets - unless you dual wield).

Q: Can you confirm that to hit multiple targets with BF-mode you need to use Long-BF
(that you can not use BF [that spit out 3 bullets in 0.1 - 0.2 seconds] to attack multiple targets - unless you dual wield).

I'm not sure that conclusion is supported by the rules. The descriptions of fire modes on p. 179 indicate that Semi-Auto Burst, Burst Fire, Long Burst, and Full Auto modes all can use the multiple attacks option. I'll check the errata to see if multiple attacks with a firearm presupposes a Complex Action.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-03-13/0921:03>
So knowledge of the SR4 Matrix is a downside for understanding the SR5 Matrix? I haven't checked the Matrix section yet but it's good to know it will be really easy for me to understand. :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MagusRogue on <08-03-13/1211:44>
Thanks Aaron!!! Yeah I understand its not the same thing, but the Limits should still remain the same. Besides, this potentially breaks the game, as I could cast a Level 18 Data Spike while running a Biofeedback Echo and kill... well, most anyone, and all it takes is one Submersion. Even without the Echo, that's an insane limit, one that's definately and EASILY obtainable by starting pcs, and far more than other limits by far. Yeah sure then I get to be rolling with 18P damage from Fading.... and that's another thing as well. If the Level limit is Resonance x 3, but the Physical marker is Resonance (like Magic), then thats going to have serious self-fragging capabilities.... Just wanted you guys to seriously think this one over, as Resonance x 3 is incredibly excessive.

Forgive me for pointing this out, but technomacners can't "cast" Data Spike. Data Spike is a Matrix Action. I think you're thinking of Resonance Spike, and Level doesn't factor into the effect of that complex form except as a limit. Also, the Biofeedback Echo acts as a program, and the rules don't allow for programs to affect complex forms. Until there's a complex form for biofeedback damage, you don't have to worry.

Yeah I was thinking Resonance Spike, my bad. Still a 18 damage limit on Resonance Spike is pretty dang nasty... And I wasn't aware that the Resonance [Program] Echo didn't allow the programs to be used with Complex Forms.... Well that's not so bad, but I still would like some thought on it. Some of the Complex Forms could easily be abused with Resoance x 3, and there's also the severe Fading issues. Thanks for the consideration!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-03-13/1813:36>
My guess is that it's a special rule that applies to throwing weapons, since the rule you quoted is in the section on throwing weapons and not in the general rule for multiple attacks. I'll check with Da Boss to make sure, though.

What I really wanted to know is what happens when you dual wield two firearms ;)

If a [another] game let you dual wield, the "norm" use to be that you can fire both weapons at the same target.
Some games also let you hit two individual targets, once with each weapon - but that is normally an edge case.

Since you are allowed to hit one target multiple times with throwing weapons it felt natural that you were allowed to hit one target twice if you dual wield two firearms in addition to hitting two individual targets, once with each weapon.




Devices don't need to be meshed into ...
I was thinking about Change Linked Device Mode on p.163 (and Eject Smartgun Clip on p.164) that both quite specific mention you need DNI to take advantage of various action economy wireless bonuses including, but not limited to smartgun firemode.

If you don't need DNI - how DO you take advantage of the various action economy wireless bonuses that let you do things with a free action (probably the Change Linked Device Mode Free Action) instead of the [manual or AR] simple action Change Device Mode.... Thought only technomancers could influence the matrix directly with their mind without using some sort of DNI :)

...that some wireless bonus would require DNI - in addition to have access to the matrix
 



I'm not sure that conclusion is supported by the rules. The descriptions of fire modes on p. 179 indicate that Semi-Auto Burst, Burst Fire, Long Burst, and Full Auto modes all can use the multiple attacks option. I'll check the errata to see if multiple attacks with a firearm presupposes a Complex Action.
Yes, we had (have) a long discussion about this earlier today in the linked thread.
Seem as if there are different rules on different pages that say different things and/or that there are rules missing.

P.179 State that you can use BF weapons to fire at multiple targets with the same burst, Long Burst weapons to fire at multiple targets with the same burst. Full auto weapons to fire at multiple targets with the same burst.
P.179 Also state that you can use suppressive fire for a combination of controlled and fully automatic bursts focused over a narrow area and directed at anything that moves. Suppressive fire is explained in detail, but it does not actually state which weapons that can use it (only that it cost 20 bullets over the cause of a full combat turn).
P.165/167 State that you can dual wield SS, SA, BF, Long BF, simple FA and complex FA to do multiple attacks.
P.165/167 State that you can use a single firearm for a SA burst or a Long Burst to attack multiple targets within Short or Medium range (but it does not state that you can use a single firearm in BF, simple FA or complex FA to fire at multiple targets)
P.164 State that you can do multiple attacks when combined with Fire Weapon Action, Throw Weapon Action, Melee Attack Action, Reckless Spellcasting, or Cast Spell Action.
P.196 State that you can take Multiple Attacks with a single melee weapon and when dual wielding firearms or melee (but it does not state that you can use a single firearm or throwing weapons to take the multiple attacks free action).
P.196 Also state you are limited to weapon skill / 2 targets.

Q If p.179 is correct - where are the rules at p.165/167 describing number of targets, stray shots between targets, how far away targets can stand, what their defense modifier will be, does it act like a cone spray, if so size of cone, do targets need to stay at close or medium range like the complex action description for SA-Burst and Long Burst on p.167. what happen when you use 3 bullet burst and have automatic skill of 7+ and according to p.196 can attack 4 targets. How do you even split an individual BF on different targets (tap trigger once and it fire 3 bullets in 0.1 to 0.2 seconds...)

Q If p.165/167 is correct (and you can only attack multiple targets with SA burst, Long BF and suppressive fire) why does p.179 state you can attack multiple targets with BF, simple FA and complex FA (or is p.179 talking about attacking with SA Burst, BF, Long BF, simple FA and complex FA while you dual wield...? That would actually make most rules fall in place and make a lot of sense from a real life perspective - but in that case the wording on p.179 is very bad).

Q If p.196 is correct (and you can only take the Multiple Attack Free Action if you have a single melee weapon or dual wield melee or firearms) then why does p.167 state you can use SA Burst and Long Burst to attack multiple targets when you wield only one firearm and p.179 that state you can attack multiple targets with SA Burst, BF, Long BF, simple FA and complex FA.

Q Do you need a weapon with FA mode to use Suppressive fire. p.179 only mention you need [up to] 20 bullets...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Raiden on <08-03-13/2029:37>
Do you get. +2 when making an attack with shock gloves?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Dracain on <08-03-13/2322:23>
A spell "attached" to a sustaining focus becomes "unattached" and disappears when the focus is turned off, which means every time someone because unconscious, the spell disappears and needs to be recast upon waking.  So a Mage who wants their aug spells up at all times will need to recast every morning. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sichr on <08-04-13/0352:30>
I got a question about character conversion:
When transfering points for skills like Shadowing or Dodge, what to do with specialization? Skill transfers to karma in Rating x 2 ratio, but specializations have nothing like that mentioned. Any clue?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-04-13/0545:36>
As Dracain pointed out elsewhere, Page 318 mentions Foci deactivate on unconsciousness.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-04-13/0644:35>
Do you get. +2 when making an attack with shock gloves?
You do as long as the intention of the attack is simply to make contact.
The action is described under Touch-Only Attack p.187

Also when just making contact is enough the attacker, not the defender, win on a tie.
Touch-Only Attack p.187 and Grazing Hit p.173
(Shock gloves were given as a specific example)



You will not get +2 if you got go all out with a punch with the intention of dealing full unarmed damage.

The real question then is rather what happens damage wise.
Will you deal only unarmed damage. Only shock damage. Will they stack.
I don't have a rule supported answer for that :(
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Novocrane on <08-04-13/0844:27>
How do Sensor Arrays and the Sensor Function slots within them work? Should the number of slots equal the rating of the array?

The sensor array housing can hold up to eight sensors, each of which have the rating of the sensor array (p. 445).
Perhaps I should have asked, "What reason is there to take less than the maximum of eight sensor functions in a sensor array?"
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <08-04-13/1610:26>
First Aid: why is the fact that a character wears a full-body armor handled by dividing by 2 the net effect of first aid?
Quote from: SR5 p. 205/206
divide the net effect in half (rounded up) if the victim being treated is wearing any kind of full-body armor in order to represent the difficulty of treating the patient through armor
Why such an exception to the usual rules? it would have been simpler to add 1 row to the Healing modifiers table with a dice pool penalty rather than a very specific and unusual rule.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: KarmaInferno on <08-04-13/1839:47>
Does firing a SA grenade launcher in Semi Auto Burst mode impose only the standard SAB -2 defense penalty, or does the Multiple Simultaneous Blasts explosives rule also apply, which would add half the DV of each subsequent grenade to the first?



-k
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SoulGambit on <08-04-13/2203:11>
How does a Technomancer grabbing Resonance [Virtual Machine] via Submersion work, if at all? Can they suddenly buy and load programs into those slots? Do they spontaneously grow programs to fill the slots, like they do for other purchases of Resonance [Program]?

How does a Technomancer grabbing Resonance [Configurator] via Submersion work, if at all? Would this allow a Technomancer the limited ability to reconfigure their living persona like a deck?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-05-13/0323:04>
I got a question that requires some introductionary talk first, to make absolutely clear where this is coming from.

There's a significant difference between Compiling/Registering Sprites and Summoning/Binding Spirits. The rules on Sprites make clear you can only have one compiled, when registering the sprite no longer counts for your limit of 1 compiled at a time and it will stay with you until it's out of tasks, though you can make it go standby for a task. In other words, you can be accompanied at any time by (likely limited as written in chargen) registered Sprites and 1 unregistered Sprite.

On the other hand, there's Spirits. You can only have 1 spirit summoned at a time, a summoned unbound spirit will disappear on dusk, dawn or when you run out of services. With Binding, you compel it to long-term services. This states you can have up to Charisma spirits, and you can call/dismiss them with a Simple Action. However, nowhere does it state you can have more than 1 spirit, bound or unbound, active at the same time. In fact, the way things are phrased with things such as the Spirit-Summoner Link and Spirit Range, they do not acknowledge in any way having more than one active at a time.

Q: Can you have only 1 spirit, no matter whether bound or unbound, active at any time?

In all fairness, this seems rather balanced, especially since you can switch spirit in 2 Simple Actions and they're rather powerful. And the significant phrasing differences between Registering Sprites and Binding Spirits appears to heavily imply this conclusion.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-05-13/0358:37>
Crack File Complex Action

p.238 state that this is a Hacking + Logic [Attack] v. Protection Rating x 2
Table on  p.244 state that this can be both an Attack Action and a Sleaze Action.


Q: Can you do a Crack File action using a Sleaze Action instead of an Attack Action



If so, comparing Brute Force and Hacking on the Fly indicate that a Sleaze version of the Crack File action should be a Hacking + Logic [Sleaze] v. Protection Rating x 2




Since a successful [Attack] will always alert the owner that the file is under attack I personally feel there should also be a way to Sleaze your way through the protection as well... Ghost in the machine and all that ;)

Also, BK example on p.224 seem to indicate that he first failed a Sleaze Action when trying to crack the file protection (something went wrong and the host automatically got a Mark on his Persona, p.231 and p.236). On p.225 he again tries to break the protection but this time it seem as if he is using an Attack Action (that fails and he is hit by Matrix Damage - just like you would when failing an attack action, p.231). The third attempt seems to be another attack action; This time he is successful - but successful attack actions always make the target aware (p.236) and the host start searching for him again.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carz on <08-05-13/1302:32>
Pulse Storm CF (pg 252) is listed as Duration: I (instant).
I'm wondering it is should be a Sustained CF, or if it should have listed an amount of time it lasts, like Transcendent Grid does.

Otherwise, an instant duration CF that hits a target with noise only for that instant isn't very useful.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lusis on <08-05-13/2002:49>
Character Generation
Choose Your Metatype
  • An entry of Human (1), Dwarf (3), and Elf (5) all mean the same thing; you have that metatype, and the number in parentheses is how many points you have to spend on Special Attributes. Special Attributes are Edge, Resonance, and Magic. (Page 65, right column, second paragraph)

So is it them possible to have a Magic above 6 (or Essence) at Chargen?[/list]
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MaxKojote on <08-05-13/2008:21>
Exceptional Attribute now can apply to Resonance and Magic.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: BlackJaw on <08-06-13/1416:36>
How separate do devices have to be to get their own icons in the matrix and/or count as a single slaved device?

Does a Gun with attached external Smartgun count as a single icon/device or is it a seperate icon for for the gun and the smartgun? 

Do cyber-eyes count as a single device with all the features of augmentations installed into their capacity, or does the smartlink, vision enhancement, and flarecomp each have it's own icon separate from the cyber-eyes themselves?  For that mater, if I install those augmentations directly into my actual real flesh and blood eyes, do they each get their own icon or do my eyes as a whole have an icon now?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-06-13/2318:19>
Quote from: Xenon link=topic=11514.msg222545#msg222545
Q: Can you do a Crack File action using a Sleaze Action instead of an Attack Action

No.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <08-06-13/2330:19>
p.456 Customization of cyberlimb state that:
  • "You can have your cyberlimb tailored and customized to your frame and musculature"
  • You can not customize your cyberlimb "beyond your natural maximum for that attribute"
Should this be read as;

A) You can improve your cyberlimb to [but not beyond] your value for that attribute
- and not beyond your natural maximum for that attribute
(in case your value for that attribute is augmented beyond natural maximum with for example exceptional attribute)

or

B) You can improve your cyberlimb to [but not beyond] your natural maximum for that attribute
(the first sentence and your value for that attribute having no impact at all on how much you can customize the cyberlimb).



Points for A)
"You can have your cyberlimb tailored and customized to your frame and musculature" is not the same as "You can have your cyberlimb tailored and customized beyond your frame and musculature" nor is it the same as "You can have your cyberlimb tailored and customized to your maximum natural frame and musculature".


Points for B)
Street Samurai Archetype have a strength 11 cyberlimb but he only got 5 strength (implying custom cyberlimb beyond 5, all the way up to maximum natural of 8, followed by +3 enhancement).

This is one I'm really looking for an answer for so i know when i run a one off in a week and a half
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Orci on <08-07-13/0242:45>
Quote from: Xenon link=topic=11514.msg222545#msg222545
Q: Can you do a Crack File action using a Sleaze Action instead of an Attack Action

No.
One can just hope this answer is wrong ... Otherwise there is now way to do any kind of file access without being detected.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <08-07-13/1009:14>
This is probably more along the lines of errata, but the skill "Infiltration" shows up a number of times in the book (notably pp. 362-63), but there is no longer a skill with this name.  Presumably all of these references should be Sneaking.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: FastJack on <08-07-13/1029:52>
This is probably more along the lines of errata, but the skill "Infiltration" shows up a number of times in the book (notably pp. 362-63), but there is no longer a skill with this name.  Presumably all of these references should be Sneaking.
That would be an errata item. I copied it over there.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <08-07-13/1108:41>
Quote from: Xenon link=topic=11514.msg222545#msg222545
Q: Can you do a Crack File action using a Sleaze Action instead of an Attack Action

No.
One can just hope this answer is wrong ... Otherwise there is now way to do any kind of file access without being detected.

The host will just know that someone is somewhere, but nothing beyond that.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Orci on <08-07-13/1627:34>
Quote
If you succeed with an Attack action, your target becomes aware that it is under attack by another icon, but it doesn’t automatically spot you.

So your target is the file, how does it and its owner not know what file you changed?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Psikerlord on <08-07-13/2305:04>
Yeah i would think as soon as you attack something in particular, the host/owner knows exactly what you targeted. the warning would be something along the lines of "secret file xxx is being attacked!". Is my guess. Which is why you ought to be able to sleaze to break file protection. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-08-13/0615:53>
During your turn, can you use Simple Actions to perform Free Actions?

For example, can you use up your 1 Free Action when an enemy mage targets you and you declare Spell Defense, then use your two Simple Actions for Reckless Spellcasting and dropping Prone afterwards? Or drop prone before your turn to avoid Suppressive Fire, then Call A Shot and Fire during your turn?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-08-13/0739:41>
During your turn, can you use Simple Actions to perform Free Actions?

For example, can you use up your 1 Free Action when an enemy mage targets you and you declare Spell Defense, then use your two Simple Actions for Reckless Spellcasting and dropping Prone afterwards? Or drop prone before your turn to avoid Suppressive Fire, then Call A Shot and Fire during your turn?
(not 100% answer to your question but....)
Counterspell can be taken as an interrupt action (p.294)
Drop Prone can be taken as an interrupt action (Hit the Dirt p.168)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-08-13/0742:35>
I am aware, I know you can sacrifice 5 Initiative if you do not have a Free Action available. The question is whether, during and only during your own turn, you can trade in a Simple Action to perform a Free Action during your turn. These are simply two examples where you might want to do that.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-08-13/0911:10>
On the forums there seem to be some confusion about grenades and how aoe work. For once I think the rules are pretty straight forward, but I think it is best to post it here anyway. The actual question is:

Q: Do defenders get to roll against an AoE?


This is how I read the existing rules:
[spoiler]
The chapter Projectiles on p.181 state that "Ranged combat rules also apply to bows and throwing weapons. Some special rules also apply".

A) Ranged combat rules apply
B) There might also be special rules in addition to normal ranged combat rules.


A Ranged Combat rules use the basic combat sequence from p.173
1) Declare
2) Attack
3) Defend
4) Apply Effect

Where  Step 2) is "The attacker rolls Combat Skill + Attribute +/- modifiers [Limit]"

And Step 3) is "The defender roll Reaction + Intuition +/- modifiers..." and "...Compare the results to the hits of the attacker. If the attacker scores more hits than the defender, the attack hits the target. Note the net hits (the number of hits that exceed the defender’s hits) and move on to the second step..." (followed by rules how to calculate modified armor value, modified damage value and final damage).

One specific defending modifier is Targeted by an Area-Effect Attack p.190
Dodging explosions is not as easy as it seems in the movies. Apply a –2 modifier when trying to defend against weapons like spells, grenades, rockets, or missiles with a blast or area effect.


B Under Throwing Weapons there is a subcategory for Grenades.
Grenades on p.181 have a special rule that state: Three hits on the test means no scatter, but it is still possible to hit the target if the scatter roll is low and the thrower got some hits.
- There is a chance you hit the target even if you don't get 3 hits (not net hits)
- The scatter roll need to be low (or target might be outside of blast radius)
- You need to have at least one hit (as you need to exceed the defender’s hits in step 3)


A) Ranged combat rules apply
B) There might also be special rules in addition to normal ranged combat rules.

A + B gives:

1) Declare
2) Attack + Check for Scatter
3) Defend
4) Apply

In the specific example of throwing a grenade step 2) would translate to:
Attacker roll Throwing Weapons + Agility [Physical]
Specific grenade rule state that if you get less than 3 hits (not net hits) there is a risk that the grenade scatter.

And step 3) would translate into
Defender roll reaction + intuition - 2 (for grenade being an aoe effect)
And then you ...Compare the results to the hits of the attacker. If the attacker scores more hits than the defender, the attack hits the target...

My answer to the question would be: Yes, defenders get to roll against an AoE per normal combat rules with a -2 aoe modifier
[/spoiler]
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-08-13/0932:38>
I am aware, I know you can sacrifice 5 Initiative if you do not have a Free Action available. The question is whether, during and only during your own turn, you can trade in a Simple Action to perform a Free Action during your turn. These are simply two examples where you might want to do that.
There are some free actions that have simple action counterparts.

For example, you can change the fire mode on an assault rifle from SA to FA with a free action (in this case the Change Linked Device Mode) by sending a mental command via DNI. There are not rules that let you send this mental command via DNI as a simple action. And there are no rules that explicit say you can't do it either (hence your question i guess). But in this case you can take the simple action Change Gun Mode and manually switch your assault rifle from SA to FA.

Most things you can do with free actions such as Change Linked Device Mode and Eject Smartgun Clip can be done with a simple action, such as Change Gun Mode or Change Device Mode. At least as long as there is a manual "switch" you can interact with instead of the mental switch used in the free action. Other actions such as Drop Object can be done as a Simple action with Pick up/Put down object.


Also, some free actions can be allowed to be taken more than once if GMs allows it. I think the examples they used were Speak Phrase or Gesture while running at the same time.



If you can take (other) multiple free actions as simple actions instead is still a valid question though. Interested in hearing the answer.


My gut feeling answer to the question is No
Why?
Because the:
- Limit of 1 free action act as a tactical limit (so you can't both run and attack multiple targets at the same time)
- Free actions you can take as a simple action have a simple action you can pick.
- Free actions that you might need when you already used your free action have an interrupt action you can use.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-08-13/0955:37>
I'd rather not get into a debate in the topic meant for the official FAQ. However, note that one of my examples involved using a free action before your own action phase, namely dropping prone when someone starts with suppressive and wanting to call a shot after that.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-08-13/1204:48>
On the forums there seem to be some confusion about grenades and how aoe work. For once I think the rules are pretty straight forward, but I think it is best to post it here anyway. The actual question is:

Q: Do defenders get to roll against an AoE?

No for dodging, yes for damage resistance (excluding direct combat spells, of course).

For grenades specifically, if the guy shooting at you is using a motion sensor trigger, then you get to dodge normally because she's trying to hit you. As a side note, the motion sensor on grenades is a full-stop (or mostly-full-stop) kind of detector, so just grazing your target or skipping a grenade off of the ground won't set it off in this triggering mode.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <08-08-13/1209:44>
No for dodging, yes for damage resistance (excluding direct combat spells, of course).



Q.What about Indirect AOE Combat Spells like Blast? The example has some gangers rolling dodge

While i'm at it

Q At Char Gen can you buy a Custom Cyberlimb that has Attributes OVER your current natural Rating, without using Enhancements. (An Elf With AGI 4 buying a Custom Limb with AGI 6)

Q What happens when you roll under 3 hits on an AOE Indirect combat spell but still more hits then the defender (if they can defend). Does this all ways make the damage to resist drop to Force?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-08-13/1454:36>
No for dodging
Did you read the spoiler...? :)

If this is really true(?!) then we need an errata to correct the following:
1) clarification on p.181 that defenders does not get to roll dodge in step 3 of the combat sequence on p.173
2) table on p.477 is wrong
3) combat spell rules on p.283 regarding indirect aoe spells are wrong
4) example on p.283 is wrong
5) table on p.189 is wrong
6) damage and passengers on p.205 need clarification
7) defender modification on p.190 is wrong

It also make grenades really really powerful.

Dealing more damage than a sniper rifle (even before confined space mods) and all you only need is 3 hits (not net hits) on your throw to always land and detonate the grenade within 1m of your target.

Or 3 hits with a semi-automatic burst using an ArmTech MGL-12 for a staggering 24P (before confined space mods) and -4AP and can be used up to 500m. No way of avoiding the blast, even with an interrupt action or full defense and over 20 dice since you don't get to roll them. On average your target will die even with 40+ dice when resisting damage. Best of all.... Anyone can do that right out of chargen. All you need is to invest 6 points in heavy weapons,  get an agility of 3+ and spend 7,000¥ for the weapon, an airbust link, an imaging scope and some grenades. gg.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-08-13/1630:56>
Q.What about Indirect AOE Combat Spells like Blast? The example has some gangers rolling dodge

Also no. Which example are you looking at?

Quote
Q At Char Gen can you buy a Custom Cyberlimb that has Attributes OVER your current natural Rating, without using Enhancements. (An Elf With AGI 4 buying a Custom Limb with AGI 6)

Yes.

Quote
Q What happens when you roll under 3 hits on an AOE Indirect combat spell but still more hits then the defender (if they can defend). Does this all ways make the damage to resist drop to Force?

You miss by a certain distance. 2D6 meters, if I remember. There is no defender roll; it's a Success Test.

Did you read the spoiler...? :)

Yes. The modifier is an error leftover from SR4.

Quote
If this is really true(?!) then we need an errata to correct the following:
1) clarification on p.181 that defenders does not get to roll dodge in step 3 of the combat sequence on p.173
2) table on p.477 is wrong
3) combat spell rules on p.283 regarding indirect aoe spells are wrong
4) example on p.283 is wrong
5) table on p.189 is wrong
6) damage and passengers on p.205 need clarification
7) defender modification on p.190 is wrong

That looks like a familiar set of errata. If you can hold on until after Gen Con, you'll get a more official answer, but until then it's only us lowly freelancers that have any time to offer help.

Quote
It also make grenades really really powerful.

Dealing more damage than a sniper rifle (even before confined space mods) and all you only need is 3 hits (not net hits) on your throw to always land and detonate the grenade within 1m of your target.

Indeed, grenades are dangerous weapons. The modern grenade is advertised with a five-meter kill radius and a casualty radius of fifteen meters. Although you're not factoring in range penalties, which come up a lot for all but the strongest throwers.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-08-13/1658:18>
Also no. Which example are you looking at?
Probably p.283

That looks like a familiar set of errata. If you can hold on until after Gen Con, you'll get a more official answer, but until then it's only us lowly freelancers that have any time to offer help.
Fair enough. I might have some apology to do in that other thread after Gen Con then :D
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <08-08-13/1815:25>
Also no. Which example are you looking at?
Probably p.283


Got it in one Xenon, yeah Aaron it was this one. Also Thank you very much for all the answers, much appreciated!

[spoiler]
Quote
One of the gangers has cornered Rikki the Rat
Shaman, so Rikki has no choice but to throw down
some mojo on him. Since there’s only one, he casts
Mana Bolt at Force 4. With Magic 5 and Spellcasting
4, Rikki gets 4 hits while the ganger with his Willpower
3 manages to get 1 hit. This means that the ganger
takes 3 points of Stun damage (equal to Rikki’s net hits
since this is a Direct Combat spell). The ganger gets
no resistance and no dodge.
The second ganger has caught up with the first,
and Rikki must step up his game. Rikki switches to
Blast at Force 7. A risky maneuver for, but he wants
to end things quickly so he can curl up and hide. He
rolls a miraculous 5 hits. This is an Indirect Combat
spell, so its damage will be equal to Force 7 + Rikki’s
net hits. Ganger 1 is a little out of it and only gets 2 hits.
The second ganger is quicker with 4 hits. The three
net hits make the total damage hitting the first ganger
10, while the second must attempt to absorb 8 points
of damage. Both are wearing armor jackets (12), but
with such a high Force, the AP of the spell reduces
the jacket’s protection to 5. Both gangers have Body
5, so they each roll 10 dice to resist damage. Ganger
1 rolls 3 hits and takes a total of 7 boxes of Stun damage.
Combined with the Mana Bolt, he is knocked out.
Ganger 2 rolls better with 5 hits and only takes 3 boxes
of stun. Ganger 2 figures it’s not worth taking on Rikki
on his own and runs off to get help. Rikki hurts more
from casting that spell than from being punched by the
gangers, as his nose is bleeding from taking 4 boxes of
Stun damage from the drain.
[/spoiler]
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-09-13/0427:00>
If you are not allowed to defend against AoE;

Q Will indirect AoE spells increase DV with number of hits*?

instead of increasing DV with number of net hits* - as the rule currently state




(*) As long as the magician get more than 3 hits (not net hits).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-09-13/0525:07>
So to be clear:

- You put 3 wireless High explosive grenades in your grenade launcher.
- You subscribe each grenade to a different member of the team.
- The grenade launcher has no range penalty within 50 meters, -1 within 100.
- You fire a Short Burst as Complex Action, firing all 3 grenades.
- You make a Heavy Weapons + Agility (3) test with the other modifiers.
- Defenders do not get to make any defensive action until their own turn.
- No penalties apply from targets Running/Sprinting, Cover or Total Defense because you target a location, not a moving person.
- After 5 meters, the grenades are armed.
- If you succesfully make the test, the grenades land at the right spot.
- Each member uses their Free Action to detonate 'their' grenade simultaneously.
- The AP becomes the best and becomes 1 better per extra explosion.
- The blast adds half the value of all lowest DVs to the highest DV for 1 combined value.
- 3x 16/-2 becomes 16+8+8/-2-1-1 = 32P/-4 damage.
- If a hacker hacks one of the commlinks in advance, he can let one of the 3 explode earlier, after it has travelled 5 meters and gets armed. He needs 1 Mark to perform that Free Action.
- A jammer would create a negative dice pool modifier, but there is no die-roll involved in triggering the grenades, so it has no effect.

Are all these steps correct?

Q: Can you change the wireless mode of multiple identical devices in one go with an identical command? E.g. turn off multiple cameras, eject multiple clips, explode multiple wireless grenades?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-09-13/0838:26>
Except that there are a couple-three ways for a hacker to mess things up, and that the wireless link is a wireless bonus and can be blocked with enough noise, Operation Grenade Ballet is a go.

As to the multiple command thing ... um ... maybe? Strictly by the rules, probably not, but it sounds like the kind of thing I'd handwave as a GM.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-09-13/0928:29>
Or just get an airburst link that will have all 3 nades detonating at the same combat initiative score (=multiple simultaneous blasts).

But in this scenario you really want to protect your launcher and your individual grenades with a strong firewall plus high intuition, willpower and logic as there are quite a few ways to tackle this from the Matrix (get a mark on the grenade owner's commlink and use that to spoof a detonate command to the grenade mid air, get two marks on the launcher and control it to fire a grenade while just hanging on the back of the troll, get a mark on individual grenades and then delay an action and use it to command the grenade to explode while in mid-air, brick the entire grenade launcher....)

A decker can also temporary turn his deck into a jammer and you can also buy jammers in the gear section. seem as if the Wireless data jack provide 1 point of noise reduction, but besides that it seem as if the only way to counter a jammer is by using a RCC set for noice reduction rather than sharing and if you have a RCC you can also compensate for noise on the fly taking a complex action electronic warfare test to reduce noise even further.

As long as you can generate more than 2 noise after noise compensation around the grenade (device rating 2) or around the launcher (also device rating 2) then the grenade can not be detonated wireless.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-09-13/1106:48>
The grenade launcher wouldn't need to be wireless, though, either the launcher or the grenades have to be.

So any high-profile target will always be protected with jamming to prevent wireless triggering of explosives of any kind, runners should always carry jammers if they lack a decker, and that takes care of getting grenades tossed at you that explode before you get a chance to move away, unless they're fired after you're out of passes and then you're SoL.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-09-13/1143:43>
(Grenades that use the Built-in timer does not explode at the end of the combat turn. They explode in the next combat turn on the same initiative score as when it was thrown, minus 10 - So you still have time to move away. But built in timed grenades are great to combine with suppressive fire to shape the battlefield and to create no-win situations for your opponents).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jamesfirecat on <08-09-13/2357:42>
Actually, here is the real no win situation for how you use grenades super effectively if wireless is not an option.


Runner A shoots spread grenades on time fuses and they land where he wants them to after holding his action so that he goes after the target at target's iniative score minus one.


Runner B shoots the target with S&S ammo.

S&S shots which deal a box of physical or stun drops five from the targets initiative score.

Target does not get to act again before grenades go off.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MagusRogue on <08-10-13/0120:09>
Q. Why does Uncouth (and possibly other negative qualities) affect Intimidate? Being rude and impulsive should have no affect on how intimidating you are; in fact, it probably should make a better case for you being more intimidating, not less.

Q. I know this isn't a real question but could it be possible to find the rules on Augmented Attribute Maximums easier to find, say perhaps on the Metatype Table? It took me an hour to find it until I got to page 94 and dug in the text. It's mentioned in TON of places, but finding the actual rules was incredibly difficult.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <08-10-13/0124:46>
Q. Why does Uncouth (and possibly other negative qualities) affect Intimidate? Being rude and impulsive should have no affect on how intimidating you are; in fact, it probably should make a better case for you being more intimidating, not less.

Having come across a few people who are completely and totally inept at it, let me just say that intimidation is a far more subtle thing than that.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <08-10-13/0128:38>
Q. Why does Uncouth (and possibly other negative qualities) affect Intimidate? Being rude and impulsive should have no affect on how intimidating you are; in fact, it probably should make a better case for you being more intimidating, not less.

Having come across a few people who are completely and totally inept at it, let me just say that intimidation is a far more subtle thing than that.

It can be, but that would be for someone who isn't normally that imposing to intimidate someone. If the big Uncouth Troll snarls at you and hefts his Troll-sized combat axe, that's pretty darn intimidating and not at all subtle.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MagusRogue on <08-10-13/0129:27>
Like All4BigGuns said. Being rude should not keep you from being able to frighten people off.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-10-13/0132:52>
I've always assumed that intimidate covered both being frightening, and getting the desired result by being frightening.

Getting shot because the guard is afraid of you is not a succesful intimidate check.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <08-10-13/0141:12>
Q. Why does Uncouth (and possibly other negative qualities) affect Intimidate? Being rude and impulsive should have no affect on how intimidating you are; in fact, it probably should make a better case for you being more intimidating, not less.

Having come across a few people who are completely and totally inept at it, let me just say that intimidation is a far more subtle thing than that.

It can be, but that would be for someone who isn't normally that imposing to intimidate someone. If the big Uncouth Troll snarls at you and hefts his Troll-sized combat axe, that's pretty darn intimidating and not at all subtle.

Not intimidating, per se - imposing, sure.  Something you need to be careful how you deal with, sure.  But a non-intimidated person is going to respond to that in any number of ways, which may not be the specific thing the troll wants - they might secretly signal for help, they might shoot you, they might run away instead of handing over their valuables, etc.

Besides, Uncouth isn't just about being rude - it's about being unaware of how to achieve a desired effect upon another person, so your intimidation attempt boils down to "I'm big and I'm an asshole", which is usually (in my subjective and incomplete experience) funny rather than intimidating.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Critias on <08-10-13/0223:34>
Someone with Uncouth isn't just ill-mannered, they "have trouble interacting with others."  Maybe they don't even understand what would be intimidating to someone, maybe they stumble over their words so they look like a baby having a tantrum instead of being scary, maybe they don't pick up on social cues and try to intimidate the weasel of a gang instead of the gang leader, maybe all kinds of stuff.

They can still stand there and be a menacing presence for someone else to make an Intimidation test (the fast-talker who always knows what to say and how to say it just thumbs over his shoulder to a hulking brute looming behind him), they can still offset the Uncouth penalty (and no doubt a low Charisma, and no doubt a not-too-great skill) with modifiers for being big and scary...but...well...if you want to be good at making people do what you want (which is what Intimidation checks are for), don't take the Negative Quality that boils down to "you're terrible at making people do what you want."
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <08-10-13/0225:57>
They can still stand there and be a menacing presence for someone else to make an Intimidation test (the fast-talker who always knows what to say and how to say it just thumbs over his shoulder to a hulking brute looming behind him)

"We have a Hulk", basically.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MacAnu on <08-10-13/0538:55>
See Thog (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0788.html) in OotS (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0388.html) for the "strong but not intimidating" archetype.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Psikerlord on <08-10-13/0601:01>
Actually, here is the real no win situation for how you use grenades super effectively if wireless is not an option.


Runner A shoots spread grenades on time fuses and they land where he wants them to after holding his action so that he goes after the target at targets iniative score minus one.


Runner B shoots the target with S&S ammo.

S&S shots which deal a box of physical or stun drops five from the targets initiative score.

Target does not get to act again before grenades go off.
not technically an option, but could be houseruled. more realistic, but do u really want more realistic grenades...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: shinryu on <08-10-13/0708:48>
jamming is also beaten via using motion-sensor/impact fusing. if i read the rules correctly, if you hit versus a standard defense roll, you do damage (plus hits!), and you only worry about scatter if you miss totally (in which case you might still hit your target). i would argue a direct hit should be treated as other explosions and halve armor, but that's a side point.

to insure hittingness + chunky salsa effect, use with MGL-12 for super happy murder time fun time. nothing quite like an SA burst that does 24P damage, -4 AP and -4 to dodge. nearly as good as a guided missile and much cheaper too. more humane runners may prefer to lay down a trio of flashbangs for 15S AP -6  instead.

actual question: what does the suppression effect affect? does it include defense rolls? there's a really nasty tactic of laying down suppressive and then having other shooters pick off the targets if that's the case.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jamesfirecat on <08-10-13/1350:42>
Actually, here is the real no win situation for how you use grenades super effectively if wireless is not an option.


Runner A shoots spread grenades on time fuses and they land where he wants them to after holding his action so that he goes after the target at targets iniative score minus one.


Runner B shoots the target with S&S ammo.

S&S shots which deal a box of physical or stun drops five from the targets initiative score.

Target does not get to act again before grenades go off.
not technically an option, but could be houseruled. more realistic, but do u really want more realistic grenades...

Why isn't it an option, did I misread/misunderstand the rules somewhere with this plan?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jamesfirecat on <08-10-13/1401:17>
jamming is also beaten via using motion-sensor/impact fusing. if i read the rules correctly, if you hit versus a standard defense roll, you do damage (plus hits!), and you only worry about scatter if you miss totally (in which case you might still hit your target). i would argue a direct hit should be treated as other explosions and halve armor, but that's a side point.

to insure hittingness + chunky salsa effect, use with MGL-12 for super happy murder time fun time. nothing quite like an SA burst that does 24P damage, -4 AP and -4 to dodge. nearly as good as a guided missile and much cheaper too. more humane runners may prefer to lay down a trio of flashbangs for 15S AP -6  instead.

actual question: what does the suppression effect affect? does it include defense rolls? there's a really nasty tactic of laying down suppressive and then having other shooters pick off the targets if that's the case.


Adding to this' does suppressive fire decrease the pool used to avoid being hit by suppressive fire, and does it still take away form someone's pool if they decide not try and dodge the suppressive fire but just take their hits from it?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-10-13/1757:05>
Actually, here is the real no win situation for how you use grenades super effectively if wireless is not an option.

Runner A shoots spread grenades on time fuses and they land where he wants them to after holding his action so that he goes after the target at targets iniative score minus one.

Runner B shoots the target with S&S ammo.
S&S shots which deal a box of physical or stun drops five from the targets initiative score.

Target does not get to act again before grenades go off.
not technically an option, but could be houseruled. more realistic, but do u really want more realistic grenades...
Why isn't it an option, did I misread/misunderstand the rules somewhere with this plan?
I think timer grenades only detonate in the next Combat Turn (not next Initiative Pass), and with 10 less Initiative than the score you had when you fired them, so that leaves a lot of time for the target to escape even if hit with SnS ammo.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-11-13/1712:37>
Since "A spirit’s physical form is metahuman-sized or smaller and very obviously ethereal" when materialized, is it possible to make a materialized spirit wear normal armor? If so, does the armor rating add to their Immunity to determine whether an attack injures them, or does it solely affect their damage soak dice pool?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DWC on <08-11-13/1738:10>
Suppressive Fire lists the penalty as being to skill checks, so I can't imagine it applies to defense tests or any other dual stat test.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Slithery D on <08-11-13/1814:45>
Since "A spirit’s physical form is metahuman-sized or smaller and very obviously ethereal" when materialized, is it possible to make a materialized spirit wear normal armor? If so, does the armor rating add to their Immunity to determine whether an attack injures them, or does it solely affect their damage soak dice pool?

For God's sake, neither! Even if Immunity isn't technically "armor" don't let it stack: spirits are hardly in need of more damage resistance.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-11-13/1819:22>
Since "A spirit’s physical form is metahuman-sized or smaller and very obviously ethereal" when materialized, is it possible to make a materialized spirit wear normal armor? If so, does the armor rating add to their Immunity to determine whether an attack injures them, or does it solely affect their damage soak dice pool?
For God's sake, neither! Even if Immunity isn't technically "armor" don't let it stack: spirits are hardly in need of more damage resistance.
Aw, but I wanted to summon a Spirit of Man, make it wear a duster and give it a Ruger Super Warhawk, and make it say "This town ain't big enough for the both of us". :(
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <08-12-13/0214:03>
Getting this back on topic by actually asking a question for the FAQ....

Running Silent says that you resist being spotted with Logic + Sleaze. So does running silent count as a Sleaze action, and thus start your overwatch score?

Also, only cyberdecks have a Sleaze attribute, so how do commlinks and other devices that are running silent resist being spotted?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-12-13/0521:08>
This wasn't my idea but a good point was raised that it isn't stated explicitly in the rules.

Q: If you put multiple Audio Enhancements Rating * in earbuds+headsets, or multiple Vision Enhancements Rating * in contacts and glasses, do their effects stack?
For example, if I got an Audio Enhancement Rating 3 and an Audio
Enhancement Rating 2 equipped, do I get +3 to my limits (and with wireless to my dicepool), or +5?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: The Masked Ferret on <08-12-13/1105:56>
This wasn't my idea but a good point was raised that it isn't stated explicitly in the rules.

Q: If you put multiple Audio Enhancements Rating * in earbuds+headsets, or multiple Vision Enhancements Rating * in contacts and glasses, do their effects stack?
For example, if I got an Audio Enhancement Rating 3 and an Audio
Enhancement Rating 2 equipped, do I get +3 to my limits (and with wireless to my dicepool), or +5?

I would say no. Audio Enhancement Rating 3 + Audio Enhancement Rating 2 != Audio Enhancement Rating 5. Audio Enhancement is Max rating 3. (pg. 445)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-12-13/1112:09>
Well that's also what I would say myself, but I'm asking so we get an official ruling to hold against people suggesting it should be fine. :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mirikon on <08-12-13/1142:42>
No official ruling needed. Just beat those people with the phone book until they stop being stupid.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: The Masked Ferret on <08-12-13/1146:58>
No official ruling needed. Just beat those people with the phone book until they stop being stupid.

But I might damage my phone book!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-12-13/1152:11>
Don't be ridiculous. We don't know the damage of a phonebook. Just wait for the physical book to arrive and use that, we know the official damage code for that puppy.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mirikon on <08-12-13/1248:24>
I dunno. A Metro Atlanta phone book I think would have a pretty hefty DV.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-12-13/1340:50>
No official ruling needed. Just beat those people with the phone book until they stop being stupid.
But I might damage my phone book!
Get two food trays from a cafeteria, and use those.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: The Masked Ferret on <08-12-13/1455:12>
No official ruling needed. Just beat those people with the phone book until they stop being stupid.
But I might damage my phone book!
Get two food trays from a cafeteria, and use those.

Sounds like a street level run to me - Johnson says that he wants you to steal 2 trays from a corp cafeteria. Two specific trays. The white ones. With the old corp logo. He will pay you in pizza.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tagami on <08-12-13/1603:54>
This wasn't my idea but a good point was raised that it isn't stated explicitly in the rules.

Q: If you put multiple Audio Enhancements Rating * in earbuds+headsets, or multiple Vision Enhancements Rating * in contacts and glasses, do their effects stack?
For example, if I got an Audio Enhancement Rating 3 and an Audio
Enhancement Rating 2 equipped, do I get +3 to my limits (and with wireless to my dicepool), or +5?

I would say no. Audio Enhancement Rating 3 + Audio Enhancement Rating 2 != Audio Enhancement Rating 5. Audio Enhancement is Max rating 3. (pg. 445)

RAW per SR5, pg 445 one sensor is max rating 3. The question at hand is what happens when you feed the output of one sensor (say headphones with Audio Enhance rating 2) into another (earbuds Audio Enhance rating 3).

It's not unheard of, in RL. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Preamplifier). I guess it depends on RAI (what rating really represents? signal clarity or volume?).

Even though everyone thinks this is a phonebook case, I disagree on that. It merely allows more creativity for the players if allowed, or clarifies the intended use of the equipment.

I would like also to remind you that this could be vital info for riggers, since they could potentially rig sensor setups for ambushes and safehouses with relative ease on the cheap (I guess that would be an INT+Hardware check) and then use that for ultra long range eavesdropping (add directional mic, tada!). Even better, running around with a spy-van trying to pick up info on corp-sec from the parking lot across the facility sounds very trenchcoaty to me (a part of SR I love to bits).

Again, it's not unheard of for people to try to get info from as far away as possible using arrays of equipment. (http://www.space.com/16000-spy-satellites-space-telescopes-nasa.html Go read about the capabilities of those babies NASA got. They were the spare/obsolete ones).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shade on <08-12-13/2021:49>
Quote
It's not unheard of, in RL. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Preamplifier). I guess it depends on RAI (what rating really represents? signal clarity or volume?).

I think you are not abstracting the rules enough, personally. If the book says the max rating is 3, I interpret that to mean that 3 includes every conceivable way of improving the quality AND volume available to state-of-the-art technology. Ratings are intended as a tool to allow bonuses using technology with an eye to game balance. They are HIGHLY abstract. Consider a max rating ANYTHING to be the equivalent of what, say, the CIA or covert ops teams would be using. Including combinations of different technologies, et al.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sir_Prometheus on <08-13-13/1352:51>
p309 Would the Adept power attribute boost add to unarmed damage if applied to Strength?
Nothing. It only adds dice to dice pools involving Strength.

Hi Aaron, I appreciate you answering our questions, but I very much dislike this answer specifically.

Strength is used for a few athletics type tests, but I think it's safe to say that damage is the main point of the strength attribute.  I get the idea behind nerfing critical strike -- in 4e you could pretty easily get small humans that could punch a tank.  But attribute boost isn't really the same sort of thing and is not subject to the same abuses (it takes an action, it has limited duration and drain) and if an adept boosts her strength.....well, they're going to hit harder.

It's also not how I would have parsed the rule itself....my assumption is that they were making boosts not affect limits and the like so that these didn't have to be recalculated on the fly.  I.e. it was an ease of play rather than a game balance issue.

In the end, strength boost that doesn't affect damage just seems fairly pointless.  I think you'll also see a lot of unarmed adepts that wind up getting bioware or cyberware to compensate, and that just seems un-fluffy. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-13-13/1417:16>
Spell Shaping allows you to create 1-meter-radius spherical "bubbles" within an area spell's area of effect that is unaffected by the spell: if you don't get the 3 hits needed, and your spell scatters, does the bubble (which will typically be used to protect you or your allies from the blast) scatter with it?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Raiden on <08-13-13/1507:50>
If I use to multiple attack action for SS weapons, then I don't use it anymore, does the recoil still progress? or only when I use said multiple attack action?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-13-13/1806:43>
Getting this back on topic by actually asking a question for the FAQ....

Running Silent says that you resist being spotted with Logic + Sleaze. So does running silent count as a Sleaze action, and thus start your overwatch score?

Also, only cyberdecks have a Sleaze attribute, so how do commlinks and other devices that are running silent resist being spotted?

No, a defense test isn't an action.

They add their Sleaze attribute of zero to the dice pool. =i)

Hi Aaron, I appreciate you answering our questions, but I very much dislike this answer specifically.

Strength is used for a few athletics type tests, but I think it's safe to say that damage is the main point of the strength attribute.  I get the idea behind nerfing critical strike -- in 4e you could pretty easily get small humans that could punch a tank.  But attribute boost isn't really the same sort of thing and is not subject to the same abuses (it takes an action, it has limited duration and drain) and if an adept boosts her strength.....well, they're going to hit harder.

It's also not how I would have parsed the rule itself....my assumption is that they were making boosts not affect limits and the like so that these didn't have to be recalculated on the fly.  I.e. it was an ease of play rather than a game balance issue.

In the end, strength boost that doesn't affect damage just seems fairly pointless.  I think you'll also see a lot of unarmed adepts that wind up getting bioware or cyberware to compensate, and that just seems un-fluffy. 

I understand where you're coming from. My answer hinges entirely on the text of the power, which includes the words "This only affects your dice pools," and I don't think melee damage is a dice pool. It's possible that the errata could change this, but in the meantime, I can only really go by the book.

Spell Shaping allows you to create 1-meter-radius spherical "bubbles" within an area spell's area of effect that is unaffected by the spell: if you don't get the 3 hits needed, and your spell scatters, does the bubble (which will typically be used to protect you or your allies from the blast) scatter with it?

Since you have to declare your use of spell shaping when you cast the spell, plus the bubble is created within the area of your spell and not independent of it, I think the bubbles scatter with the area of effect. Of course, this only applies to area indirect combat spells, since all other spells are targeted with more precision.

If I use to multiple attack action for SS weapons, then I don't use it anymore, does the recoil still progress? or only when I use said multiple attack action?

I'm not sure what you mean. The SS fire mode description (p. 178) doesn't seem to allow for multiple attacks. Am I misunderstanding your question?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-13-13/1812:41>
He's talking about dualwielding, where it mentions that this is the only way an SS weapon can face recoil.

Q: Arcana is a non-default skill, but Initiation is Arcana+Intuition (not +Logic). How does initiating works for someone without Arcana? Does it have a default penalty of -1, is it just 2 different bonuses so simply Intuition+0, is it not allowed? And how should an Adept reach high initiation levels without Arcana and limited extended tests, or is that simply not intended?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Raiden on <08-13-13/1943:26>
yes, when duel wielding, and using multiple attack actions.

Single Shots
Single Shot (SS) weapons have the disadvantage of
not being able to fire multiple rounds in a single Action
Phase, but they have the advantage of not suffering
from cumulative recoil when fired in single shot
mode. It is assumed to be taking time to chamber the
next round or otherwise make the SS weapon ready to
fire again; this pause between shots means characters
using these weapons do not suffer from progressive
recoil. Recoil penalties apply when using the Multiple
Attacks Action.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-13-13/2243:13>
Are you allowed to take Attack or Sleaze actions with commlinks if you spend Edge on the dice roll to Push the Limit?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ricochet on <08-13-13/2250:11>
Saw someone assuming that was legal in another thread (char creation) and the idea seems utterly ridiculous.  Would love to get it official though.  That player had enough other issues I didn't even want to start to get into, I just left the thread instead of ranting.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: lurkeroutthere on <08-13-13/2311:44>
Two fun facts:

1) Search function is fun and easy.

2) Just because an answer from the book isn't the one you want doesn't mean it needs clarification. But i will gladly wait if someone can find anything more difinitive then what I found. If Aaron or others chime in as something completely reversing the book. Well that will be both unexpected and unfortunate as it would stand in opposition to what I understand was one of the stated goals of the matrix rewrite, that is to say making skills and attributes matter again over programs and gear.

Also i'm going to default to one of my very basic stock answers on this. I find it extremely humorous that Shadowrun supports elves, magic, dragons, space flight, virtual reality, and underwater arcologies as basic understandings of the setting., but the idea that someone could accomplish "hacks" with skill, brains and a touch of luck instead of specialized hardware is the part that's "utterly ridiculous" to you?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ricochet on <08-13-13/2314:51>
Also i'm going to default to one of my very basic stock answers on this. I find it extremely humorous that Shadowrun supports elves, magic, dragons, space flight, virtual reality, and underwater arcologies as basic understandings of the setting., but the idea that someone could accomplish "hacks" with skill, brains and instead of specialized hardware is the part that's "utterly ridiculous" to you?

If you don't have resonance...yes.  I don't get to shoot people without my gun either...no matter how skilled at firearms I am.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: lurkeroutthere on <08-13-13/2317:18>
But i cans still bludgeon you with a thrown rock. Not nearly as effective but it got the job done for a long time before the advent of guns. Same principle.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-13-13/2324:00>
2) Just because an answer from the book isn't the one you want doesn't mean it needs clarification. But i will gladly wait if someone can find anything more difinitive then what I found.
Contrary to what you seem to think, we think it needs clarification because it makes no sense for commlinks to be able to hack in 5E when they don't mention the possibility in the entire Matrix chapter, character sheets no longer have a separate commlink section, they completely lack the attributes needed to hack, hackers have been renamed to deckers again... so basically, everything about the book at the very least implies you can't use commlinks to hack.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <08-13-13/2325:36>
Why don't you take the argument back to the original thread where it came up so as not to clutter up the FAQ thread?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-13-13/2339:29>
Are you allowed to take Attack or Sleaze actions with commlinks if you spend Edge on the dice roll to Push the Limit?

By the rules, yes. If your GM agrees with Ricochet (who says s/he believes that this is utterly ridiculous, a legitimate viewpoint), you might not be able to do it this way. Me, I see it as pushing your limits by writing one-shot code on the fly to make the non-decking device bend to your will for just the tiniest moment, so it's cool with me.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <08-14-13/0135:16>
Firstly, thanks for the answer Aaron.

Secondly, I'd like to point to this passage on Page 223:

"The cyberdeck has advanced electronics and firmware based on reverse-engineered protocols used in Matrix security. In short, a cyberdeck is the tool you need to be a hacker."

The fact is, the Corporate Court and GOD decided that hackers were getting away with too much and decided to implement new security protocols and a new topology to the Matrix.  This is why we have Grids now and why we have a Grid Overwatch Score.  That technology makes hacking impossible without a cyberdeck or Resonance.  Simple as that.  The "reverse-engineered protocols used in Matrix security" refer to the protocols that prevent commlinks from hacking.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <08-14-13/0140:03>
A much better question, which may have been asked before and I can't find the answer:

Is it possible for a Technomancer to develop Noise Reduction and/or Sharing for drone control?  If so, how?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <08-14-13/0146:11>
So, if someone were to take an arrowhead and the shaft of the arrow, have them in to different pieces, and then use them as lynchpins to create two different preparations, would they still be considered as two different preparations when reassembled into an arrow?  If so, what happens if the preparation on the arrowhead is Contact activated?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <08-14-13/0153:07>
So, if someone were to take an arrowhead and the shaft of the arrow, have them in to different pieces, and then use them as lynchpins to create two different preparations, would they still be considered as two different preparations when reassembled into an arrow?  If so, what happens if the preparation on the arrowhead is Contact activated?

I suppose that would depend on the preparations, perhaps?  As a GM, I wouldn't have any problem with someone using the arrowhead and the shaft as two different lynchpins.  Just because they're re-attached doesn't mean that would affect their form as a magical object.  If your arrowhead had a Toxic Wave spell tied to it though, it might destroy the shaft (and the preparation with it).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <08-14-13/0155:58>
So, if someone were to take an arrowhead and the shaft of the arrow, have them in to different pieces, and then use them as lynchpins to create two different preparations, would they still be considered as two different preparations when reassembled into an arrow?  If so, what happens if the preparation on the arrowhead is Contact activated?

I suppose that would depend on the preparations, perhaps?  As a GM, I wouldn't have any problem with someone using the arrowhead and the shaft as two different lynchpins.  Just because they're re-attached doesn't mean that would affect their form as a magical object.  If your arrowhead had a Toxic Wave spell tied to it though, it might destroy the shaft (and the preparation with it).

Other people have been arguing that the act of using them to make the arrow somehow invalidates the preparations (regardless of no RAW stating that).  So I figured I'd raise the question.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <08-14-13/0157:50>
I can see how that would be a dividing point.  I think for rules simplicity the arrow is a single device, the shaft and arrowhead.  But if you're comfortable with that level of detail, I'd go with the two objects = two preparations side of things.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <08-14-13/0204:44>
I can see how that would be a dividing point.  I think for rules simplicity the arrow is a single device, the shaft and arrowhead.  But if you're comfortable with that level of detail, I'd go with the two objects = two preparations side of things.

What I'm looking for here is dev response so I can get a closer sense of what RAI here is.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-14-13/0512:03>
Cough. People, if you want to debate things, it might be better to do that in the debate topics themselves, or make your own in the Rules section. This one is for the developers. And going after people because they ask questions you find nonsensical, is kinda a bad thing. It might be they already have an assumed answer but want an official ruling due to a heavy debate on it.

Q: Adrenaline Boost is a Free Action and makes you eat drain the next turn. No limit in use is mentioned. Can you use it in multiple Action Phases in the same Combat Turn? If so, does the drain stack up in one massive drain check, or will it be several independent drain checks?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: sylanna on <08-14-13/0631:28>
How does evading explosives work? If the defender wins a test against a motion triggered grenade (same with vehicle vs missile), will he take no damage at all? Will he jump like 10+ meters away in spaces without obstacles/cover? If he doesn't, he should have to soak part of the blast (but how much?).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-14-13/0644:42>
p181: If you fail the attack roll, you roll scatter and scatter the full amount, then the grenade explodes.
p182: The GM rolls 2d6 to determine the scatter direction and then rolls to determine the scatter distance.

Q: Scatter mentions (#d6 - Hits) meters in Scatter. Motion sensors mentions scatter the grenade "scatters the full amount". Does that mean that, unlike with an unopposed test where scoring 1~2 hits will reduce the scatter, you do not apply any hits from the opposed test on reducing the scatter? Or will the net hits of the defender actually count against you, increasing the scatter?

e.g. I throw a motion sensors grenade and roll 3 hits, the dodger rolls 5. I roll 1d6 for Scatter and roll a 4. Does the grenade now scatter 4-3=1 (I doubt it), 4 or 4+(5-3)=6 meters?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-14-13/0717:41>
A much better question, which may have been asked before and I can't find the answer:

Is it possible for a Technomancer to develop Noise Reduction and/or Sharing for drone control?  If so, how?

Not in the core rule book, but this functionality might be in future source books.

So, if someone were to take an arrowhead and the shaft of the arrow, have them in to different pieces, and then use them as lynchpins to create two different preparations, would they still be considered as two different preparations when reassembled into an arrow?  If so, what happens if the preparation on the arrowhead is Contact activated?

I think that strictly by the book, they'd remain two separate preparations. I think the errata will show that destroying or defacing a lynchpin destroys the preparation, but whether attaching an arrowhead to an arrow shaft defaces a preparation is a GM call (which might involve and Armorer Test). If the arrowhead has a contact trigger, the arrow would have to be handled and shot without touching it, and it would have to penetrate (cause Physical and not Stun damage) its target for the contact trigger to ... well, trigger.

What I'm looking for here is dev response so I can get a closer sense of what RAI here is.

Please keep in mind I'm keeping my answers based on the book and any errata I know has a good chance of making it through the approval process, labeling my own opinions as such. In theory, the Real Answers are in the book, albeit possibly buried somewhere in its nearly five hundred pages. Beware of using my opinion in your rules debates, partly because appealing to authority isn't a valid argument, but mostly because nothing's official unless it's in publication by Catalyst.

Also, a lot of these questions are becoming more and more centered on minutia and weird edge cases, and so they don't really fall under the "F" in "FAQ." That said, I like answering questions so I don't mind answering them (although the really specific ones probably won't make it into the official FAQ when that becomes a thing.

Q: Adrenaline Boost is a Free Action and makes you eat drain the next turn. No limit in use is mentioned. Can you use it in multiple Action Phases in the same Combat Turn? If so, does the drain stack up in one massive drain check, or will it be several independent drain checks?

Barring errata, you can use it every Initiative Pass. You'd take the Drain from each use separately.

How does evading explosives work? If the defender wins a test against a motion triggered grenade (same with vehicle vs missile), will he take no damage at all? Will he jump like 10+ meters away in spaces without obstacles/cover? If he doesn't, he should have to soak part of the blast (but how much?).

If you're in the blast zone when the explosive goes off, it's too late for you to evade it. Motion triggered grenades go off when they hit you; if they miss they scatter (p. 182) and so might take reduced damage.

Q: Scatter mentions (#d6 - Hits) meters in Scatter. Motion sensors mentions scatter the grenade "scatters the full amount". Does that mean that, unlike with an unopposed test where scoring 1~2 hits will reduce the scatter, you do not apply any hits from the opposed test on reducing the scatter? Or will the net hits of the defender actually count against you, increasing the scatter?

In the case of a missed motion triggered projectile, roll for scatter but do not reduce the scatter by the attacker's hits.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: sylanna on <08-14-13/0740:45>
They only scatter if you fail the attack roll or glitch. And this is where the problem is: When the attacker gets hits and the defender gets more hits, the attack role didn't fail. But that might just be a problem of the wording. Failed attack role = no net hits, is what I was thinking.
By RAW, the grenade should explode the moment it hits something...that would be the floor, if the target dodged.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-14-13/0744:21>
You failed to get more hits than the defender, so you failed the test.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: sylanna on <08-14-13/0802:13>
Oh okay. I didn't play a system, in which those two things are the same, yet. Thank you.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ricochet on <08-14-13/0818:30>
Firstly, thanks for the answer Aaron.

Secondly, I'd like to point to this passage on Page 223:

"The cyberdeck has advanced electronics and firmware based on reverse-engineered protocols used in Matrix security. In short, a cyberdeck is the tool you need to be a hacker."

The fact is, the Corporate Court and GOD decided that hackers were getting away with too much and decided to implement new security protocols and a new topology to the Matrix.  This is why we have Grids now and why we have a Grid Overwatch Score.  That technology makes hacking impossible without a cyberdeck or Resonance.  Simple as that.  The "reverse-engineered protocols used in Matrix security" refer to the protocols that prevent commlinks from hacking.

That is exactly the quote I was going off of when I was first thinking through this, but the fact Aaron supported this, I reread the whole hacking chapter twice last night and was trying to go through the pros and cons of allowing edge hacking.  Despite my talk of it being crazy as a first reaction (since that quote specifically put it outside the rules in my opinion) I'm moving more and more in favor of allowing  an edge hacker.  Most sleaze/attack actions require a mark, meaning you will need to invest multiple edge points to hack more often than not, making it difficult to use consistently. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <08-14-13/1712:26>
Q Can a custom Cyberlimb exceed your current natural rating in an attribute by more than +4? (For an extreme example, a Human with Strength 1 buying a Strength 6 custom limb at character creation) Can the same character then still add enhancements to reach rating 9?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-14-13/1820:01>
Sub question to the above. Can your Agility 1 character customize to 6 and then enhance to 9.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <08-14-13/1829:12>
Sub question to the above. Can your Agility 1 character customize to 6 and then enhance to 9.
added to the original question too to help.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shade on <08-14-13/2034:22>
Sub question to the above. Can your Agility 1 character customize to 6 and then enhance to 9.

"I'm fairly certain that this part in customization(pg. 456) Each increase of either attribute increases the limb’s Availability and cost. If either of your limb’s attributes are increased beyond your natural maximum for that attribute, you can’t use the cyberlimb (so don’t overdo it), but you can still add cyberlimb enhancements."

I think this means to imply that customization alone cannot go above the natural rating. Otherwise, what is a natural maximum? The +4 above natural is usually referred to as the augmented maximum. So I think a 6 Strength character can customize up to 6 strength and THEN enhance the limb up to 10.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-14-13/2037:19>
I think this means to imply that customization alone cannot go above the natural rating. Otherwise, what is a natural maximum?
The natural maximum, as described on page 66, is the highest natural value you can have that attribute at (so 7 Agi for Elves, for example).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <08-14-13/2037:45>
I think this means to imply that customization alone cannot go above the natural rating. Otherwise, what is a natural maximum? The +4 above natural is usually referred to as the augmented maximum. So I think a 6 Strength character can customize up to 6 strength and THEN enhance the limb up to 10.

Aaron has all ready stated to a previous question of mine that cyberlimbs can go over current natural, this is to confirm it can have a huge gap between natural and limb
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shade on <08-14-13/2046:09>
Doh, missed that one. That's what I get for being lazy and not ctrl+f. Crazy that you can have a 1 strength human with a 10 strength cyberlimb!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-15-13/0443:40>
I actually submitted a question on whether that means you're running at 1[10] or that in actual use it's 1[5], we'll have to wait for the official FAQ to get out.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-15-13/0802:13>
Yes, but only for activities that involve only the limb in question, and your Physical limit is unchanged.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <08-15-13/0838:58>
Yes, but only for activities that involve only the limb in question, and your Physical limit is unchanged.
So Q. Is your physical limit based off only your natural ratings or an average of your natural and cybered ratings, in the case of cyberlimbs? Another extreme example, a Human with natural STR, REA, BOD and AGI all at 1 has two cyber limbs that are 9/9/9 (neither are a cyberskull, what is his physical limit?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-15-13/0915:11>
Yes, but only for activities that involve only the limb in question, and your Physical limit is unchanged.

How official is that answer Aaron (ie are you speaking with your Catalyst hat on or just as Aaron), because Agility 1 (9) doesn't feel like an SR5 concept to me.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <08-15-13/0917:39>
I imagine he says that answer in the same light he has said all these answers are in
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-15-13/1013:06>
Yes, but only for activities that involve only the limb in question, and your Physical limit is unchanged.
How official is that answer Aaron (ie are you speaking with your Catalyst hat on or just as Aaron), because Agility 1 (9) doesn't feel like an SR5 concept to me.
You don't actually have Agility 1 (9): your arm has Agility 9, the rest of your body has Agility 1.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-15-13/1016:45>
(Which, by the way, leads to the conclusion that if your physical stats are all 1s, you'd have a limit of 2 and thus any Physical-Limit-test will be capped on 2 hits...)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-15-13/1020:47>
(Which, by the way, leads to the conclusion that if your physical stats are all 1s, you'd have a limit of 2 and thus any Physical-Limit-test will be capped on 2 hits...)

Unfortunately Agility isn't included in the physical limit calculation, and accuracy overrides it on weapon tests anyway. I'm okay with Cyberlimbs being good, but the idea that the cyberlimb functions on the SR4 mechanic while everything else in the edition works on the new Augmented limit based on current stat seems a little bizarre.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Raiden on <08-15-13/1043:40>
try to think of it as not being augmented. the arm has a max of the nat. max of the metatype it was made for, you can then add +3 to that.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-15-13/1053:05>
try to think of it as not being augmented. the arm has a max of the nat. max of the metatype it was made for, you can then add +3 to that.

I understand the argument I just find it unconvincing. If Aaron is using his Catalysyt hat and that's the official answer I'll just have to house rule it in my games, but you can already see the Agi 1(9) cyberlimb becoming de rigeur over in the chargen forum.

The reason for that is that it's an ill considered and broken port over from SR4 and completely out of sync with all of the other ways in which SR5 handles augmentation.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Raiden on <08-15-13/1110:02>
in ways yes, but its very essence costly and nuyen costly. remeber, even if they get 3 limbs there average agi (running, climbing, swimming, jumping, melee, everything besides shooting and other things) are averaged out. its not (9) for everything, sneaking, with 2 cyber arms is like 4- agi
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-15-13/1114:00>
We should probably move the debate out of the FAQ thread if we're going to have it.

If Aaron is still around I would like to know if that was a developer level answer or just his reading but other than that I think we should move the conversation.

corrected for typos
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <08-15-13/1239:41>
Yes, but only for activities that involve only the limb in question, and your Physical limit is unchanged.

So basically with all the changes that were made, one of the few things that actually needed fixing didn't get touched? *facepalm*
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-15-13/1507:59>
Q: Does your inherent recoil compensation use solely your body's (so not your cyberlimb's) Strength?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Palladion on <08-15-13/1807:42>
Would an adept with cybereyes still benefit from Improved Sense (Low-Light Vision) et al?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Raiden on <08-16-13/0215:49>
Does the -2 for being on a public server also count against defense tests?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <08-16-13/0529:58>
On the forums there seem to be some confusion about grenades and how aoe work. For once I think the rules are pretty straight forward, but I think it is best to post it here anyway. The actual question is:

Q: Do defenders get to roll against an AoE?

No for dodging, yes for damage resistance (excluding direct combat spells, of course).

For grenades specifically, if the guy shooting at you is using a motion sensor trigger, then you get to dodge normally because she's trying to hit you. As a side note, the motion sensor on grenades is a full-stop (or mostly-full-stop) kind of detector, so just grazing your target or skipping a grenade off of the ground won't set it off in this triggering mode.

Aaron, if I understand properly this post as well as some other you did before:
   - there is no defense test for grenades with timer: the defender should be able to act between the moment the grenade lands and when it explodes --> clear
   - there is a defense test for motion sensor trigger grenades. My understanding of your answers is that we consider that the attacker is trying to do a "direct hit", so a defense test apply as for a regular bullet. As you are "dodging" the grenade before it explodes, the AOE defense modifier does not apply (you state in another post that it an error leftover from SR4). In that case, I assume the attacker only needs to score more success than the defending character to hit, if the opposed test is lost by the attacker then we roll for scatter. Can you confirm all that sentence?

What about AOE indirect spells, it is said that they are handled as grenades but:
   - they cannot be handled as timer grenades because they explode immediatly
   - they cannot be handled as motion sensor trigger grenades, as I understand there is no defense roll
   - they obviously cannot be handled as wireless grenades
So my understanding is that:
   - there is no defense roll
   - in case the caster rolls less that 3 success then the spell scatter (but the damage is constant over the entire radius, correct?)
   - in case the caster rolls 3 or more success, each success above 3 increase the damage value
So unlike grenades, there is nothing the target can do, except resist damages. Can conterspelling help in resisting damages?

One other question regarding Wireless link: it is  stated that "this method also reduce scatter" but without any information about how much it reduces scatter. Can you please clarify?

Furthermore, can you confirm that the following points will be errated (to match what you explained):
Quote from: SR5, Ranged combat paragraph, p. 173
Ranged combat is determined with an Opposed Test between the attacker’s Weapon Skill + Agility [Accuracy] vs. the defender’s Reaction + Intuition. Net hits are applied to the weapons DV or used to reduce scatter in the case of thrown weapons and launched weapons.
--> It clearly states that thrown grenades and grenade launcher use an opposed test., which is not the case

Quote from: SR5, Defending in combat section (p. 188)[/quote
Targeted by an Area-Effect Attack Dodging explosions is not as easy as it seems in the movies. Apply a –2 modifier when trying to defend against weapons like spells, grenades, rockets, or missiles with a blast or area effect.
--> you stated previously that it was a leftover from SR4.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-16-13/0947:57>
Yes, but only for activities that involve only the limb in question, and your Physical limit is unchanged.

How official is that answer Aaron (ie are you speaking with your Catalyst hat on or just as Aaron), because Agility 1 (9) doesn't feel like an SR5 concept to me.

I don't have a Catalyst hat; check the signature.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-16-13/0949:34>
Thanks for the clarification.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-16-13/1010:25>
We should probably move the debate out of the FAQ thread if we're going to have it.

If Aaron is still around I would like to know if that was a developer level answer or just his reading but other than that I think we should move the conversation.

Yes, debate should happen in another topic. I'd be happy to talk about cyberlimbs or what-have-you there. Thanks.

I can't give you a developer-level answer. Shadowrun only has one developer: the esteemed Mr. Jason M. Hardy. I was on the rules committee and I did have a hand in writing and editing the new edition rule book and I am compiling the FAQ for CGL approval, but there's only one really real official source, and that's Catalyst. I can tell you how it works as currently written, and I can tell you what I personally think was the intent of each rule, and I can refer people to the possibility of a particular erratum, but that's about it. While I'd like to say that everything that I suggest will eventually be held as official, I don't make that call.

That said, I'm doing my best to give you the most accurate and up-to-date information I'm allowed to give you.

In that case, I assume the attacker only needs to score more success than the defending character to hit, if the opposed test is lost by the attacker then we roll for scatter. Can you confirm all that sentence?

Yes, I can confirm that you assume those things. =i). Seriously: yes, that seems to be the way the rule reads. If you're trying to hit a target with the grenade, they get to dodge.

Quote
So my understanding is that:
   - there is no defense roll
   - in case the caster rolls less that 3 success then the spell scatter (but the damage is constant over the entire radius, correct?)
   - in case the caster rolls 3 or more success, each success above 3 increase the damage value
So unlike grenades, there is nothing the target can do, except resist damages. Can conterspelling help in resisting damages?

- Correct.
- Yes.
- Yes.

Quote
One other question regarding Wireless link: it is  stated that "this method also reduce scatter" but without any information about how much it reduces scatter. Can you please confirm?

I believe this and the rest of your errata questions have been slated to be looked at for potential errata, but if you want better information please refer to the errata topic (which I would link if I wasn't answering this on a mobile device from Gen Con, so I'm afraid you'll have to look for that yourself; sorry).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <08-16-13/1015:58>
Q. My Attributes are 1/1/1 in respect to Physical Limit, making my Limit 2. I have one Cyberarm that is 9/9/9. I do an action using only that arm, that requires physical limit. What is my Limit for that roll?

Sorry for asking for so many clarifications Aaron, I really appreciate the help, I am running Fast Food Fight and starting Sprawl Wilds on Sunday, and nerves have me wanting to double check everything.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-16-13/1025:23>
Q. My Attributes are 1/1/1 in respect to Physical Limit, making my Limit 2. I have one Cyberarm that is 9/9/9. I do an action using only that arm, that requires physical limit. What is my Limit for that roll?

Your limit is 2.

Quote
Sorry for asking for so many clarifications Aaron, I really appreciate the help, I am running Fast Food Fight and starting Sprawl Wilds on Sunday, and nerves have me wanting to double check everything.

Glad to help!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-16-13/1028:32>
Let me ask a follow up.

The same character with a 1 Strength Body and Agi gets blown up and has to undergo full body conversion aquiring two cybearms, two legs and a torso. The stats for each limb are Strength 9, Agi 9. Would his limits change then?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-16-13/1031:54>
The same character with a 1 Strength Body and Agi gets blown up and has to undergo full body conversion aquiring two cybearms, two legs and a torso. The stats for each limb are Strength 9, Agi 9. Would his limits change then?
Since page 455 says cyberskulls and cybertorsos are shells rather than full replacements, that seems unlikely.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-16-13/1039:55>
The same character with a 1 Strength Body and Agi gets blown up and has to undergo full body conversion aquiring two cybearms, two legs and a torso. The stats for each limb are Strength 9, Agi 9. Would his limits change then?
Since page 455 says cyberskulls and cybertorsos are shells rather than full replacements, that seems unlikely.

They're expressly considered cyberlimbs though, and as the very next paragraph is "Cyberlimbs have their own Strength and Agility ratings."
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-16-13/1044:56>
The same character with a 1 Strength Body and Agi gets blown up and has to undergo full body conversion aquiring two cybearms, two legs and a torso. The stats for each limb are Strength 9, Agi 9. Would his limits change then?
Since page 455 says cyberskulls and cybertorsos are shells rather than full replacements, that seems unlikely.
They're expressly considered cyberlimbs though, and as the very next paragraph is "Cyberlimbs have their own Strength and Agility ratings."
But if having a single cyberlimb won't change your limits, and said 'full body conversion' doesn't actually replace your entire body, why would it change your limits?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-16-13/1052:41>
But if having a single cyberlimb won't change your limits, and said 'full body conversion' doesn't actually replace your entire body, why would it change your limits?

This would replace all of the locations used for cyberlimb averaging, and I was wondering if the effect would be different.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <08-16-13/1232:09>
Let me ask a follow up.

The same character with a 1 Strength Body and Agi gets blown up and has to undergo full body conversion aquiring two cybearms, two legs and a torso. The stats for each limb are Strength 9, Agi 9. Would his limits change then?

Personally, I'd say they would have the attributes to use (since all limbs are equal), but since they dumped all three natural attributes like that, they have to keep the low limit--that's what ya get for dumping three attributes to 1.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <08-16-13/1532:20>
I know the bonus from Bone Density Augmentation and Bone Lacing won't apply to getting a condition box, but will their bonus to Body apply for the purposes of calculating Physical Limit?

Example:
Body 3 + Bone Density Augmentation 3

Would Body count as 3 or 6 for Physical Limit? (I know it counts as 3 for the Condition Monitor)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-16-13/1836:37>
I know the bonus from Bone Density Augmentation and Bone Lacing won't apply to getting a condition box, but will their bonus to Body apply for the purposes of calculating Physical Limit?

As written, no.

Quote
Example:
Body 3 + Bone Density Augmentation 3

Would Body count as 3 or 6 for Physical Limit? (I know it counts as 3 for the Condition Monitor)

It would be 3 (barring other potential boosts not given in the example).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Palladion on <08-16-13/1911:40>
I know the bonus from Bone Density Augmentation and Bone Lacing won't apply to getting a condition box, but will their bonus to Body apply for the purposes of calculating Physical Limit?

Example:
Body 3 + Bone Density Augmentation 3

Would Body count as 3 or 6 for Physical Limit? (I know it counts as 3 for the Condition Monitor)

Bone density or bone lacing is not equivalent to "Body X (X + Y)" (where Y is the rating of the 'ware).  "...gives you extra Body for resisting physical damage, a little Armor (cumulative with other Armor, without adding to Encumbrance), and changes your unarmed combat damage..." (SR5 454), which is not the same as increasing your Body attribute (which would raise Limits, Condition Monitor, Overflow, etc.). If you want a strict reading, it does not help against stun damage either (bone density reads a bit differently), but that is probably for errata...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <08-16-13/2012:55>
I know the bonus from Bone Density Augmentation and Bone Lacing won't apply to getting a condition box, but will their bonus to Body apply for the purposes of calculating Physical Limit?

As written, no.

Quote
Example:
Body 3 + Bone Density Augmentation 3

Would Body count as 3 or 6 for Physical Limit? (I know it counts as 3 for the Condition Monitor)

It would be 3 (barring other potential boosts not given in the example).

This is what I was thinking, but I was just making sure. Though, that makes it all the more imperative that the Suprathyroid get a price and availability reduction, as it is the ONLY thing that mundanes have access to that can increase Body in 100% of circumstances.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-16-13/2019:32>
If it actually stacked with Synaptic Boosters, I wouldn't mind its cost (77k + 0.3 ess and some lifestyle for +1 Rea and +1 Bod), but right now it doesn't. That's more something for the errata topic though, and prices as a whole more something we already got topics on.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <08-16-13/2028:18>
If it actually stacked with Synaptic Boosters, I wouldn't mind its cost (77k + 0.3 ess and some lifestyle for +1 Rea and +1 Bod), but right now it doesn't. That's more something for the errata topic though, and prices as a whole more something we already got topics on.

Honestly, it should stack with everything and still have price and availability reduced (Essence cost is fine if reducing availability and price), simply because it is the only implant that directly increases Body.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-16-13/2038:01>
That's a matter of opinion. If it stacks with Synaptic Boosters, which it currently doesn't due to Synaptic Boosters being a copy of Wired Reflexes in stacking restrictions, you're basically paying 32k for the Reaction and 45k for the Body, and lifestyle costs for the benefits of all-in-one-boosting on top of what one already has. If we ignore your stance on how many ware prices should be slashed for a bit, it's rather competitive in price compared to the MA/MT vs RE&MR. But once again, we shouldn't pollute this topic, and you already have your topic for debate on the prices.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <08-16-13/2111:11>
That's a matter of opinion. If it stacks with Synaptic Boosters, which it currently doesn't due to Synaptic Boosters being a copy of Wired Reflexes in stacking restrictions, you're basically paying 32k for the Reaction and 45k for the Body, and lifestyle costs for the benefits of all-in-one-boosting on top of what one already has. If we ignore your stance on how many ware prices should be slashed for a bit, it's rather competitive in price compared to the MA/MT vs RE&MR. But once again, we shouldn't pollute this topic, and you already have your topic for debate on the prices.

Even giving +1 to all four physicals as it does, 20 availability and 140,000 is ridiculous for the Suprathyroid.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SoulGambit on <08-16-13/2347:34>
Will spirits spend Edge to resist being summoned or bound?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ramid on <08-18-13/0606:13>
Patrol IC. P248

Patrol IC acts more like an agent than other intrusion  countermeasures. Its job is to patrol a host, scanning people’s marks and looking for illegal activity using the Matrix Perception action on all targets in the host. While the act of placing a mark is an illegal activity, the act of simply having a mark is not. Once you have the mark, you are considered a legitimate user.

They way i have been treating this is that the patrol IC gets a perception test when a hacker attempts a Sleaze or attack action to place the mark but not once the mark is there.

Is that the correct usage ?

Also if so what should it be testing against. I have been using 1 success on perception if the decker is not running silent. And if the patrol IC has already noticed that there is an icon running silent in the system a opposed Computer + Intuition [Data Processing] v. Logic + Sleaze Test.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <08-18-13/0724:21>
I would like to request a rules clarification.
Other than having onlly one attribute at natural attribute limit, skills being restricted to level 6 and gear being restricted to it items with as Device Rating of of 6 or less or an Availability of 12 or less, are there any other limits as to what players can spend there leftover karma on during step seven of character creation? This came up when one of my players asked if they could start of with an Initiate grade of 1. I don't know if I have missed this somewhere in the character creation and magic sections. Another player then asked about submersion grade 2 for there starting tecnomancer as they where very interested in the Mind over Machine echo for there drone "rigging" tecnomancer character concept along with Resonance Signal Scrub echo.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-18-13/0727:00>
Initiation and Submerging are not available at chargen. The spending-karma section mentions a few things that are, in combination with the table (which lists limits on things such as spells) it should be an exhaustive list.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-18-13/1716:27>
Bone Lacing gives extra Body for resisting physical damage. This means that RAW it won't add to your Body when an attack doesn't pierce your armor and only does stun damage, thus only applying the armor portion to the soak test. Just to be sure, this is RAI right?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-18-13/2049:38>
Not sure I follow. If you get net hits, that means you got more hits than the defender, so you hit them, which means they can't evade the grenade. If, on the other hand, your attack roll doesn't beat their defense roll (you get the same amount of hits as they do, or they get more), the grenade scatters the full XD6 meters (1D6 if thrown, 2D6 if thrown and aerodynamic, 3D6 if fired from a grenade launcher) before exploding, and that amount of scatter will be how far the direct target is from the grenade when it explodes.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: sylanna on <08-18-13/2109:54>
Damn you are right...I overread the "net"...I should sleep before posting><
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Elektrycerze3 on <08-19-13/0256:50>
Is it possible at character creation to buy with Karma bound spirits of other traditions? It strikes me as cheezy, but I failed to find anything against it in the book...

Thank's in advance!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <08-19-13/0315:21>
Is it possible at character creation to buy with Karma bound spirits of other traditions? It strikes me as cheezy, but I failed to find anything against it in the book...

Thank's in advance!

You can't summon, let alone bind, a spirit of a different tradition.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Elektrycerze3 on <08-19-13/0325:24>
You can't summon, let alone bind, a spirit of a different tradition.

But check this out:

Quote from: SR5, p.301
If you (or another magician) has an action before the spirit departs, you can use Summoning (p. 300) to try to get it to owe you some services. It doesn’t matter what type the spirit is or which tradition you are in this case, since it’s already out and available.

After you "summon" a spirit in this fashion, what's stopping you from binding it?

On that logic my player bought a shiny fire elemental for his shaman...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <08-19-13/0445:00>
Since Agents and IC are counted as having Hot-Sim VR for the purpose of their initiative, do they also get the +2 dice pool bonus on Matrix Actions for everything they do?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-19-13/0734:02>
You can't summon, let alone bind, a spirit of a different tradition.
But check this out:
Quote from: SR5, p.301
If you (or another magician) has an action before the spirit departs, you can use Summoning (p. 300) to try to get it to owe you some services. It doesn’t matter what type the spirit is or which tradition you are in this case, since it’s already out and available.
After you "summon" a spirit in this fashion, what's stopping you from binding it?

On that logic my player bought a shiny fire elemental for his shaman...
"I summoned and bound a spirit that was banished" is very nice and all to do during gameplay, but it sounds definitely icky to put that in your character creation process.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Elektrycerze3 on <08-19-13/0806:32>
"I summoned and bound a spirit that was banished" is very nice and all to do during gameplay, but it sounds definitely icky to put that in your character creation process.

I know, right :-) But I really hope there is something in the rules against it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Unahim on <08-19-13/0959:15>
Will spirits spend Edge to resist being summoned or bound?

They -definitely- can't if they're Bound, as the rules explicitly state they don't have (or use) their Edge pools once Summoned. Whether they do while being summoned remains to be seen, I guess.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Raiden on <08-19-13/1537:14>
can you have multiple stats at 6 (nat max for humans) out of chargen? I ask because the sample character TM (or the example TM they use through out the char building sections) has both a logic 6 and a intuition of 6 (data processing and sleaze respectively)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-19-13/1640:25>
can you have multiple stats at 6 (nat max for humans) out of chargen? I ask because the sample character TM (or the example TM they use through out the char building sections) has both a logic 6 and a intuition of 6 (data processing and sleaze respectively)
Huh? Mega Pulse has 4 Logic and 4 Intuition, so those numbers for his Living Persona are wrong - in fact, it seems four of the five Living Persona attributes are actually two higher than the corresponding Mental stat (Device Rating is 6, which equals his Resonance). No idea what that is about, since I haven't read the Technomancer chapter yet.
And no, page 66 says you can only have 1 of your Mental and Physical attributes at their natural max at chargen.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MaxKojote on <08-19-13/1747:49>
can you have multiple stats at 6 (nat max for humans) out of chargen? I ask because the sample character TM (or the example TM they use through out the char building sections) has both a logic 6 and a intuition of 6 (data processing and sleaze respectively)
Huh? Mega Pulse has 4 Logic and 4 Intuition, so those numbers for his Living Persona are wrong - in fact, it seems four of the five Living Persona attributes are actually two higher than the corresponding Mental stat (Device Rating is 6, which equals his Resonance). No idea what that is about, since I haven't read the Technomancer chapter yet.
And no, page 66 says you can only have 1 of your Mental and Physical attributes at their natural max at chargen.

It's probably an error. The living persona still works directly off the mental attributes until you get some appropriate Echoes.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-20-13/1024:30>
Q: May a player, while still only receiving 25 karma for it, take more than 25 karma in Negative Qualities, e.g. when the quality-combination you want ends up at 26?

Q: When the Defiance EX Shocker is used in melee, what skill does it use? And is it a touch attack?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MagusRogue on <08-20-13/1139:59>
I want to bring up something about complex form limits I brought up earlier in another thread but didn't get to discuss it much.

As written right now, the highest Level you can choose for complex forms is Resonance x 3. I'm believing this is a typo or something that was previously considered but maybe changed in other places. Shouldn't it be Resonance x 2?

1) All similar mechanics (magic casting and summoning, sprite compiling) is Resonance x 2. And before someone mentioned it, yes, magic =/= resonance, but the mechanics are IDENTICAL, right down to fading versus drain, compiling tasks, making things permanent by sustaining up to the Level/Force, etc. This is the one instance where the rules are different, and not in a good way. See below:

2) This means we can choose to have at character creation, without any submersions, we can have a limit of 18 on tasks, which, unless my math-fu skills are bad, is all but impossible to reach by any other character (the closest I've seen is a Troll Phys Adept having a Physical Limit of 14 on unarmed attacks). That means we could potentially have 18 damage Resonance Spikes to devices, unbeatable Puppet requests, clean up to 18 points of OS at a time, etc, without Edge. Kind of game-breaking.

3) This also allows insta-glibbing your technomancer. Level x 2 means at most 12P fading, which is dang harsh but doable. 18P? yikes. And yes, there will be people who don't care and try to do it as their swansongs, but... yeah

Sorry for the long, verbose post, but I'd like to see some clarification here, because honestly Res x 3 is a bit ridiculous.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MagusRogue on <08-20-13/1151:25>
Also,

For sustained complex forms, it doesn't outright mention or detail penalties for sustaining complex forms, just one mention of -2 in the Example, and a mention of penalties without rules for it in letting a sprite sustain a complex form for you. Should we be using the same rules as sustaining spells on pg 282 (since the mechanics are the same)?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Rebeldawg on <08-20-13/1649:42>
No idea about your first question but I'd assume for the second question the taser would use the pistol skill.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <08-20-13/2341:53>
Q: For purposes of slave-master limits, particularly in the case of armor/armor mods and firearms/firearm mods, is each component treated as a separate slaved device or is it treated as one (e.g. Chameleon Suit w/Thermal Dampening, any number of firearm/smartlink combos)?

Q: I am probably missing something obvious here, but can a cyberdeck essentially sub for a commlink for all intents and purposes? Does it have all of the capabilities of a commlink + hacking or is it only a hacking tool?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Rebeldawg on <08-20-13/2351:03>
For your second question, no it cannot act as a commlink as it's a hacking tool more or less. Think of cyberdecks as of something more
like a ipad or something similar.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SoulGambit on <08-20-13/2358:16>
...What? Cyberdecks can do anything a Commlink can do. Commlinks can not do everything a Cyberdeck can do. Cyberdecks are just bigger, more expensive, and have added functionality (hacking, variable stats, capability to run programs, et cetera).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-21-13/0838:02>
Q: For purposes of slave-master limits, particularly in the case of armor/armor mods and firearms/firearm mods, is each component treated as a separate slaved device or is it treated as one (e.g. Chameleon Suit w/Thermal Dampening, any number of firearm/smartlink combos)?
I would say that a par of goggles with smartlink, image link, thermographic vision and whatnot is considered one device that you might or might not want to slave to a device with a higher device rating (such as a higher rating commlink).

In a similar fashion i would say that a firearm with a smartgun and an airburst link are considered one device as well.

As is your chameleon suit with thermal dampening considered one single device.

The smartgun (or rather your firearm) and the smartlink (or rather your goggles) count as two separate devices.

You can also link your smartgun to your smartlink with a direct cable which give you access to the camera feed to shoot around corners without exposing yourself for -3 dice, range finder, ammo count information, heat buildup information, material stress information and you also get to add +2 accuracy to your weapon. This does not require wireless ON on either the smartgun nor the smartlink (or your datajack if you use a DNI to make a wired connection to your device).


Q: I am probably missing something obvious here, but can a cyberdeck essentially sub for a commlink for all intents and purposes? Does it have all of the capabilities of a commlink + hacking or is it only a hacking tool?
Yes a cyberdeck is a comlink. And then some.
Cyberdecks are actually not even illegal in this edition (which is interesting since a commlink with hot-sim is), so basically you could even get a fake license to operate cyberdecks "legally" ;)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Automaton on <08-22-13/0537:31>
This really needs an offcial and good response.

All over the forums there are multiple topics about the addiction rules and none of them come to a real satisfying conclusion.

EIther the addiction rules are flawed and do not function as is, or the text is simply far to unclear on what its trying to say that no one gets it and starts interpretting it in all kinds of ways.

Can we please have someone (prefferably the one who made them ofcourse) clearify the addiction rules as they are mend to be used in a clear text that everyone can simply read and go "okay so thats how it works" Or can we get a fix for the addiction rules please.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-22-13/0542:43>
P257, Sprite Power Diagnostics: "The Diagnostics power allows the sprite to evaluate the inner workings of an electronic device. The sprite can assist someone using or repairing the device with a Teamwork Test. The sprite makes a Simple Hardware + Level [Data Processing] test; if any hits are rolled, the character gets a +1 limit bonus, and each hit adds 1 die to the character’s dice pool to use or repair the item."

Q: Does Diagnostics work on any wireless-enabled electronic device? Would it work on attacks made with smartguns, shock gloves, etc?

---------

Biofeedback states "when [the attack] causes Matrix damage, [...] equal amount of [...] biofeedback damage". The example shows that you first soak the Matrix damage, what remains then does Matrix damage but also gets a second roll against the Biofeedback damage. Black IC, however, states that when it HITS it does an "equal amount of biofeedback damage". This is explicitly stated in a way that suggests not serial soaking but parallel soaking instead, meaning Black IC is much more deadly than a lousy hacker with a mere Biofeedback program.

Q: Does Black IC, unlike the Biofeedback program, cause X Matrix damage and X Biofeedback damage, both receiving their own soak roll? E.g. if you take 8 damage from a Black IC, do you resist 8 Matrix damage with DR+FW and resist 8 Biofeedback damage with W+FW? Or do you first soak 8 Matrix damage with DR+FW, then apply the remainder as Matrix damage and soak it as Biofeedback damage with W+FW?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-22-13/0712:35>
This really needs an offcial and good response.

All over the forums there are multiple topics about the addiction rules and none of them come to a real satisfying conclusion.
Heeeeey. :(
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Automaton on <08-22-13/0823:40>
This really needs an offcial and good response.

All over the forums there are multiple topics about the addiction rules and none of them come to a real satisfying conclusion.
Heeeeey. :(

I mean no offense, but two persons who interpret the text in a certain way and decide that is the best way to interpret them is ofcourse good, and I do believe you may be in the right there, but its not official and since there are so many discussions and question on those rules it is clear that however made those rules seriously messed up describing how they are supposed to function.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-22-13/1042:16>
Since Agents and IC are counted as having Hot-Sim VR for the purpose of their initiative, do they also get the +2 dice pool bonus on Matrix Actions for everything they do?

That sounds like a fair reading to me. IC is supposed to be scary.

can you have multiple stats at 6 (nat max for humans) out of chargen? I ask because the sample character TM (or the example TM they use through out the char building sections) has both a logic 6 and a intuition of 6 (data processing and sleaze respectively)
Huh? Mega Pulse has 4 Logic and 4 Intuition, so those numbers for his Living Persona are wrong - in fact, it seems four of the five Living Persona attributes are actually two higher than the corresponding Mental stat (Device Rating is 6, which equals his Resonance). No idea what that is about, since I haven't read the Technomancer chapter yet.
And no, page 66 says you can only have 1 of your Mental and Physical attributes at their natural max at chargen.

Yeah, those are typos leftover from an early playtest version of the rules. Good catch: you should mention it over in the errata thread.

Q: May a player, while still only receiving 25 karma for it, take more than 25 karma in Negative Qualities, e.g. when the quality-combination you want ends up at 26?

That would be between you and your GM, but by the rules no.

Quote
Q: When the Defiance EX Shocker is used in melee, what skill does it use? And is it a touch attack?

That came up at my table at Gen Con. I let the player use either Clubs or Unarmed (her choice). But it's definitely a touch attack.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <08-22-13/1119:06>
Preparations vs. Spellcasting: The Drain Edition

Are preparations supposed to be inherently more dangerous to produce?
Quote
Spellcasting, Step 4: Cast the Spell (p. 281): If the number of hits (not net hits) you get (after applying the limit or Edge spending) exceeds your Magic rating, the spell’s Drain is Physical instead of Stun damage.
Based on that description, it sounds like you're not going to run into Physical Drain unless you set the force of the spell higher than your magic rating (or use a limitbreaker of some sort).
Quote
Alchemy, Step 6: Resist Drain (p.305): If you get more hits on your Alchemy Test than your Magic rating, the Drain is Physical, otherwise it’s Stun.
No mention of calculating hits after applying the limit. The exemplar on the same page makes me think that the final potency should be used for determining whether drain is Phyiscal or Stun, but I can't find anything that clarifies that.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SoulGambit on <08-22-13/1148:26>
Oi. I need to stop exhausting discussion on things.

The Subject: Machine Sprites and Diagnostics
1. Is anything with wireless considered an "Electronic Device?" If not, what is considered an Electronic Device?
2. May a Machine Sprite use Diagnostics on an item through a wireless connection?
3. May a Machine Sprite use Diagnostics on an item through a DNI?
4. May a Machine Sprite use Diagnostics on an item if its only connection is visual / through sensors?
5. May a Machine Sprite use Diagnostics on a Living Persona or a fellow Sprite?
6. What is required to be "using" the item? Is it
a. The item in question is modifying the diceroll somehow. I.E. Diagnostics on a Smartlink applies to guns benefiting from its bonus.
b. The item in question is required for the diceroll period. I.E. It works when performing Matrix actions with a Cyberdeck because you can't perform Matrix actions without it.
c. Something else entirely.
7. Technically a repeat of 6, but its the one I actually care about so I want to be extra sure. Can a Technomancer use Diagnostics on Trodes or a Satellite Uplink to gain the benefits on their Living Persona while using those Trodes or Satellite Uplink with their Living Persona.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-22-13/1305:22>
Preparations vs. Spellcasting: The Drain Edition

Are preparations supposed to be inherently more dangerous to produce?
Quote
Spellcasting, Step 4: Cast the Spell (p. 281): If the number of hits (not net hits) you get (after applying the limit or Edge spending) exceeds your Magic rating, the spell’s Drain is Physical instead of Stun damage.
Based on that description, it sounds like you're not going to run into Physical Drain unless you set the force of the spell higher than your magic rating (or use a limitbreaker of some sort).
Quote
Alchemy, Step 6: Resist Drain (p.305): If you get more hits on your Alchemy Test than your Magic rating, the Drain is Physical, otherwise it’s Stun.
No mention of calculating hits after applying the limit. The exemplar on the same page makes me think that the final potency should be used for determining whether drain is Phyiscal or Stun, but I can't find anything that clarifies that.

If there's a limit in place (and there is, the Force of the preparation), then one can't get more hits than the limit unless a limit breaker is involved. Basically, it's exactly the same as spellcasting.

Oi. I need to stop exhausting discussion on things.

The Subject: Machine Sprites and Diagnostics
1. Is anything with wireless considered an "Electronic Device?" If not, what is considered an Electronic Device?
2. May a Machine Sprite use Diagnostics on an item through a wireless connection?
3. May a Machine Sprite use Diagnostics on an item through a DNI?
4. May a Machine Sprite use Diagnostics on an item if its only connection is visual / through sensors?
5. May a Machine Sprite use Diagnostics on a Living Persona or a fellow Sprite?
6. What is required to be "using" the item? Is it
a. The item in question is modifying the diceroll somehow. I.E. Diagnostics on a Smartlink applies to guns benefiting from its bonus.
b. The item in question is required for the diceroll period. I.E. It works when performing Matrix actions with a Cyberdeck because you can't perform Matrix actions without it.
c. Something else entirely.
7. Technically a repeat of 6, but its the one I actually care about so I want to be extra sure. Can a Technomancer use Diagnostics on Trodes or a Satellite Uplink to gain the benefits on their Living Persona while using those Trodes or Satellite Uplink with their Living Persona.

1. Anything with a Device Rating.
2. I don't see any other way to do so, so yes.
3. How does a sprite get a direct neural interface?
4. Sprites use their powers through the wireless Matrix, so no.
5. Neither a living persona nor another sprite is a device (as defined on p. 219), so no.
6. a and b, and possibly some instances of c.
7. No, because you can't use trodes or a satellite uplink on your living persona. You're either using your Resonance abilities or you're not.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <08-22-13/1509:38>
Thanks for the response, Aaron! Makes sense, just a little wonky having asymmetrical language. Then again, if we had to wait for language symmetry, t would probably be a few more years before this book would have come out.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-22-13/1512:36>
So diagnostics on Muscle Replacement would apply it's teamwork bonus to ANY Str or Agi related test?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <08-22-13/1526:02>
So diagnostics on Muscle Replacement would apply it's teamwork bonus to ANY Str or Agi related test?

No.  Very No. You cannot use it on vat grown muscles.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SoulGambit on <08-22-13/1530:57>
Thank you Aaron! You cleared up a lot of stuff. Not happy with 7 but meh... I'll live.

Hrm... This makes a classical hacking Technomancer less viable due to fewer dice, re-emphasizing a "combat Technomancer" and emphasis on using their abilities. Its... a hard blow... but, I suppose, not an unwarranted one. On the upside(?), the Technomancer + Decker combo reigns supreme. Musing for another thread at another time.

More imminently, this brings up a question of a Living Persona's relationship with off-the-grid Matrix stuff--primarily privately stored files.

1) Can a Living Persona connect to an archive or device in a LAN or otherwise off the Matrix through a Data Tap that is set to Wireless?

2) Security Spyder Jones has a Cyberdeck that he uses, but is "Owned" by his company--something that is hinted at as being the norm. Jones has three marks on his device and permission to use it freely in his line of work, and is currently using it. Can a Technomancer use Puppeteer on Jones' Cyberdeck to perform the Invite Mark or other Owner-only actions (Full Matrix Defense, Invite Mark, Jack In, Jack Out, Jam Signals, Switch Interface Mode)? If so, does Jones spend his action doing them or does the "Owner," who may not even be otherwise present in Matrix Combat?

3) In the case of Invite Mark, who between the Technomancer, the Owner, and Mr. Jones (the user) can take back or modify the invitation? Assuming no other indicators, are Mr. Jones or the Owner aware enough of the action to do so?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-22-13/1537:13>
That was my reading as well, but going by Aaron's answers it seems that diagnostics would work on anything with a device rating regardless of whether it directly or indirectly impacts the roll.

Since the book is clear thar anything with a wireless presence is a device and that virtually everything has a wireless presence, the conclusion is that, if Aaron is correct, then essentially diagnostics is an across the board bonus to absolutely everything.

Relevant citations.

p234
Quote
A device in the Matrix is any wireless device in the real
world.

p 417
Quote
Even non-electronic items
without any moving parts have built-in computers, so
now your pants can store your favorite music (and tell
you when it’s time to do the laundry).

 p 420
Quote
Because nearly every piece of gear and ’ware is wireless
capable,

slipped by SoulGambit
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <08-22-13/1906:20>
I would like to ask for another rules clarification. It relates to Essence and Magic loss during character creation. Does Essence lost to cyberware reduce the points I get from my magic priority and metatype priority? for instance with priority E for Metatype with special point going into magic and priority D for Magic going for Aspected Magician would buying Wired-Reflexes 2 at character creation give me a starting  Magic attribute of 3 or 0? If it reduces my magic attribute to 0 could I buy my magic attribute back up to 3 with karma during step 7 of character creation?
What is the lowest I Essence a Character can have and stay alive? Assuming I can take my Essence as low 0.1 If I take exceptional attribute magic and Magic priority D (or greater)  at character creation could such a low essence character raise his Magic attribute up to 1 and then proceed to raise it further after successive initiations?

Small clarifications
The thing that prompted me to ask about the timing of Magic and Essence loss was p250 "Whenever you lose Essence (after character generation)." in relation to technomancers.
The equivalent entry on p278 makes no mention of the timing of Essence loss.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Unahim on <08-22-13/2152:55>
So, on how much essence you need to survive: 1+. You always round down with essence, so as soon as you have 1 essence and you lose even 0.1 essence more, that's it, you're done. You count as having 0 essence and are now dead.

Every point of essence you lose loses you a point of magic, doesn't matter if you got it from your metatype or your priority in magic, or whatever. If at any point in life a character reaches 0 magic, he or she burns out and is no longer Awakened. It's not really clear if you could drop points in magic and then rebuy them with karma at the end of char gen, but even if it is allowed it is a clear perversion of the rules and an obvious attempt to get your magic at a way cheaper rate than what you should be getting. If you want to drop 3 essence and have 3 magic, you should start with 6 magic. It's pure munchkinism to try and first drop 3 points, and then buy 1->3 magic because of it being cheaper than 4-6, and if I were your GM I'd never allow it.

Your mileage may vary, however. Ask your GM, maybe he's softer than I on this.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <08-22-13/2245:41>
So, on how much essence you need to survive: 1+. You always round down with essence, so as soon as you have 1 essence and you lose even 0.1 essence more, that's it, you're done. You count as having 0 essence and are now dead.
That must be new. There are plenty of characters rocking less than 1 essence out there. Care to link?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-22-13/2246:08>
Thanks for the response, Aaron! Makes sense, just a little wonky having asymmetrical language. Then again, if we had to wait for language symmetry, t would probably be a few more years before this book would have come out.

I think part of the problem is that one person wrote the procedure for Spellcasting while a different person wrote the procedure for Alchemy. The former (and more precise) rules were written well after the latter.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-22-13/2258:05>
Thank you Aaron! You cleared up a lot of stuff. Not happy with 7 but meh... I'll live.

Hrm... This makes a classical hacking Technomancer less viable due to fewer dice, re-emphasizing a "combat Technomancer" and emphasis on using their abilities. Its... a hard blow... but, I suppose, not an unwarranted one. On the upside(?), the Technomancer + Decker combo reigns supreme. Musing for another thread at another time.

Forgive my curiosity, but how do you figure technomancers have fewer dice? They get the same attribute and skill options as deckers get. And it's possible for a technomancer to start with 6 5 5 5 for Matrix attributes, while a decker is generally limited to 5 4 4 2. What am I missing?

Quote
1) Can a Living Persona connect to an archive or device in a LAN or otherwise off the Matrix through a Data Tap that is set to Wireless?

If I understand your question (i.e. target to tap to technomancer), then yes.

Quote
2) Security Spyder Jones has a Cyberdeck that he uses, but is "Owned" by his company--something that is hinted at as being the norm. Jones has three marks on his device and permission to use it freely in his line of work, and is currently using it. Can a Technomancer use Puppeteer on Jones' Cyberdeck to perform the Invite Mark or other Owner-only actions (Full Matrix Defense, Invite Mark, Jack In, Jack Out, Jam Signals, Switch Interface Mode)? If so, does Jones spend his action doing them or does the "Owner," who may not even be otherwise present in Matrix Combat?
No, because the cyberdeck isn't a separate icon while Jones is using it, it's his persona. Jones can invite a mark on his persona (because it's his), but not the deck icon (because it's not his). As to whether or not Jones spends his own action doing pushed Matrix actions, that's in the complex form description.

Quote
3) In the case of Invite Mark, who between the Technomancer, the Owner, and Mr. Jones (the user) can take back or modify the invitation? Assuming no other indicators, are Mr. Jones or the Owner aware enough of the action to do so?
That'd be the owner of whatever did the inviting. There's nothing erasing the memory of whoever did the inviting, so they're aware of the invitation.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: FastJack on <08-22-13/2319:04>
So, on how much essence you need to survive: 1+. You always round down with essence, so as soon as you have 1 essence and you lose even 0.1 essence more, that's it, you're done. You count as having 0 essence and are now dead.
That must be new. There are plenty of characters rocking less than 1 essence out there. Care to link?
I'd like to see that link as well, since that means the Street Samurai character in the book is dead.

You don't round down Essence for anything. Every fraction of a point of Essence will drop your Magic and Resonance abilities a full point. But even with the Social limit, you round Essence UP to calculate the limit.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Raiden on <08-22-13/2321:32>
Hackers can have 5+ stats in log,int, and will easily even on art. C. Also an adept hacker at magic D can get 23 dice without VR bonus out of char gen.  With a limit of 7-7-6-5 I think.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: firebug on <08-22-13/2327:59>
No, because the cyberdeck isn't a separate icon while Jones is using it, it's his persona. Jones can invite a mark on his persona (because it's his), but not the deck icon (because it's not his). As to whether or not Jones spends his own action doing pushed Matrix actions, that's in the complex form description.

Hmm, the fact that a commlink/deck/whatever isn't available as a device or icon when it is a persona is a pretty big deal.  For one, relating to Technomancers again, it means you couldn't have the whole "Machine Sprite using Diagnostics for a bonus to everything Matrix" on a deck because as soon as it was used, it becomes a Persona and isn't a valid target.

Forgive my curiosity, but how do you figure technomancers have fewer dice? They get the same attribute and skill options as deckers get. And it's possible for a technomancer to start with 6 5 5 5 for Matrix attributes, while a decker is generally limited to 5 4 4 2. What am I missing?

The issue with TMs having lower dice pools is that, it seems, Resonance doesn't really do shit for you.  Complex Forms are already weighed against just basic Programs and other stuff a deck can do, and not being a TM means having a free spot for your E Priority and the ability to use things like Cerebral Boosters without a power-reducing drawback.  With cyberware and buying a good deck, a decker can have better limits and attributes.  I dunno about you, but with Attributes B I couldn't afford a 5 or 6 in all my mentals, seeing as I already had 1 STR and didn't want to have to reduce my REA, AGI and BOD below 3 just to have limits comprable to those you can buy with money.  Deckers don't need Charisma at all, as well, allowing them more flexibility with their attributes.  Even Intuition isn't as needed because only what, two actions use it for the dice pool, if you're in VR you're already getting +3d6 initiative dice, and it isn't related to your Sleaze cap.

With an automatic Resonance/Magic Priority of E, that's probably going to be a D in Metatype (meaning either 2 more Edge or being an elf), C or B in Skills or Attributes, and A in Resources.  Spending half of that on a deck to get 6/5/5/3 is an easy choice, with the ability to spend another 250,000 or so nuyen on things like cybernetics, drones, vehicles, etc.  With their attributes, they can ignore Charisma, only need moderate Intuition, and can thus jack up Logic and Willpower, then buy a Cerebral Booster to have higher Logic than a TM should ever be capable of.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <08-22-13/2356:40>
Forgive my curiosity, but how do you figure technomancers have fewer dice? They get the same attribute and skill options as deckers get. And it's possible for a technomancer to start with 6 5 5 5 for Matrix attributes, while a decker is generally limited to 5 4 4 2. What am I missing?

The general argument is that hackers can more easily get higher skill and attribute priorities (while not needing to allocate as many attributes or skills), and can combine that with the ability to directly augment their most important attribute.  And seeing as Matrix Attributes don't give you any dice...

That, and they're not going to be running on the CM penalties that technomancers will be.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-23-13/0134:22>
So, on how much essence you need to survive: 1+. You always round down with essence, so as soon as you have 1 essence and you lose even 0.1 essence more, that's it, you're done. You count as having 0 essence and are now dead.
That must be new. There are plenty of characters rocking less than 1 essence out there. Care to link?
I'd like to see that link as well, since that means the Street Samurai character in the book is dead.
That sounds like a Shiamalan-like plot twist, actually: "Your street samurai has been dead all along".
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DigitalZombie on <08-23-13/0318:12>
...But does that mean according to Aaron that I can diagnose my katana and gain several bonus dices to attack?? ... that doesnt seem right. And those muscle replacements are still wireless cabable devices, so they should also work.... I think I will houserule, that one cant do that.

This thread did raise a whole new questionfor me though.
I cant run diagnostics on my commlink or deck when Im using it (as the device gets merged with my persona) but I can still run diagnostics on them if I were to repair them, seems fair enough. BUT what happens if I slave the deck to my commlink? (for the good old classical firewall master stat, leaving the cyberdeck with its 3 highest ratings on attack, sleaze and response)
Is it A) I can only use one persona at a time, and therefore NOT use the cyberdeck at all, I would have to switch persona (and loosing the commlinks superior firewall ,if I wanted to hack) and not be able to gain diagnostic power on my comm\deck
or B) The commlink is my persona, and therefore cant be diagnosed. The deck is a slaved device to my commlink (gaining its firewall) and therefore shows up as a device, making it elligible for the diagnostic anyway, And I can still use it to hack with, as its a slaved device.?

B) seems like it just totally ignored the limitation put on by diagnostics, making a technomancer backed decker nasty (and using shenanigans like the commlinks superior and cheaper firewall)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-23-13/0324:29>
...But does that mean according to Aaron that I can diagnose my katana and gain several bonus dices to attack?? ... that doesnt seem right. And those muscle replacements are still wireless cabable devices, so they should also work.... I think I will houserule, that one cant do that.
I wasn't aware katanas were electronic devices with device ratings. Page 228 certainly says they can't be bricked, which at the very least heavily implies a non-electronic nature.

B) seems like it just totally ignored the limitation put on by diagnostics, making a technomancer backed decker nasty (and using shenanigans like the commlinks superior and cheaper firewall)
Cleaner and Static Veil already make a technomancer-backed decker pretty sweet, actually.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-23-13/0456:16>
You are no longer awakened if your max magic reach 0.
You can not cast spells etc if your Magic Rating reach 0, but you can still increase your magic rating with Karma to cast spells again as long as your max magic rating is 1+

if your max magic ever reach 0 then you become mundane forever.

book reference p.278:
Quote
If your Magic is reduced to zero, you can no longer use any skill requiring the Magic attribute, even if your maximum Rating is still greater than zero (but you can still raise the attribute with Karma and then get back to the spellslinging). If your maximum rating falls to zero, you’ve burned out, losing all magical abilities, including astral perception and projection. You are mundane forever. Burnedout magicians retain all magical skills and knowledge, but they lack the ability to use them. All Magical active skills except for Arcana become Knowledge skills.

Having max magic 6 and magic rating 3 after step 2 (special attributes from metatype) and step 3 (magic priority) of character creation and then drop to max magic 3 and magic rating 0 due to essence loss in step 6 (spending resources) and then finally increasing your magic rating from 0 to 3 (with a max magic rating of 3) at step 7 spending your left over karma (in this case 30 Karma).
- Is perfectly legal and supported by the book (book reference p.65-98 Creating a Shadowrunner)




There is actually no rule in SR5 that state what happens if you reach 0 essence. In previous editions you would die or turn into a mindless cyberzombie NPC if you ever reached essence 0.00 (maybe the startup rules state what happens...? this was the case for what happens when you fill your condition monitor - also not explicit described in SR5 core). Edit. Shadowrun Fifth Edition Quick-Start Rules does not mention a lower essence limit either. Ill add it to Errata.


The only SR5 book reference is that a critter that use Essence Drain will kill you if you reach 0 (and at this point he might infect you if he got that power as well). p.397 Essence Drain Critter Power.

Even if I can't confirm RAW for this I think it is safe to assume that RAI is that you die at 0.00 essence, not at 0.99 essence.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DigitalZombie on <08-23-13/0503:51>
After rereading some sections in the book, you are ofcourse correct ZeConster.
The katana is not an electronic device, but it has an inbuilt computer; that takes care of informing you when its in need of a rub down with an oilcloth (with oil produced by its own manufactors ofcourse), when it needs sharpening, general stress built up, storing your favorite anime series, registration numbers for your legal or fake permit and contact and adress information on its manufactors, a weapon ARO in AR and lastly where you can buy a matching wakasashi.  Bricking that computer wouldnt do squat to the lethality of the sword, but I guess using the sprites diagnostic would help you maintain\repair it.
(but bricking its computer makes its completely invisible in the matrix)

But if one where to ramp up the engine in the vibro sword, it could get really nasty
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-23-13/0535:37>
Q Can you have a negative essence in SR5?
and a follow up on that
Q What happens when you reach 0 essence in SR5?


The SR5 rule book does not answer this as far as I can see.


In previous editions you died or turned into a cyberzombie if you reached 0.00 essence.
I guess RAI is the same for SR5....
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-23-13/0548:03>
Q Can you have a negative essence in SR5?
and a follow up on that
Q What happens when you reach 0 essence in SR5?


The SR5 rule book does not answer this as far as I can see.


In previous editions you died or turned into a cyberzombie if you reached 0.00 essence.
I guess RAI is the same for SR5....
It's currently described only in the Essence Drain power (if your Essence is drained to 0, you die) on page 397 and in the Essence Loss critter weakness (once their Essence is reduced to 0, they die in Body + Willpower days unless they replenish it) on page 401, but it should definitely be put on page 52 as well.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-23-13/0554:04>
Having max magic 6 and magic rating 3 after step 2 (special attributes from metatype) and step 3 (magic priority) of character creation and then drop to max magic 3 and magic rating 0 due to essence loss in step 6 (spending resources) and then finally increasing your magic rating from 0 to 3 (with a max magic rating of 3) at step 7 spending your left over karma (in this case 30 Karma).
- Is perfectly legal and supported by the book (book reference p.65-98 Creating a Shadowrunner)
Did we ever get a response on "does your current Magic level or the pre-essence-based-loss Magic level determine how much Karma you need to spend to raise your Magic"? Because your interpretation seems like it opens the door to taking Magic 2 as an Adept, then taking 3.01-4.00 Essence worth of 'ware (reducing Magic to 0 (actually -2?) and max Magic to 2) and then spending 15 Karma to raise it back to 2 in Step 7.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <08-23-13/0607:28>
The difference between the rules on page 250 and 287 where Resonance ever reaching zero causes burnout of technomancer abilities and Max Magic reaching zero causes burnout of magical abilities does propmpt me to ask if this was intended. p250 also does not seem to take in to account the possibility of having exceptional Resonance attribute positive quality ether.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-23-13/0612:26>
You spend karma at step 7 so from that aspect it should be ok. But I doubt it would be OK with negative magic rating at any step of chargen.

No, I never got an official response.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-23-13/0802:13>
Set data bomb p.242
(complex Action)
Marks Required: 1
Test: Software + Logic [Sleaze] v. (Device Rating x 2)

There is a ( ) around Device Rating x 2


Q Should we read this as when you set a bomb on a file that is located in your own cyberdeck it will not try to resist you?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Unahim on <08-23-13/0841:15>
1. Anything with a Device Rating.
2. I don't see any other way to do so, so yes.
3. How does a sprite get a direct neural interface?
4. Sprites use their powers through the wireless Matrix, so no.
5. Neither a living persona nor another sprite is a device (as defined on p. 219), so no.
6. a and b, and possibly some instances of c.
7. No, because you can't use trodes or a satellite uplink on your living persona. You're either using your Resonance abilities or you're not.

Based on your answers, people are now trying to rule that Machine Sprites can be used on Muscle Replacement to get the bonus to any strength/agility roll, Skillwires to get the bonus to Software, Skilljacks, and pretty much every single diceroll in the entire game.

Please tell me that was an unforeseen consequence, and that Machine Sprites are not supposed to use Diagnostics on everyone from the melee street samurai to the Decker's skillwires?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Unahim on <08-23-13/0856:55>
Seems I'm still struggling around with old concepts here.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DigitalZombie on <08-23-13/0907:34>
What attribute does a jumpedin rigger use when cutting down nosy corp kids with his ares duelist? is it logic+blades or agility+blades? what about other physical linked skills like palming?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-23-13/0947:39>
... taking Magic 2 as an Adept, then taking 3.01-4.00 Essence worth of 'ware (reducing Magic to 0 (actually -2?) and max Magic to 2) and then spending 15 Karma to raise it back to 2 in Step 7.
Actually, this is probably OK after all.
I no longer see why it should be illegal to install cyberwear if you have 0 magic rating and 3 max magic. Your magic rating will stay at null... and as long as you have max magic 1+ you can always increase it with karma.

You will lose all your power points and adept powers, but you get new power points you can use for other adept powers once you raise your magic rating with Karma.

Note that this only work if you plan on leaving chargen with a very low magic rating (max 3 i guess). A very powerful advantage of going [physical] adept is that you can start with improved reflex 3 (or improved reflexes 2 and a focus 4 qi focus with improved reflexes to give you 3) - but this require that you to leave chargen with magic rating 4+

Also note that special attribute points from metatype are wasted if you allocate them to magic rating if you plan on doing this. You can still place them in Edge (or you might pick an even lower metatype priority that have less special attribute points to allocate).

...and you probably need to prioritize resources a lot higher than the average [physical] adept since cyberwear is pretty expansive (and you will need your leftover karma to increase your magic rating rather than converting them to resources).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-23-13/0959:17>
Note that this only work if you plan on leaving chargen with a very low magic rating (max 3 i guess). A very powerful advantage of going [physical] adept is that you can start with improved reflex 3 (or improved reflexes 2 and a focus 4 qi focus with improved reflexes to give you 3) - but this require that you to leave chargen with magic rating 4+

Also note that special attribute points from metatype are wasted if you allocate them to magic rating if you plan on doing this. You can still place them in Edge (or you might pick an even lower metatype priority that have less special attribute points to allocate).
Actually, I was thinking more along the lines of EBDCA or EADCB, using 'ware to get the extra IPs (since you can burn through up to 4 Essence, Wired Reflexes 2 is a possibility, and with 275k or 450k in Resources, so is Synaptic Booster 2), buying Magic up to 2 in Step Seven, using 1.5 PP for Improved Ability 3 and having 0.5 PP left. Then once you improve that skill to a natural Level 9 for 14+16+18 = 48 Karma, you can Initiate for 13 Karma for the Metamagic PP, spend it on 2 levels of Improved Ability, and have an effective skill rating of 14.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-23-13/1016:25>
Except that the Adept version of Improved Reflexes is vastly cheaper and more available than the Sam version. If going augmented Adept makes sense it is almost certainly for Muscle Replacement/Toner or Aug or Bone Lacing/Density Augmentation.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-23-13/1024:39>
For a regular Augmented Adept, yes: not so much for a buy-Magic-up-from-0-in-Step-Seven Adept.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-23-13/1028:58>
The implication of the chargen section is that order of operations is not as strict as that for the chargern process. See the example of the character exceptional attribute who raises his stat to 7 in the attribute buying phase even though by Order of Operations that would happen before the quality existed (The strict OO reading would require the character to buy the attribute from 6 to 7 with Karma).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-23-13/1035:06>
I know the steps are fluid, and I have argued so in the past, but I'm pretty sure Step Seven is at the end: otherwise, people could spend 2 Karma to buy a skill at level 1, then use Skill Points to raise that skill to 6.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-23-13/1202:13>
Forgive my curiosity, but how do you figure technomancers have fewer dice? They get the same attribute and skill options as deckers get. And it's possible for a technomancer to start with 6 5 5 5 for Matrix attributes, while a decker is generally limited to 5 4 4 2. What am I missing?

The general argument is that hackers can more easily get higher skill and attribute priorities (while not needing to allocate as many attributes or skills), and can combine that with the ability to directly augment their most important attribute.  And seeing as Matrix Attributes don't give you any dice...

That, and they're not going to be running on the CM penalties that technomancers will be.

That's an interesting argument. What about the idea that deckers need their Resources priority to contend with while technomancers have their Resonance priority?

...But does that mean according to Aaron that I can diagnose my katana and gain several bonus dices to attack?? ... that doesnt seem right. And those muscle replacements are still wireless cabable devices, so they should also work.... I think I will houserule, that one cant do that.

This thread did raise a whole new questionfor me though.
I cant run diagnostics on my commlink or deck when Im using it (as the device gets merged with my persona) but I can still run diagnostics on them if I were to repair them, seems fair enough. BUT what happens if I slave the deck to my commlink? (for the good old classical firewall master stat, leaving the cyberdeck with its 3 highest ratings on attack, sleaze and response)
Is it A) I can only use one persona at a time, and therefore NOT use the cyberdeck at all, I would have to switch persona (and loosing the commlinks superior firewall ,if I wanted to hack) and not be able to gain diagnostic power on my comm\deck
or B) The commlink is my persona, and therefore cant be diagnosed. The deck is a slaved device to my commlink (gaining its firewall) and therefore shows up as a device, making it elligible for the diagnostic anyway, And I can still use it to hack with, as its a slaved device.?

B) seems like it just totally ignored the limitation put on by diagnostics, making a technomancer backed decker nasty (and using shenanigans like the commlinks superior and cheaper firewall)

You can only use one persona at a time, that's one thing. Also, slaving doesn't create some Frankenstein's Deck, it just lets you borrow ratings for defense, so the deck is still a deck and the commlink is still a commlink and they're both separate devices.

After rereading some sections in the book, you are ofcourse correct ZeConster.
The katana is not an electronic device, but it has an inbuilt computer; that takes care of informing you when its in need of a rub down with an oilcloth (with oil produced by its own manufactors ofcourse), when it needs sharpening, general stress built up, storing your favorite anime series, registration numbers for your legal or fake permit and contact and adress information on its manufactors, a weapon ARO in AR and lastly where you can buy a matching wakasashi.  Bricking that computer wouldnt do squat to the lethality of the sword, but I guess using the sprites diagnostic would help you maintain\repair it.
(but bricking its computer makes its completely invisible in the matrix)

But if one where to ramp up the engine in the vibro sword, it could get really nasty

If that katana has a built-in accelerometer, location system, etc. one could argue that a machine sprite could help use it by superimposing helpful data on an AR display. Think the old Star Wars Trilogy Arcade game, in the fights against Boba Fett and Darth Vader.

Q Can you have a negative essence in SR5?
and a follow up on that
Q What happens when you reach 0 essence in SR5?


The SR5 rule book does not answer this as far as I can see.


In previous editions you died or turned into a cyberzombie if you reached 0.00 essence.
I guess RAI is the same for SR5....

While it is described in Essence Drain that you die at Essence 0, the description of Essence in the Concepts chapter describes it as a "cap," which suggests you can get to zero safely. I'll run this by The Powers That Be for clarification, but I'm confident that Essence 0 = dead runner.

Set data bomb p.242
(complex Action)
Marks Required: 1
Test: Software + Logic [Sleaze] v. (Device Rating x 2)

There is a ( ) around Device Rating x 2


Q Should we read this as when you set a bomb on a file that is located in your own cyberdeck it will not try to resist you?

Generally speaking, the target's owner can choose not to defend against a Matrix action.

Based on your answers, people are now trying to rule that Machine Sprites can be used on Muscle Replacement to get the bonus to any strength/agility roll, Skillwires to get the bonus to Software, Skilljacks, and pretty much every single diceroll in the entire game.

Please tell me that was an unforeseen consequence, and that Machine Sprites are not supposed to use Diagnostics on everyone from the melee street samurai to the Decker's skillwires?

I could tell you that, but that wouldn't make it so. If it helps, a device that can be aided by a machine sprite can also be bricked.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-23-13/1207:40>
What attribute does a jumpedin rigger use when cutting down nosy corp kids with his ares duelist? is it logic+blades or agility+blades? what about other physical linked skills like palming?

Blades + Agility for cutting down noisy corp kids, Palming + Agility for masterful acts of legerdemain.

Anticipating your next question, meat or drone it's all coming from the same motor cortex and brain stem. =i)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-23-13/1212:15>
What attribute does a jumpedin rigger use when cutting down nosy corp kids with his ares duelist? is it logic+blades or agility+blades? what about other physical linked skills like palming?

Blades + Agility for cutting down noisy corp kids, Palming + Agility for masterful acts of legerdemain.

Anticipating your next question, meat or drone it's all coming from the same motor cortex and brain stem. =i)

How does that mesh with the rules for remote gunnery which (in all but one place) specify logic + gunnery for remote firing?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MrPendragon on <08-23-13/1409:36>
On page 52 is says “Each character starts with an Essence rating of 6, and it acts as a cap on the amount of alterations you can adopt. When it’s gone, it doesn’t come back.”

My question is if you start with Cyberware giving you a -5 to your essence if you later upgrade your Cyberware to deltaware would you get back some of your essence or are you just never able to get anymore or better cyberware?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-23-13/1414:19>
I think Essence Holes (which can be filled with new 'ware) are in the errata.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SoulGambit on <08-23-13/1424:39>
Aaron,

Phew. Data Tap was in the important thing, that means Technomancers can play with the big boys. The Persona / Icon split is interesting, and something I was not aware of. This also implies that a Persona must always use its own stats when defending except when part of a PAN, which clears up another bit of dissonance I was having.

Regarding dicepools, you're missing a few things. That said, before diving into this, I want to make things clear--I'm comparing a Living Persona hacking something in a mundane fashion to a Decker hacking something in a mundane fashion. Technomancers have Resonance Abilities on top of that, and I'll discuss that at the end.

First, a Decker can slave their Deck to their 5k Commlink and then put that 2 into Firewall. This immediately means their stats are effectively 6 5 4 4. Then stack programs on top of that to increase your stat, or Fork, or what-have-you. The best programs really vary by mission. On top of that, 'ware Deckers have one to three points of Noise Reduction and +2 Logic. The Decker is also more freedom to purchase the Codeslinger quality / specialties, and if they choose to go balls out speccing for Matrix they can get an even better deck--setting their stats above the Living Persona's. On top of that, they have easier access to Wired Reflexes / Reflex Enhancers, which means they have a better initiative in AR mode (arguably the mode you want to be in most often). Going forward, the Decker nabs better Decks with better stats with Nuyen and increases their key skill (likely Hacking) up to 12.

Meanwhile, the Technomancer has absolutely everything competing for their attention. Your example of 6 5 5 5 for stats is only tenable at Priority A. Since we need tons of skills to function as a Hacker, we need Skills at Priority B. That gives us Magic C, Metatype D (Human, everything going into +Resonance) and Nuyen E. That's actually what I'd consider to be the "average" Technomancer--the example in the book is pretty close to this. Grab a 6 in the relevant Skills (7 Skills, to the Hacker's 4 or 5). Technomancers are actually fantastic at defense because of Infusion of [Willpower / Sleaze], but they want Focused Concentration 5 or 6 to run it reliably (they're also choosing to protect themselves -or- their team's devices, no both).  We'll need 5~10 Karma in Nuyen on top of that just to be a contributing member of (Shadowrun) Society. We're hyper-Matrix focused, so lets nab Codeslinger on top of that for 44 Karma in qualities, leaving 6 to spend on Complex Forms, Sprites, and fleshing out the character. And... done.

2 Edge compared to the Decker's 5; 16 Dice compared to the Decker's 18; 8+1d6 AR (10+1d6 with enough dumpstats) Initiative to the Decker's 9+2d6 (or 14+2d6 if they really care); 10+3d6 VR Initiative vs the Decker's 9+3d6; 0 Noise Reduction to the Decker's 1 to 3; No DNI vs the Decker's DNI; No Satellite Uplink vs the Decker's Satellite Uplink; 6 5 5 5 Matrix stats vs the Decker's 6 5 4 4; No Programs vs Decker's Programs; Wound Penalties in a pure Matrix situation vs the Decker's no Wound Penalties in a pure Matrix situation. Going forward the Technomancer has a choice between getting Resonance stuff, Programs through Submerging, and increasing their key skill, meaning they are more likely to fall behind.

It's not really one thing. Its just that the Technomancer feels just mildly subpar and have fewer options in every area except Infusion of [Firewall / Sleaze]. The real turn of the blade, though? That's a Combat Decker. That Decker is going to be useful in situations outside of the Matrix, while the Technomancer is almost completely focused. A focused Decker could go Nuyen A, Attributes B, Skills C, Metatype D, Magic E if they want to focus even more (and even then they wind up more versatile than the Technomancer). A Chrome Adept Decker can go Attributes A, Magic B, Nuyen C and then split D and E between their Metatype and Skills (picking up the slack with Adept) and outdo either the presented Technomancer or the Combat Decker.

Now, Technomancers do have Resonance powers. But that circles back to my previous statement that the game discourages a classical Hacking Technomancer over one who just sends Sprites out while supporting with the occasional Complex Form. Its fewer Skills, you and drop Logic and Charisma down to 3 each, freeing up Priority A, and ultimately your Sprites are going to do a better job than you anyways.

All of that said, I hadn't realized Machine Sprites work on Skillwires when I made my previous post. Skillwires bring a classical hacking Technomancer back up to snuff at the cost of being mutually exclusive with spending Edge (a huge blow... but you -do- have Sprites). So... Skillwires fix to the rescue?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SoulGambit on <08-23-13/1428:52>
Question: Can I take a Device Rating 6 Commlink, run a cable to some of my ware / devices, an then use the Commlink as a router in o rder to protect from Jammers shutting off my wireless bonuses?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-23-13/1431:19>
First, a Decker can slave their Deck to their 5k Commlink and then put that 2 into Firewall.
This let you use 6 for firewall when defending.
You still only have a [Firewall] limit of 2 when you for example try to disarm a data bomb or jack out.

Question: Can I take a Device Rating 6 Commlink, run a cable to some of my ware / devices, an then use the Commlink as a router in o rder to protect from Jammers shutting off my wireless bonuses?
To keep your wireless bonus, no.
(While yes - you still have access to the Matrix; No - Your device is no longer wireless, it is wired)

To give more protection against jammers, yes
(riggers often connect their remote control device to their RCC with a direct universal access connector cable to avoid noise)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SoulGambit on <08-23-13/1448:43>
Defending  is 90% of your uses for Firewall. If you need to perform either of those actions you can swap in your 5. Deckers have their best rating in whatever they are rolling right now. Also, the Technomancer's 6 is in Data Processing unless they want to eat -1 to Matrix Actions relative to the Decker, meaning that 5 is equal to what the Technomancer has.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: samoth on <08-23-13/1612:00>
How does a Sleep Regulator work with someone who has the Insomnia negative quality?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-23-13/1618:01>
How does that mesh with the rules for remote gunnery which (in all but one place) specify logic + gunnery for remote firing?

It doesn't, but I think that's a typo. Sensor targeting uses Logic, remote targeting uses the normal attribute and skill like every other remote operation.

Question: Can I take a Device Rating 6 Commlink, run a cable to some of my ware / devices, an then use the Commlink as a router in o rder to protect from Jammers shutting off my wireless bonuses?

No. Each device is considered separately in the core rules. A data cable only allows one device (or persona running on that device) to ignore noise modifiers when targeting the other device.

How does a Sleep Regulator work with someone who has the Insomnia negative quality?

The Insomnia quality is about healing Stun boxes through rest, and the sleep regulator explicitly doesn't affect healing. In other words, you get to have crappy sleep whenever you want it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-23-13/1628:56>

It doesn't, but I think that's a typo. Sensor targeting uses Logic, remote targeting uses the normal attribute and skill like every other remote operation.

How exactly do you do drone targeting without sensors?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-23-13/1649:09>
At what point during the character creation process do you adjust your Essence (thereby losing Magic/Resonance and max Magic/Resonance as well)? Is it, say, possible to start with 2 Magic, lose 4 due to Essence Loss bought in Step Six, then use 5 Karma during Step Seven to raise your Magic back to 1 (as Magic users can still raise their Magic through Karma as long as their maximum Magic isn't 0), thereby essentially getting 2 of the Magic points lost to Essence loss for "free"? If not, would it be possible if you wait until character advancement to buy up your Magic?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Veggiesama on <08-23-13/2001:31>
How does that mesh with the rules for remote gunnery which (in all but one place) specify logic + gunnery for remote firing?

It doesn't, but I think that's a typo. Sensor targeting uses Logic, remote targeting uses the normal attribute and skill like every other remote operation.
I have to object to this. First, remote control is different from rigger control. Remote control is described as a video game, while rigger control is direct neural interface. Jumped-in riggers use Intuition for Sneaking rolls, not Agility.

Second, Riggers are already relying on Reaction, Willpower, Intuition, and Logic for doing everything else, plus they actually have to possess the necessary skills. Why add Agility to the list? At this point, what benefit exactly does a rigger get from rigging, as opposed to just walking out there and doing it himself?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: FastJack on <08-23-13/2105:26>
Please ask questions in the FAQ thread. This thread is reserved for stated clarifications only.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <08-24-13/0137:02>
If that katana has a built-in accelerometer, location system, etc. one could argue that a machine sprite could help use it by superimposing helpful data on an AR display. Think the old Star Wars Trilogy Arcade game, in the fights against Boba Fett and Darth Vader.


Oooooooo! Can we have that, please?! Combine that with Move by Wire, even?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <08-24-13/0631:10>
RePosted from [SR5] Rules Clarifications:
The difference between the rules on page 250 and 287 where Resonance ever reaching zero causes burnout of technomancer abilities and Max Magic reaching zero causes burnout of magical abilities does prompt me to ask if this was intended. p250 also does not seem to take in to account the possibility of having exceptional Resonance attribute positive quality ether.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-24-13/0718:49>
...also does not seem to take in to account the possibility of having exceptional Resonance attribute positive quality ether.
Your natural Resonance maximum is your Essence rounded down.
Whenever you lose Essence (post chargen) you lose an eq
Your natural Resonance maximum is increased by one for each Submersion grade.
Exceptional attribute let you raise your attribute above your natural maximum.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-24-13/0726:33>
RePosted from [SR5] Rules Clarifications:
The difference between the rules on page 250 and 287 where Resonance ever reaching zero causes burnout of technomancer abilities and Max Magic reaching zero causes burnout of magical abilities does prompt me to ask if this was intended.
p.250 state that you lose your "Technomancer quality" if your resonance reach zero. In SR5 Technomancer is no longer a quality, so this part need an errata in any case.

...also does not seem to take in to account the possibility of having exceptional Resonance attribute positive quality ether.
Not sure I understand what you are hinting at here. Can you explain?

Your natural Resonance maximum is your Essence rounded down.
Your natural Resonance maximum is increased by one for each Submersion grade.
Exceptional attribute let you raise your attribute above your natural attribute maximum.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <08-24-13/0752:35>
RePosted from [SR5] Rules Clarifications:
The difference between the rules on page 250 and 287 where Resonance ever reaching zero causes burnout of technomancer abilities and Max Magic reaching zero causes burnout of magical abilities does prompt me to ask if this was intended.
p.250 state that you lose your "Technomancer quality" if your resonance reach zero. In SR5 Technomancer is no longer a quality, so this part need an errata in any case.

...also does not seem to take in to account the possibility of having exceptional Resonance attribute positive quality ether.
Not sure I understand what you are hinting at here. Can you explain?
I read Exceptional Attribute as raising the natural maximum for an attribute by one.
p287 talks about only ceasing to be an awakened character if your max reaches zero.
p250 does not seem to consider that the natural max for your Resonance could be above your essence.
When I was last playing Shadowrun (before 5th edition) I was using second edition where the magic stat started equal to your essence and could only go down from there (until they introduce initiation) .
p250 was reading more like how special attributes worked in second edition than how they where working in the rest of the book.
So I was wondering if that section on page 250 was out of date and needed errata. (Xenon has spotted another pointer to this)
(my poor health is effecting my writing)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-24-13/0802:57>
It let you exceed natural maximum. On phone atm.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-24-13/1010:17>
How exactly do you do drone targeting without sensors?

Didn't say you didn't, but there's a difference between using sensors to target and using sensor targeting (p. 184).

At what point during the character creation process do you adjust your Essence (thereby losing Magic/Resonance and max Magic/Resonance as well)? Is it, say, possible to start with 2 Magic, lose 4 due to Essence Loss bought in Step Six, then use 5 Karma during Step Seven to raise your Magic back to 1 (as Magic users can still raise their Magic through Karma as long as their maximum Magic isn't 0), thereby essentially getting 2 of the Magic points lost to Essence loss for "free"? If not, would it be possible if you wait until character advancement to buy up your Magic?

That's a very good question. I think you can do it the way you describe. Even if you couldn't, you can still raise it during character advancement as long as you still have a maximum Magic rating better than zero.

And yes, this does seem to be a difference between Magic and Resonance. The two are, after all, different to the point of being mutually exclusive.

I have to object to this. First, remote control is different from rigger control. Remote control is described as a video game, while rigger control is direct neural interface. Jumped-in riggers use Intuition for Sneaking rolls, not Agility.

That is correct. Also, forgive me for pointing out that a specific rule doesn't always indicate a general one.

Quote
Second, Riggers are already relying on Reaction, Willpower, Intuition, and Logic for doing everything else, plus they actually have to possess the necessary skills. Why add Agility to the list? At this point, what benefit exactly does a rigger get from rigging, as opposed to just walking out there and doing it himself?

If it helps, you can always use sensor targeting (p. 184) to do your shooting, which uses Logic instead of Agility. You never actually have to fire a shot with Agility if you don't care to do so.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-24-13/2030:28>
Does the Exceptional Attribute Quality raise your natural maximum for said attribute by 1, or does it only allow you to raise your natural attribute 1 beyond it, while not actually increasing your natural maximum? (This matters for burning out on Magic, and cyberlimbs.)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Raiden on <08-24-13/2036:19>
natural max- 1/6 with exp. attribute- 1/7. only lets you raise it one extra. meta-genetic improvement from SR4 does what you are talking about.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-24-13/2043:54>
Actually, in SR4A, Exceptional Attribute explicitly states it increases your natural maximum for 1 attribute by 1 beyond your metatype's, while SR5 is a bit more vague about it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Raiden on <08-25-13/0045:11>
no, in SR4A, the exp. attribute gives you a natural max of +1. it does not increase your base by 1. if you are a human and take exp. attribute in bod, you now have 1/7 instead of 1/6.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Medicineman on <08-25-13/0142:30>
its Metagenetic improvement (Surge) that raises Minimum and maximum attribute directly
both Genetic improvement ( counts as Bioware)as well as exceptional Attribute(pos qual.) only raises the Max of an attribute without increasing it directly

with a direct Dance
Medicineman
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <08-25-13/0244:54>
its Metagenetic improvement (Surge) that raises Minimum and maximum attribute directly
both Genetic improvement ( counts as Bioware)as well as exceptional Attribute(pos qual.) only raises the Max of an attribute without increasing it directly

with a direct Dance
Medicineman

Neither of which, BTW, are in SR5 yet.
But, I understood the question as being: "Does Exceptional Attribute make your natural Maximum 1 higher, or does it just allow
you to exceed your natural maximum by 1. This is important because Awakened/technomancers burn out when their natural
maximum reaches 0, not if their Magic/Resonance reaches 0. "
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-25-13/0252:57>
I read Exceptional Attribute as raising the natural maximum for an attribute by one.
Sorry I was on mobile phone when answering this specific claim yesterday. As many things in this book it is ambiguous and you can find arguments to read it both ways. Here are some arguments that support the idea that your natural maximum attribute does not change when you take exceptional attribute.


p.72 Exceptional Attribute
Quote
Exceptional Attribute
Cost: 14 Karma
The Exceptional Atribute quality is how you get to be the charismatic troll, or the agile dwarf. It allows you to possess one attribute at a level one point above the metatype maximum limit. For example, an ork character with the Exceptional Attribute quality for Strength could take his Strength attribute up to 10 before augmentations are applied, instead of the normal limit of 9. Exceptional Attribute also applies toward Special Attributes such as Magic and Resonance. Edge cannot affected by the Exceptional Attribute (Edge is raised by another quality called Lucky). A character may only take Exceptional Attribute once, and only with the gamemaster’s approval.

p.65 Metatype & Special Attributes
Quote
Several metatypes also receive physical or mental advantages/disadvantages to their attribute ratings (such as higher or lower natural attribute limits).

p.66 Metatype & Special Attributes
Quote
Note that for most metatypes, the maximum rating for Magic, Resonance, and Edge is 6; humans have a maximum Edge rating of 7. Certain qualities (Lucky, Exceptional Attribute) allow characters to exceed attribute maximums by one

p.67 Example Rob that possess Exceptional Strength Attribute
He got a listed Racial Base / Natrual Limit of 5/10(11)
- Indicating that his natural limit is 10, but due to the quality have an exceptional limit of 11 (which let him exceed his natural attribute limit by 1).

p.66 Mental and Physical Attributes
State that you can only have one attribute at your natural maximum limit at chargen; It might or might not mean that you can not have a have a human with agility 6/6(7) and strength 6/6 at chargen even if you have exceptional attribute agility; but it would let you take agility 7/6(7) and strength 5/6.

p.456 Customization of cyberlimbs
State that you can only customize cyberlimbs to fit your frame and body [which might or might not mean your natural rating - not the point I am trying to do right now] but it also state that you can not customize cyberlimbs beyond your natural maximum for that attribute - witch might or might not indicate that you can never customize the limb above metatype racial maximum... even if you have a natural rating that exceed the natural maximum by one point because of exceptional attribute.



But, as I said in the beginning of the post; There are also arguments that exceptional attribute increase your natural maximum.

p287 talks about only ceasing to be an awakened character if your max reaches zero.
On the subject about losing your magic powers forever and ever the text on p.278 (not p.287) does not  even talk about natural maximum nor your metatype maximum attribute rating in the first place. This rule only mention your maximum magic rating. So in this case the question if Exceptional Attribute increase your natural maximum rating or if it let you exceed your natural maximum rating might not even be important at all.

Maximum magic rating might or might not read as the total of your metatype maximum attribute rating plus exceptional magic attribute plus grades of initiation minus loss due to essence [Cyberware Essence cost or the Essence Drain critter power].
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-25-13/0608:00>
If I use Astral Perception:

Q Will a featureless gray shadow of a mundane wall prevent me from sensing a bright and colored emotional aura of an angry or passionate living person standing in the room behind it?

Follow up on that:
Q Can I tell if the aura belong to a living entity 8m away from my body?



If I use Augmented Reality:

Q Will a normal wall without dense foliage or wireless negation prevent me from spotting the wireless commlink and all other wireless devices not currently running silent that a guard has on his body while standing in the middle of the room behind it?

Followup on that:
Q Can I tell if the spotted PAN is located 8m away from my cyberdeck?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: grid_roamer on <08-25-13/0700:19>
In SR5.....

Exceptional Attribute can raise Magic pass the natural limit but you have to buy the point.....

A magic attribute reaching 0 means you have no magic attribute left to use. Unless there is a way to relight a burnout....
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <08-25-13/0812:35>
In SR5.....

Exceptional Attribute can raise Magic pass the natural limit but you have to buy the point.....

A magic attribute reaching 0 means you have no magic attribute left to use. Unless there is a way to relight a burnout....

I think you may be thinking of old concepts.

Shadowrun 5th edition p278
Quote
Magic is a special Attribute that measures a character’s magical power. Characters do not have a Magic Attribute unless they select one of the priorities that specifically provide one (see the Priority Table, p. 65). Magic has a starting value from 1 to 6 (or 7 with the Exceptional Attribute quality), but you don’t have to settle for that limit forever. You can go through a process called Initiation (p. 324) that can enhance your abilities. The maximum value of your Magic Attribute (if you have one) is 6 + your Initiation level. Anything that reduces your Essence also reduces your Magic rating. For every point (or fraction thereof) of Essence lost, both your current Magic Attribute and your maximum Magic Rating are reduced by one. If your Magic is reduced to zero, you can no longer use any skill requiring the Magic attribute, even if your maximum Rating is still greater than zero (but you can still raise the attribute with Karma and then get back to the spellslinging). If your maximum rating falls to zero, you’ve burned out, losing all magical abilities, including astral perception and projection. You are mundane forever. Burnedout magicians retain all magical skills and knowledge, but they lack the ability to use them. All Magical active skills except for Arcana become Knowledge skills.

Unless this has been changed in errata some where?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: grid_roamer on <08-25-13/1824:14>
Nope,

I'm pretty sure it's in the rules......
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: firebug on <08-25-13/1825:38>
I have a new question related to sprites that I'm surprised no one asked yet.

Quote from: page 256
Re-register  Sprite:  You  can  attempt  to  re-register
the sprite for one task. If you use the sprite’s last task to
do this, don’t screw up. If you succeed, add your net hits
to the number of tasks the sprite owes you (minus the
one for re-registering, of course). If you fail, you’re out
of tasks, plain and simple.

The last bit about failing; is this continuing with the warning to be careful if you do this with a sprite's last task?  Or does it mean that if you try to re-register and fail, it removes all remaining tasks no matter how many are left and your sprite disappears?  If the former, it should be worded more clearly because it really sounds like the latter.  If the latter, why would it need the warning about using up your last task (when you have to end up either gaining more or losing them all no matter what) and why would you attempt this with more than 1 left anyways?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-25-13/1830:31>
fenris_mask: the rules bit that T-Hatchet quotes is pretty specific, though - if it's only your Magic that's 0, not your maximum Magic, you can simply raise it to 1 again (which takes 1 week) for 5 Karma, and you're good to go.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: grid_roamer on <08-25-13/1844:14>
fenris_mask: the rules bit that T-Hatchet quotes is pretty specific, though - if it's only your Magic that's 0, not your maximum Magic, you can simply raise it to 1 again (which takes 1 week) for 5 Karma, and you're good to go.

That's Right..... ;D
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Rythymhack on <08-25-13/2037:28>
Mystic Adepts: Is it a legitimate use of improved ability do use say..."improved ability: spellcasting". I thought of this at 3AM while..."communing with the spirits" as it were.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: firebug on <08-25-13/2047:42>
Mystic Adepts: Is it a legitimate use of improved ability do use say..."improved ability: spellcasting". I thought of this at 3AM while..."communing with the spirits" as it were.

Quote
This  power  increases  the  Rating  of  a  specific  Com -
bat, Physical, Social, Technical, or Vehicle skill per level of
the power.

Spellcasting is considered a "Magical" Skill, and so doesn't fall under any of those categories.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Rythymhack on <08-25-13/2114:06>
Ok. I am still waiting on the book and did not remember what it said in previous editions. Thank you.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <08-26-13/0030:01>
If you mount a smartgun on a drone that has a smartlink vision enhancement, does the Drone benefit from the smartlink? If so, does it get the +1 bonus for gear, or the +2 granted from ware?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <08-26-13/0128:41>
That's an interesting argument. What about the idea that deckers need their Resources priority to contend with while technomancers have their Resonance priority?

Well, let's break it down for a second.  A decker needs 3 Attributes (Logic, Intuition, and Willpower), 6 skills, and spends 73% of his possible Resources (the same percentage at A or B priority, based on full Karma expenditure for Nuyen) for his Deck, leaving him with a sizable (and very useful) remainder.  He has 4 priorities to assign, 1 of which is relatively unimportant (alternate metatype selections do very little for him as a decker, too, so his capability as a decker doesn't suffer at all for going Human D).

A technomancer, in comparison, depends on 4 Attributes (Logic, Intuition, Charisma, and Willpower), must allocate a priority for Talent, and requires 8 or 9 skills.  Her Talent priority can bridge the skills gap over, but she gets nothing leftover.  And that's in addition to lacking the ability to directly augment her most used attribute(s), having Matrix damage go to Stun (resulting in a NASTY double hit from Biofeedback), having the eat seriously huge damage to use any of the abilities that were the point of making a technomancer in the first place, major losses both to flexibility and to her ability to protect her team's gear...  And that's not even close to the end of it.

Basically, the hacker comes out with better attributes (including augmented Logic, probably 6 ( 8 )) and better skills, putting him a few dice ahead when both are fresh.  Because the technomancer is going to be filling her Stun and Physical tracks faster, the hackers edge only grows over the course of a run.  This is actually one of several reasons why I've come to suspect that the technomancer section is an afterthought.

Sorry for the delayed response.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DigitalZombie on <08-26-13/0622:19>
@Ryo
If you mount a smartgun on a drone that has a smartlink vision enhancement, does the Drone benefit from the smartlink? If so, does it get the +1 bonus for gear, or the +2 granted from ware?

Id say it works and it gets a plus 1 bonus when wireless.( It cant get a 2 dice bonus, because it cant pay it with essence) BUT! if you read the wireless bonus for smart firing platform page 433 you gain the benefit of an implanted smartlink (+2) if you are in VR. This leads me to beleive that your rigger can infact get a +2 dice bonus from smartlink\gun, if he has it implanted himself, the drone has it and the gun is a smartgun, while jumping in or controlling it from VR as remote control.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-26-13/0704:58>
This leads me to beleive that your rigger can infact get a +2 dice bonus from smartlink\gun, if he has it implanted himself...
If that is a possibility (not saying it it is, it might or it might not - but if it is) then you probably need to target with your own Agility (and your own internal smartlink you payed essence for) rather than take advantage of the drone's sensors (and internal/external smartlink that the drone did not pay essence for) for targeting (which would make you use Logic instead of Agility).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SoulGambit on <08-26-13/0753:29>
Oh! Oh! Oh! Can my Rigger, Technomancer, or Decker take some smart firing platforms, fold up the tripod, strap them to my Troll team-mate's back and fire them from there? If so, screw combat drones. :P
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DigitalZombie on <08-26-13/0754:39>
According to Aaron on the previous page in this thread, you only use logic for gunnery when you either use passive or active sensor targeting. (and with signature penalties that isnt often very advicable). So you would indeed use agility for gunnery (with or without smartlink)

(take the active gunnery example in the book, the rigger is having trouble hitting some mini drones, so he swithces to active targeting to hit them better, but he then gets a whooping minus 6 signature penalty for doing so, my bet is, he is worse off then)

(but frankly the attribute uses in controlled drones confuse me, intuition for sneaking with drones, reaction for sneaking with vehicles and agility for sneaking with both according to a third page, on top of that it seems like the majority of the community thinks gunnery should be with logic, while Aaron states it is indeed with agility and only logic with passive and active targeting)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-26-13/0923:02>
According to Aaron on the previous page in this thread, you only use logic for gunnery when you either use passive or active sensor targeting. (and with signature penalties that isnt often very advicable). So you would indeed use agility for gunnery (with or without smartlink)

(take the active gunnery example in the book, the rigger is having trouble hitting some mini drones, so he swithces to active targeting to hit them better, but he then gets a whooping minus 6 signature penalty for doing so, my bet is, he is worse off then)

(but frankly the attribute uses in controlled drones confuse me, intuition for sneaking with drones, reaction for sneaking with vehicles and agility for sneaking with both according to a third page, on top of that it seems like the majority of the community thinks gunnery should be with logic, while Aaron states it is indeed with agility and only logic with passive and active targeting)

The only support for Aaron's position in the book is the example in the control device matrix action. Remember that, while Aaron is involved in the books and its a Mitzvah that he answers questions, his interpretations aren't official answers.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SoulGambit on <08-26-13/1201:26>
I feel like going to Aaron's expertise and believing what he says except when he disagrees with you is a tad... O_o
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-26-13/1222:45>
I feel like going to Aaron's expertise and believing what he says except when he disagrees with you is a tad... O_o

Which isn't what I'm doing. I'm just noting that as Aaron says he's not making official rulings, just giving his opinion. When his opinion is well supported, like the cyberarm ruling, I'll go with it even if I disagree and go for house rules. When his opinion doesn't have textual support, like his confusing reading of the recoil rules or his belief that the rules on remote targeting will change completely from the text, I don't think it's out of place to note it.

Aaron certainly has more knowledge of what's coming down the pipe than I do, but unless he's indicated that he has knowledge of an official revision or errata, which he hasn't in this case, you should avoid using him for an argument from authority. Or indeed for driveby sniping.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-26-13/1454:37>
Aaron certainly has more knowledge of what's coming down the pipe than I do, but unless he's indicated that he has knowledge of an official revision or errata, which he hasn't in this case, you should avoid using him for an argument from authority. Or indeed for driveby sniping.

This is true. Especially the bit about sniping. I have a terrible Accuracy rating.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <08-26-13/1459:00>
Aaron certainly has more knowledge of what's coming down the pipe than I do, but unless he's indicated that he has knowledge of an official revision or errata, which he hasn't in this case, you should avoid using him for an argument from authority. Or indeed for driveby sniping.

This is true. Especially the bit about sniping. I have a terrible Accuracy rating.
Hold still while I attach this smartgun system.
Whoops, look at all those ones on my Hardware roll.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-26-13/1500:03>
Aaron certainly has more knowledge of what's coming down the pipe than I do, but unless he's indicated that he has knowledge of an official revision or errata, which he hasn't in this case, you should avoid using him for an argument from authority. Or indeed for driveby sniping.

This is true. Especially the bit about sniping. I have a terrible Accuracy rating.
 

:)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-26-13/1808:18>
Look like Control Rigs Headware come with a sim module as standard (which make it act as DNI), but it does not appear to be modded for hot-sim.

Riggers that control several drones often buy a specialized commlink called Remote Command Console or RCC. I can't find any information if the RCC have or even can have a sim module. Or if a RCC with a sim module can be modded for hot-sim.


Q: Can riggers get access to hot-sim with the sim module installed in the remote control or maybe in their RCC?

If so,
how much does it cost and will it affect viability

If not,
can they buy an external commlink with a sim module modded for hot sim and still get the bonus from their rigger control (even though they are not using the sim-module in their rigger control)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-26-13/1818:38>
Linking a device to your DNI

The book mentions "to have a direct neural interface to the linked device", but I can't find any information about how you link a device with your DNI.
For example you need to link your DNI with your smartgun to get bonus dice and eject clip as a free action. You need to link your DNI to grenades with a wireless trigger so you can detonate them with a free action. etc.

So...
How do you do it?
How long time does it take?
What is the max number of devices you can link to your DNI at any given moment?
Do you need to be the owner of the device in order to link it?

Is slaving a device to your commlink (where your sim module is located) the same thing as linking it to your DNI?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: FastJack on <08-26-13/2128:17>
As stated before, this thread is for Clarification of rules. It is not for posting Errata, nor for asking questions of rules. Posts that do either of those have been removed.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: samiam on <08-27-13/0208:23>
Question on Armor Modification stacking...in 5E encumbrance has changed so that a character could, for example, wear a synthetic leather duster (AR = 4, therefore capacity 4 for mods) with an Armor Jacket (AR=12, therefore capacity 12 for mods) without penalty - which is a reasonable case of stacking armor.  Let's say they put 6 insulation & 6 nonconductivity in the vest and 4 fire resistance in the duster.  In a Resist Damage roll they would only count the higher of the two, so AR 12 from the vest.  If they were up against a Red Hot Nuke sporting a Flame Thrower, would they still get the Fire Resistance from the duster which is not factoring into the physical damage resistance roll?

If this does not work...what is a reasonable explanation for it rather then "it's against the rules"?  Or on the flip side...how to best deal with abusers?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-27-13/0358:44>
p.452 explicit state that ultrasound headware replace/override your vision, however...

Q: Can you use Thermographic vision at the same time as you use Low-light vision?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-27-13/0536:51>
Q: If you make a Succesful Summon, but go unconscious as a result of the Drain, is the Summoning still a success, making the Spirit stick around? Same question for Binding.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-27-13/0606:57>
Q: If you make a Succesful Summon, but go unconscious as a result of the Drain, is the Summoning still a success, making the Spirit stick around?
Summoning on p.300 is a 3 step process
1) Choose spirit type & force
2) Attempt summoning
3) Resist drain

If step 2 is successful then the spirit is summoned and will owe you services. This is resolved before drain. The unbound spirit will leave at sunset or sun-raise even if it still owe you services (because you might or might not still be unconscious due to drain when the sun goes down).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-27-13/0708:25>
I am aware that is how the rules read. I'm just checking if it's indeed intended.

Q: A drone can have Autosofts+Cyberprograms.
- Can it run the same Cyberprograms as an RCC can run, as listed on page 269?
- Are these the only Cyberprograms an RCC and a Drone can run?
- Can the RCC share not just Autosofts but also Cyberprograms, or would you have to independently install the Cyberprograms on the Drones as well?
- If the latter, that means they do not count for the condition that a drone must not run any autosofts itself to share autosofts, correct?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: farothel on <08-27-13/0725:28>
I have a question on alchemy and magic.  Searched for it, but didn't find the answer.
If I have read the book correctly if you want to have a spell (say fireball) and you also want to make fireball grenades, you need to learn the same spell twice, once as sorcery spell and once as alchemy spell?  Is this correct?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-27-13/0731:21>
p.304 resolve order for enchanting.
Quote
Step 1: Choose a Spell
Choose the alchemical version of the spell to be prepared. Spells used in preparations are different versions of the Sorcery spells listed on p. 283, but have the same effect, Drain Value, keywords, and so on as those spells. You learn the alchemical versions of these spells separately from Sorcery spells, but the Karma cost is the same. You can only choose an alchemical spell you know.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-27-13/0831:40>
b]Q: [/b] Can riggers get access to hot-sim with the sim module installed in the remote control or maybe in their RCC?

I'd just use the hot-sim modification on the commlink table on p. 439: +4F Availability and +250¥.
[/quote]

Linking a device to your DNI

The book mentions "to have a direct neural interface to the linked device", but I can't find any information about how you link a device with your DNI.

DNI isn't a link per se, it's a method of input and output with your gear, like voice command, keyboard, or mouse. As long as your devices can access whatever's giving you DNI (usually wireless, but you can run a data cable from a datajack if you like), you've got DNI control.

Quote
So...
How do you do it?
How long time does it take?
What is the max number of devices you can link to your DNI at any given moment?
Do you need to be the owner of the device in order to link it?
Is slaving a device to your commlink (where your sim module is located) the same thing as linking it to your DNI?

Get something that gives you DNI.
Not long.
There isn't one.
It's not really a link, per se.
No.

Question on Armor Modification stacking...in 5E encumbrance has changed so that a character could, for example, wear a synthetic leather duster (AR = 4, therefore capacity 4 for mods) with an Armor Jacket (AR=12, therefore capacity 12 for mods) without penalty - which is a reasonable case of stacking armor.  Let's say they put 6 insulation & 6 nonconductivity in the vest and 4 fire resistance in the duster.  In a Resist Damage roll they would only count the higher of the two, so AR 12 from the vest.  If they were up against a Red Hot Nuke sporting a Flame Thrower, would they still get the Fire Resistance from the duster which is not factoring into the physical damage resistance roll?

If this does not work...what is a reasonable explanation for it rather then "it's against the rules"?  Or on the flip side...how to best deal with abusers?

It's the "highest piece," not the highest rating. If you want to use the fire resistance, you've got to use the duster's Armor rating, too. Also, if your GM catches you wearing a duster and a jacket, she's well within a rational basis to impose penalties or even assess fatigue damage as a consequence.

b]Q: [/b] Can you use Thermographic vision at the same time as you use Low-light vision?

There's no rule against it, and I wouldn't imagine it's difficult for image processing software to build a composite image for you.

Q: A drone can have Autosofts+Cyberprograms.
- Can it run the same Cyberprograms as an RCC can run, as listed on page 269?
- Are these the only Cyberprograms an RCC and a Drone can run?
- Can the RCC share not just Autosofts but also Cyberprograms, or would you have to independently install the Cyberprograms on the Drones as well?
- If the latter, that means they do not count for the condition that a drone must not run any autosofts itself to share autosofts, correct?

- Yep.
- No, just the useful ones.
- p. 270.
- n/a

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-27-13/0832:16>
I have a question on alchemy and magic.  Searched for it, but didn't find the answer.
If I have read the book correctly if you want to have a spell (say fireball) and you also want to make fireball grenades, you need to learn the same spell twice, once as sorcery spell and once as alchemy spell?  Is this correct?
I have a question on alchemy and magic.  Searched for it, but didn't find the answer.
If I have read the book correctly if you want to have a spell (say fireball) and you also want to make fireball grenades, you need to learn the same spell twice, once as sorcery spell and once as alchemy spell?  Is this correct?

Yes.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-27-13/0945:06>
I'd just use the hot-sim modification on the commlink table on p. 439: +4F Availability and +250¥.
(It make control rig rating 2 with hot-sim modification off limits at chargen due to availability).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-27-13/1017:45>
Quote
- Can the RCC share not just Autosofts but also Cyberprograms, or would you have to independently install the Cyberprograms on the Drones as well?

- p. 270.
Just to be certain: Page 270 talks about sharing programs but does so in the Autosofts section, page 267 talks about sharing Autosofts alone. Is there an official errata in the works clarifying which of these two is phrased wrong?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-27-13/1555:17>
Just to be certain: Page 270 talks about sharing programs but does so in the Autosofts section, page 267 talks about sharing Autosofts alone. Is there an official errata in the works clarifying which of these two is phrased wrong?

Does it talk about sharing autosofts alone or autosofts exclusively?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-27-13/1559:22>
Quote from: Page 267
The Sharing rating is the number of autosofts you can run on the RCC that simultaneously run on all slaved drones at the same time. One caveat: if a drone is running any of its own autosofts, it cannot benefit from the RCC’s autosofts.
Quote from: Page 270
If a drone is slaved to a rigger command console and isn’t running any of its own programs, it uses the programs running on the RCC. This can exceed its normal program limit.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: firebug on <08-27-13/1933:22>
I hope I'm not breaking any rules, I'd just like to repost this since it became a new page shortly after and it hasn't been noticed yet:


Quote from: page 256
Re-register  Sprite:  You  can  attempt  to  re-register
the sprite for one task. If you use the sprite’s last task to
do this, don’t screw up. If you succeed, add your net hits
to the number of tasks the sprite owes you (minus the
one for re-registering, of course). If you fail, you’re out
of tasks, plain and simple.

The last bit about failing; is this continuing with the warning to be careful if you do this with a sprite's last task?  Or does it mean that if you try to re-register and fail, it removes all remaining tasks no matter how many are left and your sprite disappears?  If the former, it should be worded more clearly because it really sounds like the latter.  If the latter, why would it need the warning about using up your last task (when you have to end up either gaining more or losing them all no matter what) and why would you attempt this with more than 1 left anyways?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <08-27-13/2117:36>
I'd just use the hot-sim modification on the commlink table on p. 439: +4F Availability and +250¥.
(It make control rig rating 2 with hot-sim modification off limits at chargen due to availability).
I feel like without an inherent hot-sim module there is little reason for a Control Rig's R availability rating (just like a cyberdeck). I get why it is forbidden in commlinks (hello, BTLs), but it makes total sense for a (legal) rigger to be able to operate at max effectiveness if properly licensed (just like a decker).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <08-28-13/1122:50>
I was just putting together a Magician character for my pre-gened Shadowrun team (my players wont have there own rule books in time here in the UK) and I realized I do not know if the 10 spells a priority A for magic Magician gets have to all be spells or can some of them be rituals, alchemy formulas or the like?

As an aside can anyone recommenced how I should stat a fully rigged bass guitar for the party's Rigger's day job? As this Shadowrun team will have a "day job" as an elf rock band I am trying to sort out instrument stats for them all. I am certain the party shaman will be initiating so that there centering activity is power riffs on his electric guitar.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-28-13/1157:01>

Q: Is there any difference on how to resolve a biofeedback attack from a decker (running biofeedback) and Black IC?


Decker running biofeedback is well explained in the example on p.245:
Quote
A spider hits Slamm-0! (who is of course using hot-sim) for a total of 8 Matrix damage. Slamm-0! (or rather his deck) resists this damage with Device Rating + Firewall, getting 4 hits. That means his deck takes 4 boxes of damage. The spider is running Biofeedback, so Slamm-0! (not his deck) must now use his Willpower + Firewall to resist 4P damage. Any unresisted damage sinks right into Slamm-0!’s brain, and he marks it off his condition monitor.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: D Prime on <08-28-13/1313:57>
To add more information to Xenon's question, the description for the Biofeedback program says

Quote
When your attack causes Matrix damage, the target is hit with an equal amount of Stun (if the target is using cold-sim) or Physical (if the target is using hot-sim) biofeedback damage. This program also applies to damage caused by failed Attack actions against you. Biofeedback damage is resisted with Willpower + Firewall.
The description for Black IC, on the other hand, says
Quote
Black IC is the most feared intrusion countermeasures program on the market. The hosts that run it don’t want you repelled—they want you dead. When it hits, Black IC link-locks you. It also causes (Attack) DV Matrix damage (+1 DV per net hit and +2 DV per mark on the target) along with an equal amount of biofeedback damage.
The two cases use different language, hence the confusion.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-28-13/1339:50>
I was just putting together a Magician character for my pre-gened Shadowrun team (my players wont have there own rule books in time here in the UK) and I realized I do not know if the 10 spells a priority A for magic Magician gets have to all be spells or can some of them be rituals, alchemy formulas or the like?

As an aside can anyone recommenced how I should stat a fully rigged bass guitar for the party's Rigger's day job? As this Shadowrun team will have a "day job" as an elf rock band I am trying to sort out instrument stats for them all. I am certain the party shaman will be initiating so that there centering activity is power riffs on his electric guitar.
The Occult Investigator archetype has Alchemical Preparations instead of regular spells, and page 69 says you can have up to Magic x2 of each category, so I'm guessing you can mix things up as desired.
As for your second question, it doesn't really seem like something suited for this topic: try asking in the Gear forum, instead.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <08-28-13/1346:35>
Thanks I completely missed that there was a gear forum.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-28-13/1740:46>
I was just putting together a Magician character for my pre-gened Shadowrun team (my players wont have there own rule books in time here in the UK) and I realized I do not know if the 10 spells a priority A for magic Magician gets have to all be spells or can some of them be rituals, alchemy formulas or the like?

The latter.

Quote
As an aside can anyone recommenced how I should stat a fully rigged bass guitar for the party's Rigger's day job? As this Shadowrun team will have a "day job" as an elf rock band I am trying to sort out instrument stats for them all. I am certain the party shaman will be initiating so that there centering activity is power riffs on his electric guitar.

Give it a Quality rating that acts as a Performance limit, maybe?

Q: Is there any difference on how to resolve a biofeedback attack from a decker (running biofeedback) and Black IC?

Yes.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <08-28-13/1821:33>
Q: Is there any difference on how to resolve a biofeedback attack from a decker (running biofeedback) and Black IC?

Yes.
Q What is the difference and why is there one?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-28-13/1858:20>
Q: Is there any difference on how to resolve a biofeedback attack from a decker (running biofeedback) and Black IC?

Yes.
Q What is the difference and why is there one?
(or is the decker example wrong, we seen several examples being wrong before, and both deckers and black IC deal X amount of matrix AND biofeedback damage rather than X amount of matrix damage resisted down to Y and then take Y biofeedback damage that will be resisted again)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-28-13/2119:53>
Q: Is there any difference on how to resolve a biofeedback attack from a decker (running biofeedback) and Black IC?

Yes.
Q What is the difference and why is there one?

The difference is precisely what D Prime laid out in Reply #458 of this thread. The reason is because Black IC is better at dealing out pain than hackers. If you're about to ask what the "game balance" reason might be, I'd point out that rules do more that merely balance against one another, they shape a game world. In this game world, IC is scary. One rule that reinforces that fictional truth is that Black IC does biofeedback damage better than a cyberprogram can.

I hope that helps.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: D Prime on <08-28-13/2143:17>
One rule that reinforces that fictional truth is that Black IC does biofeedback damage better than a cyberprogram can.
How about Blaster IC and Sparky IC? Are they also better at dealing biofeedback damage?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-28-13/2340:32>
Nope, just scary, scary Black IC.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <08-29-13/0143:26>
Nope, just scary, scary Black IC.

Which, frankly, I am glad is scary again...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <08-29-13/0620:29>
Let me see If I have this right
Biofeedback cyberprogram causes biofeedback damage of a type determined by sim type equal to the matrix damage done after resistances.
Black IC causes biofeedback damage of a type determined by sim type equal to the matrix damage done before resistances and link-locks you.
Blaster IC causes biofeedback stun damage equal to the matrix damage done after resistances and link-locks you.
Sparky IC causes biofeedback damage  of a type determined by sim type equal to the matrix damage done after resitances.
If that is all correct I have to say that from the text of the rules it was not clear that in the descriptions of the IC that "with biofeedback damage" means "with biofeedback damage like from the biofeedback cyberprogram"

(edit: I am thinking more and more that I need the differences carefully explained to me)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <08-29-13/0859:39>
Thanks Aaron, so basically your firewall doesn't get to scrub any of the attack from the black IC before it reaches your body whereas with normal biofeedback it would get to.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Elektrycerze3 on <08-29-13/0907:55>
Hoi!

The recent discussion of cybereyes in the Gear section gave me an idea which raises a question:

Q: Do the wireless bonuses of multiple datajacks (Noise reduction 1) stack?

Thanks in advance!

[spoiler]I've already asked in the Gear section, feel free to express your thoughts on the matter there (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=12597.new;topicseen#new) so that we don't fill this thread with discussions.[/spoiler]
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <08-29-13/1604:57>
Question About Casting Multiple Spells:

Step 1 under Spellcasting describes Casting Multiple Spells. It basically works the same way as dual wielding weapons (splitting the Spellcasting + Magic dice pool in this case), save for modifiers:
Quote from: SR5, pg.281
Since the modifers per spell may be different, they are applied after you split the dice pool.
Does this apply to ALL modifiers? Specifically, I am trying to figure out how bonus dice from Specialization, Mentor Spirits, and Foci would fit in here.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-30-13/1047:47>
Q: Do the assistant(s) test in a teamwork test use modifiers?

Q: Do the assistant(s) test in a teamwork test use a limit?



Melee Teamwork test p.188 (which is similar to a teamwork test but have special rules) explicit state that assistants in a Melee Teamwork test use both modifiers and limit while Teamwork tests p.49 only state assistants use "appropriate skill + attribute" and does not mention modifiers nor limits (except for the team leader).

p.49 Teamwork test example list the Limit for the team-leader, but not for the assistant.
p.257 Diagnostics give sprites a [Data Processing] limit on the sprite's assist test.
p.300 Group Summoning have a -2 mod on the assist test if from different traditions.
p.418 Fencing Gear list the option to use availability in a teamwork test.

...all other reference to teamwork test point back to p.49 (or p.188 if it is a Melee Teamwork test).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: davesignal on <08-30-13/1220:43>
Building on the above:
Q: Can you make a teamwork test for matrix actions?
Q: Do you receive the +2 bonus for hot-sim VR on a teamwork test for matrix actions?
Q: Can Technomancer Sprites be tasked to perform or benefit from teamwork tests for skills they posses?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <08-30-13/1223:06>
I'll jump in as well:

Q: Outside of Group Summoning and the Ritual Sealing Test, can a Magical skill benefit from teamwork? If so, do the assistants resist drain as in both the known examples of Magic Teamwork?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <08-30-13/1652:00>
Q: The entry for the homunculus states that it derives its Body attribute from the structure rating of the material from which it is produced. Does it also gain any armor benefit from its material base or does it have to resist all damage with, in all likelihood, a single digit value?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-30-13/1759:06>
While Synaptic boosters "cannot be combined with any other form of Reaction or Initiative enhancement", the restriction for Wired Reflexes is that they "are incompatible with augmentations that affect Reaction or Initiative". On the magical side, while the Improved Reflexes power  says "the increase cannot be combined with other technological or magical increases  to Initiative", the Increase Reflexes spell doesn't say it's incompatible with anything except itself.
Does this mean Wired Reflexes and the Increase Reflexes can stack, since neither says it's incompatible with the other, or is this simply another phrasing mistake?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-30-13/1802:10>
Actually check the note on 159.

Quote
Initiative determines the order in which characters act,
as well as how often they act during a single Combat
Turn. Initiative is based on three factors: Initiative Attribute,
Initiative Score, and Initiative Dice.

Initiative is the more inclusive usage.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-30-13/1814:35>
Actually check the note on 159.

Quote
Initiative determines the order in which characters act, as well as how often they act during a single Combat Turn. Initiative is based on three factors: Initiative Attribute, Initiative Score, and Initiative Dice.
Initiative is the more inclusive usage.
..........
..........
..........
Maybe, just maybe, you shouldn't tell me I should FAQ something if you're only going to tell me it didn't need to be FAQ'd when I FAQ it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-30-13/1850:15>
Actually check the note on 159.

Quote
Initiative determines the order in which characters act, as well as how often they act during a single Combat Turn. Initiative is based on three factors: Initiative Attribute, Initiative Score, and Initiative Dice.
Initiative is the more inclusive usage.
..........
..........
..........
Maybe, just maybe, you shouldn't tell me I should FAQ something if you're only going to tell me it didn't need to be FAQ'd when I FAQ it.

Sorry, I didn't find the reference until after you had posted here and thought it would be rude not to mention it.

I took your question seriously, did some reading and found something I thought was on point. I'm not sure how I offended you but i apologize.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <08-30-13/2127:39>
increase reflexes, adrenaline boost, increase attribute (reaction), increase attribute (intuition), improved physical attribute (reaction), attribute boost (reaction) and suprathyroid gland all stack with each other (but increase reflexes does not stack with another increase reflexes spell). they all also stack with the reaction part of improved reflexes for everything except initiative.

wired reflexes and reaction enhancers both stack with each other, but only if both are wireless ON. They are both incompatible with everything else.

synaptic booster is incompatible with everything.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: deek on <08-30-13/2326:58>
Quote
page 197
If the barrier between the attacker and defender is transparent, like
bullet resistant glass, there is no cover or obstruction to
sight, but the attack must penetrate the barrier to reach
the defender (see Penetration Weapons, p. 198).

If the barrier takes the hit first, the gamemaster rolls
Structure + Armor to resist the damage, and the structure
takes any unresisted damage. If the Structure rating
is exceeded by the damage it suffers, any remaining
damage is transferred to the target behind the barrier.

Can you clarify if the resistance test in the second paragraph is always rolled when the barrier takes the hit first or only when it is NOT hit by a penetration weapon? The example on page 198 implies that with a penetration weapon, there is no resistance roll, per se, just the barrier taking damage based on the number of bullets.

Also, I am assuming the target always gets to soak whatever damage makes its way through the barrier, but please confirm.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-31-13/0500:11>
Penetration Weapons do auto-damage, as it says on page 198, and most damage breaks through. The second part of the rules you quoted are more for hitting through with blasts, punches and such.

By the way, the example appears incorrect. Since he fires in Full Auto, the barrier would take 3 (for 6) or 4 (for 10) damage, not 1 box of damage. Someone reported that in the Errata topic a month ago.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-31-13/0506:18>
Please keep personal interpretations on debated issues out of the FAQ topic. :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tagami on <08-31-13/0741:57>
Can you add a commlink (capacity 2) to cybereyes?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: deek on <08-31-13/0919:15>
Thank you for the response. That is the conclusion I drew (about the auto-damage), but it is nice to have a second opinion that gives me confidence.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-31-13/1018:04>
Question About Casting Multiple Spells:

Step 1 under Spellcasting describes Casting Multiple Spells. It basically works the same way as dual wielding weapons (splitting the Spellcasting + Magic dice pool in this case), save for modifiers:
Quote from: SR5, pg.281
Since the modifers per spell may be different, they are applied after you split the dice pool.
Does this apply to ALL modifiers? Specifically, I am trying to figure out how bonus dice from Specialization, Mentor Spirits, and Foci would fit in here.

By the book and barring errata, the only pool you split is the Spellcasting + Magic pool.

Q: Do the assistant(s) test in a teamwork test use modifiers?

Q: Do the assistant(s) test in a teamwork test use a limit?

Yes and yes. The test for the assistants is basically the same as the test for the leader.

Building on the above:
Q: Can you make a teamwork test for matrix actions?
Q: Do you receive the +2 bonus for hot-sim VR on a teamwork test for matrix actions?
Q: Can Technomancer Sprites be tasked to perform or benefit from teamwork tests for skills they posses?

Yes, yes, and yes.

I'll jump in as well:

Q: Outside of Group Summoning and the Ritual Sealing Test, can a Magical skill benefit from teamwork? If so, do the assistants resist drain as in both the known examples of Magic Teamwork?

Good question. Not per the current rules. I can see a case made for teamwork tests on dispelling or Enchanting Skill Group skills, though.

Q: The entry for the homunculus states that it derives its Body attribute from the structure rating of the material from which it is produced. Does it also gain any armor benefit from its material base or does it have to resist all damage with, in all likelihood, a single digit value?

Minions don't have armor. The material of a homunculus is tougher than the homunculus itself. In other words, much like living creatures, you can kill them without completely destroying the body.

While Synaptic boosters "cannot be combined with any other form of Reaction or Initiative enhancement", the restriction for Wired Reflexes is that they "are incompatible with augmentations that affect Reaction or Initiative". On the magical side, while the Improved Reflexes power  says "the increase cannot be combined with other technological or magical increases  to Initiative", the Increase Reflexes spell doesn't say it's incompatible with anything except itself.
Does this mean Wired Reflexes and the Increase Reflexes can stack, since neither says it's incompatible with the other, or is this simply another phrasing mistake?

Yes.


Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <08-31-13/1018:38>
Can you add a commlink (capacity 2) to cybereyes?

No. Cybereyes can only take cybereye augmentations.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <08-31-13/1023:10>
Aaron in the initiative response what exactly are you saying yes to?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <08-31-13/1029:23>
[spoiler](http://www.retailhellunderground.com/.a/6a00e54f10a0988834019aff144282970c-450wi)[/spoiler]
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: davesignal on <08-31-13/1534:16>
Q: Can a Technomancer target a host with complex forms that targets a device, such as Resonance Veil, Diffusion of [Matrix Attribute], or Puppeteer?
Q: When a Technomancer targets a slaved device with a complex form, does the slaved device have the option of using the master's Willpower/Device Rating and Firewall to defend against it?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-01-13/1708:42>
Q: Can an Adept, Magician or Mystic Adept without Ritual Spellcasting but with Astral Perception play the roll of Spotter in a ritual (which means they do not roll but still suffer drain), or is Ritual Spellcasting required to participate?
Q: Bound Spirits can function as Spotter for a ritual [thanks to their mental link with a Ritual Spellcaster]. Can Watchers, which are like bound Spirits, function as Spotter? Can a Homonculus?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DigitalZombie on <09-02-13/0904:49>
In relation to Chandras question. IF an adept can be used as a spotter, does he roll body+willpower as if it was an adept power with drain, as he doesnt have a tradition?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: HiddenBoss on <09-02-13/1220:16>
on page 238, DATA SPIKE is a (complex Action) but on page 244 it listed on the table as a Simple, i take it this is a error right?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: FastJack on <09-02-13/1255:47>
on page 238, DATA SPIKE is a (complex Action) but on page 244 it listed on the table as a Simple, i take it this is a error right?
You're looking for the 5E Errata thread (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11363.msg)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: wepv on <09-02-13/1557:13>

Questions about how a mana barrier interacts with quickened(or non quickened) spells.

How do mana barriers define "object"?
Are spells "objects"?
If you try to walk through a mana barrier and fail your magic+cha vs barrier force x2 roll, do you simple fail to walk through as if you hit a wall? Or do you make it through, but all your spells and foci are disrupted? It is very unclear as to what actually happens if you attempt this.

Regarding astral intersections:
You drive a van through a mana barrier with five spells on you,
Do you:
A: roll spell force x 2 vs barrier force x 2 for every spell on you? If so:
What order do you roll in? If the first spell beats the barrier, the barrier drops (forever or until the end of the combat turn, depending on the barrier) do you then not roll for the other spells?
B: Roll for the person (magic + cha) vs barrier force x 2? If so, on a failure to break through are your spells disrupted AND you are unconscious? Are you just unconscious? Are you only unconscious if you were astrally perceiving but your spells are still disrupted?

Why are the rules different for being forced through a barrier and pushing your way through a barrier?
Modify message
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-02-13/1619:13>
Q: How do mana-based spells interact with homunculi? Are they objects like drones? Living things like spirits? Their static Willpower makes me hope for the former.
Q: Do homunculi have Stun Condition Monitors? Spirits are explicitly called out as having them, homunculi are not.
Q: Is the Physical condition monitor for the homunculi calculated normally based on their Body?
Q: Homunculi have movement listed as 15/30. They seem to be the only critter listed with a static movement not based on their Agility. Is this Walking/Running speed and can they sprint?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: davesignal on <09-02-13/2340:24>
Q: Does Natural Hardening simply increase the Firewall rating of a Technomancer's Living Persona by +1? The text seems to imply this. If not, what is the proper interaction between Technomancers and Natural Hardening?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-03-13/0518:42>
Q: Are the Adept Power Combat Sense and the Spell Combat Sense supposed to stack?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-03-13/1147:48>
Edge Clarification:

The Edge rules state:
Quote
A character’s Edge attribute never actually changes, even when Edge points are spent, unless the character permanently burns Edge
Does that mean that if a) I am a really lucky human with Edge 7 and b) I spend Edge to Push the Limit in three subsequent rounds, that I roll 7D6 extra each time? It says you apply your Edge rating to the roll and I'm not sure if that means Attribute or (Attribute - Spent Edge).

Follow up, if you've spent all of your Edge, can you still burn Edge since your Edge attribute doesn't actually change as a result of spending Edge?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sielle on <09-03-13/1252:17>
Q: Which specialization of negotiation would be used for trying to track down black market gear? Bargaining?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Veggiesama on <09-03-13/1404:28>
Q: What do autopilot drones roll for defense tests? Is it Pilot + Evasion autosoft, or is Evasion limited only to Sensor Defense Tests? Could it be Pilot + Maneuver autosoft? (I am partial to using Pilot x 2 so it remains an attribute + attribute defense test without a limit, but the rules hint otherwise)

Q: p269 says "The Device Rating of a drone is the same as its Pilot Rating, meaning all of its Matrix attributes are equal to the Pilot Rating." p234 says drones have a device rating of 2. Which is it? It's important to know because drones can only run up to DR / 2 (round up) autosofts.

Q: Does it cost money to repair a drone? Repairing Matrix damage seems to be free, except critical glitches permanently brick the device. Build/repair tests for Physical damage are looser and more open to GM interpretation, but I imagine they'd be similar to repairing Matrix damage. The only time the text mentions cost is when the drone is bricked and destroyed.

Q: Recoil stuff
A. Does firing a Single-Shot (SS) weapon eliminate progressive recoil penalties or merely allow you to ignore them? For example, I am holding an SMG in my left hand and a revolver in the right. Pass 1, I fire full-auto with the SMG and rack up a -9 penalty, which would normally carry over to the next pass. Pass 2, I fire the revolver and suffer no recoil. Pass 3, I fire the SMG. Do I add the -9 from earlier, or do I start at 0 again?
B. If I fire my SS five times in a row, then quick-draw an SMG, am I starting at 0 or -4 for the accumulated recoil?
C. Does Suppressive Fire work the same way? Are accumulated recoil penalties eliminated or simply ignored?
D. Even though I ignore recoil during Suppressive Fire, does my next attack in the next pass start from 0 or do I include the 20 bullets fired from the previous attack as a -19 recoil penalty?
(I'm writing an app to help track recoil across combat, and these questions came up)

Thanks.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ImaginalDisc on <09-03-13/1415:37>
I did a search for posts about detection spells, but I did not find anything to address this specific issue I am having. Maybe I am merely being obtuse.

I don't understand the range of detection spells.

Case in point, from page 287:

Quote
Detect [Life Form]
(Active, Area)
Type: M Range: TDuration: S Drain: F – 2

Detect [Life Form], Extended
(Active, Extended Area)
Type: M Range: TDuration: S Drain: F

The subject detects all of a specified type of life form
within the range of the sense and knows their number
and relative location. This is actually several different
spells that must be learned separately, one for each type
of life form that a caster might like to detect (Detect
Orks, Detect Elves, Detect Dragons, and so forth), which
are learned separately.

There are two salient parts here:

Firstly: "The subject detects all of a specified type of life form within the range of the sense and knows their number and relative location." What sense is "the sense," taste? Proprioception? Balance? I understand that the "range" is touch because one must touch someone to cast this spell on them, but how far away can the beneficiary "sense" life? Is it out to the range of their line of sight? What good is it to see living things if they're already within LOS? Is it out to [Force] meters, making weird auras glow in the vision of the benefciary even when a wall or other mundane barrier blocks them?

Can one use this spell to give people the ability to sense life?

Issue the second:
What does "extended" mean in the case of the second spell? How much of a range exentsion is it?

In short, I can't figure out how the range of detection spells work at all. Mind throwing me a bone?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <09-03-13/1417:47>
Quote from: Page 285 (basic description of Detection Spells)
Detection spells may be cast upon yourself or on another subject within touch range. The standard range of the sense a Detection spell grants is the spell’s Force x caster’s Magic in meters as a radius from the target of the spell. Extended-range detection spells have a Force x Magic x 10 meter range.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ImaginalDisc on <09-03-13/1419:57>
Quote from: Page 285 (basic description of Detection Spells)
Detection spells may be cast upon yourself or on another subject within touch range. The standard range of the sense a Detection spell grants is the spell’s Force x caster’s Magic in meters as a radius from the target of the spell. Extended-range detection spells have a Force x Magic x 10 meter range.

ZeConster for the win!

Thanks, I was going mad looking for clarification in the book.

I award you one APDS clip in gratitude.

 ;D
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-03-13/1818:19>
Does that mean that if a) I am a really lucky human with Edge 7 and b) I spend Edge to Push the Limit in three subsequent rounds, that I roll 7D6 extra each time?
Correct. You always add your full Edge attribute with Pushing the Limit.

Yes, you can burn Edge when you spent all your temporary Edge points. They're two different things after all, one is an Attribute and the other a Pool.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-03-13/1837:03>
Cool. Thanks Michael. That's what I thought, but when the text threw "Edge Rating" I wavered a bit. LOL
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-04-13/0353:22>
Q: Does an Airburst simply reduce scatter or does it also detonate the grenades as part of reducing the scatter?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <09-04-13/2234:11>
Q: Which skill do you use for cyberguns?

Might be a silly question, but the cyberguns paragraph on the page 458 doesn't mention skills, while the "Cyber melee weapons" paragraph on the same page specifically states:
"Attacks with cyber melee weapons use Unarmed Combat skill and the Physical limit."

The Automatics skill is the only skill with a "Cyber Implants" specialization listed of the possible cybergun skills, which are Pistols, Automatics, Longarms, and Heavy Weapons.

Furthermore, on page 132 the Unarmed Combat skill specifically states (emphasis mine):
"Unarmed Combat covers the various self-defense and attack moves that employ the body as a primary weapon. This includes a wide array of martial arts along with the use of cybernetic implant weaponry and the fighting styles that sprung up around those implants."

Additionally, the cyberguns paragraph on page 458 also states (emphasis mine):
"Generally speaking, these are mounted in a cyberarm or directly into a natural arm, but you could install one in a leg or even your torso. Cyberguns are distinct from cyber holsters in that the gun itself can be controlled and fired directly, as an extension of your body. Depending on the size of the gun, cyberguns take up part of your forearm or replace your arm altogether, with the functional parts of the arm built around the gun. Smaller cyberguns fire through a hidden port in the palm or knuckles, while larger cyberguns fold back the user’s hand at the wrist."

I would be tempted to houserule this so that the Unarmed Combat skill applied equally to all cyber implant weapons; from my own experience with firearms, at least, I cannot even begin to comprehend how being trained in the classic Weaver stance would help you fire a gun that's implanted in your ribcage.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-06-13/0836:03>
Q: If, due to essence loss, a Magician/Mystical Adept character's Magic drops below their Free Spells / 2, and they only have 1 skill for Spell Slots / Ritual Slots / Alchemical Preparations Slots: Do they lose the excess, since they cannot have more than Magic x2 per category at chargen? Or do free spell slots override this limit?

For example, a character SichoPhiend posted went Magic Priority A, lost 2 magic from ware and only had Spellcasting. This character starts with 10 free Spell from Magic A, but due to having only 4 Magic is not allowed to have more than 8 spells at chargen.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-06-13/1302:05>
Q: If I am a rigger with a Control Rig (2) and I plug directly into a vehicle to jump into it (cutting out both Commlink and RCC), what are my matrix attributes? Are they based on the device rating of the rig (which appears to be 2)? Can I even jump into a vehicle by direct connection without some kind of additional interface?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-09-13/1140:22>
Natural Recovery is described as an Extended Test. Since all Extended Tests are now Limited, this results in two questions:
Q: Is Natural Recovery supposed to be a Limited Test, or is it meant to be without losing dice?
Q: If it is supposed to be a Limited Test, is it possible to take a break before starting a new test? If so, what time period would count as a sufficient break?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <09-09-13/1233:29>
Q: If it is supposed to be a Limited Test, is it possible to take a break before starting a new test? If so, what time period would count as a sufficient break?
Yes, we are all very curious as to how long a break you need to take from resting.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-09-13/1245:47>
Yes, we are all very curious as to how long a break you need to take from resting.
OK then.. platelets and white blood cells, y'all can go back to my bone marrow and take a break for now. I'll give you a call when we try this again.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-09-13/1518:18>
Natural Recovery is described as an Extended Test. Since all Extended Tests are now Limited, this results in two questions:
Q: Is Natural Recovery supposed to be a Limited Test, or is it meant to be without losing dice?
Q: If it is supposed to be a Limited Test, is it possible to take a break before starting a new test? If so, what time period would count as a sufficient break?
Since the threshold is zero you only need one hit to end the extended test in a success, in that case you can take the test again after you rested that first hour.

The question only become interesting if you have a very small pool and fail over and over until you run out of pool without a single hit.
- Can you in this situation make a new extended test with a fresh pool.
- Can you choose to end the test and restart it with a fresh pool when you failed to get a hit during the first hour. 
- Do you need to wait a set period of time (black market extended test state you have to wait twice the base time before you can try that specific test again).
- Do you get a negative modifier if you try again after a failed attempt to heal stun damage (the Trying Again rule on p.49 state you can try again with -2 pool, but it is unclear if this applies to extended tests or not. And to get rid of the -2 pool you have to take a break from trying -- taking a break from resting... o'rly?)

(Gut feeling tells me you are allowed to make a new recover stun damage test, restart the test, every hour with a full willpower+body pool without delay or penalty)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-10-13/1810:57>
Aaron in the initiative response what exactly are you saying yes to?

The first part of the question.

Q: Can a Technomancer target a host with complex forms that targets a device, such as Resonance Veil, Diffusion of [Matrix Attribute], or Puppeteer?

No.

Quote
Q: When a Technomancer targets a slaved device with a complex form, does the slaved device have the option of using the master's Willpower/Device Rating and Firewall to defend against it?

Yes.

Q: Can an Adept, Magician or Mystic Adept without Ritual Spellcasting but with Astral Perception play the roll of Spotter in a ritual (which means they do not roll but still suffer drain), or is Ritual Spellcasting required to participate?
Q: Bound Spirits can function as Spotter for a ritual [thanks to their mental link with a Ritual Spellcaster]. Can Watchers, which are like bound Spirits, function as Spotter? Can a Homonculus?

Yes.
No; it turns out that watchers aren't spirits like everyone used to think. Although now I'm going to pitch an idea for a minion ritual called Spotter.

In relation to Chandras question. IF an adept can be used as a spotter, does he roll body+willpower as if it was an adept power with drain, as he doesnt have a tradition?

Adepts use Body + Willpower against Drain.

How do mana barriers define "object"?
Are spells "objects"?
If you try to walk through a mana barrier and fail your magic+cha vs barrier force x2 roll, do you simple fail to walk through as if you hit a wall?

Physical things. Mana barriers only interact with astral forms.
No.
Yes, if you're astrally active (dual-natured as in astral perception or fully astral).

Quote
Regarding astral intersections:
You drive a van through a mana barrier with five spells on you,
Do you:
A: roll spell force x 2 vs barrier force x 2 for every spell on you? If so:
What order do you roll in? If the first spell beats the barrier, the barrier drops (forever or until the end of the combat turn, depending on the barrier) do you then not roll for the other spells?
B: Roll for the person (magic + cha) vs barrier force x 2? If so, on a failure to break through are your spells disrupted AND you are unconscious? Are you just unconscious? Are you only unconscious if you were astrally perceiving but your spells are still disrupted?

A. The order your GM calls for them. Correct.

Quote
Why are the rules different for being forced through a barrier and pushing your way through a barrier?

Because in one case you have no choice (astral forms can't pull or push physical ones, but a dual-natured astral form attached to a physical form is stuck to the physical form), and in the other you're trying to push through on your own. The answer to your next question (can I just force myself through a mana barrier while astrally perceiving?) is yes, but you might end up unconscious for your efforts (or perhaps I should say, "knock yerself out").

Q: How do mana-based spells interact with homunculi? Are they objects like drones? Living things like spirits? Their static Willpower makes me hope for the former.
Q: Do homunculi have Stun Condition Monitors? Spirits are explicitly called out as having them, homunculi are not.
Q: Is the Physical condition monitor for the homunculi calculated normally based on their Body?
Q: Homunculi have movement listed as 15/30. They seem to be the only critter listed with a static movement not based on their Agility. Is this Walking/Running speed and can they sprint?

Good question. The description of the homunculus doesn't specify whether or not it's dual-natured, but after reading the rest of the chapter I'd say that it's a physical object with an aura (the same way a spell has an aura rather than an astral presence).
Homunculi [thanks, Jack VII] don't have Stun Condition Monitors. They're physical objects with Armor and Structure ratings.
Yep.
That's one for the errata.

Q: Does Natural Hardening simply increase the Firewall rating of a Technomancer's Living Persona by +1? The text seems to imply this. If not, what is the proper interaction between Technomancers and Natural Hardening?

The quality does not increase the technomancer's Firewall. It gives +1 die when resisting biofeedback damage. It's cumulative with a technomancer's Firewall and any other ratings used in such a dice pool.

Q: Are the Adept Power Combat Sense and the Spell Combat Sense supposed to stack?

I'm not sure why they wouldn't.

Q: Which specialization of negotiation would be used for trying to track down black market gear? Bargaining?

The one your GM picks.



Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-10-13/1824:08>
Q: What do autopilot drones roll for defense tests? Is it Pilot + Evasion autosoft, or is Evasion limited only to Sensor Defense Tests? Could it be Pilot + Maneuver autosoft? (I am partial to using Pilot x 2 so it remains an attribute + attribute defense test without a limit, but the rules hint otherwise)

Q: p269 says "The Device Rating of a drone is the same as its Pilot Rating, meaning all of its Matrix attributes are equal to the Pilot Rating." p234 says drones have a device rating of 2. Which is it? It's important to know because drones can only run up to DR / 2 (round up) autosofts.

Q: Does it cost money to repair a drone? Repairing Matrix damage seems to be free, except critical glitches permanently brick the device. Build/repair tests for Physical damage are looser and more open to GM interpretation, but I imagine they'd be similar to repairing Matrix damage. The only time the text mentions cost is when the drone is bricked and destroyed.

Q: Recoil stuff
A. Does firing a Single-Shot (SS) weapon eliminate progressive recoil penalties or merely allow you to ignore them? For example, I am holding an SMG in my left hand and a revolver in the right. Pass 1, I fire full-auto with the SMG and rack up a -9 penalty, which would normally carry over to the next pass. Pass 2, I fire the revolver and suffer no recoil. Pass 3, I fire the SMG. Do I add the -9 from earlier, or do I start at 0 again?
B. If I fire my SS five times in a row, then quick-draw an SMG, am I starting at 0 or -4 for the accumulated recoil?
C. Does Suppressive Fire work the same way? Are accumulated recoil penalties eliminated or simply ignored?
D. Even though I ignore recoil during Suppressive Fire, does my next attack in the next pass start from 0 or do I include the 20 bullets fired from the previous attack as a -19 recoil penalty?
(I'm writing an app to help track recoil across combat, and these questions came up)

Thanks.

Maneuvering.

The table on p. 234 is general. The rule about Device Rating and Pilot Rating being the same is specific, so it takes precedence.

Yes, following the build and repair rules that say that your GM will tell you if it costs money. More specific cost rules will probably be in a future source book.

A. SS weapons don't generate recoil.
B. 0
C. Recoil remains at the level you have when you start your suppressive fire.
D. You don't ignore recoil, you just don't add any to your current amount.

Q: Does an Airburst simply reduce scatter or does it also detonate the grenades as part of reducing the scatter?

The airburst link only reduces scatter, it's the grenade's wireless bonus that gives you wireless triggering. Yes, you can do the trick you're thinking of.

Q: Which skill do you use for cyberguns?

The appropriate skill for the firearm of that type (the rest doesn't seem to be a question, so I edited it out; hope you don't mind).

Q: If, due to essence loss, a Magician/Mystical Adept character's Magic drops below their Free Spells / 2, and they only have 1 skill for Spell Slots / Ritual Slots / Alchemical Preparations Slots: Do they lose the excess, since they cannot have more than Magic x2 per category at chargen? Or do free spell slots override this limit?

The excess is lost.

Q: If I am a rigger with a Control Rig (2) and I plug directly into a vehicle to jump into it (cutting out both Commlink and RCC), what are my matrix attributes? Are they based on the device rating of the rig (which appears to be 2)? Can I even jump into a vehicle by direct connection without some kind of additional interface?

You'd have the Matrix attributes of your vehicle.

Natural Recovery is described as an Extended Test. Since all Extended Tests are now Limited, this results in two questions:
Q: Is Natural Recovery supposed to be a Limited Test, or is it meant to be without losing dice?
Q: If it is supposed to be a Limited Test, is it possible to take a break before starting a new test? If so, what time period would count as a sufficient break?

I think I answered this question already. Barring errata, if you run out of dice, you need medical care (which gives you extra dice). If you take a break and want to start over, ask your GM how long a break you need; I'd go with "at least as long as you just took to get to this point."



Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <09-10-13/1911:41>
Aaron in the initiative response what exactly are you saying yes to?

The first part of the question.


So in other words you're saying that Wired Reflexes and Increased Reflexes do stack because Augmentation in the wired reflexes text only refers to cybernetic augmentations?

Do you intend the corollary to this that the augmented maximum only applies to Cybernetic augmentation and that magical augmentation (or whatever you've decided to call it since we can't now call it augmentation) is completely uncapped?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-10-13/1914:21>
Q: How do mana-based spells interact with homunculi? Are they objects like drones? Living things like spirits? Their static Willpower makes me hope for the former.
Q: Do homunculi have Stun Condition Monitors? Spirits are explicitly called out as having them, homunculi are not.
Q: Is the Physical condition monitor for the homunculi calculated normally based on their Body?
Q: Homunculi have movement listed as 15/30. They seem to be the only critter listed with a static movement not based on their Agility. Is this Walking/Running speed and can they sprint?
Good question. The description of the homunculus doesn't specify whether or not it's dual-natured, but after reading the rest of the chapter I'd say that it's a physical object with an aura (the same way a spell has an aura rather than an astral presence).
Spirits don't have Stun Condition Monitors. They're physical objects with Armor and Structure ratings.
Yep.
That's one for the errata.
Thanks for the responses Aaron! Although I am disappointed to see that my lightning fast homunculi may be no more, but it seems like they have gained so much. My Jewish Israeli Golemancer is coming more clearly into focus! LOL Did you mean homunculi when you said "Spirits don't have Stun Condition Monitors"? You don't have to give a new response, just change your response if that was your intention if you don't mind. Thanks!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-10-13/1952:42>
Q: If I am a rigger with a Control Rig (2) and I plug directly into a vehicle to jump into it (cutting out both Commlink and RCC), what are my matrix attributes? Are they based on the device rating of the rig (which appears to be 2)? Can I even jump into a vehicle by direct connection without some kind of additional interface?

You'd have the Matrix attributes of your vehicle.
Yuck, so for most ground vehicles your DataPro and Firewall would be a 1? Uh, I'm not going to be direct connecting to my vehicle.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <09-10-13/2013:41>
I can not seem to find the Nuyen cost for learning a new ritual only the 5 Karma cost.
How much Nuyen, if any, does learning a new ritual cost?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sielle on <09-10-13/2054:24>
I can not seem to find the Nuyen cost for learning a new ritual only the 5 Karma cost.
How much Nuyen, if any, does learning a new ritual cost?

Page 461 the spell formula cost chart?  Wouldn't it be the same formula cost if it was a cast spell, ritual spell, or alchemy preparation?  Granted each type would require a different formula, but all 3 cost the same per formula.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-10-13/2102:55>
That could probably be assumed for rituals with the (Spell) keyowrd (seems fair to me), but what do you do about Ward, Homunculus, Watcher, and Circle of Protection?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <09-10-13/2116:08>
The (Spell) keyword doesn't have anything to do with it, I think: it simply means the ritual "is used in conjunction with a spell that the ritual leader knows".
Quote from: Page 296
You learn each ritual the same way you learn a spell (p. 299).
Quote from: Page 299
New spells, rituals, or alchemical preparations (p. 316) can be learned by studying spell formulae or finding some mentor (either a spirit or another Awakened individual) to teach you.
(...)
If you want to learn alone, you can buy a spell formula (prices on the Magical Goods table, p. 326).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-10-13/2125:30>
Right, that's true. The problem is that there are no ritual spell formulae listed in the Magical Goods section. One suggestion (at least for the (Spell) keyword rituals) is to price them commensurate with whatever class of spell can be cast through them. So the Curse Ritual would be priced with Illusion formula and the Renesence Ritual would be priced as Manipulation formula. It still doesn't address Ward, Watcher, etc, but would be a start.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-11-13/0821:53>
Yuck, so for most ground vehicles your DataPro and Firewall would be a 1? Uh, I'm not going to be direct connecting to my vehicle.
(You don't need data processing or firewall when using pilot or gunnery skill when jacked in...)

Direct connect [your control rig to your RCC and] your RCC to your vehicle.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <09-11-13/0827:54>
Natural Recovery is described as an Extended Test. Since all Extended Tests are now Limited, this results in two questions:
Q: Is Natural Recovery supposed to be a Limited Test, or is it meant to be without losing dice?
Q: If it is supposed to be a Limited Test, is it possible to take a break before starting a new test? If so, what time period would count as a sufficient break?

I think I answered this question already. Barring errata, if you run out of dice, you need medical care (which gives you extra dice). If you take a break and want to start over, ask your GM how long a break you need; I'd go with "at least as long as you just took to get to this point."

Medical care only add dices to the extended test, it does not guarantee that you will completely heal before you run out of dice.
So what if with the bonus of medical care you run out of dice before being fully healed?
(please note that in the examples, the number of dice is not reduced as it should be for a regular extended test)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-11-13/0828:31>
(You don't need data processing or firewall when using pilot or gunnery skill when jacked in...)
Not for that, but you better hope they don't have a hacker.
Direct connect [your control rig to your RCC and] your RCC to your vehicle.
That's what I do, but the book implies that riggers regularly connect directly to their vehicles, which seems like a terrible idea.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-11-13/0914:58>
So in other words you're saying that Wired Reflexes and Increased Reflexes do stack because Augmentation in the wired reflexes text only refers to cybernetic augmentations?
Interesting.... You still can't combine improved reflexes with wired reflexes, synaptic boosters or increase reflexes, you still can't combine synaptic boosters with improved reflexes, wired reflexes or increase reflexes and you still can't combine reaction enhancers with improved physical reaction or increased reaction  - but this would make it possible to combine wired reflexes and increase reflexes and muscle toner with increased physical agility...


Actually, reading up on on all location where the word Augmentation appears in the book make pretty clear that augmentation and augmentations only deal with cyberware and bioware.

Spells and physical adept powers are very careful to not use the word augmentation and instead use words such as Increased, Improved, Enhanced and Boosted as in increases, improvements, enhancements and boosts.

However, magical and physical adept descriptions, while not being augmentations, state that they still do "Augment" -but since spells are not augmentations they all also explicit state that the spell or power is still limited by the "up to your augmented [Attribute] maximum".

We need a name for non cybernetic and bionetic spells and powers that augment attributes.
- Magical attribute increases? Magical increases to <attribute>?
And what about a name for the whole group of cyberware, bioware, spells and adept powers.
- Attribute enhancers? <attribute> enhancement? Augmented <attribute>?


This sure sound as if the cap of +4 (but at no point can augmentations exceed the +4 bonus cap p.94) only affect Augmentations (cybernetics and bioware), unless the spell, adept power or drug explicit state that it is also affected by the limit.

Drugs does not explicit state that they are limited by the +4 augmented limit
Drugs are not augmentations (cyberware or bioware)

Improved reflexes does not explicit state that it is limited to the +4 augmented limit
Improved reflexes is not an augmentation.

Medical care only add dices to the extended test, it does not guarantee that you will completely heal before you run out of dice.
So what if with the bonus of medical care you run out of dice before being fully healed?
(please note that in the examples, the number of dice is not reduced as it should be for a regular extended test)
Either examples need errata or you can choose to end the extended test if you fail and then restart it the next hour with a full dice pool (don't see why you would not be allowed to do that tbh).

...if you run out of dice your extended test failed and you need to restart the test with a full dice pool. In some explicit cases - like the black market extended test - you have to wait before you can restart the test, but there is nothing about that in the general extended test definition. There is also a rule called Trying Again that give you -2 dice per repeated try if you repeat a test after you fail unless you take a break - not sure if that would apply to extended tests or not (if it do you might need to rest or think about something else for an hour or two before you try again - but rest from resting...??)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-11-13/1734:45>
Aaron in the initiative response what exactly are you saying yes to?

The first part of the question.

So in other words you're saying that Wired Reflexes and Increased Reflexes do stack because Augmentation in the wired reflexes text only refers to cybernetic augmentations?

Do you intend the corollary to this that the augmented maximum only applies to Cybernetic augmentation and that magical augmentation (or whatever you've decided to call it since we can't now call it augmentation) is completely uncapped?

Yes, followed by no. You can't get more than 5D6 in Initiative Dice no matter what your source.

I can not seem to find the Nuyen cost for learning a new ritual only the 5 Karma cost.
How much Nuyen, if any, does learning a new ritual cost?

Good question. I'll check with the errata crew.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-11-13/1739:42>
Natural Recovery is described as an Extended Test. Since all Extended Tests are now Limited, this results in two questions:
Q: Is Natural Recovery supposed to be a Limited Test, or is it meant to be without losing dice?
Q: If it is supposed to be a Limited Test, is it possible to take a break before starting a new test? If so, what time period would count as a sufficient break?

I think I answered this question already. Barring errata, if you run out of dice, you need medical care (which gives you extra dice). If you take a break and want to start over, ask your GM how long a break you need; I'd go with "at least as long as you just took to get to this point."

Medical care only add dices to the extended test, it does not guarantee that you will completely heal before you run out of dice.
So what if with the bonus of medical care you run out of dice before being fully healed?
(please note that in the examples, the number of dice is not reduced as it should be for a regular extended test)

I had hoped I was clear in my previous answers. If you run out of dice in an Extended Test, you stop. If you want to rest between attempts, your GM will tell you how long that is. If you want me to say "you don't reduce dice when you're healing," I can't do that without making a change to written rules, and that's the sort of thing I only do in my home games, not on FAQ threads.

While I'm at it, I'd like to request that folks take any rules discussions to other threads. I'd like to focus this topic on questions and follow-up questions. Thanks!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-11-13/1742:44>
Which is why I frequently ask RAI questions to make sure they didn't accidentally make a mistake in the SR4->SR5 conversion. :) And I know you're not always able to answer those yourself.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <09-12-13/0443:57>
Natural Recovery is described as an Extended Test. Since all Extended Tests are now Limited, this results in two questions:
Q: Is Natural Recovery supposed to be a Limited Test, or is it meant to be without losing dice?
Q: If it is supposed to be a Limited Test, is it possible to take a break before starting a new test? If so, what time period would count as a sufficient break?

I think I answered this question already. Barring errata, if you run out of dice, you need medical care (which gives you extra dice). If you take a break and want to start over, ask your GM how long a break you need; I'd go with "at least as long as you just took to get to this point."

Medical care only add dices to the extended test, it does not guarantee that you will completely heal before you run out of dice.
So what if with the bonus of medical care you run out of dice before being fully healed?
(please note that in the examples, the number of dice is not reduced as it should be for a regular extended test)

I had hoped I was clear in my previous answers. If you run out of dice in an Extended Test, you stop. If you want to rest between attempts, your GM will tell you how long that is. If you want me to say "you don't reduce dice when you're healing," I can't do that without making a change to written rules, and that's the sort of thing I only do in my home games, not on FAQ threads.

While I'm at it, I'd like to request that folks take any rules discussions to other threads. I'd like to focus this topic on questions and follow-up questions. Thanks!

Thank you, this is now clear: you need to rest between 2 resting periods  :o
You are right, let's not discuss the rules themselves here, this thread is already long enough ;)
Just one remark: you (i.e. CatLabs) will have to make a change to the written rules, because the healing examples are bogus (the dice pool is not reduced).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-12-13/0749:27>
According to p.207 "Stun damage" and "Physical damage" under the chapter "Natural Recovery"
...both stun damage and physical damage are naturally recovered using an extended test (with a threshold of zero).

According to extended test definition on p.48 you remove one dice from the pool for each test you take and that the test is over when you reach the threshold (success) or when you run out of dice (fail).

Since the threshold is zero you automatically reach the threshold (zero hits or more) each time you take the test.
And since the test was not a fail (you reached the threshold and you did not ran out of pool) you can take the test again without delay or penalty.

This exact behavior (always taking a new test with full dice pool each time even after zero hits - without delay or penalty) is also reflected in the [second] example on p207.




Q Is there any error in my reasoning?

Q If so what and why?
(Feel I need a bit info why the [second] example on p.207 being wrong before i post it in the errata thread)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <09-12-13/0824:39>
Xenon, I understand your reasonning, however it seems really far-fetched.
I would rather consider that the threshold is the number of boxes of damage.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <09-13-13/1142:51>
what does the Drain code of Resist Pain mean?
Quote
Drain:(Damage Value)-6
Is it intended to be the only spell that does not use the spell's Force in the calculation?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-13-13/1238:55>
Is it intended that the Headware "Cyberdeck" have an Avaiability of 5R (despite what deck you install) and only cost 5,000¥ + deck cost?

(as it mean you can install a Shiawase Cyber-5 at chargen as Used headware for 415,781.25¥ and 5R 1R -instead of 549,375¥ and 15R)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <09-13-13/1520:23>
I asked this else where but thought i would move it to hear as i'm still trying to understand how multiple noise sources interact. Slightly altered from the original question to add in some more info.
Q. It is raining really heavily in Seattle, enough to get static noise or rating 3, I'm in the shopping district and it's a spam zone of rating 5 Spam noise, and then someone turns on a Jammer (lets say that with rating and distance, it's 3 noise). What is my noise penalty?
Q. The devices releasing the spam are RFID tags, so Device Rating 2, does this mean that with the Static Noise of 3 from the rain, they lose their broadcasting functionality, lowering the spam noise by 5?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Pollution on <09-13-13/1551:43>
Is it intended that the Headware "Cyberdeck" have an Avaiability of 5R (despite what deck you install) and only cost 5,000¥ + deck cost?

(as it mean you can install a Shiawase Cyber-5 at chargen as Used headware for 415,781.25¥ and 5R 1R -instead of 549,375¥ and 15R)

I'm assuming they meant +5R, or something like that. (though +5 seems WAY high, should probably be +2 or something)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-13-13/1759:16>
Just one remark: you (i.e. CatLabs) will have to make a change to the written rules, because the healing examples are bogus (the dice pool is not reduced).

I suggest posting your suggestion in the errata thread.

According to p.207 "Stun damage" and "Physical damage" under the chapter "Natural Recovery"
...both stun damage and physical damage are naturally recovered using an extended test (with a threshold of zero).

According to extended test definition on p.48 you remove one dice from the pool for each test you take and that the test is over when you reach the threshold (success) or when you run out of dice (fail).

Since the threshold is zero you automatically reach the threshold (zero hits or more) each time you take the test.
And since the test was not a fail (you reached the threshold and you did not ran out of pool) you can take the test again without delay or penalty.

This exact behavior (always taking a new test with full dice pool each time even after zero hits - without delay or penalty) is also reflected in the [second] example on p207.




Q Is there any error in my reasoning?

Q If so what and why?
(Feel I need a bit info why the [second] example on p.207 being wrong before i post it in the errata thread)

Yes, but only because I'm not seeing where the book states that threshold of zero you seem to be assuming. Could you tell me which section you're referring to?

what does the Drain code of Resist Pain mean?
Quote
Drain:(Damage Value)-6
Is it intended to be the only spell that does not use the spell's Force in the calculation?

I think that's one for the errata. I'll check with the errata folks.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-13-13/1802:13>
Is it intended that the Headware "Cyberdeck" have an Avaiability of 5R (despite what deck you install) and only cost 5,000¥ + deck cost?

(as it mean you can install a Shiawase Cyber-5 at chargen as Used headware for 415,781.25¥ and 5R 1R -instead of 549,375¥ and 15R)


Think of it as an accessory. Deck sold separately.

I asked this else where but thought i would move it to hear as i'm still trying to understand how multiple noise sources interact. Slightly altered from the original question to add in some more info.
Q. It is raining really heavily in Seattle, enough to get static noise or rating 3, I'm in the shopping district and it's a spam zone of rating 5 Spam noise, and then someone turns on a Jammer (lets say that with rating and distance, it's 3 noise). What is my noise penalty?

11.

Quote
Q. The devices releasing the spam are RFID tags, so Device Rating 2, does this mean that with the Static Noise of 3 from the rain, they lose their broadcasting functionality, lowering the spam noise by 5?

No, because broadcast functionality is not a wireless bonus. Only wireless bonuses are affected by noise, not basic functionality. For example, you can still browse the Matrix and send messages, even in that nightmare Rating 11 noise you've got in the previous question. However, your grenade's wireless trigger wouldn't work.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <09-13-13/1806:47>
No, because broadcast functionality is not a wireless bonus. Only wireless bonuses are affected by noise, not basic functionality. For example, you can still browse the Matrix and send messages, even in that nightmare Rating 11 noise you've got in the previous question. However, your grenade's wireless trigger wouldn't work.
I have been vastly misunderstanding noise then, thank you. I still do not get how they hinder riggers and deckers then...

In terms of browsing he Matrix, with the -11 Data Search Dice Pool, surely I cannot?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-13-13/1811:25>
No, because broadcast functionality is not a wireless bonus. Only wireless bonuses are affected by noise, not basic functionality. For example, you can still browse the Matrix and send messages, even in that nightmare Rating 11 noise you've got in the previous question. However, your grenade's wireless trigger wouldn't work.
I have been vastly misunderstanding noise then, thank you. I still do not get how they hinder riggers and deckers then...
Well, there is the part where it says it applies a negative dice pool modifier to all of your Matrix actions. So I guess you could still send a command to a drone with Send Message (No test) but might have a hell of a time remote controlling it using Control Device?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <09-13-13/1816:47>
Well, there is the part where it says it applies a negative dice pool modifier to all of your Matrix actions. So I guess you could still send a command to a drone with Send Message (No test) but might have a hell of a time remote controlling it using Control Device?
Yeah Jack, I started rereading it after Aaron's post. I think I'm starting to get it... It is just strange to me that browsing the matrix for anything takes a Data Search, so you actually couldn't browse the matrix surely?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-13-13/1832:00>
Could you tell me which section you're referring to?
p.207
Make a Body + Willpower (1 hour) Extended Test
Make a Body x 2 (1 day) Extended Test

No mention of a threshold you need to keep rolling until you reach

the [second] example on p.207
He keeps making the same roll each hour with his 6 dice and gets...
Full pool each roll with no penalty or delay as if the extended test restart each time after a success.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <09-13-13/1908:42>
Is it intended that the Headware "Cyberdeck" have an Avaiability of 5R (despite what deck you install) and only cost 5,000¥ + deck cost?

(as it mean you can install a Shiawase Cyber-5 at chargen as Used headware for 415,781.25¥ and 5R 1R -instead of 549,375¥ and 15R)


Think of it as an accessory. Deck sold separately.

I asked this else where but thought i would move it to hear as i'm still trying to understand how multiple noise sources interact. Slightly altered from the original question to add in some more info.
Q. It is raining really heavily in Seattle, enough to get static noise or rating 3, I'm in the shopping district and it's a spam zone of rating 5 Spam noise, and then someone turns on a Jammer (lets say that with rating and distance, it's 3 noise). What is my noise penalty?

11.

Quote
Q. The devices releasing the spam are RFID tags, so Device Rating 2, does this mean that with the Static Noise of 3 from the rain, they lose their broadcasting functionality, lowering the spam noise by 5?

No, because broadcast functionality is not a wireless bonus. Only wireless bonuses are affected by noise, not basic functionality. For example, you can still browse the Matrix and send messages, even in that nightmare Rating 11 noise you've got in the previous question. However, your grenade's wireless trigger wouldn't work.

I thought the grenades wireless bonus was being able to use wireless trigger without a DNI. So assuming I have a Datajack or the like I can still trigger grenades with the wireless trigger?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: firebug on <09-13-13/1934:59>
Quote
Q. The devices releasing the spam are RFID tags, so Device Rating 2, does this mean that with the Static Noise of 3 from the rain, they lose their broadcasting functionality, lowering the spam noise by 5?

No, because broadcast functionality is not a wireless bonus. Only wireless bonuses are affected by noise, not basic functionality. For example, you can still browse the Matrix and send messages, even in that nightmare Rating 11 noise you've got in the previous question. However, your grenade's wireless trigger wouldn't work.

Quote
When an item has additional functionality when connected to the Matrix, it’s described under the “Wireless” entry  in  the  item’s  description.  This  functionality  only applies when the device has access to the Matrix, which is most of the time unless your gamemaster says otherwise,  like  if  you’ve  entered  a  wireless  static  zone.  If there is a Noise Rating from a situation that is greater than  the  item’s  Device  Rating,  not  including  distance, the item temporarily loses its wireless functionality (see Noise, p. 230).

Your example...  The wireless trigger on the grenade isn't a "wireless bonus", isn't it literally just how the wireless device functions?  The rules don't say there's a difference; they say "wireless functionality" not "wireless bonus" implying they stop functioning entirely.  There's no setting for devices that's "wireless is on but wireless bonus is not active".  The whole point of the wireless bonus/functionality is that they are the both connected, the former being the reward and the latter being the risk.

The rules don't differential between things that are just "bonuses" for being wireless and things that are "basic wireless functions".  They are both considered bonuses that only work when the device is fully functional.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <09-13-13/2016:54>
The rules don't differential between things that are just "bonuses" for being wireless and things that are "basic wireless functions".  They are both considered bonuses that only work when the device is fully functional.
I think they do differentiate to some degree, actually:
Quote from: Page 421
When an item has additional functionality when connected to the Matrix, it’s described under the “Wireless” entry in the item’s description. This functionality only applies when the device has access to the Matrix, which is most of the time unless your gamemaster says otherwise, like if you’ve entered a wireless static zone. If there is a Noise Rating from a situation that is greater than the item’s Device Rating, not including distance, the item temporarily loses its wireless functionality (see Noise, p. 230).
The only RFID tags with a Wireless entry are Sensor tags.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-14-13/0913:21>
No, because broadcast functionality is not a wireless bonus. Only wireless bonuses are affected by noise, not basic functionality. For example, you can still browse the Matrix and send messages, even in that nightmare Rating 11 noise you've got in the previous question. However, your grenade's wireless trigger wouldn't work.
I have been vastly misunderstanding noise then, thank you. I still do not get how they hinder riggers and deckers then...

Riggers and deckers still have Matrix actions to perform, and noise hinders them.

Quote
In terms of browsing he Matrix, with the -11 Data Search Dice Pool, surely I cannot?

I did say browse, not search. You can still visit the Dante's Inferno host, you just would have a hard time finding your friends in the crowd. I point out that you're browsing these words as you read them, but you didn't search for them (well, probably not).

Could you tell me which section you're referring to?
p.207
Make a Body + Willpower (1 hour) Extended Test
Make a Body x 2 (1 day) Extended Test

No mention of a threshold you need to keep rolling until you reach

the [second] example on p.207
He keeps making the same roll each hour with his 6 dice and gets...
Full pool each roll with no penalty or delay as if the extended test restart each time after a success.

I do see that, but I don't see where it says the threshold for the Extended Test is zero.

The rules don't differential between things that are just "bonuses" for being wireless and things that are "basic wireless functions".  They are both considered bonuses that only work when the device is fully functional.

Actually, the rules do differentiate between wireless bonuses and basic functionality on page 421.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: firebug on <09-14-13/0938:36>
The rules don't differential between things that are just "bonuses" for being wireless and things that are "basic wireless functions".  They are both considered bonuses that only work when the device is fully functional.
Actually, the rules do differentiate between wireless bonuses and basic functionality on page 421.

I...  Really don't want to keep arguing this, but, I assume you're talking about this section? I'll bold for my own emphasis.

Quote
When an item has additional functionality when connected to the Matrix, it’s described under the “Wireless” entry  in  the  item’s  description.  This functionality  only applies when the device has access to the Matrix, which is most of the time unless your gamemaster says otherwise,  like  if  you’ve  entered  a  wireless  static  zone.  If there is a Noise Rating from a situation that is greater than  the  item’s  Device  Rating,  not  including  distance, the item temporarily loses its wireless functionality (see Noise, p. 230).

So what you're saying is, since commlinks and other devices (like drones) don't specifically have a "wireless" section, it's assumed that they can't lose any functionality from noise?  This is a good thing for my augmented technomancer...  I just wanna make sure I finally have this understood.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-14-13/1204:09>
The rules don't differential between things that are just "bonuses" for being wireless and things that are "basic wireless functions".  They are both considered bonuses that only work when the device is fully functional.
Actually, the rules do differentiate between wireless bonuses and basic functionality on page 421.

I...  Really don't want to keep arguing this, but, I assume you're talking about this section? I'll bold for my own emphasis.

Quote
When an item has additional functionality when connected to the Matrix, it’s described under the “Wireless” entry  in  the  item’s  description.  This functionality  only applies when the device has access to the Matrix, which is most of the time unless your gamemaster says otherwise,  like  if  you’ve  entered  a  wireless  static  zone.  If there is a Noise Rating from a situation that is greater than  the  item’s  Device  Rating,  not  including  distance, the item temporarily loses its wireless functionality (see Noise, p. 230).

So what you're saying is, since commlinks and other devices (like drones) don't specifically have a "wireless" section, it's assumed that they can't lose any functionality from noise?  This is a good thing for my augmented technomancer...  I just wanna make sure I finally have this understood.

Yes, the "wireless functionality" mentioned in the last sentence you quoted from the book refers to the additional functionality given by the wireless benefit listed with the gear.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-14-13/1300:15>
Q Do Wired Reflexes 1 add +1d6 Initiative Dice even if you are using astral projecting, cold-sim VR or hot-sim VR (to a maximum of total 5d6 Initiative Dice)?


I do see that, but I don't see where it says the threshold for the Extended Test is zero.
Extended tests are used to make repeated rolls and then accumulate the hits you made in each roll until you reach the threshold (success). Each successive roll on an Extended test, players should remove one die from their dice pool. Eventually they'll have no dice left, and the test will be over (fail).

Since there is no listed threshold I assume you don't make repeated rolls to accumulate the hits and instead [always] restart the test (no removal of dice on successive rolls) after just one roll with a full pool and no delay or penalty. Or if lack of listed threshold mean the threshold is zero then you automatically reach the threshold on each roll and [always] restart the test (no removal of dice on successive rolls) after just one roll with a full pool and no delay or penalty.

To enhance this theory; The example [always] restart the test (no removal of dice on successive rolls) after just one roll with a full pool and no delay or penalty.

All three would mean that you [always] restart the test (no removal of dice on successive rolls) after just one roll with a full pool and no delay or penalty.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <09-15-13/1242:40>
Does a stim patch remove (temporarily) stun damage from fading and drain?
Does a stim patch rating 3 used on a character with 1 stun damage still cause 4 stun damage after 30 minutes?

What happens when an effect removes a number of stun (or physical) damage greater than the amount on a condition monitor?
{edit to make separation of subject clearer}
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <09-15-13/1247:16>
Can you have additional SINs loaded (but not active) on your comlink and switch between them like programs or do you need a separate comlink for each SIN?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-16-13/0507:40>
Does a stim patch remove (temporarily) stun damage from fading and drain?
Yes
No. You can not heal fading or drain in any other way than resting.

The wording of Stim patch is that it remove (permanently heal) the damage.
When the duration is up the patient take (new)  stun damage.

What happens when an effect removes a number of stun (or physical) damage greater than the amount on a condition monitor?
Nothing.
(It removes a number of boxes of Stun damage (not physical) equal to its Rating. The effect of removing a number of boxes of Stun damage last for (Rating x 10) minutes).

Does a stim patch rating 3 used on a character with 1 stun damage still cause 4 stun damage after 30 minutes?
Yes.
(So in this case it would have been better to use a stim patch rating 1 or wait until you suffer more stun damage before you use the stim patch rating 3)

Can you have additional SINs loaded (but not active) on your comlink and switch between them like programs or do you need a separate comlink for each SIN?
You can have multiple (often fake) SINs stored on a commlink and switch between them at will. You can only have one SIN loaded (or currently active - same thing) per commlink.

At a security checkpoint or when you legally buy an item you will only display one SIN; the loaded or currently active SIN.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-16-13/1624:46>
Q: Detecting Hackers
Quote
If you succeed with an Attack action, your target becomes aware that it is under attack by another icon, but it doesn’t automatically spot you. It will most likely actively search for you on its next action...

Please describe what (if any) action the target has to use in order to spot the attacker?
If in a Host/within 100 meters, is it automatic on their next turn?
If the attacker is Running Silently, does the target have to specify any pertinent information (i.e. Last Matrix Action An icon performed) or is it sufficient to just search for the icon that attacked them (i.e. Spot the Icon You Are Looking For). (I realize that is a compound question, but I hope you get the jist).

Thanks!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-17-13/1428:36>
Q: Gremlins Negative Quality

The NQ states that you are to reduce the number of 1s required for a glitch by 1 for each level of ths skill required. The glitch rules state that a glitch occurs when more than half of the dice rolled on a test come up as ones.

What happens if you have Gremlins (2) and a dice pool of 3? Normally, you would need two 1s to trigger a glitch. With Gremlins, this would be reduced to 0 ones required for a glitch. Does that mean that you always glitch in this situation? The text doesn't say "Reduce the number of 1s required for a glitch by one for each level of Gremlins, to a minimum of X" as some other qualities/skills/actions do. Thanks!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <09-18-13/0125:53>
Q: Gremlins Negative Quality

The NQ states that you are to reduce the number of 1s required for a glitch by 1 for each level of ths skill required. The glitch rules state that a glitch occurs when more than half of the dice rolled on a test come up as ones.

What happens if you have Gremlins (2) and a dice pool of 3? Normally, you would need two 1s to trigger a glitch. With Gremlins, this would be reduced to 0 ones required for a glitch. Does that mean that you always glitch in this situation? The text doesn't say "Reduce the number of 1s required for a glitch by one for each level of Gremlins, to a minimum of X" as some other qualities/skills/actions do. Thanks!

Well...if you can still glitch and succeed, I do not see a problem with this..You can succeed, and still have something bad happen!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-18-13/1133:18>
Spirits

Q: The Spirit Basics entry on p. 301 states:
Quote
When materialized, the spirit uses astral perception (its only perception) to perceive the physical world.
How does this work with Spirits who explicitly have Enhanced Sense powers? (e.g. Spirits of Man (Thermographic Vision), Spirits of Beast (Hearing, Low-Light Vision, Smell))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: acolyte99 on <09-18-13/1233:14>
In addition to the spirit post: all spirits have Perception, which would be useless, if the quoted sentence is correct.
Normally one could argue, that a materialized spirit is dual-natured and the dual-natured critter power stated that " that a dual-natured critter always senses both the physical and astral worlds". But with this quote specific would trump general and materialized spirits wouldn't be able to see colors, see through glass, hear words exactly (not muffled like from astral space), see photographs etc.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-19-13/0709:28>
(are you assuming you can't take perception tests when you are using astral perception to spot things that are not astral obvious...? mana barriers, for example, impose a visual penalty equal to the barrier's Force on the astral plane - but transparent or even invisible on the physical plane).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-19-13/0813:55>
The book seems to state that this would be assensing. I know there was an earlier thread on this, but I am not sure if this passage was brought up or not. Yet again, it's a question of whether the final clause modifies both prior statements:
Quote
Like physical perception, you don’t need to make a test to see things that are immediately obvious (and since astral forms are bright and vibrant, this means that most astral forms are easy to spot). You only need to roll the dice when your target is trying to hide or when you’re trying to observe in detail—then you make an Assensing Test to see what you can see.
Given that both functions would be covered by Perception in the meat world, it seems like Asssensing would apply equally here. Not a fan of it, but I think it is what the book is saying.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: acolyte99 on <09-19-13/0834:13>
(yes, I always assumed, that when using astral perception I always use Assensing for perception, not only when I analyse an aura. I've just checked the Assensing skill description (page 142)  and the paragraph about Astral Perception (page 312) and I see that may have been wrong. Interesting, that JackVII has just found this quote, that explicitly uses Assensing for percepting hidden things.
Assensing is probably only for auras, nor for "seeing" in general in astral space (except by RAW also for percepting hidden things). So all spirits having Perception would be ok, even if they couldn't see the physical world like humans do).

But the question is still there, why do some spirits have Enhanced Senses they don't have the basic sense for and in addition
What is meant by the sentence right before the quote JackVII wrote before:
page 301, SR5
Quote
The spirit is dual-natured while it’s materialized, which means it exists simultaneously on the physical and astral plane, meaning it can see objects in both places

The emphasised part makes no sense, if the spirit can only use astral perception. The only instance how there could be a difference in astral perception between being physical and being astral would be, if there was a mana barrier between me and the objects that was cast in astral space. Then I couldn't see the physical objects behind the barrier from my astral point of view, but I could see them from my physical point of view. But this is such an improbable case, that I don't think that this sentence was formulated for this one thing.

Normally I would assume, that this sentence does express, that a spirit can simultaneously astral percept and see physically like a human does.
But that is expressively contradicted in the next sentence.
So
Question: can a materialized spirit see like a normal human can?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-19-13/1209:06>
To access and interact with Virtual Reality you need Direct Neural Interface (DNI) and a sim-module.
You can access and interact with Augmented Reality (AR) if you have an Image Link (in an imaging device or in eyes/cybereyes).

Q Do you need sim-module to access and interact with AR if you have DNI (and no Image Link)?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-20-13/0608:59>
Ages ago I asked in the FAQ if you can trade in Simple Actions during your Action Phase for Free Actions. The answer is "yes, page 164". D'oh. -_-

This is assuming "A character may also take a Free Action with the two Simple Actions" means "You can use a Simple Action for a Free Action" rather than a complicated way in an incorrect manner of repeating what has already been stated repeatedly in the rules, namely that you get 1 Free Action per Action Phase.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-20-13/1604:45>
Q Can a slaved device use both the mental attribute and the matrix attribute from a master device when defending against a matrix attack.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <09-20-13/1842:56>
And in a related thread:

Q. Can a device that is wirelessly slaved to another device use the Device Rating of it's master to determine Noise modifiers and whether or not Wireless functionality is temporarily lost?
Q: Can a device be connected to another device through a Universal Data Cable as per "Direct Connections"  on page 231 and still be considered "connected to the Matrix", as long as both devices have wireless functionality enabled and are not suffering from positive noise modifiers (i.e. disconnected)?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MagusRogue on <09-20-13/1849:30>
Not sure if this has been noted already or not, but this really needs to go to the Devs. No where in the book does it outright state if damage overflows either Condition Monitor that you go unconscious. It's only mentioned in some merits and the like. This needs to be directly mentioned on pg 170 as an absolute when a condition monitor overflows (in addition to other stuff). This put a GRINDING halt in our combat and ran it into the ground until I pulled up the pdf and did a search for Unconscious........... Really really needs fixed here.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-20-13/1856:15>
I first posted that in the errata topic 2 months ago.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MagusRogue on <09-20-13/2138:57>
lol well then my apologies. my search foo isn't the best in the world.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-21-13/0522:01>
The search function is a pain to use so I tend to just grab the print versions of the FAQ and Errata topics and search in those. :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <09-21-13/0723:18>
The Mindlink spell says
Quote
The subject must remain
within range of the magician for the Mindlink to work.
does this mean within arms reach or actually touching or something else?

(edit)
can't believe I missed this
Quote
The standard range of the sense a Detection
spell grants is the spell’s Force x caster’s Magic in
meters as a radius from the target of the spell
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DigitalZombie on <09-21-13/1145:21>
is it correctly understood that a character with the quality "natural immunity 10 jazz" can take a dose of jazz and gain its benefits of increased reaction and initiative dice, but not suffer addiction? as the quality makes the character immune to all ill effects (unless he ODs), but benefits are unaffected. Or does it only make him ignore automatic stun damage from cram, nitro and so on? with the relevant quality ofcourse.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lynx on <09-21-13/1419:51>
What are IC statistics, I understand the host rating, but what about for willpower or logic ?

What about IC intuition for initiative ?

What about condition monitors ?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-21-13/1539:24>
IC use the Device Rating for attributes.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-22-13/0358:09>
Q.What about Indirect AOE Combat Spells like Blast? The example has some gangers rolling dodge

Also no. Which example are you looking at?

Quote
Q At Char Gen can you buy a Custom Cyberlimb that has Attributes OVER your current natural Rating, without using Enhancements. (An Elf With AGI 4 buying a Custom Limb with AGI 6)

Yes.

Quote
Q What happens when you roll under 3 hits on an AOE Indirect combat spell but still more hits then the defender (if they can defend). Does this all ways make the damage to resist drop to Force?

You miss by a certain distance. 2D6 meters, if I remember. There is no defender roll; it's a Success Test.

Did you read the spoiler...? :)

Yes. The modifier is an error leftover from SR4.

Quote
If this is really true(?!) then we need an errata to correct the following:
1) clarification on p.181 that defenders does not get to roll dodge in step 3 of the combat sequence on p.173
2) table on p.477 is wrong
3) combat spell rules on p.283 regarding indirect aoe spells are wrong
4) example on p.283 is wrong
5) table on p.189 is wrong
6) damage and passengers on p.205 need clarification
7) defender modification on p.190 is wrong

That looks like a familiar set of errata. If you can hold on until after Gen Con, you'll get a more official answer, but until then it's only us lowly freelancers that have any time to offer help.

Quote
It also make grenades really really powerful.

Dealing more damage than a sniper rifle (even before confined space mods) and all you only need is 3 hits (not net hits) on your throw to always land and detonate the grenade within 1m of your target.

Indeed, grenades are dangerous weapons. The modern grenade is advertised with a five-meter kill radius and a casualty radius of fifteen meters. Although you're not factoring in range penalties, which come up a lot for all but the strongest throwers.

So - did we ever get any clarification from Gen Con... Did players get to take a defense test [of some sort] against grenades and indirect LOS (A) spells?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-22-13/0552:22>
On GenCon, yes, though it likely was houserules. The witness statement can be found elsewhere on this forum and I quoted it in one debate.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-22-13/0808:55>
Spellcasting targeting:
Cyber- or bioware visual enhancements that have been paid for with Essence count as natural.

Smartgun/smartlink bonus:
+2 if you’re using an augmentation for which you paid Essence


Q Do visual augmentations that you pay with capacity provided by cybereyes count as natural and/or give you +2 dice pool bonus to all attacks with the weapon?



On GenCon, yes, though it likely was houserules. The witness statement can be found elsewhere on this forum and I quoted it in one debate.
Was mostly referring to the part i marked in bold.

Let me shorten down the quote for visibility:
...If you can hold on until after Gen Con, you'll get a more official answer...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <09-23-13/1718:23>
When increasing an augmented attribute with karma, is the starting value used to calculate cost the augmented or unaugmented value?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-23-13/1722:08>
Unaugmented.

[spoiler]There was a debate on that a while ago, but while people are conflicted on Magic, nobody seems to think the augmented value is used for raising an augmented attribute.[/spoiler]
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-23-13/1804:14>
Q Do Wired Reflexes 1 add +1d6 Initiative Dice even if you are using astral projecting, cold-sim VR or hot-sim VR (to a maximum of total 5d6 Initiative Dice)?

No.

Quote
Since there is no listed threshold I assume you don't make repeated rolls to accumulate the hits and instead [always] restart the test (no removal of dice on successive rolls) after just one roll with a full pool and no delay or penalty.

I see, so the "threshold zero" theory is an assumption on your part and not actually something in the rulebook that I was missing. Okay, thanks.

No, the threshold of the Extended Test isn't zero.

Does a stim patch remove (temporarily) stun damage from fading and drain?

Yes. Drain and Fading can't be healed except by time, but stim patches remove stun damage (albeit temporarily).

Quote
Does a stim patch rating 3 used on a character with 1 stun damage still cause 4 stun damage after 30 minutes?

Yep.

Quote
What happens when an effect removes a number of stun (or physical) damage greater than the amount on a condition monitor?
{edit to make separation of subject clearer}

The remaining effect is lost. You can't remove what ain't there, chummer. =i)

Can you have additional SINs loaded (but not active) on your comlink and switch between them like programs or do you need a separate comlink for each SIN?

The first thing.

Q: Detecting Hackers
Quote
If you succeed with an Attack action, your target becomes aware that it is under attack by another icon, but it doesn’t automatically spot you. It will most likely actively search for you on its next action...

Please describe what (if any) action the target has to use in order to spot the attacker?

This has been covered in great detail in another thread (if not already in this one). I'll just give quick answers here.

Quote
If in a Host/within 100 meters, is it automatic on their next turn?
If the attacker is Running Silently, does the target have to specify any pertinent information (i.e. Last Matrix Action An icon performed) or is it sufficient to just search for the icon that attacked them (i.e. Spot the Icon You Are Looking For). (I realize that is a compound question, but I hope you get the jist).

Yes, if the attacker isn't running silent.
"The guy who just attacked me" is sufficient for a Matrix Perception Test against an icon that's running silent.

Q: Gremlins Negative Quality

The NQ states that you are to reduce the number of 1s required for a glitch by 1 for each level of ths skill required. The glitch rules state that a glitch occurs when more than half of the dice rolled on a test come up as ones.

What happens if you have Gremlins (2) and a dice pool of 3? Normally, you would need two 1s to trigger a glitch. With Gremlins, this would be reduced to 0 ones required for a glitch. Does that mean that you always glitch in this situation? The text doesn't say "Reduce the number of 1s required for a glitch by one for each level of Gremlins, to a minimum of X" as some other qualities/skills/actions do. Thanks!

DOOOOOOOOMMMMMMM!!! Or rather, GLIIIIIITTTTCHHHHHHHH! Or more specifically, every roll is a glitch, and a critical glitch if you get no hits.

Spirits

Q: The Spirit Basics entry on p. 301 states:
Quote
When materialized, the spirit uses astral perception (its only perception) to perceive the physical world.
How does this work with Spirits who explicitly have Enhanced Sense powers? (e.g. Spirits of Man (Thermographic Vision), Spirits of Beast (Hearing, Low-Light Vision, Smell))

The Enhanced Senses are above and beyond the default perception. These powers allow the spirit to perceive mundane things in addition to their astral perception.

In addition to the spirit post: all spirits have Perception, which would be useless, if the quoted sentence is correct.
Normally one could argue, that a materialized spirit is dual-natured and the dual-natured critter power stated that " that a dual-natured critter always senses both the physical and astral worlds". But with this quote specific would trump general and materialized spirits wouldn't be able to see colors, see through glass, hear words exactly (not muffled like from astral space), see photographs etc.

If you haven't already, I suggest you bring this up on the errata thread.

Question: can a materialized spirit see like a normal human can?

Not without a critter power or a spell.

To access and interact with Virtual Reality you need Direct Neural Interface (DNI) and a sim-module.
You can access and interact with Augmented Reality (AR) if you have an Image Link (in an imaging device or in eyes/cybereyes).

Q Do you need sim-module to access and interact with AR if you have DNI (and no Image Link)?

Nope. You can see and hear with just DNI, and you get the rest of the senses with a sim module.

Q Can a slaved device use both the mental attribute and the matrix attribute from a master device when defending against a matrix attack.

Yep.



Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-23-13/1817:24>
And in a related thread:

Q. Can a device that is wirelessly slaved to another device use the Device Rating of it's master to determine Noise modifiers and whether or not Wireless functionality is temporarily lost?

Nope, only when making defense tests.

Quote
Q: Can a device be connected to another device through a Universal Data Cable as per "Direct Connections"  on page 231 and still be considered "connected to the Matrix", as long as both devices have wireless functionality enabled and are not suffering from positive noise modifiers (i.e. disconnected)?

If both devices have their wireless active, they're both on the Matrix, regardless of whether they're also directly connected. The direct connection would be redundant in this case (assuming no noise modifiers as stated).

is it correctly understood that a character with the quality "natural immunity 10 jazz" can take a dose of jazz and gain its benefits of increased reaction and initiative dice, but not suffer addiction? as the quality makes the character immune to all ill effects (unless he ODs), but benefits are unaffected. Or does it only make him ignore automatic stun damage from cram, nitro and so on? with the relevant quality ofcourse.

Good question. Strictly speaking, the jazz would work fine, and the character wouldn't suffer the associated depression and disorientation when she comes down unless she takes more than one dose in six hours.

So - did we ever get any clarification from Gen Con... Did players get to take a defense test [of some sort] against grenades and indirect LOS (A) spells?

Yes we did: there's no defense test against grenades, indirect LOS (A) spells, and other "zones of damage." The defense against these attacks is to take precautions against them. This is really really really true, and been confirmed by multiple sources inside the company. So unless there's been a meeting somewhere to which I wasn't privy, you really really honestly and truly don't get to make a defense test against grenades or indirect LOS (A) spells.

Q Do visual augmentations that you pay with capacity provided by cybereyes count as natural and/or give you +2 dice pool bonus to all attacks with the weapon?

Yes, as long as the thing that provided the capacity was paid for with Essence.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <09-24-13/0207:27>
Thanks, Aaron.

Followup on the Matrix stuff:
When taking a hostile action against a device that is not his (i.e. brute forcing an opponents commlink, or spoofing a drone), in which device does his persona reside?

This is important to determine when noise modifiers for items like Jammers apply. For example; character A (a street sam) is wielding a Rating 6 Jammer, and Character B (the decker) is attempting to (Brute Force/Crash Program/Data Spike/other harmful action that would be affected by Noise) A's commlink. In which of the following is B affected by Noise from A's Jammer, given that Noise = (Rating -1) / 5 meters from device:

A's Jammer is enabled and set to EXCLUDE his own commlink, and A is MORE than 30 meters from B (outside of Jammer range)
A's Jammer is enabled and set to EXCLUDE his own commlink, and A is LESS than 30 meters from B
A's Jammer is enabled and set to INCLUDE his own commlink, and A is MORE than 30 meters from B (outside of Jammer range)
A's Jammer is enabled and set to INCLUDE his own commlink, and A is LESS than 30 meters from B

And by the way, I presume that you meant to say "Nope, only when making defense and resistance tests" ;)

Also, given the apparent ruling on AoE tests; what's with the -2 defense penalty when "defending against an AOE attack", then? When would that ever apply if you don't get a defense test?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <09-24-13/0934:06>
Lots of rigger-related questions.

1. Page 264 mentions "other devices" as things that can be rigged and the security spider is reminiscent of the old CCSS rigger.  Is there a way for a rigger to get marks on a device so s/he can use the Control Device matrix action?

2. What does a rigger roll to drive a vehicle while using cold- and/or hot-sim?  Presumably not Reaction since the rigger is a rag doll.

3. Similarly, what does a rigger use for initiative while using cold/hot sim?  I'm assuming it's also Data Processing + Intuition (+dice as appropriate).

4. Can you give an example of a Matrix action that would share a bonus with a Vehicle action (p. 266, under "VR and Rigging")?  For example, does the +1 die to Vehicle and Matrix tests while using hot sim (p. 266) stack with the +2 dice to Matrix tests (p. 231) since "any bonus you get to Matrix actions also applies to Vehicle actions."

5. A rigger is running hot sim on his Optix-X2 scouting an area for potential threats.  Does he get to pick between Perception + Intuition [Sensor] (p. 270) and Electronic Warfare + Intuition [Sensor] (p. 445) for the roll assuming he's using his sensor array.  Is there any reason not to use his sensor array?

6. How are sensor arrays priced?  Are any eight functions from the table on p. 446 essentially free, but after-market modifications (a thermographic modification for your free camera (3), for example) out of pocket?  If the functions aren't free, where are the prices?

7. Going back to the interchangeability of Perception and Electronic Warfare in question 5, can a rigger use Electronic Warfare for a sensor test (p. 184)?

Non-rigger related question:

8. How does a dart of narcojet interact with armor?  Without a power or AP rating for the dart pistol/rifle, it's hard to know how to determine if the dart can deliver its payload.  A guy in full armor is going to be tougher to take down than a pedestrian.



Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: FastJack on <09-24-13/1001:42>
Okay, I can see that this thread is not going to stay on just clarifications on rules, but will be questions as well. As such, I'll merge it with the FAQ thread so we have everything in one place.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <09-24-13/1017:29>
Q: What is allowed to be added to a helmet (i.e. using capacity)?
Trode nets and vision enhancements are listed specifically, and both have known capacity ratings, but what about other equipment like communications gear (jammer/headjammer, white noise generator, etc) audio enhancements, survival gear (respirator/gasmask, flashlight ala Aliens Marines), sensors, etc.

Q: What, if any, is the recovery time for installing cyberware that costs capacity instead of Essence, such as a cybergun or a commlink in a cyberlimb, and how does this affect training times?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-24-13/1257:44>
Is there a way for a rigger to get marks on a device so s/he can use the Control Device matrix action?
Being the owner of the device (or considered the owner, p.360).
Owner of the device invite marks to the rigger.
Jacking into the Matrix from a cyberdeck and steal marks using hack on the fly or brute force.


... in which device does his persona reside?
His persona reside on the Matrix. The decker's persona is his own icon and the device is its own icon. The two does not "merge" unless the persona Jumped Into the device (and the owner of the persona have a control rig, owner or 3 marks on the device, the device got rigger interface and nobody else is jumped into it at the moment) or if he use the device to Jack into the Matrix with (your persona icon merge with the commlink or cyberdeck icon you use when you jack into the matrix). The only time a decker "enter" another icon is when he enter a host.

If the decker is not on the jammer's exclude list then he will suffer noise when performing wireless matrix actions against a device that physically is in the jammer's area of effect (or if the decker's physical cyberdeck is within the jammer's area of effect -unless he use a direct cable to the device).


the -2 on the defense test table is an old legacy that will be changed in upcoming errata.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <09-24-13/1327:54>
Is there a way for a rigger to get marks on a device so s/he can use the Control Device matrix action?
Being the owner of the device (or considered the owner, p.360).
Owner of the device invite marks to the rigger.
Jacking into the Matrix from a cyberdeck and steal marks using hack on the fly or brute force.


If I recall correctly, Aaron (with all the usual caveats) indicated that a Comlink could be used to hack if edge was spent to push the limit for the absent Sleaze and Attack ratings. If that ends up being the case then I see no reason the same shouldn't be true of RCCs, which would allow a Rigger to spend edge to brute force or hack on the fly.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <09-24-13/1357:45>
Xenon, so in all of my above examples the decker (B) would be affected by Noise generated by the jammer carried by A? Makes sense; didn't catch the part about hosts.

Another question that's been asked before (page 5) but that I'd really like an answer to:
P. 141/142, "Using Leadership" :
How long does the potential Initiative bonuses from the complex action "Rally" last?
1. Until the next combat turn as per the "Changing Initiative" rules on P160, or
2. Until combat ends as there is no duration stated, or
3. Something else
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-24-13/1755:53>
Thanks, Aaron.

Followup on the Matrix stuff:
When taking a hostile action against a device that is not his (i.e. brute forcing an opponents commlink, or spoofing a drone), in which device does his persona reside?

The one providing the persona. In SR4, you could enter other people's devices. In SR5, the only thing your persona can enter is a host.

Quote
And by the way, I presume that you meant to say "Nope, only when making defense and resistance tests" ;)

You're welcome to presume that, but you'd be wrong. Defense tests are the ones you use against actions (the bit after the "v." in the test description). Resistance tests are for things like resisting damage. Slaving helps with the former, but not the latter.

Quote
Also, given the apparent ruling on AoE tests; what's with the -2 defense penalty when "defending against an AOE attack", then? When would that ever apply if you don't get a defense test?

It would never apply because it's an error that I believe will be removed in the errata when it is released.

Lots of rigger-related questions.

1. Page 264 mentions "other devices" as things that can be rigged and the security spider is reminiscent of the old CCSS rigger.  Is there a way for a rigger to get marks on a device so s/he can use the Control Device matrix action?

2. What does a rigger roll to drive a vehicle while using cold- and/or hot-sim?  Presumably not Reaction since the rigger is a rag doll.

3. Similarly, what does a rigger use for initiative while using cold/hot sim?  I'm assuming it's also Data Processing + Intuition (+dice as appropriate).

4. Can you give an example of a Matrix action that would share a bonus with a Vehicle action (p. 266, under "VR and Rigging")?  For example, does the +1 die to Vehicle and Matrix tests while using hot sim (p. 266) stack with the +2 dice to Matrix tests (p. 231) since "any bonus you get to Matrix actions also applies to Vehicle actions."

5. A rigger is running hot sim on his Optix-X2 scouting an area for potential threats.  Does he get to pick between Perception + Intuition [Sensor] (p. 270) and Electronic Warfare + Intuition [Sensor] (p. 445) for the roll assuming he's using his sensor array.  Is there any reason not to use his sensor array?

6. How are sensor arrays priced?  Are any eight functions from the table on p. 446 essentially free, but after-market modifications (a thermographic modification for your free camera (3), for example) out of pocket?  If the functions aren't free, where are the prices?

7. Going back to the interchangeability of Perception and Electronic Warfare in question 5, can a rigger use Electronic Warfare for a sensor test (p. 184)?

Non-rigger related question:

8. How does a dart of narcojet interact with armor?  Without a power or AP rating for the dart pistol/rifle, it's hard to know how to determine if the dart can deliver its payload.  A guy in full armor is going to be tougher to take down than a pedestrian.

1. Yes, the same way that hackers do it. They can't jump into a device that doesn't have a rigger interface, though.

2. Reaction. It's the same medulla oblongata and motor cortex, it's just the signals go to different places than Mother Nature intended.

3. Data Processing + Intuition.

4. Yep, your example is correct. Rigging is awesome (until you get hacked or totaled).

5. Yep. Possibly, depending on the situation.

6. Single sensor functions cost Rating x 100¥, arrays of eight cost Rating x 1,000¥. Since your vehicle is big enough to not have to worry about sensor capacity, I suggest you buy them individually at your vehicle's Sensor rating.

7. I think this was already answered in 5.

8. Injection darts, p. 434, SR5.

Okay, I can see that this thread is not going to stay on just clarifications on rules, but will be questions as well. As such, I'll merge it with the FAQ thread so we have everything in one place.

Thanks, FastJack!

Q: What is allowed to be added to a helmet (i.e. using capacity)?
Trode nets and vision enhancements are listed specifically, and both have known capacity ratings, but what about other equipment like communications gear (jammer/headjammer, white noise generator, etc) audio enhancements, survival gear (respirator/gasmask, flashlight ala Aliens Marines), sensors, etc.

Sounds good to me. Check with your GM to be sure.

Quote
Q: What, if any, is the recovery time for installing cyberware that costs capacity instead of Essence, such as a cybergun or a commlink in a cyberlimb, and how does this affect training times?

The recovery is based on Essence cost. Since there's no Essence spent, there's no recovery time, and it doesn't affect training times.

Xenon, so in all of my above examples the decker (B) would be affected by Noise generated by the jammer carried by A? Makes sense; didn't catch the part about hosts.

Another question that's been asked before (page 5) but that I'd really like an answer to:
P. 141/142, "Using Leadership" :
How long does the potential Initiative bonuses from the complex action "Rally" last?
1. Until the next combat turn as per the "Changing Initiative" rules on P160, or
2. Until combat ends as there is no duration stated, or
3. Something else

The answer is 1. The Rally use of Leadership is an instantaneous bonus, added immediately the same way that taking an interrupt action reduces Initiative Score immediately.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <09-24-13/1918:26>
Thanks for the reply--a quick follow-up/clarification regarding sensor cost.  Page 445 states, "most vehicles and drones come factory-equipped with a sensor array (at a rating listed with their stats)."  I took this to mean that all drones have a sensor array (3) as part of their off-the-shelf cost.  Since an array "includes up to eight functions listed on the Sensor Table," I read this as meaning that all drones have up to 8 things from the table at rating 3 for free, even though it's a little strange to have a 3,000 nuyen array in a 1,000 nuyen drone.  Drones have arrays, arrays are specific things, ergo drones have those specific things.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-24-13/1924:30>
Q: When does Spell Defense apply vs AoE spells? Versus the Spellcasting roll, on damage resistance or not at all?

Also, just to be sure: Am I reading page 164 correct that it means that during your own turn, you can convert Simple Actions into Free Actions (for using during your own turn, not for during other people their turns)?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-24-13/1932:24>
Thanks for the reply--a quick follow-up/clarification regarding sensor cost.  Page 445 states, "most vehicles and drones come factory-equipped with a sensor array (at a rating listed with their stats)."  I took this to mean that all drones have a sensor array (3) as part of their off-the-shelf cost.  Since an array "includes up to eight functions listed on the Sensor Table," I read this as meaning that all drones have up to 8 things from the table at rating 3 for free, even though it's a little strange to have a 3,000 nuyen array in a 1,000 nuyen drone.  Drones have arrays, arrays are specific things, ergo drones have those specific things.

The manufacturer gets a bulk discount on most drone parts. If you're willing to buy sensor arrays in 50,000 count lots, you could probably get that kind of a discount, too. =i)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <09-24-13/1935:13>
1: Do the effects of a Stim Patch wear off, or are the effects permanent?

So if you have 6 stun damage, and use a Rating 6 stim patch, after 60 minutes, what happens?

A: You take Rating+1 damage, so you now have 7 stun.
B: The effects wear off, and then you take Rating+1 damage, so you now have 13 stun, and probably overflowed into physical.

2: How does the Indirect Touch spell, Punch, work?

According to page 282, to hit an unwilling target of a Touch spell, you must make an Unarmed attack.
According to page 283, Indirect Combat spells are Spellcasting + Magic [Force] vs. Reaction + Intuition.

So do you roll Unarmed + Agility [Physical] vs. Reaction + Intuition to Touch the target, then Spellcasting + Magic [Force] Vs. Reaction + Intuition for the actual spell? This seems weird to me, since it means the target is dodging twice, the second time after you've already touched him.

3: Punch/Clout/Blast are Physical magic spells that deal Stun damage. Shatter/Powerbolt/Powerball are Physical magic spells that deal Physical damage. These two groups of spells seem to be parallels to eachother, but the first group is Indirect, the second group is Direct. There are no Indirect combat spells that deal non-elemental Physical damage. Is this a typo?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <09-24-13/1944:53>
Thanks for taking time to answer us, Aaron, that takes care of all of my questions for now :)

And my bad on the presumption; I was thinking about Noise, which does not affect defense and resistance tests.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Cormroc on <09-24-13/2229:18>
4. Can you give an example of a Matrix action that would share a bonus with a Vehicle action (p. 266, under "VR and Rigging")?  For example, does the +1 die to Vehicle and Matrix tests while using hot sim (p. 266) stack with the +2 dice to Matrix tests (p. 231) since "any bonus you get to Matrix actions also applies to Vehicle actions."

4. Yep, your example is correct. Rigging is awesome (until you get hacked or totaled).

Reading p266 again I still am of the opinion that the +1 bonus and the +2 bonus are the same bonus, either p231 should  have been +1 or p266 should have been +2. The entire paragraph in question is summing up the primary matrix VR bonuses that riggers can apply to vehicle tests while jumped in, I don't see how the phrase (clause? I'm not particularly good at grammar) in question could be interpreted any differently. I lean towards the +2 being correct as any changes made during development were probably applied to the Matrix chapter and the Rigger chapter was overlooked as no one remembered that the applicable bonuses were restated there.

If the +3 pool modifier is correct then there definitely needs to be an errata for that section (p266) because that is not what it currently states.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <09-24-13/2255:40>
Q: Does the simple action "Stand Up" count as "Movement" for the purposes of Interception attacks?
In other words, if Character A knocks Character B to the ground with a melee attack during A's initiative phase, and Character B stands back up during B's initiative phase, can A take an immediate Intercept Action (decreasing his initiative by 5) to attempt a melee attack as per page 194?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Noble Drake on <09-24-13/2314:07>
There are no Indirect combat spells that deal non-elemental Physical damage. Is this a typo?
There are no spells which create a cutting or puncturing attack, so why would there be an indirect combat spell that deals non-elemental Physical damage?

My opinion: you want to inflict physical damage with good armor penetration at range, use the Enfield AS-7 loaded with APDS rounds spell.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-24-13/2337:08>
1: Do the effects of a Stim Patch wear off, or are the effects permanent?

So if you have 6 stun damage, and use a Rating 6 stim patch, after 60 minutes, what happens?

At the end of 60 minutes you take 7 boxes of Stun damage that you can't resist. The 6 boxes you used to have were removed by the initial effect of the stim patch.

Quote
2: How does the Indirect Touch spell, Punch, work?

In the specific case of a touch-range combat spell, the Spellcasting test takes the place of the Unarmed attack. So you only need to make the Spellcasting Test, which is defended against by the target's Reaction + Intuition.

Quote
3: Punch/Clout/Blast are Physical magic spells that deal Stun damage. Shatter/Powerbolt/Powerball are Physical magic spells that deal Physical damage. These two groups of spells seem to be parallels to eachother, but the first group is Indirect, the second group is Direct. There are no Indirect combat spells that deal non-elemental Physical damage. Is this a typo?

Nope, not a typo. At this time, the spells listed are the ones available. Look for more spells in future source books.

4. Can you give an example of a Matrix action that would share a bonus with a Vehicle action (p. 266, under "VR and Rigging")?  For example, does the +1 die to Vehicle and Matrix tests while using hot sim (p. 266) stack with the +2 dice to Matrix tests (p. 231) since "any bonus you get to Matrix actions also applies to Vehicle actions."

4. Yep, your example is correct. Rigging is awesome (until you get hacked or totaled).

Reading p266 again I still am of the opinion that the +1 bonus and the +2 bonus are the same bonus, either p231 should  have been +1 or p266 should have been +2. The entire paragraph in question is summing up the primary matrix VR bonuses that riggers can apply to vehicle tests while jumped in, I don't see how the phrase (clause? I'm not particularly good at grammar) in question could be interpreted any differently. I lean towards the +2 being correct as any changes made during development were probably applied to the Matrix chapter and the Rigger chapter was overlooked as no one remembered that the applicable bonuses were restated there.

If the +3 pool modifier is correct then there definitely needs to be an errata for that section (p266) because that is not what it currently states.

I had assumed that you were talking about stacking the hot-sim bonus and the control rig bonus. They do stack.

Q: Does the simple action "Stand Up" count as "Movement" for the purposes of Interception attacks?
In other words, if Character A knocks Character B to the ground with a melee attack during A's initiative phase, and Character B stands back up during B's initiative phase, can A take an immediate Intercept Action (decreasing his initiative by 5) to attempt a melee attack as per page 194?

Good question. I'd say that it looks like as long as all you're doing is changing your stance from prone to upright, you're not susceptible to an Intercept attack. If you're trying to get away while scrambling to your feet, then you're askin' for it.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <09-25-13/0120:27>
Am I correct in thinking that a Physical Barrier spell is extremely unlikely to stop bullets because bullets are a penetrating attack and will only do one damage to he barrier created if they have a DV greater than the armor of the barrier reduced by AP with the rest going through to hit the intend target?
It strikes me as odd that the barrier created by a Physical Barrier spell seems to be the only one with armor equal to structure. All the example barriers had double the structure in armor.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <09-25-13/0236:30>
Q: Which specialization applies to cyber guns?
The Automatics and Unarmed Combat skills both list Cyber Implants as possible specializations, while Heavy Weapons (for the Grenade Launcher cybergun), Longarms (for the Shotgun cybergun), and Pistols (for the Holdout, Light, and Heavy Pistol cyberguns) do not.

The section for cyber melee weapons lists Unarmed Combat as the skill to use, but the same section for cyberguns do not. In other words, will a Longarms (Shotgun) specialization apply to the implanted Shotgun cybergun, or would one have to take Longarms (Cyber Implants) for this to apply?

[spoiler=Personal Opinion]
While Unarmed Combat (Cyber Implants) seems to be the most sensible choice for cyber melee weapons, I don't think the same applies to the ranged firearms categories. For one, all four implant weapons (hand razors, hand blades, spurs, and shock hand) benefit from this specialization, whereas the same is not true for ranged weapons. Breaking it down by category;
Automatics: 2 total (SMG and machine pistol)
Heavy Weapons: 1 total (grenade launcher)
Longarms: 1 total (shotgun)
Pistols: 3 total (holdout, light, and heavy pistol)
Unarmed Combat: 4 total (razors, blades, spurs, and shock glove)

By forcing the player to specialize in Heavy Weapons (Cyber Implants), for example, the cost effectiveness (and thus game balance) of this compared to the much more common Pistols (Cyber Implants) is dramatically offset. Spending 7 karma and a month of training (in game) for +2 dice for ONE weapon is hardly comparable to that of gaining it for multiple ones.

Furthermore, a character that is highly trained in Unarmed Combat (Cyber Implants) is also highly trained in unarmed combat, subdual combat, and knockdown. The same is not the case for any of the other weapon categories.[/spoiler]
I believe that the specialization for each subcategory should apply to ranged cyberguns, which seems to be the case by RAW except for everything except Automatics.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ve4grm on <09-25-13/0254:34>
So - did we ever get any clarification from Gen Con... Did players get to take a defense test [of some sort] against grenades and indirect LOS (A) spells?

Yes we did: there's no defense test against grenades, indirect LOS (A) spells, and other "zones of damage." The defense against these attacks is to take precautions against them. This is really really really true, and been confirmed by multiple sources inside the company. So unless there's been a meeting somewhere to which I wasn't privy, you really really honestly and truly don't get to make a defense test against grenades or indirect LOS (A) spells.

Very well. Then can we please get an explanation as to how counterspelling is meant to be used against area spells? The text goes out of its way to describe how you can give the bonus to multiple people, but counterspelling only adds to defense tests, and area spells like Fireball have no such tests.

(Additionally, the spellcasting example on page 283 has an unidentified defense test being made in it against a Blast spell, and the counterspelling example on page 295 specifically uses a fireball as the example of group counterspelling. This section has left me very confused.)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Novocrane on <09-25-13/0502:48>
Stupid question, but I couldn't find the answer. What happens when you purchase more than one lifestyle quality at chargen?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-25-13/0536:12>
Q Does an imaging device (p.443) digitizes the visual input for you (p.281) or will it act as a transparent object (p.281) if you turn off visual enhancements.
(can you use low light vision goggles to target spells through if you turn off low light).




Stupid question, but I couldn't find the answer. What happens when you purchase more than one lifestyle quality at chargen?
You can buy a secondary lifestyle to use together with a fake SIN or to use as a safe house / hiding.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-25-13/0944:30>
Quote
Q. The devices releasing the spam are RFID tags, so Device Rating 2, does this mean that with the Static Noise of 3 from the rain, they lose their broadcasting functionality, lowering the spam noise by 5?

No, because broadcast functionality is not a wireless bonus. Only wireless bonuses are affected by noise, not basic functionality. For example, you can still browse the Matrix and send messages, even in that nightmare Rating 11 noise you've got in the previous question. However, your grenade's wireless trigger wouldn't work.
Does that mean Sprawl Wilds Ashes needs to be errata'd, since it says the blanket of Military Grade Jammers blocks wireless communications, resulting in only infrared LOS and cables as possible communication measures?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <09-25-13/1027:23>
Q: How far does a character need to move to be considered running for the purposes of A) making a running jump, and B) making a charging attack?

[spoiler=Physics Breakdown]
To provide some real world examples, look at this (http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2012/08/maximum-acceleration-in-the-100-m-dash/) and this (http://speedendurance.com/2008/08/22/usain-bolt-100m-10-meter-splits-and-speed-endurance/) article examining acceleration and the human body. Physically, at least, the fastest acceleration attainable is 9.8m/s; although the book indicates a falling rate of 50m in the first combat turn, followed by 150m in the second, and a terminal velocity of 200m per combat turn (240km/h, which is a little less than real world skydivers can attain), realistically this will be much less. Usain Bolt managed to clear the first 10 meters of his record setting 100m dash in just 1.685 seconds; in other words, going from 0 to 5.935m/s in one second.

Using equal scores for Agility, Body, Reaction, and Strength, and assuming that a trained runner could get maximum hits allowed by physical limit, this would put Usain Bolt at just below an attribute rating of 3 in Game Mechanic terms:
3 AGI/BOD/REA/STR gives a base running rate of 12m
Add an additional 8m from sprinting (Physical Limit of 4 x2, assuming 4 net hits)
For a total sprinting rate of 6.666667m/s (20m/3 seconds).

The fastest man of the modern world, then, can accelerate to 21km/h in just over 1.5 seconds, whereas in the world of Shadowrun even a complete weakling (1 in all physical stats) can manage to hit nearly 10km/h in just 1 second.

Interestingly, an AGI10 BOD/REA/STR 6 character with Running 12, Hydraulic Jacks Rating 6, and using Edge 6 to get rule of Six on 30 dice (Run rate of 40m + (Sprint = Physical Limit of (16+6)*2 = 48m)) could reach speeds as high as 88m/second (an astounding 316km/h, or, if using the more conservative 3 second combat turn measurement, 29m/s or 105km/h); such a character would be surpassing the modern day cheetah in terms of acceleration by a factor of three (and possibly breaking the laws of physics in the process), and demolishing it's maximum speed as well.

With the current rule of having to exceed walking rate, I am imagining an Agility 10 character doing a warm up lap, running 10 meters away from the enemy just so he can turn around and charge 11 meters back (effectively counting as running). :D

As Agility directly impacts how far a character can jump it makes sense to require that a character attain a certain speed for the purpose of a running leap, but a charge move seems to be all about acceleration in order to increase momentum and thus the force of an attack.

Since even the slowest character can achieve a running speed of 4m/s in one action phase, it seems odd to penalize high-agility characters who could potentially achieve as much as 40m/s speeds in one action phase.

Given that an increase in velocity results in an equal increase in momentum, even the slowest character moving at 4m/s can attain a quadrupled momentum which in effect quadruples his/her mass (a 60kg character impacting with a momentum of 240kg-m/sec in the direction of movement). The faster character in effect multiplies his/her momentum by 40, which could lead to potentially catastrophic consequences (imagine the same 60kg character sprinting at a rate of 40m/s, effectively impacting with a momentum of 2400kg-m/sec in the direction of movement). By comparison, a 100kg linebacker in the NFL can hit approximately 35km/h, meaning that if he was to hit an immobile target he would impact with an approximate momentum of 980 kg-m/sec.[/spoiler]
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Csjarrat on <09-25-13/1036:36>
Q: please can you clarify the options for driving a vehicle for non-riggers?
PG 201, Sr5:
If the pilot is driving with the aid of Augmented Reality,
increase the limit of any tests by 1, and if the pilot is
driving using Virtual Reality, increase limits by 2. If the
pilot is equipped with a Control Rig and is controlling
the vehicle while Jumped In, decrease the threshold of
tests by the rating of the Control Rig (to a minimum of 1).

to me it looks like you have the option of driving in meat, AR and VR (is VR the "control device" matrix option or an at-seat driving option?).
it the book also reads that rigged control is VR only and grants different bonuses to VR/AR driving, being totally separate.

Sub question: if you can drive in VR as a non-rigger, can you ride a bike in VR or does your limp body fall off everytime you make a turn?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: acolyte99 on <09-25-13/1145:37>
About the subquestion:
In SR4 the Motorcycle Gyro Stabilization Modification was published in Arsenal and not contained in the core rulebook. It will probably be the same with SR5. This modification allowed the bike to stay upright, when your body went limp because you were in VR (or dead).
By the way in SR4 driving in VR was not the same as being jumped in. You could "remote-control" your vehicle (and even do that if you were in it; you didn't have to be remote) while in VR. Think of your persona being in a VR "room" full of control interfaces for the vehicle that you can move with your thoughts. It's not being the vehicle (jumped-in), but better than having only a steering wheel and a few pedals.
I think this kind of VR-control is still there in SR5 page 256:
Quote
Remote control is the result of the Control Device action (p. 238),

as one of the four ways to steer a vehicle.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Csjarrat on <09-25-13/1222:51>
About the subquestion:
In SR4 the Motorcycle Gyro Stabilization Modification was published in Arsenal and not contained in the core rulebook. It will probably be the same with SR5. This modification allowed the bike to stay upright, when your body went limp because you were in VR (or dead).
By the way in SR4 driving in VR was not the same as being jumped in. You could "remote-control" your vehicle (and even do that if you were in it; you didn't have to be remote) while in VR. Think of your persona being in a VR "room" full of control interfaces for the vehicle that you can move with your thoughts. It's not being the vehicle (jumped-in), but better than having only a steering wheel and a few pedals.
I think this kind of VR-control is still there in SR5 page 256:
Quote
Remote control is the result of the Control Device action (p. 238),

as one of the four ways to steer a vehicle.
yeah this is why i'm asking. none of the vehicle section mentions anything about bikes not having/needing gyroscopes in this edition, it mentions that a pilot will quite happily take over/drive a vehicle if the driver cannot, with no mention that this doesnt apply to bikes. so by RAW, i should be able to pilot the bike in VR, but wanted to clarify that.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-25-13/1755:31>
Am I correct in thinking that a Physical Barrier spell is extremely unlikely to stop bullets because bullets are a penetrating attack and will only do one damage to he barrier created if they have a DV greater than the armor of the barrier reduced by AP with the rest going through to hit the intend target?
It strikes me as odd that the barrier created by a Physical Barrier spell seems to be the only one with armor equal to structure. All the example barriers had double the structure in armor.

Physical Barrier is being discussed in errata, at least last I checked.

Q: Which specialization applies to cyber guns?

Whichever one you can get your GM to agree on.

So - did we ever get any clarification from Gen Con... Did players get to take a defense test [of some sort] against grenades and indirect LOS (A) spells?

Yes we did: there's no defense test against grenades, indirect LOS (A) spells, and other "zones of damage." The defense against these attacks is to take precautions against them. This is really really really true, and been confirmed by multiple sources inside the company. So unless there's been a meeting somewhere to which I wasn't privy, you really really honestly and truly don't get to make a defense test against grenades or indirect LOS (A) spells.

Very well. Then can we please get an explanation as to how counterspelling is meant to be used against area spells? The text goes out of its way to describe how you can give the bonus to multiple people, but counterspelling only adds to defense tests, and area spells like Fireball have no such tests.

Spell defense dice are rolled against Indirect Combat spells the same way they're rolled against other spells with no defense test: you roll them as a dice pool of their own.

Quote
(Additionally, the spellcasting example on page 283 has an unidentified defense test being made in it against a Blast spell, and the counterspelling example on page 295 specifically uses a fireball as the example of group counterspelling. This section has left me very confused.)

Please mention this in the errata thread.

Does that mean Sprawl Wilds Ashes needs to be errata'd, since it says the blanket of Military Grade Jammers blocks wireless communications, resulting in only infrared LOS and cables as possible communication measures?

No, because the specific case in the adventure overrides the general rule. The jammers aren't just there to add noise, they're deliberately cutting off wireless communications.

Q: How far does a character need to move to be considered running for the purposes of A) making a running jump, and B) making a charging attack?

About two or three meters. Maybe less if she's got something to push off of.

Q: please can you clarify the options for driving a vehicle for non-riggers?

Let me ask about this one.

Quote
Sub question: if you can drive in VR as a non-rigger, can you ride a bike in VR or does your limp body fall off everytime you make a turn?

If by bike you mean bicycle, the bike would slow to a halt. If you mean VR, you'd be controlling something that's carrying a limp body, yes. Not impossible, but not easy--kinda like riding with a drunk passenger who's passed out.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Csjarrat on <09-25-13/1802:18>
Obviously I mean a motorbike. Thanks, will wait on the answer to the first question
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <09-25-13/1804:16>
Thank you I had failed to find anything on Physical Barrier spell in my search (I am suspecting spelling mistakes from my dyslexia to be the cause)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-26-13/0110:41>
to me it looks like you have the option of driving...
Auto pilot = Giving commands to the autopilot (while physically in the vehicle or via remote -or from within the matrix)
Manual operation = Old school manual driving (while in the meat and physically at the driver seat in the vehicle).
Remote control = AR, cold-sim, hot-sim (either physically in the vehicle or via remote)
Rigger control (*)= Jumped In (either physically in the vehicle or via remote)

I'd say that the "normal" way of driving a vehicle is via autopilot or remote control (while physically in the vehicle) via augmented reality.
The "normal" way of driving as a rigger would be jumped in (but in SR5 there are no rigger cocoons yet afik; high risk for whiplash)

The "normal" way of driving a bike that you are sitting on would be augmented reality (until we get more options).
(Or manual operation if you equipped the vehicle with that)


(*) Rigger control require control rig, owner or 3 marks on the vehicle, rigger interface in the vehicle and that you are jumped in.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <09-26-13/0147:22>
Q: Does Noise Reduction (such as that offered by a wireless Datajack) affect the Noise Rating (not including distance) that prevents wireless functionality in gear with a device rating?
Example: Character A has a Datajack (+1 NR) and an Ares Alpha (smartgun system with a DR of 2); which Noise Rating will exceed the smartgun system in this case, 3 or 4?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tyburn on <09-26-13/0925:30>
...
Spell defense dice are rolled against Indirect Combat spells the same way they're rolled against other spells with no defense test: you roll them as a dice pool of their own.
...

So how does that play out in the case of an area effect that hits multiple targets who are all receiving spell defense? Each defender would roll their spell defense individually and reduce the hits of the caster? What happens if one or more of the defenders get enough hits to reduce the net hits of the caster before the 3 hit threshold for having the spell not scatter?

i.e. Caster casts a force 5 fireball at goon A and B and gets 4 hits. Goon A is a mage and puts up spell defense on himself and Goon B and devotes 6 dice to the effort. Both goon A and B roll well on their spell defense and score 3 and 2 hits respectively. The caster now has only 2 (or 1?) net hits and his fireball scatters either 1d6 (or 2d6?) meters off target and deals 5 damage to goon A and B depending on whether or not they're still in the blast radius? What would happen if the Goons only get 1 and 2 hits respectively? Does the fireball land on target and deal F+3 damage or does it scatter 1d6 m and deal F damage?

If the spell defense dice only reduce the damage of the spell and do not cause the spell to scatter if they reduce the casters hits below 3 why not just say the spell defense dice are added to the damage resistance test instead for indirect area spells?

Follow up question regarding spells that don't allow tests:

Direct spells allow a defense test (typically either body or willpower) but no damage resistance test. p170 of SR5 states that wound modifiers don't apply to this defense test but do other "general" negative pool modifiers like the -1 for electricity damage or the effects of a confusion spell apply? Normally they wouldn't apply to a damage resistance test, but this is a defense test.


Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-26-13/0936:56>
Spell Defense vs Areas are only rolled once, hits apply to all protected. Still, the question is fair: Does it reduce the damage or reduce the hits?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tyburn on <09-26-13/0958:13>
Spell Defense vs Areas are only rolled once, hits apply to all protected. Still, the question is fair: Does it reduce the damage or reduce the hits?

Alright, so in the case of area indirect spells, spell defense roll is made by the counterspelling mage vs the caster as it was done in SR4 as opposed to adding to a defense roll on the part of the recipient? In the case of spells that have a defense test (all other spells?) the spell defense dice are added to the defense pool of the defender. Not exactly clean, but it's workable.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-26-13/1022:20>
Not exactly. Vs an area direct spell it'd also apply as single roll rather than combined with other defense dice.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <09-26-13/1024:37>
Q: How are items with a "+ X" Availability Rating handled for the purpose of Availability Tests?

As the rules on page 418 only state that you make an opposed test of Negotiation + Charisma (Social) vs Availability Rating, I see three possible scenarios:
1. Value as stated for item (example; 6 for Thermographic vision enhancement)
2. Sum of Availability Ratings of base item + new item (example; 6 for Contacts, +6 for Thermographic vision, for a total of 12)
3. Sum of Availability Ratings of base item + all existing and new enhancements (example; as 2. above, but with an additional +4 for existing Low-light vision enhancement for a total of 16)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-26-13/1040:46>
As far as I can tell there are not rules to upgrade your existing imaging device with additional enhancements.
I would say you have to buy a new imaging device.
- This time factory modified with the correct vision enhancements.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tyburn on <09-26-13/1059:23>
Not exactly. Vs an area direct spell it'd also apply as single roll rather than combined with other defense dice.

Alright, so for area direct spells the casting mage is facing 2 "defense" rolls (1 by the counterspelling mage and 1 by the target) and no damage resistance roll.

But if that's the case, why not just have the counterspelling mage roll spell defense dice against the caster of the spell and in all cases independent of any rolls the target they're protecting would need to make? It seems like it would completely avoid any "special case" scenarios. It would be more or less consistent with how it worked in SR4 with the exception that the counterspelling mage now has a maximum pool of spell defense dice per combat turn.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Noble Drake on <09-26-13/1107:49>
Not exactly. Vs an area direct spell it'd also apply as single roll rather than combined with other defense dice.

Alright, so for area direct spells the casting mage is facing 2 "defense" rolls (1 by the counterspelling mage and 1 by the target) and no damage resistance roll.

But if that's the case, why not just have the counterspelling mage roll spell defense dice against the caster of the spell and in all cases independent of any rolls the target they're protecting would need to make? It seems like it would completely avoid any "special case" scenarios. It would be more or less consistent with how it worked in SR4 with the exception that the counterspelling mage now has a maximum pool of spell defense dice per combat turn.
Probably because of the way that everyone targeted getting to add in Edge would work out in the spell, and because it creates a situation where the spell manifests a harmful effect in an area but some people don't feel it as much or at all... while the counterspelling as a single roll could result in the spell not actually manifesting (the difference between a bunch of unharmed people standing in the crater a powerball spell just created, and a counterspelling mage having completely stopped a powerball spell).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tyburn on <09-26-13/1151:14>
Probably because of the way that everyone targeted getting to add in Edge would work out in the spell

The defending mage could, in theory, apply edge to his spell defense roll and if the caster still gets enough his to cast the spell through the defense, the targets could still individually apply edge to their respective defense rolls per usual. I'm not sure what the issue is here other than this not being how the rules are written.

and because it creates a situation where the spell manifests a harmful effect in an area but some people don't feel it as much or at all... while the counterspelling as a single roll could result in the spell not actually manifesting (the difference between a bunch of unharmed people standing in the crater a powerball spell just created, and a counterspelling mage having completely stopped a powerball spell).

This actually doesn't occur anymore than it already does now. If the counter spelling mage gets enough hits to reduce the caster to 0 hits, the spell just doesn't go off (i.e. no crater) just as if the caster scored no hits on the spellcasting test.

If the caster gets enough hits to get through the defense, the target(s) face a uniform (but potentially less powerful) spell and get to defend normally.

In fact, if it does work like this, conceivably spell defense can make an area indirect spell scatter, but at least it does mean that the scatters in a consistent and easily resolvable way.

I recognize we're talking about a system not described in the books...it just seems to make slightly more sense from an interpretation and implementation perspective.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Noble Drake on <09-26-13/1218:06>
This actually doesn't occur anymore than it already does now. If the counter spelling mage gets enough hits to reduce the caster to 0 hits, the spell just doesn't go off (i.e. no crater) just as if the caster scored no hits on the spellcasting test.

If the caster gets enough hits to get through the defense, the target(s) face a uniform (but potentially less powerful) spell and get to defend normally.
I'm not sure you caught my meaning... allow me to show a detailed example:

Scenario A: A hostile mage is throwing a Powerball spell into Jim's apartment, where Jim and his friend Eddy are hanging out watching Trid while cleaning their guns - and counterspelling applies only to each person that Eddy (a mage) decides to cover with it.

Hostile mage gets an impressive limit-hitting roll on a force 10 powerball; Jim gets his 5 body and Eddy's  astounding 10 counterspelling, and ends up only taking 5 damge on average; Eddy has similar results... but the entire apartment is now in a state ranging from beat-up to completely destroyed (even the gun parts and tridscreen!)

Scenario B: Same characters involved, but the counterspelling applies directly to the spell instead of to each chosen person.

The force 10 powerball is reduced to only having 7 hits; Jim still averages 5 damage, and Eddy too... but the apartment is looking at being largely okay, other than a few simpler objects which are damaged, but not destroyed.

It's a significant difference, and one that people usually just hand-wave away or gloss over because of the implication that a character blasted by a high force powerball might just end up functionally (if not actually) naked because of it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-26-13/1246:04>
(maybe we can start a new thread to discuss the mechanics of spell defense and use this thread for Q&A...)



A hostile mage is throwing a Powerball spell...
To answer your question:

Powerball is a direct LOS (A) physical spell that is resolved with Spellcasting + Magic [Force].

The opposed test for each target in the AoE pits the Spellcasting + Magic [Force] roll against their own Body.

If a friendly magician dedicate some or all dice from her remaining counterspell dice pool this combat turn to protect against the Powerball then each target (up to max magic rating number of targets) that the friendly magician choose to protect add the number of dice as a positive dice modifier to his or her Body test (rolled individually for each target together with their body dice pool when opposing the spellcasting test).

Unless, of course, how you resolve Spell Defense is also up for errata ;)

[spoiler]
Spell defense example p.295
...That means Chordae and each of her teammates receives a +4
dice pool bonus to their Defense Tests...


Spell defense p.294-295:
Spell defense is used against hostile spells cast at you or at targets that are within your line of sight (using the same rules as for targeting spells) that you decide to protect with spell defense. Declaring this protection is either a Free Action or, if you don’t have one left, an Interrupt Action that reduces your Initiative Score by 5. Each Combat Turn, you have a pool of dice for spell defense equal to your Counterspelling skill. When a spell is cast, you may choose to use some or all of your Counterspelling dice to defend against an incoming spell. Against each spell attack, you have to choose how many dice from this pool to allocate for defense, and you can select how many people (including yourself if you desire) are covered by these defensive dice. You can protect a number of people at one time equal to your Magic Rating. These dice are then added to the defense tests of everyone you’re covering. The pool refreshes at the beginning of each Combat Turn.

And how to resolve a Direct Physical Combat spell p.283
Direct: When your direct combat spell is successfully cast, it inflicts a number of boxes of damage equal to your net hits on the opposed test. The opposed test generally pits your Spellcasting + Magic [Force] against either Body (for physical spells) or Willpower (for mana spells). The target does not get to resist the damage, only the Spellcasting test.


Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Noble Drake on <09-26-13/1403:29>
To answer your question:
I wasn't asking a question... I was merely stating that I believe that "I got more successes from my spell defense dice than the caster got on his area direct combat spell," should mean that the spell does absolutely nothing (as if the caster had failed to cast the spell), and that the rules (which you've pointed out) don't actually support that.

Now for a question: When deciding on targets to extend your counterspelling to, would you say that "appartment" is 1 and "self" is 1, or is "self" 1 and then each piece of furniture, decoration, or appliance is each 1?

I mean, do you support the idea that a mage can prevent a direct area spell from destroying his living space, or does he have to choose something like "Me, my couch, my commlink, the coffee table, my coffee cup and the coffee pot," and hope that the object resistance dice of the rest of his Lifestyle manage to be enough?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <09-26-13/1408:03>
Q: Does the smartgun system on an Ares Alpha provide +2 dice when firing the assault rifle part of the weapon AND the grenade launcher part of the weapon?
I couldn't really find anything that would contradict this reading, and the grenade launcher does have Accuracy 4 (6), so it would seem to apply.

Also:
The description text for Airburst Link reads "this grenade/rocket launcher smartgun accessory"; as a smartgun accessory with no slot listed, does it use capacity instead, or is it installed without taking up slots or capacity?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tyburn on <09-26-13/1418:38>
(maybe we can start a new thread to discuss the mechanics of spell defense and use this thread for Q&A...)


Agreed. Since there's already a thread in the rules discussion forum I'll continue the discussion back there. http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=12951.0 (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=12951.0).

As a parting comment here: there's no confusion as to how spell defense affects powerball since, as a direct spell, it both allows a defense roll  and doesn't scatter if it doesn't hit a certain threshold. This works just fine with the rules as they are written or as Michael Chandra suggested they should be interpreted. The problem is that indirect area spells don't allow a defense roll and can scatter and so need to be treated as a special snowflake when it comes to spell defense.

How a table wants to deal with collateral damage isn't really a huge deal in my mind. Once you get into the territory of a mage using spell defense to protect objects in his immediate surroundings from powerball (and only powerball since it's the only direct area physical damage spell) we're well beyond what the rule set covers. If you go with Micheal Chandra's suggestion then you'd have to designate objects that were protected by spell defense if you wanted to protect them and the group of them would get protected by the spell defence roll of the mage and then do their regular object/damage resistance checks.

That said further clarification on whether or not spell defense can cause a previously on target fireball to fly off course would be appreciated.

There's also that odd situation where general negative pool modifiers other than from wounds make direct combat spells harder to defend against.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-26-13/1527:17>
Now for a question: When deciding on targets to extend your counterspelling to, would you say that "appartment" is 1 and "self" is 1, or is "self" 1 and then each piece of furniture, decoration, or appliance is each 1?
Self is 1
Apartment is not people.
Each piece of furniture, decoration or appliance is no people.

Spell Defense p.295
...and you can select how many people (including yourself if you desire) are covered by these defensive dice...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Noble Drake on <09-26-13/1544:38>
Now for a question: When deciding on targets to extend your counterspelling to, would you say that "appartment" is 1 and "self" is 1, or is "self" 1 and then each piece of furniture, decoration, or appliance is each 1?
Self is 1
Apartment is not people.
Each piece of furniture, decoration or appliance is no people.

Spell Defense p.295
...and you can select how many people (including yourself if you desire) are covered by these defensive dice...
Correct, and also the worst decision on the matter that can possibly be RAW... "sorry bud, can't counterspell that - he targeted an object... so what if it was an object he then crushed you with."
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tyburn on <09-26-13/1613:09>
Correct, and also the worst decision on the matter that can possibly be RAW... "sorry bud, can't counterspell that - he targeted an object... so what if it was an object he then crushed you with."

If you're trying to use counterspelling versus a sustained effect such as a levitate spell lifting something heavy before it falls on your buddy (which seems to be what you're talking about here) that's an application of the skill as dispelling, not spell defense.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Noble Drake on <09-26-13/1643:13>
Correct, and also the worst decision on the matter that can possibly be RAW... "sorry bud, can't counterspell that - he targeted an object... so what if it was an object he then crushed you with."

If you're trying to use counterspelling versus a sustained effect such as a levitate spell lifting something heavy before it falls on your buddy (which seems to be what you're talking about here) that's an application of the skill as dispelling, not spell defense.
I was thinking more like a high force fling spell - like slamming a 12 kg dumbbell into your face, which you can obviously dodge, but according to the rules read strictly cannot possibly counterspell because the dumbbell isn't a person, and can't dispel because it is instant.

...or something like blasting a tree so it falls on you, thus circumventing the ability to counterspell.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-26-13/1913:32>
Q: Does Noise Reduction (such as that offered by a wireless Datajack) affect the Noise Rating (not including distance) that prevents wireless functionality in gear with a device rating?

Yep.

If the spell defense dice only reduce the damage of the spell and do not cause the spell to scatter if they reduce the casters hits below 3 why not just say the spell defense dice are added to the damage resistance test instead for indirect area spells?

This is a great suggestion. You should post it in the errata thread.

Quote
Direct spells allow a defense test (typically either body or willpower) but no damage resistance test. p170 of SR5 states that wound modifiers don't apply to this defense test but do other "general" negative pool modifiers like the -1 for electricity damage or the effects of a confusion spell apply? Normally they wouldn't apply to a damage resistance test, but this is a defense test.

As long as the test isn't about reducing the number of boxes you're about to take on a Condition Monitor, Wound Modifiers apply.

Spell Defense vs Areas are only rolled once, hits apply to all protected. Still, the question is fair: Does it reduce the damage or reduce the hits?

It reduces the hits. Makes the aim go all wobbly.

This all said, stay tuned. There's a weird edge case here and I'm going to bring it up with the other designers.

Q: How are items with a "+ X" Availability Rating handled for the purpose of Availability Tests?

As written, they're not typically available as individual parts. You might want to try asking your GM to allow you to get your hands on an upgrade kit if you can do the installation yourself.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <09-26-13/2105:53>
Question: If two casters both declare spell defense to protect their team, would both of their Counterspelling skill ratings apply to each test resisting a spell?

Mainly asked because it isn't something I'd thought of before, and while it would make sense, I wasn't sure if it would actually work that way.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <09-26-13/2331:37>
Q: Does Noise Reduction (such as that offered by a wireless Datajack) affect the Noise Rating (not including distance) that prevents wireless functionality in gear with a device rating?

Yep.

Interesting. Does that mean that a decker can provide noise reduction for his team using the Scrub (i think that's the NR one) program? How else does one form of Noise Reduction work, but not another? Presumably, the decker would have to have access to the pan of each member for this to work. Thoughts?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: acolyte99 on <09-27-13/0137:37>
Question: If two casters both declare spell defense to protect their team, would both of their Counterspelling skill ratings apply to each test resisting a spell?

Mainly asked because it isn't something I'd thought of before, and while it would make sense, I wasn't sure if it would actually work that way.
In SR4 it was explicitly mentioned, that in such a case Teamwork rules would be used. But you are right, this was left out in SR5.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-27-13/0412:02>
If a caster decide to spend one, several or all of his remaining spell defense dice to protect a person being targeted by a spell then that person add the spell defense dice as a positive dice modifier to the opposed test. If another caster also decide to spend one, several or all of her remaining spell defense deice to protect a person being targeted by a spell then the person add the spell defense dice from this caster as a positive dice modifier as well.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-27-13/0523:07>
Presumably, the decker would have to have access to the pan of each member for this to work. Thoughts?
Are you even allowed to slave a PAN to another device? Wouldn't you have to slave it all to the Decker without an intermediate Master?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lobo on <09-27-13/0926:10>
Presumably, the decker would have to have access to the pan of each member for this to work. Thoughts?
Are you even allowed to slave a PAN to another device? Wouldn't you have to slave it all to the Decker without an intermediate Master?

It would seem logical that you could not slave a PAN to a device - otherwise you could have an almost limitless number of devices slaved to your PAN - a rating 6 commlink can slave 18 devices.  If each of those device "slots" could be a commlink with its own 18 devices...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-27-13/1055:34>
Running signal scrub on a cyberdeck give the decker 2 points of noise reduction (when for example performing matrix actions jacked in on the cyberdeck). It does not give your team mate noise reduction. Why would it?

Running data jack wireless give the user 1 point of noise reduction. It does not give his team mate noise reduction. Why would it?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-27-13/1123:14>
Question: If two casters both declare spell defense to protect their team, would both of their Counterspelling skill ratings apply to each test resisting a spell?

Yes, but remember it's a resource that doesn't refresh until the end of the Combat Turn.

Q: Does Noise Reduction (such as that offered by a wireless Datajack) affect the Noise Rating (not including distance) that prevents wireless functionality in gear with a device rating?

Yep.

Interesting. Does that mean that a decker can provide noise reduction for his team using the Scrub (i think that's the NR one) program? How else does one form of Noise Reduction work, but not another? Presumably, the decker would have to have access to the pan of each member for this to work. Thoughts?

No, the noise reduction is only available to the person(a) using it.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-27-13/1125:03>
Presumably, the decker would have to have access to the pan of each member for this to work. Thoughts?
Are you even allowed to slave a PAN to another device? Wouldn't you have to slave it all to the Decker without an intermediate Master?

No. Yes.

Also, everybody please remember to move discussions to another thread, starting one if necessary. That makes it a lot easier for me to find and answer questions.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <09-28-13/1947:07>
Considering repairing Matrix Damage now takes a Hardware + Logic Extended Test, how does one go about repairing Matrix Damage for Cyberware, especially the Commlink and Cyberdeck Headware Augmentations? Can someone with this augmentation make the test on themselves, or would it require surgery?

If its the latter, having a Deck in your head is a complete waste of money and essence if you have to get your street doc to crack your skull open every time you botch an Attack action or get into Cybercombat.

On a similar vein, considering bricking is described as explosive failure of the device, complete with spark and fire, what happens to a piece of cyberware that gets bricked inside the body? Does it deal damage to the owner?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Chrona on <09-28-13/2212:14>
Q. If a Logic 3+ character is learning 2 new skills (and doing nothing else during that downtime) at rating 2 each, how long does it take?

Improving a skill Rating 1–4 is New Rating x 1 day. If you are only Learning Skills in downtime you may learn Logic/2 (round up) Skills at the same time. Does this mean it takes 2 days (2x1 Day) getting two skills in one time span, 4 days (2x1 day + 2x1 day) learning both in the same downtime but one after another or 6 days ((1x1 day + 2x2 days) + (((1x1 day + 2x2 days)) learning both in increments?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DigitalZombie on <09-29-13/1153:31>
I was just for s#ts and giggles making a terra first terrorist flesh rigger :o
A mystic adepts with a high handle animal skill and mob mind and control action spells, a bunch of RFID sensor tags and cockroaches/rats/pidgeons/chihuahuas sounded like fun. But several questions arose during his birth.

1. the range of control action is LOS, I presume its only when casting the spell, and that its perfectly viable for the caster to move his "puppet" out of LOS of sight later, as long as he sustains the spell, right? and then using either clairvoyance or RFID sensor tags to navigate with.

2. What happens when the resist roll (logic+will) is equal to or lower than the force of the spell? As the "puppet", if it so chose, must make the resist roll with the spell force as a penalty, and ends up with zero dices? is it/he then under the casters control as long as he sustains it, with no means to break free?

3. when using the control action spell, the caster uses his own skills, but does he use the "puppets" physical attributes and limits? and his own metal attributes?

4. what kind of modifers are on control action? say, the caster, with 1 wound modifer penalty, decides to control his troll buddy( because the troll doesnt have sneaking, but the
caster does) in order to get his friend close to the enemy forces unseen, what would the dice pool be for that if the troll also had a -1 wound modifier? -1 or -2?

5. can you cast control thoughts/actions on critters?

6. what would happen if the troll was unconscious, could I still control his body? and if yes, could he roll to resist it?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-29-13/1200:02>
Considering repairing Matrix Damage now takes a Hardware + Logic Extended Test, how does one go about repairing Matrix Damage for Cyberware, especially the Commlink and Cyberdeck Headware Augmentations? Can someone with this augmentation make the test on themselves, or would it require surgery?

All the user-serviceable parts of cyberware with wireless bonuses are accessible without surgery.

Quote
On a similar vein, considering bricking is described as explosive failure of the device, complete with spark and fire, what happens to a piece of cyberware that gets bricked inside the body? Does it deal damage to the owner?

It's quite uncomfortable, but not enough to take out a box on the Condition Monitor.

Q. If a Logic 3+ character is learning 2 new skills (and doing nothing else during that downtime) at rating 2 each, how long does it take?

A total of three days. Each skill takes one day per rating to complete training, and your Logic allows for two skills "in the pipe" at a time. On Day 1 you learn the two skills and improve them to Rating 1, then spend Days 2 and 3 to bring them both up to 2.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-29-13/1218:22>
I was just for s#ts and giggles making a terra first terrorist flesh rigger :o
A mystic adepts with a high handle animal skill and mob mind and control action spells, a bunch of RFID sensor tags and cockroaches/rats/pidgeons/chihuahuas sounded like fun. But several questions arose during his birth.

1. the range of control action is LOS, I presume its only when casting the spell, and that its perfectly viable for the caster to move his "puppet" out of LOS of sight later, as long as he sustains the spell, right? and then using either clairvoyance or RFID sensor tags to navigate with.

Once the spell is on the target, you can sustain the spell even when the target is out of your line of sight. Of course, with a spell like Mob Mind and a navigation system like a bunch of RFID tags, you're pretty obvious in both astral space and in the Matrix.

Quote
2. What happens when the resist roll (logic+will) is equal to or lower than the force of the spell? As the "puppet", if it so chose, must make the resist roll with the spell force as a penalty, and ends up with zero dices? is it/he then under the casters control as long as he sustains it, with no means to break free?

Without Edge (or help), the target is completely defenseless against the spell if its LOG + WIL is equal to or less than the Force of the spell.

Quote
3. when using the control action spell, the caster uses his own skills, but does he use the "puppets" physical attributes and limits? and his own metal attributes?

I believe you'd use the target's Attribute, because ultimately it's the target performing the action, you're just directing the target yourself.

Quote
4. what kind of modifers are on control action? say, the caster, with 1 wound modifer penalty, decides to control his troll buddy( because the troll doesnt have sneaking, but the
caster does) in order to get his friend close to the enemy forces unseen, what would the dice pool be for that if the troll also had a -1 wound modifier? -1 or -2?

You're doing the controlling, so your Wound Modifier counts. Your target is performing the action, so her Wound Modifier also counts.

Quote
5. can you cast control thoughts/actions on critters?

Yep.

Quote
6. what would happen if the troll was unconscious, could I still control his body? and if yes, could he roll to resist it?

Nope. Sleeping troll is sleeping, so his muscles are relaxed.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Imveros on <09-29-13/2112:52>
Has there been any word on how many programs an RCC can run?

Thanks!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-29-13/2118:02>
I recall DR but cannot remember who said it when so here's hoping someone else can provide a link.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Imveros on <09-29-13/2136:28>
Yeah DR is what decks get as well. I just didn't want to make any assumptions in case decks were supposed to be much better than RCCs in that department
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-30-13/0222:05>
Yeah DR is what decks get as well. I just didn't want to make any assumptions in case decks were supposed to be much better than RCCs in that department
Deckes actually have a special rating for that - that currently just happen to be the same as device rating
(odds are you can upgrade that rating without upgrading the device rating and that there will be other decks two different ratings).

I have personally not seen anyone confirm nor deny that they can run device rating number of cyberprograms.
If this is true, then I would too like a link ;)

The book explicit state Drones (and cyberdecks) can run cyberprograms and how many they can run.
Drones can load a total device rating / 2 cyberprograms and autosoft (for a drone cyberprograms and autosoft share the same "RAM")

The only place this is even mention that RCC can run cyberprograms is a red box on p.269...

Sharing talk about autosofts (but maybe they mean cyberprograms as well)
- In that case RCC would have up to device rating active cyberprograms (at the cost of noise reduction and autosoft programs).

Maybe RCC can load up to total device rating cyberprograms and autosofts (so they, like drones, share the same "RAM").

...or maybe they can load up to a total of device rating cyberprograms (and then a number equal to sharing rating autosofts on top of that).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-30-13/0657:16>
It's not entirely clear, one point talks about Sharing Autosofts and no running autosofts, another (in the Autosofts section) talks about programs but given how this is in the section about Autosoft programs, it might be a simple slip.

I would assume myself an RCC can run its DR in Cyberprograms+Autosofts combined, and can then share part of its Autosofts with drones (but it cannot share Cyberprograms). Since Cyberprograms, under this assumption, cannot be shared (Drones and RCCs can both run Autosofts and Cyberprograms but only Autosofts are explicitly stated as sharable), and the Sharing limitation only mentions not running Autosofts, the Drone can run multiple Cyberprograms and then share its Autosofts from the RCC. However, this is an assumption that requires errata to confirm or deny.

(Interesting detail: Virtual Machine gives you two Program slots, not Cyberprogram slots. Autosofts are programs, so running VM on a drone lets you run 3 Autosofts instead of 2.)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-30-13/0720:08>
Yes, but they talk about "this program", except for Shell (which wouldn't stack with Autosofts since those don't include such a bonus) and Virtual Machine.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <09-30-13/1020:06>
Here is an interesting question that came up in discussion with my group:
If Ones Initiative gets reduced to 0 or lower, they cannot act that turn.
Say you have a character who has only reaction and intuition of 2 each, and only 1 Initiative die.
He rolls horribly, getting a 1, but, he is a mage so he has Increased Reaction with 3 hits up, so
he is good. Enemy side mage goes ahead of him, and dispels the Increased Reaction, eliminating
the bonus that provides to initiative. Over the turn, this mage takes physical and stun damage
to give him -6 dice pool penalty between the two. Since wound penalties apply to initiative, and
apply immediately, this means that, at this point, the character has a -1 initiative score, and has
not acted yet. Does he still get to act?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Noble Drake on <09-30-13/1115:14>
No, a character reduced to zero or lower initiative - no matter how they get there - does not get to act further in the combat turn. Not even if they hadn't acted to start with.

Consider it one of the many reasons that players should avoid Attributes rated at 2 and lower unless they are prepared for significant consequences of their choice.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <09-30-13/1418:44>
You still have a free action in every initiative pass.

...and i believe you can still run (but not sprint) up to agility x 4 meters per combat turn by spending one of your free actions on the free action called "Run".
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T-Hatchet on <09-30-13/1556:59>
A issue that was brought up by one of my players this sunday.
Can linguasofts (or for that matter knowsofts) be run on a comlink or the like to provide, possibly much slower, access to translations (or knowledge)?
If not is there such things as translation software available for comlinks and the like?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <09-30-13/1729:56>
Has there been any word on how many programs an RCC can run?

Noise Reduction and Sharing, p. 267, SR5. The Sharing rating refers to the combination of autosofts and cyberprograms (neither of which my spell checker likes).

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <09-30-13/1731:41>
According to page 233, if you are in a Host that is part of a WAN, you are directly connected to every device slaved in the WAN. Does this mean that if you enter a host, you could immediately hack any of the slaves directly, while ignoring the host's Firewall?


If this is the case, this seems like a terrible idea, as it actually makes setting up a WAN less secure, since a mark on a slave also gives you a mark on the master. So a decker could walk into any public host, which automatically invites marks to allow patrons to enter, and immediately be directly connected to any devices on their WAN. You then hack marks on those Rating 2 or 3 devices, and automatically get marks on the Host itself.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-30-13/1742:00>
Has there been any word on how many programs an RCC can run?

Noise Reduction and Sharing, p. 267, SR5. The Sharing rating refers to the combination of autosofts and cyberprograms (neither of which my spell checker likes).
That is how many you can share, not how many you can run. Unless you are saying you cannot have more programs active than you can share.

Also, as we discussed before, there's 2 conflicting segments on whether it's the combination or just autosofts that can be shared. If since then you became aware of an official stance on the matter, I missed that, otherwise I'd rather wait for errata.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-30-13/1754:13>
Rules Clarification: Resting and Natural Recovery

What constitutes "resting" for the purpose of Natural Recovery?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <09-30-13/1853:58>
Rules Clarification: Resting and Natural Recovery

What constitutes "resting" for the purpose of Natural Recovery?

any non strenuous activity. Bed rest. Watching TV. Reading a book.

basically if doing it would put you "ahead" then you are not resting :p
So:
No shopping
no contact meetings
no B/R tasks
no raising a skill
no <insert action that is usually done during down time that requires mental or physical exertion. >
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Imveros on <09-30-13/2310:29>
Has there been any word on how many programs an RCC can run?

Noise Reduction and Sharing, p. 267, SR5. The Sharing rating refers to the combination of autosofts and cyberprograms (neither of which my spell checker likes).

That page states

Quote
The Sharing rating is the number of autosofts you can run on the RCC that simultaneously run on all slaved drones at the same time.

Nothing in that entire section mentions cyber programs at all. The only thing that makes me assume you even can is the red box on p269.

Also, as  Michael Chandra said, The noise and sharing section also only mentions the sharing of said programs. I was looking for programs solely for the RCC. Mainly extra dice to resist taking damage while diving in drones would be awful nice to have
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <10-01-13/0224:06>
It is entire possible that number of cyber programs is your sharing rating (which in normal case IS your device rating) but you can choose to load less cyber programs and load more auto softs instead. Or increase your noise reduction.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <10-01-13/0403:03>
Can you slave a device across grids? For example, have your deck on a Global Grid, but your Smartgun on the Local Grid. If so, would a decker on the Global Grid take the -2 for hacking across grids if he hacks the gun, or would the penalty not apply, since it uses the Master's ratings on the same grid?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <10-01-13/0425:42>
The device icon can only exist on one grid (or in one host). If the decker is on the same grid as the icon he is attacking then he does not suffer -2 dice for working across grids.


It is very possible that a device slaved to a master device (being part of a PAN) will only exist on the same grid as the master device - and in the case when a device is slaved to a host (being part of a WAN) that the device icon only exist inside the host. Aaron, do you have any insight on this...?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-01-13/0511:44>
That page states

Quote
The Sharing rating is the number of autosofts you can run on the RCC that simultaneously run on all slaved drones at the same time.

Nothing in that entire section mentions cyber programs at all.
Under Autosofts (next page I think) it mentions Sharing and programs, which might be because it's just talking about [Autosoft] programs and didn't think about Cyberprograms, or because it's intended Cyberprograms are included in the limit. Hence my statement that until we get errata, we do not know the exact intent. Both versions have consequences.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <10-01-13/1131:16>
Q Do you get -2 to all matrix action if you are inside a host located on the public grid (even if you jacked into the matrix from the local grid before you entered the host)?

Q Do IC in a host located on the public grid suffer -2 dice to all it's actions?


p.234
As a result, all Matrix actions are performed at a –2 dice pool penalty when you’re using the public grid, even in a host.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <10-01-13/1706:13>
Does being the Master of a Slaved device grant any degree of control over the Slaved Device?

For example, if the Street Sam slaves his smartgun to the Decker, how much control does the Decker have over the Smartgun? Does he count as having an Owner mark?

This came up because of the Wrapper program. A Decker wants to use Wrapper to make an ally's smartgun look like a credstick, as per the example. However, Wrapper uses the Change Icon matrix action, which can only be used by the Owner of the device.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <10-01-13/1737:45>
According to page 233, if you are in a Host that is part of a WAN, you are directly connected to every device slaved in the WAN. Does this mean that if you enter a host, you could immediately hack any of the slaves directly, while ignoring the host's Firewall?

Yep. Well, you probably needed to get by the host's Firewall to get in there in the first place, but the slaved targets don't get to use the host's ratings for defense against you once you're in there.

Quote
If this is the case, this seems like a terrible idea, as it actually makes setting up a WAN less secure, since a mark on a slave also gives you a mark on the master. So a decker could walk into any public host, which automatically invites marks to allow patrons to enter, and immediately be directly connected to any devices on their WAN. You then hack marks on those Rating 2 or 3 devices, and automatically get marks on the Host itself.

This is why hosts that are open to the public aren't part of WANs, and those hosts that are part of WANs are guarded by patrolling spiders and IC.

Has there been any word on how many programs an RCC can run?

Noise Reduction and Sharing, p. 267, SR5. The Sharing rating refers to the combination of autosofts and cyberprograms (neither of which my spell checker likes).
That is how many you can share, not how many you can run. Unless you are saying you cannot have more programs active than you can share.

That is the number you can run. Thanks in advance for taking further discussion to another thread.

Rules Clarification: Resting and Natural Recovery

What constitutes "resting" for the purpose of Natural Recovery?

Whatever your GM says is resting.

Can you slave a device across grids? For example, have your deck on a Global Grid, but your Smartgun on the Local Grid. If so, would a decker on the Global Grid take the -2 for hacking across grids if he hacks the gun, or would the penalty not apply, since it uses the Master's ratings on the same grid?

The cross-grid penalty is based on the target's grid, not the master's grid. In your example, the decker would take a -2 penalty for hacking across grids if he was not on the same grid as the gun.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <10-01-13/1746:39>
Q Do you get -2 to all matrix action if you are inside a host located on the public grid (even if you jacked into the matrix from the local grid before you entered the host)?

b]Q [/b] Do IC in a host located on the public grid suffer -2 dice to all it's actions?

"Hosts are part of the Matrix, so once you’re inside a host, the grid you’re on doesn’t really matter." (p. 246, SR5)

Hosts don't perform actions outside of themselves, so the question is academic.

Does being the Master of a Slaved device grant any degree of control over the Slaved Device?

Given that by definition you're either the owner of the slave or it's not in your PAN, I'd say that it doesn't grant any additional control; you were its owner before you slaved it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <10-01-13/1750:16>
Does being the Master of a Slaved device grant any degree of control over the Slaved Device?

Given that by definition you're either the owner of the slave or it's not in your PAN, I'd say that it doesn't grant any additional control; you were its owner before you slaved it.

So the Street Sam who slaves his smartgun to the Decker's deck to get the firewall bonus is in fact handing over ownership?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-01-13/1822:37>
Q: Does Virtual Machine help with Sharing?

For example, if my Sharing ratio is 2, can I run Virtual Machine, Signal Scrub, Toolbox and Maneuvering[MCT-Nissan Roto-Drone]?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <10-01-13/1846:37>
Initiating as a magician requires an Arcana + Logic Extended test, however no such test is mentioned for Submerging as a technomancer, nor is any timeframe provided. Does this mean that Submerging takes no time and requires no test, or is this up for Errata?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Agonar on <10-01-13/2351:42>
Quote
2: How does the Indirect Touch spell, Punch, work?

In the specific case of a touch-range combat spell, the Spellcasting test takes the place of the Unarmed attack. So you only need to make the Spellcasting Test, which is defended against by the target's Reaction + Intuition.

I find this answer odd, or a mistake, since on page 282, under Range, the book says "Some spells require you to Touch (T) the target—if the target is unwilling, you’ll need to make an unarmed attack against the target"

And on Page 187, under Touch-Only Attack  "If the intention of an attack is to simply make contact, whether to discharge a spell, plant a RFID tag, or just playing tag, than the attacker gains a +2 dice pool bonus. Additionally, if all that is needed is contact, the attacker and not the defender succeeds on a tie."

So either both of these entries referencing Touch Spells are wrong, and needs serious errata, or As part of casting a touch spell, you first make an unarmed attack +2 dice vs Target, and if you succeed, then you make the spellcasting vs their reaction + Intuition since it's Indirect, then they get to resist damage (which granted is a lot of dice rolls for Punch, as one of the only indirect touch spell).

Which one is actually the correct procedure?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <10-02-13/0007:28>
Quote
2: How does the Indirect Touch spell, Punch, work?

In the specific case of a touch-range combat spell, the Spellcasting test takes the place of the Unarmed attack. So you only need to make the Spellcasting Test, which is defended against by the target's Reaction + Intuition.

I find this answer odd, or a mistake, since on page 282, under Range, the book says "Some spells require you to Touch (T) the target—if the target is unwilling, you’ll need to make an unarmed attack against the target"

And on Page 187, under Touch-Only Attack  "If the intention of an attack is to simply make contact, whether to discharge a spell, plant a RFID tag, or just playing tag, than the attacker gains a +2 dice pool bonus. Additionally, if all that is needed is contact, the attacker and not the defender succeeds on a tie."

So either both of these entries referencing Touch Spells are wrong, and needs serious errata, or As part of casting a touch spell, you first make an unarmed attack +2 dice vs Target, and if you succeed, then you make the spellcasting vs their reaction + Intuition since it's Indirect, then they get to resist damage (which granted is a lot of dice rolls for Punch, as one of the only indirect touch spell).

Which one is actually the correct procedure?

He said Touch range combat spell. Presumably, with a spell like Reduce Attribute, you make the unarmed touch attack as per those rules.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Cyber-Dave on <10-02-13/0021:53>
Is the listing for bows of 0-STR short range distance intentional? It seems very odd. First of all, it seems like a bows range should be based on its rank, not a character's STR. Second of all, based on all other existing patterns of progression, it seems like a bows short range should be Rank*2 or Rank*3, not 0-Rank (or STR). I mean, why does a bow have such a worse short range than a crossbow? For that matter, why does a bow and a thrown weapon have the same short range? That can't be right, can it? Is this a case of something needing errata, or is this intentional? And, if it is intentional, what is the logic?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <10-02-13/0127:16>
Q A physical device slaved to a Host (belong in a WAN) always only have it's icon inside the host?




(p.234 , SR5)
As a result, all Matrix actions are performed at a –2 dice pool penalty when you’re using the public grid, even in a host.

(p. 246, SR5)
Hosts are part of the Matrix, so once you’re inside a host, the grid you’re on doesn’t really matter.

The two statements seem to contradict each other.
One say that you (always) get -2 dice pool penalty if you jack in from the public grid (always bad connection) even if you are in a host and the other say that once you are inside a host it [really] does not matter which grid you came from (always good connection).

Q Is it a correct interpretation that the second statement mean that being inside a Host you no longer suffer cross-grid penalty and distance noise penalty (but you still suffer public grid penalty if you used the public grid while jacking into the matrix)?



Initiating as a magician requires an Arcana + Logic Extended test...
(p.325 SR5)
The time it takes to complete initiation is determined by an Arcana + Intuition [Astral] (initiate grade, 1 month) Extended Test.

So either both of these entries referencing Touch Spells are wrong, and needs serious errata, or As part of casting a touch spell, you first make an unarmed attack +2 dice vs Target, and if you succeed, then you make the spellcasting vs their reaction + Intuition since it's Indirect, then they get to resist damage (which granted is a lot of dice rolls for Punch, as one of the only indirect touch spell).
...or a third option would be that the target does not get to dodge indirect T combat spells after you made the connection with unarmed combat to touch the subject. The connection is already made - you can't dodge the spell. Spell defense would be rolled as a pool on it's own against the actual spellcast; possible reducing the damage or even cause the spell to fail/miss if you have enough spell defense hits.

(similar to targets does not get to dodge indirect LOS (A) combat spells. you are already inside the blast area - you can't dodge the spell. but spell defense is rolled as a defense pool of it's own).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <10-02-13/1803:19>
Q: Do items that take up capacity count as separate items when slaved to a master?

Examples:
Does an Ares Alpha containing a smartgun system (1), airburst link (2), and a bipod (3) count as 1 or 3 devices for the purposes of slaving?
How about a cyberarm with a Large Smuggling Compartment (1) and an SMG containing a smartgun system (2) and a silencer (3)?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <10-02-13/1821:43>
Does being the Master of a Slaved device grant any degree of control over the Slaved Device?

Given that by definition you're either the owner of the slave or it's not in your PAN, I'd say that it doesn't grant any additional control; you were its owner before you slaved it.

So the Street Sam who slaves his smartgun to the Decker's deck to get the firewall bonus is in fact handing over ownership?

Yep.

Q: Does Virtual Machine help with Sharing?

Yep.

Initiating as a magician requires an Arcana + Logic Extended test, however no such test is mentioned for Submerging as a technomancer, nor is any timeframe provided. Does this mean that Submerging takes no time and requires no test, or is this up for Errata?

Errata is in process.

Quote
2: How does the Indirect Touch spell, Punch, work?

In the specific case of a touch-range combat spell, the Spellcasting test takes the place of the Unarmed attack. So you only need to make the Spellcasting Test, which is defended against by the target's Reaction + Intuition.

I find this answer odd, or a mistake, since on page 282, under Range, the book says "Some spells require you to Touch (T) the target—if the target is unwilling, you’ll need to make an unarmed attack against the target"

And on Page 187, under Touch-Only Attack  "If the intention of an attack is to simply make contact, whether to discharge a spell, plant a RFID tag, or just playing tag, than the attacker gains a +2 dice pool bonus. Additionally, if all that is needed is contact, the attacker and not the defender succeeds on a tie."

So either both of these entries referencing Touch Spells are wrong, and needs serious errata, or As part of casting a touch spell, you first make an unarmed attack +2 dice vs Target, and if you succeed, then you make the spellcasting vs their reaction + Intuition since it's Indirect, then they get to resist damage (which granted is a lot of dice rolls for Punch, as one of the only indirect touch spell).

Which one is actually the correct procedure?

In the specific case of a touch-range combat spell, the Spellcasting test takes the place of the Unarmed attack. So you only need to make the Spellcasting Test, which is defended against by the target's Reaction + Intuition.

Is the listing for bows of 0-STR short range distance intentional? It seems very odd. First of all, it seems like a bows range should be based on its rank, not a character's STR. Second of all, based on all other existing patterns of progression, it seems like a bows short range should be Rank*2 or Rank*3, not 0-Rank (or STR). I mean, why does a bow have such a worse short range than a crossbow? For that matter, why does a bow and a thrown weapon have the same short range? That can't be right, can it? Is this a case of something needing errata, or is this intentional? And, if it is intentional, what is the logic?

Answers, in order:
Yes. That's not a question. That's not a question either. Neither is that. Crossbows typically have a stronger pull than bows. Bows are fired in an arc, and that arc starts sooner than you think. Yes it can. It's intentional. The drop on a fired arrow starts out pretty quick; it's been my experience that even a three-meter shot doesn't go directly where you aim it on a bow with a thirty-pound draw (Rating 3-ish).

Q A physical device slaved to a Host (belong in a WAN) always only have it's icon inside the host?

No. In fact, there's no way by the current rules for that to happen. The device is outside the host, the same way the ACHE is outside the Space Needle--you can just see it from there.

Quote
Q Is it a correct interpretation that the second statement mean that being inside a Host you no longer suffer cross-grid penalty and distance noise penalty (but you still suffer public grid penalty if you used the public grid while jacking into the matrix)?

If you are on the public grid, you take a -2 penalty. If you entered the host from the public grid, that penalty comes along for the ride.

Q: Do items that take up capacity count as separate items when slaved to a master?

Examples:
Does an Ares Alpha containing a smartgun system (1), airburst link (2), and a bipod (3) count as 1 or 3 devices for the purposes of slaving?
How about a cyberarm with a Large Smuggling Compartment (1) and an SMG containing a smartgun system (2) and a silencer (3)?

If it's integral to the device, it's part of that device. If it's an accessory, it's a separate device. If it takes up Capacity, we're talking integrated.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lobo on <10-03-13/1040:16>
Q A physical device slaved to a Host (belong in a WAN) always only have it's icon inside the host?

No. In fact, there's no way by the current rules for that to happen. The device is outside the host, the same way the ACHE is outside the Space Needle--you can just see it from there.
Quote

Aaron - if that is the case, then what does this mean:

Page 246:

"The virtual space inside a host is separate from the
outside grid. When you’re outside of a host, you can’t interact
directly with icons inside it, although you can still
send messages, make commcalls, and that sort of thing.
Once you’re inside, you can see and interact with icons
inside the host, but not outside (with the same caveat for
messages, calls, etc.)."

What devices are inside a Host then?
How does a spider who is inside a Host interact with the devices that are outside the Host  - does he have to leave the Host to do so?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <10-04-13/0851:23>
Q: Can one implant more than one datajack, and if yes, does the Noise Reduction wireless bonus stack?
Example; Quantum Princess (SRM Season 5 contact) is shown as having two datajacks. What is the purpose of this if the bonuses do not stack?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-04-13/0907:34>
Question got asked before, I think Aaron pondered an answer in another topic. As for why two: Plugging 2 different pieces of equipment into them, getting 1 Noise Reduction on each?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <10-04-13/0914:56>
Michael; duly noted. I tried using the search function, but I couldn't find a clear answer. Also, I just noticed the fact that Quantum Princess has two of the buggers (heh), and wondered what that would mean for her if it ever came to a GM playing her in the CZ.

Also, since Noise Reduction is a wireless bonus that applies to all gear the runner is using (as per a previous answer in this thread), the Noise Reduction does not apply to "just" what's plugged into the datajack. How else would one explain that a runner with an implanted commlink AND datajack receives a noise reduction bonus, when the commlink clearly isn't plugged into the jack?

I'll try searching again, but I would very much appreciate it if Aaron had another go at this one. Cheers!

[EDIT]
Well, would you lookat that, I actually found it: http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=12597.msg232959#msg232959
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-04-13/0935:04>
Noise Reduction is a wireless bonus that applies to all gear the runner is using (as per a previous answer in this thread)
I looked but cannot find an answer supporting that the Noise Reduction of a Datajack would apply to all gear, rather than solely the item implanted into it. Aaron might be able to give you an official clarification or an argument himself, I'll stay out of that debate.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <10-04-13/0956:44>
you have 2 jacks to hardwire 2 devices at once.

(you only need 1 jack to get the wireless bonus).

If wireless bonus of the jack stack (not very likely) then i would get 8-10 jacks and never worry about noise ever again. Even when hacking devices on the other side of the world.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <10-04-13/1001:15>
See answer from Aaron in other thread:
I see no reason why a second data jack wouldn't offer extra signal scrubbing, and neither have any of the other freelancers I've asked. I figure you've bought the thing with Essence and nuyen, so knock yourself out.

Also, his answer in this thread indicates that the Noise Reduction affects the gear a person is using, not just whatever is plugged in (which would be directly connected anyway, so what's the point of the wireless datajack bonus except to provide Noise Reduction for all gear the runner is using).
http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11514.msg239527#msg239527
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-04-13/1020:08>
Ah, so elsewhere. Yes, I know he made those comments. Like I said, staying out of that debate.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <10-04-13/1043:58>
...so what's the point...
you have 2 jacks to hardwire 2 devices at once.
you can't hack a device that is directly connected with a wire.
with 2 jacks you can directly connect two devices.

do you have a link to the character that have two data jacks?


IF wireless bonus stack (unlikely) THEN all deckers would have multiple jacks.
Hacking any device in the world and in any spam or static zone without suffering noise penalty(?!)
- Yes please.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <10-04-13/1049:19>
Last post on the subject for my sake, as my original question has been answered.

Michael; Duly noted. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction re: quote from Aaron!

Xenon, see quotes from and links to posts made by Aaron above.

As for the character, it's Quantum Princess, contact from the Season 5 SRM prep files. Get them for free at http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/product/119272/Shadowrun-Missions-Season-5-Prep-Files

"Augmentations:Beta Cybereyes Rating 4 [Flare Comp, Image Link, Lowlight, Smartlink, Thermo, Vision Enhancement 3,
Vision Mag], Beta Datajack x 2, Beta Skilljack Rating 5"
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <10-04-13/1416:38>
Q: Hydraulic Jacks (page 457) add their Rating to your limit for certain physical tests, but the wireless bonus is a fixed +1 dice pool; is this a typo and should the wireless bonus also be dependent on Rating, or is the dice pool bonus intended to always be +1?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DigitalZombie on <10-04-13/1726:55>
Statement: Only natural recovery can remove drain/fading damage, no medkits or magic can heal it.
Question: can boosts to natural healing, increase the natural healing dicepool and thereby assist in removing more drain/fading?
like medicine (and medicine boosted with medkits) increase body/willpower spells(as long as they are active during the whole natural recovery period, improved attribute body, rapid healing etc.

My reasoning: first aid with medkit uses are applied directly towards removing damage and therefor cant be used at healing drain. While medicine+medkit use doesnt heal any damage at all. (But gives an increased recovery pool, when the natural recovery test is taken) so even though many of those mentioned are either technological or magic, none of them actually "heals" any drain. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <10-05-13/1525:33>
Q: How are cybertorsos and cyberskulls treated if they are shells instead of limbs, as stated on page 455?
In other words, how are they treated for the purposes of:
1) having their own STR and AGI attributes
2) being a particular limb used for a test
3) being coordinated with arms and legs for a task
4) being enhanced with STR, AGI, and armor modifications
5) adding 1 physical condition monitor box
6) any other specific mention of "cyberlimb" in the book

Since they are specifically mention to be shells rather than replacements, what effect does this have in terms of game mechanics?

Q: Since cyberlimbs have their own attributes, do you use their attributes to calculate limits when using them for a test, either individually, as an average, or as the weakest limb?
Since cyberlimbs are augmentations, and augmentations can affect limits (as per page 100 under Final Calculations, "since many [derived mechanics] are adjusted by augmentations"), it logically follows that when a cyberlimb is used in a test they affect the relevant limit for that test. Otherwise, the rules become rather inconsistent.

Example A: A character with STR and AGI 3, and a single cyberarm with STR and AGI 6 fires a pistol one-handed. Does he get 1 or 2 points of Recoil Compensation, and rolls 3 or 6 + Pistols skill, using the accuracy of his pistol?
Example B: The same character throws a punch, leading the attack with his cyberarm and counting as using a particular limb for a test. Does he roll 3 or 6 + Unarmed skill, does he do 3P or 6P unmodified-DV, and is his physical limit calculated with 3 or 6 STR?

If the limb is not counted for the purposes of limits, then the mechanics have the potential to work out rather unfairly for the character who uses cyberlimbs for anything where physical limits are imposed.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: deek on <10-05-13/2147:43>
On page 184, under Active Targeting, it mentions a vehicle/drone could break sensor contact with an Evade Detection action, but there is no other mention of such an action in the book. I can basically figure out it is just another Opposed Sensor Test, this time initiated by the vehicle/drone being targeted.  Since a normal Sensor Test is a Simple Action, is the Evade Detection also a Simple Action?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <10-05-13/2228:01>
Q: When firing at a barrier, does penetrating weapons bypass the Structure + Armor rating test of the "Shooting through barriers" rules on page 197?

The example on page 198 seem to indicate this, but the rules seemingly contradict each other.

Q: Is surprise a situational event, or does it apply every time a combat is started?
Since Surprise is listed under Special Actions, it is my belief that surprise is situational and is applied as the GM sees fit, rather than at all times.

Q: What does being Unaware of an attack entail, and when can it occur?
The rules on defenders being unaware seems contradictory; on one hand, page 189 states that being unaware results in "no defense possible", while also stating that it "does not apply to defenders who are already engaged in combat" and then referencing the Superior Position rule on page 187. Furthermore, characters in cover gain a defense pool equal to the cover, +2 or +4. How should this rule be interpreted?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Cyber-Dave on <10-06-13/0122:09>
Is the listing for bows of 0-STR short range distance intentional? It seems very odd. First of all, it seems like a bows range should be based on its rank, not a character's STR. Second of all, based on all other existing patterns of progression, it seems like a bows short range should be Rank*2 or Rank*3, not 0-Rank (or STR). I mean, why does a bow have such a worse short range than a crossbow? For that matter, why does a bow and a thrown weapon have the same short range? That can't be right, can it? Is this a case of something needing errata, or is this intentional? And, if it is intentional, what is the logic?

Answers, in order:
Yes. That's not a question. That's not a question either. Neither is that. Crossbows typically have a stronger pull than bows. Bows are fired in an arc, and that arc starts sooner than you think. Yes it can. It's intentional. The drop on a fired arrow starts out pretty quick; it's been my experience that even a three-meter shot doesn't go directly where you aim it on a bow with a thirty-pound draw (Rating 3-ish).

Cool. Thanks for the response! I have another question, on another subject.

Question: right now, there does not seem to be a reason to use autofire against a foe when you have surprised that foe, unless you are looking to divide multiple attacks up against the target; are there any plans to grant slight errata to the "rate of fire" rules so that there is some reason to burst fire or autofire against a surprised target when you only want to make a single attack against the target, or does the development team feel that the current benefit (in the form of being able to make multiple attacks against a target that cannot defend) is enough?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <10-07-13/0829:06>
Since they are specifically mention to be shells rather than replacements...
Despite being a shell rather than a limb; both skull and toros are still Cyberlimbs, they are still listed in the Cyberlimbs table and still use Cyberlimbs rules.

(unless a more detailed rule say so; melee cyberguns for example can only be installed in cyberarms. That mean you can not install them in cyberlegs, cybertorso or cyberskull).

...do you use their attributes to calculate limits when using them for a test, either individually, as an average, or as the weakest limb?
There are 3 options here. It depend on the test.

1) Shooting a light pistol use the agility and strength of the arm and the limit of your weapon even if the rest of your body have higher or lower agility, strength or physical limit.

2) Shooting an assault rifle use the average agility and strength of your left and your right arm (round up) and the limit of your weapon even if the rest of your body have higher or lower agility, strength or physical limit.

3) Using your arms to lift something really heavy from the ground use the weakest rating of your right leg, left leg, torso, left arm and right arm. Since this is an attribute test there is no limit so for this test it does not matter what your physical limit is.

Q: Is surprise a situational event...
Yes.
If there is a surprise situation it is most often at start of combat but combat can start without anyone taking a surprise test. GM can also call for a surprise test after combat started.

Q: What does being Unaware of an attack entail...
Defender does not roll reaction + intuition when defending against an attack. If defender is behind cover then defender roll a total dice pool of 2 dice for 25-50% cover or 4 dice for >50% cover.

...and when can it occur?
When defender is unaware of the attacker. For example melee successfully sneak up behind the character before combat started, Ranged attack from behind, Sniper from far far away, Defender can't see the attacker due to total darkness or being fully concealed behind cover.

A surprised character also fall under this category but only against targets he is surprised by.

...characters in cover gain a defense pool equal to the cover, +2 or +4. How should this rule be interpreted?
A character that is unaware of the attacker (see above) will not roll reaction + intuition when defending against an attack. He does, however, still roll a total dice pool of 2 dice if he got 25-50% cover or 4 dice if he got >50% cover.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <10-07-13/0900:26>
All due respect, Xenon, but we already know our differences of opinion on some of these topics. I asked in this thread in order to hopefully get more clarification from some of the sources regarded as more official than you and I.

All I'm saying.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Cyber-Dave on <10-07-13/1010:31>
I, too, actually have a question about the "Unaware of an Attack" rules. My question is specific to the following sentence: "This does not apply to defenders who are already engaged in combat (see Character Has Superior Position, p. 187)." That sentence is being interpreted in two different ways on the boards. The way I read it is follows: the main clause, that the condition does not apply to defenders who are already engaged in combat, is always true. The parenthetical modification supplies extra information, which allows melee attackers to gain a dice pool benefit from perceptual advantage, but in no way shape or form stops the main clause from always being true. A few other posters seem to believe that the parenthetical modification makes the main clause only true when the parenthetical modification is applicable. In other words, if you are not attacking with a melee weapon it is possible for your target to still be unaware of the attack during combat. Which interpretation of that sentence is correct by the Rules as Intended? 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <10-07-13/1240:45>
(In point of fact, if you're already debating the subject with someone, it is simply inappropriate to "answer" them here, since you're actually just bringing the debate over to this thread, not providing an answer or clarification)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Cyber-Dave on <10-07-13/1248:48>
(Ok. Sorry about that. I self-moderated my responses and deleted them.)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <10-07-13/1346:15>
Q: How does one use the Complex Action Use Skill: Leadership?
The rules state that by using a complex action (presumably Use Skill) you can use Leadership for one of four effects; Command, Direct, Inspire, and Rally.

Command, Direct, and Rally all seem straight forward; the character uses the Use Skill Complex Action, rolls Charisma + Leadership [Social], then hits apply in various forms. But the Inspire function has a curious effect, in that net hits "act as a Teamwork Test for your subordinates' Surprise Test for the rest of the Combat Turn.

A Teamwork Test adds net hits as dice to the focus' (in this case subordinates) dice pool. How would you be able to take a Complex Action to aid subordinates before being Surprised? Or do they get to roll extra dice after the surprise test, effectively changing the sequence of surprise?

[EDIT]
If wearing multiple pieces of gear providing AV, which armor modifications apply?
The rules for "Armor and encumbrance" on page 169 states that only "the value of the highest armor piece applies for determining armor applies". Then, under "Specialized protection" on the same page, it is stated that "additional protection is used along with the modified Armor values to determine total Armor against an attack.".

Does this mean that only the modifiers on the highest armor value piece apply regardless of circumstance, or do you get to choose?

For example:
Character A is wearing Armored Clothes (AV6) and an Armor Jacket (AV12).

1. The AV6 item has Chemical Protection 6 and the AV12 item has Nonconductivity 6 and Insulation 6. He is hit by a sword coated in a contact vector toxin; does he roll AV12 + BOD for the melee damage resist, and then BOD + WIL + Chemical Protection 6?
2. The AV6 item has Fire Resistance 6 and the AV12 item has Nonconductivity 6 and Insulation 6. He is hit by a fire based attack; does he roll AV12 - AP, or can he choose to roll AV6 - AP + Fire Resistance 6?

Q: When wearing multiple pieces of armor that provides the same AV, can you choose which AV to use
Similar question as the above, but with two distinct differences.

1. If a character wears an Armored Vest over an Urban Explorer Jumpsuit, or a Lined Coat over a Chameleon Suit, can he choose which item to use? (this could potentially matter for acid and cold attacks, which have the potential to damage the armor piece)
2. As 1, but this time the character has armor pieces with modifications; would the modification be included in the AV calculation (so AV9 - AP 5 electrical = 4 vs AV9 - AP 5 electrical + Insulation 6 = (9 or 10, depending on reading) for example)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <10-09-13/1205:08>
Q Is it actually intended that an awakened character that initiate (but does not spend karma to raise magic rating, common for [Physical] Adepts) is harder to heal with magic?
(SR5, p288)
...this means you take a dice pool modifier equal to the target’s actual Essence minus his maximum Essence (which will turn out to be 0 or a negative number), rounded up.

Q What augmentations, drugs or magic enhancements increase Matrix AR Initiative?
(I would like to think that Matrix AR Initiative is the same as your [Physical] Initiative as you can mix physical and AR actions in a combat turn - or maybe even take a simple physical action and a simple AR action in the same action phase. Table on SR5 p.101 list Initiative and Matrix AR Initiative at two different rows and in that table there is no comment for augmentation bonuses on Matrix AR Initiative but it is for [Physical] Initiative).

Q What augmentations, drugs or magic enhancements -if any- increase Matrix VR Initiative (Cold Sim and Hot Sim)?



...How would you be able to take a Complex Action to aid subordinates before being Surprised?
You use inspire before attacking (and rally while in combat).

...can you choose which AV to use...
(SR5, p169)
...the value of the highest armor piece applies for determining Armor
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sichr on <10-09-13/1346:38>
It was nice, when FAQs in this thread were to be answered by Aaron, not just by another forums member.
IIRC:
We're putting together the FAQ for Shadowrun, 5th Edition. We've already been scraping questions from the various SR5 threads, but we could always use more questions, so if you have any questions about how the game works, please chime in!

While some questions might be answered in this thread, it's mainly for the collection of questions, so please bear with us if folks aren't able to answer right away.

And yeah, I know it's still a couple days from the PDF release, but this thread will still be open when it becomes available. Ditto for the dead tree version.

Just saying...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: deek on <10-09-13/1937:09>
Quick question on reach.  Say a character has +3 reach, does that mean he is engaging the opponent 3m out or are they adjacent (say within a meter) and the 3m is just relevant for determining intercept range?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <10-10-13/0821:45>
It was nice, when FAQs in this thread were to be answered by Aaron, not just by another forums member.
In all fairness, they did consolidate the Rules Clarifications and FAQ threads into one. I don't think anyone affiliated with CGL ever answered questions in the RC thread, it was mostly posters.

But I fully agree. Can we all agree that this thread should serve as a compendium of questions? If there is or has been a discussion about the question elsewhere in the Forum and/or if Aaron has previously answered a question, can we just LINK to that discussion/answer rather than starting arguments over interpretation in this thread?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <10-10-13/0830:18>
Q Is it actually intended that an awakened character that initiate (but does not spend karma to raise magic rating, common for [Physical] Adepts) is harder to heal with magic?
(SR5, p288)
...this means you take a dice pool modifier equal to the target’s actual Essence minus his maximum Essence (which will turn out to be 0 or a negative number), rounded up.

Initiation increases the Magic attribute maximum, not the Essence maximum. So it has no effect on magical healing.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <10-11-13/0350:23>
Q: How does toxins with multiple vectors affect the toxin resistance test?

In other words, can you apply multiple pieces of protective gear against such toxins?
Quote from: Page 409, Using Toxins: (emphasis mine)
When a toxin comes into play, note its Speed to determine when it takes effect. At the end of the appropriate Combat Turn, the victim makes a Toxin Resistance Test to see if the toxin takes effect. This test uses Body + Willpower + the rating of any protective gear/systems; each hit reduces the toxin’s Power by 1 point.
So a character hit by CS/Tear Gas (Contact and Inhalation vectors) could roll Body + Willpower + Chemical Protection + Respirator, as opposed to just adding dice equal to the rating of Chemical Protection OR Respirator, correct?

Q: How big is a non-implanted simrig device?
There is little information on this in the rulebook, so it'd be nice to know if I'm carrying around a credstick sized, item, something a little bigger like a cyberdeck, or even larger like a rating 4 or higher medkit.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: rizzo on <10-11-13/0820:06>
Some question:

1. Is your answers are "official" answers from the SR5 developer group?

2. How chargen skill limit works: (A) Summary of skill and improved ability adept power should be less or equal to chargen skill limit 6(7) or (B) improved ability can increase the skill over the chargen skill limit?

3. Analytical Mind quality: "This quality gives the character a +2 dice pool modifier to any Logic Tests involving pattern recognition, evidence analysis, clue hunting, or solving puzzles."
Does the character get +2 for all of her Logic test (and the listing is only a filler text) (A), or she can get the bonus only those Logic tests, where she has to recognize patterns or analyze evidences or etc. (B) ?

4. Gearhead quality: "She also receives a +2 dice pool modifier when attempting difficult maneuvers or stunts in the vehicle. This bonus lasts for 1D6 minutes."
How long this ablity's cooldown? If it isnt time based, what event triggers the cooldown of this ability? Pilot has to rest, or just a new action or vehicled fight or something else?

5. Weapon mount and clip size: "Standard weapon mounts may hold any assault rifle or smaller-sized weapon and 250 rounds of ammo."
How does it work? The smaller sized weapon get bigger clip (A), or some automat changes the standard clips (B), or the weapon is modified to belt (C), or you have to change the small clips by hand (D), or other way?

6. If an extended test has not treshold does it mean, the dice pool doesnt decreasing after every throw? (for example at Natural Recovery)

Thank you!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Bach_The_Fox on <10-13-13/0853:53>
Hi! Hunting around for these questions on the boards and elsewhere, and not seeing it. Would appreciate anyone's input.

Main Q: Can I hack a commlink and have it turn on a device that is slaved to it (that currently has wireless off)?

These are the assumption questions that need to be answered for a yes to the main question.

Q: Can a device be slaved if it's wireless is off? (if not, that mean it needs to be re-slaved each time it's rebooted or turned on; that doesn't seem to be the case)
Q: Where does the command to turn on a wireless device originate from? (I assume if it's slaved, from the commlink it's slaved to, but this is the part I am least sure of)
Q: Is control device or spoof the appropriate matrix action? If neither, IS there an appropriate matrix action?

My goal is proactive grenade defense...by hacking the commlink of the guy with wireless grenades slaved, turning them on, then turning him off.  ;D
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <10-13-13/1325:23>
Slaving requires the two devices can communicate, so if the wireless on the grenades are off, the only way it could be slaved is if the guy has a direct connection cable plugged into them, which doesn't strike me as likely.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <10-13-13/1732:58>
Q: What happens if you fire a cybergun installed in your arm while wearing a pair of AR or Gecko Gloves?

And for that matter;

Q: How long does it take to ready a cybergun?
In other words does a cybergun even require readying, and if it does is it a free, simple, or complex action to do so? Can a cybergun be quick-drawn? So many questions, so little time...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <10-14-13/0851:55>
Q A physical device slaved to a Host (belong in a WAN) always only have it's icon inside the host?

No. In fact, there's no way by the current rules for that to happen. The device is outside the host, the same way the ACHE is outside the Space Needle--you can just see it from there.

Aaron - if that is the case, then what does this mean:

Page 246:

"The virtual space inside a host is separate from the
outside grid. When you’re outside of a host, you can’t interact
directly with icons inside it, although you can still
send messages, make commcalls, and that sort of thing.
Once you’re inside, you can see and interact with icons
inside the host, but not outside (with the same caveat for
messages, calls, etc.)."

What devices are inside a Host then?
How does a spider who is inside a Host interact with the devices that are outside the Host  - does he have to leave the Host to do so?


It means this:

Page 233:

"If you are in a host that has a WAN, you are considered directly connected to all devices in the WAN."

The device isn't in the host, but you can still access it as though you were directly connected to the device.

Q: Can one implant more than one datajack, and if yes, does the Noise Reduction wireless bonus stack?
Example; Quantum Princess (SRM Season 5 contact) is shown as having two datajacks. What is the purpose of this if the bonuses do not stack?

Yes and yes.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <10-14-13/0914:08>
Q: Hydraulic Jacks (page 457) add their Rating to your limit for certain physical tests, but the wireless bonus is a fixed +1 dice pool; is this a typo and should the wireless bonus also be dependent on Rating, or is the dice pool bonus intended to always be +1?

The rules definitely say that you get a flat +1 dice pool bonus. You might want to post in the errata thread, just to be sure.

Statement: Only natural recovery can remove drain/fading damage, no medkits or magic can heal it.
Question: can boosts to natural healing, increase the natural healing dicepool and thereby assist in removing more drain/fading?
like medicine (and medicine boosted with medkits) increase body/willpower spells(as long as they are active during the whole natural recovery period, improved attribute body, rapid healing etc.

Yes. A good guideline would be to make sure that all the healing comes from the patient's Body + Willpower or Body x 2 Test.

Q: How are cybertorsos and cyberskulls treated if they are shells instead of limbs, as stated on page 455?
In other words, how are they treated for the purposes of:
1) having their own STR and AGI attributes
2) being a particular limb used for a test
3) being coordinated with arms and legs for a task
4) being enhanced with STR, AGI, and armor modifications
5) adding 1 physical condition monitor box
6) any other specific mention of "cyberlimb" in the book

Since they are specifically mention to be shells rather than replacements, what effect does this have in terms of game mechanics?

There's no real mechanical difference; the book describes the cybertorso and cyberskull as shells to indicate that while they fall under the mechanical category of "cyberlimb," they aren't actually limbs. All rules that apply to cyberlimbs also apply to cybertorsos and cyberskulls.

Quote
Q: Since cyberlimbs have their own attributes, do you use their attributes to calculate limits when using them for a test, either individually, as an average, or as the weakest limb?
Since cyberlimbs are augmentations, and augmentations can affect limits (as per page 100 under Final Calculations, "since many [derived mechanics] are adjusted by augmentations"), it logically follows that when a cyberlimb is used in a test they affect the relevant limit for that test. Otherwise, the rules become rather inconsistent.

Cyberlimbs are not included in inherent limit calculations.

Quote
If the limb is not counted for the purposes of limits, then the mechanics have the potential to work out rather unfairly for the character who uses cyberlimbs for anything where physical limits are imposed.

I'm not sure if this is a question, but you're right. There's a difference between having a buffed cyberlimb and knowing how to use it effectively.

On page 184, under Active Targeting, it mentions a vehicle/drone could break sensor contact with an Evade Detection action, but there is no other mention of such an action in the book. I can basically figure out it is just another Opposed Sensor Test, this time initiated by the vehicle/drone being targeted.  Since a normal Sensor Test is a Simple Action, is the Evade Detection also a Simple Action?

This one should be posted in an errata thread. If I was your GM, I'd call it a use of a skill and make it a Complex Action.

Q: When firing at a barrier, does penetrating weapons bypass the Structure + Armor rating test of the "Shooting through barriers" rules on page 197?

The example on page 198 seem to indicate this, but the rules seemingly contradict each other.

When a penetrating weapon strikes a target, it passes through the barrier causing a small amount of damage. Per the same rule, the GM could decide that it takes no damage at all. One way to determine this is to have the barrier resist the damage normally, although if the barrier isn't all that important to the action you can safely skip so much dice rolling.

Quote
Q: Is surprise a situational event, or does it apply every time a combat is started?
Since Surprise is listed under Special Actions, it is my belief that surprise is situational and is applied as the GM sees fit, rather than at all times.

It is situational and can happen at any time during a fight.

Quote
Q: What does being Unaware of an attack entail, and when can it occur?

If you are not expecting an attack from the direction it is coming, you are unaware of the attack. This rarely happens once combat is in full swing, except in cases where an ally turns against you or an attack comes from a quarter you had no reason to believe wasn't secure (like through a solid wall).

Question: right now, there does not seem to be a reason to use autofire against a foe when you have surprised that foe, unless you are looking to divide multiple attacks up against the target; are there any plans to grant slight errata to the "rate of fire" rules so that there is some reason to burst fire or autofire against a surprised target when you only want to make a single attack against the target, or does the development team feel that the current benefit (in the form of being able to make multiple attacks against a target that cannot defend) is enough?

There probably won't be any errata on the subject, but there just might be some advanced firearm rules coming out in a future release (which might have the initials R&G).

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <10-14-13/0944:13>
Q: How are cybertorsos and cyberskulls treated if they are shells instead of limbs, as stated on page 455?
In other words, how are they treated for the purposes of:
1) having their own STR and AGI attributes
2) being a particular limb used for a test
3) being coordinated with arms and legs for a task
4) being enhanced with STR, AGI, and armor modifications
5) adding 1 physical condition monitor box
6) any other specific mention of "cyberlimb" in the book

Since they are specifically mention to be shells rather than replacements, what effect does this have in terms of game mechanics?

There's no real mechanical difference; the book describes the cybertorso and cyberskull as shells to indicate that while they fall under the mechanical category of "cyberlimb," they aren't actually limbs. All rules that apply to cyberlimbs also apply to cybertorsos and cyberskulls.
Does that mean cybertorsos and cyberskulls count as limbs for the purposes of calculating the average and/or value of weakest limb when "careful coordination of several limbs" are required or not? Take skills like Gymnastics (used for a Dodge intercept action, for instance), Swimming or running (just regular swimming and running). In other words, is a cybertorso with STR and AGI of equal or greater value as other cyberlimbs required to maximize potential gain?

Quote
Q: Since cyberlimbs have their own attributes, do you use their attributes to calculate limits when using them for a test, either individually, as an average, or as the weakest limb?
Since cyberlimbs are augmentations, and augmentations can affect limits (as per page 100 under Final Calculations, "since many [derived mechanics] are adjusted by augmentations"), it logically follows that when a cyberlimb is used in a test they affect the relevant limit for that test. Otherwise, the rules become rather inconsistent.

Cyberlimbs are not included in inherent limit calculations.
I'm going to have to ask for some more clarification here; why is this (see below)?

Quote
If the limb is not counted for the purposes of limits, then the mechanics have the potential to work out rather unfairly for the character who uses cyberlimbs for anything where physical limits are imposed.

I'm not sure if this is a question, but you're right. There's a difference between having a buffed cyberlimb and knowing how to use it effectively.
As with the above, this seems highly illogical; a character with low "natural" Strength and Agility but two cyberarms at Rating 9 Agility and Strength can fire a high-accuracy rifle (limits at 9 and up) with pin-point accuracy and with little-to-no recoil penalty, but doesn't know how to throw a simple punch (limit difference of 4+)?

As per the above, why is it that cyberlimbs, when used solely, as an average, and/or in a calculation of lowest rating, do not affect limits for tests that expressly uses said cyberlimb attributes (for better or for worse, for that matter)?

Thank you for the rest of your answers, as always much appreciated. Feel free to let me know if I'm nitpicking too much, but some of these rules just make absolutely zero logical sense to me.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <10-14-13/0948:33>
I, too, actually have a question about the "Unaware of an Attack" rules. My question is specific to the following sentence: "This does not apply to defenders who are already engaged in combat (see Character Has Superior Position, p. 187)." That sentence is being interpreted in two different ways on the boards. The way I read it is follows: the main clause, that the condition does not apply to defenders who are already engaged in combat, is always true. The parenthetical modification supplies extra information, which allows melee attackers to gain a dice pool benefit from perceptual advantage, but in no way shape or form stops the main clause from always being true. A few other posters seem to believe that the parenthetical modification makes the main clause only true when the parenthetical modification is applicable. In other words, if you are not attacking with a melee weapon it is possible for your target to still be unaware of the attack during combat. Which interpretation of that sentence is correct by the Rules as Intended? 

Once you're in combat, you're pretty much expecting an attack from anywhere. The only times you'll be unaware of an attack is if it comes from somewhere you were certain was safe, as with an ally turning on you, or perhaps a bush that you thought was cover but turned out to be an Awakened carnivorous plant ...

Q: How does one use the Complex Action Use Skill: Leadership?
The rules state that by using a complex action (presumably Use Skill) you can use Leadership for one of four effects; Command, Direct, Inspire, and Rally.

Command, Direct, and Rally all seem straight forward; the character uses the Use Skill Complex Action, rolls Charisma + Leadership [Social], then hits apply in various forms. But the Inspire function has a curious effect, in that net hits "act as a Teamwork Test for your subordinates' Surprise Test for the rest of the Combat Turn.

A Teamwork Test adds net hits as dice to the focus' (in this case subordinates) dice pool. How would you be able to take a Complex Action to aid subordinates before being Surprised? Or do they get to roll extra dice after the surprise test, effectively changing the sequence of surprise?

Since surprise can happen at ANY TIME (see, you didn't see that coming), you can substitute the Surprise Test with your Leadership Test. Your team is better prepared for sudden changes in the situation.

Quote
If wearing multiple pieces of gear providing AV, which armor modifications apply?
The rules for "Armor and encumbrance" on page 169 states that only "the value of the highest armor piece applies for determining armor applies". Then, under "Specialized protection" on the same page, it is stated that "additional protection is used along with the modified Armor values to determine total Armor against an attack.".

Use the best protection for the attack you're resisting on a case-by-case basis. On the other hand ...

Q: When wearing multiple pieces of armor that provides the same AV, can you choose which AV to use
[/quote]

If your armor is doing the resisting (as with cold or acid attacks), then the armor on the outside (farthest from your tender skin) is the subject of the effect.

Q Is it actually intended that an awakened character that initiate (but does not spend karma to raise magic rating, common for [Physical] Adepts) is harder to heal with magic?
(SR5, p288)
...this means you take a dice pool modifier equal to the target’s actual Essence minus his maximum Essence (which will turn out to be 0 or a negative number), rounded up.

Initiation doesn't increase your Essence, just your maximum Magic rating, which doesn't have anything to do with Essence health spells.

Quote
Q What augmentations, drugs or magic enhancements increase Matrix AR Initiative?

All of them. Your AR Initiative is the same as your physical Initiative because while everything happening is virtual, the AR controls and displays are, at least for you, in physical space.

Quote
Q What augmentations, drugs or magic enhancements -if any- increase Matrix VR Initiative (Cold Sim and Hot Sim)?

Anything that raises your Intuition, basically.

Quick question on reach.  Say a character has +3 reach, does that mean he is engaging the opponent 3m out or are they adjacent (say within a meter) and the 3m is just relevant for determining intercept range?

The physical measurement (1m times Reach) is only for interception (p. 194, SR5). Your Reach 3 character can intercept anyone who comes within 4 meters.

Q: How does toxins with multiple vectors affect the toxin resistance test?

In other words, can you apply multiple pieces of protective gear against such toxins?

Nope. Only the best one (or the worst one if your GM hates you).

Quote
Q: How big is a non-implanted simrig device?
There is little information on this in the rulebook, so it'd be nice to know if I'm carrying around a credstick sized, item, something a little bigger like a cyberdeck, or even larger like a rating 4 or higher medkit.

It can fit into a commlink, so it's not that big. Put it between a credstick and a cell phone.

Some question:

1. Is your answers are "official" answers from the SR5 developer group?

They're as official as I can make them. I worked on the book and on the rules committee that came up with the rules before the book was written. I'm working on the Shadowrun FAQ that will be released once Line Developer Jason M. Hardy has a chance to look it over. Those answers I'm not 100% certain about I vet with Jason and the folks who work on Shadowrun. I never post an answer that I think might be contradicted in a future update. Other than that, you get what you pay for.

Quote
2. How chargen skill limit works: (A) Summary of skill and improved ability adept power should be less or equal to chargen skill limit 6(7) or (B) improved ability can increase the skill over the chargen skill limit?

Yep, to the maximum that ability allows (natural rating x 1.5).

Quote
3. Analytical Mind quality: "This quality gives the character a +2 dice pool modifier to any Logic Tests involving pattern recognition, evidence analysis, clue hunting, or solving puzzles."
Does the character get +2 for all of her Logic test (and the listing is only a filler text) (A), or she can get the bonus only those Logic tests, where she has to recognize patterns or analyze evidences or etc. (B) ?

The dice pool modifier from Analytical Mind applies only to those tests involving pattern recognition, evidence analysis, clue hunting, or solving puzzles. The list is not filler text.

Quote
4. Gearhead quality: "She also receives a +2 dice pool modifier when attempting difficult maneuvers or stunts in the vehicle. This bonus lasts for 1D6 minutes."
How long this ablity's cooldown? If it isnt time based, what event triggers the cooldown of this ability? Pilot has to rest, or just a new action or vehicled fight or something else?

The "cooldown" of this power is after the vehicle that's been pushed to its limits has had some maintenance performed on it. Pushing a vehicle isn't like pushing a mount; it doesn't heal between sessions.

Quote
5. Weapon mount and clip size: "Standard weapon mounts may hold any assault rifle or smaller-sized weapon and 250 rounds of ammo."
How does it work? The smaller sized weapon get bigger clip (A), or some automat changes the standard clips (B), or the weapon is modified to belt (C), or you have to change the small clips by hand (D), or other way?

The weapon is modified to feed ammunition from an internal magazine. For some weapons it's a belt, for others it's a drum, for still others it's something completely unique to the weapon.

Quote
6. If an extended test has not treshold does it mean, the dice pool doesnt decreasing after every throw? (for example at Natural Recovery)

That's been asked and answered a few times. For natural recovery, the pool decreases after every throw until you're fully healed or you discover that you need medical attention. It's possible that this will be changed with future errata, but I have no information either way, so I'm sticking to what the rules say.

Quote
Thank you!

You're welcome!

Hi! Hunting around for these questions on the boards and elsewhere, and not seeing it. Would appreciate anyone's input.

Main Q: Can I hack a commlink and have it turn on a device that is slaved to it (that currently has wireless off)?

These are the assumption questions that need to be answered for a yes to the main question.

Q: Can a device be slaved if it's wireless is off? (if not, that mean it needs to be re-slaved each time it's rebooted or turned on; that doesn't seem to be the case)
Q: Where does the command to turn on a wireless device originate from? (I assume if it's slaved, from the commlink it's slaved to, but this is the part I am least sure of)
Q: Is control device or spoof the appropriate matrix action? If neither, IS there an appropriate matrix action?

My goal is proactive grenade defense...by hacking the commlink of the guy with wireless grenades slaved, turning them on, then turning him off.  ;D

Main A: No. A commlink isn't a user, it's a device. Devices can't own other devices, even when they're a master in a PAN.

A: It's not technically slaved when it's off, but can be set to re-slave by the owner when it turns back on. The master-slave relationship doesn't have to end when you power something down.
A: The owner of the devices (which, incidentally, has to be the same for both master and slave).
A: I'm not sure what you're asking. I imagine the Grid Overwatch Division considers Spoofing to be inappropriate at pretty much all times, and the Control Device action can be rather rude depending on the circumstances.

Q: What happens if you fire a cybergun installed in your arm while wearing a pair of AR or Gecko Gloves?

And for that matter;

Q: How long does it take to ready a cybergun?
In other words does a cybergun even require readying, and if it does is it a free, simple, or complex action to do so? Can a cybergun be quick-drawn? So many questions, so little time...

"Smaller cyberguns fire through a hidden port in the palm or knuckles, while larger cyberguns fold back the user’s hand at the wrist." (p. 458, SR5) That, I hope, answers your question about the gloves.

Arguably, a cybergun is always readied. You might need a Free Action to release the safety.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <10-14-13/0953:34>
Aaron, are you sure that you meant to say that the Augmented Maximum applies to SKILLS?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <10-14-13/1005:41>
Does that mean cybertorsos and cyberskulls count as limbs for the purposes of calculating the average and/or value of weakest limb when "careful coordination of several limbs" are required or not? Take skills like Gymnastics (used for a Dodge intercept action, for instance), Swimming or running (just regular swimming and running). In other words, is a cybertorso with STR and AGI of equal or greater value as other cyberlimbs required to maximize potential gain?

If your GM thinks your cybertorso or cyberskull should be included for the purposes of calculating the average and/or value of the weakest limb when "careful coordination of several limbs" is required, then it is. Otherwise, it's not.

Quote
As with the above, this seems highly illogical; a character with low "natural" Strength and Agility but two cyberarms at Rating 9 Agility and Strength can fire a high-accuracy rifle (limits at 9 and up) with pin-point accuracy and with little-to-no recoil penalty, but doesn't know how to throw a simple punch (limit difference of 4+)?

I'm sure there are plenty of Web sites that describe in intricate detail the physical mechanics of throwing a punch (a process that involves core muscles, balance, and follow through) and those that describe the mechanics of using a firearm (lining up the weapon, steadying unnecessary movement, squeezing the trigger smoothly). Case in point: compare the best recommended stances for punching and sniping. Suffice it to say that the two tasks are, indeed, different, and that the rules take different approaches to each as a result.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <10-14-13/1007:11>
Aaron, are you sure that you meant to say that the Augmented Maximum applies to SKILLS?

I am absolutely certain that I didn't. =i)

Post edited. Thanks for catching that.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <10-14-13/1358:15>
Quote
Q What augmentations, drugs or magic enhancements -if any- increase Matrix VR Initiative (Cold Sim and Hot Sim)?
Anything that raises your Intuition, basically.
What about augmentations, drugs or magic enhancements that give bonus directly to initiative (such as Increase Reflexes spell)?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <10-14-13/1436:17>
Question: It seems rather unclear from reading the book, so does Bio-ware still come in the various different grades as it did in the previous edition?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <10-14-13/1504:50>
Question: It seems rather unclear from reading the book, so does Bio-ware still come in the various different grades as it did in the previous edition?

Yes.

Chasin' the Wind Spoiler
[spoiler]Sam is chock full of delta-grade bioware.  Scarily so.[/spoiler]
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <10-14-13/1507:25>
Question: It seems rather unclear from reading the book, so does Bio-ware still come in the various different grades as it did in the previous edition?

Yes.

Chasin' the Wind Spoiler
[spoiler]Sam is chock full of delta-grade bioware.  Scarily so.[/spoiler]

Perhaps I should clarify. I will only consider a response valid if it comes from Aaron or another developer.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <10-14-13/1517:07>
Question: It seems rather unclear from reading the book, so does Bio-ware still come in the various different grades as it did in the previous edition?

Yes.

Chasin' the Wind Spoiler
[spoiler]Sam is chock full of delta-grade bioware.  Scarily so.[/spoiler]

Perhaps I should clarify. I will only consider a response valid if it comes from Aaron or another developer.

As opposed to a direct quotation from the book?

Quote
Cyberware and
Bioware Grades
Cyberware and bioware implants are available in five distinct
grades: standard, alphaware, betaware, deltaware,
and used. Only standard, alphaware, and used implants
are available for purchase at character creation. The prices
for cyberware and bioware presented in this chapter are
for standard ‘ware. When purchasing implants of other
grades, apply the Essence Cost, Cost, and Availability adjustments
as noted on the Implant Grades table.
All accessories and add-ons must be of the same
grade as the implant to which they are added.

Where are you seeing the contradiction?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <10-14-13/2142:39>
Quote
Q What augmentations, drugs or magic enhancements -if any- increase Matrix VR Initiative (Cold Sim and Hot Sim)?
Anything that raises your Intuition, basically.
What about augmentations, drugs or magic enhancements that give bonus directly to initiative (such as Increase Reflexes spell)?

Initiative (no modifier like "Astral" or "Matrix") refers to only physical Initiative.

Question: It seems rather unclear from reading the book, so does Bio-ware still come in the various different grades as it did in the previous edition?

Kincaid and Crunch are quite correct to say yes.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <10-14-13/2203:17>
In a number of places, the Matrix Chapter refers to defense tests as if the term applied to all opposed tests.  The term, however, seems to originate specifically in the Combat Chapter, and in that chapter refers specifically to rolls not to get hit.  Am I missing a definition somewhere, or is this a candidate for errata?

Notably, this Matters, because it impacts things like when you get a bonus from Full Matrix Defense.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-15-13/1158:08>
So just to be clear: A Street Samurai with 4 wireless Datajacks would be down 0.4 essence and 4k nuyen, but have 4 Noise Reduction on all their wireless gear simultaneously, meaning every piece of equipment they have (armor, smartguns, vision enhancement glasses, audio enhancement earbuds, medkit and so on) would function at Noise (DR2+NR4) 6 or less, making them essentially immune to all but the most extreme environmental Noise. Also, a Decker with 10 wireless Datajacks and Signal Scrub would be immune to any Noise that isn't 13+, letting them bypass Jammers and such. Correct?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: FasterN8 on <10-15-13/1309:54>
Don't forget Hacking the other side of the planet with no penalty.  But yes, that's the logical extension of what he said. 

I agree with where you're going on this Michael, but this probably isn't the place to discuss it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <10-15-13/1853:26>
Can you use Full Matrix Defense against a Data Spike from an Icon you have not spotted?

Since Attack actions only notify the victim if they succeed, not fail, it seems to me like you don't realize you were attacked until after you already failed the test. If you interrupt to add dice to this attack, and then succeed, their attack failed, so you were never notified it happened.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <10-15-13/2255:30>
In a number of places, the Matrix Chapter refers to defense tests as if the term applied to all opposed tests.  The term, however, seems to originate specifically in the Combat Chapter, and in that chapter refers specifically to rolls not to get hit.  Am I missing a definition somewhere, or is this a candidate for errata?

Notably, this Matters, because it impacts things like when you get a bonus from Full Matrix Defense.

Whenever you see "defense test," you're looking at the dice pool to the right of the "v." in an Opposed Test.

So just to be clear: A Street Samurai with 4 wireless Datajacks would be down 0.4 essence and 4k nuyen, but have 4 Noise Reduction on all their wireless gear simultaneously, meaning every piece of equipment they have (armor, smartguns, vision enhancement glasses, audio enhancement earbuds, medkit and so on) would function at Noise (DR2+NR4) 6 or less, making them essentially immune to all but the most extreme environmental Noise. Also, a Decker with 10 wireless Datajacks and Signal Scrub would be immune to any Noise that isn't 13+, letting them bypass Jammers and such. Correct?

Pretty much, yeah. Although that's a lot of hardware open to hacking.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <10-15-13/2256:25>
Can you use Full Matrix Defense against a Data Spike from an Icon you have not spotted?

Yes.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <10-15-13/2259:28>
Can you use Full Matrix Defense against a Data Spike from an Icon you have not spotted?

Yes.

That creates a weird metagame situation. A hidden spider tries to Dataspike the decker. The decker uses full defense, so the spider fails. Since the spider failed the Attack action, the decker was not notified that he just got attacked. The character doesn't know what just happened, but the player does.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <10-15-13/2303:27>
In a number of places, the Matrix Chapter refers to defense tests as if the term applied to all opposed tests.  The term, however, seems to originate specifically in the Combat Chapter, and in that chapter refers specifically to rolls not to get hit.  Am I missing a definition somewhere, or is this a candidate for errata?

Notably, this Matters, because it impacts things like when you get a bonus from Full Matrix Defense.

Whenever you see "defense test," you're looking at the dice pool to the right of the "v." in an Opposed Test.

Is that specific to the Matrix, or is the latter half of an opposed test considered to be a defense test at all times?  Because that seems like there could be some serious unintended consequences...  Is it intended, then, that Full Matrix Defense applies to any and all Matrix actions, and not just attack actions?

Can you use Full Matrix Defense against a Data Spike from an Icon you have not spotted?

Yes.

How does taking full defense against an action of which you have absolutely zero awareness work?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <10-15-13/2329:55>
If you are the owner of a device, can you choose to not roll a defense test against a Matrix Action?

For example, the Set Data Bomb action is Software + Logic [Sleaze] v. (Device Rating*2), and the rating of the Data Bomb can go up to Net Hits. So can you voluntarily refuse to make this test, so that all your hits are net hits?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <10-16-13/1340:21>
Q: Can a cyberware scanner (millimeter wave detection, page 366) detect bioware?
It seems that it can only detect cyberware and weapons, as the rules specifically include "non-biological item".
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sichr on <10-16-13/1424:39>
Yes, bioware pretty much seems to be The answer since Augmentation :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <10-16-13/1807:54>
If you are the owner of a device, can you choose to not roll a defense test against a Matrix Action?

For example, the Set Data Bomb action is Software + Logic [Sleaze] v. (Device Rating*2), and the rating of the Data Bomb can go up to Net Hits. So can you voluntarily refuse to make this test, so that all your hits are net hits?
Yes.

[spoiler]
Set data bomb p.242
(complex Action)
Marks Required: 1
Test: Software + Logic [Sleaze] v. (Device Rating x 2)

There is a ( ) around Device Rating x 2


Q Should we read this as when you set a bomb on a file that is located in your own cyberdeck it will not try to resist you?

Generally speaking, the target's owner can choose not to defend against a Matrix action.
[/spoiler]
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <10-16-13/1919:39>
In a number of places, the Matrix Chapter refers to defense tests as if the term applied to all opposed tests.  The term, however, seems to originate specifically in the Combat Chapter, and in that chapter refers specifically to rolls not to get hit.  Am I missing a definition somewhere, or is this a candidate for errata?

Notably, this Matters, because it impacts things like when you get a bonus from Full Matrix Defense.

Whenever you see "defense test," you're looking at the dice pool to the right of the "v." in an Opposed Test.

Is that specific to the Matrix, or is the latter half of an opposed test considered to be a defense test at all times?  Because that seems like there could be some serious unintended consequences...  Is it intended, then, that Full Matrix Defense applies to any and all Matrix actions, and not just attack actions?

That's true for the entire book. And yes, it applies against all Matrix actions.

Quote
Can you use Full Matrix Defense against a Data Spike from an Icon you have not spotted?

Yes.

How does taking full defense against an action of which you have absolutely zero awareness work?

The same way you can choose to dodge down the street, ducking and weaving, moving from cover to cover, even if you're not being attacked. You take time- and energy-consuming precautions that may or may not be necessary.

If you are the owner of a device, can you choose to not roll a defense test against a Matrix Action?

For example, the Set Data Bomb action is Software + Logic [Sleaze] v. (Device Rating*2), and the rating of the Data Bomb can go up to Net Hits. So can you voluntarily refuse to make this test, so that all your hits are net hits?

Yes, although that might be better listed as errata than frequently asked question.

Q: Can a cyberware scanner (millimeter wave detection, page 366) detect bioware?

No.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <10-16-13/1923:53>
I didn't mean using full Defense in general, I meant as an interrupt. How do you suddenly decide that right now, you're going to start using more effort to avoid, just when you happen to get attacked by something you don't know is there? That just sounds like metagaming.

As for Full Matrix Defense working against  all Matrix Actions,

Quote
FULL MATRIX DEFENSE
(interrupt Action)
Marks Required: Owner
Test: none (Firewall action)
This allows you to defend against Attack actions, and
may be taken at any time. Whenever you make a defense
test against a Matrix Action, add your Willpower to the
dice pool (or add it again if it’s already in there). When
you take this action, your Initiative Score is reduced by
10, but the effects last for the rest of the Combat Turn.

First line specifies Attack Actions only, second line uses the more general term Matrix Action. So is the general term correct, or the specific one?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <10-16-13/1935:38>
That's true for the entire book. And yes, it applies against all Matrix actions.

Does that mean (for example) that rider effect of Electricity damage (which includes a -1 penalty to defense tests) applies to any time you're on the other side of an Opposed test?

In any case, should it then be submitted for errata that this is the case?  Because the term "defense test" does not get used in the definition of an opposed test, and in fact doesn't come up at all outside the Magic, Combat, and Matrix chapters.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Belker on <10-18-13/1426:16>
Backdoor or fake host accounts
Once a hacker has gained access to a host, is it possible for the hacker to use Edit File or some other matrix action to create any type of
"legitimate" account so that at a later date, the hacker could request a mark from the host without utilizing either Brute Force or Hack on the Fly?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-19-13/0417:07>
This one came up again in a debate, so wondering if there's an official answer now:

When an edged diceroll results in, or is accompanied by, a secondary test, are you unable to edge the second test? Under what circumstances would it count as 'part of the same action'?

For example, if I cast a Spell with Edge, can I edge the Drain Resistance test? When I edge and still roll a critical glitch with Explosive rounds, am I uncapable of edging the resulting damage soak test? If I summon a Sprite/Spirit with the help of Edge, can I then Edge the Fading/Drain test? If I edge a dodge test and fail, can I edge the soak test? If I throw a grenade with Edge and the blast still hits me, can I edge the soak test?

Related: If you multicast, are you allowed to Edge only 1 of the Drain tests?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Koshnek on <10-19-13/1221:37>
When buying a control rig, does it come with hot sim or do you have to buy hot sim? If you buy it, does that increase it's rating by 4F?

Also, do drones need the rigger interface or only vehicles? I figured that one out. Can any drone with 3+ Body be given a weapon mount?

Finally, could a fly spy be modified to deliver injection vector toxins?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Belker on <10-19-13/1405:32>
Possible errata: On page 301, under Spirit Basics, the second paragraph refers to materialization but the page cited (314) is for manifestation. Should this actually be referring to the critter Materialization power on page 398?

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Froggy711 on <10-23-13/0125:24>
If my character has a cup of soykaf in the morning every monday through friday for 10 weeks (that amounts to 50 cups of soykaf) at the end of 10 weeks does my character need to make 1 addiction test or 50? (assuming the addiction is strictly physical)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Rocks In My Dryer on <10-23-13/0148:23>
I've found a rule which I'm unsure about on p.169, Armor and Encumbrance.

"Armor accessories, items listed with a “+” in front of their rating, add to the character’s Armor for the purpose of Damage Resistance tests. The maximum bonus a character receive from these items is limited to their Strength attribute. For every 2 full points by which the bonus exceeds the character’s Strength, the character suffers a –1 penalty to Agility and Reaction."

This makes it seem that a character with only 1 point of Strength can only have one point of armor. I assume that this refers only to the bonus provided by armor accessories and not to the character's total armor value. Otherwise, having an armor value higher than your Strength would A) Grant no additional armor bonus, and B) Lower two other stats.

So, let's say the character has no accessories. They have 1 Strength and an Armor Jacket (9 armor), they receive -4 to their Agility and Reaction. Can a character have their Agility or Reaction lowered to below 0? If yes, physical attributes are extremely important for every character, making it much more difficult to have a mage with a low attribute score. If not, all the physical stats could be considered dumpstats if one were so inclined and a mage could simply wear Full Body Armor and all the possible accessories. Just wondering which of these extremes my mage will end up having. Thanks.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-23-13/0447:56>
Like it says, Encumbrance only applies to Armor Accessories, not normal armor.

By the way, I think hitting 0 gets you paralyzed.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <10-23-13/0500:21>
The situational modifier "Attacker firing from cover with imaging device" p. 177 states that it is possible to fire with only the gun around the cover.
If someone wants to shoot at a character doing so, is he considered having Good cover, or is he completely hidden, imposing a blind fire penalty to the attacker?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <10-23-13/0654:59>
If my character has a cup of soykaf in the morning every monday through friday for 10 weeks (that amounts to 50 cups of soykaf) at the end of 10 weeks does my character need to make 1 addiction test or 50? (assuming the addiction is strictly physical)
Only 1. You've used soykaf during the 10-week period, often enough (week 1, 3, 5, 7, 9) to not reduce the Addiction Threshold to 0, and during week 10, so the Addiction Threshold is 2, not 1. The rules do not say anything about the other 44 soykafs affecting anything.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <10-23-13/0752:41>
If my character has a cup of soykaf in the morning every monday through friday for 10 weeks (that amounts to 50 cups of soykaf) at the end of 10 weeks does my character need to make 1 addiction test or 50? (assuming the addiction is strictly physical)
Only 1. You've used soykaf during the 10-week period, often enough (week 1, 3, 5, 7, 9) to not reduce the Addiction Threshold to 0, and during week 10, so the Addiction Threshold is 2, not 1. The rules do not say anything about the other 44 soykafs affecting anything.

nothing wrong with a caffeine addiction. It's one of the four basic food groups!!!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Cyber-Dave on <10-23-13/1045:42>
@Aaron: If you wouldn't mind clarifying, do you NEED to be surprised in order to be "unaware of an attack?" It is my understanding that you do not. The surprised rules and the unaware of an attack rules are their own entities, which is why the unaware of an attack rules say that they are invoked when a target "does not see the attacker, the attacker is behind him, or he is surprised," not "you are unaware of an attack when you are surprised." But, at least one forum poster thinks that the unaware of an attack condition is only applied when a target fails its surprise roll, so I thought I would ask in order to double check.

Likewise, if someone successfully sneaks up on a target and knifes them, or shoots a target with a sniper rifle from a hidden position, or some such, would you roll surprise before or after the attack? My understanding is that the attack is handled "outside combat." That one attack is made against a foe who is "unaware of the attack." After that, everyone rolls surprise. Am I correct? 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tempo on <10-23-13/1248:52>
I have a question regarding Ghouls, and HMHVV.

There seems like a large discrepancy between how Kreiger Strain of HMHVV is described other source material, and the Ghoul profile listed in the SR5 book.

In multiple sourcebooks it mentions how infectious and virulent Krieger HMHVV is, yet there is no mention of this in the monster profile.

Are Ghouls supposed to be really contagious or...  Are only certain ones contagious? Or are the default ghouls listed in the book 2nd or 3rd generation ghouls and no longer an infection vector?

How are we supposed to run ghouls out of the book?

Thanks for the clarification,

-Tempo
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <10-23-13/1435:54>
I'll add my voice to Cyber-Dave's question above.

Q: Can you take a Combat Action (such as Fire Single Shot Weapon as a simple action, or Melee Attack) without following the Combat Turn Sequence described on page 158 and/or the Combat Resolution rules beginning on page 172?
In other words, is it possible to somehow make a Combat Action as above without rolling for surprise and or initiative first?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Rocks In My Dryer on <10-23-13/1631:40>
Like it says, Encumbrance only applies to Armor Accessories, not normal armor.

This still doesn't really make sense. The paragraph in the book which handles armor accessories says two things regarding encumbrance which seem to apply only to accessories and are somewhat redundant.

1. You cannot receive more of a bonus than your Strength allows.
2. If the value does exceed your Strength, you receive negatives due to encumbrance.

Does this second rule, found in the area which pertains to accessories, apply only to accessories or should there be an erratum which puts this rule in the same paragraph which covers armor in general? I am trying to figure out if you can put every character in Full Body Armor, no matter what their physical stats. Or does the second rule also apply to your main piece of armor? Based on where the rule is, it doesn't seem that way, though I instinctively feel it should.

By the way, I think hitting 0 gets you paralyzed.

Looks like you're right. In the description of the Decrease [Attribute] Spell, it says, "If a Physical Attribute is reduced to 0, the victim is incapacitated and paralyzed. If a Mental Attribute is reduced to 0, the victim stands still, mindlessly confused." Presumably this applies to every instance of your stats hitting zero; not just for the effects of this spell. Perhaps this should be in the errata so it can also be written somewhere near the Armor and Encumbrance section, since it's relevant to that cumulative attribute decrease. Or maybe even near the section which describes attributes and their functions. Though it might need to be reworded for use with armor. I assume that putting on a big piece of armor doesn't necessarily paralyze you, though it might make you useless for the purposes of combat.

I've made bold the things which are possible errata for the benefit of the moderators, just in case they're skimming. Though I'm still curious about the rule for heavy armor on a tiny dude.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <10-23-13/1635:46>
It only applies to accessories.

SR5 Armor encumbrance rules are basically.

1) You can only benefit from one piece of non accessory armor.
2) Armor accessories are limited by strength.

Any encumbrance penalties beyond that are up to the GM and fall under the standard encumbrance rules, not armor encumbrance.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Cyber-Dave on <10-24-13/0133:42>
Oh, and one more question for you Aaron: once you have already been shot through a wall, as you now know that there is someone capable of shooting at you from the other end of the wall, are you still considered unaware of the attack? Or, as you now know that the quarter is insecure, do you regain your ability to use your defense bonus vs. people shooting at you through that wall?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <10-24-13/1737:31>
Do the Perceiving Magic rules apply only to the casting of spells, or also the effect of spells? If the latter, does it apply to the presence of Sustained and Quickened spells? So if a Mage has a sustained/quickened Force 6 Armor spell on himself, is he just walking down the street visibly glowing at all times?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Daedalus on <10-24-13/1844:11>
So Street Cred has two different mechanics. While this is an eratta find I am also looking for a rules clairification as to which one is correct so I think this is the correct thread.

p. 372 states characters automatically get an amount of street cred = karma/10 (rounddown).  It goes on to state, "Street Cred is applied as a positive Limit Modifier to all Social Tests in situations where the character’s reputation would be known."

Note that this increases the *limit*.

However, the chart on p. 140 states that street cred increases the die pool.
Is the chart or the entry correct?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <10-24-13/1945:13>
So Street Cred has two different mechanics. While this is an eratta find I am also looking for a rules clairification as to which one is correct so I think this is the correct thread.

p. 372 states characters automatically get an amount of street cred = karma/10 (rounddown).  It goes on to state, "Street Cred is applied as a positive Limit Modifier to all Social Tests in situations where the character’s reputation would be known."

Note that this increases the *limit*.

However, the chart on p. 140 states that street cred increases the die pool.
Is the chart or the entry correct?

Just a guess, I would go with the increase to the Limit....

The other one is worded almost exactly like the 4e write up which leads me to think it wasn't edited properly for the Limits they put in place.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Bach_The_Fox on <10-25-13/1249:39>
In all previous editions, you could explicitly attack active Foci in Astral space.

Now the only things that interact with them is Disenchanting and Mana Barriers.

Is this intentional or errata worthy?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <10-25-13/1309:13>
In all previous editions, you could explicitly attack active Foci in Astral space.

Now the only things that interact with them is Disenchanting and Mana Barriers.

Is this intentional or errata worthy?

The trick you are talking about was called "Grounding" and it has been removed since 4e. there is a write up as to why in the 4th edition SR 2050 book.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Bach_The_Fox on <10-25-13/1311:50>
In all previous editions, you could explicitly attack active Foci in Astral space.

Now the only things that interact with them is Disenchanting and Mana Barriers.

Is this intentional or errata worthy?

The trick you are talking about was called "Grounding" and it has been removed since 4e. there is a write up as to why in the 4th edition SR 2050 book.

Nah, not grounding (which I'm happy was removed, however amusing it was to ground a Fireball through a Sustaining Focus).

Active Foci are astral constructs, like wards, barriers, etc, and could be attacked by Astral entities or spells in the same way.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <10-25-13/1422:37>
In all previous editions, you could explicitly attack active Foci in Astral space.

Now the only things that interact with them is Disenchanting and Mana Barriers.

Is this intentional or errata worthy?

The trick you are talking about was called "Grounding" and it has been removed since 4e. there is a write up as to why in the 4th edition SR 2050 book.

Nah, not grounding (which I'm happy was removed, however amusing it was to ground a Fireball through a Sustaining Focus).

Active Foci are astral constructs, like wards, barriers, etc, and could be attacked by Astral entities or spells in the same way.
Not ever to my knowledge.... the only way was "grounding" which allowed an astral entity (spirit or Mage) to attack a physical active foci, or materialized spirit for the purpose of sending a spell to the physical plane.

you could however target an active foci with a meta magic technique that rendered the foci inactive for a set period of time from the astral.... But that has been removed too since 4e. could you provide the page number for 3e and 4e so I can look and see what you are talking about?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Bach_The_Fox on <10-25-13/1426:48>
SR4A pg 183 (resistance for Foci vs. Spells); pg 193 (Astral Combat "Astral objects...only affected by physical damage")

SR3 and SR2? Yeesh. No PDFs for those, heh.

EDIT: No, scratch that, found it. "Astral objects are non-intelligent astral forms like barriers and foci, which only fight in astral combat if they are attacked." pg 176 SR3; is much more explicit with how handle attacking them.


Someone else can go hunt down SR2 and SR1 . :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <10-25-13/1449:48>
SR4A pg 183 (resistance for Foci vs. Spells); pg 193 (Astral Combat "Astral objects...only affected by physical damage")

SR3 and SR2? Yeesh. No PDFs for those, heh.

EDIT: No, scratch that, found it. "Astral objects are non-intelligent astral forms like barriers and foci, which only fight in astral combat if they are attacked." pg 176 SR3; is much more explicit with how handle attacking them.


Someone else can go hunt down SR2 and SR1 . :)

Sorry buddy, but I can not find anything in SR4a about attacking a foci. (used the search command, 0 hits)
pg 183 says nothing about attacking foci... and only that attacks but be on the same plane (astral to astral, physical to physical) and that attacking in astral must be done with a mana spell only (so no elemental effects)

Pg 193 talks about astral forms, astral combat, manifesting, astral tracking. but says nothing about attacking a Foci.

infact the only thing stated anywhere I could find about "attacking a foci" was when a foci is forced through an astral barrier, in which case either the barrier breaks, or the foci is disrupted and gets turned off.

could you please cut and paste the info, you have me curious now.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Bach_The_Fox on <10-25-13/1455:41>
It's not very clear. Here, this is from the FAQ
No idea what future book it is referring to.

http://old.shadowrun4.com/resources/faq.shtml

Quote
Can I attack an active focus in Astral Combat? If so, how much damage can it take, and what happens when its damage track is filled up?

This will be answered fully in an upcoming sourcebook. In the meantime, the following is an optional rule gamemasters may choose to implement in their games, based on the Disrupt [Focus] spell:

An active focus is dual-natured and can be attacked using Astral Combat much like a ward or targeted by spells like Disrupt [Focus] (p.16, Digital Grimoire) or other Mana-based spells that deal Physical damage.

From the Disrupt [Focus] spell description: On the astral plane, an active focus has Barrier and Structure ratings equal to its Force. If its Structure rating is reduced to 0, the focus is disrupted and becomes inactive; the magician bonded to the focus cannot gain dice bonuses or any other benefit from the focus until it is reactivated. A focus "heals" a number of boxes of damage equal to its Force every Combat Turn; when all the damage is repaired the owner may spend a Simple Action to reactivate the focus. Disrupting a sustaining focus will also disrupt the spell it is sustaining. Astrally projecting magicians whose foci become disrupted cannot reactivate them until their astral form rejoins their physical body.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-25-13/1502:58>
So let me summarize what I think I know about SR4:
- A focus is dual-natured so active on the astral.
- This means it's visible and can be assensed from the astral.
- It can, however, not be targeted with astral spells.
- So it cannot be attacked from from the astral.
- It can be attacked in itself on the physical realm, however.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <10-25-13/1505:11>
It's not very clear. Here, this is from the FAQ
No idea what future book it is referring to.

http://old.shadowrun4.com/resources/faq.shtml

Quote
Can I attack an active focus in Astral Combat? If so, how much damage can it take, and what happens when its damage track is filled up?

This will be answered fully in an upcoming sourcebook. In the meantime, the following is an optional rule gamemasters may choose to implement in their games, based on the Disrupt [Focus] spell:

An active focus is dual-natured and can be attacked using Astral Combat much like a ward or targeted by spells like Disrupt [Focus] (p.16, Digital Grimoire) or other Mana-based spells that deal Physical damage.

From the Disrupt [Focus] spell description: On the astral plane, an active focus has Barrier and Structure ratings equal to its Force. If its Structure rating is reduced to 0, the focus is disrupted and becomes inactive; the magician bonded to the focus cannot gain dice bonuses or any other benefit from the focus until it is reactivated. A focus "heals" a number of boxes of damage equal to its Force every Combat Turn; when all the damage is repaired the owner may spend a Simple Action to reactivate the focus. Disrupting a sustaining focus will also disrupt the spell it is sustaining. Astrally projecting magicians whose foci become disrupted cannot reactivate them until their astral form rejoins their physical body.

um, that is a specific spell that allows you to do so... not just any mana based attack. meaning if you do not have that spell, you can not attack the focus directly.
which in turn, was turned into an  optional rule that appeared VERY late in the SR4 product line. (meaning, it is not a core rule.... so YMMV as to if you can do so at a table and may not be available for Missions play (Michael is the guy to ask about, he's a demo agent and easier to get the aaron as he is lives online:P )

I doubt very much if it will be included (many optional rules were cut in 5e) so you will probably have to wait until the 5e magic book comes out.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Bach_The_Fox on <10-25-13/1510:17>
So let me summarize what I think I know about SR4:
- A focus is dual-natured so active on the astral. ✔
- This means it's visible and can be assensed from the astral. ✔
- It can, however, not be targeted with astral spells.
- So it cannot be attacked from from the astral.
- It can be attacked in itself on the physical realm, however. ✔

The SR4A and the FAQ are clear you can hit them with spells and attack them in astral combat, as long as you inflict physical damage.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-25-13/1512:35>
I'm not familiar with SR5 rules, still need to read up on them more. Also note that as demo agent I do not have any access to extra official sources of clarification, it simply means I need to make judgement calls when something isn't clear and follow the official rules where I can.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Bach_The_Fox on <10-25-13/1528:15>
@Reaver: As far is SR4 is concerned, it is a grey area that needed clarification, since the core book said you could cast spells on them, and that they could be attacked, but failed to mention what that actually means.

With SR5, you have the same issue, except  Foci are some sort of weird exception, that are immune to everything on the astral plane. Mana Barriers can be attacked, Astral forms can be attacked, but foci are invincible.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <10-25-13/1543:41>
ok, there is an issue here.... This is the spell in it's entirety from Digital Grimoire

Quote
Disrupt [Focus] (Direct)
Type: M • Range: LOS • Damage: Special • Duration: I • DV: (F÷2) – 1
This spell channels magical energy into disrupting an active
magical focus, dealing temporary damage to its astral form.
A focus that receives damage equal to its Force from this spell is
disrupted and becomes inactive; the magician bonded to the focus
cannot gain dice bonuses or any other benefit from the focus until
the focus is reactivated. A number of boxes of temporary damage
equal to the focus’s Force is “healed” at the beginning of the next
Combat Turn. The owner may spend a Simple action to reactivate
the focus when all damage is healed. Disrupting a sustaining focus
will also disrupt the spell it is sustaining. Astrally projecting magicians
whose foci become disrupted cannot reactivate them until
their astral form rejoins their physical body.
Disrupt [Focus] is designed to target a specific type of focus:
Disrupt Weapon Focus, Disrupt Anchoring Focus, Disrupt
Spellcasting Focus, etc. The target of each spell is designated by
the spell formula. A stacked focus is affected by this spell if at least
one of its focus types matches that of the spell, but the damage
dealt by the spell must equal or exceed the combined Force of the
stacked focus to disrupt it.

Combine this with that FAQ, and the issue is: the FAQ says the foci has a "barrier and structure rating" = to force.... but barriers have ARMOR and structure..... (not  barrier... barrier is a THNG, not a mechanic)... if we assume that they meant ARMOR where they say barrier... ok....?

Then we have this blurb from the SR4a pg 204

Quote
Direct Combat spells cast against nonliving objects are treated
as Success Tests; the caster must achieve enough hits to beat the item’s
Object Resistance (p.183). Net hits increase damage as normal (the
object does not get a resistance test)

So wait. What. we have 2 different rules conflicting.

Either it is a barrier with structure and armor = force used to resist damage, (as per what is implied by the FAQ) or it is NOT a barrier, and the spell test must beat the Object Resistance... which is never stated for the Foci.... So which is it? An undermined number of hits needed or an opposed test?

very confusing.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Bach_The_Fox on <10-25-13/1601:56>
Quote from: SR4a page 183
Spells cast on astral objects like mana barriers or active foci are resisted with Force.

Combine that with the Disrupt [Force] spell's text, and you get the missing rule, i.e. how much damage a foci can take and what happens.

Pretty straightforward, even if they hid the damage and healing rules for foci in a dang spell as opposed to in the rules proper.

So my original point stands: All previous editions had rules for attacking foci; is it intentionally left out of SR5 or errata? And if intentional, are Foci simply invincible/untargetable?

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <10-25-13/1616:57>
Quote from: SR4a page 183
Spells cast on astral objects like mana barriers or active foci are resisted with Force.

Combine that with the Disrupt [Force] spell's text, and you get the missing rule, i.e. how much damage a foci can take and what happens.

Pretty straightforward, even if they hid the damage and healing rules for foci in a dang spell as opposed to in the rules proper.

So my original point stands: All previous editions had rules for attacking foci; is it intentionally left out of SR5 or errata? And if intentional, are Foci simply invincible/untargetable?

Quote
SR4a (passing through barriers pg 194)

An astral mana barrier may be attacked in astral combat; treat it as a
standard barrier with an Armor and Structure equal to its Force(see
Barriers, p.166).

So a force 6 power foci would roll 6 defense dice and take up to 6 damage before being deactivated, and would heal 6 points the next combat turn... Correct?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-25-13/1922:19>
Q: What exactly is the Device Rating for cars? Their Pilot Rating, or page 421?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: rizzo on <10-25-13/2012:16>


6. If an extended test has not treshold does it mean, the dice pool doesnt decreasing after every throw? (for example at Natural Recovery)

That's been asked and answered a few times. For natural recovery, the pool decreases after every throw until you're fully healed or you discover that you need medical attention. It's possible that this will be changed with future errata, but I have no information either way, so I'm sticking to what the rules say.

I though a lot of it, and unfortunately I cant attune the rule and the example (Full Deck's natural recovery) near to the rule on the page 207. If the die pool decreasing after every throw at natural recovery extended tests, how can Full Deck throw every time 6 dices?

Other:
Character creation Step Five Purchase skills (page 88):
"In addition, skill groups cannot be broken up in this step, so individual skill points cannot raise the ratings of skills purchased as a group. (Note
that skill groups can be broken up in Step Seven: Spend Your Left Over Karma (p. 98)."

A bit later:
"All skill and skill group points must be spent at the time of character creation. These points cannot be saved or used after the game starts."
Not during step five, at the time of character creation! Step seven (when I can break skill groups) pass the written condition: at the time of character creation.
So does it mean: I can spare some skill point at step five, and spend at step seven?

If yes, it has far leading consequences:
There are similar wording at special attributes and normal attributes (...must be spent at the time of character creation)
So I can spend the karma at step seven (I buy a lot of lvl. 2 attributes, and/or lvl 1-2 active skills), and after it, I can spend the spared attribute, and skill points. That way the attribute and skill points are more valuable.

I did nowhere find any rules, sentences, etc. that would forbid to spare attribute and skill points at earlier steps, and spend them at one of the later steps.

Thank you!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Bach_The_Fox on <10-26-13/0112:13>
Quote from: SR4a page 183
Spells cast on astral objects like mana barriers or active foci are resisted with Force.

Combine that with the Disrupt [Force] spell's text, and you get the missing rule, i.e. how much damage a foci can take and what happens.

Pretty straightforward, even if they hid the damage and healing rules for foci in a dang spell as opposed to in the rules proper.

So my original point stands: All previous editions had rules for attacking foci; is it intentionally left out of SR5 or errata? And if intentional, are Foci simply invincible/untargetable?

Quote
SR4a (passing through barriers pg 194)

An astral mana barrier may be attacked in astral combat; treat it as a
standard barrier with an Armor and Structure equal to its Force(see
Barriers, p.166).

So a force 6 power foci would roll 6 defense dice and take up to 6 damage before being deactivated, and would heal 6 points the next combat turn... Correct?

oh dagnabbit. I see the spell is self referential with regards to the rules for foci damage ("A focus that receives damage equal to its Force from this spell"), so my RAW argument is dashed. Glossed right over that.

PROBABLY because the FAQ is lying. It adds in that bit about an active focus having a barrier/structure rating, which is NOT in the spell description, nor stated anywheres else that I can find.

So, if we go by strict RAW in SR4a - as far as I've been able to find - you can cast a spell on a focus and it will resist with its force, but how much damage it can take is not answered. You can also attack it in Astral Combat, but how it reacts to that is not stated (Foci are not explicitly stated to have a barrier/structure rating.

If we go by the FAQ's optional rule, it has a structure/barrier rating equal to its force, and reacts to spells/astral combat as if it was any other object.

I'm not overly familiar with SR4A, but judging by the rules on barriers, a focus being treated as an a both a barrier and resisting a spell is inconsistent - barriers don't make resistance tests.

So either you go with SR4A, which doesn't make sense and is incomplete (Obviously - why else for the FAQ!), or you go with the optional rule, which would preclude the opposed test in SR4A.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <10-26-13/0136:51>
yea, I was kinda running myself in circles there too trying to figure out exactly what the FAQ and RAW were trying to tell us to do....
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <10-27-13/1533:24>
Lots of rigger-related questions.
3. Similarly, what does a rigger use for initiative while using cold/hot sim?  I'm assuming it's also Data Processing + Intuition (+dice as appropriate).

3. Data Processing + Intuition.

Does this make a rigger who is jacked directly into a vehicle slower (aka a wheelman) than a rigger who is using a RCC (aka a drone rigger)?

Quote
Since surprise can happen at ANY TIME (see, you didn't see that coming), you can substitute the Surprise Test with your Leadership Test. Your team is better prepared for sudden changes in the situation.

Does the Leadership test count for your own Surprise Test?  Inspire mentions "your subordinates' Surprise Test," but not your own.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-30-13/0742:44>
Q: What are the default sensors of drones? Or does the player pick?
If there's a default, or the GM decides, I'd assume a camera and omni-directional microphone as 2 of them.

Q: Can you upgrade armor after purchase?
e.g. Add Thermal Damping 6 to your Armor Jacket (NC 6), as to not have to buy a new one.

Asking the next one again just to be sure, to see if anything new has come up since:
Q: Can you add enhancements to sensors/Imaging+Audio Devices after purchase? What about to ware?
e.g. add thermographic vision to a drone's camera, or a smartlink to cybereyes.

Follow-up Question: If not: What are the costs for replacing a single sensor with a new one? Single-sensor costs or an entire new array?
e.g. replace the drone's rating-3 camera with a new rating-3 camera that has TV and other enhancements: 300+enhancements or 3000+enhancements?

Follow-up follow-up Question: What is the availability of an enhanced sensor camera? 5+(enhancements), or max(5,enhancements)?

Follow-up Question: If not, what is the availability of an Armor's helmet? Can you buy special helmets separately when buying new enhancements?
Take for example a Full Body Armor, which has 14 availability, 23 with all the mods. Would the helmet with TV,VE3,SL,FC have 0+(4+6+4+1)=15 availability, 14+15=29, or 23+15=38, or would it compare the sum of the vision availability to the armor's availability and take the highest? (So max(enhancements,armor) which is 15 for a non-modded armor with the afore-mentioned helmet, and 17/20/23 with a modded armor.) And must they be bought with the armor or can you buy spare ones?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MisterNix on <10-30-13/1130:43>
When do you apply limits on an opposed test? 

Let's use summoning as an example - let's say you have Summoning 6 and Magic 6 and you're summoning a Force 4 spirit.  You get 6 hits on your test and the spirit gets a good roll and hits 3.  How many hits do you have?  - 3 (limits applied after) or 1 (limits applied before)?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <10-30-13/1338:04>
On p 100 in the instructions for calculating the social limit.

Quote
For Social limits, round up  Essence to
the nearest whole number prior to calculating the cost.

Should that read "round up", or "round to the nearest whole number"?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <10-30-13/1720:45>
When do you apply limits on an opposed test? 

Let's use summoning as an example - let's say you have Summoning 6 and Magic 6 and you're summoning a Force 4 spirit.  You get 6 hits on your test and the spirit gets a good roll and hits 3.  How many hits do you have?  - 3 (limits applied after) or 1 (limits applied before)?

Limits are always on total hits, not on net hits - so it's applied before.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <11-01-13/0827:54>
A player had loaded his clip alternating between APDS, explosive and Stick-n-Shock ammo.  He fires a 3-round burst at his target and hits.  How is damage calculated?  Similarly, a player using an Ares Super Squirt loads with with alternating DMSO/nasty stuff rounds and fires a semi-auto burst.  What drugs effect his target?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Elektrycerze3 on <11-01-13/0834:13>
A player had loaded his clip alternating between APDS, explosive and Stick-n-Shock ammo.  He fires a 3-round burst at his target and hits.  How is damage calculated?  Similarly, a player using an Ares Super Squirt loads with with alternating DMSO/nasty stuff rounds and fires a semi-auto burst.  What drugs effect his target?

It is expressly forbidden to load different types of ammo in one clip, tracers being an exception.

Edit: OK, not as expressly as I thought, as Michael has pointed out =)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-01-13/0835:36>
They seem to have forgotten to include the original statement that it isn't allowed, but to quote Tracer Rounds:

"This type of ammunition can only be used in Full Auto weapons and, being loaded as every third round in a clip, is an exception to the restriction of one type of ammunition per clip."

Should be errata'd to include the rule outside Tracer rounds.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MaxKojote on <11-02-13/1841:30>
Do all Adept Powers including powers such as Critical Strike bypass Immunity to Normal Weapons? Just want to know because Killing Hands specifies it can bypass Magical Defences "...such as Immunity to Normal Weapons". I more or less want to know if  Critical Strike does or does not bypass Immunity, but it would be good for general clarification. Especially since if Critical Strike does bypass  Immunity to Normal Weapons, then why would you bother taking Killing Hands when a set of Knucks works just as well.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <11-02-13/2007:20>
Can you clarify the rules for progressive recoil, please? Specifically, the part where you get a free point...

Page 175:
You get 1 free point anytime you start firing

Q: Does this free point apply until you stop firing? Is it just for that first round (or burst) that is being fired?

Which of the below is right, assuming a character with STR 8 firing a Single Auto weapon with 1 Recoil Compensation:
Start firing on IP 1, total recoil comp is 1 for start of fire, plus (8/3 rounded up = 3), plus 1, for a total RC of 5.
IP 2, total recoil comp is still 5.
Alternatively, IP 2 and for all subsequent passes recoil comp is 4 (no longer +1 for start firing).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-03-13/0435:20>
(((Max: It doesn't say it does, so I'd say no. Critical Strike merely boosts your own damage, it doesn't make your attack magical, and magical attacks is what makes Killing Hands bypass Immunity.)))
(((Martin: Isn't that simply Str/3+1 = physical RC, where the free point is from where in SR4a the first bullet didn't give recoil?)))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xabulba on <11-05-13/1015:23>
Sorry if this has been covered, i couldn't find a reference, but why do Alchemists (enchanters) get screwed over on free spells? Spellcasters get free spells when picking A-D at character creation but enchanters get nothing. It would make the same amount of sense for a enchanter to get the same amount of points to spend on alchemical formula as spellcasters get in spell formula.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-05-13/1021:14>
(((Xabulba: I cannot find an explicit statement right now but I recall that these free 'spells' can be divied up over Spell Slots, Ritual Slots and Alchemical Preparations Slots. So you could e.g. take those 10 free 'spells' and use them for 5 spells, 2 rituals and 3 preparations, or put all 10 in preparations assuming your Magic is 5+.)))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <11-05-13/1030:06>
Sorry if this has been covered, i couldn't find a reference, but why do Alchemists (enchanters) get screwed over on free spells? Spellcasters get free spells when picking A-D at character creation but enchanters get nothing. It would make the same amount of sense for a enchanter to get the same amount of points to spend on alchemical formula as spellcasters get in spell formula.

If you're talking about an aspected enchanter the reasoning (and it's certainly been questioned) is that one of the aspected magicians types (summoners) doesn't have a "spell" equivalent. To avoid having to write a conditional rule for summoners they simply removed the free spells and replaced them with something that all aspected magicians could use. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xabulba on <11-05-13/1048:08>
(((Xabulba: I cannot find an explicit statement right now but I recall that these free 'spells' can be divied up over Spell Slots, Ritual Slots and Alchemical Preparations Slots. So you could e.g. take those 10 free 'spells' and use them for 5 spells, 2 rituals and 3 preparations, or put all 10 in preparations assuming your Magic is 5+.)))

That was what I was thinking but a literal reading of character creation says an asspected magician get free spells not formula. I'll re-read the rules again to look for the statement you mentioned but if you come across where you found it let me know.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-05-13/1110:27>
(((Aspected Magicians do not get any free spells/rituals/preparations at all. Magicians and Aspected Magicians can max know Magicx2 Spells, Magicx2 Rituals and Magicx2 Preparations at chargen, from a combination of free and bought ones. Yes, this means that an Augmented Magician, with 4 Essence and Magic A, who only knows Spellcasting would lose 2 of the 10 free spells.)))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <11-05-13/1335:32>
(((Xabulba: I cannot find an explicit statement right now but I recall that these free 'spells' can be divied up over Spell Slots, Ritual Slots and Alchemical Preparations Slots. So you could e.g. take those 10 free 'spells' and use them for 5 spells, 2 rituals and 3 preparations, or put all 10 in preparations assuming your Magic is 5+.)))

That was what I was thinking but a literal reading of character creation says an asspected magician get free spells not formula. I'll re-read the rules again to look for the statement you mentioned but if you come across where you found it let me know.

Could you point me to the line that makes you think that?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <11-05-13/1553:58>
Partial Cover gives you +2 dice to your defense test, but you forgo the standard "ties go to the defender" rule.  This makes taking partial cover riskier than standing out in the open in some situations.  Is this the intent of the rule?  Are so many Shadowrunners taking cover behind the landscaping that this rule was added? 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-06-13/1024:16>
Q: What counts as overdosing, if any, for Foci-usage?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Moonshine Fox on <11-06-13/1814:52>
Question about AR. If I have a comlink hooked up via direct plug in, do I still need the image and sound cyberware/peripherals to experience augmented reality, or is just the direct interface enough?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-07-13/0607:06>
Copy-editing Movement from SR3 resulted in a possible error: In SR3, Speed was at meters per Combat Turn, so Movement on a Vehicle would boost its Speed with hits*acceleration rate meters. That'd could boost for example a Rapier with hits*10 meters, which means that rolling 5 hits would make it move 25% faster.

In SR5, Speed is not a straight number anymore. As such, applying the same boost to Speed results in insane numbers. The copy-editing also results in confusion on "terrain that the critter controls" and the way it talks about Acceleration/Deceleration, but let's leave those aside for a moment.

Q: Should Movement read "add the result to (or subtract it from) the vehicle's Movement Rate in the next Combat Turn", meaning 5 hits vs a vehicle with 3 Acceleration would result in it going 15 meters faster/slower?

Perhaps a rebalancing is required since Acceleration is now also exponential so the numbers are lower, resulting in far lower results of the multiplication. I'd understand, for example, if it was done x5 or so, so that scoring 5 hits vs a Scorpion would result in a speed difference of 50 meters.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Unahim on <11-07-13/1124:48>
How much damage do Shock Frill deal, and in what situations do they deal their damage? I'm assuming only on an unarmed attack action, as they could elsewise trigger multiple times in an IP and do not mention triggering when being attacked, the way Energy Aura does.

Also, do touch-only attacks give a bonus to damage due to net hits? If so, how does function for touch spells?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: bull30548 on <11-09-13/1147:28>
Okay I was listening to a podcast and they spoke about flash bangs.  Now here is my question.  In Flash-pak and flare compensation it is very clearly defined what they do in regards to what happens as far as penalties.  However, there is not one at all for a flash bang and if a character has for example a datajack running in wireless mode earbuds with select sound filter and goggles with flare compensation.  Or for that matter if such things would have an impact on the damage code of such an item.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-09-13/1930:06>
I think only Dampers can reduce that damage.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Starfury on <11-11-13/0030:05>
Question About Casting Multiple Spells:

Step 1 under Spellcasting describes Casting Multiple Spells. It basically works the same way as dual wielding weapons (splitting the Spellcasting + Magic dice pool in this case), save for modifiers:
Quote from: SR5, pg.281
Since the modifers per spell may be different, they are applied after you split the dice pool.
Does this apply to ALL modifiers? Specifically, I am trying to figure out how bonus dice from Specialization, Mentor Spirits, and Foci would fit in here.

By the book and barring errata, the only pool you split is the Spellcasting + Magic pool.

Just to clarify:  Would this also be the case for your Drain Pool?  Or would you split that to deal with the drain of both spells?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <11-11-13/1925:06>
Quote
Once you get up to 400 percent of the item’s value (12 extra dice), throwing money at the problem doesn’t get you any more dice. Even if you had money left to throw.

The rules on buying something on the black market say you get 1 extra dice for every 25% extra you spend, up to a maximum of 400% (12 extra dice).

Of course, the math on this is wrong. 400% would be 16 dice. 12 extra dice would be 300%. Obviously this needs to be errata'd, but which number is correct: 400% maximum, or 12 extra dice maximum?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <11-12-13/0254:52>
Quote
Once you get up to 400 percent of the item’s value (12 extra dice), throwing money at the problem doesn’t get you any more dice. Even if you had money left to throw.

The rules on buying something on the black market say you get 1 extra dice for every 25% extra you spend, up to a maximum of 400% (12 extra dice).

Of course, the math on this is wrong. 400% would be 16 dice. 12 extra dice would be 300%. Obviously this needs to be errata'd, but which number is correct: 400% maximum, or 12 extra dice maximum?

Or it can be understood as, you pay at maximum 400% of the original cost (which means +300%) which gives you +12 dice.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <11-12-13/0852:37>
]

Or it can be understood as, you pay at maximum 400% of the original cost (which means +300%) which gives you +12 dice.

What he said. The first 100% is the base price and you get no bonus for it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <11-17-13/0513:44>
If you get zero hits on a spellcasting test to cast a spell, will the spell still [always] "fire" or will it [always] "fizzle"?



More specifically will an indirect area of effect combat spell scatter 2D6 meters (minus zero for zero hits) and deal Force damage to everyone (friends and foe) caught in the area (or will the attacking magician twitch his fingers and then nothing happens....)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: wraith on <11-17-13/2158:11>
Just a bit of clarification, is this the proper methodology?



Say you slap a quarter kilo of minimum rating (6) plastique in a directional shaped charge (45 degree arc to only blow into the room) onto an apartment door to blow it in.  Logic + Demolitions scores four successes. So our equation looks like this :

Rating + (Successes on Demolitions + Logic) x sqrt(number of kilograms of explosive)

[6 + 4] x sqrt(.25) = 10 x .5 = 5

So we've got a DV 5 explosion.

Quote from: SR5, Page 436
An explosive’s Damage Value is calculated
as its Rating (modified by the Demolitions Test,
if you made one) times the square root of the
number of kilograms used (rounded down). The
Blast value for a circular explosion is –2 per meter,
while the Blast value for a directional explosion
(up to 60 degrees in a specific direction)
is –1 per meter. When explosives are attached
directly to a target, the target’s armor is halved;
otherwise the explosive has an AP value of –2.
If an explosion destroys a barrier, it creates a
cloud of deadly shrapnel that threatens an area
far bigger than the actual blast—the shrapnel blast
has a DV equal to the explosive’s DV minus the
Structure rating of the barrier, with a Blast of –1/m.

Quote from: SR5, Page 197
If a character intends to destroy a barrier (or knock a hole
in it), resolve the attack normally. Since barriers can’t
dodge, the attack test is unopposed. The purpose of the
attack test is to generate extra hits to add to the Damage
Value. If a character got no hits, then only apply the base
Damage Value. The only way a character could “miss”
is if he got a critical glitch on the attack test, thus proving
themselves literally unable to hit the broad side of a
barn. A character may use Demolitions as the attack skill
if he has the proper materials and time to set charges.

Before rolling the barrier’s damage resistance test,
adjust the modified Damage Value to reflect the type of
attack, as noted on the Damaging Barriers Table.

Now then, onto what happens when it goes boom.

First, the barrier gets to roll a damage resistance test, with structure + armor.  Given this is a standard door, it has Structure 2 and Armor 4 per the chart on pg 197.  However, since this is an explosive placed up against the door, we're not done with the math and ready to roll yet.  Per the 'Damaging Barriers' chart on page 198, explosives in contact with the barrier get to use Base DV times two.  As this section quotes a completely different method of blowing up a door than the one under Demolitions :

We're going to assume the Base DV of this explosive is the one calculated above, despite it having the results of a demolitions + logic roll added in, as the rules on 197 state that the table's results adjust the modified DV.  So the next roll is as follows :

2 (structure) + 4 (armor) dice rolled vs 5 (base DV) x 2 (per damaging barriers chart)

So 6 dice vs DV 10.

Assuming an average roll on 6 dice, the barrier gets 4 successes.  This leaves 6 DV unsoaked, which is more than the 2 structure the door has, and thus the door has been damaged!

Per 'Damaging A Barrier', page 197-198,  The remaining 6 successes are divided by the door's structure to determine the extent of the damage. 1 square meter of hole is generated per multiple of the structure left over in DV.  Thus here, a 3 square meter hole would be generated.

We'll assume most apartments don't have a 3 square meter door.  Now back to page 436!

Quote
If an explosion destroys a barrier, it creates a
cloud of deadly shrapnel that threatens an area
far bigger than the actual blast—the shrapnel blast
has a DV equal to the explosive’s DV minus the
Structure rating of the barrier, with a Blast of –1/m.

The penetrating a barrier section on page 197-8 doesn't actually have any specifics at all as to how you actually destroy a barrier, only how to punch a hole in one.  In this case, I'm going to go with the assumption that if the hole is larger than the object, that object is destroyed.

This door has clearly been destroyed!

Therefore, anyone on the other side of this door needs to soak :

The 5 DV (AP-2) (Minus 1 DV per meter as this is a directional explosion) explosion/blast effect itself.

-AND-

The secondary shrapnel explosion, at :

5 (Explosion DV) - 2 (structure rating of the door) with a Blast of -1 per meter.

So the door is gone, and the guy standing behind it is soaking two hits, one at 5DV (AP-2) and one at 3 DV.

As this is a shaped explosion, the people on the outside of the door do not have to soak it as well. If this was a standard spherical explosion, they would have to soak 5 DV (AP-2) -2 per meter from the door.

I have intentionally assumed this apartment is big enough that we don't have to calculate the blast reflection as well.


Now we move on to the next combat turn, and hopefully success on the part of the runners storming the apartment.


You see the number of assumptions I had to make up there? This is why I'm asking if this is an errata point or rules as intended, because there are details missing and conflicting rules in these two sections that need clarification.  Also, there's a typo in the earlier part of that same rule on page 436. The rules for barriers are not on page 194 as quoted, they're on page 197.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: acolyte99 on <11-19-13/0534:08>
Interaction between Edge and Extended Test:

Since the description of Push the Limit ist written with a normal simple test in mind, it says "Add your Edge rating to your test, either before or after the roll", so it uses it uses "test" and "roll" interchangeably.
In case of an Extended Test its a difference if I add Edge rating to the test (so I get +Edge die in every roll) or if I add Edge rating to one and only one roll of the dice. The other die rolls of which the Extended Test consists would not be affected.
It makes a huge difference, but from the way it's written (or rather not written), I can only houserule it, without being sure, what was intended.
Q: Does Edge in Extended Test apply to all die rolls in the Extended Test or only to one die roll?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <11-19-13/0859:13>
Interaction between Edge and Extended Test:

Since the description of Push the Limit ist written with a normal simple test in mind, it says "Add your Edge rating to your test, either before or after the roll", so it uses it uses "test" and "roll" interchangeably.
In case of an Extended Test its a difference if I add Edge rating to the test (so I get +Edge die in every roll) or if I add Edge rating to one and only one roll of the dice. The other die rolls of which the Extended Test consists would not be affected.
It makes a huge difference, but from the way it's written (or rather not written), I can only houserule it, without being sure, what was intended.
Q: Does Edge in Extended Test apply to all die rolls in the Extended Test or only to one die roll?


Given that Edge is basically "Universal luck", I would say that edge on an extended test either:

A: is not allowed. (could be used to clear a critical glitch, or the like I suppose)

B: only affects one (1) roll.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: John Smith on <11-19-13/1454:28>
I hate to be a dunce,  but I'm confused about how adepts use the Flexible Signature metamagic, since an adept's powers are not measured by Force.  Does this only apply to an adept's foci (if any?).  Or does the use of adept powers, such as Killing Hands, leave an astral signature on those affected by them?  If so, how is the level of Force determined?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Arioch on <11-22-13/1438:51>
Any chance we can get some clarification on how power foci work? Do they add their rating to the magic attribute or do they just add a dice pool bonus to casting and summoning test?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <11-23-13/1407:29>
It's been a little over a month since this thread has had some official-ish attention.  Is it still active?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: bull30548 on <11-23-13/1453:09>
Flashbangs- Is there anyway to mitigate the damage of these because they seem over powered and if I throw three to five flash bangs at a party I render then incapacitated or dead.

Spirits: I used to use them to scare my street sams and make the mage just that much more useful.  Now the group just shoots them up and that is it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Starfury on <11-23-13/2308:56>
Flashbangs- Is there anyway to mitigate the damage of these because they seem over powered and if I throw three to five flash bangs at a party I render then incapacitated or dead.

Spirits: I used to use them to scare my street sams and make the mage just that much more useful.  Now the group just shoots them up and that is it.

I am new to this and all, but I would suggest not throwing 3-5 Flashbangs.  In real life, they are meant as a shock weapon to soften the target before a team moves in.  I do not think they are generally to be used in a barrage fashion.  As for spirits, they used to be only combatable in a specific way (spells or melee using different stats, if I recall correctly).  The fluff they wrote implies it is still this way, and it was so in previous editions, but in this edition, spirits apparently can be harmed by mundane ranged weapons.  I wonder if that might be an oversight?

Another question:
Has anyone found where the Augmented Attribute Maximum is listed?  It seems to be implied that this is different from your racial attribute maximum (and higher, too).  It is not in the Index.  I withdraw the question.  After more searching, I found the answer buried in the text on Page 94.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <11-23-13/2328:24>
Flashbangs- Is there anyway to mitigate the damage of these because they seem over powered and if I throw three to five flash bangs at a party I render then incapacitated or dead.

Spirits: I used to use them to scare my street sams and make the mage just that much more useful.  Now the group just shoots them up and that is it.
If you get issues when you throw three to five flash-bangs at a party and don't give them any chances to escape from the blast zone, then maybe you shouldn't be doing that. Why are you even throwing that many at them in the first place? But yes, if you make characters soak 10S damage three to five times, they tend to go unconscious.

As for spirits: are you using the 5e Immunity rules properly? If we compare an Ares Alpha with regular ammo to a Force 6 Spirit of Man with 1 net hit, you've got 12P/-2 versus Hardened Armor 10 and 7 Body: that's 17 dice and 5 bonus hits on the soak test, so the spirit will take about 1.6 damage on average. So while it's true that with heavy guns or more expensive ammo, mundanes can now take out spirits, there's still the matters of hitting them in the first place and the spirits typically not being alone either.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-24-13/0441:41>
Not to mention the Spirit using Fear on the Street Sam.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: bull30548 on <11-24-13/1950:05>

Spirits: I used to use them to scare my street sams and make the mage just that much more useful.  Now the group just shoots them up and that is it.
If you get issues when you throw three to five flash-bangs at a party and don't give them any chances to escape from the blast zone, then maybe you shouldn't be doing that. Why are you even throwing that many at them in the first place? But yes, if you make characters soak 10S damage three to five times, they tend to go unconscious.

As for spirits: are you using the 5e Immunity rules properly? If we compare an Ares Alpha with regular ammo to a Force 6 Spirit of Man with 1 net hit, you've got 12P/-2 versus Hardened Armor 10 and 7 Body: that's 17 dice and 5 bonus hits on the soak test, so the spirit will take about 1.6 damage on average. So while it's true that with heavy guns or more expensive ammo, mundanes can now take out spirits, there's still the matters of hitting them in the first place and the spirits typically not being alone either.

Could you refer me to the page that states that a Spirit of Man has Hardened Armor Power or any spirit for that matter because I could not find that in the book. or was that a errata that I missed.  I have to admit I am still reading through the book so there is stuff I know I must of missed.

Thank you for the clarification of Flash bangs but this was also to have my group also not use this exploit in their favor because see they believe in suppression through superior firepower and well Flash bangs are pretty cheap and are, based on the rules right now the SUPERIOR firepower item.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <11-24-13/2003:39>
All Spirits have Materialization, and per the description of Materialization, this means they get Immunity to Normal Weapons when materialized, which gives them Hardened Armor equal to twice their Essence (so equal to twice their Force) against non-magical attacks.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <11-24-13/2032:26>
All Spirits have Materialization, and per the description of Materialization, this means they get Immunity to Normal Weapons when materialized, which gives them Hardened Armor equal to twice their Essence (so equal to twice their Force) against non-magical attacks.

And also, Half that armor is treated as auto successes in the damage resistance test. (so a force 6 spirit has 12 hardened armor... and possibly 6 auto successes on its damage resistance test!)

But don't worry that you couldn't find it. All the spirit and animal abilities are lumped together under "animal powers" and start on page 394... But so spirits they make you jump through several hoops....

First you have to look at Materialization
which takes you to Immunity... then the subset of immunity listed as normal weapons...
then to hardened armor


its very convoluted :(
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: bull30548 on <11-25-13/0014:44>
Thank you!  I appreciate it.  I knew I was missing something.

Now please someone tell me Flash bangs has some wacky path I haven't found yet. 

This is mainly cause my players would exploit the crap out of this.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-25-13/0407:59>
((Are they throwing timed, wireless or motion sensor? Are you equipping enemies with Damper cyberears? Are they actually not that easily all-hit with flashbangs? Are the cops called the second so many explosions go off?))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <11-25-13/0527:32>
sadly, with flash bangs and grenades the only limiter is "common sense" and "world reactions"

Meaning, you have to look at the world and how it would react to such things. FBs make A LOT of noise! They are going to attract a lot of unwanted attention! (Same as grenades).  Also, that attention isn't just going to be your typical beat cop... it's going to be HTR teams.. which means heavy ordinance and hardened armor, lots of drones, and magical support.


Corp Security isn't going to be throwing around grenades (well maybe flash bangs) because of collateral damage... they are there to protect Corp property, not blow it to bits with explosives. At the same time, if Runners are using grenades on Corp Security, they are breaking the unwritten rules of Shadowruns (meaning: "We know shadowruns are a cost of doing business, and we will try to stop you, but if you keep it professional, we won't hold a grudge")

(the larger the body count, and collateral property damage, the more runners "force" a Corp's hand into revenge tactics..... After all, losing a prototype is just business... losing a prototype, AND two dozen dead employees..... yea, someone's gotta pay!)


IRL Explosives kill through the compression wave. The wave ruptures the alveoli, preventing them from collecting oxygen, and filling the lungs with blood. In effect, your drown in your own blood and die of asphyxiation. Often with out any other marks on the body. Then there is the shrapnel.. which just tears through the body, severing arteries and organs...

IRL, the only REAL defense against grenades is to NOT be in the area of effect, or, baring that, make sure there is a hardened structure between you and the explosion. which is why always fighting from cover is a great idea :D (but even that may not save you)


Basically, with grenades, the only defense is to clear the area... which with many of the wireless grenades in SR can be almost impossible. :(
Title: Attacks on the Astral Forms of Magical Objects
Post by: spuwdsda on <11-25-13/0658:36>
How are astral attacks on the astral forms of active magical objects handled?

For example: A projecting mage spots the astral form of an active focus. The mage lacks Disenchanting or otherwise decides not to use Disenchanting against the focus. Instead he hits it with his weapon focus. The owner of the attacked focus is unaware of the attack, he is not using astral perception or projecting and is sitting down still.

This is an unopposed attack, hitting the object for 15 DV.

How is this attack resolved? Does it make a difference if the damage is Physical or Stun?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: bull30548 on <11-25-13/1038:55>
Thank you again for the advice but based on the way the rules are written dampeners and flare compensation does not negate flash bangs.  The full body armor suit could negate it just for the fact the stun damage would be going against the armor rating.  Though that might be what I am missing is the fact that armor is more universal now I might be missing that aspect that a body+armor check could negate the whole of damage.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <11-25-13/1054:04>
It really depends on the circumstances and what trigger mechanism you use (timed can be easily avoided or thrown back, wireless can be jammed). A low-armor mage or face will take significant Stun damage from a flashbang (although a Physical Barrier spell might be able to block it since it's only Stun damage, meaning it won't break the barrier, but on the other hand the noise might just go through it), while someone with Full body armor (including the helmet) will have 14 dice from armor alone even after the -4 AP, so if you add 5 Body (high for a human, minimum for a troll), that's about 6-7 hits on average, so only 3-4 Stun damage post-soak each time.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <11-25-13/1059:35>
it really also depends on what you rule as "protection" from a flashbang.


Flashbangs produce a brilliant light and a very brief, but very loud "bang"

The idea is to overwhelm the hearing and eyes of the defender (and in real life, this overload has been known to render people unconscious!)


If you are feeling generous as a GM you could rule that flare compensation and audio dampeners provide a bonus to Flashbangs. But this would be a houserule.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-25-13/1735:38>
If you are feeling generous as a GM you could rule that flare compensation and audio dampeners provide a bonus to Flashbangs. But this would be a houserule.
"The damper adds a +2 dice pool bonus to resisting sonic attacks, including flashbangs."
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <11-25-13/1806:04>
If you are feeling generous as a GM you could rule that flare compensation and audio dampeners provide a bonus to Flashbangs. But this would be a houserule.
"The damper adds a +2 dice pool bonus to resisting sonic attacks, including flashbangs."

well, there you go, an actual book RAW bonus to resisting FBs



on a side note, I hope Aaron gets back soon (last post date of Sep 1) he only has what 20 pages of questions to answer
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: dragrubis on <11-28-13/0228:53>
Is the exceptionnal ability (up to 13 in a skill 7 at starting) a little over paid?

It's the same as the cost of the exceptionnal attribute but just usable for one pool and it as no effect on any limit's...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <11-28-13/0453:43>
It has significant interactions with a wide array of things which key off skill rating.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: dragrubis on <11-28-13/0740:42>
Can you explain yourself on that? The aptitude quality applies only on a unique skill.

Where exceptional attribute may change a lot of dice pools.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: dragrubis on <11-28-13/0836:15>
Yep but in the v4 the aptitude  cost was half the exceptional attribute's cost

And an other question is how to change the owner of a device? For reselling or thieving purposes?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <11-28-13/1026:01>
Page 237: devices require a Hardware toolkit and an Extended Hardware+Logic [Mental] (24, 1 hour) test, where a glitch means authorities are notified, while with a file you can use Edit File to copy it, then Edit File to delete the original.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <11-28-13/1501:57>
Can you explain yourself on that? The aptitude quality applies only on a unique skill.

Where exceptional attribute may change a lot of dice pools.

Yep but in the v4 the aptitude  cost was half the exceptional attribute's cost

And an other question is how to change the owner of a device? For reselling or thieving purposes?

While Exceptional Attribute changes more dice pools, it isn't likely to change a limit and only in a couple of cases will it do anything OTHER than increase dice pools.  However, several skills (all Sorcery and Conjuring skills along with Alchemy, along with all combat skills - and that's just to start) have elements that key directly off of skill rank (the number of attacks you can get with Multiple Attacks, for example).  Additionally, with skills going to 12 naturally, it means that an Adept with Aptitude can take a skill to frigging 20 by taking 7 ranks of Improved Ability.  Skills are now more likely to change things outside of dice pools, especially the prime candidates for Aptitude, while the prime candidates for Exceptional Attribute largely only change dice pools.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: KraakenDazs on <11-28-13/2322:38>
Slight oversight, not sure if anyone spotted it yet.

BINDING a spirit. The rules mention a Summoning+Magic test, not a Binding+Magic test.  p.301.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-29-13/0655:40>
Slight oversight, not sure if anyone spotted it yet.

BINDING a spirit. The rules mention a Summoning+Magic test, not a Binding+Magic test.  p.301.
((Been reported for errata. Might be better to ask people questions for clarity before reporting them.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Stormvane on <11-29-13/1024:13>
Apologies if this has been discussed, but I didn't see any search results related to this point.

What is the cost and availability for autosofts?

Incidentally, there is no listing for Pilot programs, but since they are largely the same as Agent programs, it is easy to just substitute.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-29-13/1027:22>
((Autosofts have been listed in the HotPatch Errata, which you can find in the Missions forum. The HotPatch are basically pre-emptive errata on some of the details that are really needed right now, with a few more fixes such as racial gear/lifestyle costs. They may not match the actual errata, but it is extremely likely they will.))

((Pilot Programs do not have upgrade information available yet. They may be in a future book, just like how in SR4 they were in Arsenal, so it is extremely likely it is intended for them not to be purchasable yet. Keep in mind it might not be a simple substitution, since the hardware system was redesigned they may have different costs and requirements.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Stormvane on <11-29-13/1059:10>
Thank you for the pointer to the HotPatch Errata.

The SR4 and the 20th Anniversary edition both listed the costs of Pilot programs as the same as agents. Which I know doesn't mean that they will do so again and why I took the exclusion as a possible oversight.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Dracain on <12-09-13/0512:15>
There has been some confusion as to how cover and the take cover action works.  I am going to use what Xenon wrote when he summed up the three ways we've read how cover works. 
1) You always get 2 dice for partial and 4 dice for good if you have enough cover for your body, even if you don't take action.
2) When you take cover you are (or remain) in partial or good cover but can still return fire without losing the cover and without using blind fire or fire from imaging device.
3) When you take cover you "hunker down" behind cover and if you want to remain in cover and still fire you take blind fire or fire from imaging device.
Can someone tell me which, if any, are right?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Cyber-Dave on <12-12-13/1526:50>
So, I need clarification on what you are supposed to roll when attempting to fly a drone/drive a vehicle set up like a drone in a stealthy manner. On page 238 the rules say that when you are controlling a device, "The dice pool of any test you make using this action uses the rating of the appropriate skill and attribute you would use if you were performing the action normally." Furthermore, "All actions you take while controlling a device use either the normal limit for that action or your Data Processing rating, whichever is lower." In this case, when using drone stealth, it seems to me that handling would replace physical as the "normal limit." So, according to those rules drone stealth should use Stealth + Agility [Handling or Data processing, whichever is lower]. But then, on page 270, the game tells us that for drone infiltration, "When jumped in, the test is Stealth + Intuition [Handling]." Huh? Why Intuition? That doesn't jive with the "control device" rules at all. How do the control device rules interact with this? Does someone use a different dice pool to control a drone based on whether they are hacking it or controlling it legitimately? That doesn't make sense. Is the rule on 270 an exception to the norm that applies to drone infiltration? And, if so, why does drone infiltration use Intuition instead of Agility?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Redwulfe on <12-17-13/2225:00>
Are we getting close to getting a compiled FAQ 1.0 PDF?

Red
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <12-19-13/1450:47>
Are we getting close to getting a compiled FAQ 1.0 PDF?

Red

They likely have more important things to do, like writing new books.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <12-19-13/1558:49>
Are Toxin Resistance Tests limited by anything?

The text seems to imply they aren't, as the rules simply state that you roll BOD + WIL + "the rating of any protective gear/systems; each hit reduces the toxin’s Power by 1 point."
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Pontoark on <12-22-13/1156:59>
What test do my drones do that uses the Electronic Warfare in my RCC? I searched the entire book and haven't found a single test using it.

Thanks in advance
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <12-22-13/1637:13>
Can you load a rigger command console (RCC) with cyberprograms such as Exploit and Sneak typo Stealth
to get an artificial Sleaze rating.

...and then use that rating as a limit when you take a Hack on the Fly [Sleaze Limit 3] test or Hide [Sleaze Limit 1] test when someone is trying to locate you with matrix perception while you are running in silent mode?

and if so, can you Push the Limit on the test? :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Pontoark on <12-22-13/1648:34>
Can you load a rigger command console (RCC) with cyberprograms such as Exploit and Sneak to get an artificial Sleaze rating.

...and then use that rating as a limit when you take a Hack on the Fly [Sleaze Limit 3] test or Hide [Sleaze Limit 1] test when someone is trying to locate you with matrix perception while you are running in silent mode?

and if so, can you Push the Limit on the test? :)

I think the only cyberprograms you can load in your RCC are those in pg 269, and Exploit is not one of then (Sneak is but it doesn't give Sleaze).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <12-22-13/1650:42>
((They're not. You can get all Cyberprograms for your RCC, has been stated by Aaron.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: FasterN8 on <12-23-13/1523:31>
Since the Control Rig cybverware provides both DNI and has a sim module, is it (by itself) sufficient to access AR and/or VR without the aid of a Commlink/Deck/RCC?

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kanly on <12-24-13/1436:47>
VCR possible dicepool bonus to Gunnery:

In Splintered State, a rigger NPC has his Gunnery listed az "6 (8)" and a R2 VCR implant. (S)he has no other augmentation or quality or anything that could give a bonus to the Gunnery, and it's not denoted as a specialization (which would be "6 (+2)").

Could this mean that VCRs give a dicepool bonus to Gunnery as well as Pilot? Or is this an oversight / error.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <12-24-13/1502:54>
To be precise, when the Control Rig says its rating adds to all Vehicle Skill Tests, is that all Pilot Tests or all Vehicle Tests that include a Skill?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MisterNix on <01-02-14/1302:12>
Are Toxin Resistance Tests limited by anything?

The text seems to imply they aren't, as the rules simply state that you roll BOD + WIL + "the rating of any protective gear/systems; each hit reduces the toxin’s Power by 1 point."

"Tests using a single attribute, or two attributes, do not use limits." - page 47

(I forget this one occasionally myself)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Pontoark on <01-02-14/1335:43>
How does the Control Device works with Full Matrix Defense and Full Defense? do you make a Full Defense with all your controlled devices or just one?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kanly on <01-02-14/1354:44>
Do you mean slaved devices? If your master device is the one making the defense rolls, only it - and you - needs to go Full Matrix Defense. Normal Full Defense would apply for remote controlled drones maybe? I don't think you can Control Device multiple drones or turrets. So if you're controlling one, you'd probably do Evasive Driving (+INT).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Pontoark on <01-02-14/1435:27>
Do you mean slaved devices? If your master device is the one making the defense rolls, only it - and you - needs to go Full Matrix Defense. Normal Full Defense would apply for remote controlled drones maybe? I don't think you can Control Device multiple drones or turrets. So if you're controlling one, you'd probably do Evasive Driving (+INT).

Acording to the Control Device action (p 238): "You can use this action to control multiple devices at once. If you are the owner of all devices being commanded and they are all being commanded to do exactly the same thing"
There is a discursion about it in this topic: http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=14211.0

I think most of the time you won't use the Driving rules for a drone, I would only use it if the drone was using it's speed enough for me to call it "driving", otherwise a lot of weird situations would arise: a drone standing still doing evasive driving, or a jumped in rigger spending a complex action every turn or the Drone is considered uncontrolled. But the rules are not clear about it (I'm also not entire sure a drone is considered a vehicle)

Adding two more question to the FAQ:

Pag 267 says that whenever a slaved device is called on to make a defense test, it uses either its own or its master’s Rating for each Rating in the test., that is true only against matrix actions or any defense test?
When a drones slaved to an RCC, in Autopilot, goes Full Matrix Defense, does it use my willpower or his device rating to his defense bonus?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kanly on <01-02-14/1509:43>
Slaving only applies to Matrix Actions, and so does Full Matrix Defense. So slaving has no effect on defending against a spell or an attack.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: hayek on <01-04-14/0959:05>
p. 438: both the Shock Frills Armor Modification and the Riot Shield say they do electricity damage if someone touches them, but it doesn't say how much damage. Would it be the same as Shock Gloves? Or is it trying to say there's no actual 'damage' (DV) caused, but the person who touches it suffers the secondary effects of electrical damage (penalty to tests and initiative)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kanly on <01-04-14/1012:44>
Riot Shield does 9S(e) with the obvious -5 AP. It's on p. 438.

Shock frills are missing any indicator for exact damage done. In SR4 it did the same damage as the Taser Shield. So it probably either does 9S(e) like the Riot Shield (SR5) or 8S(e) like the Shock Gloves (SR5 ofc).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Assen on <01-06-14/1034:57>
Hey guys I got 2 questions here,

I am wondering about the balance of the inherent physical limit. It seems to me that in some cases (well... more than just some), the physical limit makes no sense. Let me pull something from the book p.363:
Breaking a maglock; This requires a successful Locksmith + Agility [Physical] (Maglock Rating x 2, 1 Combat Turn) Extended Test.
I'm trying to figure out why something as being delicate with a lock and carefully unraveling it would require this abysmal limit based on Strength:
[(Strength x 2) + Body + Reaction] / 3 (round up)

The second problem I have is with MagLocks is as follow:
In the quickstart rules a decker uses only one test based on his hardware skill to defeat the lock.
In the Core rulebook it requires 2 different rolls with locksmith.
Finally on page 225 of the core book an example of a decker using the "universal" port of the maglock hacks a whole bank network.

I feel the rules are a free-for-all buffet of free interpretation and no hard lines as to what skill does what here...

Can somebody help a lost sheep here?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <01-06-14/1305:49>
The most logical guess is game-balance: they don't have Agility in the physical limit because every single attack skill already uses it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Crunch on <01-06-14/1407:15>
Yep. a large part of the reason that the limits are what they are is that in 4E Strength and Logic were commonly dumped stats that were percieved as less useful. Making them count extra in the limit makes those stats more valuable and makes the old "I'm a master of Kung Fu with a shock glove and a Strength of 1" builds less viable.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <01-08-14/1143:57>
Q: Do cyberlimbs affect movement rate?
Specifically, if a character with AGI X has cyberlegs with AGI Y, and/or cyberams with AGI Y or Z, how would the player calculate movement rate?

As I see it, you can either:
1. Ignore the cyberlimb values entirely, and use the unaugmented values
2. Factor in the limbs used and average them (legs only, legs and arms, legs and arms and torso, legs and arms and torso and skull, depending on GM interpretation)
3. If considering running to require "careful coordination of all limbs", use the lowest value
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <01-08-14/1228:43>
Cyberlimb attributes aren't augmented attributes.
Anyway, the way I see it, your actual body still needs to keep up, or you'll have situations like your legs running off without you (or when lifting something, your cyberarms being torn off at the shoulder). So I'd use the lowest value of both your legs and main body (the Agility of your main body can still be augmented by other factors). So "careful coordination", not counting your arms.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kanly on <01-08-14/1751:04>
What can "Fire a Vehicle Weapon" constitute? Is it the same Complex Action for a SA shot and FA w/ 10 rounds?

Also do drones on auto pilot use the exact same rules?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <01-08-14/1823:41>
((Isn't that just for manual/remote control by players, giving drones and jumped-in riggers an advantage?))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kanly on <01-08-14/1849:20>
I sure as hell hope so. But still, I'm confused.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: bull30548 on <01-12-14/1236:32>
Ok so I am doing the conversion to fifth and need a clarification. As it was in fourth there was no strength requirement to lug around and HMG. However my player bought a gyro mount harness to hold it because it made sense due to  size and strength of the character.  My question is this in 5th edition does the harness mitigate the strength requirement?  I am house ruling it right now as it mitigates half the Strength you would normally need to just free hand it.  Also does the mount help lessen the actual RC before the multiplier is applied or after? If it is before and the character had a gas vent 3 and the gyro that would be 9 RC that would reduce a full auto burst (complex) of -10 down to 1 then multiplied by 2 = - 2 modifier. Or is it after with a -10 multiplied by 2 = - 20 then 9 RC applied = - 11.  I am thinking the first but thought I would ask anyway.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: hayek on <01-14-14/1258:02>
p. 460 says "If the pain editor is active,..." but says nothing about activating the Pain Editor, or whether it is forced to activate from certain conditions (like an Adrenaline Pump).

Is it only active if it is currently editing pain (i.e. you've taken at least 3 boxes of damage)? Can you then turn it 'off' if you want? Can you willingly activate it without having taken any damage to get the bonus to Willpower?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <01-14-14/1837:23>
p. 460 says "If the pain editor is active,..." but says nothing about activating the Pain Editor, or whether it is forced to activate from certain conditions (like an Adrenaline Pump).

Is it only active if it is currently editing pain (i.e. you've taken at least 3 boxes of damage)? Can you then turn it 'off' if you want? Can you willingly activate it without having taken any damage to get the bonus to Willpower?


With few exceptions that should make sense, all cyberware can be turned on and off at will.  Bone density changes are one of those exceptions where there is no 'off' button.  I'm not really the person to ask about the last question though.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <01-14-14/1852:43>
((Pain Editor is Bioware.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <01-15-14/0032:12>
((Pain Editor is Bioware.))

Pfft - same concept, different name.  :P
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <01-15-14/0252:54>
((Pain Editor is Bioware.))

Pfft - same concept, different name.  :P

Really? See, I never really saw bioware, which is a biological component, to be able to be turned off. I mean,
how does one turn off a bundle of nerves?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Elektrycerze3 on <01-15-14/0415:23>
Really? See, I never really saw bioware, which is a biological component, to be able to be turned off. I mean,
how does one turn off a bundle of nerves?

With a knife =)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sichr on <01-15-14/0552:30>
Really? See, I never really saw bioware, which is a biological component, to be able to be turned off. I mean,
how does one turn off a bundle of nerves?

With a knife =)

In this case, you will probably turn it on with the knife ;D
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SirValeq on <01-16-14/1637:37>
Question 1: can hosts run incognito? I only have the SR5 rulebook and all host mentioned there are easily recognizable entities. Can I have a generic host that is somewhere there in the Matrix, holding some protected information and running silent, so that people don't bump into it accidentaly? I would like a Matrix Search action (with a high enough score) to point to such host as a source of information on the subject of the query. Is this possible?

Question 2: Can two datajacks on two different metahumans be joined by cable? Specifically: can a rigger plug the cable from his control rig into someone's datajack and, for example, start controlling their installed cyberware without having to hack through the matrix?

Question 3: Let's assume a rigger+decker character, owning both a RCC and a deck. If the character is currently  running drones through the RCC, but also wants to hack something with the deck, does he have to plug out completely from the RCC? Or can one persona be linked to two devices at once? And if he does have to disconnect himself from the RCC, can drones still run their autosofts even though the master of PAN is offline?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <01-16-14/1701:24>
((You might want to ask those questions in their own topic, because they're not really ones requiring official clarifications.))

((1: JackPoint cannot be seen without the right code, so there's room for the GM there.))

((2: Datajacks note that you can run a wire between them to communicate through. Of course cyberware usually doesn't involve PAN-controls, since nearly none needs it, so you wouldn't be able to control them that easily, since that's more a mental-control thing. Not sure why you'd want to, by the way, you can't rig people.))

((3: A Persona can have Marks, so you'd start by giving yourself marks with your other device. And it's not as if the persona is required for the Sharing, all that is required is for the RCC to be online and connected, the controller is irrelevant at that point.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SirValeq on <01-16-14/1719:35>
Thank you and sorry for messing in the wrong thread.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <01-16-14/1720:41>
S'okay, this topic is confusing anyway.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: GM907 on <01-19-14/1706:15>
A couple of questions.  New to the forum, started pouring through the pages of this doc so if they've been answered please just submit a link if you have easy access to them:

Cyber/bioware and essence loss:
In the front of the corebook it says that essence loss is permanent, you can't get it back.  What if someone losses a limb, do they loss essence? 

One of my players brought up the thought that essence loss is pretty much a loss of your pattern, so even losing a limb should probably result in essence loss.  Otherwise losing a limb and then having a vat grown replacement made seems like replacing it with bioware.  Haven't seen anything about having basic limb/organ replacements for those lost or defective (with bioware being available it seems these medical miracles would at least be touched on).

PANs/WANs:
I haven't found anything clarifying whether you have to mark an individual device or if you can just mark the PAN/WAN and therefore have marks on all devices in the network.  The closest thing I found was in the Hosts section, where if you mark anything connected to the host you have marks on everything.  I'd assume it'd be the same for PAN/WANs and would streamline Matrix combat/hacking.

Technomancers:
Why is the Fade so extreme?  You have magicians who can throw Force 5 bolts (Effective 5P, -5AP) and only have to soak 2 drain, whereas a Technomancer just wanting to do a Level 5 Res Spike has to soak 5 fade.  Does he not have to contend with failed attack Matrix Damage?

Also, are Resonance actions also considered Matrix actions?  Do they benefit from the +2 dice for being "hot-sim"?

If you use the Editor complex form do you have to crack a file before using it?  If so, what's the point when you have to mark and crack the file with matrix hack actions before you can use your Editor?  I believe the point and "mysticism" of complex forms/resonance actions is you don't need marks on files/personas to manipulate them.  There seems to be a distinct lack of complex forms that mirror hack actions.  Was it the intention to have to hybridize between complex forms and traditional hacking for Technomancers?

Spirits:
With spellcasting and complex forms, having one sustained nets you a -2 modifier on all further actions.  Then do summoned spirits, who materialize (a sustained power) to affect the physical world also gain the -2 to their pools for continued actions, i.e. unarmed combat, etc.


Thanks in advance.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <01-20-14/0310:50>
In the past, essence loss has NOT occurred on limb loss - the difference between the loss of the limb and the artificial replacement being the introduction of a foreign element.  The vat-grown replacement is cloned, and is thus just like the limb that is lost; thus, it fits the pattern.  If I remember Arsenal right (SR4, had rules for cloned replacements), cloned replacements did not cost you Essence.

As far as Technomancer Fading:  General consensus is that there is no good reason for Fading to be so extreme.  The rules for them kinda suck.  That said, the implications for failed Attack or Stealth actions are not relevant to Resonance actions like Threading, because they do not use either of those limits.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ren on <01-20-14/0330:08>
P. 250, Resonance Actions: second sentence states that Resonance actions are not Matrix actions.

The book says nowhere that sustaining a power incurs any penalty to further actions.

P. 233, PANs and WANs: third paragraph, second sentence states that getting a mark on a slaved device also gets a mark on the master.

As rules for Matrix actions are not followed by Resonance actions, i'd say you don't need to crack a file's protection before using Editor. Hence the hefty Fading value. But this is just opinion.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <01-20-14/0354:53>
Hence the hefty Fading value.

Please compare Fading values to Drain values before making this statement again.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ren on <01-20-14/0922:59>
Hence the hefty Fading value.

Please compare Fading values to Drain values before making this statement again.
Did that before posting my opinion.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SirValeq on <01-20-14/1002:16>
Question: does the master-slave relation always have only two levels? Can a slave serve as a master for something else? Example: drone slaved to a cyberdeck, cyberdeck slaved to a host (let's assume the host isn't only virtual, but also physical).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Neongelion on <01-20-14/1023:58>
So the rule is that you take a minimum of 2 Drain while casting spells. For some reason I'm interpreting this as meaning that a magician takes a minimum of 2 Drain regardless of whatever foci he has or how many hits he got on to resist drain. Is this true?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <01-20-14/1036:14>
Incorrect. The Drain Value is never lower than 2, but you resist the Drain Value with a Drain Resistance Test. It simply means that no matter how low the spell's Force is, you always have to resist at least 2 drain.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: GM907 on <01-20-14/2157:55>
P. 250, Resonance Actions: second sentence states that Resonance actions are not Matrix actions.

The book says nowhere that sustaining a power incurs any penalty to further actions.

P. 233, PANs and WANs: third paragraph, second sentence states that getting a mark on a slaved device also gets a mark on the master.

As rules for Matrix actions are not followed by Resonance actions, i'd say you don't need to crack a file's protection before using Editor. Hence the hefty Fading value. But this is just opinion.

Ren - thank you for the page numbers.  Regarding sustaining I did some more digging and found one relating to Spirits.  However if you're speaking about the book, spellcasting and complex forms both incur penalties for sustaining.  Pg. 282, under Step 7: Determining Effects talks about the -2 to all tests while maintaining a spell.  Then again, for Technomancers on pg. 251 under Threading.  For those wondering about Spirits/critters/etc. that use "innate powers", pg. 394 under Duration, talks how these beings and creatures are not subjected to the same penalty.  -.-

RHat - thanks for your reply, it was helpful.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MadBear on <01-21-14/0938:44>
When wielding two firearms and taking attacking two targets, do you get wireless smartlink bonus twice, once for each weapon? Or only once? In previous editions you couldn't use a Smartlink with two guns at all, but then, you didn't have to divide your dice pool in half either...
When wielding two firearms and Taking Aim, do you add the bonus twice? Or only once per Simple Action? CAN you Take Aim with two firearms?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <01-21-14/1252:37>
When wielding two firearms and taking attacking two targets, do you get wireless smartlink bonus twice, once for each weapon? Or only once? In previous editions you couldn't use a Smartlink with two guns at all, but then, you didn't have to divide your dice pool in half either...
When wielding two firearms and Taking Aim, do you add the bonus twice? Or only once per Simple Action? CAN you Take Aim with two firearms?

Point of fact, in 4ea you did in fact have to split your dice pool (and got a -2 unless you had ambidextrous quality)

Laser sights and smartlinks still can not be used while dual wielding.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MadBear on <01-21-14/1334:10>
I've not been able to find a reference to that...
There is no mention of that under the description of Multiple Attacks on p 196, nor is there mention in the description of Smartgun System p 433, or Smartlink vision enhancement p 444, or cyberware p 453.
If I'm just missing it, great. Otherwise, rules dont say I can't do it, so that means I can.
But what about Take Aim action with two firearms? If I choose the Accuracy bonus, does it apply to both? If I choose the Dice Pool bonus, does it apply before I split my dice pool?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JourneysEnd on <01-22-14/1243:33>
I need clarification on the Suppression Sprite Power.

Does the power completely stop the host from launching IC for the duration, does the host launch the IC and they just can't do anything until the end of the duration, or are the individual IC just delayed for the duration?

Does the sprite have to sustain the power, is it just in effect for  (Level / 2) Combat Turns, or does it just effect IC launched the turn it is used?

Thanks for the help.  :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <01-22-14/1423:35>
The sprite has to activate Suppression and sustain the power in order to gain the effect.  Let's see it in use in some scenarios:

Scenario 1:
Technomancer Bob has a level 4 Crack Sprite compiled and registered, but not active.  Bob trips the alarm in a node and the IC is unleashed instantly.  Bob then brings out his Crack Sprite and activates Suppression.  The IC that is already launched stays active.  Bob manages to take out the IC that has been launched, and the IC attempts to respawn.  Because Suppression is active, the IC being launched is delayed by Level / 2 (2) turns.

Scenario 2:
Technomancer Bob has learned his lesson.  He still has his trusty level 4 Crack sprite registered, and when he enters a node he asks the sprite to activate Suppression.  Bob trips another alarm, but this time the IC is delayed from launching by Level / 2 (2) turns.  This gives Bob enough time to get what he needs and get out of the node.

Scenario 3: Bob stops tripping alarms by learning how to be a good technomancer.  :P
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: bull30548 on <01-27-14/0650:01>
New Question:

In fourth edition there was a rule that if you bought cyberware and bioware it cost essence.  However, if for example you bought more of one then the other the other essence cost was reduced by half.  Is that still the case in fifth edition?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Novocrane on <01-27-14/0655:37>
Is that still the case in fifth edition?
Nope.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tuoweit on <01-27-14/1355:40>
Tried a quick search but came up empty.

What number do you use for a Sprite's Mental Attribute when it performs a Matrix task?  Its Level, or its corresponding Matrix Attribute value according to the Living Persona table?   (I'm assuming we use Level for its skill ratings, which isn't stated either but there's no reasonable alternative.)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <01-27-14/1924:15>
Going strictly by the Sprite example in the book (which is admittedly not the best vouchsafe), I believe Level is the correct answer.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tuoweit on <01-27-14/1948:36>
Going strictly by the Sprite example in the book (which is admittedly not the best vouchsafe), I believe Level is the correct answer.

Ah thanks, hadn't noticed the example at all.  It's not very precise but yeah that seems to be how they calculate things.  I suppose it makes sense, otherwise high-Level Sprites would be a bit too good - I'd mostly been contemplating more moderate-Level sprites.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mr.Sarsaparilla on <01-30-14/0754:58>
Hello!

Sorry if this has been asked somewhere else but the questions thread is getting rather daunting to shift through so I'll hazard ridicule:

Matrix geography and related issues...

SR5 gives a fanciful description how all devices are on a flat dimension which can be considered matrix "ground" above it, the "sky" is filled with hosts, the largest being the big ten. How does is description relate to the following scenarios?:

1. Lets assume that we have a device,say a sentry gun in a Renraku black city slaved to the local host. Where does it show in the matrix? Near the hacker (Assuming that the hacker is near the sentry gun) or is it inside the host and therefore invisible to the hacker? Other possibility would be that you can see the icon of the gun but a "glowing forcefield" is transmitted around it from the nearby moon of Endor..Sorry Renraku blacksite host.

2. Next stop, the problem of the nature of hosts. In SR5, it is stated both in the matrix glossary and in the description (sorry, i haven't got the PDF here with so i can't make direct quotes) of hosts that hosts are non-localized matrix entities. The chapter's intruction would support that statement by saying that for example the hosts of the big ten can be always seen hovering above. So how do you measure distance to a host? Furthermore if hosts are non-localized why would the big ten create separate hosts for example blacksites? It would then make sense to actually have everything on that one big host above the sky and put the hundreds of spiders and IC in their disposal running inside the one host and make that host virtually impregnable. This problem is made even more obscure by the statement that when you're inside a host the distance to any device slaved to it doesn't matter.

I get that you can measure distance to local host quite easily(just measure your distance to the closest stuffer shack etc.) but what i don't get that is, if hosts are non-localized and noise isn't an issue inside a host, why would anything owned by the big ten be outside their main hosts and guarded by a veritable army of spiders and black IC. If this is the correct reading, I have to admit running against a Renraku blacksite went from crazy-dangerous to mission impossible on steroids. Basically that reading would mean anything connected to the big ten would be basically out of reach, even the local Renraku office gopher's Honda Gopher...

Tell me what I am missing....

Thanks!

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <01-30-14/1007:55>
Hey there Mr. Sarsaparilla, I'll hazard an attempt to answer your questions.

1. Lets assume that we have a device,say a sentry gun in a Renraku black city slaved to the local host. Where does it show in the matrix? Near the hacker (Assuming that the hacker is near the sentry gun) or is it inside the host and therefore invisible to the hacker? Other possibility would be that you can see the icon of the gun but a "glowing forcefield" is transmitted around it from the nearby moon of Endor..Sorry Renraku blacksite host.

The sentry gun is almost 100% likely to be on the Renraku grid and host.  This depends on the architecture that your GM decides to use for the sentry gun.  Most likely he/she will want to put the gun on the Renraku grid and host to take full advantage of the Matrix security that they have to offer.

The blacksite host would be running silent, but still connected to the overall Renraku grid.  It's also likely that the blacksite is hardlined to the grid, making it impossible to access from outside the site.  So assuming the blacksite is running a host (it probably is) and the host is wireless (which is probably is), your hacker will need to get into the building or find a way to tap the hardline that the blacksite is running to the rest of the Matrix.

You can access any grid from wherever you are, but you suffer a penalty if you're not on the same grid as your target.  So you'd "hop" to the Renraku grid to find the host.  Once you've gained access to the host (either by hacking it or directly tapping the line), then you have to find the sentry gun's node.  Once you've got the node in sight, you can put marks on it to spoof commands, or hack it to try to take full control, etc.

2. Next stop, the problem of the nature of hosts. In SR5, it is stated both in the matrix glossary and in the description (sorry, i haven't got the PDF here with so i can't make direct quotes) of hosts that hosts are non-localized matrix entities. The chapter's intruction would support that statement by saying that for example the hosts of the big ten can be always seen hovering above. So how do you measure distance to a host? Furthermore if hosts are non-localized why would the big ten create separate hosts for example blacksites? It would then make sense to actually have everything on that one big host above the sky and put the hundreds of spiders and IC in their disposal running inside the one host and make that host virtually impregnable. This problem is made even more obscure by the statement that when you're inside a host the distance to any device slaved to it doesn't matter.

I was trying to think of a good analogy to help explain the nature of hosts, but honestly the tech doesn't exist yet to give a good analogy.  Picture this instead: the hosts are all connected via a grid.  The grid helps to minimize signal attenuation and packet loss, but it's not perfect because distance still applies.  This is why the Big Ten don't run a single host that manages hundreds of thousands of nodes.  On top of that, the hosts simply wouldn't have the power to run all of those nodes at once.

However, having all the hosts visible all at once is a huge mistake, right?  Not when you consider that a host can run silent, making it invisible to casual observers.  Consider also that the point at which a user jacks in to full VR is the location that is used when determining matrix perception.  Most hosts, nodes, etc. are difficult to perceive at distances further than 100m away.  So a potential hacker has to be closer than 100m away from the host, perceive the host, hop a grid, and possibly also tap the data lines in order to hack a host.  It's a pretty secure system, really.

I get that you can measure distance to local host quite easily(just measure your distance to the closest stuffer shack etc.) but what i don't get that is, if hosts are non-localized and noise isn't an issue inside a host, why would anything owned by the big ten be outside their main hosts and guarded by a veritable army of spiders and black IC. If this is the correct reading, I have to admit running against a Renraku blacksite went from crazy-dangerous to mission impossible on steroids. Basically that reading would mean anything connected to the big ten would be basically out of reach, even the local Renraku office gopher's Honda Gopher...

As stated in my previous answer, the hosts simply wouldn't have the power to do what you're describing.  On top of that, there's the fact that doing what you describe is a huge mistake from a security perspective.  That would mean that Joe Schmo at the Stuffer Shack in Des Moines can access (via hacking, naturally) the Aztechnology data in Cali, Columbia.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <01-30-14/1040:49>
Just FYI: This is probably more of a question for the main section than the FAQ thread. There's a lot of room for interpretation and rules quotes, so it should have its own thread.

For one:
Quote
For all intents and purposes, there is no “physical” distance to any host in the Matrix. You can always spot a host from anywhere on the planet without a test, assuming the host isn’t running silent.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mr.Sarsaparilla on <01-30-14/1057:07>
Thanks for the answers!

I think I get what you're saying. What has bothered me always is the relationship between the noise-distance rules and host. However, if I understand this view correctly, distance induced noise come to play only when dealing with devices that aren't coupled with a host and that as host are "the stuff of matrix" they are present as such everywhere in the matrix and have no distance. This then means that when you're hacking a host, you don't get distance penalties but other noise modifiers are still in play, yes?


Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <01-30-14/1127:48>
Yes. Also, note that the noise penalties for environment are those that apply from where the hacker is physically located, since a host, even if "physically tethered" exists everywhere in the matrix at all times).

With that said, I believe that a device that is slaved to a host, but not necessarily located inside (still not sure if you can even do that with a device) would introduce noise-due-to-distance penalties. If the gun you mentioned in your example were merely slaved to the host, you would suffer noise-to-distance penalties as well as environmental penalties. If you were somehow able to plug in directly to the device, all of those penalties would disappear (plus you wouldn't have to deal with the host's ratings for defense.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kanly on <02-01-14/1424:25>
How do non-drones defend against Active Sensor Targeting?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Pontoark on <02-01-14/1428:03>
How do non-drones defend against Active Sensor Targeting?

It's an opposed Test using the appropriate Sensor Defense (Sensor Defense Table page 184)

I suppose it's a simple action but the book only says it's an action...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kanly on <02-01-14/1443:12>
Thanks I forgot about that table. Reading it spurred additional questions tho.

What is "Infiltration (Vehicle)"? I know Infiltration = Sneak, but what is that for Vehicles? Asking especially b/c of the next bit:
The table says drones should use Sneak as well, but the example and the Rigging chapter both tell us that drones use Evasion (and not Stealth) autosoft against sensors.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Pontoark on <02-01-14/1517:40>
Thanks I forgot about that table. Reading it spurred additional questions tho.

What is "Infiltration (Vehicle)"? I know Infiltration = Sneak, but what is that for Vehicles? Asking especially b/c of the next bit:
The table says drones should use Sneak as well, but the example and the Rigging chapter both tell us that drones use Evasion (and not Stealth) autosoft against sensors.
I believe that this Infiltration (Vehicle) happens when you are controlling (by remote control action, by jumping in or manual control) a vehicle or a drone, and it's  value is  is the lowest rating between his stealth skill and pilot skill of the one controlling the vehicle.

Drones uses the evasion autosoft only against active targeting, and stealth against sensor detection (taking in consideration what is written in the evasion autosoft (page 269)), this is only my opinion of course, I think this really needs a official faq/errata
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kanly on <02-01-14/1524:32>
Any source for this Vehicle Infiltration?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Pontoark on <02-01-14/1527:57>
Any source for this Vehicle Infiltration?

"make this an Opposed Test versus the target’s Infiltration + Agility [Physical] (metahumans, critters), Infiltration (Vehicle) + Reaction [Handling] (driven vehicles), or Pilot + [Model] Stealth [Handling] (drones). Since vehicle stealth is limited by the driver’s ability..." page 184
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: samoth on <02-01-14/1806:00>
Must a physical adept learn the Arcana skill in order to Initiate, or can he do an Intuition-only test (as opposed to Arcana + Intuition)?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <02-02-14/1045:57>
Must a physical adept learn the Arcana skill in order to Initiate, or can he do an Intuition-only test (as opposed to Arcana + Initiation)?

Currently the adept uses Arcana.  I'm letting my Adept use physical skills though, because I don't like that rule.  In Street Magic (4th edition) there were alternative ways for Adepts to initiate, and I imagine we'll see those with the magic book (either called Aetherology or Street Grimoire).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <02-02-14/1611:34>
Actually, every splatbook title we know has some relation to running - Run and Gun, Run Faster, Data Trails (as in, you run along the trail)...  I assume this theme will continue.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: tasti man LH on <02-04-14/0633:44>
Actually, every splatbook title we know has some relation to running - Run and Gun, Run Faster, Data Trails (as in, you run along the trail)...  I assume this theme will continue.


Sadly no; in Coyotes, the magic book was name-dropped as "Street Grimoire".

--------------------------------------------------

Anyways, so looking over Hack on the Fly vs Brute Force...besides requiring a different skill, Matrix attribute, and a different defense roll, it looks like the two actions do pretty much the same thing. Is that really all the differences the two have? Or is their a clear cost/benefit between the two that I'm somehow missing?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <02-04-14/0645:18>
One is an Attack action, which means that if it fails you get a rebound attack but the target remains unaware, while if you fail the Sleaze alternative the target knows you're there and scores a mark on it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <02-04-14/0653:27>
Sadly no; in Coyotes, the magic book was name-dropped as "Street Grimoire".

Damn, that is unfortunate...  Of course, it does beg the question as to what the "Aetherology" book teased in the book's login page is...  Magic PDF release?

And in addition to what Michael Chandra mentioned, the two actions have different benefits for scoring multiple net hits (Matrix Damage vs. Matrix Perception, if I recall correctly).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <02-04-14/1026:17>
Found a few threads discussing this, but no definitive answer, so I figured a FAQ entry would be appropriate:

How does the Shatter/Powerbolt/Powerball line of spells interact with Barriers, specifically with the intent to destroy? The part that is confusing is whether the barrier gets to use its structure in place of body to resist the spell. The example seems to imply that the spell is indeed resisted in some way (given the use of net hits), but something explicit would be appreciated.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: samoth on <02-04-14/1230:09>
What specialization of the Gymnastics skill would give bonus die to dodging attacks?  "Dodge" isn't listed as a spec.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <02-04-14/1338:44>
Sorry JackVII, I don't have an answer for your question.  I'm not trying to bury your question as it's extremely valid and one that I would like to know as well.

What specialization of the Gymnastics skill would give bonus die to dodging attacks?  "Dodge" isn't listed as a spec.

I think there isn't a specialization that can be applied generically to all attacks.  You might say something along the lines of "evasion", but even that's a little vague.  Most dodge actions aren't being done in a vacuum.  Most dodge actions are to attempt to find cover, hit the dirt, etc.  I don't know of any specialization of Gymnastics that might help in that area.

Honestly, it's one of the irritating things about switching all extra dodge dice to Gymnastics, but it's also nicely balanced because now people can't just become "dodge tanks."  Dodging is done with your Reaction and Intuition, as it should be - Gymnastics is already the bonus dice.

In answer to your question though: there isn't anything specifically in the rules exhaustively stating all the potential specializations.  So you and/or your GM can work together to determine if a "dodge" specialization is something you want to include.  I wouldn't include it, personally.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <02-04-14/1346:06>
No problem. Honestly, neither Aaron or anyone else in even a quasi-official capacity has been answering questions in this thread for some time. I'm just posting in the hope that they do go through this thread at some point and compile a FAQ.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <02-07-14/1543:49>
Q: Difference between meeting and beating Thresholds. The book seems to use the terms "meeting" and "beating" pretty cavalierly when referencing thresholds. It's not clear if these terms are somewhat synonymous with each other or not. It's possible that "beating" a threshold refers to getting net hits, but isn't exactly clear. For a specific example, the spell Levitate states:
Quote
You have to beat a threshold equal to the subject’s mass divided by 200 kilograms, rounded up.
Does this mean the spell does nothing if you only achieve one net success as you would have only met the threshold rather than beaten it? Or would one success allow you to levitate up to 200kg?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <02-07-14/1602:28>
Q: Difference between meeting and beating Thresholds. The book seems to use the terms "meeting" and "beating" pretty cavalierly when referencing thresholds. It's not clear if these terms are somewhat synonymous with each other or not. It's possible that "beating" a threshold refers to getting net hits, but isn't exactly clear. For a specific example, the spell Levitate states:
Quote
You have to beat a threshold equal to the subject’s mass divided by 200 kilograms, rounded up.
Does this mean the spell does nothing if you only achieve one net success as you would have only met the threshold rather than beaten it? Or would one success allow you to levitate up to 200kg?

I've always interpreted that text to refer to the latter option.  If someone's trying to levitate 250kg, the threshold is clearly 2.  I say that when you meet the threshold, you beat the test.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <02-07-14/1613:41>
I've always interpreted that text to refer to the latter option.  If someone's trying to levitate 250kg, the threshold is clearly 2.  I say that when you meet the threshold, you beat the test.
That's my general interpretation too. I think what complicates it is this text in the Hits & Thresholds paragraph of Section.02:
Quote
Each time you roll the dice, you’ll be looking to get enough hits to meet or beat a threshold, which is the number of hits you need to do the thing you’re trying to do.
Emphasis added indicating they are two distinct concepts (or just somewhat sloppy writing when combined with the Levitate text).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kanly on <02-07-14/1801:18>
I vote for sloppy writing bc "beating" a treshold ie. having actual net hits is only relevant if they have an effect eg. some matrix legwork tests. Since levitate doesnt give you a bonus (could be that you can move the mass faster / further etc), net hits should be irrelevant, so you only need to meet the treshold in my opinion.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <02-08-14/0104:46>
Yeah that section is a little confusing too.  I think of it like this:

Hits >= Threshold

That is to say that you need to roll enough hits to equal the threshold or exceed the threshold to succeed at a test.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <02-08-14/0546:04>
What confuses things even more is some tests really requiring you to exceed the threshold, since you need net hits on them to get anything done.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <02-11-14/1741:28>
I searched through the FAQ using keyword "Device Rating" but didn't find the following question, so here goes:

Under the PANs and WANs section of the Matrix Chapter (p. 233), the following is stated:
Quote
Slaving gives a weaker device some added protection. Whenever a slaved device is called on to make a defense test, it uses either its own or its master’s rating for each rating in the test. For example, if your slaved smartgun is the target of a hacker’s Brute Force action, it would use your Willpower or its Device Rating, and its Firewall or your commlink’s, whichever is higher in each instance.
That seems pretty clear cut.

Later on in the Matrix Chapter, under the Matrix Actions section (p. 237) the following is stated:
Quote
When a defense test calls for a Mental attribute, use the owner’s rating. Even if she isn’t currently defending or even interacting with the device, her previous interactions and settings affect the defense test. If a device is completely unattended, the Device Rating stands in for any Mental attributes an icon needs but doesn’t have.
Which seems to contradict the PAN/WAN text somewhat.

Is the PAN/WAN text a specific rule? Is that one of the benefits of having a PAN?

Given a shadowrunner with a Willpower (1) and a weapon (DR2) wirelessly slaved to a Transys Avalon (DR6), which of the following is correct?

1) PAN/WAN rule: The gun defends against a Brute Force attack with 8 dice (The weapon's DR + the commlink's DR)

2) Matrix Action Rule (Light v1.0): The gun defends against a Brute Force attack with 7 dice (The shadowrunner's Willpower + the commlink's DR)

3) Matrix Action Rule (Light v2.0): The gun defends against a Brute Force attack with 3 dice (The weapon's DR + the shadowrunner's Willpower)

4) Matrix Action Rule (Heavy): The gun defends against a Brute Force attack with 2 dice (The shadowrunner's Willpower + the shadowrunner's Willpower due to both devices being attended)

TIA
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <02-11-14/1755:43>
2: Cannot be correct due to PAN/WAN rules.
3: Cannot be correct due to PAN/WAN rules.
4: Cannot be correct because Willpower cannot replace Firewall.

What confuses me more is why the smartgun can use its own DR if you're the owner of the gun and it should use your Willpower instead of its DR, period.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <02-11-14/1756:18>
I would think situation 1 wins out.  It does seem a little silly to use the device's last user's mental attribute when there is a system in place for handling stats unattended.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tuoweit on <02-11-14/1955:18>
I would think situation 1 wins out.  It does seem a little silly to use the device's last user's mental attribute when there is a system in place for handling stats unattended.

I think the "use owner's willpower" clause is intended to reflect the owner's ability to put up with intrusive security measures and not bypass them for convenience, e.g. Windows Vista.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <02-11-14/1957:41>
((Which is rather silly when it even applies to commlinks solely used for teamspeak, phonecalls and slaving.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Pontoark on <02-11-14/2006:05>
2) Matrix Action Rule (Light v1.0): The gun defends against a Brute Force attack with 7 dice (The shadowrunner's Willpower + the commlink's DR)

I think that this is the RAI and RAW IMHO...

My 10 cents is that the rule that actually needs addressing is the " If a device is completely unattended, the Device Rating stands in for any Mental attributes an icon needs but doesn’t have.", they should change it to use 1 as the mental attribute if a device is completely unattended
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <02-11-14/2009:42>
I would think situation 1 wins out.  It does seem a little silly to use the device's last user's mental attribute when there is a system in place for handling stats unattended.

The only way Willpower of a user should be used, IMO, is if it's somehow higher than the Device Rating. Very silly for a high Device Rating device designed for the average metahuman (which any device would be) to possibly suffer a security reduction when used by the average metahuman.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <02-11-14/2021:30>
I would think situation 1 wins out.  It does seem a little silly to use the device's last user's mental attribute when there is a system in place for handling stats unattended.

The only way Willpower of a user should be used, IMO, is if it's somehow higher than the Device Rating. Very silly for a high Device Rating device designed for the average metahuman (which any device would be) to possibly suffer a security reduction when used by the average metahuman.
That's pretty normal for security, really - the human element is the weakest link.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <02-12-14/0052:55>
That's pretty normal for security, really - the human element is the weakest link.

But the average joe wageslave isn't going to go and disable their security elements just because they have poor self-control.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <02-12-14/0109:06>
That's pretty normal for security, really - the human element is the weakest link.

But the average joe wageslave isn't going to go and disable their security elements just because they have poor self-control.

Were that true (and I'd argue it isn't), even then the habits of said average joe will cause security trouble REGARDLESS of security elements.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <02-12-14/0132:33>
That's pretty normal for security, really - the human element is the weakest link.

But the average joe wageslave isn't going to go and disable their security elements just because they have poor self-control.

Were that true (and I'd argue it isn't), even then the habits of said average joe will cause security trouble REGARDLESS of security elements.

For the purpose of game-play, it would be better for the assumption to be that the security software in devices was designed to compensate for that especially since the same would apply to the Mega-Corporate computer system security. As it stands, Jane Doe the secretary leaves work a couple hours late filing some paperwork, making her the last person to use the system. Under how things currently work, her average Willpower will replace the computer's rating, allowing a shadowrunner hacker easier access to the system.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <02-12-14/0142:50>
That's pretty normal for security, really - the human element is the weakest link.

But the average joe wageslave isn't going to go and disable their security elements just because they have poor self-control.

Were that true (and I'd argue it isn't), even then the habits of said average joe will cause security trouble REGARDLESS of security elements.

For the purpose of game-play, it would be better for the assumption to be that the security software in devices was designed to compensate for that especially since the same would apply to the Mega-Corporate computer system security. As it stands, Jane Doe the secretary leaves work a couple hours late filing some paperwork, making her the last person to use the system. Under how things currently work, her average Willpower will replace the computer's rating, allowing a shadowrunner hacker easier access to the system.


Which makes sense, and frankly is better for purposes of gameplay.  It means if you're smart you can find vulnerabilities to make it easier to get in to the system, and it helps make things more about the characters and less about the gear.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: All4BigGuns on <02-12-14/0150:11>
Which makes sense...

No. No it doesn't in any way. How does it make sense for security software to be designed with such an obvious loophole intrinsic to it?

...and it helps make things more about the characters and less about the gear.

And this...geez, there was absolutely no reason for things to be taken down this ludicrous road. The character with the better gear should be better 9 times out of 10 than the one that doesn't have it. Peoples using iron in ages past supplanted peoples using bronze because of better equipment. Those same peoples were supplanted by those using steel later on for the same reason, and once firearms came into being, the peoples who developed those first were more successful than those without. Better gear is just better. Period.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Insaniac99 on <02-12-14/0239:02>
Which makes sense...

No. No it doesn't in any way. How does it make sense for security software to be designed with such an obvious loophole intrinsic to it?

...and it helps make things more about the characters and less about the gear.

And this...geez, there was absolutely no reason for things to be taken down this ludicrous road. The character with the better gear should be better 9 times out of 10 than the one that doesn't have it. Peoples using iron in ages past supplanted peoples using bronze because of better equipment. Those same peoples were supplanted by those using steel later on for the same reason, and once firearms came into being, the peoples who developed those first were more successful than those without. Better gear is just better. Period.

I'm a software engineer in real life and have done a lot of IT work; the Users are always the weakest link.  They leave passwords laying around, they rotate the same X passwords, they use mathematically simple passwords that the stupid password filters think is strong, they leave accounts logged in, they find holes in security then make them worse for their convenience, they don't update software unless forced, they use passwords that anyone and their brother can guess ( look at this for example. (http://gizmodo.com/the-25-most-popular-passwords-of-2013-god-help-us-1504852434) ), they tell secrets to people who charm them, and they download BS junk that creates more security holes.

So yeah, I'm okay with the last user ruining the careful work that the IT guy set up because sadly it is all too true.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <02-12-14/0311:26>
No. No it doesn't in any way. How does it make sense for security software to be designed with such an obvious loophole intrinsic to it?

Because it's impossible for it not to be.  No matter how good and how well designed the security software, user action can and very often will compromise security.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <02-12-14/0513:01>
No. No it doesn't in any way. How does it make sense for security software to be designed with such an obvious loophole intrinsic to it?

Because it's impossible for it not to be.  No matter how good and how well designed the security software, user action can and very often will compromise security.

Actually, it is possible. However, it is impossible if the computer is intended to be accessed by people outside of very strict controls.
Punchcard computers were more secure then anything we can do today.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Insaniac99 on <02-12-14/0541:19>
No. No it doesn't in any way. How does it make sense for security software to be designed with such an obvious loophole intrinsic to it?

Because it's impossible for it not to be.  No matter how good and how well designed the security software, user action can and very often will compromise security.

Actually, it is possible. However, it is impossible if the computer is intended to be accessed by people outside of very strict controls.
Punchcard computers were more secure then anything we can do today.

Yes, and no...  They were more susceptible to certain types of vulnerabilities, but the physical access restriction was the best thing for security.  Even now, we do have computers in locked and guarded rooms, that don't have access to the internet when we are really serious about security. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <02-12-14/0949:51>
I'd just like to say that I posted the original question that sparked this in hopes that CGL would consider putting it into the FAQ. If y'all want to continue the conversation elsewhere, a new thread would be a great idea.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <02-12-14/1003:09>
I would argue that if the players want to exploit the human element of my NPCs, they need to interact with the NPCs.  If someone has redundant passwords, then they need to find a weaker device and grab the password from it.  If there's a chance they can get the person to give them access via some means - well that's even better.

Even though the rules state otherwise, I think it's better for roleplaying, better for mechanics, and better for bookkeeping if the Willpower is taken out of the unmanned devices equation.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <02-15-14/0830:05>
Q: Is the +3 Drain Value penalty for Reckless Spellcasting applied as part of the Drain Value calculation (e.g F-3+3)? Due to the minimum drain value clause, there is a distinction for many spells when cast at a lower force.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <02-15-14/1013:57>
((Given how it's listed as +3 DV in Step 4, then step 6 says you use the calculation and such but can't go below 2, I think the +3 applies before, not after, the minimum drain.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <02-15-14/1021:19>
Good call, thanks Michael! My brain is absolutely not working this morning.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: tasti man LH on <02-20-14/1757:18>
Can hackers share their illegal marks with another friendly Matrix user? Or do those marks only work for the hacker that put them there?

If they can't, then I shall be very sad that riggers can't do drone hijackings anymore...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <02-20-14/1819:03>
There's nothing in the rules currently that indicates that tthe marks transfer.  This might be something that changes with Data Trails.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <02-20-14/1820:09>
Can hackers share their illegal marks with another friendly Matrix user? Or do those marks only work for the hacker that put them there?
Marks cannot be shared.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: tasti man LH on <02-20-14/1839:18>
...ugh.

Well, unless if Data Trails or Rigger 5 changes something, say goodbye to drone hijacking for 5th, I guess!!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MisterNix on <02-21-14/1615:34>
This is where having a technomancer doing puppeteer can be handy, forcing the device to "Invite marks from Personas X, Y, and Z for the next 1 hour" is VERY handy
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <02-23-14/1223:50>
In reference to mana illusion spells cast on the astral plane, the book contains the following:
Quote from: p. 290, BBB
Though mana-based illusions can be created on the astral plane, their magical auras give them away as illusions to anyone who makes
a successful Assensing Test—illusions can’t fool Assensing and cannot be used to disguise or create auras.

Q1: Is there a threshold for the Assensing Test? If so, what it is? Two net hits would normally be required to determine that a spell was of the illusion category.
Q2: Is this reactive or does the target need to take a Simple Action to assense?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <02-23-14/1252:06>
I read that to mean a simple success, that is only 1 hit necessary.  As to whether or not it's reactive, that might depend on the situation.  Worst case, it's just like astral perception - all auras and such are visible immediately, but you need to take an Assensing action to get information.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: tasti man LH on <02-26-14/0053:11>
Can someone remind me again where the recoil penalties are listed?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Insaniac99 on <02-26-14/0122:03>
Can someone remind me again where the recoil penalties are listed?
page 175
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Minimax le Rouge on <03-01-14/0907:41>
When using a Detox spell :
Quote
Detox relieves the side effects of a drug or poison.
The Force of the spell must equal or exceed the toxin’s base DV.

I get it for Toxins, if they have a DV.
but with drugs, or toxins without DV, how does it work please?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <03-01-14/1647:55>
I don't have anywhere to quote, but I think I saw this question asked somewhere else and the answer was that instead of DV, you'd use the Addiction Rating.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Minimax le Rouge on <03-02-14/0418:31>
seams a balanced idea. TY.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <03-03-14/1321:22>
Assume a non-wireless device A is attached through a wire (Direct Connection as per page 232 of SR5) to a wireless device B.
Q: Can device A be accessed through hacking/accessing device B?

Q: Can a data tap be attached to the wire be accessed wirelessly for the purposes of hacking the device(s) on either end of the wire?

Question spawned from this thread:
http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=14978.0
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <03-03-14/1542:36>
Assume a non-wireless device A is attached through a wire (Direct Connection as per page 232 of SR5) to a wireless device B.
Q: Can device A be accessed through hacking/accessing device B?

By RAW, any Marks placed on the slave (device B in this case) also carry over to the master (device A).  As to whether or not you have access, the RAW isn't clear enough on that.  However, given that the Marks transfer I would assume the answer is yes.

Q: Can a data tap be attached to the wire be accessed wirelessly for the purposes of hacking the device(s) on either end of the wire?

Yes.  The communication flowing both ways can be intercepted via the data tap.  I say this because there's nothing that says otherwise or clarifies the data flow.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: norskface on <03-09-14/0012:33>
I have the English version of the book but all the others of my group use the German version.
Now I found on the Special fire weapons, that in my book its always said they are using the range for pistols…. But in the German version they use the Pistol skill for almost all weapons.
Now I really wonder, if this is intended (but then I wonder, why it doesn't show up now in the Errata), or if it was only a translation mistake.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <03-09-14/1557:30>
I have the English version of the book but all the others of my group use the German version.
Now I found on the Special fire weapons, that in my book its always said they are using the range for pistols…. But in the German version they use the Pistol skill for almost all weapons.
Now I really wonder, if this is intended (but then I wonder, why it doesn't show up now in the Errata), or if it was only a translation mistake.


Who, knows. The Errata is far from finished, and it is hard to say if it is a translation error, or a correction, or an update.


Make a group ruling and move on until Run and Gun comes out.... usually combat books have combat rule updates/ corrections in them. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: lychanking on <03-17-14/2002:47>
I can't seem to find any information about this. When you become unbonded to a focus what happens to the karma you used to bond with it?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <03-17-14/2005:55>
I can't seem to find any information about this. When you become unbonded to a focus what happens to the karma you used to bond with it?


It's gone. Wasted. Spent.


such is the nature of Magic.... fleeting!


Keep in mind that becoming unbound to a foci is an almost unheard of thing....
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: tasti man LH on <03-17-14/2313:05>
So what's the Initiative for a remotely-controlled drone? Is it just the rigger's Matrix initiative (depending on what mode they're in)?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <03-18-14/0124:29>
So what's the Initiative for a remotely-controlled drone? Is it just the rigger's Matrix initiative (depending on what mode they're in)?

Quote from: Page 270
Drone Initiative
Drones acting autonomously have an Initiative attribute of Pilot Rating x 2, and get 3D6 additional Initiative Dice (for a total of 4D6). When jumped in, the drone uses the VR initiative of the rigger.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: tasti man LH on <03-18-14/0415:25>
That's for autonomous drones and jumped-in drones only though.

I'm looking at if the the drones operating remotely, with the rigger sending in Commands.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <03-18-14/0729:55>
((The drone still has its own Initiative. However, every IP you remote-control them, you're overriding the Auto-Pilot and using your own Initiative, and the drone doesn't get to act on its own. And nobody else can command it either for one IP. Note that this has been part of a big debate and the rules are decently clear on Intent but not entirely as written, it's a jigsaw puzzle as most of Drones are.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SirValeq on <03-19-14/1251:24>
Quote
If you have a smartlink, you can mentally
switch between gun modes, eject a clip, and fire
the gun without pulling the trigger.
Do I have to be holding the gun to fire it? Can I put a smartgun-featured gun on a table, walk away and still remotely pull the trigger via an implanted smartlink?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <03-19-14/1315:46>
Quote
If you have a smartlink, you can mentally
switch between gun modes, eject a clip, and fire
the gun without pulling the trigger.
Do I have to be holding the gun to fire it? Can I put a smartgun-featured gun on a table, walk away and still remotely pull the trigger via an implanted smartlink?


Hmm, probably. But you can not aim or direct the weapon when it fires after you put in on the table...As the gun has no means of moving itself. And the act of firing (depending on the weapon) could blow it right off the table...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <03-19-14/1506:39>
Quote
If you have a smartlink, you can mentally switch between gun modes, eject a clip, and fire the gun without pulling the trigger.
Do I have to be holding the gun to fire it? Can I put a smartgun-featured gun on a table, walk away and still remotely pull the trigger via an implanted smartlink?
Hmm, probably. But you can not aim or direct the weapon when it fires after you put in on the table...As the gun has no means of moving itself. And the act of firing (depending on the weapon) could blow it right off the table...
4E Arsenal had rules about putting Pilot programs in guns (so you could give it a command like "shoot if anyone comes through the door that isn't broadcasting one of these frequencies" and leave it on the table) and even making them capable of movement - here's hoping.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <03-19-14/1525:43>
Quote
If you have a smartlink, you can mentally switch between gun modes, eject a clip, and fire the gun without pulling the trigger.
Do I have to be holding the gun to fire it? Can I put a smartgun-featured gun on a table, walk away and still remotely pull the trigger via an implanted smartlink?
Hmm, probably. But you can not aim or direct the weapon when it fires after you put in on the table...As the gun has no means of moving itself. And the act of firing (depending on the weapon) could blow it right off the table...
4E Arsenal had rules about putting Pilot programs in guns (so you could give it a command like "shoot if anyone comes through the door that isn't broadcasting one of these frequencies" and leave it on the table) and even making them capable of movement - here's hoping.

ahh yes.. the gun drone mod... hate that one with a passion... but it's there...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <03-19-14/1606:48>
Quote
If you have a smartlink, you can mentally switch between gun modes, eject a clip, and fire the gun without pulling the trigger.
Do I have to be holding the gun to fire it? Can I put a smartgun-featured gun on a table, walk away and still remotely pull the trigger via an implanted smartlink?
Hmm, probably. But you can not aim or direct the weapon when it fires after you put in on the table...As the gun has no means of moving itself. And the act of firing (depending on the weapon) could blow it right off the table...
4E Arsenal had rules about putting Pilot programs in guns (so you could give it a command like "shoot if anyone comes through the door that isn't broadcasting one of these frequencies" and leave it on the table) and even making them capable of movement - here's hoping.
ahh yes.. the gun drone mod... hate that one with a passion... but it's there...
There's also "grenade drone" it's highly expensive, but there is something fascinating about the idea of having a dozen minigrenades sneak into someone's bedroom, stand around his bed, sing Happy Birthday, and blow up.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <03-19-14/1609:24>
Quote
If you have a smartlink, you can mentally switch between gun modes, eject a clip, and fire the gun without pulling the trigger.
Do I have to be holding the gun to fire it? Can I put a smartgun-featured gun on a table, walk away and still remotely pull the trigger via an implanted smartlink?
Hmm, probably. But you can not aim or direct the weapon when it fires after you put in on the table...As the gun has no means of moving itself. And the act of firing (depending on the weapon) could blow it right off the table...
4E Arsenal had rules about putting Pilot programs in guns (so you could give it a command like "shoot if anyone comes through the door that isn't broadcasting one of these frequencies" and leave it on the table) and even making them capable of movement - here's hoping.
ahh yes.. the gun drone mod... hate that one with a passion... but it's there...
There's also "grenade drone" it's highly expensive, but there is something fascinating about the idea of having a dozen minigrenades sneak into someone's bedroom, stand around his bed, sing Happy Birthday, and blow up.


 :o

You had a troubled childhood didn't you?



 :P
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <03-19-14/1618:53>
((Yup, my fault. He's demanding I see Frozen so I can sing Let It Go to him.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Insaniac99 on <03-19-14/1629:32>
Quote
If you have a smartlink, you can mentally switch between gun modes, eject a clip, and fire the gun without pulling the trigger.
Do I have to be holding the gun to fire it? Can I put a smartgun-featured gun on a table, walk away and still remotely pull the trigger via an implanted smartlink?
Hmm, probably. But you can not aim or direct the weapon when it fires after you put in on the table...As the gun has no means of moving itself. And the act of firing (depending on the weapon) could blow it right off the table...
4E Arsenal had rules about putting Pilot programs in guns (so you could give it a command like "shoot if anyone comes through the door that isn't broadcasting one of these frequencies" and leave it on the table) and even making them capable of movement - here's hoping.
ahh yes.. the gun drone mod... hate that one with a passion... but it's there...
There's also "grenade drone" it's highly expensive, but there is something fascinating about the idea of having a dozen minigrenades sneak into someone's bedroom, stand around his bed, sing Happy Birthday, and blow up.

I have a character in my files that would TOTALLY have them play "Wake Up Little Suzy (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4X7b2E_Jq-k)" or the firs few bars of the song that inspired Happy Birthday: Good Morning To All   :D
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <03-19-14/1705:39>
((Yup, my fault. He's demanding I see Frozen so I can sing Let It Go to him.))
((Do You Want to Build a Snowman?, actually.))

Something I actually used was an Internal Smartgun System + Voice Activation combo, with a bit of GM-permitted editing: I'd program the grenades with 6 challenge - response phrase pairs, and when it was time to throw a grenade (with only a single level in the skill), I'd push the activation button and give one of the challenge phrases, then throw it. If it landed in the right place, I'd shout the response phrase, and it would explode at the end of the CT, like normal.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <03-19-14/1754:19>
Something I actually used was an Internal Smartgun System + Voice Activation combo, with a bit of GM-permitted editing: I'd program the grenades with 6 challenge - response phrase pairs, and when it was time to throw a grenade (with only a single level in the skill), I'd push the activation button and give one of the challenge phrases, then throw it. If it landed in the right place, I'd shout the response phrase, and it would explode at the end of the CT, like normal.
Marco.

...


POLO! BOOOM!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kargush on <03-20-14/0846:01>
Maybe this has come up earlier, so I apologize if I'm repeating a question here.

On page 65 (I think, haven't got the book at hand), it says trolls pay +50% on gear, as well as the +100% on lifestyle costs. Page 94 (or 96, again not sure) says +50% on both gear and lifestyles. The example troll character doesn't pay extra for his gear, however. Likewise the costs for dwarfs are a little all over the place, from +20% on both gear and lifestyles to just +20% on lifestyles.

I'm a little confused here, which one is correct for the two respective metahumans?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <03-20-14/0903:27>
Maybe this has come up earlier, so I apologize if I'm repeating a question here.

On page 65 (I think, haven't got the book at hand), it says trolls pay +50% on gear, as well as the +100% on lifestyle costs. Page 94 (or 96, again not sure) says +50% on both gear and lifestyles. The example troll character doesn't pay extra for his gear, however. Likewise the costs for dwarfs are a little all over the place, from +20% on both gear and lifestyles to just +20% on lifestyles.

I'm a little confused here, which one is correct for the two respective metahumans?

This is in the errata, but both races simply pay the extra (+100%, +20% respectively) in Lifestyle costs.  Gear prices are unchanged.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kargush on <03-20-14/0913:10>
Thanks, I've no idea how I could have missed the errata.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ImaginalDisc on <03-20-14/2043:34>
I am positive this must have been addressed before, but I don't see it.


Are agents capped in rating based on the device rating of the deck they are on? The book explicitly compares them to pilot programs, and pilots are capped by the device rating of their drones, so I assumed agents were capped the same way?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Insaniac99 on <03-20-14/2045:31>
I am positive this must have been addressed before, but I don't see it.


Are agents capped in rating based on the device rating of the deck they are on? The book explicitly compares them to pilot programs, and pilots are capped by the device rating of their drones, so I assumed agents were capped the same way?

There is nothing in raw that caps them, The rating of the device will serve as a limit however.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <03-20-14/2046:14>
...and pilots are capped by the device rating of their drones, so I assumed agents were capped the same way?
Can you cite this? Most drones have a "DR" of 2, but a Pilot (and apparently effective DR) of 3 from what I recall.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ImaginalDisc on <03-20-14/2058:31>
...and pilots are capped by the device rating of their drones, so I assumed agents were capped the same way?
Can you cite this? Most drones have a "DR" of 2, but a Pilot (and apparently effective DR) of 3 from what I recall.


Oh, right. Hmmm.

This is weird. Why wouldn't deckers all run rating 6 agents all the time then? They're not terribly expensive.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <03-20-14/2136:49>
NPCs? Because even with a Middle Lifestyle, 12k is more than 2 months of rent + food + clothes + entertainment budget. PCs? Because decks are expensive enough on their own, and you'll always want more stuff than you can have.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <03-20-14/2148:20>
NPCs? Because even with a Middle Lifestyle, 12k is more than 2 months of rent + food + clothes + entertainment budget. PCs? Because decks are expensive enough on their own, and you'll always want more stuff than you can have.


Wait, you telling me that I don't actually own lunar property???
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ImaginalDisc on <03-20-14/2207:13>
NPCs? Because even with a Middle Lifestyle, 12k is more than 2 months of rent + food + clothes + entertainment budget. PCs? Because decks are expensive enough on their own, and you'll always want more stuff than you can have.

Yes, but it seems that many PC deckers will have a bunch of a rating 6 agents and not bother with lower rating ones at all unless their contacts/face cannot handle the 18 availability.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <03-20-14/2228:10>
NPCs? Because even with a Middle Lifestyle, 12k is more than 2 months of rent + food + clothes + entertainment budget. PCs? Because decks are expensive enough on their own, and you'll always want more stuff than you can have.
Wait, you telling me that I don't actually own lunar property???
Hate to break it to you, but no. There's a treaty about how nobody can own the moon, no matter how many people claim otherwise and try to sell you a few square feet of moon.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <03-21-14/0048:51>
NPCs? Because even with a Middle Lifestyle, 12k is more than 2 months of rent + food + clothes + entertainment budget. PCs? Because decks are expensive enough on their own, and you'll always want more stuff than you can have.
Wait, you telling me that I don't actually own lunar property???
Hate to break it to you, but no. There's a treaty about how nobody can own the moon, no matter how many people claim otherwise and try to sell you a few square feet of moon.


oh :(
.
..
...

Hey, wanna buy a bridge?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <03-21-14/1020:30>
Depends. Is it on the moon?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <03-21-14/1023:53>
...and pilots are capped by the device rating of their drones, so I assumed agents were capped the same way?
Can you cite this? Most drones have a "DR" of 2, but a Pilot (and apparently effective DR) of 3 from what I recall.
((Actually, one of the tables is pretty clear that Drones are DR3. However, DR doesn't cap programs so dunno if they will cap Pilots when we can buy Pilot programs. There also don't seem to be any DR-rating limits left in SR5.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <03-21-14/1043:56>
...and pilots are capped by the device rating of their drones, so I assumed agents were capped the same way?
Can you cite this? Most drones have a "DR" of 2, but a Pilot (and apparently effective DR) of 3 from what I recall.
((Actually, one of the tables is pretty clear that Drones are DR3. However, DR doesn't cap programs so dunno if they will cap Pilots when we can buy Pilot programs. There also don't seem to be any DR-rating limits left in SR5.))
((Both the Device Rating tables on p. 234 and 421 say 2, but the drone section says "Pilots have a Rating indicated by the Device Rating of the vehicle, drone, or other piece of gear they’re in." Agree with everything else.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <03-21-14/1108:58>
((There's another table that says DR3.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <03-21-14/1856:04>
The main point of this question is for it to hopefully be included in the FAQ, but I'd welcome other players interpretations:

The Astral Tracking description seems to imply that you can only use the astral signature of a spell to track down the caster if the spell is still active. From what I recall, an extant astral signature was all that was required previously. Additionally, the first condition in the Astral Tracking Modifiers table would seem to imply that an astral link no longer needs to be active in order to use Astral Tracking (for instance, a Force 4 spell cast at location 2 hours ago that wasn't wiped clean by the spellcaster).

Q: Can the astral signature of a previously cast spell, summoned spirit, etc. be used as the basis for an Astral Tracking attempt or must the spell/spirit/etc still be active?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <03-21-14/2216:02>
The main point of this question is for it to hopefully be included in the FAQ, but I'd welcome other players interpretations:

The Astral Tracking description seems to imply that you can only use the astral signature of a spell to track down the caster if the spell is still active. From what I recall, an extant astral signature was all that was required previously. Additionally, the first condition in the Astral Tracking Modifiers table would seem to imply that an astral link no longer needs to be active in order to use Astral Tracking (for instance, a Force 4 spell cast at location 2 hours ago that wasn't wiped clean by the spellcaster).

Q: Can the astral signature of a previously cast spell, summoned spirit, etc. be used as the basis for an Astral Tracking attempt or must the spell/spirit/etc still be active?

After reading through the (admittedly very short) section on Astral Tracking, I think I see the part that you're referring to, on page 315:

Quote
Active spells are linked to their casters, spirits are linked to their summoners, astrally projecting magicians are linked to their physical bodies, and foci and magical lodges are linked to the magicians who activated them.

However, I see nothing else on the subject of auras, astral signatures, or astral tracking that supports that line.  In fact, like you I found a great deal of contradictory evidence.  Therefore, I would assume that this is not a typo so much as poor phrasing.  It probably should simply drop the word "Active" from the sentence.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Domingini on <03-23-14/0416:43>
I have a question about the negative quality 'code of honor' possible official ruling. Hope this wasn't already a thread issue already.

A member of my crew took 'assassin's creed' [page 79] more for flavor than the points, our gm is a stickler for rules verbatim and verbiage he reads the rules abd takes them for face value. I was wondering does assassin's creed overwrite code of honor? Is the protected group anyone who isnt a paid target?

Do the deaths extend to members of the adventuring party or just the person with the the quality. Does the assassin still try to stop people from killing non targets?

What about public awareness? Does the assassin gain one public awareness no matter what cause people are bound to die that dont have a contract, and some will live. So 1 public awareness for each death and 1 public awareness for  Witnesses?

Thanks in advanced for the help.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: alvyjereza on <03-25-14/1128:53>
1. Question about adept advancement.  If an adept spends karma to improve magic attribute does he also get an equivalent amount of powerpoints?
Ex. 1 Adept at end of character regen has Magic 5 and 5 powerpoints.  After earning karma he increases his Magic attribute to 6, does he get another power point too?
Ex. 2 Adept has Magic Attribute 6 and 6 powerpoints.  He initiates to his first level and chooses powerpoint metamagic, does he gain a total of one(due to powerpoint metamagic only) or two (due to powerpoint metamagic AND magic attribute increase) powerpoints?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <03-25-14/1141:10>
((Yes on 1. Page 279.))
((No on 2. Initiation does NOT raise his Magic Attribute.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <03-25-14/1212:23>
I have a question about the negative quality 'code of honor' possible official ruling. Hope this wasn't already a thread issue already.

A member of my crew took 'assassin's creed' [page 79] more for flavor than the points, our gm is a stickler for rules verbatim and verbiage he reads the rules abd takes them for face value. I was wondering does assassin's creed overwrite code of honor? Is the protected group anyone who isnt a paid target?

Do the deaths extend to members of the adventuring party or just the person with the the quality. Does the assassin still try to stop people from killing non targets?

What about public awareness? Does the assassin gain one public awareness no matter what cause people are bound to die that dont have a contract, and some will live. So 1 public awareness for each death and 1 public awareness for  Witnesses?

Thanks in advanced for the help.

Assassin's Creed is an "other form" of Code of Honor (see the sentence immediately before the bullet point), so it replaces the main text.  Your PA will go up just like it describes in the Assassin's Creed bullet point: killing without a contract.  You don't need to worry about leaving witnesses.  Wait--that sounds crazy.  Just make sure, "kill at witnesses" is a clause in your contract.  Carry a nonlethal option at all times.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: alvyjereza on <03-25-14/2256:44>
((Yes on 1. Page 279.))
((No on 2. Initiation does NOT raise his Magic Attribute.))

Thanks for answering Michael
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: firebug on <04-07-14/2136:55>
Search didn't give anything on this, but there needs to be an official ruling of what counts as "touching" for the purpose of Touch Trigger preparations, and how much an alchemist can handle their own touch triggers.  Lemme see if I can outline the stuff that people have pointed out.

1) You can assume "touch" means that the preparation's aura comes into contact with the living being's aura.  This is the same reason touch spells aren't useless against people wearing clothing.  Would this be correct?  If this is not the case, then touch triggers would be almost useless.

2) When it says "the next living being", does this mean the alchemist is excluded?  Can an alchemist not trigger their own touch-trigger preparations?

3) Assuming the above is not the case, when does the preparation "arm"?  If it is possible for an alchemist to trigger it immediately after they finish making it, then transporting a touch-trigger preparation would be very difficult (assuming #1 is accurate). 

4) Or, is it that the preparation does not "arm" until it leaves the alchemist's aura (the alchemist was the first to touch is, and now the "next living being" is able to trigger it) at which point the alchemist would trigger it if they touched it again?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Coldstone on <04-08-14/1209:20>
The official 'unofficial' answers in regard to touch trigger preparations are as thus (it has come up a few times, it may just be well buried within topics.

1) touch implies a living beings aura, yes. Metahuman, spirit, probably watchers...not sure about things like homunculi or spell aura's though (like magic fingers).

2) the alchemist is not excluded, meaning he can set it off as well.

3) this reflects partly to 2, but the preparation is basically armed right after the rolls are completed. So the moment the alchemy is finished, you got a live one right in front of you. It's strongly recommended you have something non living to grab it (like a robot or tongs) or put it in a very thick object to minimize aura contact.

4) see 3



This is one of those questions that people are hoping will get fine tuned during a bigger errata, because it does make live triggers very risky to handle. If things like magic fingers can handle it safely, then there is a few plausible options that are less of a problem, but until they invent Aura-sealing latex gloves, you want to give Fireball Preps a wide berth.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <04-08-14/1222:29>
<znip>until they invent Aura-sealing latex gloves, you want to give Fireball Preps a wide berth.
(( Or cast it on the door handle of the open door that you're about to walk through and close behind you without touching the handle...

When pursuit catches up to you; kafwooom! ))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Coldstone on <04-08-14/1236:39>
If you have that many minutes to set an exploding Door knob (why does that sound like a Harry Potter gag? Biting Doorknobs!) Are they really chasing you? XD

Still, a cute idea that may work anyways for stuff.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <04-08-14/1746:55>
If you have that many minutes to set an exploding Door knob (why does that sound like a Harry Potter gag? Biting Doorknobs!) Are they really chasing you? XD

Still, a cute idea that may work anyways for stuff.



It's not that hard to set up. Just have it as part of your evac plan.... while the rest of the party is off getting the item/dude/data, the mage is prepping the evac path with things like this. Yes it takes minutes to do, but it all depends on when you spend those minutes. (in the middle of a case as they are bearing down on you is too late.)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <04-08-14/1749:41>
((Just like how a Decker shouldn't try to get his Marks on enemy comms when combat starts, but in advance.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Jackal on <04-08-14/2049:17>
Agony and Mass Agony Question:

"Each net hit scored by the magician temporarily inflicts 1 box of Physical and 1 box of Stun damage on the target."

"Grunts have only one Condition Monitor, which is used to track both Physical and Stun damage."

When cast on Grunts, do these two spells effectively double the damage since a grunt only has a single damage track and treats Stun and Physical Damage the same? IE, 5 net hits would knock out a average grunt (10 boxes).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <04-08-14/2117:12>
Agony and Mass Agony Question:

"Each net hit scored by the magician temporarily inflicts 1 box of Physical and 1 box of Stun damage on the target."

"Grunts have only one Condition Monitor, which is used to track both Physical and Stun damage."

When cast on Grunts, do these two spells effectively double the damage since a grunt only has a single damage track and treats Stun and Physical Damage the same? IE, 5 net hits would knock out a average grunt (10 boxes).

based on what the book says on page 379

Quote

SR 5 Core Book. page 379: Condition monitors

...
All damage taken by a grunt, whether it’s Physical
or Stun, is tracked on this one Condition Monitor; when
it’s full, the grunt is out of action for the rest of the fight.
Grunts don’t get overflow damage like PCs do.
...

I would say that yes, it double dips the damage, so that 5 nets hits would indeed be 10 damage for Grunts (and thus most likely taking them out of the fight)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Jackal on <04-08-14/2142:55>
Yeah, I had a feeling. Using RAW I had a mage disable everyone in a bar fight with Mass Agony, then walked around and executed all the baddies, it was a gang turf war thing which will obviously draw some serious attention. She got 6 hits on the test and due to my GM dice apparently taking pity on the players, the mooks only got 1 success. So 5 net hits... 5 Stun + 5 Physical = On the ground thinking they were mostly dead. Allies on her side are going to be extremely angry and or fearful of her after that move since she incapacitated them as well.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Coldstone on <04-08-14/2342:38>
Keep in mind that damage is 'temporary' at least until they were dealt with. You only need one or two non-grunts to make that strategy not perfect, and get the hits, -and- they have to resist it badly.

It's a good anti-grunt, but it's not perfect either.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <04-10-14/2139:57>
Run&Gun:

Ammo-Whammy is listed separately from Location,Location,Location / Specific Target, do Ammo-Whammy effects require 2+ net hits like LLL, and do they follow the "no net-hits for damage" rule that Specific Target follows?

Double-Tap: "The attack results in an AP increase equal to the base AP multiplied by [...]". If I fire 2 bullets, do I get an increase of x2 or x3? If I fire 6, do I get x3 added or is the maximum x3 total? And what is the base AP, the base AP of the attack, so weapon+apds combined?

There's shots with a DV of 0, yet you are supposed to do damage to be able to apply the effects. I assume that what happens is that the damage is calculated as normal (without bonus-damage from net hits), then a soak happens, if damage remains then effects happen (if enough net-hits were scored), then damage is capped by the DV Limit?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <04-11-14/0012:37>
Yeah, Bulls-Eye Double-Tap is in some serious need of clarification. If it's the Base AP of the weapon without APDS bonus, then it's at least not completely broken. If it's the Weapon AP + APDS, it's ridiculous. An Ares Alpha firing 3 (or 6, worst case) rounds would have an effective AP of 18, enough to completely negate the armor of an Ares Roadmaster. Even in the more conservative reading, it'd still be (Base AP of 2 * 3 = 6) + APDS 4 = AP 10 for assault rifles. As if Automatics needed power creep...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Agonar on <04-11-14/0109:16>
It does say "Base AP" which I think is very clear.  But, results in an AP increase of base x # of bullets.  Does this mean that is Base AP is -2, it is increased by -6 to -8 in the case of a 3 round burst?  Instead of saying the AP is increased to base AP times number of bullets. 

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <04-11-14/0142:23>
It does say "Base AP" which I think is very clear.

I'm far from certain on that, especially with the weird ways the math can go otherwise.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <04-11-14/0637:26>
It does say "Base AP" which I think is very clear.
Base AP of the attack? Of the weapon? Of the ammo? If I fire an APDS-loaded EBR, do I use -3, -4 or -7 as additional value per round?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ikarinokami on <04-16-14/1629:58>
bulls eye seems pretty clear that it's the Base AP of the weapon and from the description you can only use three bullets. and the max you can get is x3 the base ap modifier with 3 bullets. it says specificly in the description you can only use 3 bullets.


the revelent thing that's missing is whether or not the new AP superceds the +4 from APDS or Adds to the +4 from APDS.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <04-16-14/1756:20>
bulls eye seems pretty clear that it's the Base AP of the weapon and from the description you can only use three bullets. and the max you can get is x3 the base ap modifier with 3 bullets. it says specificly in the description you can only use 3 bullets.
No, it says the limit caps out at x3, while it talks about the second or third, it doesn't state you can't use it with a bigger burst. And while I agree that it's likely the base AP of the weapon, it's not really clear on the matter. Nor is it clear on whether 4 bullets means +basex3 or +basex2. So far from clear.

Yes, it's easy to make a call on what it means. But it IS incredibly ambiguous, so we need an official answer on it, for the sake of all GMs to prevent rule-lawyering munchkins.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <04-16-14/2037:48>
bulls eye seems pretty clear that it's the Base AP of the weapon and from the description you can only use three bullets. and the max you can get is x3 the base ap modifier with 3 bullets. it says specificly in the description you can only use 3 bullets.


the revelent thing that's missing is whether or not the new AP superceds the +4 from APDS or Adds to the +4 from APDS.

It's actually quite unclear on what it's the base AP of - it could be the weapon, or it could be the attack.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ikarinokami on <04-16-14/2219:54>
bulls eye seems pretty clear that it's the Base AP of the weapon and from the description you can only use three bullets. and the max you can get is x3 the base ap modifier with 3 bullets. it says specificly in the description you can only use 3 bullets.
No, it says the limit caps out at x3, while it talks about the second or third, it doesn't state you can't use it with a bigger burst. And while I agree that it's likely the base AP of the weapon, it's not really clear on the matter. Nor is it clear on whether 4 bullets means +basex3 or +basex2. So far from clear.

Yes, it's easy to make a call on what it means. But it IS incredibly ambiguous, so we need an official answer on it, for the sake of all GMs to prevent rule-lawyering munchkins.

its seems quite clear that since the max is X3 and each bullet gives a X1 and it says how each bullet is working. it says "second or third" ( not more, or each following, etc). i don't see any ambiguity here, there are penal statues that wish they were written with this much clarity.

it's AP of the gun because it didn't say "modified AP"

.
it's the weapon AP because that's the standerd wording in the book



unfortunately there is no guidance as to whether the +4 from the APDS is subsumed after firing the second bullet or added, since either would not be contridicted by any other rules or text
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <04-16-14/2223:40>
10 posts in on a question in the Rules & FAQ thread. If y'all want to continue this, can you start a thread in the forum? Granted, it's been like 6+ months since we've heard anything from Aaron, but let's keep hoping, right?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <04-17-14/0227:01>
its seems quite clear that since the max is X3 and each bullet gives a X1 and it says how each bullet is working. it says "second or third" ( not more, or each following, etc). i don't see any ambiguity here, there are penal statues that wish they were written with this much clarity.
Until you can state, with full truth, that it is written explicitly, I'm not buying your claim that there's no ambiguity. And no offense, but I cannot provide YOUR opinion on the matter to support mine to players, not at this level of ambiguity. When you become the official FAQ answerer from Catalyst, your opinion will be enough, but until then, the ambiguity exists and won't go away until officially clarified.

Once more, it's easy to make a call, but we DO need an OFFICIAL answer on it, and unless you are the OFFICIAL answer, please stop arguing, because that's the kind of debate that does NOT belong in this topic.

tl;dr: Unless you're Aaron or someone else authorized to answer it, please stop claiming an answer to something that lacks enough support to shut up all munchkins.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Yetibruce on <04-19-14/0019:04>
Rigger Questions:
1) How much do Autosofts cost per rank (ref. p269 especially, with related material on 243-245, 441-442)?

2) Page 270 has a heading "Drone Infiltration" that describes how drones sneak using their Stealth Autosoft.  P184 states under Sensor Attacks that "If the target is trying to evade detection, make this an Opposed Test versus the target's Infiltration+Agility [Physical] (metahumans, critters), Infiltration [Vehicle]+Reaction [Handling] (driven vehicles), or Pilot+[Model] Stealth [Handling] (drones).  Since metahumans are supposed to test vs. infiltration for themselves or driven vehicles, please tell us what "infiltration" is?
 
2A) "Infiltration" sounds like a skill, but it is not in the skills section. Sneaking (p133 & 136) sounds like it would be the skill used by meta-humans for this type of action. Page 153 references "Stealth" which is a skill group, so it sounds like Palming or Disguise might be applicable if the GM deems circumstances fit those skills.  Would that be correct?
2B) My read of the rules is that the word Infiltration should be replaced by Stealth or Sneaking wherever it appears in the text (p184 & 270), since Infiltration appears to be a skill name that was removed/changed, but was missed during the editing of these pages. Please confirm if that is correct?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <04-19-14/0113:39>
*snip*

Please consult the errata document for the answers to your questions.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lobo on <04-21-14/1659:57>
Quick Healer - just checking, assuming I am a mage with the heal spell.  With this 3 karma quality, I get the bonus when:

1) I use First Aid on someone
2) Someone uses first aid on me
3) I cast a Heal spell on someone
4) Someone casts a Heal spell on me
5) I am healing naturally

This seems weird, as in, you would think the quality means you are resilient, but then how does that work with you casting spells and using medkits on other people better?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <04-21-14/1724:51>
Leaving aside the way it's poorly phrased, its name, history and karmic costs suggest to me 2, 4 and 5 apply. However, I have two players arguing it's all five, and the way it's phrased, they have a point, though I find it unbelievable that is intended.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SunFire on <04-22-14/0450:32>
Hey,

is the Savalette Guardian obsolete?
Because every Weapon with SA Mode can fire a SMB with a complex action.


regards
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <04-22-14/0923:35>
Hey,

is the Savalette Guardian obsolete?
Because every Weapon with SA Mode can fire a SMB with a complex action.


regards

General thought: It is not for the short burst that the BF is used. But, because it is a burst fire weapon, it can do the
long burst like other burst can for a complex action. I.E.: 3 round Bursts are not where it matters, but that it can do
6 round bursts DOES.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jim1701 on <04-22-14/1056:38>
There are four pistols capable of using the BF fire mode.  Except for the Ares Viper Slivergun they all use the same rule making all burst fire a complex action.  It still puts such pistols in a position between standard SA pistols which cannot fire 6 round bursts at all and machine pistols which require the automatics skill to use.  It's better than the former but not quite as good as the latter but also doesn't require a second skill to fire. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lobo on <04-24-14/1504:46>
Run and Gun issue:

Page 49: Flamethrowers
Flamethrowers cannot mount any accessories except
biometric safety systems (Advanced Safety, p. 50).

Page 53: Under-barrel Flamethrowers
We’ve known runners so fond of fire that they might mount one
of these on an actual flamethrower.

So, should we just dismiss the text on page 53 as tongue-in-cheek fluff?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jim1701 on <04-24-14/1602:41>
I would say yes.  Unfortunately I have been disappointed with how much they have mixed fluff into without a reliable way of determining what is fluff and what is rules. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Erling on <04-24-14/1655:16>
Hoi chummers. Let me ask a question.

In Run&Gun heavy pistol Savalette Guardian has following description:

A heavy pistol with an integrated smartgun link, an internal micro-
gyro recoil absorption system, and the option for
burst firing, it’s a very reasonable weapon for an experienced
owner who expects to be in heavy combat.

*Burst Fire on this weapon requires a Complex Action


AFAIK, in basic rules difference between semi-auto burst and burst fire is what SAB requires Complex Action, while BF requires Simple Action. So, I have a heavy pistol which can fire SAB or BF, either for Сomplex Фction, either make 3 points of recoil. What's the advantage of that pistol's BF mode?
I would understand that if I could fire Long Burst with it (AFAIK, any weapon which can fire BF can fire LB as well), by I'm not sure about that: if BF requires Complex Action, how can I shoot LB with that gun?
So what's the point?

UPD: uh oh, errm, and just NOW I can see there was a discussion of that issue at the same page of the forum :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <04-25-14/1247:54>
*looks up at Erling, shakes head*

OK..at least Erling looked up and read it..This has been so common, it is a but rediculous. And has
been discussed MULTIPLE times already.

Please people, before asking a question, PLEASE read through the thread to make sure it hasn't
been asked(and discussed, and answered) MULTIPLE times.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <04-25-14/1311:45>
((Tip: Use the Print button to be able to do an easy search through the entire topic.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: cndblank on <04-25-14/1436:50>
((Tip: Use the Print button to be able to do an easy search through the entire topic.))

Great tip!!!

Thanks!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tenlaar on <04-25-14/1502:52>
That really is, thanks Mr. Chandra.  Time to see if some questions are answered in here!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Medicineman on <04-28-14/0917:04>
what range are hunting rifles and carbines ?

HokaHey
Medicineman
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <04-28-14/0931:58>
what range are hunting rifles and carbines ?

HokaHey
Medicineman

Sporting Rifles (which I assume are hunting rifles)
Short 0-50 Medium 51-250 Long 251-500 Extreme 501-750

Carbines use SMG ranges.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Medicineman on <04-28-14/1123:17>
Thanks :)

Hough!
Medicineman
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <05-11-14/1354:33>
Blackwatch, your question is better directed in this forum: http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?board=12.0
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tarislar on <05-12-14/2240:20>
Is there a limit on the # of spirits you can have doing a service for you.


For instance.

Merlin the Magician (Magic-4, Spellcasting-4) is tossing a Fireball,  Force-4.
Merlin has three Force-2 Fire Elementals bound to him.
Can all 3 Elementals burn a service (that's 3 services burned) and add their Force (2) dice to his cast to give Merlin 14 Dice total instead of his starting 8 dice?

I see no limit to the # of dice that Aid Sorcery can donate (except Spirit Force) & I see no limit to the # of Spirits active at one time (except Charisma), & I see no limit in the # that can contribute to an action anywhere at all in the rules.


I know it older editions there were examples of NPC's that had multiple Elementals on call in scenario books with descriptions on what each one was doing so I'm assuming the scenario above is legal since I can find nothing saying it isn't.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Agonar on <05-13-14/0959:15>
(Best i can provide, is that Aid is a task.  Tasks need to be asked/commanded of Spirits, so each Spirit you want to Aid you would need it's own Simple Action to command it.  If you have the time to spend asking each spirit to Aid you [3 Simple Actions for 3 spirits] Then I would imagine yes)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Neongelion on <05-19-14/2012:05>
I don't think I'm reading something right, because the alternate rules for initiative in Run and Gun seem exactly like the ones presented in the core book. Could someone explain to me what the difference actually is?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <05-19-14/2022:25>
Standard rules (IS = Initiative Score):

Run&Gun alternate rules:

So with the alternate rules, if you have, say, an Initiative Score of 45, there's a chance you'll get 3 turns in a row.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <05-20-14/0331:15>
Basically SR5 core rule is equivalent to SR3 rule, whereas R&G rule is equivalent to SR2 rule.

This roughly means that with SR5 Core rule, extra initiative pass occur at the end of the turn, whereas with R&G rule they occur at the beginning.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <05-21-14/0721:35>
Run&Gun:

Is the Bunker Gear Helmet intended to have such a low Capacity (3)? Their Capacity hasn't changed from SR4, but they no longer contain a massive set of vision-enhancements (4) like in SR4.

The SWAT Helmet, on the other hand, lost 5 vision enhancements but had its Capacity raised from 4 to 8, while the Riot Control Helmet remained the same but only lost its Image Link, and Biker lost Image Link and Flare Compensation. This leaves the Bunker Gear Helmet as far too weak in comparison.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <05-22-14/1124:03>
Can't find it asked before so asking just in case:

- Internal Smartguns: Do they cost WeaponCost, or 2xWeaponCost? As in, if I buy a gun of 1k nuyen and get an internal smartgun for it, is that 1k+1k or 1k+2k? Language used suggests +1k, SR2~4 had +1k, tables say +2k.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <05-22-14/1126:08>
1k + 1k, the cost of the weapon is doubled if you want one with an internal smartgun
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <05-22-14/1128:14>
1k + 1k, the cost of the weapon is doubled if you want one with an internal smartgun
Do you have an official source for that? Because the tables, both in core and Run&Gun, disagree, while the text agrees.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SlowDeck on <05-22-14/1143:42>
1k + 1k, the cost of the weapon is doubled if you want one with an internal smartgun
Do you have an official source for that? Because the tables, both in core and Run&Gun, disagree, while the text agrees.

Are you sure on this? The core rulebook text says the cost is doubled, while the text on the table in my copy of the book says it is weapon cost multiplied by two (which, mathematically, is weapon cost doubled). Run and Gun says the same thing on my copy. While it is sloppy, the text of the weapon cost on the tables supports the written text, since the test presents it as a mathematical modifier of weapon price.

Edit: I think I figured it out.

Pretty much, the problem comes down to how they wrote the text and how some people may misinterpret it. Other than saying "see text" for the price, there really is no way to put it down that won't lead to some people having questions as to the cost and thinking it disagrees with the text. Even "Weapon cost is doubled" would suggest the possibility the price of the internal smartgun actually triples the cost of the cost of the weapon by having a price double the weapon's cost. But for general usage and general understandings of language, the wording they did use is accurate enough to prevent confusion in most people, which is really all they could hope for.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <05-22-14/1153:48>
((So your interpretation is that the text should be read as "the weapon modification itself costs twice as much as the gun", rather than as "weapon+modification costs twice as much as the gun itself"?))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Furious Trope on <05-22-14/1156:43>
((So your interpretation is that the text should be read as "the weapon modification itself costs twice as much as the gun", rather than as "weapon+modification costs twice as much as the gun itself"?))

That seems to be what a close parsing of the phrasing suggests it's supposed to be. A price hike, but then again everything around smartlink seems to have been made more expensive.

No idea if this was intended or not. It's... ambiguous.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SlowDeck on <05-22-14/1158:00>
((So your interpretation is that the text should be read as "the weapon modification itself costs twice as much as the gun", rather than as "weapon+modification costs twice as much as the gun itself"?))

No. My interpretation of it is that the table should be read as "the cost of weapon + modification is twice as much as weapon itself."

It probably would have been better if they had more accurate, reliable wording to use for this... but then the text wouldn't have been in English.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <05-22-14/1207:49>
((@FT: It's kinda silly if external smartguns get halved but internal get doubled in cost. Still, I'd like some official clarification to be sure, whichever way it falls.))

((@SlowDeck: That interpretation of the table doesn't seem right when you check the other entries. The table is what the modification itself costs, not what the gun with it added costs.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SlowDeck on <05-22-14/1218:56>
Like I said in my edit up above: The only way the table entry, using the allocated space, cannot disagree with the text entry is if they replaced it with "See text."

However, if you treat the table as a list of weapon price modifiers, with the weapon cost being the base price and the modified weapon cost being the final price, the smartgun entry makes sense as written; it is modifying the number at the beginning of the equation. As such, the equation would look like this:

Weapon cost x base price modifiers + (weapon mod price x rating) = modified weapon cost
where rating = 1 if weapon mod price does not include a rating factor

Smartguns then go in the base price modifiers. Thus, a weapon costing 1000 nuyen with an internal smartgun and a gas vent 2 would look like this:

1000 x 2 + (200 x 2) = 2400
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <05-22-14/1221:41>
((So at 3 different interpretations that 3 different people see as the right one, I'd say it's pretty clear we need official clarification. :P))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <05-22-14/1300:22>
((For what it's worth, I've always ruled the internal smartgun to be equal to the cost of the weapon without any modifications added in.  But that's far from saying anything official, and I agree that we could use some clarity on this matter.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SlowDeck on <05-22-14/1318:43>
((Agreed. Clarity is a must at this point!))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Carmody on <05-23-14/0455:54>
1k + 1k, the cost of the weapon is doubled if you want one with an internal smartgun
Do you have an official source for that? Because the tables, both in core and Run&Gun, disagree, while the text agrees.

No, I do not have an official source. This is the way I understand it and I never realised before that it could be understood differently  ???
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <05-23-14/0530:41>
1k + 1k, the cost of the weapon is doubled if you want one with an internal smartgun
Do you have an official source for that? Because the tables, both in core and Run&Gun, disagree, while the text agrees.

No, I do not have an official source. This is the way I understand it and I never realised before that it could be understood differently  ???

The tables(which are always treated as more correct unless an Errata changes them) are rather clear: the cost of the
accessory of an Internal Smartlink is twice the weapons cost. This means that if you put an internal smartlink on
a 250 Nuyen pistol, the smartlink will cost 500, bringing the total cost of the weapon to 750 nuyen, if you put it on
a 1,000 nuyen rifle, that rifle's total cost will be 3,000 nuyen(1,000 for hte rifle, 2,000 for the internal smartlink). Yes,
this seems crazy, but it is the current RAW. Remember: if it was not in the Errata Document released, it must be
presumed to be Correct.

(yes, this DOES mean that, per the RAW, Sumbersion for Technomancers is a multiplier while for Mages it is
additive. Clearly this was intentional to fix the complaints of TMs being overpowered in 4th.)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <05-23-14/0536:16>
((Just because it's RAW doesn't mean it's correct. And we have multiple incorrect table entries. So I disagree with your cynical logic, especially about Submersion. Anyway, since text and tables collide, which means at least one has to be errata'd before we can claim any form of correctness, I'm asking for an official clarification, not a cynical claim of which RAW to follow. Now can we please either take the debate to another topic or simply wait and see if we ever get an official answer?))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Erling on <05-24-14/1634:22>
Need help with rules at p. 161:

"He can make that declaration when it is time for players with that score to act. Characters who have a Delayed Action and intervene in this manner can choose to go before, after, or at the same time as a currently acting character who would normally take his action on that Initiative Score; any actions they take receive a –1 dice pool penalty. If multiple characters delay their actions until the same Initiative Score, they break the tie in the same manner as Initiative (p. 159). Characters delaying an action in this manner keep their initial Initiative Score. If the character does not act before the end of the Initiative Pass, they incur the standard reduction of 10 at the end of the Initiative Pass."

For example, the combat has been started. My character is standing in a room, pointing his gun at a doorway. My character's Initiative Score is the highest in this combat. I'm sure that the enemy soldier (standing behind the wall in the corridor) will rush into the room, so I delay action and want to shoot him as soon as he'll appear at a doorway. So I have some questions:

1) Am I right in assuming that I can declare at the beginning of enemy's Action Phase that my character will act simultaneously with the enemy soldier, and thus my character can shoot him as soon as he'll try to enter the room?

2) If answer is "yes", what will happen if I declare my "overwatch shooting" intervene action, but enemy soldier won't appear at the doorway (GM has decided that NPC is escaping the site)? Will I be able to delay action again?
I want to believe I can, because it's kinda consistent: if my character will see that there's no target, he won't shoot and will stay at overwatch.

3) If I delay action till next Initiative Pass, but next Initiative substraction (-10) normally will leave me without Action Phase in following Initiative Pass, will I be able to accomplish my delayed action despite my Initiative Score has been exhausted?
I guess I won't: "A character can delay his action into the next Initiative Pass and be the first to act. He must still use his own Initiative Score to determine the Action Phases he has for the Combat Turn." (p. 161).
On the other hand, why not? Initiative substraction represents quickness and ability to accomplish multiple actions in a short period of time. But my character isn't trying to be quicker than he is, he's trying to accomplish only one action.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <05-25-14/1434:39>
((Wouldn't that question be better in its own topic first? Sounds like something other players and GMs can help you with, not something that requires official clarification.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <05-26-14/0322:38>
So..would Hero Lab count as Official Clarifications? If so:

1) Yes, the cost of internal Smart Links is just the price of the weapon.

2) The whole issue with Submersion being multiplicative is additive

anything else from the core rules to check through the Hero Lab as Rules Clarification Test?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <05-26-14/0415:25>
((See if they took the RCC stats errata into account that the German edition has?))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <05-26-14/1912:32>
((See if they took the RCC stats errata into account that the German edition has?))

I would need to know what that errata was, as I do not have the german edition(and do not speak
german, even if I did).

Cursory look: the numbers are the same, but it is System and Firewall, not Data Processing
and Firewall.

Also, it does allow programs, but has a limited suite it can use.
Encrypt, Signal Scrub, Tool Box, Virtual Machine, Armor, Biofeedback Filter, Guard, Shell, Sneak,
Wrapper + all the Autosofts.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <05-27-14/0229:06>
((That would be a mistake then. Aaron clarified they can run them all, the list just focuses on what's really useful.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Agonar on <06-02-14/1541:36>
Sacrifice Throw [Run & Gun p.125]
This technique seems to be missing some information.  It is an Interrupt Action, but doesn't list what you are interrupting by using it.  It also makes allusions to Throw Person, which is a simple action that can be used as an interrupt action (with details on when you can use it).

So, question is, is Sacrifice Throw meant to mimic Throw Person except in the specified results (prone at the end, instead of still standing)?  Should the Interrupt cost be the same as Throw Person, even though it leaves you prone and needing to stand up at some point?  Or, just what is it missing, and how does it work currently?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Mara on <06-03-14/0540:04>
On page 15 of the new Bullets and Bandaged PDF, there is a floating table on the pregnancy
quality, listing thresholds, damage amounts, and etiology and toxin types. No where around
it does anything reference using this chart or anything to do with the Pregnancy quality.

What is the purpose of this table?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Medicineman on <06-07-14/0013:25>
Can You specialize in Aimed shots (no matter what firearm and without taking a pos Qual. ) ?

with an aimed Dance
Medicineman
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Medicineman on <06-07-14/0026:04>
If a Rifle has no Burst Fire capacity (only SA ) what Skill do you use it for
is it Longarms or Automatics ?

HokaHow
Medicineman
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Medicineman on <06-07-14/0101:57>
is there a difference between Flechette Ammo that is used in Rifles and Shotgun Ammo used in Shotguns ?
 (except for Shotgun choke )

with a different Dance
Medicineman
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DigitalZombie on <06-07-14/0307:26>
If a Rifle has no Burst Fire capacity (only SA ) what Skill do you use it for
is it Longarms or Automatics ?

Well, there are 2 kinds of rifles in the core book. Assault rifles and sniper rifles. Assault rifles uses the automatics skill and sniper rifles uses the longarms skill.
In the core book, all assault rifles has burst fire cabability. Are there assualt rifles not capable of other firing modes than (SA)? even if so, by RAW and unless otherwise stated they would oddly enough still use the automatics skill.

Can You specialize in Aimed shots (no matter what firearm and without taking a pos Qual. ) ?

Well, I dont think you can "no matter what firearm" as in you cant take aimed shots once, and have it work for pistols, automatics, longarms and heavy weapons. I dont know if you can take Pistols (aimed shots)? its not as crazy as pistols (SA) or pilot ground(wheeled) so at my table Id likely allow it, but I have no rules to back it up.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Medicineman on <06-07-14/0336:53>
@ Aimed Shots I meant can i take
Pistole (Aimed Shot)
Automatics (Aimed Shot) and/or Longarms aimed Shot
or even Throwing (Aimed Shot)

Quote
Are there assualt rifles not capable of other firing modes than (SA)?
Yes f.E. the Rainforest Carbine

Hokahey
Medicineman
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Argyle on <06-14-14/1820:36>
I'm afraid I don't have anything to chime in on the current topic, but I'd like to ask a question that I haven't found a solid citation for in either SR4 or SR5.

Is it possible for a skillsoft (activesoft, knowsoft, linguasoft) to have a specialization in it?

I've seen a number of folks state that you can't have a specialization for a skillsoft, but I can't find a distinct citation for that in any book I've got. Is it just as simple as there not being rules for it? I sort of think that it makes more sense for a skillsoft to have a specialization, given that it's a muscle memory recording of a set of specific actions. I'm not sure why it shouldn't be allowed, but I also can't see a specific reference that it IS allowed. Any thoughts? Thanks!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tarislar on <06-15-14/1408:07>
Does Attribute Boost Strength affect Melee Damage?

Yes: It affects Dice Pools
No: It does Not affect Physical Limits
No: It does Not affect Initiative.

There are all of 2 skills attached to Strength, Running & Swimming.  Not exactly the high demand of Agility & its 17 skills.
  If it doesn't affect Melee Damage then, honestly, its a useless gimped ability that no one will ever take, IMHO.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sichr on <06-15-14/1602:28>
I'm afraid I don't have anything to chime in on the current topic, but I'd like to ask a question that I haven't found a solid citation for in either SR4 or SR5.

Is it possible for a skillsoft (activesoft, knowsoft, linguasoft) to have a specialization in it?

I've seen a number of folks state that you can't have a specialization for a skillsoft, but I can't find a distinct citation for that in any book I've got. Is it just as simple as there not being rules for it? I sort of think that it makes more sense for a skillsoft to have a specialization, given that it's a muscle memory recording of a set of specific actions. I'm not sure why it shouldn't be allowed, but I also can't see a specific reference that it IS allowed. Any thoughts? Thanks!

Specialization is treated as DP donus, not part of the skill.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shadowwalker on <06-19-14/1611:50>
Ok I have one
 (Step 4)Reckless Spellcasting and  (Step 1)Muliple Spell castings per Page 282
So for the sake of discussion

I can multi Cast two Spell Slicing my dice pool in 1/2 while reckless casting increasing the drain code by +3
 
then for my next simple action
I can multi Cast two Spell Slicing my dice pool in 1/2 while reckless casting increasing the drain code by +3
 
Please note I could cast these as a Lightning Bolt with a force 5
 
making this a Drain Code 5S for each casting of the Spell which I gain my full Drain resistence dice for at 4 targets
 
Is this also sound correct?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <06-19-14/1629:50>
Reckless Spellcasting doesn't allow you to cast offensive spells with both your Simple Actions - you're still limited by the "one attack action per turn" rule.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shadowwalker on <06-19-14/1635:46>
 So basically I could instead recklessly Multicast a Lightning Bolt and a Lightning Bolt then recklessly multicast Armor and Increase Reflexes. All in the same Phase just gotta watch the Drain
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Typhon on <06-19-14/1723:03>
Also, unless I misunderstand the multitargeting rules, but you'd also have to use your free action to select multiple targets, so you could:
Free Action - Multitarget two guards.
Simple Action - Reckless Cast a split lightning bolt on two guards
Simple Action - Armor or Increased Reflexes but not both because you used your multiple Targets Free action on the guards.

Again, I could be wrong if targeting yourself twice doesn't count for multiple targeting.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shadowwalker on <06-19-14/2109:50>
Well you are not changing targets so it should be fine
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: elrikthebastard on <06-23-14/1518:15>
Afternoon,

I haven't seen this question yet so either I read something wrong or I have to rerereread the magic section.
Enchanting objects. Old rules said that you could not enchant a bullet or an arrow. From what we are reading, you can now do that? My players are trying to figure out how to attach a fire/lightening bolt to above objects.

Has this changed, am I not reading it right?

Thank you.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <06-23-14/2323:32>
Afternoon,

I haven't seen this question yet so either I read something wrong or I have to rerereread the magic section.
Enchanting objects. Old rules said that you could not enchant a bullet or an arrow. From what we are reading, you can now do that? My players are trying to figure out how to attach a fire/lightening bolt to above objects.

Has this changed, am I not reading it right?

Thank you.

There are at least 6 multi page threads on this very issue, with no consensus on it. I would encourage you to read them and draw your own conclusion
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: elrikthebastard on <06-23-14/2340:12>
There are at least 6 multi page threads on this very issue, with no consensus on it. I would encourage you to read them and draw your own conclusion

Done. Thanks Reaver. I will figure out the search function.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: voydangel on <06-26-14/0154:34>
Where can I find said SR5 FAQ? or is it still being compiled from this thread (and other places) and isn't actually "out" yet?

Also, every time I ask anyone about their interpretation of the armor stacking/encumbrance rules from SR5p169, I get a different answer each time.
The group I'm playing with now (I'm not the GM for once!) is interpreting it as:
"Only the stacked armor part of your armor counts towards encumbrance" so if, for example, you are wearing base armor 8 (actioneer business clothes) with a STR of <whatever> then you are good to go with no enc.
But if that same person then grabs a helmet and riot shield (total extra stacked armor bonus = +8, total armor for soak rolls not counting AP = 16) they would then need to have a STR of at least 7 to get no penalties.
[due to at STR 6, your armor bonus (8) would then exceed your STR by 2 full points thereby resulting in a -1 to AGI and REA]
I like the way this seems to be working, but I am really curious if this is how the rules were intended. The section on armor encumbrance is very poorly written imho.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <06-26-14/0844:59>
The only time Str comes into the equation is when you're dealing with armor accessories (basically, things with a +X value).  So anyone can wear a Sleeping Tiger suit (armor rating 13), but if you're adding helmets, forearm guards, and a shield, you're going to need to check your Strength value vs. the total added value.  There is a small degree of disagreement (that is, only one guy I can think of) who thinks that the Custom Stack rules in Run & Gun do not use the armor accessory/Strength rules, but it seems like most people do.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Elektrycerze3 on <06-26-14/0852:40>
There is a small degree of disagreement (that is, only one guy I can think of) who thinks that the Custom Stack rules in Run & Gun do not use the armor accessory/Strength rules.

There are at least two of us =P
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <06-26-14/0854:23>
There is a small degree of disagreement (that is, only one guy I can think of) who thinks that the Custom Stack rules in Run & Gun do not use the armor accessory/Strength rules.

There are at least two of us =P

Haha!  I stand corrected  :D
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <06-26-14/0953:22>
I asked about it in the new FAQ topic, so we should get an answer in 2016.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: vizx on <06-26-14/1215:37>
Would hacking a maglock through Control Device require one mark or two? I don't think it's ever mentioned explicitly, but since Use Simple Device is a simple action I'd assume it would require two marks. Can anyone confirm?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: voydangel on <06-26-14/1411:31>
Working from the RAW, it states that skills now go up to 12 (13 with aptitude), but have a cap of 6 at character creation.
Quote from: SR5 pg 88
In character generation, the highest characters can raise a skill is 6 (7 if they purchase the Aptitude quality). After character generation, the highest rating a skill can hit is 12 (13 with the Aptitude quality).
Quote from: SR5 pg 129
The skill Rating is a numerical value ranging from 1, representing the most rudimentary skill, to 12 (or 13 with the Aptitude quality) representing the height of sentient achievement.

It also states somewhere that an augmented skill can only be 1.5x the base skill. So if you have a 6 in firearms, then the highest you can get your firearms is a 9 with augments.
(Or am i just remembering this from SR4 and getting my rules crossed? that's been happening a lot lately)
Now, for adepts that's easy: spend points on "improved ability". It happens to explicitly state the 1.5x rule in the description for this adept power as well.
But, for non-awakened, is there any way to get an augmented skill? Or are they all stuck at 12/13 while adepts get a 50% bonus over them? (and potentially almost a 100% bonus over them: see next line/question)
Also, does the +2 to unarmed from having a shark mentor count as augmentation? Or could a shark adept have an unarmed "base skill" of 22 (13 base (aptitude), +7 imp. ability (RAW states to round up), +2 shark)?

I am assuming specialization doesn't enter into this discussion since it would be added to the augmented skill after the fact in each of these scenarios, in a similar manner to smartlink.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DigitalZombie on <06-26-14/1428:36>
But, for non-awakened, is there any way to get an augmented skill? Or are they all stuck at 12/13 while adepts get a 50% bonus over them? (and potentially almost a 100% bonus over them: see next line/question)
Also, does the +2 to unarmed from having a shark mentor count as augmentation? Or could a shark adept have an unarmed "base skill" of 22 (13 base (aptitude), +7 imp. ability (RAW states to round up), +2 shark)?

I am assuming specialization doesn't enter into this discussion since it would be added to the augmented skill after the fact in each of these scenarios, in a similar manner to smartlink.

Reflex recorder, adds a bonus die, to a skill. I presume its an augmentation bonus. Alas, it doesnt stack with itself. So your shark adept could get a "base skill" of 23. I havent read anything about the mentor spirit bonus should be an augmentation bonus, I think its just an unnamed bonus.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Koshnek on <06-28-14/1829:46>
Edit: Meh. I overlooked the Touch-Only Attack update in Run & Gun. Sorry guys x.x. I assume the following is the correct order to attempt Neijia:

1) Perform a touch-only attack  for a complex action with a +2 dice pool modifier (you may use any melee combat skill you are equipped to use). It will do no damage (unless the weapon has a touch/contact vector), but you will be in contact on a success or tie. If you maintain contact you will be able to perform neijia during your next action phase. However, being in touch imposes a -2 dice pool penalty upon your character for the opposing character to clinch or grapple you.

2) Wait for your turn to come back. If you have 5 or more initiative, you may attempt to intercept the spirit if it attempts to move away from you. If you have 4 or less initiative, you watch as he backs up and smites you, laughing the whole way as you've just wasted an entire turn. Don't perform a touch attack if you can't follow through.

3) You may now attempt neijia for a complex action.

OK, I'm having the devil with this. Can I use the martial arts technique Neijia with my sword (or any other weapon)?  I think it works, it makes sense to me that it would work, and I don't see why the rules wouldn't allow it to work. However, I haven't came up with a definitive answer for myself.

Here is the full text, Ill requote the relevant bits as I go.

Quote from: p. 142 R&G Neijia (Complex Action)
Neijia means internal strength. It’s as close as a mundane can get to magical weaponry in fighting spirits. The technique focuses the spiritual and mental strength of the character in order to inflict damage to a Materialized spirit as an Attack of Will. It allows the character to perform a physical version of Astral Combat (p. 315, SR5) against Materialized spirits. The style of the attack is based on Tai Chi’s soft and fluid motion and mental discipline. The character must first make a successful Touch Attack against the spirit. This can include a Grapple or Clinch, but it also counts if the character has been Engulfed. Using only Willpower vs. Willpower as an attack, the character can impose Charisma + net hits in Stun Damage that the spirit must resist. This damage is not physical, so it cannot be used to take down wards or magical barriers. The character feels drained after making this attack, resisting Stun Damage equal to hits (not net hits) from the spirit defending against the attack. If they are a mage they resist Drain per their tradition; everyone else uses Willpower + Charisma.
-------
Quote from: p. 142 R&G
The character must first make a successful Touch Attack against the spirit. This can include a Grapple or Clinch, but it also counts if the character has been Engulfed. Using only Willpower vs. Willpower as an attack, the character can impose Charisma + net hits in Stun Damage that the spirit must resist.

Ok so, it says that you must first make a successful Touch Attack. Here are the rules for a Touch Only Attack.

Quote from: p. 187 SR5
If the intention of an attack is to simply make contact, whether to discharge a spell, plant a RFID tag, or just playing tag, than the attacker gains a +2 dice pool bonus. Additionally, if all that is needed is contact, the attacker and not the defender succeeds on a tie.

The description doesn't specify what kind of attack has to be made, and neither does it specify what type of dice pool bonus. I assume that is because of stun batons which would benefit greatly from this rule. If that is the case then wouldn't it work for other melee weapons too?

Note: Weapons would not work for touch spells. The emphasis is mine.

Quote from: p. 282 SR5
Some spells require you to Touch (T) the target-if the target is unwilling, you'll need to make an unarmed attack against the target (see Accuracy, p. 168).

However, I don't believe that precludes neijia working with weapons because there are also these bits. One is mostly fluff, the other isn't.

Quote from: p. 142 R&G
Neijia means internal strength. It’s as close as a mundane can get to magical weaponry in fighting spirits.
Quote from: p. 142 R&G
[Neijia] allows the character to perform a physical version of Astral Combat (p. 315, SR5) against Materialized spirits.

Astral Combat can be used with weapon foci. Neijia is as close as a mundane can get to magical weaponry and allows them to perform a physical version of Astral Combat. Astral combat with a weapon is similar to Neijia. The formula for Astral Combat with a Focus is below.

Quote from: p. 315 SR5
Astral attacks with a weapon focus are an Opposed Astral Combat + Willpower [Accuracy] v Intuition + Logic Test. Base Damage Value [is by weapon (using Charisma instead of Strength)]; add 1 to the DV per net hit on an attack.

And here is the forumla for performing an attack with Neijia.

Quote from: p. 142 R&G
The character must first make a successful Touch Attack against the spirit. This can include a Grapple or Clinch, but it also counts if the character has been Engulfed. Using only Willpower vs. Willpower as an attack, the character can impose Charisma + net hits in Stun Damage that the spirit must resist.

So you make an touch only attack.
Unarmed + Agi + 2[Phys] vs Rea + Int. If you succeed or tie, you make a Willpower vs Willpower test. If you succeed, deal Cha + net hits stun damage. He rolls his resist, then you resist drain.

Quote from: p. 142. R&G
The character feels drained after making this attack, resisting Stun Damage equal to hits (not net hits) from the spirit defending against the attack. If they are a mage they resist Drain per their tradition; everyone else uses Willpower + Charisma.

Is this in any way different from making a touch only attack with lets say Blades?
Blades + Agi + 2[Accuracy] vs Rea + Int. If you succeed or tie, you make a Willpower vs Willpower test. If you succeed, deal Cha + net hits stun damage. He rolls his resist, then you resist drain.

Also regardless of the ruling, am I correct in my understanding of how to use neijia? As in, you roll to see if you can touch the spirit, and then you roll for damage if you succeed or tie.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <06-28-14/2024:29>
OK, I'm having the devil with this. Can I use the martial arts technique Neijia with my sword (or any other weapon)?  I think it works, it makes sense to me that it would work, and I don't see why the rules wouldn't allow it to work. However, I haven't came up with a definitive answer for myself.

If you were at my table, I'd say yes weapons can be used for the Neijia touch attack.  This is simply because Touch attacks can use weapons - as you pointed out the stun baton falls into that category.

Also regardless of the ruling, am I correct in my understanding of how to use neijia? As in, you roll to see if you can touch the spirit, and then you roll for damage if you succeed or tie.

The odds are slim to none that we'll have an official ruling on this in any timeframe that is pertinent to you.  So I'd suggest talking to your GM and finding out his/her take on this.  After all, the GM's ruling is the only one that matters.

The only time that's not true is when you're playing in Missions - Missions GMs have to follow the precise wording of the book in all cases possible.  Therefore, there are some Missions FAQs that seek to answer questions like these for Missions-related games.  Often, the rulings in the Missions FAQ are made canon later in errata and such.  As a result, if you're looking for an answer that is semi-official, you'd be best off posing your question in the Missions FAQ questions thread.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Koshnek on <06-28-14/2033:59>
Thanks :p. I actually figured it out while you were making your post. I feel kinda retarded because its actually clearly stated in an expanded Touch-Only Attack update in R&G. I edit'd my post just before you made yours so people wouldn't have to read my huge wall of text. Thanks for the suggestion though!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Starsomava on <06-28-14/2042:40>
Does the Orthoskin Bioware add to your encumbrance like regular armor?  or is it an exemption like dermal plating cyberware?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Medicineman on <06-29-14/0125:01>
Does the Orthoskin Bioware add to your encumbrance like regular armor?  or is it an exemption like dermal plating cyberware?
Cybered Armor, no matter which one (Orthoskin,Dermal Plating, Cyberarm/Leg,Bone Lacing, etc) is generally without any encumberance

Hough !
Medicineman
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <06-30-14/2101:53>
Does the Orthoskin Bioware add to your encumbrance like regular armor?  or is it an exemption like dermal plating cyberware?

Side-Note for SR5 - there's no encumberance for regular armour.  Armour accessories, yes, but not for armour.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sternenwind on <07-01-14/1515:09>
Shadowrun Street Grimoire - S.137 - Greater Spirite Power

"As per the base type of the spirite"

7 little words, perfect to start a long and deep philosophical discussion about rules, man, spirits and magic. But for little me, who prefer clear and simple rules. Need some enlightenment, and asks -“What are the base spirit types?”

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <07-01-14/1648:28>
The spirit types from the core rulebook are the "base spirit types".

Spirit of Man
Spirit of Earth
Spirit of Water
Spirit of Fire
Spirit of Air
Spirit of Beasts
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sternenwind on <07-01-14/1745:58>
Are you saying that for great guardian, task and guidance spirit you can chose whatever "base spirit" greate power you want?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <07-01-14/1911:30>
No - that was my mistake.  You have the type of spirit, and you make it a great spirit.  If you're a hermetic summoning a combat (fire) spirit as a great form, then you summon a great form fire spirit.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: voydangel on <07-01-14/2354:43>
While we're on the topic of street grimoire and great spirits...

On Street Grimoire pg 137, the sidebar about greater spirit powers, it list the powers that various spirits would gain in the "great" form, such as storm for air spirits.
However, for guardian, guidance, and task spirits, it states "as per base type of spirit". However, after reading through the spirits chapter multiple times, I can't seem to find anywhere that it mentions which powers would be appropriate for those, not can i find anywhere where it mentions "base types" for those 3 spirit types.

Now, fluff wise I can understand that this because you could summon a task spirit to make some shoes, or summon one to build a house, however, I would assert that a shoe task and a house task are different sub-types and that all task spirits should have the same great form power based on their base type (Task), which would make their sub-type completely irrelevant. Which would in turn imply that the table on pg 137 is simply an errata candidate where someone forgot to replace the phrase "as per base type of spirit" with whatever power was supposed to be listed there.

Edit: Updated as errata.
This is per one of the developers, Giabralter:

Greater Spirit Powers:
Guardian: Shielding (SR5 p. 326)
Guidance: Psychometry (p. 119)
Task: Compulsion (SR5 p. 395)
Can we get a link or source or something? or was this you speaking to them IRL and we can take this as "official"?
Also, no offense intended by questioning your post, I know you're in contact with some people and all, I'm just looking for double confirmation.
It's a direct quote from a PM convo with Giabralter.
I can vouch for Giabralter ;-)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <07-02-14/0008:01>
Ahhhh, now I understand the confusion.  I apologize again - I thought that Sternenwind was asking what are the "base" types of spirits, and then asking what it means to summon a "great form" of a spirit.  I believe this is an issue caused by taking data from Street Magic and applying it in the new book without verifying integrity.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <07-02-14/0024:44>
Ahhhh, now I understand the confusion.  I apologize again - I thought that Sternenwind was asking what are the "base" types of spirits, and then asking what it means to summon a "great form" of a spirit.  I believe this is an issue caused by taking data from Street Magic and applying it in the new book without verifying integrity.

No, I don't think so. In Street Magic, Guardian and Task Great Forms both got Endowment, and Guidance got Astral Gateway. I have no idea where this 'as base spirit' thing came from. It seems to imply that Guardians, Guidance and Task spirits are modifications of other spirit types, but they aren't.

I assume this happened because they removed turning LOS into LOS(A) and increased Physical Attributes from the possible results of a Great From, and instead gave all Great Forms the ability to get Endowment and Astral Gateway (a choice I'm iffy on, frankly.) As a result, they were at a loss for what powers those spirits get, so....your guess is as good as ours.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <07-02-14/0110:03>
I assume this happened because they removed turning LOS into LOS(A) and increased Physical Attributes from the possible results of a Great From, and instead gave all Great Forms the ability to get Endowment and Astral Gateway (a choice I'm iffy on, frankly.) As a result, they were at a loss for what powers those spirits get, so....your guess is as good as ours.
This at least removes the issue with Great Form Spirits simultaneously engulfing the whole enemy squad, which would have been ridiculous with the upscaling of Engulf and especially Elemental Aura. On the other hand you nowadays can hardly recognize Great Form spirits anymore with no mentioned increase in size.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ryo on <07-02-14/0116:32>
I assume this happened because they removed turning LOS into LOS(A) and increased Physical Attributes from the possible results of a Great From, and instead gave all Great Forms the ability to get Endowment and Astral Gateway (a choice I'm iffy on, frankly.) As a result, they were at a loss for what powers those spirits get, so....your guess is as good as ours.
This at least removes the issue with Great Form Spirits simultaneously engulfing the whole enemy squad, which would have been ridiculous with the upscaling of Engulf and especially Elemental Aura. On the other hand you nowadays can hardly recognize Great Form spirits anymore with no mentioned increase in size.

Yeah, but that kind of thing is easily avoided by traditional "oh shit they have a mage, stop grouping up" tactics. I am way more hesitant and nervous about Endowment and Astral Gateway being handed out willy nilly. Right off the top of my head, I can already see a Great Form Plant spirit giving the entire party Regeneration. I'll take LOS(A) Engulf over that any day.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <07-02-14/0454:31>
Seems as if got their form of Sleep Regulator taken away with Sustenance only applying to the need for food/water.
Metabolic Control now allows to go longer without sleep, although I don't know in what way sleep is related to metabolism. And if you need to go without sleep, I can hardly imagine that you'd have the time to meditate to be able to go longer without sleep  :-\
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: voydangel on <07-02-14/2043:06>
I've seen it mentioned that as per RAW, you can use the free action to attack multiple targets and then using burst fire or FA or what have you, can then attack two different targets that are 180 degrees from each other (one in front of the shooter and one behind the shooter) as long as both targets are at medium range or the like.
This seems to not be what was intended by the rules, but due to lack of explicitly forbidding it, current RAW deems it acceptable.
Is this an oversight and the targets have to be within a certain number of meters of each other (like in previous editions where you had to spend bullets to walk the shot)?
Or is this "Working as intended" ?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Glimaash on <07-03-14/1329:25>
My question is does the full defense bonus continue to apply if the character makes an attack later in the combat turn.

"Full Defense:
... Dice gained from being on Full Defense
last for the entire Combat Turn."

So in the example on page 191, Wombat had a 26 initiative, does a full defense and a back for -15 so is down to initiative 11.
"As the Initiative Pass winds down (first pass) Wombat switches to
offense. He uses a Complex Action to make a melee attack
but decides to make it a Called Shot with his Free Action."
He is then attacked in the second pass.  Does he still benefit from the full defensive action or did "switch to the offense" negate the full defense bonus.  The full defense rule seems to indicate it last the whole turn regardless what action he takes later in the combat turn. 

Thanks, Glim
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <07-03-14/1443:35>
It lasts the entire turn, so he'd still benefit from it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: voydangel on <07-03-14/1550:34>
It lasts the entire turn, so he'd still benefit from it.
This is correct, the bonus he got to defense would last until he had to roll a new initiative score.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: vizx on <07-04-14/0822:06>
Does DocWagon "resuscitation" just refer to stabilizing characters who are in overflow damage?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: horngeek on <07-06-14/0219:30>
Out of interest/pedanticness/nitpicking... there's a mention of straitjackets in the Escape Artist table in the core rulebook, but they're mentioned nowhere else (in particular, not available to purchase).  Is that because they're something that was going to be on the equipment list, didn't get added but didn't get taken out of Escape Artist?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <07-06-14/1227:42>
Straitjackets don't serve a lot of purpose in the vast majority of SR games.  It seems like it should be easy enough to implement the restraints with the current systems.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tarislar on <07-07-14/2139:43>
Wondering about a couple items from Core & Run&Gun.

Lined Coat   (Pg.437)
Synthleather Duster   (Pg.437)
Synergist Business Line Longcoat  (Pg19)

What I'm wondering is, if the Duster & Synergist lines should provide the same Concealability -2 for hiding things beneath them as the Lined Coat does?

I mean, the basic concept is the same, Trenchcoat,  but only the Lined Coat specifically mentions hiding things underneath it.

Would this be an oversight & lack of fluff in the descriptions, or, are the other 2 just not intended to also be a long trenchcoat type item?

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <07-08-14/0106:51>
I think the Lined Coat gets its concealability from more than simply its length, actually.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tarislar on <07-08-14/1604:41>
I can see that being the case w/ thicker ballistic cloth hiding something by texture/feel.
But in that case all the armor types would get some type of bonus like a concealed holster.

The fluff for Lined Coat description specifically says hiding something under it.
To me that is the picture if every movie I've ever seen where a guy has a shotgun up against his leg w/ a long coat covering it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sir_Prometheus on <07-08-14/1657:42>
I was under the impression the Lined coat let you hide things mostly cuz of it's length, yes. 

I would personally rule most knee length or longer coat should get the same benefit.  Certain styles could be an exception cuz they were longer, tighter, whatever.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <07-09-14/0109:17>
I was under the impression the Lined coat let you hide things mostly cuz of it's length, yes. 

And I'm saying you can't assume that - between the factors in it's armour rating, and the fact that it's clearly multi-layered (the whole "Lined" part), it's pretty reasonable to conclude that there's more than just length at play here.

The Lined Coat was the only longcoat granting this benefit before, as well, so I would think at very least the intent is in fact clear.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: voydangel on <07-09-14/0343:54>
And I'm saying you can't assume that - between the factors in it's armour rating, and the fact that it's clearly multi-layered (the whole "Lined" part), it's pretty reasonable to conclude that there's more than just length at play here.

The Lined Coat was the only longcoat granting this benefit before, as well, so I would think at very least the intent is in fact clear.
I would have to agree with this
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tarislar on <07-09-14/1208:51>
Do you need anything beside Smart Link & Smart Gun to get the full benefits of that system ?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ve4grm on <07-09-14/1231:36>
Do you need anything beside Smart Link & Smart Gun to get the full benefits of that system ?

Either a commlink (to get all benefits) or a wire between the two (to just get the accuracy increase), but that's it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tarislar on <07-09-14/1602:52>
Either a commlink (to get all benefits) or a wire between the two (to just get the accuracy increase), but that's it.
Okay, thanks, I didn't realize that.
I thought a DNI gave you partial abilities (Magazine/Mode) but that the SGL itself gave you that & all the Accuracy & Dice benefits.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: voydangel on <07-09-14/1637:57>
I believe you could technically get all the benefits without a commlink, and you could use wireless to connect the SG directly to the SL so no cable would be needed either.

However, if you do that, you leave yourself WIDE open to getting both systems bricked by a hacker super easy mode since you have no master/slave set-up and no firewall anywhere. Really, everyone should have a commlink anyway, so just go with that, it's the easy and sensible way out of the "what do i need" dilemma.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ve4grm on <07-09-14/1642:25>
Either a commlink (to get all benefits) or a wire between the two (to just get the accuracy increase), but that's it.
Okay, thanks, I didn't realize that.
I thought a DNI gave you partial abilities (Magazine/Mode) but that the SGL itself gave you that & all the Accuracy & Dice benefits.

There are a few threads around clarifying this. I'm not sure I can do it justice here.

But yes, DNI with wireless (implants, trodes, etc) (or a wired connection) gives you magazine/mode stuff.
Smartlink gives you +accuracy stuff (needs to be used with the same wireless/wired connection, as they need to connect in some way).
And having the smartgun/smartlink have wireless on gives you the bonus dice on your attack roll and free-action clip eject/mode change.

There are arguments about some further details, but this seems pretty safe as a baseline.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tarislar on <07-10-14/1159:03>
I believe you could technically get all the benefits without a commlink, and you could use wireless to connect the SG directly to the SL so no cable would be needed either.

However, if you do that, you leave yourself WIDE open to getting both systems bricked by a hacker super easy mode since you have no master/slave set-up and no firewall anywhere. Really, everyone should have a commlink anyway, so just go with that, it's the easy and sensible way out of the "what do i need" dilemma.

Okay, that makes sense,  I get that Commlink = Good Protection,  I just wanted to know what you HAVE to have.

I didn't think you HAD to have Data Jack or Image Link since SmartLink+SmartGun gives you the "DNI" for that single item, or so I thought.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tarislar on <07-10-14/1202:21>
The Lined Coat was the only longcoat granting this benefit before, as well, so I would think at very least the intent is in fact clear.
Well the Argentum Line also does too, and that is, well, I guess a really big thick Extra-Lined version of the Lined Coat IIRC.
I just found it odd that Synergist didn't get the same since its also an armored long coat.  (or the Leather Duster if its a length issue)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <07-11-14/0156:53>
I think the layering does a lot to help; masks the shape of what's under the coat.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <07-11-14/0659:03>
I think concealability is a result of the cut of the fabric more than anything, based on the various attires that have the modifier and those that don't.

Armanté Suit/Dress; No modifier
Mortimer of London Berwick Suit/Dress; -2 modifier
Mortimer of London Crimson Sky Suit; -2 modifier
Mortimer of London Summit Suit/Dress; No modifier
Mortimer of London Greatcoat/Ulysses/Argentum; -3 modifier
Vashon Island Ace of Cups/Swords/Wands/Coins; No modifier
Vashon Island Ace of Spades/Clubs/Hearts; Holster (not specified if it's quickdraw, concealable, or concealable quickdraw)
Vashon Island Ace of Diamonds; +2 modifier (probably supposed to be a -2)
Vashon Island Steampunk; No modifier
Vashon Island Synergist Business Line; Concealed Holster (so only -2 for pistol sized items)
Vashon Island Synergist Business Line Longcoat; No modifier
Vashon Island Sleeping Tiger; Holster (not specified if it's quickdraw, concealable, or concealable quickdraw)
Zoé Executive Suite; No modifier
Zoé Heritage; No modifier
Zoé Nightshade/Moonsilver; No modifier
Zoé Second Skin; No modifier
Ares Victory Globetrotter Jacket; Holster (not specified if it's quickdraw, concealable, or concealable quickdraw)
Ares Victory Globetrotter Vest; No modifier
Ares Victory Globetrotter Clothing; No modifier
Ares Victory Wild Hunt; Holster (not specified if it's quickdraw, concealable, or concealable quickdraw)
Ares Victory Industrious; No modifier
Ares Victory Big Game Hunter; Holster (not specified if it's quickdraw, concealable, or concealable quickdraw)
Ares Victory Rapid Transit; No modifier

The interesting part is that there are three different ways of writing concealability modifiers in Run & Gun;
-2 modifier to Concealability
Concealability +2
Concealability (-6)

The first one refers to longcoats and suits, the second is likely a misprint unless the Ace of Diamons is supposed to make it harder to smuggle items, and the last one refers to the difficulty of spotting Form Fitting Body Armor underneath regular clothing.

There's also no rhyme or reason I can find as to which items provide a modifier and are also custom fit; I would have presumed that an item that is custom fit for you (i.e. tailored to fit your frame perfectly) would not have a lot of room to conceal items, but apparently this is not the case.

So, we're left with whatever's in the book, for better or worse. Houseruling it is a pretty simple solution if you ask me.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: voydangel on <07-11-14/1437:54>
Vashon Island Ace of Diamonds; +2 modifier (probably supposed to be a -2)
I actually just assumed it was a skin tight dress or super tailored suit so it left no room to hide anything. But the fluff description is totally neutral so now I'm thinking you may be right about the errata on this one...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Southpaw on <07-14-14/2255:25>
Do you need hands free to cast spells?

This is important; I need my dwarf to burn people's faces without needing to let go of his machine gun, Betsy.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <07-14-14/2301:53>
Do you need hands free to cast spells?

This is important; I need my dwarf to burn people's faces without needing to let go of his machine gun, Betsy.

No. No movement at all is required while casting a spell.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Southpaw on <07-15-14/1109:21>
Do you need hands free to cast spells?

This is important; I need my dwarf to burn people's faces without needing to let go of his machine gun, Betsy.

No. No movement at all is required while casting a spell.

Happy days!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <07-15-14/2003:11>
Do you need hands free to cast spells?

This is important; I need my dwarf to burn people's faces without needing to let go of his machine gun, Betsy.

No. No movement at all is required while casting a spell.

Though hand motions, chanting, and similar are embraced by many traditions, which make them common choices for centering.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sternenwind on <07-16-14/0644:11>
What is the combat pool for a rigger in a drone?
What is the defense pool against malice health spells?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <07-16-14/0745:56>
For attacks he'd use LOG+Gunnery, for defense I couldn't find anything that would deviate from the standard REA+INT test.

The only negative Health spell where they didn't spell out the defense is Decrease Inherent Limits. Each of the other spells states the appropriate defense.
For Decrease Inherent Limit it gets difficult. It would have been sensible (and in line with other spells), if the required Force was at least as high as the limit in question. Then a defense test of only one attribute with Counterspelling would have been enough.
So I think a defense test of including the leading attribute (STR, LOG or CHA) paired with BOD (for physical) or WIL (for mental and social) would be appropriate.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DMK on <07-18-14/1452:27>
I'm a big Adept fan, and I'm trying to wrap my head around Elemental Weapon & Elemental Strike. I'm just not sure how it works with armor protections.

If you use Elemental Strike: Electricity and your opponent has Nonconductivity 6, does he now have 6 more dice to defend against you then if you didn't use ES:S? As ES:S doesn't grant any Armor Piercing, wouldn't that just basically suck?

But if it doesn't do that, does it mean that the prepared Shadowrunner with Nonconductivity is now oddly vulnerable to the secondary effects of Electricity damage?

Elemental Body doesn't raise these concerns, as it has its own DV and a clearly defined AP value.

Any thoughts?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <07-21-14/0058:00>
Armor mods add in, if you are hit with elemental effects. So Nonconductivity would apply against Elemental Weapon/Strike [Electricity].
It's hard to tell what they really planned for these powers. In SR4 elemental effects automatically halved your armor. Maybe just an oversight, who knows.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <07-21-14/0915:52>
If you use Elemental Strike: Electricity and your opponent has Nonconductivity 6, does he now have 6 more dice to defend against you then if you didn't use ES:S? As ES:S doesn't grant any Armor Piercing, wouldn't that just basically suck?
You could pick an element people are less likely to have armor mods against - of course, running the risk of dealing 2 less damage on average might be worth the -5 hit to their Initiative Score and -1 to all their actions for a Combat Turn.

Semi-related: googling for what Elemental Strike did in 4th, I found a Dumpshock topic about how people thought it was incredibly overpowered for a 0.5PP power.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: vanishingpointe on <07-22-14/1448:58>
I've found rules for used (second-hand) cyberware and could have sworn I saw rules recently (Run and Gun?) for applying modifiers to cost and such for other used equipment. Am I misremembering? Does a ruling like this exist?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ve4grm on <07-22-14/1601:28>
I've found rules for used (second-hand) cyberware and could have sworn I saw rules recently (Run and Gun?) for applying modifiers to cost and such for other used equipment. Am I misremembering? Does a ruling like this exist?

Run and Gun has rules for getting Custom Fit armour used. Nothing else, I don't believe.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <07-23-14/1005:36>
Run & Gun has rules for stolen, counterfeit, and defective equipment. Page 197.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sternenwind on <07-24-14/0636:01>
Some questions about possession spirits in a living vessel.

Can possession spirits fly or defy gravity?
Have possession spirits immunity against natural weapons?
Are possession spirits affected by drugs and poison?
If a spirit possesses a living spirit, what happened with the spell on this vessel?
Will the possession of a living vessel cancel all spells on this vessel?
Can a spirit possess a shape changed vessel?
What is the Ini-modifier for possession spirits?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <07-24-14/0811:10>
Some questions about possession spirits in a living vessel.

1. Can possession spirits fly or defy gravity?
2. Have possession spirits immunity against natural weapons?
3. Are possession spirits affected by drugs and poison?
4. If a spirit possesses a living spirit, what happened with the spell on this vessel?
5. Will the possession of a living vessel cancel all spells on this vessel?
6. Can a spirit possess a shape changed vessel?
7. What is the Ini-modifier for possession spirits?

1. Depends on the aircraft or other tools they use.
2. No, Immunity is tied to Materialization.
3. Yes, since they are not immune.
4. What do you mean?
5. Increase Attribute spells may become redundant, but the possession itself does not dispel any spells.
6. It should be able to. You just have to be careful to adjust the attributes again when the spell is ended.
7. You calculate Initiative as given with Fx2 +modifier +2d6. An Increased Reaction from the possession thereby has no Influence on Initiative.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sternenwind on <07-24-14/0838:01>

...

1. Depends on the aircraft or other tools they use.
2. No, Immunity is tied to Materialization.
3. Yes, since they are not immune.
4. What do you mean?
5. Increase Attribute spells may become redundant, but the possession itself does not dispel any spells.
6. It should be able to. You just have to be careful to adjust the attributes again when the spell is ended.
7. You calculate Initiative as given with Fx2 +modifier +2d6. An Increased Reaction from the possession thereby has no Influence on Initiative.

The thing is … I, no we, cannot trust the Street Grimoire.

1.   It is spirit a ability. Possession does not say that spirits are losing it.
2.   They could just forget to add this sentence to possession.
3.   Yes, but do drugs work like they would on normal living beings?
4.   In 4 you created another being and with that every sustained spell broke.
5.   Yes and again it did in the past.
6.   No plan, but if the spell is not canceled how is it all work out with the “shapechange replace your body story*”?
7.   The Modifier in the book are bound to the physical attributes of the spirits in the book, but possession spirits have no fixed physical attribute. And, apparently, you can profit from passive enhancements of the vessel**.


*Cyber- and bioware vanish into the limbo
**Are synaptic booster passive?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <07-24-14/1247:15>
2. Have possession spirits immunity against natural weapons?

Are we certain there's not a rule that grants it?  Don't have Street Grimoire yet, but in SR4 it was in a sidebar - and that would be a pretty massive nerf...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sternenwind on <07-24-14/1329:20>
@RHat
There is no such rule, but we know this book is full of failure and thats why i ask.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <07-25-14/0058:28>
RHat, I also took a look at Street Magic when this question was first raised. And nothing in possession relates to that.

1. How was it in SR4? Since the part about not having any weight is more or less fluff text and not mentioned in any way for possession, why do you think a possessed being would somehow become weightless? I would approach it the other way: It's not stated that they keep this ability ;)

2. Of course they might have forgotten it. But who knows? They don't get it by RAW.

3. Are drugs supposed to work differently for paracritters? Drugs are toxins with both a positive and a negative effect. Since they don't make exceptions on what they can affect, you could feed some Kamikaze to a possessed being :)

4. Vessel+Spirit count as single dual-natured entity. The former beings don't cease to exist, they are merged. I don't think that physical spells would be ended, as they are cast at a physical representation, which does not change. I could understand that manaspells fizzle, because the targeted aura has changed. But I have no reference in the rules.
For the case of the vessel itself sustaining spells, I think they would end.

5. I didn't find anything related neither in the possession power nor in the sidebar of Street Magic. Your source?

6. Shapechange does not replace your body. It transforms it. Cyberware is not excluded from shapechange, so it would be unaccessible while shapechanged.

7. The modifiers are random. Fire should have +4 instead of +3, Man should have +3 instead of +2 and it gets even worse because Guardian has +1 instead of +3, Guidance has +0 instead of +2.
For Fire and Man it may be because their higher Intuition is not factored in, but both Guardian and Guidance spirits receive a higher bonus to their REAction than their Initiative bonus indicates.
That's why:
Quote
You calculate Initiative as given with Fx2 +modifier +2d6. An Increased Reaction from the possession thereby has no Influence on Initiative.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <07-25-14/0320:29>
RHat, I also took a look at Street Magic when this question was first raised. And nothing in possession relates to that.

Quote
When a spirit possesses a vessel, the com-bined being that results is dual-natured, has
Immunity to Normal Weapons (p. 289, SR4),
and boasts all of the spirit’s powers and skills.

Sidebar on page 102.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: T on <07-26-14/0906:22>
Quote
This power allows the critter to speed up or slow down the target’s movement rate. [...] If used only on the critter itself, this power can be used anywhere. The critter can multiply or divide the target’s movement rate by up to its Magic attribute.

I have a few questions regarding the Movement critter power. I didn't read the whole thread, but I searched it and I don't think those questions have been answered yet.

1- Does the Movement critter power only apply to the "walk rate" and "run rate"?

2- Does it also apply to the "sprint increase" (i.e. meters per hit)?

3- What about jumping? Does it multiply distances jumped too? My gut tells me that it should, but you could argue that the Movement power is more of a fast-forward you-don't-jump-any-farther-but-you-get-there-faster kind of thing than a regular-physics you-run-really-fast-so-you-jump-really-far kind of thing. Not sure which one is RAI.

4- What about falling damage? If you are falling 200 meters and are slowed down by a Force 8 Air Spirit, what kind of damage are you facing when you land? Do you divide the distance fallen by 8?

Thanks.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <07-28-14/0032:02>
Quote
When a spirit possesses a vessel, the com-bined being that results is dual-natured, has
Immunity to Normal Weapons (p. 289, SR4),
and boasts all of the spirit’s powers and skills.

Sidebar on page 102.
Yes ... I did say I looked at Street Magic, didn't I?
But there is nothing in Street Grimoire duplicating what we had in Street Magic.
Inhabitation has it spelled out, when they get/keep Immunity, so it looks more and more like a deliberate omission.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <07-28-14/0041:48>
Quote
When a spirit possesses a vessel, the com-bined being that results is dual-natured, has
Immunity to Normal Weapons (p. 289, SR4),
and boasts all of the spirit’s powers and skills.

Sidebar on page 102.
Yes ... I did say I looked at Street Magic, didn't I?
But there is nothing in Street Grimoire duplicating what we had in Street Magic.
Inhabitation has it spelled out, when they get/keep Immunity, so it looks more and more like a deliberate omission.
Quote
When a spirit possesses a vessel, the com-bined being that results is dual-natured, has
Immunity to Normal Weapons (p. 289, SR4),
and boasts all of the spirit’s powers and skills.

Sidebar on page 102.
Yes ... I did say I looked at Street Magic, didn't I?
But there is nothing in Street Grimoire duplicating what we had in Street Magic.
Inhabitation has it spelled out, when they get/keep Immunity, so it looks more and more like a deliberate omission.

I read your post as saying you didn't see it in Street Magic.

Seems like a bad omission if it is intentional, though.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sternenwind on <07-28-14/0225:06>
Spirits with materialize get immunity(SR5 S.398). Spirits with inhabitation in hybrid and flesh from get immunity. Heck spirits in hybrid form can even use neural interface and active cyberware “unlike possession spirits”(SR5 SG S.195ff).

To tell the true, from a balance point of view, I can, a little bit, understand why possession spirits lost their immunity. A guard, or channeling mage, possessed with an attribute boost and immunity in addition to his armor is a force of itself. But if that is the problem you could just say that immunity does not stack with worn armor.

Back to the other points; 4-6 is void. I must apologise for my hasty comment. I don’t know how I got these ideas. Probably read it in a thread, which I could not find anymore, got convinced and accepted it as solid fact. Most likely something the line that shapechange replaces your body with a generic one to explain the vanishing of cyberware, and that a possessed one is a new being and never was target this spell … stuff.

So 1 and 2, about flying and immunity is just a question about if the designer missed something, because again based on the quality of SG this would plausible.

1.   Did they miss to explain that the Spirit Movement in SR5 S.303 only concern materialization?
2.   Is the loss of immunity against natural weapon deliberately?
3.   Ok not immune, so they are affected. What is about hybrid and true from inhabitation spirits?
4-5 … ok
6. At this point I am just irritated. First I wanted to write how the initiative modifier for most of the spirits, match their reaction modifier. But then I notice that shadow spirits have an intuition modifier with a matching astral initiative*. And that that the initiative modifier does not include increased intuition for notshadow spirits. But for creatures of the unknown its reaction + intuition + 2D6 back again**+, or not+***.
Somehow the “that is not on purpose they are just ... “, … let’s say ‘absent-minded’, line finally start to stick on me. I think I am ready to buy it.

So the best is to just ignore this stuff until they published errata. And take the Initiative Attribute Chart in the Core Rulebook (SR5 S.159), adding follow sentence to spirits. “Spirits have the power advanced reflexes and receive 1D6 Initiative Die (to a maximum of 5D6). The increase count for the astral and physical plane and cannot be combined with other technological or magical increases to initiative”

*SR5 SG S.92 Shadowspirit
**SR5 SG S.100ff
***SR5 SG S.100 manananggal torso(while detached)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: voydangel on <07-30-14/2011:22>
On page 161 of SR5 it states:
Quote
A character’s movement for an entire Combat Turn
(meaning total movement for all Initiative Passes, not
for each Initiative Pass) is based on their Run rate, which
is determined by metatype.

This means that a person with a run rate of 20 could not move 21 meters in a single combat round (barring sprinting of course - we're not talking about sprinting here). That much is clear.

However, this also implies that a person who gets more than one pass in a combat round would have to "divide" their total running movement in a combat round across each of their passes in that round since they don't get their full running move rate on each pass.
Is this correct?

Or could a person with a move of 20 and 4 initiative passes in a single round move the full 20 meters on their first pass and then just not move any more for the rest of the current combat round?

There seems to be a lot of community support for the latter interpretation due to a lack of the RAW explicitly declaring that the move rate must be "divided". People seem to think that since the RAW doesn't use that exact word ("divide") that you don't have to, so I would really appreciate it if we could get something more "official" on this to settle the debate.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MadBear on <07-30-14/2041:31>
The problem here, as I see it, is that interpreting the rules one way you can 'teleport' your 20 meters in one initiative pass, and are then stuck standing still the rest of the turn(unless you then decide to sprint); but interpreting the rules the other way so a wired Sam with 4 passes moves 5 meters per pass you can have a mook with only one initiative pass move his, lets say 12 meters all at once, thereby 'teleporting'. It's a lose/lose scenario. Someone's gonna be pissed with the outcome no matter what.
Which is why I like the DnD 3.5 method, where you spend a Simple Action to move your AGL in meters. You can spend both Simple Actions to move double your AGL, or can still run. But moving 20 or 24 or even 32 meters in an initiative pass, that makes no sense to me at all. But that's a separate topic.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <07-30-14/2111:26>
There seems to be a lot of community support for the latter interpretation due to a lack of the RAW explicitly declaring that the move rate must be "divided". People seem to think that since the RAW doesn't use that exact word ("divide") that you don't have to, so I would really appreciate it if we could get something more "official" on this to settle the debate.

The only thing "official" at this point is the main book, which does not specify the need for dividing your movement between Initiative Passes.  Adding the interpretation of dividing movement is not RAW.  There is no need to settle this debate, as there shouldn't be a debate about what is clearly not written in the book.  Perhaps this is something worth submitting as errata, but asking for official interpretation of a clearly-written section of the book isn't going to get an official response.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: voydangel on <07-31-14/0611:51>
I disagree that it is clearly written, so therein lies the issue.

You say that "adding the interpretation of dividing movement" is not RAW.
I say that "adding the interpretation that you can move your entire move rate in a single pass when it clearly states that movement is over the entire combat round" is not RAW.

The issue here is that RAW doesn't give any info or examples on how movement should work when the character gets more than 1 initiative pass. I don't think it's too much to ask for someone to clarify this. All it would take is a "yes you can move your entire running move rate in a single initiative pass, but then you (obviously) can't move for the rest of the combat round" or a "no, you can't do that".

I'm sorry if you are annoyed at this particular rules question for whatever reason, but I don't think I should get shot down so harshly for asking for a rules clarification in the rules clarification thread. :P
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <07-31-14/0759:16>
Unlike in 4th, the amount of Initiative Passes you get isn't set in stone - Interrupt actions, wound modifiers, electricity, spells and dispelling can all change how many Initiative Passes you get in a Combat Turn while the Combat Turn is already in progress. The rules do not support dividing your movement alottance if you have more than 1 Initiative Pass, and doing so would cause more issues than it solves, which is why houserule proposals use a constant number of Initiative Passes to split movement over regardless of how many Initiative Passes you actually get.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <07-31-14/0941:55>
Quote from: SR5, page 161
A character’s movement for an entire Combat Turn (meaning total movement for all Initiative Passes, not for each Initiative Pass) is based on their Run rate, which is determined by metatype.

This is RAW.  It is absolutely RAW, because anyone can pull it up and read this exact quote.  There is nothing in this sentence, or any of the sentences that precede or follow it, that talk about movement being broken up by Initiative Pass.  So there is no need for clarification of RAW.  What you're looking for is clarification of RAI, which is (to paraphrase your signature) "Rules as Imagined" unless a developer chimes in on it.  Therefore, your request isn't for clarification, it's for errata.

The issue here is that RAW doesn't give any info or examples on how movement should work when the character gets more than 1 initiative pass. I don't think it's too much to ask for someone to clarify this. All it would take is a "yes you can move your entire running move rate in a single initiative pass, but then you (obviously) can't move for the rest of the combat round" or a "no, you can't do that".

There is an example given in which Wombat and Caster move over the course of multiple Initiative Passes.

Quote from: SR5, page 162
Wombat wants to take a quick shot and bolt for the next piece of cover. He declares his actions and fires while moving for cover 8 meters away. He has an Agility of 5, making his Walk Rate 10 meters. He makes the cover and would be considered walking on this Action Phase.
If the same cover was 11 meters away, Wombat would be considered running. On his next Action Phase Wombat can only move 2 meters before he is considered Running. His Run Rate is 20 meters, meaning he has 12 meters of movement left for the Combat Turn before he has to Sprint.
Caster, a dwarf with Agility 3, is going right after Wombat and wants to blast a guard with a quick spell while moving into cover with Wombat. Since the cover is 8 meters away and Caster’s Walking rate is 6, he is considered Running. On any subsequent Initiative Passes in this Combat Turn, Caster is still considered to be Running even if he doesn’t cover any more ground. He can only move another 4 meters. This Combat Turn before he has to Sprint.

So there's the clarification you requested.  As far as being shot down "harshly," I apologize for not being overly apologetic or polite in my phrasing.  I am trying to be matter-of-fact about this instead.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: voydangel on <07-31-14/1817:25>
So, even in the example, the characters both split their movement over multiple passes, further validating my point.
And it fails to specify whether or not 'Wombat' could move his full 20 meters in his first pass if he wanted, also further validating the need for clarification and/or a more thorough example.

You've voiced your opinion, I've voiced mine, we both understand each others point of view, and yet we disagree. Which is kind of the whole point of this thread right?

You could be right, but you could also be wrong, which is why I would like a clarification. The fact that you are sure that "you are right" and "I am wrong" doesn't invalidate my question/request.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <07-31-14/1839:35>
So, even in the example, the characters both split their movement over multiple passes, further validating my point.
And it fails to specify whether or not 'Wombat' could move his full 20 meters in his first pass if he wanted, also further validating the need for clarification and/or a more thorough example.
Actually, the example has someone with 2 IPs who is totally allowed to move more than 10m (their Running Rate of 20m divided by 2) in their first IP without having to Sprint - this contradicts your point, it doesn't validate it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ve4grm on <07-31-14/1841:52>
So, even in the example, the characters both split their movement over multiple passes, further validating my point.
And it fails to specify whether or not 'Wombat' could move his full 20 meters in his first pass if he wanted, also further validating the need for clarification and/or a more thorough example.

You've voiced your opinion, I've voiced mine, we both understand each others point of view, and yet we disagree. Which is kind of the whole point of this thread right?

You could be right, but you could also be wrong, which is why I would like a clarification. The fact that you are sure that "you are right" and "I am wrong" doesn't invalidate my question/request.

Unfortunately, Namikaze is correct in this.

In the example, you are correct to say that neither character moves their full movement speed in one initiative pass. However, both of them move (or are said to be able to move) over half of their total run rate in a single pass (causing them to be running during the first initiative pass). If they had had to divide their movement equally between initiative passes, this would be impossible.

For example: Caster, the dwarf, has a walk speed of 6, and run speed of 12. He has (at least) two initiative passes (implied in the example).

Since his max speed without sprinting is 12, that would mean he couldn't move more than 6 during each initiative pass (at least without sprinting). The example allows him to move 8 with no checks during a single initiative pass, and only mentions making a sprint roll is the 12 is exceeded for the entire combat turn.

This means one of two things. Either:
1) Your movement is per combat turn, and you are not required to divide it, or
2) You are required to divide it, but not equally.

If it's number 2, they would have to explain that somewhere, which they do not. There is no indication how to divide your movement, except that it obviously doesn't have to be equal between initiative passes because you can exceed half during a given pass. You could rule that you have to save at least 1m for each pass, I guess, but that would still end up with situations where you "teleport" 21m on IP#1, then move 1m for each of your next three IPs.

Add to this the fact that every reference in the example is to movement distance per combat turn:
Quote
"he has 12 meters of movement left for the Combat Turn"
and it's pretty clear that the correct answer is #1 above: Movement is per combat turn, spend it however you like. This may indeed leave you "stuck" unless you make a Running check.

So yeah, I'm sorry, voydangel, but Namikaze is correct here.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <07-31-14/1846:24>
Unfortunately, Namikaze is correct in this.
*snip*
So yeah, I'm sorry, voydangel, but Namikaze is correct here.

I've never been so sad to be so right.   :'(
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ve4grm on <07-31-14/1849:46>
Unfortunately, Namikaze is correct in this.
*snip*
So yeah, I'm sorry, voydangel, but Namikaze is correct here.

I've never been so sad to be so right.   :'(

Hey, don't mind me. I'm Canadian. I can't disappoint someone without apologizing. :)

Also, to voydangel, it should be noted that Namikaze is part of the Catalyst Demo Team (which I hadn't noticed earlier). They're probably the most official answers you're going to get here, most of the time.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <07-31-14/1936:22>
Also, to voydangel, it should be noted that Namikaze is part of the Catalyst Demo Team (which I hadn't noticed earlier). They're probably the most official answers you're going to get here, most of the time.
Actually, Demo Team is just a shiny badge for people who GM 'official' Shadowrun games - it doesn't make them part of Catalyst, or the development process. You're thinking of freelancers.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: voydangel on <07-31-14/2056:11>
I'm fully aware of Nami's status and what it means, I have a number of RL friends who are in that club, and I would be too if I had more extra time and money to devote to it. He and I have had many good conversations in the past about rules and getting clarifications & what not. I have no ill will towards him as a general rule, I was merely feeling a little affronted at the confrontational tone of his posts regarding this matter.

That is a very good point about the dwarf with a run rate of 12 moving 8 meters in a round, and normally that would be all the proof I need, except that it doesn't explicitly state anywhere in the example that he has 2 initiative passes. It states the at wombat has two, but doesn't give us an initiative score for the dwarf. And, I'm sorry to say, implication does not equal RAW.

Don't get me wrong - at this point I'm more or less fully convinced that Nami is correct as well. I'm not trying to get an errata to change this to being divided, and I'm not arguing that I'm correct... I simply want this clarified to make sure that this interpretation is indeed the correct one due to the lack of specificity in the RAW and the example given.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ve4grm on <07-31-14/2218:59>
That is a very good point about the dwarf with a run rate of 12 moving 8 meters in a round, and normally that would be all the proof I need, except that it doesn't explicitly state anywhere in the example that he has 2 initiative passes. It states the at wombat has two, but doesn't give us an initiative score for the dwarf. And, I'm sorry to say, implication does not equal RAW.

Fine. Then look at Wombat, who is said to be able to move 11 if the cover had been further away, and explicitly has two IPs.

As far as I'm concerned, the book is pretty explicit about this issue.

Also, to voydangel, it should be noted that Namikaze is part of the Catalyst Demo Team (which I hadn't noticed earlier). They're probably the most official answers you're going to get here, most of the time.
Actually, Demo Team is just a shiny badge for people who GM 'official' Shadowrun games - it doesn't make them part of Catalyst, or the development process. You're thinking of freelancers.

I know, and I know freelancers come around sometimes as well. All I meant was that Demo Team are a good resource for how something would be run in an "official" game, making them the most frequent source of "official-ish" feedback we get around here.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <08-01-14/0049:40>
I think the last OFFICIAL, official reply was over 6 months ago...

Rule of 3 is a good rule of thumb....

Get 3 good replies to a issue: chances are its pretty close to the way things work... at least mission wise.

And if you are not running missions, then do what you feel is best for your group. After all, its just your group. No harm done....As long as the rule is applied across the board...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: aaron_1706 on <08-09-14/0649:27>
Questions about channeling.

Page 148 SG:

  Treat channeling the same as if the spirit has the Possession power (p. 197), with a few exceptions:

      • The magician can use her own skills and has motor
      control over her body.

      • She may relinquish control of her body to the
      spirit, but at the cost of a service.



How does this effect using the skills of the spirit?  Is it 1 service to be able to relinquish control any time you want so that spirit will handle a task?  Is it 1 service to relinquish control for a single use of a skill?



      • The magician can use the powers of the spirit,
      but at the cost of a service.

1 Service for unlimited use of the spirit's powers?  Or 1 service for 1 use?


      • Because two minds inhabit this same body,
      Mana spells or powers are resisted by the lowest
      Mental attribute of the two. Damage from
      Mana spells or powers is applied to both (no
      free rides).


Do you use the magician's or the spirit's stats for resisting drain?  In other words, does drain count as resisting a mana spell or is it its own thing?

Physical attributes are increased by half the spirit’s Force Page 197 SG

There is not a mention of this being a stat augmentation or the augmentation limit applying.  Are these physical attribute increases considered augmenting, and therefore limited to the +4 limit, or not?

the spirit’s Mental and Special attributes are used, Page 197 SG


This also seems to indicate that augmentation is not occurring, but rather new stats are being generated, and also lacks a mention of the augmentation limit.  Are these stat increases subject to the +4 limit?

And lastly, does the Concealment critter power effect perception tests to notice magic?


Thanks for reading.
     
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sternenwind on <08-11-14/1617:48>
Character A has an initiative score of X, the reaction B cost Y initiative.
If 0 < X < Y , can A use reaction B?
If X < 1 and X < Y , can A use reaction B?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <08-12-14/0230:04>
You can only use Full Defense, if you have at least 10 initiative left. For Dodge/Block/Parry you need 5 initiative.

p. 167 CRB:
When a character uses an Interrupt Action, such as Full Defense, he takes an action out of turn, but only if he has enough Initiative Score left in the Combat Turn to pay the price for the action.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <08-12-14/0249:25>
Questions about channeling.

Page 148 SG:

  Treat channeling the same as if the spirit has the Possession power (p. 197), with a few exceptions:
      • The magician can use her own skills and has motor
      control over her body.
      • She may relinquish control of her body to the
      spirit, but at the cost of a service.


How does this effect using the skills of the spirit?  Is it 1 service to be able to relinquish control any time you want so that spirit will handle a task?  Is it 1 service to relinquish control for a single use of a skill?
Each use of the spirit's skills would be one service per task. Which would fall under "relinquish control".

Quote

      • The magician can use the powers of the spirit,
      but at the cost of a service.

1 Service for unlimited use of the spirit's powers?  Or 1 service for 1 use?
What would you expect to be reasonable? ;)
It's similar to normal spirit rules, so 1 service per use.

Quote

      • Because two minds inhabit this same body,
      Mana spells or powers are resisted by the lowest
      Mental attribute of the two. Damage from
      Mana spells or powers is applied to both (no
      free rides).

Do you use the magician's or the spirit's stats for resisting drain?  In other words, does drain count as resisting a mana spell or is it its own thing?
Drain is not included, so each creature uses its own attributes for resisting drain (Spirit of Man casts -> spirit's attributes; magician casts -> magician's attributes)

Quote
Physical attributes are increased by half the spirit’s Force Page 197 SG

There is not a mention of this being a stat augmentation or the augmentation limit applying.  Are these physical attribute increases considered augmenting, and therefore limited to the +4 limit, or not?

the spirit’s Mental and Special attributes are used, Page 197 SG


This also seems to indicate that augmentation is not occurring, but rather new stats are being generated, and also lacks a mention of the augmentation limit.  Are these stat increases subject to the +4 limit?

No limit mentioned -> no limit applied. The term "augmentation" is used for 'ware. Spells and magical powers mention limits when applicable.

Quote
And lastly, does the Concealment critter power effect perception tests to notice magic?
Indirectly, as it makes you harder to be detected. They will see the Fireball, but might not know who threw it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: aaron_1706 on <08-13-14/0223:32>
Hey Lucean, thanks for the Reply.  The only thing I guess I would disagree with is the notion that different drain rules apply depending on who is casting the spell.  The rules clearly stats that the spirit's mental stats are used, with the only exception being that

      • Because two minds inhabit this same body,
      Mana spells or powers are resisted by the lowest
      Mental attribute of the two. Damage from
      Mana spells or powers is applied to both (no
      free rides).


If that exception above does not apply to drain, then the rule should be "the spirit’s Mental and Special attributes are used" Page 197 SG, in my opinion.


Cheers.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <08-13-14/0255:15>
With possession you have the spirit pushing the original owner of the body into the backseat, tying it up and having it watch.
A channeling mage can be active, he can use his skills, his abilities, his knowledge.
I can understand your argument from a RAW perspective, but I'd suggest using the attributes of the acting entity as that should IMHO be RAI.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Yinan on <08-18-14/0900:11>
I saw that several people here said that if the current Noise level is above the Device Rating of a Device, that Device can't access the Matrix anymore.

Does it say so anywhere in the rules? Because I couldn't find something like that.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: martinchaen on <08-18-14/1029:31>
Yinan,

Technically, the rule states that the device loses it's Wireless Bonus. A developer has confirmed this, so per the rules you can still make calls with your commcode as this is not a "wireless bonus".
Quote from: SR5 p421
If there is a Noise Rating from a situation that is greater than the item’s Device Rating, not including distance, the item temporarily loses its wireless functionality (see Noise, p. 230).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shrazkil on <08-18-14/1540:34>
I'm new to the forums, and largely to shadowrun, so forgive me for asking duplicated questions, searched around a bit, but didn't find much i was looking for.

So here are my questions, largely pertaining to character creation.

1) Are you able to use starting karma points to gain a level of magic initiation? Also, can you use leftover karma at creation  to increase an ability under the normal rules for advancement (if i have 20 extra karma points, could i raise edge from 3 to 4).

2)If an adept increases magic to 7 at creation, do they get all 7 power points?

3)If an adept looses 1 point of essence/magic , they are required to sell back the equivilent power points, can you sell back the free active ability granted from option b/c adept.

4)Can the adept ability increase (1pp) version increase an ability above the +4 level, for instance if i had adept wired reflex 3 equivelent, could i also increase reaction further through the ability increase.

Thanks in advance for any help!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Malevolence on <08-18-14/1554:40>
1. Other than as a house rule, no.
2. Yes.
3. If you take cyberware during character creation, you just lose the Magic and the associated power point. The active skill granted is not tied to your magic attribute and so is not affected. You don't "sell" the magic point/PP back, you simply lose it.
4. No, Improved Physical Attribute is restricted to the normal +4 limit in its own description (core p 309): "This power allows you to exceed your natural Attribute maximum, up to your aug- mented maximum." In other words, if you were human (max natural attribute of 6) and had reaction of 3, then took Improved Reflexes of 3 (thus raising Reaction to 6 - the human max), you could take a point of Improved Physical Attribute [Reaction] to raise your Reaction to 7, but you could not raise it higher than that. If you raised your base Reaction to 4, your augmented Reaction would become 8 without any change to your Adept powers, but still could not be raised beyond that 8 since it is at the +4 max.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-18-14/1622:43>
1) Initiating no, raising attributes yes (since page 98 mentions the only-one-mental/physical-attribute-hardcapped rule still applies when spending karma).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shrazkil on <08-18-14/1650:04>
Thanks!

Also, for initiative level for adepts, one of the metamagics available are to gain a power point.

So if i were to become a level 1 initiative , and gain a power point, but NOT increase the corresponding magic rating yet, would i still get the power point, because i thought it read you cannot have more power points then your magic rating.

Follow up, when i do raise that magic point, does it also provide a power point?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Malevolence on <08-18-14/1722:41>
Yes, if you take the PP during initiation, you can have 8 PP while still having 7 magic (assuming we are still using your Magic 7 adept in the examples). You are only limited to Magic rating or fewer PP in char gen.
If you then raise your  magic rating to the new cap, you would have 9 PP and 8 magic.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-18-14/1813:31>
So if i were to become a level 1 initiative , and gain a power point, but NOT increase the corresponding magic rating yet, would i still get the power point, because i thought it read you cannot have more power points then your magic rating.
I don't think there's a restriction like that, actually - Mystic Adepts can only buy Power Points with Karma up to their Magic rating at chargen, and the maximum rank you can get in adept powers is equal to your Magic, but there's no direct restriction on how many Power Points you can have (otherwise the Power Point metamagic would only be usable by Mystic Adepts).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Yinan on <08-22-14/0759:28>
I have some questions regarding Agents on Cyberdecks:

When running, an Agent occupies one program slot, has it's own Persona and Icon, shares the Matrix condition-Box of the Deck and can use the programs runnin on that Deck.

1. Can you have several Agents of the same Rating run on ther Cyberdeck?
It states you each Agent occupies one slot, which suggest you can run several. the question is if they have to be of a different rating or if they can be the same.

2. Can you copy Agents?
So can I only buy 1 Rating 6 Agent and copy that one 5 times to get the maximum amount of Agents to run on my Deck (as long as I can run several of them, see question 1).

3. Do they have their own Overwatch Score?
Since they have their Own Persona and their own Icon, I would think so. On the other hand, they run on the same device.


Unfortunately I cant find anything in the rules regarding these questions, so maybe someone here knows more?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shrazkil on <08-27-14/2043:10>
For the adept power "improved reflexes" are you able to upgrade it?

If i start out with level 2, can i upgrade it later with 1 more PP to raise it to level 3?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <08-27-14/2108:22>
For the adept power "improved reflexes" are you able to upgrade it?

If i start out with level 2, can i upgrade it later with 1 more PP to raise it to level 3?

Absolutely!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <08-28-14/1020:28>
You can also get a Force 4 Improved Reflexes L1 Qi Focus, if you want, and use that.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shrazkil on <08-28-14/1847:23>
You can also get a Force 4 Improved Reflexes L1 Qi Focus, if you want, and use that.

Interesting, thank you.

With how incompatable cyber/bioware is to upgrade i figured it would have been stricter. Very good to know!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: leoric on <08-30-14/0614:30>
Is there a limit associated with an Object Resistance test? Maybe the Device rating?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Yinan on <08-30-14/0620:26>
Nearly no defense test has a limit (as far as I can tell, there is no defense test that has a limit), so no, there is no limit for an Object Resistance test.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: MisterNix on <08-31-14/1350:08>
Is there a limit associated with an Object Resistance test? Maybe the Device rating?
Nearly no defense test has a limit (as far as I can tell, there is no defense test that has a limit), so no, there is no limit for an Object Resistance test.
The only time limits apply is when you're using a skill. Most defense tests only use stats, and device ratings/object resistance ratings aren't skills - thus no limit.

The only times in defensive tests I can think of that limits start applying is with qualities like Acrobatic Defender which lets you use gymnastics rather than willpower - making it a skill test, and thus applying your physical limit.

So no - there are no limits on Object Resistance, hacking defense, summoning/compiling resistance etc unless some other rule also adds in a skill.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shrazkil on <08-31-14/2335:39>
Do trolls have to pay 100% increased cost to foci , or just worn equipment/cyber/lifestyle?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <09-01-14/0111:56>
Do trolls have to pay 100% increased cost to foci , or just worn equipment/cyber/lifestyle?

This is covered in the errata.  Trolls and dwarves do not pay increased cost for any equipment, only for lifestyle costs.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shrazkil on <09-01-14/1112:36>
Do trolls have to pay 100% increased cost to foci , or just worn equipment/cyber/lifestyle?

This is covered in the errata.  Trolls and dwarves do not pay increased cost for any equipment, only for lifestyle costs.
Thanks Namikaze, i totally misunderstood the Errata then.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shrazkil on <09-01-14/1438:47>
Can you stack the adept power combat sense and the spell together? Say I have 7 combat sense and 7 magic, would a force 4 spell with 4 hits add to my defense pool?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <09-02-14/0053:56>
Can you stack the adept power combat sense and the spell together? Say I have 7 combat sense and 7 magic, would a force 4 spell with 4 hits add to my defense pool?

Nothing in RAW explicitly forbids it, but I wouldn't allow it at my table.  Too unbalancing.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ursus Maior on <09-07-14/0641:06>
Question from my last game session, does anyone have clue?

Our Technomancer tried to get into a host of a diner and access the cameras. In my (gamemaster) idea the host was running without on-site human support, i.e. the diner contracted its host's security to a local matrix security service to save money.

Now, at what point do you use the host's attributes to defend and at what point does the spider come into play? I wanted the spider to come into play as late as possible (or not at all), because the hack was not part of the main plot, but "a good idea" of the player to advance the story line.

The TM's player was of the oppinion that the spider had to have programmed the host (set the ports, installed the architecture etc.), so his attributes were relevant for defense (especially Willpower + firewall). Is that the case?

My reason for asking is mainly that it would force me to think about who is in charge of a host and what his Willpower might be for every hack the players try to accomplish. Instead of simply designing the host (or taking one from the shelf), I would now have to design an appropriate spider/decker as well.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Yinan on <09-07-14/0857:34>
A Host aloways defends itself with Host Rating + Matrix Attribute, which is based on the Host Rating (Its HR +0, HR +1, HR +2, HR +3 for the 4 Attributes).
The Spider doesn't change anything with that.

So if the Technomancer wanted to hack into the Host (let's say Rating 4 and with Sleaze/Firewall of 6/7), the Host would defend with 4 + 6 = 10 Dice against any Matrix Perception tests to spot it (if it was running silent, which it should) and 4 + 7 = 11 Dice against Hack on the Fly.
The Spider doesn't change anything here, he doesn't affect the Host at all with his attributes.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Malevolence on <09-07-14/1253:08>
Question from my last game session, does anyone have clue?
No.

Oh, that wasn't the question? :p

In addition to what Yinan said, the Spider only shows up after the TM does something that alerts the host to his illegal presence. If he's throwing arround Attack actions, this will happen early, but if he is using Sleaze and not failing, the host may never know he is/was there.

Once the alarm is tripped, the arrival of the Spider is really up to GM fiat. He could be sitting on the toilet and have to pinch it off before checking in, or he could be primed and ready and simply need to issue a mental command to enter the host, so you can have him enter based on a dice roll, or just have it happen when you think the TM has overstayed his welcome (already got the information you think he should have and don't feel like letting him keep listening in).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ursus Maior on <09-07-14/1800:50>
Great guys, that was my interpretation of the rules as well. Just need to convince him now...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ursus Maior on <09-07-14/1856:33>
But, errr wait, what about SR5 page 237? It states:

Quote
When a defense test calls for a Mental attribute, use the owner’s rating. Even if she isn’t currently defending or even interacting with the device, her previous interactions and settings affect the defense test.

So, whenever I do not use Mental attributes, I use Matrix attributes?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <09-07-14/1858:08>
Great guys, that was my interpretation of the rules as well. Just need to convince him now...

That's what 'print screen' is for :D
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <09-08-14/0101:00>
But, errr wait, what about SR5 page 237? It states:

Quote
When a defense test calls for a Mental attribute, use the owner’s rating. Even if she isn’t currently defending or even interacting with the device, her previous interactions and settings affect the defense test.

So, whenever I do not use Mental attributes, I use Matrix attributes?

That quote is referring to a device that is unattended.  It's saying that even an unattended device gets the benefits (or penalties) associated with the last person to use the device.  Some have taken the sentence to mean that a person with high mental attributes should touch everyone's commlink before starting a run, but I think that's a bit too much metagaming.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Malevolence on <09-08-14/0235:04>
But, errr wait, what about SR5 page 237? It states:

Quote
When a defense test calls for a Mental attribute, use the owner’s rating. Even if she isn’t currently defending or even interacting with the device, her previous interactions and settings affect the defense test.

So, whenever I do not use Mental attributes, I use Matrix attributes?
The spider is not the owner of the host - he is an employee (or contractor) of the company that owns it. Also, You use the higher of the device's stat or the owners attribute, and for all but the lowest rating hosts, the host attribute is almost certain to be better than the spider's. Hosts are not devices. They are special cases and use the rules in the host section, which does not mention using the owner's attributes. I suppose this is open to interpretation as the hosts section doesn't specifically mention they are omitted from this rule, but for the same reason you brought the question up (not wanting to stat the owner), it is the best interpretation and almost certainly RAI.

That quote is referring to a device that is unattended.  It's saying that even an unattended device gets the benefits (or penalties) associated with the last person to use the device.  Some have taken the sentence to mean that a person with high mental attributes should touch everyone's commlink before starting a run, but I think that's a bit too much metagaming.
It says owner, so I think that trick would fail unless you have the person with the best mental attributes own everything and just lend it out to everyone else for the run.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <09-08-14/0329:53>
It says owner, so I think that trick would fail unless you have the person with the best mental attributes own everything and just lend it out to everyone else for the run.

Yeah, I think that the trick is metagaming and rules-lawyering at best.  It's been the topic of some heated discussions though, but those are best left to other threads.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ursus Maior on <09-08-14/0634:19>
I'm still confused, because I seem unable to find a lot of rules quoted here.

On p. 247 it says that a host has a rating of 1-12 and matrix attributes derived from that. All ICs running on the host have exactly these attributes. But if a host needs to role against a decker's martix action, it needs to have not only matrix attributes, but mental attributes as well. Of course it also has its host rating.

Also, hosts do have owners as stated on several occasions (p. 236-237 also p. 218; 219; 221 or the IC "Track" p. 249); hell, even grids have owners (p. 215 and p. 236-237). In fact it seems to run like this: You buy a device or anything running in the matrix, you will receive the rights as an owner, but owning a device (legally) and being the owner (matrix rights) isn't necessarily the same (p. 236).

Transferring matrix owner rights takes about one minute and is necessary to avoid that the item behaves like someone else's property all the time (p. 247).

Some matrix actions call for rolls vs device rating. In this case I guess device rating is substituted by host rating, making data bombs on files in high rated hosts very mean. But if you're trying to spoof command (p. 242), you have to go against Logic + Firewall, not device rating + firewall, since you're working against the capability of the owner to simulate his work, so that the host/device thinks you are in fact him.

So I guess I'll need to create an owner for eacht device after all...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: 8-bit on <09-08-14/1319:53>
So I guess I'll need to create an owner for eacht device after all...

According to page 360 of SR5, spiders are considered to be owners of the system (in other words, the host). Sure, not all hosts have spiders, but that's a starting point for most situations at least.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RHat on <09-08-14/1441:34>
You don't need the full statline for an owner at that point, though; the attributes for defense alone would be sufficient.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ursus Maior on <09-13-14/1036:26>
That's right, thanks. If in doubt, I might just use the archetype decker. Even though the values don't add up.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shrazkil on <09-18-14/1313:53>
I have a really hard time understanding spell foci, and was hoping for some clarification.

So when you purchase one, it needs both a school and a specific task, for example healing sustaining force 4.
The cost and availability throw me off though, because of the formula chart, listed below the foci chart.

Or are you able to just buy a straight spell focus item for a school of magic and it can do all in that school?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <09-18-14/1328:13>
"Spell foci" is a category of 4 foci types, all of which require [Force x 2] Karma to bind, have an Availability of [Force x 3]R, and cost [Force x 4,000]¥:

So yes, you'll have a Sustaining Focus (Force 4, Health spells) in your example.

The Formulae chart isn't about foci: it's about formulae, which are manuals you use to learn new spells, rituals or alchemical preparations.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shrazkil on <09-18-14/1334:55>
"Spell foci" is a category of 4 foci types, all of which require [Force x 2] Karma to bind, have an Availability of [Force x 3]R, and cost [Force x 4,000]¥:
  • Counterspelling [spell category]
  • Ritual Spellcasting [spell category]
  • Spellcasting [spell category]
  • Sustaining [spell category]

So yes, you'll have a Sustaining Focus (Force 4, Health spells) in your example.

The Formulae chart isn't about foci: it's about formulae, which are manuals you use to learn new spells, rituals or alchemical preparations.
Ok perfect thanks! The formula section was throwing me off because the top part listed it's cost as percentage of foci , etc.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <09-18-14/1420:20>
Ah, that one. Focus formulae are used to craft foci, rather than buy them.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shrazkil on <09-18-14/1445:31>
That makes sense now, thanks again. I felt like there was something I was missing. Wanted to make sure I had it right.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shrazkil on <09-19-14/1901:25>
Under the street grimoire , if you initiate as an adept , do you have the option to choose any "way" to follow, or are you only allowed to initiate in the undecided way, unless you have bought one of the"way" qualities.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <09-19-14/2129:49>
Under the street grimoire , if you initiate as an adept , do you have the option to choose any "way" to follow, or are you only allowed to initiate in the undecided way, unless you have bought one of the"way" qualities.

You initiate as "Undecided" until you pick one of the Way qualities.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shrazkil on <09-25-14/0120:51>
Could anyone point me in the right direction for rules on selling bioware/cyber and replacing with a better grade? (in 5e)

For instance if i have used cerebral booster 2, at creation, and want to upgrade to normal cerebral booster 3 during gameplay. (Being an adept)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: 8-bit on <09-25-14/0151:17>
Do you mean Essence wise or cost wise? I can give you a more detailed explanation, but this is from the SR5 Missions FAQ; about as official as it gets.

"Presuming that the item in question has not been damaged, you may sell back installed non-cultured bioware and cyberware for a flat 30 percent of its retail value (book price; taking into account alpha or beta mark-up, if any) when upgrading cyberware. Remember, if you upgrade from 3 points of “normalware” to the equivalent in alpha grade, the alpha only takes 2.4 Essence points off, but you do not get the excess back—you simply have a 0.6 point “hole” that can be filled with something else at no further Essence cost until the “hole” is exceeded."

The whole flat 30% thing is Missions only, you might have to talk to your GM on what his specific rules are.

Also, Used Cerebral Boosters, while not explicitly prohibited, should be impossible to get if you use reason. Cultured is specifically grown for your body and DNA; therefore incompatible with anyone else. Used means it was in someone else. So, not exactly useable, thus Cultured Bioware is only available in Standard and above grades.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <09-25-14/0948:54>
Not only can you not buy *used* cultured bioware in Missions, you can't sell it for the 30% trade-in allowance.  Cultured bioware is expensive, expensive stuff.

EDIT: Serves me right for posting from my phone.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-25-14/1050:53>
Not only can you not buy cultured bioware in Missions, you can't sell it for the 30% trade-in allowance.  Cultured bioware is expensive, expensive stuff.
Used Cultured. You can buy normal Cultured if I recall Bull's posts correctly. But yes, you cannot get Cultured Used and cannot sell it, since it's fit only for you.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shrazkil on <09-27-14/2128:56>
I know this would be more of a GM decision ultimately, but would the following tactic be able to get me a surprise attack?

As a mysad Face, i play the damsel in distress (handcuffed, have my fellow runners shoot at me when i try to "escape" ) , use con ( would have 27 fast-talk dice :) )
to hide behind my targets...errr i mean rescuers. Then, once they focus on my team (or at least 1 member who was my captor or perpetrator) , I cast a nice hefty force 10 Punch, with my magical mojo aura.

Would that be likely to get me a defenseless roll?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Quickscope on <09-27-14/2131:26>
Can someone please clarify the Improved Range finder for me? I have a Street Sammy that has Vision Magnification, but it is not on the weapon. Does this means that Improved Range Finder stacks with my innate Vision magnification?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <09-27-14/2222:59>
I know this would be more of a GM decision ultimately, but would the following tactic be able to get me a surprise attack?

As a mysad Face, i play the damsel in distress (handcuffed, have my fellow runners shoot at me when i try to "escape" ) , use con ( would have 27 fast-talk dice :) )
to hide behind my targets...errr i mean rescuers. Then, once they focus on my team (or at least 1 member who was my captor or perpetrator) , I cast a nice hefty force 10 Punch, with my magical mojo aura.

Would that be likely to get me a defenseless roll?

Simply using my GM hat, I'd have people roll to notice your casting (p. 280).  If they did notice, I'd have everyone roll for Surprise, with your side getting bonus dice.  So you'd have a shot at getting them flat-footed.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shrazkil on <09-27-14/2346:45>
I know this would be more of a GM decision ultimately, but would the following tactic be able to get me a surprise attack?

As a mysad Face, i play the damsel in distress (handcuffed, have my fellow runners shoot at me when i try to "escape" ) , use con ( would have 27 fast-talk dice :) )
to hide behind my targets...errr i mean rescuers. Then, once they focus on my team (or at least 1 member who was my captor or perpetrator) , I cast a nice hefty force 10 Punch, with my magical mojo aura.

Would that be likely to get me a defenseless roll?
Well at force 10 they would certainly notice(unless penalties for being distracted by a threat, and having their backs turned) , but surprise roll still potentially worth it, if not enough targets to put me in immediate life-threatening danger.

Simply using my GM hat, I'd have people roll to notice your casting (p. 280).  If they did notice, I'd have everyone roll for Surprise, with your side getting bonus dice.  So you'd have a shot at getting them flat-footed.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <09-28-14/0025:35>
Can someone please clarify the Improved Range finder for me? I have a Street Sammy that has Vision Magnification, but it is not on the weapon. Does this means that Improved Range Finder stacks with my innate Vision magnification?

Where is the character's vision magnification?  Is it built into a cybereye?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Quickscope on <09-28-14/0617:10>
Can someone please clarify the Improved Range finder for me? I have a Street Sammy that has Vision Magnification, but it is not on the weapon. Does this means that Improved Range Finder stacks with my innate Vision magnification?

Where is the character's vision magnification?  Is it built into a cybereye?

It is part of a vision augment into his natural eye.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <09-28-14/1258:11>
Then he gets to use either mod, imo.  There will be those that disagree, meaning this might need to become a separate thread.  Here's my rationale:

The vision magnification is in the eye, magnifying anything the eye sees.  The range finder is in the scope, which targets what the scope "sees."  These can be two different things, or the same thing, but what is important is that they are separate.  Generally speaking, I don't let my players with vision magnification in their eyes use many modifications in their scopes to help, because the scope acts as a sort of stopping point for the vision magnification.  You're basically just zooming in on the scope.  The exception to this is if your optic isn't a magnification optic.

As I said, I'm certain that there are people who would disagree with me, and they might be right - it's a topic that isn't really discussed in the book.  I'm simply working off my own experience in putting magnification screens into firearm optics for the purposes of military training.  What I found was that when you have the scope, and you have the target, the scope supercedes your natural vision - putting any kind of display in there presents a problem, and trying to imagine putting a scope on top of a scope, which I've done, makes it extremely difficult to calibrate and configure.

However, the rules state nothing at all prohibiting this kind of thing, so if it's easier to just stack the effects, then go for it.  What matters in this game isn't realism - it's fun.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Quickscope on <09-30-14/1516:53>
That's exactly the rationale that I used when explaining it to my GM. If I was using an optic on the rifle (Barrett Model 122) I would see that it does not stack. However, my character is essentially firing with iron sights and integrated smartlink, which will be fed information from the improved range finder. That way, the inherent vision magnification is not impeded by the sight picture via the scope, and therefore would allow me to eliminate 2 range categories when making ranged attacks with firearms. (aka treat extreme range shots as medium range shots) His defense to this is that there is an errata to it, forbidding that combination. If there is an errata to this, I have not seen it, which is why I was asking here in hopes I could get some official word on this pairing and if it was intended to be that way.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <09-30-14/1721:53>
That's exactly the rationale that I used when explaining it to my GM. If I was using an optic on the rifle (Barrett Model 122) I would see that it does not stack. However, my character is essentially firing with iron sights and integrated smartlink, which will be fed information from the improved range finder. That way, the inherent vision magnification is not impeded by the sight picture via the scope, and therefore would allow me to eliminate 2 range categories when making ranged attacks with firearms. (aka treat extreme range shots as medium range shots) His defense to this is that there is an errata to it, forbidding that combination. If there is an errata to this, I have not seen it, which is why I was asking here in hopes I could get some official word on this pairing and if it was intended to be that way.

I don't believe your GM is correct in his/her statement about errata forbidding this combination.  There's only three errata documents out, and they total less than 75 pages, so it's really not hard to find information like that.  Since you're using iron sights, I'd say go for it.  In fact, I'd heartily encourage that kind of thing, since I believe you've got the right idea.  As far as getting official word though, there's no such thing.  :P  Kidding aside though, it's unlikely that we'll see a developer post to actually clarify anything.  The freelancer that started this thread (Aaron) hasn't been on the site since September 10th, and hasn't posted anything since October 16th of 2013.  So there are a pile of us who are avid players who like to try to state what is and is not RAW.  By RAW, you can absolutely do what you're wanting to do.  Since you're doing it with your iron sights, it's even more feasible.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <09-30-14/1745:12>
With the understanding that I doubt the devs are actually checking this, I'm posting for posterity. :D

R&G
Q: Is the special Weapon Skill + Reaction [Accuracy] opposing test for Riposte modified by the Reach differential?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <09-30-14/1754:08>
Q: Run&Gun: Are explosion-caused Background Counts Negative or Positive? It talks about rising, but since it predates SG's differing between positive and negative, it's not entirely clear. It talks about Mana Warps, but those are mentioned both as + and - in SG.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jim1701 on <09-30-14/1824:21>
That's exactly the rationale that I used when explaining it to my GM. If I was using an optic on the rifle (Barrett Model 122) I would see that it does not stack. However, my character is essentially firing with iron sights and integrated smartlink, which will be fed information from the improved range finder. That way, the inherent vision magnification is not impeded by the sight picture via the scope, and therefore would allow me to eliminate 2 range categories when making ranged attacks with firearms. (aka treat extreme range shots as medium range shots) His defense to this is that there is an errata to it, forbidding that combination. If there is an errata to this, I have not seen it, which is why I was asking here in hopes I could get some official word on this pairing and if it was intended to be that way.

I don't believe your GM is correct in his/her statement about errata forbidding this combination.  There's only three errata documents out, and they total less than 75 pages, so it's really not hard to find information like that.  Since you're using iron sights, I'd say go for it.  In fact, I'd heartily encourage that kind of thing, since I believe you've got the right idea.  As far as getting official word though, there's no such thing.  :P  Kidding aside though, it's unlikely that we'll see a developer post to actually clarify anything.  The freelancer that started this thread (Aaron) hasn't been on the site since September 10th, and hasn't posted anything since October 16th of 2013.  So there are a pile of us who are avid players who like to try to state what is and is not RAW.  By RAW, you can absolutely do what you're wanting to do.  Since you're doing it with your iron sights, it's even more feasible.

I believe that currently by RAW it would be allowed but my interpretation I believe that it is not RAI.  I think they just got over specific in the wording.  Otherwise there is no reason vision magnification could not eliminate multiple range bands except that it is explicitly forbidden as a game balance mechanic.  Vision magnification allows for 50x magnification which more than sufficient to go from extreme to short range for just about any weapon system.  Also, AFAIK neither of the other two version of range reduction are allowed to stack.  I just don't see why they would leave this single exception to that rule.  That's my two cents YMMV.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <09-30-14/1847:32>
Also, AFAIK neither of the other two version of range reduction are allowed to stack.  I just don't see why they would leave this single exception to that rule.  That's my two cents YMMV.

I agree with you that I think the text of the Improved Range Finder accessory should be changed to prevent stacking with any vision magnification.  The quote is too specific, indeed.  "This bonus cannot be combined with any bonuses from image magnification on the weapon."  It's the "on the weapon" bit that is weirdly worded.  Most accessories and such don't have such specific terms.  The thing is that the imaging scope accessory specifically comes with vision magnification, which would be the only way that a weapon can get image magnification.  The book doesn't explicitly prevent you from using implanted vision magnification with a scope, either.  Though I think it should.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Quickscope on <10-01-14/1405:12>
where does it say that different types of range reduction do not stack? Also, glad that it has sparked some healthy debate here. and if vision magnification can grant up to 50x magnification, WTH is it only giving 1 range bracket reduction? you can make an accurate shot at 1,000 yds with a 10x magnification scope. I can only imagine the kind of shot you can make with a 50x magnification.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeConster on <10-01-14/1419:58>
In 4th you could use image magnification to completely neutralize range modifiers - I assume they nerfed it in 5th so that shiny table on page 175 gets more use. As for the stacking: the Improved Range Finder itself says it doesn't stack with image magnification bonuses, but it has "on the weapon" in there, which leaves a bit of a loophole that may not be intended.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <10-01-14/1422:44>
In 4th you could use image magnification to completely neutralize range modifiers - I assume they nerfed it in 5th so that shiny table on page 175 gets more use. As for the stacking: the Improved Range Finder itself says it doesn't stack with image magnification bonuses, but it has "on the weapon" in there, which leaves a bit of a loophole that may not be intended.

Bingo.  I liked that it removed all the range modifiers when you spent a Take Aim action, it seemed realistic.  As Quickscope pointed out, if you're using a 50x optic your target is going to be gigantic.  Still not a shoo-in to hit though, as there are still a crapton of other variables, but it certainly would eliminate the size of the target being an obstacle to success.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-01-14/1442:07>
On the other hand, distance still can make for a tricky shot, so it may represent that.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Malevolence on <10-01-14/1544:44>
Yeah, I'm with Michael on that - the perceived size of the target is only part of the challenge that distance provides. There are things like bullet drop and general inaccuracy of the gun - they don't shoot exactly straight, or even non-straight in exactly the same way every shot. More than that, any slight tremble or twitch or slight adjustment of the shooter can more dramatically impact the point of, well, impact, the further away the target is, making it difficult to keep your gun aimed at a distant target, especially when it doesn't have the common decency to stay still for you.


So, yeah, I can see the argument for it to be able to reduce the penalty by more than one category, but not completely eliminate it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jim1701 on <10-01-14/1801:31>
I don't think anything should be able to eliminate range (beyond medium to short) completely.  None of the other environmental factors can be reduced by more than one step AFAIK which is why they have a cap on how bad the modifier can be when multiple factors are in play at the same time.  The majority of the rules indicate there is a limit to how far you can reduce the effects of visibility, light, glare and wind so I'm not seeing the intent to allow this one combination of tech to bypass range completely with a take aim action.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: 8-bit on <10-01-14/1834:22>
I don't think anything should be able to eliminate range (beyond medium to short) completely.  None of the other environmental factors can be reduced by more than one step AFAIK which is why they have a cap on how bad the modifier can be when multiple factors are in play at the same time.  The majority of the rules indicate there is a limit to how far you can reduce the effects of visibility, light, glare and wind so I'm not seeing the intent to allow this one combination of tech to bypass range completely with a take aim action.

I'll just point out that low-light can turn Partial Light or Dim Light into Full Light. That's 2 steps negated.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Fedifensor on <10-01-14/1909:09>
Can you downgrade actions?  For example, using one of your two Simple Actions to take an extra Free Action?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <10-02-14/0023:31>
Can you downgrade actions?  For example, using one of your two Simple Actions to take an extra Free Action?

Don't you have a topic about this already?  Located here (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=18231.0)?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: 8-bit on <10-02-14/0029:43>
Can you downgrade actions?  For example, using one of your two Simple Actions to take an extra Free Action?

Don't you have a topic about this already?  Located here (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=18231.0)?

He probably didn't read through the entire 87 pages of this thread and notice that Aaron doesn't post here anymore. He was probably looking for the "official Catalyst Games" answer.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Fedifensor on <10-03-14/0747:10>
He probably didn't read through the entire 87 pages of this thread and notice that Aaron doesn't post here anymore. He was probably looking for the "official Catalyst Games" answer.
Yeah, that's correct.  Is there a place to go for official answers, anymore?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <10-03-14/0750:38>
Nope. You can post here and hope that the folks at CGL are still looking at this thread and using it for errata and a future FAQ, but that's about it. Occasionally, one of the nice freelancers will opine with their opinion on things, but that's about as official as it usually gets.

ETA: With that said, I think they sometimes pull out errata from here and add it to the books without mentioning it. For instance, the Cyberware Scanner table on p. 362 of the Core Book now correctly has "Modifier" for the header for the Situation line. It used to say Threshold (making it harder to detect cyberware if there was more of it, for some reason). I don't know if that actually appeared in a written errata, I'll have to check.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <10-03-14/0821:33>
Speaking strictly for myself, I sometimes churn through here, but when I'm looking for book-specific stuff, it's infinitely easier to go through the book-specific errata threads.  I understand that this distinction isn't always made as clearly in the forums as elsewhere, but the community writ large seems to be pretty good about clarifications (how many gauss rifle availability threads are we up to now?) and FAQ items are handled separately from errata, so winnowing things down to strictly errata using this thread can be tricky.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: dfmaia on <10-04-14/1910:44>
I would like to know if an agent running on the hacker's cyberdeck share marks with his owner.
I would also like to know if they share a single OS score.

1) If the decker marks a host, does his agent mark it as well?
2) If the decker gets marked by IC will his agent gets marked as well?
3) Can the agent hack a persona on the public grid while the decker hacks a host from a global grid?

Thank you in advance!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <10-05-14/0125:05>
I would like to know if an agent running on the hacker's cyberdeck share marks with his owner.
I would also like to know if they share a single OS score.

Yes to both questions.  Unlike technomancers, the OS score is shared as the agent is still running on the cyberdeck.  Also, any marks acquired on/by the agent are shared with the deck.

1) If the decker marks a host, does his agent mark it as well?

Yup.

2) If the decker gets marked by IC will his agent gets marked as well?

Yup, though at that point the decker has more to worry about than the IC getting a mark on his/her agent.

3) Can the agent hack a persona on the public grid while the decker hacks a host from a global grid?

That's a question of whether the agent and the decker need to be on the same grid.  There's nothing hard-and-fast that says you have to be on the same grid, but I think logically you'd have to be on the same grid.  The agent is running on the deck, which is also running the persona.  Unless the deck is capable of processing multiple grids at once the agent and the persona would have to be on the same grid.  However, the book does state the agent gets it's own persona.  Unfortunately that's where it stops.  One could argue successfully on both sides of this question, which means ultimately it's up to your GM.  But for what it's worth, I would make the agent stay on the same grid as the decker.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-05-14/0449:03>
Uhm, Namikaze, where are you getting this from about the Agents? All I found was that marks cannot be shared, I did not manage to find anything supporting that Agents and Deckers share their marks through the Cyberdeck. Marks are given to personas, and Agents are their own Personas. Your marks are specific and connected to your persona and whatever you've marked, so since the Agents are separate personas, the marks don't go to them. Same for the IC: It marks a single Persona, not the others.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <10-05-14/1116:53>
It's just logical - the agent, even with it's own persona, is still a program.  Sprites are explicitly given their own marks while Agents are not.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: TheDelta on <10-05-14/1224:45>
Quick question that had me confused as I'm building my first SR5 mage: What's the practical difference between Foreboding (from Street Grimoire) and Mass Confusion (from Core)? Foreboding has 2 less drain so looks much better while the effect seems to be identical. The one difference I found was that Foreboding specificially said it works on friends and foes alike, but I got the impression all area spells do that anyway, or am I mistaken? Am I able to cherry pick my targets from the area of effect with Mass Confusion? The one short paragraph on Area Spells isn't absolutely clear on that, just saying that all targets in the area are "valid" targets, which leaves some room for interpretation.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: dfmaia on <10-05-14/1613:08>
Thank you Namikaze and Michael.

As you can see, the rules are not very clear on how to handle agents so it is definetly worth going to the official FAQ.

The rules do say that marks cannot be shared among personas but they open an exception for the ICs. That let me wondering if agents would behave the same. Without this exception we are lead to believe that agents would have their own marks and OS scores.
In my opinion sharing marks makes the agent stronger because it can do assisted teamwork with the decker very easily, which maybe is the true purpose of agents. In this scenario the agent must necessarily run on the same grid/host as the decker otherwise they would need to build their own OS.

By the way, the errata on IC+Hosts+marks is still not very clear. Does it work both ways?
A mark put on the decker by one IC makes all ICs psychohappy. If the decker puts a mark on the host does it mark the ICs too?
I ask this because I intuitively think that agents/deckers would follow the same logic.

Thank you again!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-05-14/1738:36>
"The IC in a host and the host itself share marks, so if one IC program marks, they all do, and so does the host itself. Similarly, the IC and host instantly share spotting information, so if the host spots you, so does all its IC. Which usually turns out not well for you."

No support of it going the other way. So IC+Host are an exception to the 'no sharing Marks' rule, whereas Agents are not. IC programs are still their own personas, so you will not mark all when you mark one. If they intended that, they would have left that line in after the errata.

As such, I still see no support for Agents sharing Marks with their Deckers. Teamwork tests may be possible depending on the GM though, not sure what is the official intent there.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: dfmaia on <10-05-14/2053:28>
Ok, in summary, no mark sharing and a separate OS score for agents because they are separate personas.

Last question on this topic. If I understood correctly, when a decker logs into a host the agent persona does not get access and so it is left behind on the local grid which means that agents can exist in a different grid than the decker. Is that correct, or the agent would just automatically hop into the host when the decker does?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <10-06-14/0104:04>
"The IC in a host and the host itself share marks, so if one IC program marks, they all do, and so does the host itself. Similarly, the IC and host instantly share spotting information, so if the host spots you, so does all its IC. Which usually turns out not well for you."

No support of it going the other way. So IC+Host are an exception to the 'no sharing Marks' rule, whereas Agents are not. IC programs are still their own personas, so you will not mark all when you mark one. If they intended that, they would have left that line in after the errata.

As such, I still see no support for Agents sharing Marks with their Deckers. Teamwork tests may be possible depending on the GM though, not sure what is the official intent there.

Using IC as the comparison makes sense to me.  I stand corrected.

when a decker logs into a host the agent persona does not get access and so it is left behind on the local grid which means that agents can exist in a different grid than the decker. Is that correct, or the agent would just automatically hop into the host when the decker does?

If the persona of an agent is separate enough to generate it's own marks and OS score, then it should be able to run on a separate grid.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <10-06-14/0256:53>
Quick question that had me confused as I'm building my first SR5 mage: What's the practical difference between Foreboding (from Street Grimoire) and Mass Confusion (from Core)? Foreboding has 2 less drain so looks much better while the effect seems to be identical. The one difference I found was that Foreboding specificially said it works on friends and foes alike, but I got the impression all area spells do that anyway, or am I mistaken? Am I able to cherry pick my targets from the area of effect with Mass Confusion? The one short paragraph on Area Spells isn't absolutely clear on that, just saying that all targets in the area are "valid" targets, which leaves some room for interpretation.

Welcome to the forums.
Foreboding seems to designate a specific area in which all targets suffer the consequences while with Mass Confusion you pick a point in space or a target as the center and can then affect anyone you want who is inside the area depending on the force.

The general method for area manaspells is the latter. You pick a destination and choose the targets that you have to be able to perceive. Foreboding seems to be an exception to the rule.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <10-06-14/2054:25>
One More for the FAQ:

For effects that give a duration of 1 Combat Turn that are inflicted some time during a CT (rather than at the end of the CT), when do they end?

For example: a Bear Shaman fails a Composure Check, only scoring 2 Hits, and goes berserk for one Combat Turn. Let's say the check was failed during CT2. The berserk part happens immediately, assuming nothing happens to extend it, when does the effect end?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: shreck on <10-13-14/1259:29>
a few questions :
if i play a streetsam and have my wireless gear slaved to my commlink on the public grid wat happens to my gear ?
wat happens to for instance my smartlink ?
do i still get the wireless bonus of +1/+2 to my dicepool .
can i still use my wired reflexes +  reaction enhancers together ?

just asking becous it looks like a very cheap way to get a extra -2 to the dicepool of the hacker who is trying to brick your gear.

wat happens if one of my players decides to run around whith like 10-15 ( cost 200 for a external ) smartgun systems .
(i am sure he will come up whith a way to carry them and activate/deactivate them  )
all turnd on but only 1 of them on his gun wen i combat.
is it for the npc hacker possible to find the correct one or is it just pick one and hope for the best.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-13-14/1301:36>
It is indeed a nice cheap way to get a -2 in defense. The functionality isn't harmed, only matrix actions are.

If your runner walks around with a dozen wireless guns in his bag, he indeed makes it impossible for an enemy IN combat to figure out which is which. But if they start hacking before a fight starts, they can definitely find it. And if your runner does that in the streets, the cops will arrest him.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: shreck on <10-13-14/1358:25>
It is indeed a nice cheap way to get a -2 in defense. The functionality isn't harmed, only matrix actions are.

If your runner walks around with a dozen wireless guns in his bag, he indeed makes it impossible for an enemy IN combat to figure out which is which. But if they start hacking before a fight starts, they can definitely find it. And if your runner does that in the streets, the cops will arrest him.
ok thanks .
and he woud not have the guns on him ( just the system itself ).
from wat i understand he woud rigg something up to house them and just activate wireless whith the push of a button .
i dont think a wireless gun even is always online.
i am seeing it more like a red dot laser that you activate wen you pull your gun ( by presure sensors on the grip or by flicking a button on it ).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-13-14/1409:57>
((Wouldn't work. The matrix icon is very restrictive, if the smartgun isn't in an actual gun it wouldn't be shown as a gun in the matrix.))

((And yes, you can turn off the wireless on items, but then you have to spend actions to turn it on.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: shreck on <10-13-14/1454:23>
its a external smartlink.(top mounth or underbarrel ).
thy shoud show up on the grid wen you activate them .
even if thy have to be attacht to a gun , how hard coud it be to build something that can fool the sensors on it.

i know i can get the same effect by just grabbing a bunch of rfid tags and using wrapper + change icon.
but if you use the real devices the hacker will have spend a lot of time on matrix perception tests trying to find out if thyr fake.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-13-14/1500:53>
((How are you going to Wrap the RFID tags? Anyway, if you insist on arguing yourself as a GM into a corner, you may want to start a topic on it since this is not a FAQ question but a rules debate.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: shreck on <10-13-14/1506:43>
ok ill just tell him it cant be done then .
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Darzil on <10-23-14/1515:08>
A couple of questions:

The tables on Noise on SR pg 231 shows Spam Zone or Static Zone giving Rating Noise. Was that just to save a line on the table or do they actually not stack? It would make some sense for some items (can't really have high grid traffic a long way from the grid), but you could have heavy rain and high grid traffic ? I guess they probably stack, but you'd be unlikely to get both.

What is the practical difference between Tool Kits, Shops and Facilities, for using, say, Hardware skill ?

edit, added:

If you have an agent running on a deck, it can take it's own Matrix Actions. However, if it is attacked, does the Agent defend, or as it's the deck being attacked, does the character defend ?

An observation:

I saw a comment earlier in this thread that the Noise Reduction bonus from Datajacks stacks if you have multiple. I think I'll recommend our GM ignores that. It sounds rather broken from a gameplay perspective, and hard to justify. Having a good route to the Grid help makes sense to reduce Noise. Having multiple good routes should have at the least diminishing returns I would hope, if any effect at all.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Gratuitous Boom on <10-24-14/1658:27>
How should the range of Spirits be handled while a mage is astrally projecting? Is the distance measured from his body, his projection, or both?
Also, would the positive effects of a Circle of Healing (such as Circle of Increase Willpower) fade as soon as a mage's projection leaves the circle or would they continue because his body is still within it's bounds?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ursus Maior on <11-16-14/1011:05>
I got two questions from yesterday's session.

A: When mages and matrix-users change from the physical world into the astral or matrix (and vice versa), how should their initiative be modified. 1) Do you reroll initiative (and presumably deduct 10, 20 etc, from it depending on the phase) or 2) do these characters generate seperate sets of initiative scores all the time, simply "just in case" or 3) something diffrent?

B: How do you dodge grenades launched or hurled at you and any other forms of attack with a blast radius. Specifically: What kind of defense allows you to get out of the blast radius (and to what degree?) and how does this attacking with blast weapons really work at all? I think I did not fully grasp the mechanic...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: 8-bit on <11-16-14/1254:30>
I got two questions from yesterday's session.

A: When mages and matrix-users change from the physical world into the astral or matrix (and vice versa), how should their initiative be modified. 1) Do you reroll initiative (and presumably deduct 10, 20 etc, from it depending on the phase) or 2) do these characters generate seperate sets of initiative scores all the time, simply "just in case" or 3) something diffrent?

Page 160 of the Core Rule Book has the answers you want.

Quote from: Core Book of SR5; page 160
In some cases, a character’s Initiative Score or Base Initiative Dice may change in the middle of a Combat Turn. A player might gain Initiative by activating an augmentation, for example, or could receive a boost from a drug or spell or other enhancer. Conversely, a character who is wounded or whose vital equipment (weapon, augmentation, etc.) takes damage might lose Initiative.

If a character’s Initiative attribute changes, immediately apply the difference as a positive or negative modifier to the character’s Initiative Score. This new Initiative Score applies to all remaining actions in that Combat Turn. So a character with Initiative 8 and an Initiative Score of 11 who activates an implant that changes his Initiative to 10 (+2) immediately raises his Initiative Score to 13 (11 + 2).

If the number of Base Initiative Dice available to a character increases, that character immediately rolls the extra Initiative Dice and adds the sum to their current Initiative Score for that Combat Turn. So a magician with 1d6 Initiative dice who takes his first action to astrally project (2d6 Base Initiative Dice) gains the die (and the change in Initiative) for their Astral Initiative during that Combat Turn. (In this case, the magician would also replace their Reaction + Intuition for Physical Initiative with Intuition x 2 for Astral Initiative.)

If the number of Initiative Dice available to a character decreases, then that character immediately rolls the number of lost dice and subtracts the total from their Initiative Score (along with any decrease to their Initiative Attribute).

Initiative also changes when a character or NPC is injured. Wound modifiers are applied directly to the character’s Initiative attribute. These changes are made immediately after the injury occurs and can affect the initiative order even within the same Initiative Pass. These changes do not allow the character to act again; they simply change their Initiative score.

If a character enters combat after it has already begun, they should roll for their Initiative Score as normal and then subtract 10 for each Initiative Pass that has already occurred. This means they may get an Action Phase during the current Combat Turn or they may not, but at least they have a chance.

So, to use your example.

A Decker is in AR, his initiative is Reaction + Intuition + 1d6. Let's say it's 3 + 5 (+3 for the die) to equal 11. He then switches to hot-sim VR. His initiative is now Intuition + Data Processing + 4d6. We keep the Intuition (5), the first die rolled (3), and then add Data Processing and 3d6 to his score. The end result is his hot-sim VR initiative. If he switches back to AR, we simply remove his Data Processing, roll 3d6 and subtract that, and add back in his Reaction (3 in this case). Thus, we end back up at his AR initiative, however, this is likely different than his original AR initiative.

A Mage has initiative equal to Reaction + Intuition + 1d6 in the meat world. We'll say its 3 + 5 (+3 for the die) to equal 11. He then astrally projects. His initiative is now Intuition (5) times 2, and we roll 1d6 to add to the final result. If he stops projecting, we simply use Reaction + Intuition as his base, and roll 1d6 to subtract from his initiative score. We end up back in meat world initiative.

B: How do you dodge grenades launched or hurled at you and any other forms of attack with a blast radius. Specifically: What kind of defense allows you to get out of the blast radius (and to what degree?) and how does this attacking with blast weapons really work at all? I think I did not fully grasp the mechanic...

Currently, the only method of dodging grenades or Indirect AoE spells is on page 125 of Run & Gun; the new interrupt action "Run for your Life". You can also attempt to throw a grenade back with the "Right Back at Ya!" interrupt action on page 124 of Run & Gun.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ursus Maior on <11-16-14/1306:45>
Thanks man, we missed both things apparently yesterday.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: 8-bit on <11-16-14/1307:41>
Thanks man, we missed both things apparently yesterday.

No problem. The first one is hidden away and most forget about it; and the second one is horribly unexplained in the Core Book. It's not really explained very well in Run & Gun either, but at least there are options there.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ursus Maior on <11-16-14/1615:44>
Yeah, I figured so. As I'm the GM I focus on the story for most of the part, leaving rules-knowledge to my players. Yesterday however one of my well versed (rules-wise) players was missing and the other had no clue on that matter. I also almost TPKed the whole party for sheer lack of well balanced enemies (and the missing player not factored in and bad preperation on their part).

Well, it ain't fun, until you earned it...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-16-14/1619:44>
In SR5 Core they deliberately did not allow for dodging grenades. R&G fortunately added a rule for getting out of their range (and that of AoE spells). 1 downside: You run away from the INTENDED target, so if it scatters it may bounce after you.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tarislar on <11-17-14/1105:43>
1 downside: You run away from the INTENDED target, so if it scatters it may bounce after you.
Or it could just be making you move out into the open for you to be shot at by bullets.  That's called a Lose/Lose scenario, hehe.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <11-17-14/1459:40>
1 downside: You run away from the INTENDED target, so if it scatters it may bounce after you.
Or it could just be making you move out into the open for you to be shot at by bullets.  That's called a Lose/Lose scenario, hehe.

Yeah, the dodging grenades thing lasted for about one session.  Now folks lay down suppressive fire beforehand.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ursus Maior on <11-17-14/1715:38>
1 downside: You run away from the INTENDED target, so if it scatters it may bounce after you.
Or it could just be making you move out into the open for you to be shot at by bullets.  That's called a Lose/Lose scenario, hehe.
That's the idea. :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ramlatus on <11-21-14/0050:40>
Do my characters have to buy multiple copies of a given autosoft/program? If I have 3 drones can the all have the same clearsight Rating 6 installed or do I have to buy 3 copies, one for each drone. Can you or can you not also keeps copies on another device or data chip as a backup to loosing the device the program is on?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: 8-bit on <11-21-14/0054:33>
Do my characters have to buy multiple copies of a given autosoft/program? If I have 3 drones can the all have the same clearsight Rating 6 installed or do I have to buy 3 copies, one for each drone. Can you or can you not also keeps copies on another device or data chip as a backup to loosing the device the program is on?

Unless you are running the autosoft on an RCC (See Noise Reduction & Sharing; page 267), yes, you do need to buy multiple copies of autosofts/programs.

What you are saying with backups makes sense, but is currently unavailable (and thus, impossible) within the SR5 rules. Sorry.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Darzil on <11-21-14/0523:27>
What you are saying with backups makes sense, but is currently unavailable (and thus, impossible) within the SR5 rules. Sorry.
Unfortunately users lost the copyright battles with the corps in Shadowrun.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <11-21-14/0700:35>
Do my characters have to buy multiple copies of a given autosoft/program? If I have 3 drones can the all have the same clearsight Rating 6 installed or do I have to buy 3 copies, one for each drone. Can you or can you not also keeps copies on another device or data chip as a backup to loosing the device the program is on?

Unless you are running the autosoft on an RCC (See Noise Reduction & Sharing; page 267), yes, you do need to buy multiple copies of autosofts/programs.

What you are saying with backups makes sense, but is currently unavailable (and thus, impossible) within the SR5 rules. Sorry.
I would disagree with this assessment. As the owner of a file (in this case, let's say a Clearsight Autosoft, since it isn't specific to any one make or model) you can make a copy of it. The only rules on copies of programs are specifically listed as applying to running multiple copies of the same program on the same device.

SR5 page 243:
Programs (technically cyberprograms if they’re for the Matrix) are files you can run on your deck. While a program is running, it makes your deck better or gives you more utility. You can’t run more than one program of the same type on your deck at once (and no, changing the name of one copy of a program to run two copies doesn’t work, chummer). You get the benefit of a program while it is running on your deck; as soon as you end it or swap it out for another program, it stops providing those benefits.

There is no mention of Copy Protection as there was in SR4A / Unwired. As such, I would argue that a single copy of a program can be copied across multiple devices, with the caveat that a Model or Weapon specific program can only be used with the Model or Weapon for which it applies.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-21-14/0748:51>
Do my characters have to buy multiple copies of a given autosoft/program? If I have 3 drones can the all have the same clearsight Rating 6 installed or do I have to buy 3 copies, one for each drone. Can you or can you not also keeps copies on another device or data chip as a backup to loosing the device the program is on?
((There are currently no copy restrictions, though those may be added in Data Trails in the future. It was the same in SR4, no copy restrictions in Core, which were introduced by Unwired. Unwired also came with illegal cheaper downloads and downsides to cracked software in the form of over-time degradation.

So I'd argue that just like in SR4 Core, you currently simply are restricted in 2 ways: No running the same program twice, and programs are either made for drones+rccs or for cyberdecks, so you cannot copy from one to the other. Keep in mind that Data Trails will likely add restrictions to this and your GM could take a glance at Unwired for a temporary houserule if they deem it necessary.))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: 8-bit on <11-21-14/1118:56>
I would disagree with this assessment. As the owner of a file (in this case, let's say a Clearsight Autosoft, since it isn't specific to any one make or model) you can make a copy of it. The only rules on copies of programs are specifically listed as applying to running multiple copies of the same program on the same device.

SR5 page 243:
Programs (technically cyberprograms if they’re for the Matrix) are files you can run on your deck. While a program is running, it makes your deck better or gives you more utility. You can’t run more than one program of the same type on your deck at once (and no, changing the name of one copy of a program to run two copies doesn’t work, chummer). You get the benefit of a program while it is running on your deck; as soon as you end it or swap it out for another program, it stops providing those benefits.

There is no mention of Copy Protection as there was in SR4A / Unwired. As such, I would argue that a single copy of a program can be copied across multiple devices, with the caveat that a Model or Weapon specific program can only be used with the Model or Weapon for which it applies.

Oh, sure. I agree with copying programs. I've just seen it argued for no copying in most cases, so you shouldn't plan to be able to copy programs.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lilinka on <02-10-15/1753:19>
I'm fairly confused and wanted clarification on what the following (from Street Grimoire, page 41) even means:

"Assigning tasks outside the general area of their tradition will not receive a response from the spirit (for example, a Buddhist mage telling an air spirit to heal him will get no response, as air is a Combat spirit in that tradition, while the Health spirit is earth)."

It seems to contradict core (all spirits can use powers as tasks) and is a massive change to how spirit types break down, but there's no errata covering it, and it's only covered in a single sentence.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Namikaze on <02-11-15/0042:48>
I'm fairly confused and wanted clarification on what the following (from Street Grimoire, page 41) even means:

"Assigning tasks outside the general area of their tradition will not receive a response from the spirit (for example, a Buddhist mage telling an air spirit to heal him will get no response, as air is a Combat spirit in that tradition, while the Health spirit is earth)."

It seems to contradict core (all spirits can use powers as tasks) and is a massive change to how spirit types break down, but there's no errata covering it, and it's only covered in a single sentence.

It's mostly just a fluffy bit.  That's why you don't see any rules for it.  This is justification for a GM saying that a player cannot use a spirit outside their selected field of expertise.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: LonePaladin on <02-23-15/1513:39>
Has this thread's original purpose ever come to light? It claimed to be gathering questions for an official FAQ, but the main site still lacks one. I have several questions about the rules, and I don't want to be That Guy who asks questions that were answered a year ago.

This thread is eighteen months old, with 90 pages. I don't have enough free time to spend going over the whole thing, taking notes, hoping my questions have already been covered. (Not to mention the inevitable times where a question links to another discussion in the forums.)

If someone has put a FAQ together, could we get a link to it in this forum's original post?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: 8-bit on <02-23-15/1516:54>
There is no current FAQ, at least, not that I am aware of.

However, you could always ask a question anyway, and the community will be glad to answer. Aaron, the freelancer who started this, has not been active for a while. Another option you can use if the print button on the top right corner of the forum. This will give you a text only page of all the posts. You can then use Cntrl + F to search for words relevant to your question. If you don't find an answer, feel free to ask.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Decade Rider on <03-22-15/0733:05>
Is there a official pdf or something for rule clarification/errata? im looking for cyberlimbs clarification. specifically the customized ones reguarding the limit they can be optimized.. is it still like SR4 in the way you can only customized up to your flesh stat or did that change?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: prionic6 on <03-22-15/0815:09>
The only official errata yet (for the core rulebook) are here: http://www.shadowruntabletop.com/2014/02/shadowrun-fifth-edition-errata-now-available/ - nothing on cyberlimbs though.

The section in the core rulebook states pretty clearly (after reading it maybe five or six times ;-P) that you can only use customized cyberlimbs that do not go over your racial maximum (6 for human). You can then add cyberlimb enhancements up to rating three.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Decade Rider on <03-22-15/0817:02>
I think I was just confused cause im so used to SR4 putting you couldnt customized past your "actual" stat. But I guess they changed that?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeldaBravo on <03-31-15/0945:18>
You can customise a cyberlimb up to your racial maximum (6 for human). You can also add cyberlimb enhancements on top of that.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sternenwind on <04-06-15/1111:23>
Can you use Edge for a SIN check, Maglog passkey, your drone and your agends?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: 8-bit on <04-06-15/1334:42>
SIN - Yes
Maglock Passkey - Yes
Drone - Yes, if jumped in; no, if not
Agent - No

The reason you can't use Edge for the last two is that they are separate entities; you aren't rolling for them. The SIN check is something you can get lucky on, as is the Maglock Passkey. For the drone and agent though, your luck has nothing to do with how well or poorly their programming functions.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Malevolence on <04-06-15/1653:13>
From Run&Gun Pg 126 (Lucky Duck) you can spend two edge for a teammate to avoid an attack. I suppose you can consider a drone or an agent a teammate for this purpose.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ursus Maior on <04-06-15/1703:44>
To what 8-bit and Malevolence said, I would add that if your character is doing it in person, you may use Edge. The RG-rule "Lucky Duck" seems to be the only exception so far, but stands in the tradition of former SR-editions. What is now called Edge used to be a pool of Karma only usable for "rolls of fortunate chance" (i.e. "luck") Basically you can use your Edge to keep your friends alive.

This is why I (as a GM) would not allow my players to use Edge to keep equipment intact. Their is no karmic connection to equipment, neither should there be. I absolutely would extend this rule to dependents, relative, friends, contacts etc. of the character, if a connection was somehow enacted in the past. If you know the TV show "My Name is Earl", that's how I understand the basic concept of Karma in SR. It also explains, why "running for the people" will result in more karma for a run (although less money).

But this is purely my opinion.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tarislar on <04-07-15/1455:06>
What is the Aspected Background Count in a Magic Lodge?
St.Grimoire gives generic level figures which would seem to be 1-3.
Meanwhile I've also heard its the Level of the Lodge.
Thanks for any answer you can give.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Skill Monkey on <04-07-15/1754:33>
What should the Force be for a Great Form Spirit?  I might have missed it in Street Grimoire or maybe it's discussed elsewhere in this forum but I'm not seeing it anywhere.
I'm thinking something around Force 15 seems reasonable, but the fluff makes it sound like it's more Force 20+ ("9.1 Richter scale" quote from page 187 and such).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sternenwind on <04-07-15/2105:53>
SIN - Yes
Maglock Passkey - Yes
Drone - Yes, if jumped in; no, if not
Agent - No

The reason you can't use Edge for the last two is that they are separate entities; you aren't rolling for them. The SIN check is something you can get lucky on, as is the Maglock Passkey. For the drone and agent though, your luck has nothing to do with how well or poorly their programming functions.

So what is the difference between a Sin-scanner or magkey pass card and an agent or drone? You are not rolling for a magkey passcard or a Sinscanner. No skill or attribute of your character is involved in the test.
On the other side Agents don’t even have an own matrix monitor.

All four are more or less advanced programs packed in more or less hardware doing their thing without direct control from a sentient being, except the “do your thing” command.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: 8-bit on <04-07-15/2221:35>
I can't give you any book quotes for any of those answers. I can tell you that out of the 7 or so groups I've played with, Agents and Drones can't have Edge spent on them. SINs and Maglock Passkeys? I've never actually seen Edge spent on them, but most GMs I've played with would allow it. After all, spending it there means you aren't able to spend it elsewhere.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Pixie on <04-07-15/2322:37>
What should the Force be for a Great Form Spirit?  I might have missed it in Street Grimoire or maybe it's discussed elsewhere in this forum but I'm not seeing it anywhere.
I'm thinking something around Force 15 seems reasonable, but the fluff makes it sound like it's more Force 20+ ("9.1 Richter scale" quote from page 187 and such).

A Great Form spirit can be at any force.  It requires summoning the spirit via the Invocation ritual.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <04-08-15/0704:42>
SIN - Yes
Maglock Passkey - Yes
Drone - Yes, if jumped in; no, if not
Agent - No

The reason you can't use Edge for the last two is that they are separate entities; you aren't rolling for them. The SIN check is something you can get lucky on, as is the Maglock Passkey. For the drone and agent though, your luck has nothing to do with how well or poorly their programming functions.

So what is the difference between a Sin-scanner or magkey pass card and an agent or drone? You are not rolling for a magkey passcard or a Sinscanner. No skill or attribute of your character is involved in the test.
Agreed with Sternenwind on SIN check, because the GM simply rolls a "Device Rating x 2 Test with a threshold equal to the rating of the fake SIN" to check it.

A Maglock Passkey is different, however, because the rules for maglocks state that resolving a maglock passkey against a lock is done through an "Opposed Test between the passkey/forged keycard rating and the maglock rating".
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: silencer201 on <04-15-15/1102:24>
Quick question, Do gas grenades like pepper punch do damage over time during the 4 rounds they are active, or do they only do damage once.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <04-16-15/0155:19>
Gas grenades can expose the victim to multiple doses of the toxin. So you'd have a resistance test for every two combat turns of exposure for Pepper Punch.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: McGuffin on <04-19-15/0448:03>
I got a question regarding enviromental modifiers.

The text only mentions them in context of combat, with the notable exception of perception tests.
But what if a character sneaks outside of combat during the night? So far I thought these modifiers would surely apply there as well, meaning outside of combat when using skills that could be influenced by those modifiers.
How are you handling this? And are there maybe page references that I missed?

Thanks.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <04-19-15/0828:45>
I got a question regarding enviromental modifiers.

The text only mentions them in context of combat, with the notable exception of perception tests.
But what if a character sneaks outside of combat during the night? So far I thought these modifiers would surely apply there as well, meaning outside of combat when using skills that could be influenced by those modifiers.
How are you handling this? And are there maybe page references that I missed?

Thanks.

Perception tests use the same modifiers as environmental modifiers in combat (p. 135), so the guard trying to spot someone sneaking at night will likely suffer some form of penalty.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: McGuffin on <04-20-15/0358:45>
Perception tests use the same modifiers as environmental modifiers in combat (p. 135), so the guard trying to spot someone sneaking at night will likely suffer some form of penalty.

Thank you. But what about the person sneaking? Wouldn't he suffer from some kind of penalty as well, assuming he hasn't any vision enhancements?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <04-20-15/0813:06>
Perception tests use the same modifiers as environmental modifiers in combat (p. 135), so the guard trying to spot someone sneaking at night will likely suffer some form of penalty.

Thank you. But what about the person sneaking? Wouldn't he suffer from some kind of penalty as well, assuming he hasn't any vision enhancements?

That's entering into GM-call territory (and how-many-dice-do-you-want-to-roll territory).  Darkness doesn't make you more or less quiet (perceived differences in sound at night aside), so there's no worry there.  If you were trying to avoid an obstacle that would ruin your efforts to be quiet--a patch of dry leaves, for example--that GM would probably call for a Perception test, which brings us back to the visual modifiers.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: McGuffin on <04-20-15/1030:02>
Thank you very much, Kincaid, that helped a lot.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: gradivus on <05-16-15/0143:20>
I'm fairly confused and wanted clarification on what the following (from Street Grimoire, page 41) even means:

"Assigning tasks outside the general area of their tradition will not receive a response from the spirit (for example, a Buddhist mage telling an air spirit to heal him will get no response, as air is a Combat spirit in that tradition, while the Health spirit is earth)."

It seems to contradict core (all spirits can use powers as tasks) and is a massive change to how spirit types break down, but there's no errata covering it, and it's only covered in a single sentence.

It's mostly just a fluffy bit.  That's why you don't see any rules for it.  This is justification for a GM saying that a player cannot use a spirit outside their selected field of expertise.

I wouldn't say there are no rules- SR5 pg 303:
Aid Alchemy, Sorcery, and Study: As a service, the
spirit can add its Force as a dice pool bonus to your Alchemy,
Spellcasting, Ritual Spellcasting (for spell rituals), and
Learning Tests if its type matches the spell’s category, as
listed under your tradition (p. 279).

The  Health Spirit of your Tradition can give you a bonus to your DP to cast Health spells for example but not illusion spells.
You could also argue that the wording in Street Grimoire could be interpreted to include Spell sustaining and Spell Binding but that's less clear and is GM fiat territory.
As far as the unbound services- doesn't effect them at all.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <05-18-15/0327:17>
Minor addition:
The bound Health Spirit ...

By argueing you can really screw a player, especially when it comes to Spirits of Man and Innate Spell. A Spirit of Man categorized as Manipulation could be given Heal as Innate Spell. There is no further restriction aside from knowing the spell to grant to the spirit. Could the spirit cast the spell? What if the mage in question doesn't even know manipulation spells?
Things should be kept simple. Just remove that sentence - and especially that horrid example - from the book and just use the spirit categories for the services listed on p. 303.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: monkeywrench on <06-03-15/1308:44>
In character creation, if I wanted to play a Troll - who wouldn't - do I have to use either my A or B priority codes? or can I dump my E into metatype and save the rest for the other slots?.
I apologise if this has been answered
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kiirnodel on <06-03-15/1402:19>
You would need to use Priority A or B to create a Troll. You only gain access to a particular metatype through a priority where it is listed on the chart.

For example, at Priority E for metatype, the only choice is to be a human.

Now, you do get extra Special Ability points for choosing higher priority, for Troll at A priority, you get 5 to spend. But you cannot play one at all if you don't use at least a B for your metatype Priority
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Novocrane on <06-03-15/2034:23>
It is possible to make a troll shapeshifter at Priority C.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Cafroe on <06-10-15/1215:52>
Here's a question (one that may have been asked and answered already - 90-odd pages is a lot to trawl through). Under the 'Immunity' Critter Power, Critters are said to have an effective Hardened Armor rating equal to twice their Essence.

1) Does this mean that all spirits, regardless of force, have Hardened Armor r.12? I.E. Damage values <13 do not do damage, and for those over 12, the spirit gets 6 auto successes, plus getting body+6 dice to resist (more, if the spirit is Inhabiting a body wearing armor)?

2) If the effective Hardened Armor comes from the Immunity power, does the Critter actually have Hardened Armor, and is it subject to AP? AP does not necessarily function against Immunity - in the above example, would an APDS FN HAR need to get at least 13P damage and applying the AP to the (Body+6+OtherArmor) test, or would it need to get 7P, plus the critter only getting 3 automatic hits on the resistance test, AND applying AP to (Body+6+OtherArmor)?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <06-10-15/1232:10>
Yes, spirits have immunity to mormal weapons. Meaning VS any non magical attack, they have (force)×2 hardened armor.

Yes, AP is used to reduce that value.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Cafroe on <06-10-15/1258:49>
Except that they explicitly don't use force as a metric for Immunity - they use essence (p398, 5e Core). I'm asking for confirmation on this - everyone keeps saying Force, when the book says essence.

I'm aware how Hardened Armor works, but I'm not convinced that AP applies to it through Immunity, seeing as Immunity means that they have that Hardened Armor 'effectively', but not actually. Given that Hardened Armor applies AP in very particular ways, I'm much more willing to believe that the 'effectively' in this case does allow the AP to apply, upon re-reading that entry.

The essence clarification still applies.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <06-10-15/1331:51>
I would suggest you do a search of the forums if you are interested. This has been brought up at least half a dozen times already so everything you are curious about can be found.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Cafroe on <06-10-15/1350:15>
Thank you for not answering my question in the most direct manner possible - a reminder that for spirits, Essence = Force would have been satisfactory. Which, might I add, is not very intuitive to me, but I suppose that it stops problems precisely like the one I raised from becoming an issue.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <06-10-15/1425:36>
be happy I answered at all.

I am on a phone and do not have access to books and what not to quote from for you from.


On the reverse side, YOU could simply have done a search to start with and read the info.


Stop being an entitled brat and take some personal responsibility, look it up yourself if THAT is going to be your attitude.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: JackVII on <06-10-15/1530:41>
For f(*&^'s sake, can people at least try to be cordial? The internet wasn't created yesterday, so we should all be familiar with not reading more into posts than what's actually written in them (well, at least until you get to know a poster). With that said...

@Cafroe: Here's a trick. If you want to find something quickly in any long thread (like the Rules Clarification & FAQ thread), click the Print button on the far right hand side at the top of a post. It won't print, but will open a new webpage that has every thread on it. From there (if you're on a Windows PC), push CTRL + F and enter your search term.

ETA: The game stat blocks on Spirits on pg. 303 & 304 list Essence = Force.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Cafroe on <06-11-15/0212:46>
I do apologise for my behaviour -  I had tried several different google searches (often leading me to threads on these forums), but nothing that addressed what I saw as a problem directly. This, of course, was because I had misremembered some spirit stats, which led me to feeling a touch defensive. Mea culpa.

Thank you for the tip on the search function, it should definitely help in the future.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DARKBLADEZD73 on <06-25-15/2255:18>
Hey Chummers,
                             
This post is concerning Run Faster and the rules on Life Modules/Qualities and Surge.

Not sure if any of what I am about to say is going to help ,but here it goes. As far as I know from talking with several GM's and scouring the forums on
these topics I have come to this conclusion.

  The Core Rules Stand for ALL character creation alternatives unless otherwise stated. Specifically, regarding Attribute Min/Max, Starting Quality
Limits (25 Karma Total), and any conflicts that might arise regarding Skills.

  Each option specifies what changes regarding that creation path. Like having Active Skills at 7 on pg. 66 or what to do when you exceed your
Karma limit with Qualities on pg. 84.
 
  Note: That the Core is clear on pg. 71
 "Additionally, at creation characters can only possess at most 25 Karma Worth of Positive Qualities and 25 Karma Worth of Negative Qualities."

So, as the alternative character creation methods are still part of the character creation system, The RAW Stands. This is my understanding.
 
  Also, Surge at any level is NOT A QUALITY!

 It is a separate character option that can be purchased with extra Karma from the alternative character creation options. Whether you can buy Surge

3 using the priority chart is not clear to me as it would put you over the 25 Karma Limit.
 
  Which is strange that there are certain loopholes around that where character's end up with 25P/26N CC Qualities and 31P/30N Metagenic Qualities.
 
  So, much for limits huh? Kinda blows my whole The Core Rules Stand out of the water don't you think? Ah lovely contradictions! Gotta Love it in the Shadows!
 
  Welcome to Shadowrun Chummers. I have been here since Day one back in the day with FASA and looking forward to many more conflicting rules

in the future. If GOD wills it.

Note: Also, my post was reported to the mod for being to hard to follow. My apologies. I am new to the forums.
Will work on making my post easier to follow.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: UnLimiTeD on <07-04-15/0811:38>
Heh. I'd like to ask about the above as well.

In regular Priority Chargen, there's a limit of 25 Karma on both positive and negative qualities.
In play, positives cost double, and you can't buy negatives.
And Point buy says you use the rules for character advancement. So, how to buy qualities?
The latter is how a group I'm in does it atm, and while it's not upon me to worry about that, I find it.... odd, to say the least.

Edit: The gernam version clarifies:
Qualities are bought like in every other system.
I am left somewhat unsurprised.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: gradivus on <07-09-15/1909:27>
Heh. I'd like to ask about the above as well.

In regular Priority Chargen, there's a limit of 25 Karma on both positive and negative qualities.
In play, positives cost double, and you can't buy negatives.
And Point buy says you use the rules for character advancement. So, how to buy qualities?
  • Same as Priority?
  • You can only buy positives?
  • You can buy both positives and negatives at double the price?

It's still chargen...core says positive qualities cost double AFTER chargen.
The latter is how a group I'm in does it atm, and while it's not upon me to worry about that, I find it.... odd, to say the least.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: fseperent on <07-13-15/1510:37>
Way it's put in the books SURGE shouldn't count towards the quality limits, like HMHVV.
Sadly, Hero Lab currently has it put as a positive quality, so I can't build a "legal" SURGE 3 character.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sterling on <07-13-15/1548:12>
That's no surprise; Herolab can't apply the Infected Quality correctly either.

e.g. Add Ghoul to an in-play character and instead of applying a -1 to Logic and Charisma it changes all your stats to match the Ghoul from the Critters section in the CRB.  Somebody brought it up and the Herolab guys blamed CGL for not making it clear!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: fseperent on <07-13-15/1622:30>
I saw that post.
Thought it was Hero Lab applying the penalties twice.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sterling on <07-13-15/1721:57>
Nope. I tried it today and my characters stats went ballistic. Strength and Body went up, Willpower shot right up.  It seems that Herolab modifies your stats so you remain as far from the new maximums as you were from the old.

Say you had Strength 5, after applying the Ghoul template you'd have Strength 9, as that is 1 below the new maximum of 10.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tiaexz on <07-28-15/0839:49>
Chummer5a has recently updated so Knowledge is now Log+Int*3 instead of Log+Int*2 and this is starting to some a few arguments as people have different amounts of knowledge and saying "Well Chummer says.." but I cannot find where Chummer got this information from and the rulebook (and earlier posts of this thread) say it is Log+Int*2.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <07-28-15/1101:07>
Page 89.

Quote
Characters receive free Knowledge and Language skills points equal to (Intuition rating + Logic rating) x 2.

In 4e, it was x3 and since Chummer goes back to that, I suspect it's a stray value that carried over.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tiaexz on <07-28-15/1107:37>
Page 89.

Quote
Characters receive free Knowledge and Language skills points equal to (Intuition rating + Logic rating) x 2.

In 4e, it was x3 and since Chummer goes back to that, I suspect it's a stray value that carried over.

It wasn't in the old Chummer5, so I thought a book or errata came about and changed the value again, but thank you for confirming, Kincaid.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tiaexz on <07-28-15/2241:29>
This came up in a game, so I want to double check.

Rigger has an Eyedrone in the room with Person X, and he wants to shoot through the wall to kill them with Doberman.
Does Doberman controlled via Rigger who is also operating Eyedrone shoot Person X with Blind Fire modifier in place or not?

I said "yes" on the argument that even though he knows Person X is there, he cannot accurately aim via the eyedrone, so it would constitute as Blind Fire (and shooting through barrier penalties).

Also said this is the case because if he didn't have eyedrone there, he wouldn't know Person X was there, so couldn't make the shot at all.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <07-29-15/0916:06>
I'd use the rules for Shooting Through Barriers (p. 197).  In this situation, the shooter would get the -6 Blind Fire penalty but the defender would be unaware of the attack and not get a Defense Test.  That's a pretty good trade-off for the attacker.

To get the -6 modifier at my table, you have to have some idea where the target is.  You can't just send a single bullet through a wall and expect to hit someone specific in the conference room on the other side.  (My 20+ dice Pistol Adept would love this.)  It's akin to "attacking a square" in other games in my mind.  The eye drone would certainly allow someone to do this.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: LordGrizzle on <07-29-15/1028:41>
This came up in a game, so I want to double check.

Rigger has an Eyedrone in the room with Person X, and he wants to shoot through the wall to kill them with Doberman.
Does Doberman controlled via Rigger who is also operating Eyedrone shoot Person X with Blind Fire modifier in place or not?

I said "no" on the argument that even though he knows Person X is there, he cannot accurately aim via the eyedrone, so it would constitute as Blind Fire (and shooting through barrier penalties).

Also said this is the case because if he didn't have eyedrone there, he wouldn't know Person X was there, so couldn't make the shot at all.

I would say he shouldn't get Blind Fire but "Attacker firing from cover with an imaging device" instead which is only -3 because it is just another kind of indirect aim
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tiaexz on <07-29-15/1214:04>
I would say he shouldn't get Blind Fire but "Attacker firing from cover with an imaging device" instead which is only -3 because it is just another kind of indirect aim

Just realised I typo'd in my question, as I said "yes" he had to do Blind Fire.

I didn't realise there was an imaging device one. I will have to double check, as it might be acceptable to use that.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-29-15/1558:22>
started a topic on blind fire rather than bloating this thread:

http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=21565.0
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: George on <08-07-15/1856:34>
Question about Adept Power Attribute Boost:

P.309 SR5:
Quote
"...Each hit on this test boosts your attribute rating by 1, up to your augmented Attribute maximum. This only affects your dice pools; your Physical limit and Initiative ratings don’t change with Attribute Boost...."

Does this mean that boost Strength does not increase your Melee DVs, Throwing Distance and Recoil Compensation, since these are not pools but value based?

Thanks.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <08-07-15/1916:10>
Question about Adept Power Attribute Boost:

P.309 SR5:
Quote
"...Each hit on this test boosts your attribute rating by 1, up to your augmented Attribute maximum. This only affects your dice pools; your Physical limit and Initiative ratings don’t change with Attribute Boost...."

Does this mean that boost Strength does not increase your Melee DVs, Throwing Distance and Recoil Compensation, since these are not pools but value based?

Thanks.

Yes. If there is a dice pool involved then Boost works, such as in a jumping or climbing test.

However, for a derived value such as recoil compensation, it has no value.
Title: Unconscious from a full stun/physical condition monitor?
Post by: demion on <08-08-15/1054:47>
I know this question gets "answered" in another thread, but I think the answer is fairly poor justified. In the combat core rules the statement to what happens if your stun or physical condition monitor says nothing about falling unconscious. Its only mentioned via reference in the "finishing your character" chapter and in the stunbolt-spell (because its named the "sleep spell"). And in the quick rules which have no real meaningfullnes - especially because in the german quick rules its stated otherwise again.

There are really a lot references in the core rules book to rules and text-passages, that are not part in the final 5th edition ruling. So it seems, that text either got copied from 4th edition and not fully adapted (always this copy-paste errors;) or that changes in the course of designing the 5th edition rules were not corrected everywhere because of the many, many cross-references which you can easily forget to correct.

I believe that - if a character really should have fallen unconscious from a full condition monitor - it would have been corrected in the errata and the 2nd printing - which is not the case. I think it was a last minute design choice to leave off the unconscious from the 5th edition.

Is there any official statement to this cause?

Edit 9.8.15: I also posted the question with the relevant text passages in the SR5 Errata Forum for clarification. I hope there is an official answer...  http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11363.msg390737#msg390737
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <08-08-15/1059:30>
That's incorrect.  The intent is most clear in the description of the Survival skill ("If your Stun Condition Monitor overflows and you fall unconscious..."), which is admittedly a fairly obscure spot.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: demion on <08-08-15/1325:04>
Yeah, that's the problem - there are only such obscure mentions as references (see Character finalization), but there is no rule as to how long you stay unconscious or if this also happens if only the physical is full and if you wake up if only one hp recovered and so on. There is no rule for it, just obscure references.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <08-08-15/1611:37>
Well, you're unconscious until you heal enough boxes to stagger to your feet, following the normal healing Stun Damage rules (that is, your Monitor is no longer full).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: prionic6 on <08-09-15/0416:03>
enough boxes to stagger to your feet

One box is enough, right?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: demion on <08-09-15/0629:35>
One box is enough, right?

Well, we don't know because there are no rules for going unconscious and getting up again in the book. Kincaids interpration is just a possibility to rule it - therefore houseruling.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <08-09-15/0959:52>
The text on page 100 that you quoted in the other thread is pretty clear as well.  I think this is one of those instances when having a book written by folks intimately familiar with the game causes some hiccups.  You've always fallen unconscious when you're Stun Monitor is full, so the guy writing part XYZ (Survival, for example) writes as such so you end up with more references to the rule than explicit statements of the rule.  It's 100% RAI, however.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: demion on <08-09-15/1725:27>
Yeah that could be true. But how do you know it is RAI? Is this your opinion or from one of the authors?

For example - there is no rule how long you stay unconscious. But if you just interpret the writings in the healing section, it would mean, you are unconscious for one hour. Thats much too long for just stun damage in my opinion.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kiirnodel on <08-10-15/0507:21>
Yeah that could be true. But how do you know it is RAI? Is this your opinion or from one of the authors?
I'm not seeing where you are confused:
"Every character has a Condition Monitor that tells the player how much Physical and Stun damage they can  take  before falling  unconscious."

That passage is fairly clearly stating that the calculated number of boxes are how much Physical or Stun damage a character can take before being rendered unconscious. In plain terms, if you have taken enough damage to fill up either Condition Monitor, you are unconscious.  That's what that sentence means, that section of the book isn't fluff, or allegory, it is character creation. And all of the other passages that people have mentioned simply support that.

For example - there is no rule how long you stay unconscious. But if you just interpret the writings in the healing section, it would mean, you are unconscious for one hour. Thats a little ridicolous...

I'm not sure what you find ridiculous, being rendered unconscious for an hour (or more, since you can fail to heal some stun damage on that first try) seems fairly reasonable.

If you think that is too short, I point out that like I said, there isn't a guarantee you automatically wake up in an hour. And I also feel it is important to note that if the Physical damage track is full, you don't wake up until you have at least one open damage box there as well. That means all overflow, plus one healed.

If that is too long for you, there are a few people that have suggested some homebrew tweaks to make waking up not so standard. Including dividing the hour by how many hits you got and healing one box every X minutes (so it's a gradual heal over time instead of 1 hour passesand suddenly 4 boxes are healed!).

Also, there are several things that can wake someone up early, such as applying First Aid, stim patches, or the Awaken spell (SG). These things also let you wake up early (albeit only temporarily), but with a full Stun damage track we're talking seriously concussed runners. I don't expectthem to always be walking away on their own right away.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: prionic6 on <08-10-15/1132:34>
AFAIK, unconsciousness in fiction is generally not represented in a realistic way. Being unconscious for an hour after a combat wound and then "just" waking up is not a thing that happens in the real world. According to https://skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/3451/are-one-hit-knockouts-possible-and-do-they-cause-permanent-brain-damage, if you're hit hard enough to be out for more than "a few seconds, minutes at most", that "may indicate severe brain damage, which could lead to loss of function, life-long debilitation, coma, and death. Essentially, a blow hard enough to knock a person unconscious is classified as a Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)". That wouldn't even be addressable with dividing the hour by successes.

On the other hand, I think the hour-long unconciousness is aligned pretty well with what we have come to expect for fiction, so I'm fine with it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: demion on <08-10-15/1201:52>
I'm not seeing where you are confused:
"Every character has a Condition Monitor that tells the player how much Physical and Stun damage they can  take  before falling  unconscious."

I am confused because puting this important rule in the "finishing character creation" section and never mentioning it in the combat or damage explanation rules where it should be adressed is very, very strange. So either it was forgotten to explain in the combat rulings and should go into the errata or it was forgotten to take out of the other text passages and should also go into the errata file.

If that is too long for you, there are a few people that have suggested some homebrew tweaks to make waking up not so standard. Including dividing the hour by how many hits you got and healing one box every X minutes (so it's a gradual heal over time instead of 1 hour passesand suddenly 4 boxes are healed!).

Yeah, that sounds a lot more reasonably for me, but in the end its just a houserule.

@prionic6: I know that healing in fiction is always far better then it is in the real world. But beeing unconscious for one hour is far worse than in the real world if you didn't get seriously damaged (=physical). But in the end I can live with it, if it was really intended this way.

Also, there are several things that can wake someone up early, such as applying First Aid, stim patches, or the Awaken spell (SG). These things also let you wake up early (albeit only temporarily), but with a full Stun damage track we're talking seriously concussed runners. I don't expectthem to always be walking away on their own right away.

Well now you got me with the awaken spell;) After all SG was released after the core rules and the spell addresses unconsciousness from the effects of stun - which seems to mean "full stun damage condition monitor" aside of stun on the basis of medication or chemicals -> SG page 109 "temporarily alleviating the effects of Stun, including modifiers from damage. This spells works on a subject that is unconscious due to an external cause such as injury, medication, or chemicals. The caster must achieve a threshold equal to the Stun modifiers (or 1 for targets simply asleep) the subject currently experiences."
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Limrasson on <08-10-15/1233:12>
Hi!

Currently me and some of my friends are preparing to start our own characters and RP in the shadows!
I'm the one doing some research on the newer information and rules about the game, since my english skills prove to be the best in my group.
What I'm trying to find right now is:

Q.: What are the height and weight ranges for different metatypes?
       Obviously this is a tricky question, because weight and height is determined my many factors. There could be and elf who si shorter than a dwarf and a dwarf that's not actually that stocky, but rather lean. Just as real humans tend to greatly differ in weight, height and body type as well. However my question aims to find out, that what are the height and weight treshholds for certain body types for a givan metahuman? As in, when is an elf considered a "tall elf"?
When is considered a dwarf as a "muscular dwarf" ? When is considered a troll a giant even among trolls? What's a fat elf? When do other orks call another ork "Skinny" ?

Things like that would be nice to know to give a guideline.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jim1701 on <08-10-15/1236:08>
Average height and weight for metatypes are on pg 380 of the core book. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: DMiller on <08-12-15/0354:01>
I have one... Can a Gauss Rifle use other ammo? Is there APDS, Explosive, etc. ammo for a Gauss Rifle?

-D
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ScytheKnight on <08-12-15/0358:15>
I have one... Can a Gauss Rifle use other ammo? Is there APDS, Explosive, etc. ammo for a Gauss Rifle?

-D

The only Gauss Riffle ammo listed is in the Run and Gun errata.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Deadfly on <08-14-15/0331:31>
Hello,

one questions about the cyber suits in Lockdown:

Is it possible to use customization on the limbs when buying the suits, since it is noted that you are not allowed to change anything on the suits? (so, adapt them to the maximum str/agi)


- Dead
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Novocrane on <08-14-15/0432:31>
one questions about the cyber suits in Lockdown:

Is it possible to use customization on the limbs when buying the suits
Quote
The only way new elements can be added to cybersuites is by adding new features to elements that have the capacity to accept them
RAWest of RAW, you might get someone argue that this doesn't cover customisation. They should be slapped upside the head with a rulebook.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: pi4t on <08-14-15/0709:32>
Am I reading the control device action correctly? It seems to have problems deciding whether it's legal or illegal. If the action you're performing happens to need a dice roll, it's legal (assuming you have enough marks on the device, of course). However, making the device do a trivial action which doesn't need a dice roll requires a sleaze roll (meaning it's illegal, requires a deck, adds to your overwatch score, etc) even if you're the owner of the device. Is this really intended, or have I misunderstood a rule?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Bulshock on <08-15-15/1410:48>
Technically it would also include things like remotely opening a door.  Meaning only hackers and others with a Sleaze Score, can remotely open the door to their apartment/house/car...  Or remotely start them.  I tend to not worry about things like that when you're the owner, though it's technically a House Rule because it's not RAW.
Title: Defense roll against area damage?
Post by: demion on <08-20-15/1309:49>
Do you get a defense roll against area damage from granates or spells? The attacker needs to roll the treshold of 3 to hit without scatter. But it's never mentioned if there is a defense roll for the defender.

There is only one table on page 189 where there is a dice pool modifier for the defender "targeted by area-effect attack" -2. The text speaks about defending against grenadeds and area spells. But - which value of the attackers dice do you need to beat? All his  successes or only his successes in advance of the treshold of 3? This would be fairly easy to defend for an area damage - even with the -2 modifier.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Darzil on <08-20-15/1319:26>
No, but Run and Gun (pg125) has Run for your Life to avoid them.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: demion on <08-20-15/1338:56>
No, but Run and Gun (pg125) has Run for your Life to avoid them.

But what about the text on page 190: "Targeted by an area-effect attack: Dodging explosions is not as easy as it seems in the movies. Apply a -2 modifier when trying to defend against weapons like spells, grenades, rockets, or missiles with a blast or area effect."
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Raven2049 on <08-20-15/2056:11>
No, but Run and Gun (pg125) has Run for your Life to avoid them.

But what about the text on page 190: "Targeted by an area-effect attack: Dodging explosions is not as easy as it seems in the movies. Apply a -2 modifier when trying to defend against weapons like spells, grenades, rockets, or missiles with a blast or area effect."

never noticed that before, will have to look into that.



Also, from a topic that was started earlier:

As far as Duration Permanent spells go, do the effects Ramp up? or are they full potency right after casting...

For example if you cast a F4 Heal spell on a person, you have to sustain it for 4 combat turns before it becomes permanent. Does that mean during those 4 turns the damage is slowly healing? or is it instantly healed and just requires the concentration before its made "permanent"

Same situation for the Spell Mana Static, cast at Force 4, does the background count start at 1 and slowly increase over the 4 turns? or is it at [hits] from the get-go and just requires the concentration on the spell before its made "permanent"
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <08-20-15/2102:44>
That's a holdover error.  AoEs work like grenades--3 hits puts it where you want it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: demion on <08-21-15/0631:42>
That's a holdover error.  AoEs work like grenades--3 hits puts it where you want it.

Hm, are you referencing to my question? I know that AoE spells work the same like grenades - thats why my question is for all area damage attacks.
Or do you mean the table entry from page 189 and the cited text from page 190 is an holdover error?
Title: Multiple Attacks -> 1 target?
Post by: demion on <08-22-15/0732:03>
I have another question: multiple Attacks on multiple targets are possible. But can you do multiple attacks on one target? It's not specified, as its not even specified how many bullets you need to attack for example 3 persons (logic would say at least a short burst with 3 bullets - but to be true hitting 3 targets calls for more than just a short burst...).
Title: Summon Spirit: One at a time?
Post by: demion on <08-22-15/0736:35>
And than I have another question. On page 300 it's written: "Summoning a spirit is a Complex Action. You can only summon one spirit at a time."

Does this mean you can have only ony spirit serving you (unless you bind it) and if you summon another spirit the first vanishes? Or is it just a clarification, that you cannot summon let's say 2 spirits with one complex action?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: ZeroIP on <08-28-15/2258:34>
I posted this as a concern in the Technomancer feedback for a new book! topic but I also want to know if any freelancer such as Aaron can help with this.

What exactly are the rules for Resonance Realm Searches in Data Trails? We have the extended test for finding the backdoor to the Resonance Realms but the rest of the rules are nebulous at best. I play on Runnerhub and they said that they could allow their usage but only if they were given explicit written rules or errata to follow. As of right now it seems to be a great power of technomancers but the main issue is the "Event Horizon" and the tasks need to obtain the Goals. Most GM's are unable to create this event on the fly and normally avoid using it altogether because they do not have definitive rules. Please advise us on some mechanics to crossing the "Event Horizon" and more examples of tasks for resonance realm actions.

Personally it feels that Crossing the Event Horizon requires a mixture of a judge intentions test and a composure test with a certain threshold (please define on the number or how to define the threshold). The rules on the Judge Intentions check are vague but I would say that it would have a chart that has a baseline number then modifiers depending on what they are trying to do. Submersion level could give a -1 per grade on the test along with possible good intentions such as finding a file to save a friend's life. Heartless monster intentions should increase the threshold such as finding erased dirt to blackmail someone or erasing data of a horrendous crime possibly adding +1 or two to the threshold. Afterwards you tally those modifiers and  then roll that dice pool vs with a the PC's composure dice pool as the event horizon bombards you with simsense-like data of your worst fears, regrets, and desires. If you are unworthy you are shunted from the resonance realms and the backdoor you used closes. This means must redo the searching for the backdoor test all over again and go through the above. If you pass though, welcome to the resonance realms and on to the next part.

The second part is goals and how they should have definitive guidelines for completing the goal. For example the book on Data Trails says "For example, a
search to erase data (see p. 163) could require the technomancer to track down all instances of that data, represented as fruit, hidden away in an expansive digital forest." I would rule that this is similar to a host simulation in which you have to use matrix search to find the fruit. I would rule that the threshold for finding the fruit is similar to the rating of the file (which you stated as a general rule) but also has penalties such as finding fruit equal to its rating and some require a matrix perception as if running silent. However since I am not a GM and this is not an official ruling technomancers cannot use the resonance realms because this ruling is not definitive. Please help and advise on what to do. Thank you.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: IntrepidVector on <08-28-15/2338:36>
If I fill a gas grenade with NovaCoke is that a recipe for a fun party or is everyone about to pass out and die from overdose? I'm trying to figure out. I think the rules suggest if you stick around in the gas cloud you would end up taking four separate hits of NovaCoke, one each turn?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: demion on <08-29-15/1053:40>
Quote
As far as Duration Permanent spells go, do the effects Ramp up? or are they full potency right after casting...

I think the spells have full potency right after casting because there are no rules for "ramping up" effects. Like, your wounds close just after casting heal, but if the mage is knocked out after 1 turn (and before the spell gets "permanent") the closed wounds just return to their previous state.

And I still would really like to know if you can do multiple attacks against the same target or if it have to be different targepts per multiple attack dice pool split (so for dice pool/2 split -> 2 attacks on two different targetes or possible 2 attacks on one target)...
Title: Re: Summon Spirit: One at a time?
Post by: living on <09-03-15/1749:50>
And than I have another question. On page 300 it's written: "Summoning a spirit is a Complex Action. You can only summon one spirit at a time."

Does this mean you can have only ony spirit serving you (unless you bind it) and if you summon another spirit the first vanishes? Or is it just a clarification, that you cannot summon let's say 2 spirits with one complex action?

You can only have one unbound spirit at time. if you summon another one, the first vanishs.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: antaskidayo on <09-13-15/0614:02>
Quote
Quote from: demion on (13:38:56/08-20-15)
Quote from: Darzil on (13:19:26/08-20-15)
No, but Run and Gun (pg125) has Run for your Life to avoid them.

But what about the text on page 190: "Targeted by an area-effect attack: Dodging explosions is not as easy as it seems in the movies. Apply a -2 modifier when trying to defend against weapons like spells, grenades, rockets, or missiles with a blast or area effect."

never noticed that before, will have to look into that.

yeah i'd like to know this one as well                     
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: CitizenJoe on <09-14-15/1346:04>
I've seen that question come up a lot.  I think it is an editing hold over and you don't get a dodge for grenades and area effects.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shamie on <10-05-15/1327:08>
Do a mage have to sustain a combat spell for F turns for the damage to take hold? Per the rules in page 283?

Quote from: CoreRulebok
Permanent (P) spells don’t fade or dissipate; their effect becomes a lasting, non-magical characteristic after you sustain the spell for (Force) Combat Turns.

Thanks
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sendaz on <10-05-15/1516:26>
Combat spells typically have a Duration of Instant (I), so you can not sustain these.

Were you perhaps looking at Damage or Type in combat spells and seeing the P there, which in there cases means Physical damage and should not be confused with a P in duration, which means permanent?

Some manipulations spells that can be used offensively like Ignite and similar do have a duration of P and need to be sustained for Force number of turns to kickstart them.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Max Mustermann on <10-08-15/0252:22>
Hi to alle,

Seems as if got their form of Sleep Regulator taken away with Sustenance only applying to the need for food/water.
Metabolic Control now allows to go longer without sleep, although I don't know in what way sleep is related to metabolism. And if you need to go without sleep, I can hardly imagine that you'd have the time to meditate to be able to go longer without sleep  :-\

i'dont understand metabolic control, particular the sentence to toxins, but i cant find some reference to toxins, how influence metabolic control toxins  ???

kind regards Max
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <10-08-15/0658:17>
Since Metabolic Control doesn't mention any effects on toxins for the suspension time, by RAW it also doesn't effect them. The last sentence is meaningless regarding toxins.

We can now just guess whether the mentioning of toxins is a mistake or they skipped the important part from the power of Street Magic:

Quote
The character’s metabolism is reduced by a factor equal to his Magic (therefore also delaying the effects onset of toxins, poisons, and diseases). For example, a character with Magic 5 will have his metabolism decreased by a factor of 5.

So it has to be a copy&paste-error. Since I assume they wanted to avoid the complicated part of having to divide by 6 or 7 the reference to toxins should just be deleted completely. But that is just guess-work.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Beta on <10-09-15/1552:15>
If you find a combat spell with duration marked as permanent, yes you would.  But IIRC they all have duration of instant.

"Permanent" shows up on duration most often in health spells (such as heal....maintain it for enough turns, and they are healed).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jofer234 on <10-18-15/1459:10>
Can someone help me with a few questions please?
1) So, we have a decker/rigger in our group.Can he use a deck and RCC at the same time?IMO he cant have two separate personas,so,he need to reboot his persona on the deck and activate it on the RCC.I also think he lose his matrix functionality on the deck in that case
2) What exactly can i do with drones if i am not the rigger?My best guess is:
а) If i have a commlink i cant contol my drone by Control Device action,but still i can tell him what to do.He will avoid danger and do task with his appropriate skills and autosoft (if any)
b) If i have a deck,i can do all actions like with commlink but i can also control him and use my appropriate skills (if any) and drone"s autosoft for test (if any)
3) Can i notice adept magic?i know there is the test on page 280.Is it only for magical spells or adept powers included?
Probably i rolled critical glitch on Search Core Book and Google search actions,but i really cant answer to my own questions  :(
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: korusef on <10-19-15/1209:55>
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jofer234 on <10-19-15/1233:31>
  • You can use both at the same time. Usually you will form persona on the deck (better stats) and just use the RCC as any other online device. You won't be able to jump-in, but you will be able to command your drones and share auto-softs.
  • The only thing you cannot do as non-rigger is the "Jump In" matrix action.
    • No, you can use Control Device from comlink.
    • It really doesn't matter whether you use a commlink or a deck.
  • Yes, it says any magic.

1)Oh..so sad.Thanks!
2) a)b) But on the page 222, there are only 5 matrix actions for typical matrix user.Or is it something like everyone can do but someone cant do control device on his commlink?
3)Thanks!

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Darzil on <10-19-15/1246:28>
Typically matrix users don't, but they can.

You can only use control device in this way to do normal actions the device could normally be asked to do. You'd need a commlink/deck with sleaze to make it do more exotic things, as per Control Device rules.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jofer234 on <10-19-15/1250:22>
Oh..i see.Thanks everyone for help!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Starsomava on <11-02-15/1204:20>
Looking at the SMG vs Assault rifle thing, I noticed some people were talking about dual wielding SMGs. then I started looking for a mention of something like "this gun requires two hands to use properly" like they have for melee weapons.  Is there something I'm missing as to why someone wouldn't just dual wield LMGs (or HMGs for trolls) or grenade launchers?  concealability aside, when things go haywire and its time to tell Knight Errant to leave you alone, Why isn't everyone (both runners and KE) dual weilding assault rifles?

Did I miss something, or is there just supposed to be a GM ruleing of whether that kind of thing works based on how pink mohawk/black trenchcoat your group is?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <11-02-15/1511:23>
Looking at the SMG vs Assault rifle thing, I noticed some people were talking about dual wielding SMGs. then I started looking for a mention of something like "this gun requires two hands to use properly" like they have for melee weapons.  Is there something I'm missing as to why someone wouldn't just dual wield LMGs (or HMGs for trolls) or grenade launchers?  concealability aside, when things go haywire and its time to tell Knight Errant to leave you alone, Why isn't everyone (both runners and KE) dual weilding assault rifles?

Did I miss something, or is there just supposed to be a GM ruleing of whether that kind of thing works based on how pink mohawk/black trenchcoat your group is?

<Puts on Gun Nut Hat>

Simple fact is, you can "one arm" an AR let alone an LMG. The weight and balance of an AR is not designed for that operation, thus you would have ZERO control of the weapon. Then add in the recoil from the rounds fired and all you would do is punch holes in the ceiling.

LMGs are an even more extreme and heavy AR so you just compound the issue. (Typical weight and length of an LMG 1.7m and 20kg)...

Here is a simple experiment for your home. Get you broom out. Grab the handle as far back as you can in a single hand, and now try to lift the head of the broom off the ground and straight out in front of you. Feel that tension in your fore-arm? Yea thats with a broom... not 5 to 20kg (10 to 40lbs) of fire-arm.

Also note, not ALL smgs are smaller then ARs.

If you hunt around on the forums, you'll find a few pictures I have posted of my personal collection of fir-arms. (Pistols, long-arms, military weapons)

In one picture, you can clearly see that my model 1928 Thompson is actually bigger then both my AK-47p and my AR15.

By definition, the difference between an SMG and an AR is the ammo. A SMG fires "pistol caliber" rounds while an AR fires "Rifle rounds". (Not that it makes a difference in the weight of the ammo... .45acp weights more the 5.56mm Nato rounds...)


But, thanks to population "dumbassery" that is only re-enforced by movie idiocy, people think that you CAN "one arm" Assault Rifles. (Want some great examples... YOUTUBE! I have spent hours laughing my ass off at morons who try to one arm ARs and break their wrists, clobber themselves in the face, break their weapons, or nearly shoot their dumbass camera man!)


So yes, it depends on the realism you want in your game.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Starsomava on <11-02-15/1557:28>
Simple fact is, you can "one arm" an AR let alone an LMG. The weight and balance of an AR is not designed for that operation, thus you would have ZERO control of the weapon.

Oh IRL I've done the dual wielding thing with everything from 9mm pistols, to M-249s and I've seen a guy dual wield .50 cal Barretts (I'm too small to even try shoulder fireing one of those at a time).  And its true that with 2x M-249s I had a hard time hitting a target like "north" even though I was a good shot when using a 249 traditionall.  I would put ANY form of dual wielding firearms as "range shenanigans".

What I'm asking is if there is a RAW limit to orkish gun-fu monks and elven cyborgs ability to dual wield howizters, or does the GM just have to make a call at some point.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <11-02-15/1746:23>
Simple fact is, you can "one arm" an AR let alone an LMG. The weight and balance of an AR is not designed for that operation, thus you would have ZERO control of the weapon.

Oh IRL I've done the dual wielding thing with everything from 9mm pistols, to M-249s and I've seen a guy dual wield .50 cal Barretts (I'm too small to even try shoulder fireing one of those at a time).  And its true that with 2x M-249s I had a hard time hitting a target like "north" even though I was a good shot when using a 249 traditionall.  I would put ANY form of dual wielding firearms as "range shenanigans".

What I'm asking is if there is a RAW limit to orkish gun-fu monks and elven cyborgs ability to dual wield howizters, or does the GM just have to make a call at some point.

Other then common sense?

No.

Some weapons will explictly state 2 handed use in their description. But the vast majority do not.

Once again, its up to your table to determine what and how they want to handle the issue. The combat section discusses HOW you handle dual weapons, but never explicitly says which ones you can or can not dual wield.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: UnLimiTeD on <11-03-15/1258:40>
Wasn't there an optional rule in SR4 with a dice pool malus for using a two-handed weapon one-handed?
I think a troll could actually fire an AR one-handed with a dice-pool malus that would probably be the equivalent of -2 in SR5, given the general amount of dice people roll.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Starsomava on <11-03-15/1309:10>
When upgrading a 'ware, say from Synaptic boosters 1 to synaptic boosters 2, do I have to pay all over again for the essence (in this case for a total of 1.5) or just the new one (total essence 1)?  how about from something like standard synaptic boosters 1 to alphaware synaptic boosters 2?  would that be a total loss of .8 essence or 1.3?

how about something like eyeware.  If I start with just a smartlink (putting a tiny projector inside my eyeball) and later I decide to gouge out my entire eyeball and get it replaced with a cybereye, would I only pay for the loss of the cybereye, or for both the cybereye and the smartlink?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: gradivus on <11-04-15/0358:50>
When you remove 'ware there's an essence hole. You don't get the essence back. However, the essence hole is filled up first before you lose any more essence if you put new things in.

example, you have a character that has a tricked out cyberarm and a total essence of 5.
He later removes the cyberarm and replaces it with a beta version.
He now has a .3 essence hole because the new arm is .7 and not 1 but he's still at 5 Essence.
Later he adds Cerebellum Boosters 2. The first .3 of the .4 fill up the essence hole thus meaning he loses just .1 more essence and is now at total essence of 4.9
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: PortMan on <11-05-15/1359:20>
Hey All!
I thought that i knew what the Matrix is,but recently i found something new:
The first piece of assistance comes from your commlink, which automatically filters out the least interesting icons.(SR 5 pg 217)
Also cutting down on the visual noise is the fact that some icons are deliberately hidden from view, such as locks and other security devices, baby monitors, maintenance monitors, and of course people who prefer not to be seen. (SR 5 pg 217)
I thought the tricks like this are possible if someone or something use Running silent function.So,how can i find this tricky icons?Is it like- Roll Matrix Perception "I want to know every baby monitor device icon in 100m radius?Can i find every security device like this?

They’re clever, often using homemade decks assembled from commlink parts, sweat, and chutzpah.(RF page 194 Script Kiddie description)
How can i make  deck like this?Is it any test?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: bull30548 on <11-19-15/1948:49>
I can't find an answer to this otherwise I wouldn't be asking.  It is a faq/ fact checking.  So I was looking at life modules and the sample character they show at the end on page 84-86 and I noticed an issue.  On the first table the character picks up Computer and by the 4th table he picks up the electronics skill group but they still have the computer skill listed at the end.  So what happens in this case?  Just thought i point out the issue and try to find an answer to a question in the process.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <11-19-15/2241:29>
Hey All!
I thought that i knew what the Matrix is,but recently i found something new:
The first piece of assistance comes from your commlink, which automatically filters out the least interesting icons.(SR 5 pg 217)
Also cutting down on the visual noise is the fact that some icons are deliberately hidden from view, such as locks and other security devices, baby monitors, maintenance monitors, and of course people who prefer not to be seen. (SR 5 pg 217)
I thought the tricks like this are possible if someone or something use Running silent function.So,how can i find this tricky icons?Is it like- Roll Matrix Perception "I want to know every baby monitor device icon in 100m radius?Can i find every security device like this?

They’re clever, often using homemade decks assembled from commlink parts, sweat, and chutzpah.(RF page 194 Script Kiddie description)
How can i make  deck like this?Is it any test?
All those hidden Icons are just filtered search results. None of those items are actually "invisible" except those actually Running Silent. The rest aren't showing up b/c the default display says to hide them. Like when you sort out your email to Family, Friends, Work, Mailing Lists, and Spam... all those emails came in, you just chose which to pay more attention. So to find the locks, monitors, etc. you just change the filter settings. That shouldn't even take a roll, especially if you know what you're looking for. You don't need to see EVERY Icon after all.

Another way to find erroneous devices, is to look for certain traits. They may have made a Cyberdeck out of a calculator, but it's still going to have an Attack and Sleaze rating that an ordinary calculator never would. So roll Matrix Perception and say "show me devices with a measurable Attack or Sleaze rating". Suddenly, you spot a Deck here or there, and a "calculator" in that guy's pocket.

As for making them on your own, Data Trails pg 62 covers "non form factor Cyberdecks", which cost 20% more with Avail +3.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: PortMan on <11-20-15/0833:32>
Hey All!
I thought that i knew what the Matrix is,but recently i found something new:
The first piece of assistance comes from your commlink, which automatically filters out the least interesting icons.(SR 5 pg 217)
Also cutting down on the visual noise is the fact that some icons are deliberately hidden from view, such as locks and other security devices, baby monitors, maintenance monitors, and of course people who prefer not to be seen. (SR 5 pg 217)
I thought the tricks like this are possible if someone or something use Running silent function.So,how can i find this tricky icons?Is it like- Roll Matrix Perception "I want to know every baby monitor device icon in 100m radius?Can i find every security device like this?

They’re clever, often using homemade decks assembled from commlink parts, sweat, and chutzpah.(RF page 194 Script Kiddie description)
How can i make  deck like this?Is it any test?
All those hidden Icons are just filtered search results. None of those items are actually "invisible" except those actually Running Silent. The rest aren't showing up b/c the default display says to hide them. Like when you sort out your email to Family, Friends, Work, Mailing Lists, and Spam... all those emails came in, you just chose which to pay more attention. So to find the locks, monitors, etc. you just change the filter settings. That shouldn't even take a roll, especially if you know what you're looking for. You don't need to see EVERY Icon after all.

Another way to find erroneous devices, is to look for certain traits. They may have made a Cyberdeck out of a calculator, but it's still going to have an Attack and Sleaze rating that an ordinary calculator never would. So roll Matrix Perception and say "show me devices with a measurable Attack or Sleaze rating". Suddenly, you spot a Deck here or there, and a "calculator" in that guy's pocket.

As for making them on your own, Data Trails pg 62 covers "non form factor Cyberdecks", which cost 20% more with Avail +3.

Thanks!
Unfortunately for me,ive got another moments to clarify( pls,help me if you can.
If i understand all matrix things right,if i know the location of the device,i can hack it.That is not neccesary,but if i need specifica printer and i dont wanna to hack and trace about 20 printers in the building,i need to know it.Lets imagine,there is a printer machine on the 3th floor,in the conference room.Probably i hacked it one or two weeks ago.Then,IT deparment changed the printer.Do i still need roll Matrix perception test to know his ID, IP to hack it or all i just need is to know that the printer is there?
Can i spot devices in the specifica room?There are mini and micro drones,and if i saw them in my 100m radius,can i say-Roll Matrix Perception "Is it any Drones in this or that room?"
 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Halinn on <11-21-15/1018:03>
I can't find an answer to this otherwise I wouldn't be asking.  It is a faq/ fact checking.  So I was looking at life modules and the sample character they show at the end on page 84-86 and I noticed an issue.  On the first table the character picks up Computer and by the 4th table he picks up the electronics skill group but they still have the computer skill listed at the end.  So what happens in this case?  Just thought i point out the issue and try to find an answer to a question in the process.

For life modules, when you get a skill group, you just add it to the skills.

Page 66: "If a skill group is selected but previous selections have made skills in the group have different value, simply add one rank to each skill in the group"
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Cesar 052 on <12-01-15/1748:18>
I know it probably has already been asked but, do shapeshifters have regeneration, dual natured, silver vulnerability and a severe allergy toward silver?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: gradivus on <12-01-15/2114:56>
I know it probably has already been asked but, do shapeshifters have regeneration, dual natured, silver vulnerability and a severe allergy toward silver?

no on all counts

but on the bright side there's nothing stopping them from using implant, in both forms, now.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kiirnodel on <12-02-15/2138:40>
Quote from: gradivus link=topic=11514.msg416066#msg416066internalwaredate=1449022496
I know it probably has already been asked but, do shapeshifters have regeneration, dual natured, silver vulnerability and a severe allergy toward silver?

no on all counts

but on the bright side there's nothing stopping them from using implant, in both forms, now.

The Shift power ejects all non-deltaware and all non fully internal ware. So Shifters still can't implant most ware if they want to keep it.

Side Note: I'm not convinced the lack of all those powers was intentional...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: gradivus on <12-08-15/2326:50>
Quote from: gradivus link=topic=11514.msg416066#msg416066internalwaredate=1449022496
I know it probably has already been asked but, do shapeshifters have regeneration, dual natured, silver vulnerability and a severe allergy toward silver?

no on all counts

but on the bright side there's nothing stopping them from using implant, in both forms, now.

The Shift power ejects all non-deltaware and all non fully internal ware. So Shifters still can't implant most ware if they want to keep it.

Side Note: I'm not convinced the lack of all those powers was intentional...

so your saying the shift power from Aetherology IS the rule for the shift power in Run Faster because Run Faster does not have rules for it... does that also mean the Vanish power in Aetherology is the power that Pixie's have? Beccause up to this point, your the first Catylyst Demo member to link the two as far as I know.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kiirnodel on <12-09-15/0515:00>
The Shift power ejects all non-deltaware and all non fully internal ware. So Shifters still can't implant most ware if they want to keep it.

Side Note: I'm not convinced the lack of all those powers was intentional...

so your saying the shift power from Aetherology IS the rule for the shift power in Run Faster because Run Faster does not have rules for it... does that also mean the Vanish power in Aetherology is the power that Pixie's have? Beccause up to this point, your the first Catylyst Demo member to link the two as far as I know.

First up, I just want to make sure it is clear, I'm a Demo Agent, not Catalyst staff. I run Missions at conventions, I don't have any more access to official rules than you do.

The Shift power in Aetherology is an official printing for the Shift power in Fifth Edition, so it would be my go-to for an official rule. It is also not a huge change from the 4th edition version of the power.

Vanish has a semi-official response. The Missions FAQ has touched on that issue. The Vanish for Pixies is a drawback, it makes them completely disappear when they die. It is somewhat related, but different from the power. If you want the full write-up, take a look at the Runner's Companion from 4th or the newest Missions FAQ v0.1
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: NoxMortem on <12-22-15/1727:21>
Do essence holes now exist in SR5 or do they not exist? The google search revealed many many posts all referring to "it is in the missions and should be in the cyberware/bioware book". Now chrome & flesh is out but there is no rule about essence holes in it.  The only rule in all SR5 publications I am aware of mentioning it is page 156 chrome & flesh which says: genetech does never ever create an essence hole, beside I could not find a rule in SR5 stating that anything does create one.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kiirnodel on <12-23-15/1636:58>
Do essence holes now exist in SR5 or do they not exist? The google search revealed many many posts all referring to "it is in the missions and should be in the cyberware/bioware book". Now chrome & flesh is out but there is no rule about essence holes in it.  The only rule in all SR5 publications I am aware of mentioning it is page 156 chrome & flesh which says: genetech does never ever create an essence hole, beside I could not find a rule in SR5 stating that anything does create one.

As far as I'm aware there is no explicit rules reference for "essence holes" as you said. However there is plenty of support for the concept. You already mentioned that genetech states that the essence loss from it cannot be recovered. There is also genetech specifically for regaining lost essence, which when combined with the fact that the core rules say 'ware lowers essence (but never says removing it gives it back) we have the concept of an essence hole.

Now, the only issue is that as far as I'm aware, SR5 does not have an explicit rule for the ability to implant 'ware and have it take away from the "hole" first before digging into fresh essence.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Halinn on <12-23-15/2128:33>
Authors have said that the only reason essence holes aren't mentioned in Chrome Flesh is that they erroneously thought that it was already in the core book.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ - Mount RC and Drone duel weapons
Post by: ClaytonCross on <01-05-16/2330:04>
I posted about this severally to see if any of the senor guys had clear answers but I don't see one yet, they look like a good questions for FAQ.
http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=23026.0

1. According to the Mount descriptions they are capable of absorbing most if not all recoil for weapons they are designed/fitted with. If this is true a turret mounted on a building would have no RC limit and would never need to retarget or suffer a penalty from too much recoil. A drone however suffers a recoil to the chassis for mounted weapons. In that case it would seem like the RC of the weapon would be added to the bodies limit since mount is supposed to assist in managing the weapon but not using the weapons RC or having an RC listed on mounts results in an effective lose of any RC from the mount or the gun. While the real world is not always the best justification for gaming, I would say even a rotary drone IRL would be able to absorb some amount of recoil with sliders and gyros. So can mounts allow for some RC for drones ether by type (standard/heavy) or  by transference of weapon RC?

2. Clarification on duel wielding drones. Another topic discussed in the above post was the drones duel wielding weapons. A. Since they don't have an off hand they suffer no off hand penalty. B. They would need to only fire weapons of the same model in the same fire mode at the same time restricted by the running autosoft issueing group commands the way riggers do via RCC to control multipdrones. C. Targeting the same unit would only add burst rounds and recoil basically just like firing longer bursts. D. Actually multi targeting 2 units would either require a repeat instance of the autosoft to run for each additional mount/target or the drones are considered to be giving orders to the smartgun enable mounts that share and autosoft in which case the smartgun/mount systems are both running to autosoft on their own as turrets and they just act as separate attacks against different opponents (not the same one, that's burst damage) with a pre-shared recoil but independent burst round defense adjustments on their independent targets.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <01-17-16/2326:52>
Hey!

I want to defend from a Fireball spell. What do I do?

I want to defend from a grenade. What do I do?

I ask these two 'cause I've found all types of information:

Quote
Dodging explosions is not as easy as it seems in the movies. Apply a –2 modifier when trying to defend against weapons like spells, grenades, rockets, or missiles with a blast or area effect.

This is from CRB and page 190.

Also these two (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11290.msg208978#msg208978) posts (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11303.msg208773#msg208773) by Bull and they contradict each other by one day of difference.

Thanks in advance.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <01-17-16/2348:36>
Hey!

I want to defend from a Fireball spell. What do I do?

I want to defend from a grenade. What do I do?

I ask these two 'cause I've found all types of information:

Quote
Dodging explosions is not as easy as it seems in the movies. Apply a –2 modifier when trying to defend against weapons like spells, grenades, rockets, or missiles with a blast or area effect.

This is from CRB and page 190.

Also these two (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11290.msg208978#msg208978) posts (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11303.msg208773#msg208773) by Bull and they contradict each other by one day of difference.

Thanks in advance.
Those links don't necessarily contradict each other. They're just talking about general events vs specific events.

Direct and Indirect are 2 very broad categories of spells. Then you get down to whether it's singular target, or AOE. Singular target spells can be avoided b/c it's targeting you specifically and you can attempt to evade. AOE cannot be avoided b/c you can't really move fast enough to get out of the area.

When you're talking about Fireballs and grenades, you're looking at Indirect AOE specifically. So when a Fireball or grenade lands next to you, it explodes and affects anything and everything within the radius. There is no roll to evade or avoid the damage. There is only the roll to see how badly it hurts you for having been hit.

That little blurb you quoted about modifiers to AOE defense, is a pesky little line. All I can think, is that 2 teams of writers got together and talked about AOE stuff. Then they went their separate ways and never spoke again. One team eventually decided to make AOE unavoidable. The other team never heard that change, and went about writing rules for modifiers. But as we see, in the end, there is nothing to modify and thus that line is moot.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jim1701 on <01-19-16/1741:23>
Run and Gun has actions you can use vs. AOE attacks.  Run for your Life/Dive on the grenade on pg 125 for example. 

Also the line in the CRB about the -2 penalty is a mistake according to Aaron

http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11514.msg238706#msg238706 (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11514.msg238706#msg238706)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <01-19-16/1819:30>
Run and Gun has actions you can use vs. AOE attacks.  Run for your Life/Dive on the grenade on pg 125 for example. 

Also the line in the CRB about the -2 penalty is a mistake according to Aaron

http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11514.msg238706#msg238706 (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11514.msg238706#msg238706)

Ah! Thanks for the link. It was pretty much what I needed. Thanks again.

EDIT:

Quote
Yes we did: there's no defense test against grenades, indirect LOS (A) spells, and other "zones of damage."

Uh, there's no Defense Test for spells (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=11514.msg238999#msg238999) then. Run for your life is now very, very useful.

"The Damage Value of a successful indirect combat spell is Force + net hits, with an AP equal to –(Force)", page 283. What net hits? There is no opposed test.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <01-19-16/1920:50>
Quote
indirect LOS (A) spells
Indirect, as in Physical based spell that produces a physical effect (like a giant ball of flames which will catch anything flammable on fire as per usual. As opposed to Direct Mana based spells which are pure magical energies striking directly at the target's soul / aura / whatever.

LOS = Line of Sight, meaning that you can't shoot a Fireball around a blind corner. The best you can do is cast a Fireball at the intersection and hope when it explodes that the flames go around the corner.

(A) = Area of Effect, meaning that it doesn't just target an individual, it targets a location and affects everyone and everything in that location. When the Fireball spell goes off, it creates a huge rush of flames within the radius.

So...

There is no Defense Test for an Indirect, Line of Sight, Area of Effect spell like Fireball. You only get to soak the damage. It's basically a magical grenade, and will hurt anyone who happens to be close when it goes off.

There IS still a Defense Test for an Indirect, Line of Sight, non-AOE spell like Flamethrower. Which causes a jet of flame to leap out at the single person you intend on setting aflame. They get to dodge out of the way of the fiery spray, thus avoiding the damage if possible. If they don't get out of the way completely, they still get to soak the damage.

Direct spells such as Manabolt or Manaball, do not have "avoidance" Defense Tests at all. They are magically guided to hit the targets. But you do get to roll to "resist" the harmful effects. And after attempting to resist the effects, you also get to roll to soak the harmful damage that was left over.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <01-19-16/1931:32>
"The Damage Value of a successful indirect combat spell is Force + net hits, with an AP equal to –(Force)", page 283. What net hits? There is no opposed test.
There's no opposed test for Area Indirect spells, but there is a success test.

Quote from: SR5 p. 283
Area indirect spells travel from the magician to the point of detonation and then go boom. The test is like that for grenades (p. 181): a Spellcasting + Magic [Force] (3) Test with scatter of 2D6 meters. Unlike grenades, you get to add your net hits on this test to the Damage Value of the spell, but only if you beat the threshold; otherwise the spell still detonates, but the hits are used to reduce scatter by one meter per hit.

Net hits in this case are any hits beyond the 3 needed to land your spell on target.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <01-31-16/1127:41>
Note: Deleted previous post of mine to avoid double post.

"The Damage Value of a successful indirect combat spell is Force + net hits, with an AP equal to –(Force)", page 283. What net hits? There is no opposed test.
There's no opposed test for Area Indirect spells, but there is a success test.

Quote from: SR5 p. 283
Area indirect spells travel from the magician to the point of detonation and then go boom. The test is like that for grenades (p. 181): a Spellcasting + Magic [Force] (3) Test with scatter of 2D6 meters. Unlike grenades, you get to add your net hits on this test to the Damage Value of the spell, but only if you beat the threshold; otherwise the spell still detonates, but the hits are used to reduce scatter by one meter per hit.

Net hits in this case are any hits beyond the 3 needed to land your spell on target.

I see. Thanks a bunch.

Then now:

So - did we ever get any clarification from Gen Con... Did players get to take a defense test [of some sort] against grenades and indirect LOS (A) spells?

Yes we did: there's no defense test against grenades, indirect LOS (A) spells, and other "zones of damage." The defense against these attacks is to take precautions against them. This is really really really true, and been confirmed by multiple sources inside the company. So unless there's been a meeting somewhere to which I wasn't privy, you really really honestly and truly don't get to make a defense test against grenades or indirect LOS (A) spells.

Very well. Then can we please get an explanation as to how counterspelling is meant to be used against area spells? The text goes out of its way to describe how you can give the bonus to multiple people, but counterspelling only adds to defense tests, and area spells like Fireball have no such tests.

Spell defense dice are rolled against Indirect Combat spells the same way they're rolled against other spells with no defense test: you roll them as a dice pool of their own.

So, let's assume the Mage rolls against incoming Fireball. What happens in each scenario?

A) Mage  rolls Counterspell. He rolls 5 and enemy rolls 3 on Spellcasting. Mage wins with 2 net hits. Fireball dissapears, Mage is immune to Fireball or Mage's Counterspelling causes the Fireball to scatter?
B) Mage rolls Counterspell. He rolls 4 and enemy rolls 5 on Spellcasting. Mage loses with 1 net hit. Mage's hits are wasted? Does he reduces the "net htis of the grenade test" with his own hits? You know, the "The test is like that for grenades (p. 181): a Spellcasting + Magic [Force] (3) Test with scatter of 2D6 meters." on page 283, Core.
C) Mage rolls Counterspell. He rolls 3 and enemy rolls 3 on Spellcasting. What happens with the tie?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <01-31-16/1219:45>
So - did we ever get any clarification from Gen Con... Did players get to take a defense test [of some sort] against grenades and indirect LOS (A) spells?

Yes we did: there's no defense test against grenades, indirect LOS (A) spells, and other "zones of damage." The defense against these attacks is to take precautions against them. This is really really really true, and been confirmed by multiple sources inside the company. So unless there's been a meeting somewhere to which I wasn't privy, you really really honestly and truly don't get to make a defense test against grenades or indirect LOS (A) spells.

Very well. Then can we please get an explanation as to how counterspelling is meant to be used against area spells? The text goes out of its way to describe how you can give the bonus to multiple people, but counterspelling only adds to defense tests, and area spells like Fireball have no such tests.

Spell defense dice are rolled against Indirect Combat spells the same way they're rolled against other spells with no defense test: you roll them as a dice pool of their own.

So, let's assume the Mage rolls against incoming Fireball. What happens in each scenario?

A) Mage  rolls Counterspell. He rolls 5 and enemy rolls 3 on Spellcasting. Mage wins with 2 net hits. Fireball dissapears, Mage is immune to Fireball or Mage's Counterspelling causes the Fireball to scatter?
B) Mage rolls Counterspell. He rolls 4 and enemy rolls 5 on Spellcasting. Mage loses with 1 net hit. Mage's hits are wasted? Does he reduces the "net htis of the grenade test" with his own hits? You know, the "The test is like that for grenades (p. 181): a Spellcasting + Magic [Force] (3) Test with scatter of 2D6 meters." on page 283, Core.
C) Mage rolls Counterspell. He rolls 3 and enemy rolls 3 on Spellcasting. What happens with the tie?

I'm kinda torn by this one. Which is why I kinda hate this Aaron guy, sometimes his answers make no sense whatsoever.

We've already decided that the line in the book about "-2 to dodging explosions" is just supposed to be ignored, b/c there is no defense test to modify. Well by that logic, Counterspell shouldn't apply to a Fireball at all, b/c it's just another modifier to a non-existent defense test.

* If you do allow it to apply, then logically it makes you into Fireball repellant. So long as you can reduce the caster's net hits under the Threshold 3, the Fireball will scatter. According to Aaron, since there is no defense test, you're allowed to roll just your Counterspell skill. Which means you do not get to roll Reaction + Intuition + Counterspell... you only get to roll your Counterspell rating.

A) Assuming that for whatever reason, they rolled Spellcasting + Magic [Force] and only got 3 hits... while you only rolled Counterspell and got 5 hits (statistically meaning you've got Counterspell 15)... since they didn't get their Threshold 3, the Fireball would scatter.

B) Again, assuming you've got Counterspell 12 to mathematically score 4 hits... since the caster didn't get his Threshold 3, the Fireball will still scatter.

C) Once again, assuming you've got Counterspell 9 and they suck at rolling their full dice pool... the caster still didn't beat Threshold 3, so it scatters.

If you're allowed to use Counterspell for AOE spells, the only way it's going to land on target is if the caster overcomes your check in addition to the Threshold 3. Which really shouldn't be too difficult realistically. They're rolling Magic 6 + Spellcasting 6 + Combat spec 2 = 14 dice averaging 5 hits. You've only got Counterspell 6 averaging 2 hits, giving them just enough to meet the Threshold.

** But... the easier answer would be to say that Counterspell doesn't apply to Fireballs, for the same reason we don't worry about the -2 to defense against AOE. You can use it to avoid a Flamethrower or Lightning Bolt, but AOE is just targeting a point in space that you happen to be near.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <01-31-16/1237:33>
I'm kinda torn by this one. Which is why I kinda hate this Aaron guy, sometimes his answers make no sense whatsoever.

We've already decided that the line in the book about "-2 to dodging explosions" is just supposed to be ignored, b/c there is no defense test to modify. Well by that logic, Counterspell shouldn't apply to a Fireball at all, b/c it's just another modifier to a non-existent defense test.

* If you do allow it to apply, then logically it makes you into Fireball repellant. So long as you can reduce the caster's net hits under the Threshold 3, the Fireball will scatter. According to Aaron, since there is no defense test, you're allowed to roll just your Counterspell skill. Which means you do not get to roll Reaction + Intuition + Counterspell... you only get to roll your Counterspell rating.

A) Assuming that for whatever reason, they rolled Spellcasting + Magic [Force] and only got 3 hits... while you only rolled Counterspell and got 5 hits (statistically meaning you've got Counterspell 15)... since they didn't get their Threshold 3, the Fireball would scatter.

B) Again, assuming you've got Counterspell 12 to mathematically score 4 hits... since the caster didn't get his Threshold 3, the Fireball will still scatter.

C) Once again, assuming you've got Counterspell 9 and they suck at rolling their full dice pool... the caster still didn't beat Threshold 3, so it scatters.

If you're allowed to use Counterspell for AOE spells, the only way it's going to land on target is if the caster overcomes your check in addition to the Threshold 3. Which really shouldn't be too difficult realistically. They're rolling Magic 6 + Spellcasting 6 + Combat spec 2 = 14 dice averaging 5 hits. You've only got Counterspell 6 averaging 2 hits, giving them just enough to meet the Threshold.

** But... the easier answer would be to say that Counterspell doesn't apply to Fireballs, for the same reason we don't worry about the -2 to defense against AOE. You can use it to avoid a Flamethrower or Lightning Bolt, but AOE is just targeting a point in space that you happen to be near.

Or you know, good luck, Edge, Background and/or some sort of penalty. I think I will go with the "defender's hits takes away attacker's hits" you suggest. Seems the most balanced to me (maybe 'cause I don't really adore Mages in general). If someone else has a better idea, please let me know. I am all ears eyes.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <01-31-16/1443:15>
Keep in mind, you only get to roll the Counterspell skill itself.

Enemy caster shoots a Fireball. They roll Spellcasting 6 + Magic 6 + Combat spec 2 + Spell Focus 4 = 18 dice, Edging to re-roll 6's and ignore Limits. Statistically, they get 6 hits and reroll 3 of those for an extra hit, 7 hits total.

You on the other hand, may not have maxed your Counterspell skill right out the gate, since you probably wanted to be better at casting than avoiding casting. So your Spellcasting is 6, but your Counterspell is only 3-4. That means you only get to roll 3-4 dice to avoid the Fireball. Statistically, that's only 1 hit.

So you take the caster's check down to 6 hits, which is still more than enough to beat the Threshold 3, and even gives them +3 damage. It could have been +4 damage, but somehow your Counterspell training makes you into a magic deflector shield? And what's more, just standing in the middle of your group means you are deflecting the Fireball away from the whole group. You're like the opposite of a lightning rod.

That's why I think the better approach is to disallow Counterspell for Fireballs and such. Nowhere does it say that Counterspell gives you a magical radius of magic repellant. It's supposed to keep YOU safe from targeted effects. Or you can choose to extend that protection to a limited number of friends. But you could stand in a crowded room and cause the Fireball to reflect off entirely, protected who knows how many people at once. So for my money, I'd say it just doesn't work. The Fireball isn't targeting YOU or your friends. It's targeting a point in space, nothing more. The flames it creates aren't magical flames to be resisted, it's just fire. It's not different than teleporting a grenade (if teleportation were possible) and then letting the grenade explode.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <01-31-16/1502:46>
Keep in mind, you only get to roll the Counterspell skill itself.

Enemy caster shoots a Fireball. They roll Spellcasting 6 + Magic 6 + Combat spec 2 + Spell Focus 4 = 18 dice, Edging to re-roll 6's and ignore Limits. Statistically, they get 6 hits and reroll 3 of those for an extra hit, 7 hits total.

You on the other hand, may not have maxed your Counterspell skill right out the gate, since you probably wanted to be better at casting than avoiding casting. So your Spellcasting is 6, but your Counterspell is only 3-4. That means you only get to roll 3-4 dice to avoid the Fireball. Statistically, that's only 1 hit.

So you take the caster's check down to 6 hits, which is still more than enough to beat the Threshold 3, and even gives them +3 damage. It could have been +4 damage, but somehow your Counterspell training makes you into a magic deflector shield? And what's more, just standing in the middle of your group means you are deflecting the Fireball away from the whole group. You're like the opposite of a lightning rod.

That's why I think the better approach is to disallow Counterspell for Fireballs and such. Nowhere does it say that Counterspell gives you a magical radius of magic repellant. It's supposed to keep YOU safe from targeted effects. Or you can choose to extend that protection to a limited number of friends. But you could stand in a crowded room and cause the Fireball to reflect off entirely, protected who knows how many people at once. So for my money, I'd say it just doesn't work. The Fireball isn't targeting YOU or your friends. It's targeting a point in space, nothing more. The flames it creates aren't magical flames to be resisted, it's just fire. It's not different than teleporting a grenade (if teleportation were possible) and then letting the grenade explode.

You assume too much. So many dices makes a suicidal mage go down quickly by himself, unless Reagents and tricks. But it's true, the Spellcaster has better odds than the Counterspeller.

I have no issues with a Counterspeller being a kind of magic shield. You still gotta beat the odds and the mental image of someone doing a mean look to a Fireball and causing it to scatter somehwere else, is pretty awesome.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <01-31-16/1554:45>
You assume too much. So many dices makes a suicidal mage go down quickly by himself, unless Reagents and tricks. But it's true, the Spellcaster has better odds than the Counterspeller.

I have no issues with a Counterspeller being a kind of magic shield. You still gotta beat the odds and the mental image of someone doing a mean look to a Fireball and causing it to scatter somewhere else, is pretty awesome.
I'm not sure what you mean, too many dice makes a suicidal mage?

And I'm sure you are happy with the idea of a magical Star Trek deflector shield that always works to your benefit and never against you... But that's not how the game was written.

Core pg 76 details the Magic Resistance quality. It does say that it could potentially make a Fireball bounce away, even though it maxes out at Rating 4 (and it's referring to Spell Resistance tests which we know don't apply to Indirect AOEs anymore). However, it's also a permanent effect that cannot be voluntarily lowered. So someone with true Magic Resistance cannot be magically Healed, and cannot participate in spells that require a voluntary subject. Also, they themselves cannot have a Magic rating.

So... for the sake of game balance, being a Mage who casts Fireballs left and right, I'm just not seeing this cheap skill (hmm, should I train Pistols or another rank in Counterspell) providing such an auspicious bonus. As I said before, it clearly works for targeted effects. But glaring menacingly at a grenade does you no good.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <02-02-16/0239:40>
I'm kinda torn by this one. Which is why I kinda hate this Aaron guy, sometimes his answers make no sense whatsoever.
You know what? Look at Aaron's signature:
"I like to answer questions, but my answers are not official and don't necessarily reflect the opinions of Catalyst Game Labs or its employees. I might even be wrong."

We at least had someone step up and take their time to answer questions, even when they only had the status of a FAQ the often enough helped people to continue playing the game.
But as usual, the more questions you try to answer the higher the chance that some answer might not be the ideal solution for a given problem.

Congratulations! You have found one - and again, you're very late to the party: http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=19395.msg345521#msg345521 (http://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=19395.msg345521#msg345521)

I suggest you improve your Matrix Search dice pools when you already know that the forums are a good source for answers ;)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <02-02-16/0937:30>
... you already know that the forums are a good source for answers ;)
FTFY =)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <02-15-16/1711:12>
Hey, it's me again!

Street Grimoire, 105. Radiation Burst and Radiation Beam. Do Mentor Spirit and/or Bone Lacing/Density apply to resist Radiation damage?

Thanks.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <02-15-16/1729:36>
Street Grimoire pg 105, Elemental Damage - Radiation
Quote
Radiation attacks cause Physical damage. Armor provides no dice to resist Radiation damage, unless it has an upgrade to provide Radiation resistance, which provides dice equal to its rating for the Damage Resistance Test and the following Toxin Resistance Test. Treat every Radiation attack that hits as a toxin causing Nausea (see Toxins, p. 408, SR5) with a DV equal to net hits of the attack (before the Damage Resistance roll).
Physical damage in general is soaked by Body + Armor. Armor is ignored for the Radiation damage, but the Body bonuses would still apply. As would the Bear Mentor Spirit's +2 to resist damage, since it's not armor as much as just general hardiness.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: NoxMortem on <03-03-16/1527:11>
Do defenders roll any defense test against INDIRECT AREA COMBAT spells? How is spell defense to apply? I am aware of the answer aaron gave in this thread way above but the answers there suddenly stopped with many many questions left open.

They should be treated like grenades, which means there is no defense test and the only action you can take is "RUN FOR YOUR LIFE". If spell defense is applicable, which the example on page 48 for critical glitches shows, when is it to apply. Also the fireball example tells that everyone defended by the spell defense against the fireball gets +4 on his DEFENSE test, which tere is none.

If aaron was right and everyone rolls for his own, does he roll with REA+INT or only with ANTIMAGIC. How is scatter handled?

Edit: If this still was never cleared up until now, that would be an answer as well.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <03-03-16/1617:37>
Do defenders roll any defense test against INDIRECT AREA COMBAT spells? How is spell defense to apply? I am aware of the answer aaron gave in this thread way above but the answers there suddenly stopped with many many questions left open.

They should be treated like grenades, which means there is no defense test and the only action you can take is "RUN FOR YOUR LIFE". If spell defense is applicable, which the example on page 48 for critical glitches shows, when is it to apply. Also the fireball example tells that everyone defended by the spell defense against the fireball gets +4 on his DEFENSE test, which tere is none.

If aaron was right and everyone rolls for his own, does he roll with REA+INT or only with ANTIMAGIC. How is scatter handled?

Edit: If this still was never cleared up until now, that would be an answer as well.
They really haven't covered this "officially" with errata or anything.

The way the Core was written, at one point they expected defense rolls for grenades and explosions. Then later on they changed their minds and took those away (except for "Run For Your Life" as you pointed out). But they never really went back and fixed up any of the other entries.

The quickest and easiest solution is to ignore Spell Defense in this regard. Indirect AOEs aren't targeting anyone, it's targeting a point in space. And the flames it produces (assuming Fireball) are non-magical and wouldn't be affected by Spell Defense anyway. The best you could hope to do is deflect the point of origin, causing some degree of Scatter. But you would only get the few Counterspell dice towards that effort, if you chose to allow it at all. But that really means that learning any amount of Counterspell turns you into a magic repellant, which sounds way too powerful IMO.

For my money, I'd say it just doesn't work. =)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lucean on <03-04-16/0236:11>
To not make indirect AoE immune to counterspelling, one could apply Spell Defense dice to the soak test.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <03-04-16/0807:58>
To not make indirect AoE immune to counterspelling, one could apply Spell Defense dice to the soak test.
Except the flames aren't magical. That's like letting them use Spell Defense against grenade shrapnel.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SichoPhiend on <03-04-16/0904:30>
Before I chime in on a thread I was involved way back and what we came up with that seemed to make sense, I need to ask,

Since when have the effects of indirect spells been non-magical?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <03-04-16/0932:12>
Since when have the effects of indirect spells been non-magical?
This. Any acid spell is a good example as magical acid dissipates after the first combat turn, unlike real, physical acid which does not. Fire and Ice seems to be exceptions in that magical fire may cause flammable materials to catch on (real, physical) fire.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SichoPhiend on <03-04-16/1240:51>
Which is an argument for them being magical, not non-magical.  Just like their AP being based on Force instead of elemental effects AP.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <03-04-16/1440:07>
Which is an argument for them being magical, not non-magical.  Just like their AP being based on Force instead of elemental effects AP.
Absolutely; that's what I was agreeing with you on :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sternenwind on <03-05-16/1129:54>
Can an AI, with pilot origin, running themselves on a drone (DT p156 AI Vehicle Combat) profit from a RCCs Sharing function (SR5 p267)? Can it use the Autosofts (SR5 p269) running on a RCC?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <03-05-16/1243:16>
Can an AI, with pilot origin, running themselves on a drone (DT p156 AI Vehicle Combat) profit from a RCCs Sharing function (SR5 p267)? Can it use the Autosofts (SR5 p269) running on a RCC?
Data Trails pg 156, AI Vehicle Combat
Quote
AIs can run themselves on drones that have available program slots (see Autosofts, p. 269, SR5), or they may choose to use the Control Device action from an RCC, cyberdeck, or commlink...

Only AIs with the Pilot Origins quality may use autosofts in place of active skills, they also use their Depth in place of the Pilot rating of vehicles/ drones they are running on.
I would say that if they are Jumped Into the drone itself, then they have to use the Autosofts running locally. Since they themselves are a program running on the drone itself, that would (in my mind at least) trigger the rule about only running local programs or shared programs, not both.

If they are merely using Control Device remotely from the RCC, then they could use the Autosofts on the RCC, but they won't benefit from any of the Control Rig type bonuses (dice pools, Limits, thresholds).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sternenwind on <03-05-16/1338:55>
 I withdraw my question.

I found the answer i was looking for.
Quote from: SR5 p267
One caveat: if a drone is running any of its own autosofts, it cannot benefit from
the RCC’s autosofts.

thx for feedback
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: NoxMortem on <03-05-16/1723:17>
How does the damage compensator in SR5 is supposed to work. Does a rating 4 compensator work like similar positve/negative quality, spell, adept power and does simply ignore its rating on both monitors OR does one have to split the rating to both monitors. e.g. A rating 4 damage compensator bioware can ignore 4-0,3-1,2-2,1-3,0-4 damage on the physical/mental monitor. The reason I ask is because the wording has significantly changed in shadowrun 5 from shadowrun 4:

Quote
SR4A(p347): The user may ignore a number of damage boxes (both Physical and Stun) equal to the compensator’s rating before determining injury modifiers.
SR5e(p 460): You ignore a number of damage boxes (your choice of Physical, Stun, or a combination of the two) equal to the compensator’s Rating before determining your injury modifiers.

If it has to be split now, why was the compensator changed from all other similar injury modification damage box ignoration rules? Availability and essence cost stayed the same while the prices was significantly reduced. If it does not have to be split and works like in 4th edition, why would someone ever choose not to apply the full rating to both monitors? If it has to be split when has one to decide how it is split? As it is bioware and therefore cloned tissue it seems not like there is a on/off switch so do I have to buy a 3-1 damage compensator? Can I choose how to split whenever I feel like?

Personally I assume it works exactly like in 4th edition but several people argue: Why wouldn't they have used the same wording if it has not changed?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <03-05-16/1809:14>
Yes, by that wording it has to be split up. With a Rating 4, you have 4 boxes to distribute. Like you said that can be 4/0 or 2/2 or 0/4 however you want it distributed. Obviously they thought giving you 4/4 was overpowered, so they dialed it back this edition.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: NoxMortem on <03-05-16/1818:12>
Do you have to decide how to split up when you buy the compensator?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <03-05-16/1825:21>
Ehh... bioware is weird. It's not cyberware, so there isn't an actual interface to log in and change settings. But I also don't think that bioware is constantly running, or else Synaptic Boosters would drive people bonkers when the whole world is perpetually slow motion.

The book doesn't say one way or the other, so it's up to GM interpretation. For my money, I'd say that it has to be activated as a Free Action (Adrenaline Pump is one of the only Bioware that specifies being activated, and says it's a Free action, so that's my basis). And when you activate it, you decide where to put the 4 boxes. After it's activated, you have to wait until the end of the scene to turn it off and reset it. So no rearranging mid-combat.

But that's just me. Your GM may very well say you have to decide the distribution at purchase and implantation, and it cannot be changed afterwards.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: NoxMortem on <03-06-16/0413:12>
Don't get me wrong, I thank you very much for your explanation, but is this how others read this as well? Beeing over-correct the wording does not necessarily require a splitting up at all as a combination (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/combination) does not implicate a sum. For a rating 4 compensator this can be very easily and correctly read as a "physical, or mental or (physical and mental)=4 boxes compensation" which would be physical=4 boxes or mental=4 boxes or physical=4 boxes and mental=4 boxes. The wording does not require a "(physical, or mental or (physical + mental))=4" which would be physical=4 or mental=4 or physical+mental=4.

Was this topic already discussed at some earlier point? How do demo teams interpret this? Has this come up maybe in one of the mission games/faqs?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <03-06-16/0621:43>
I read that as:

You have <compensator rating> Worth of Stun and/or physical.
So: a rating 4 DC, would give you 0 stun 4 physical. OR 4 stun 0 physical OR  1 stun 3 physical. Or any other combination of damage up to the total of the compensator.


As to WHY it was changed... Keep in mind this is only my opinion, with no communication from anyone at CGL, nor a freelancer, and is expressed in my own words.

"To stop rules lawyering armor and DC stacking, cheese monkeys from being a the whiny, rules lawyering armor and DC stacking, cheese monkeys that they are?"

Do you KNOW how many times I heard the argument in 4e of: "Well, I have a Damage compensator of 9, and a stun track of 8. So OBVIOUSLY the damage compensator makes me totally ignore stun damage, including falling unconscious when it's exceeded. Combine that with 45 points of armor from loading armor into all my cyber limbs, demal plated, and welding 3 shields - 1 for each ass cheek and an other directly to my face, I am totally unkillable as nothing can penetrate my armor. THUS all attacks that don't penetrate have ZERO effect! Which for the record, is nothing short of a combined Thor shot."

And other types of Cheese lawyering that went on? As to why they are not ALL like that... different writers for each section? The cyber section just happened to have been a freelancer who got VERY sick of hearing the above argument ad-nausium??


But, that's just a guess... 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: NoxMortem on <03-06-16/0942:14>
Thank you for the answer Reaver! What I don't exactly see why one can't make the same argument you quote from 4e in 5e? Ok, he now needs to split between physical or mental damage, but wouldn't he be able to make the exact same statement as the one you quote?

Just to be clear, personally I would only apply it to injury modifiers and not to the condition when to fall unconscious. I just wonder why the change to split the boxes affects the quote in any way?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jim1701 on <03-07-16/1201:06>
My GM ruling on Damage Compensators would be to declare at the time the damage is taken.  It doesn't make sense to me to do it any other way. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <03-07-16/2149:12>
My GM ruling on Damage Compensators would be to declare at the time the damage is taken.  It doesn't make sense to me to do it any other way.
Ooh, that's a good idea! It automatically buffers the first 4 boxes of damage you take, however that may be.

Good thinking Jim, I knew there was a reason we kept you around. ;)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jocan2003 on <04-12-16/1837:23>
So ive been having a nice discussion with my shadowrun group about agents skill.

1. Agents by default doesnt have electronic warfare skill, is it an oversight? If not i found a workaround but we are having hard discussion about the legitimacy of my argument.

In core Page.246
Quote
An agent
runs as a program and can use programs running on
the same device as them.

In Rigger 5 Page.127
Quote
Some skills are Restricted or Forbidden. Those will be
indicated on the individual autosoft profile. Remember
also that an autosoft is designed for only a single drone;
you cannot slot a Clearsoft autosoft designed for an Aztechnology
Crawler into an Evo Proletarian. (Well, you
can; it just doesn’t do anything.)

In core Page. 267
Quote
The Sharing rating is the number of autosofts
you can run on the RCC that simultaneously run on all
slaved drones at the same time. One caveat: if a drone is
running any of its own autosofts, it cannot benefit from
the RCC’s autosofts.

Using these 3 quote i come to the conclusion, i could have an agent on my RCC using a virtual machine hardwired in and my agent could teamroll for assist a drone running autosoft from the RCC?

Can i push it as to he assist me if i am rigged in? Since its the autosoft running are for the drone im rigged in?
--------

2. Another question that bangs my way around. Using the juggernaut, he has weapon mounts in his cyberarms, if my drone uses the weapon from his cyberarm mounted weapon its a simple action right? But what if im rigged in? Since i become the drone wouldnt it be simple action too? or complex gunnery thingy?

3. Another related question, if in the other hand the Juggernaut has the weapon in hand, would it be simple or complex action, i mean i AM the drone now and drones combat action follows the same rule as for meat action right?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <04-12-16/1925:21>
1) Agents are like a baby AI, programmed and designed to be an assistant Hacker. They cannot be run on an RCC b/c it's not a hacker tool, it's a Rigger tool. The reason why they only know Computer, Hacking, and Cybercombat is b/c they are a purely Matrix entity. Electronic Warfare is a skill that jams real world tech, and they only live inside the Matrix.

Even if that weren't the case, they cannot assist you or the drone. Agents can't "use" Autosofts, so they won't have the EW skill. Autosofts are software that only works for drones, just like Agents are software that really only works for Decks. Even if the RCC is sharing out the Autosoft, it's the drone running it. And if you were Jumped In to the drone, then it wouldn't be running anything since Jumping In basically suppresses the drone Pilot program completely. You are 100% in control of the drone.

2) Drones live in a difficult middle ground between "personnel" and "vehicles". Attacking with a vehicle mounted weapon is always a Complex action, even though it would be Simple for a person with the same weapon. Even if you Jump In and take control of the drone's Cyberlimbs, it's still using the Vehicle rules which makes it a Complex action.

3) "Technically" if your drone had hands and fingers, and were simply grasping an ordinary firearm, that wouldn't be a "vehicle mounted weapon" and would still be a Simple action. Really all it boils down to is these writers suck at their jobs and left a bunch of illogical flaws in place. Such as when does a drone count as a person, and when does it count as a vehicle?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <04-12-16/2010:24>
1. Depending on who you ask, agent programs can run on RCCs just fine. The rules are unclear on this point so its up to table interpretation. Marcus thinks they shouldn't, I think they should. My reasoning is that an RCC can run any program a deck can, and agents remain a cyberprogram be definition.

I also wouldn't necessarily agree with Marcus on the usage of autosoft, as agents are much like pilots and can use any program loaded on the device they are running on. Operating under the assumption that an agent can run on an RCC (see above), I would say it's likely that said agent could use all programs on the RCC which would include autosofts.

2. I agree with Marcus on this one. Gunnery with a vehicle mounted weapon is a complex action for some reason. This gets even weirder if the drone picked up a weapon in its mechanical arms and used it...

3. Yep. See above :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <04-12-16/2025:53>
Herr B kinda highlighted my point... Agent programs are like drone Pilot programs. Both are semi-AI programs that make your devices function unattended. Only Agents are for hacking with a Deck, existing entirely in the Matrix and doing Matrix things. And Pilot programs operate on drones which wander around the real world. Since Agents are clueless about the real world, they wouldn't know what to do with Autosofts even if they could run them. This has already been illustrated in Data Trails, when they said only Pilot Origin AI can Jump into drones, and run Autosofts. Other forms of AI can't, and Agents aren't even on the same level of complexity as full fledged AI.

Furthermore, RCCs don't "use" the Autosofts, they just make the data network accessible so the drones can use it. Just like how your USB thumb drive doesn't "use" the music or movies you have saved on it, it's just the place where your PC looks to find the files.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: adzling on <04-12-16/2037:35>
Yeah I think Marcus has it with Agents = Pilots for Matrix.
The two experiences (VR vs. real) are so vastly different that you need both an Agent and Pilot to deal.
Otherwise you would be an A.I. ;-)

I disagree with both of them re: anthro drones.
I seem to remember somewhere (in Rigger 5.0?) that humanoid anthro drones use regular firearms and melee attack skills when rigged in.
The defining line is that they have real arms/ hands/ fingers that allow them to pick up and manipulate different weapons and such.

Anyhoo ymmv.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <04-12-16/2048:50>
And this does highlight a problem with vague rules; three people, three different interpretations :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <04-12-16/2340:03>
There is a reason why the written word is considered the least exact form of communication.....
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jocan2003 on <04-13-16/0447:03>
I was mainly thinking about the Juggernaut drone since in the description he has 2 cyberlimb and they are to be considered the same as the metahuman counterpart exept with it comes down to price since there is no flesh/electronics connection/adaptor.

The juggernaut has 2 cyberarms wich are identical to the metahuman counterpart exept for flesh/electronics adaptor hence thereduced price. So if a metahuman can pick up a weapon and use it in a simple action, there is no reason to make it a complex action if the rigger is jumped in and use the weapon with the cyberarm hands.

Also my reasoning about the mounted weapon if the following, If the weapon were mounted on a swivel of some sort on the drone hull i would understand, but if the weapon is mounted on the exteriorof the cyberarm, wouldnt it be the same as a metahuman using an weapon modified to be a cyberweapon mounted on the inside of the limb? Thus using simple action? I mean the only difference in these case is outside vs inside mounted of the weapon.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <04-13-16/0813:27>
Yep, and unfortunately in this case, as with just about everything else SR5 has done so far, the rules are poorly written making the answer unclear.

Drones are tiny vehicles. So they fit in the space a person would, but they use vehicle rules for a majority of their actions. And vehicles don't get much in the way of Simple actions. Everything you do with a vehicle is Complex.

So while I see the argument for humanoid arms holding a typical rifle, if the weapon is "mounted" to the drone then it would be treated as a "mounted weapon." According to the rules.

Now, if Pegasus were writing the English version instead of just the German version, then we'd probably have a better understanding of all the rules in general.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kiirnodel on <04-13-16/1645:08>
Marcus, I'm not sure why you seem to be taking the rules editing so personally, but you are injecting confrontation where it doesn't need to be at this point. It seems like every chance you get you are making some sort of rude comment about the writers or even just Catalyst directly, even when there is no call for it. I know that there is a general unrest with some of the rules and the "standard of writing" but it really doesn't need to be rehashed every other post you make. And making comments like "if Pegasus were writing..." is completely unfounded. Pegasus is only translating and localizing content, they haven't written any rules so we have no basis for how they would do at it. We haven't even gotten absolute confirmation that Pegasus does the clarifications themselves. For all we know, it could be a fluke in translation, there has already been positive proof that different translations get different results (see discussion about Good Cover, difference between French and German).

In this particular discussion there doesn't even seem to be a rules ambiguity, a drone shooting is a complex action. Nothing ambiguous about it. Maybe it's because they have to take the extra processing time to confirm target lock...

I would also like to note that while I am a member of the Catalyst Demo Team, I do not speak for Catalyst in any way. I am simply speaking up because I feel the repeated negative commentary is unnecessary and inappropriate to the discussion.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <04-13-16/1703:45>
Marcus Gideon
In the absence of a "Like" button I'll just state for the record that I support Kiirnodel's comments 100%. There's constructive criticism, and then there's just criticism; many of your comments cannot objectively be labeled "constructive" in my opinion, and I too feel like the repetitive negative commentary is unnecessary.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jocan2003 on <04-14-16/1726:00>
In SR5 drone/vehicule needed both condition to be filled to be a total unrepairable wreck, in R5 it now seem to only be physical, is that what was really meant to be? From SR5 page 270
Quote
If the chassis and the electronics of your drone get
trashed, it will probably cost you more to fix it than buy a
new one. But if it has sentimental value, ain’t it worth it?

Says here its a possibility to repair it, while in R5 page 29
Quote
If all of the boxes on its Condition
Monitor are filled, then sorry chummer, your baby is totaled (but I know a guy on Maynard who can give you a
good deal on a refurb).

Seem to indicate repair is impossible after only phys being filled? Is that really the intention? Moving from having both condition track filled to only 1 for totaling a vehicule/drone? Thats kinda of a big finger to riggers in that case....

Whats the official word on this?

Edit: Why i find it interesting. Using the juggernaut as example using a single high power sniper shot you can totally fill the condition monitor if the rolls arent in your favor, that would really totally wreck that beast with no chances of repair? I understand if the drones stepped on an anti-vehicule mine or get shot with a anti-tank cannon... but being grinded with low power bullets or a single high power snipershot shouldnt make a total mess of the drone and could still be repairable. Now if matrix AND phys were to be filled up or have phys overflow to move toward matrix damage like it were short circuit yeah i could understand that invesment would be quite high. But again should make a vehicule irreparable either... The cost is still there isnt it?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <04-14-16/1839:05>
jocan
Vehicles have always had a single condition monitor in SR5, as they are immune to Stun damage. As for filling both Matrix and Physical; I for one never interpreted the statement on page 270 to mean that a physically destroyed vehicle could somehow be repaired just because it's electronics were still functional.

I will agree that the notion introduced by Rigger 5.0 of a vehicle being destroyed completely beyond repair is a little odd, and one we house quite simply ruled away.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <04-14-16/2153:35>
Ultrasound, CRB 446 and 452. How well do you "see" with an Ultrasound sensor in your headware? Like Daredevil/Matt Murdock or just a rough topographic map?  Do you get Blind Fire penalty against an invisible enemy?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: jocan2003 on <04-14-16/2234:37>
Personaly i see it like daredevil like vision exept maybe with less details, might not be able to see the exact contour of lips, eye brows and stuff like that but see the general shape of items/ppl. Also some material might be able to absorb the soundwaves making it look like an infinite corridor since there is no bounceback

My house rule and in no way is it official. The way i work is you throw a perception test/ewar test against a set threshold similar to a sensor attack but without the locking, if you succeed you get reduced negative for each net hits.and it counts as a simple action, pretty much like the observe in details action but using sensors instead of flesh sensory input. Keep in mind... if the sensor the player is using is olfactory... that wont help much trying to find where the guy is behind that smoke cover. But if the player choose to he can use a simple action oberve in details and try to find the target using a mean of his choosing and i adapt a threshold from there.

I mean sure a smoke can hide visualy the enemy, but i can clearly see somebody squinting in the hope to see a shadow or mass moving behind the smoke and reduce the negative accordingly.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Dinendae on <04-15-16/0000:18>
I've always mentally pictured ultrasound as being similar to those 3D sonar images you see now; they show a surprising level of detail, but they're not as good with lots of clutter around.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <04-15-16/0022:12>
On phone so next to impossible to link :(

But google 'Ultrasonic building pictures' to get an idea of what you would see. All 'greyscale' as the density of objects is shown. Enough detail to identify objects but not enough to actually read anything (so no note reading).

Or, that is what i expect from the technology in 70 years based off of what I have seen from non-destructive ultrasonic field testing eqiupment.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <04-15-16/0834:33>
Does Shock Weave (Run & Gun page 85) inflict 8S(e) with or without an AP of -5 as per usual for electrical attacks?

AP isn't mentioned in the text, but all other electrical attacks in the books as far as I know have an AP modifier, so I'm wondering if this is just an oversight. Per RAW I'm sure it doesn't, but what do you think the intent is?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <04-15-16/0836:24>
On phone so next to impossible to link :(

But google 'Ultrasonic building pictures' to get an idea of what you would see. All 'greyscale' as the density of objects is shown. Enough detail to identify objects but not enough to actually read anything (so no note reading).

Or, that is what i expect from the technology in 70 years based off of what I have seen from non-destructive ultrasonic field testing eqiupment.

Stick this into your kanimushi swarm's sensor array and load up some AutoCad 5.0 software.  Instant(-ish) floorplans.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <04-15-16/1356:11>
On phone so next to impossible to link :(

But google 'Ultrasonic building pictures' to get an idea of what you would see. All 'greyscale' as the density of objects is shown. Enough detail to identify objects but not enough to actually read anything (so no note reading).

Or, that is what i expect from the technology in 70 years based off of what I have seen from non-destructive ultrasonic field testing eqiupment.

Stick this into your kanimushi swarm's sensor array and load up some AutoCad 5.0 software.  Instant(-ish) floorplans.


More then that.
Adjust it correctly, and spot structrual weaknessess in a building, pipeline, support! (Possible bonus to demolitions?).

Currently ultrasonics are used to test welds and cement for structural faults and weak points. They do a very good job of showing mirco cracks, thin walling, shaling, and air pockets...

Expand the tech by 70 years.....
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <04-15-16/1358:40>
You'd also get things like patrol routes and all sorts of other useful info, but I'll leave that up to enterprising players.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: adzling on <04-17-16/1913:51>
Yeah but it'd be risky with wireless on.
If you turn wireless off I guess you could rely on its pilot and autosofts to stay hidden, do the mapping and return to a pre arranged meet poont😬.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <04-18-16/1130:48>
Rigger 5 questions.

Increased seating with an odd number of seats. Increases seating 50%. Round up or round down?

Buying a new pilot program. This also increases firewall, data processing, and device rating now, right?

Can a vehicle run encryption?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <04-18-16/1136:41>
Increased seating:
Quote from: SR5 page 48
The general rule of thumb is to round up, unless a specific rule tells you to do otherwise.

Pilot program:
Yes, raising Pilot raises Device Rating, which raises Firewall and Data processing.

Vehicles and programs
Vehicles have Pilots, Pilots can load and run autosofts, but autosofts are a specific type of program. So no, unless you slave the vehicle to an RCC or install a program carrier, the vehicle cannot natively run cyberprograms.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kiirnodel on <04-19-16/0332:55>
Pilot program:
Yes, raising Pilot raises Device Rating, which raises Firewall and Data processing.

Can you point to where the books say that? I don't doubt that it is possible, but I don't recall anything saying that the Pilot rating is the same as or equals the Device Rating...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <04-19-16/0642:11>
Pilot program:
Yes, raising Pilot raises Device Rating, which raises Firewall and Data processing.

Can you point to where the books say that? I don't doubt that it is possible, but I don't recall anything saying that the Pilot rating is the same as or equals the Device Rating...
It's a new rule introduced by Rigger 5.0.

Quote from: Rigger 5.0 page 127
The Pilot program determines the Rating of the drone as a whole, serves as the primary source of attributes for skill tests, serves as a cap on the highest rating autosoft the drone can run, and more.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SichoPhiend on <04-19-16/1022:20>
It's a new rule introduced by Rigger 5.0.

Quote from: Rigger 5.0 page 127
The Pilot program determines the Rating of the drone as a whole, serves as the primary source of attributes for skill tests, serves as a cap on the highest rating autosoft the drone can run, and more.

Not even a new rule
Quote from: SR5 CRB p.269 Second paragraph of Drones in the Matrix
The Device Rating of a drone is the same as its Pilot Rating, meaning all of its Matrix attributes are equal to the Pilot Rating.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <04-19-16/1037:57>
Hah, good find, SichoPhiend.

I guess the only new part introduced by Rigger 5.0 is the ability to upgrade the Pilot rating, thus upgrading the Firewall and Data Processing.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <04-22-16/1817:02>
Thank y'all.

Questino about the Jam Signals matrix action.

How long does it last?  Does it last until you do something else with the device, or do you have to spend an action to reroll it every round?  Can you put a rating 1 attack dongle on your metalink, then spend edge to push the limit and get ten hits and let your metalink just sit there jamming like it was a turbocharged rating 10 area jammer that can cover two football fields at full strength, while you're going around doing other stuff?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sternenwind on <04-24-16/0840:25>
Rigger 5 page 33; Motion Sickness
Q: What is the Power of Motion Sickness?

ref.: SR5 page 408 Toxin, Power and SR5 page 409 Toxin, Effect, Nausea
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <04-26-16/2112:20>
Elemental Aura!

If I have a 6P fist and get six hits on a force 6 Fire Aura, does that mean my fists are now 12P/-6 [Fire] resisted by body + armor + fire proofing, or is it a separate soak roll against the 6P fist and the 6P/-6 [Fire] fire aura?

Does counterspelling come into the equation at any point?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sternenwind on <04-27-16/0849:43>
yes no no

-SR5 p.396 Energy Aura
... The critter adds its Magic to the Damage Value of any melee attack it makes. The damage may have a specific type (Elemental Damage, p. 170) and has an AP of –(critter’s Magic). ...

-SR5 p.171 Fire Armor Penetration
Fire-based spells: Fire AP = spell Force
To determine if something catches fire ....

-SR5 p.283 Combat Spells indirect
... with an AP equal to –(Force).

- There was a clarification about Stun Baton that i can not find. It basically said that, if you hit with a stun baton, you do either electricity damage or physical damage, and not both no matter how hard you hit someone.


SG p.115 [Element] Aura
... Said auras increase the Damage Value of any melee attacks by the caster’s hits ... Attacks are also treated as Cold, Electricity, Fire, or some other elemental damage (p. 105 and p. 170, SR5), and have the armor penetration appropriate to each attack.

Following the above, in general every attack is dealing damage only once. Toxin could be the exemption. And magical Attacks with AP, have a AP equal to its Force.

Elemental Strike  (SG p.170) doesn't change the DV, it only adds a elemental Effect, and Elemental Body has a specific AP.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <04-28-16/1108:14>
Hey, it's me again.

Run for your life/Dive on the grenade. Run & Gun, 125.

What is exactly remaining movement? Running speed counts?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <04-28-16/1112:27>
"Remaining movement" should refer to the amount of unused Movement (Agility x2/x4 for most) that a character has for the Combat Turn.

So if a character has moved his entire Agility x4 and is then targeted by a grenade, he can't use Run For Your Life.

If, however, he's only moved Agility x2 he would be able to move up to his Agility x4 assuming he has enough Initiative to take the -5 for Interrupt action; since you're already taking a -5 to Initiative, I think it's fair to allow the necessary Free Action for running, as you'd also be counting as running for the rest of the Combat Turn and as such couldn't use any other Free actions. This is a GM call, though.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: wraith on <05-07-16/0106:44>
Bumping this, as I never did see a response and it came up in game the other week.

Just a bit of clarification, is this the proper methodology?



Say you slap a quarter kilo of minimum rating (6) plastique in a directional shaped charge (45 degree arc to only blow into the room) onto an apartment door to blow it in.  Logic + Demolitions scores four successes. So our equation looks like this :

Rating + (Successes on Demolitions + Logic) x sqrt(number of kilograms of explosive)

[6 + 4] x sqrt(.25) = 10 x .5 = 5

So we've got a DV 5 explosion.

Quote from: SR5, Page 436
An explosive’s Damage Value is calculated
as its Rating (modified by the Demolitions Test,
if you made one) times the square root of the
number of kilograms used (rounded down). The
Blast value for a circular explosion is –2 per meter,
while the Blast value for a directional explosion
(up to 60 degrees in a specific direction)
is –1 per meter. When explosives are attached
directly to a target, the target’s armor is halved;
otherwise the explosive has an AP value of –2.
If an explosion destroys a barrier, it creates a
cloud of deadly shrapnel that threatens an area
far bigger than the actual blast—the shrapnel blast
has a DV equal to the explosive’s DV minus the
Structure rating of the barrier, with a Blast of –1/m.

Quote from: SR5, Page 197
If a character intends to destroy a barrier (or knock a hole
in it), resolve the attack normally. Since barriers can’t
dodge, the attack test is unopposed. The purpose of the
attack test is to generate extra hits to add to the Damage
Value. If a character got no hits, then only apply the base
Damage Value. The only way a character could “miss”
is if he got a critical glitch on the attack test, thus proving
themselves literally unable to hit the broad side of a
barn. A character may use Demolitions as the attack skill
if he has the proper materials and time to set charges.

Before rolling the barrier’s damage resistance test,
adjust the modified Damage Value to reflect the type of
attack, as noted on the Damaging Barriers Table.

Now then, onto what happens when it goes boom.

First, the barrier gets to roll a damage resistance test, with structure + armor.  Given this is a standard door, it has Structure 2 and Armor 4 per the chart on pg 197.  However, since this is an explosive placed up against the door, we're not done with the math and ready to roll yet.  Per the 'Damaging Barriers' chart on page 198, explosives in contact with the barrier get to use Base DV times two.  As this section quotes a completely different method of blowing up a door than the one under Demolitions :

We're going to assume the Base DV of this explosive is the one calculated above, despite it having the results of a demolitions + logic roll added in, as the rules on 197 state that the table's results adjust the modified DV.  So the next roll is as follows :

2 (structure) + 4 (armor) dice rolled vs 5 (base DV) x 2 (per damaging barriers chart)

So 6 dice vs DV 10.

Assuming an average roll on 6 dice, the barrier gets 4 successes.  This leaves 6 DV unsoaked, which is more than the 2 structure the door has, and thus the door has been damaged!

Per 'Damaging A Barrier', page 197-198,  The remaining 6 successes are divided by the door's structure to determine the extent of the damage. 1 square meter of hole is generated per multiple of the structure left over in DV.  Thus here, a 3 square meter hole would be generated.

We'll assume most apartments don't have a 3 square meter door.  Now back to page 436!

Quote
If an explosion destroys a barrier, it creates a
cloud of deadly shrapnel that threatens an area
far bigger than the actual blast—the shrapnel blast
has a DV equal to the explosive’s DV minus the
Structure rating of the barrier, with a Blast of –1/m.

The penetrating a barrier section on page 197-8 doesn't actually have any specifics at all as to how you actually destroy a barrier, only how to punch a hole in one.  In this case, I'm going to go with the assumption that if the hole is larger than the object, that object is destroyed.

This door has clearly been destroyed!

Therefore, anyone on the other side of this door needs to soak :

The 5 DV (AP-2) (Minus 1 DV per meter as this is a directional explosion) explosion/blast effect itself.

-AND-

The secondary shrapnel explosion, at :

5 (Explosion DV) - 2 (structure rating of the door) with a Blast of -1 per meter.

So the door is gone, and the guy standing behind it is soaking two hits, one at 5DV (AP-2) and one at 3 DV.

As this is a shaped explosion, the people on the outside of the door do not have to soak it as well. If this was a standard spherical explosion, they would have to soak 5 DV (AP-2) -2 per meter from the door.

I have intentionally assumed this apartment is big enough that we don't have to calculate the blast reflection as well.


Now we move on to the next combat turn, and hopefully success on the part of the runners storming the apartment.


You see the number of assumptions I had to make up there? This is why I'm asking if this is an errata point or rules as intended, because there are details missing and conflicting rules in these two sections that need clarification.  Also, there's a typo in the earlier part of that same rule on page 436. The rules for barriers are not on page 194 as quoted, they're on page 197.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <05-15-16/1633:35>
To be clear...

Can you learn a spell without the ability to cast it?

If you are an aspected conjurer, can you spend karma to learn spells to pass on to spirits of man that you summon, without the ability to cast those spells, or is that power for spirits of man unavailable?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SIlverBudda on <05-20-16/0629:20>
What is the highest attribute you have ever had / seen. Just curios.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <05-20-16/0701:19>
Harlequin in the SR4 Street Legends compendium has a Magic attribute of 30, I think.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: SIlverBudda on <05-20-16/0925:25>
I was think more along the lines of a player character. Sorry for not clarifying. But 30 out he must hit like a truck. I always liked Harlequin.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <05-20-16/0956:47>
My high karma mage has a magic rating of 23.

Wyrm's mage is even higher.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus Gideon on <05-22-16/2148:47>
To be clear...

Can you learn a spell without the ability to cast it?

If you are an aspected conjurer, can you spend karma to learn spells to pass on to spirits of man that you summon, without the ability to cast those spells, or is that power for spirits of man unavailable?

Core pg 299 says in order to learn a spell you have to make a Spellcasting + Intuition roll. Since you're an Aspected Summoner, you don't have the Spellcasting skill, which means you cannot learn spells.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <05-25-16/1726:14>
Thank y'all.

Questino about the Jam Signals matrix action.

How long does it last?  Does it last until you do something else with the device, or do you have to spend an action to reroll it every round?  Can you put a rating 1 attack dongle on your metalink, then spend edge to push the limit and get ten hits and let your metalink just sit there jamming like it was a turbocharged rating 10 area jammer that can cover two football fields at full strength, while you're going around doing other stuff?

I think it's just one Combat Turn. I vaguely recall something about it in Rigger 5 (like an updated action?) , but I can't look it up just now as I'm posting from a waiting room (I'd wait until I get home, but I'm bored right now). =i)

EDIT: Nope, I was completely wrong about that. It looks like the dongle + Metalink + Edge is a valid tactic. Seems like it's a pretty expensive one, though, at over 3k¥.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <05-25-16/2118:44>
I've spent far more on less useful tricks and come out ahead. 3k and a point of edge for nigh radio silence everywhere for a hundred yards in every direction?  About as subtle as a tactical nuke, but even many deckers will be hard pressed to keep online without a lot of noise reduction.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <05-25-16/2235:42>
Aaron!!

Good to see you back here after a long absence.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <05-26-16/0829:36>
I've spent far more on less useful tricks and come out ahead. 3k and a point of edge for nigh radio silence everywhere for a hundred yards in every direction?  About as subtle as a tactical nuke, but even many deckers will be hard pressed to keep online without a lot of noise reduction.

True, although like most tactics, it depends on what you're going for. Still valid, though. =i)

Good to see you back here after a long absence.

Hi! Thanks! Good to be back.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <05-26-16/0919:29>
True, although like most tactics, it depends on what you're going for. Still valid, though. =i)
Oh, absolutely. It's a handy emergency trick to keep in the back pocket, not plan A.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Zweiblumen on <05-26-16/1100:05>
EDIT: Nope, I was completely wrong about that. It looks like the dongle + Metalink + Edge is a valid tactic. Seems like it's a pretty expensive one, though, at over 3k¥.

Couldn't you do the "Device Modification: Add a Matrix Attribute" to give a Metalink an attack rating for the cost of 2 Spare Parts?

Quote from: Data Trails P. 66 DEVICE MODIFICATIONS
Add a Matrix Attribute:You can add a rating that a device doesn’t have, specifically Attack or Sleaze. When you perform this mod, the rating starts at 1. You can’t add a Matrix attribute to a device that already has that attribute. Remember that all devices have Data Processing and Firewall, even if that information is not listed in their gear entry. The Increase a Matrix Attribute modi - cation can later be added to this modi cation. The number of parts packs needed for this modi cation equals the (Device Rating x 2) of the object being modified.

Human with 7 Edge (since we are pushing the limit and can't re-roll misses you'd want as many dice as possible) Logic 6 and EW 6 is rolling 19 dice.  Not a great chance of 10 hits even with exploding 6s, but definitely feasible.  And the cost would be 100¥ for the meta-link plus either 500¥ to straight up buy parts or scavenge from any device rating ≥2 (ie, anything that isn't a meta-link).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <05-26-16/1356:26>
To be clear...

Can you learn a spell without the ability to cast it?

If you are an aspected conjurer, can you spend karma to learn spells to pass on to spirits of man that you summon, without the ability to cast those spells, or is that power for spirits of man unavailable?

Core pg 299 says in order to learn a spell you have to make a Spellcasting + Intuition roll. Since you're an Aspected Summoner, you don't have the Spellcasting skill, which means you cannot learn spells.
Yep. Looks pretty water tight. Thank you.

*Takes notes for some aspected summoner ideas.*
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <05-26-16/1924:43>
The biggest thing for me in each of these hacked-together plans for an area jammer is that player characters have to make some skill tests. I'm always in favor of something that promotes active playing.

That and player ingenuity. =i)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <05-26-16/2155:37>
Human with 7 Edge (since we are pushing the limit and can't re-roll misses you'd want as many dice as possible) Logic 6 and EW 6 is rolling 19 dice.  Not a great chance of 10 hits even with exploding 6s, but definitely feasible.  And the cost would be 100¥ for the meta-link plus either 500¥ to straight up buy parts or scavenge from any device rating ≥2 (ie, anything that isn't a meta-link).
I generally go with Logic 8-ish deckers, and if that metalink were one of my backup plans, I'd strongly consider a specialization in jamming, and if practical...

Actually, does jacking out of VR reset your device?  If no, then I'd take the hot sim dice if I could, jack out, and let my metajammer run.  That'd make the final dice pool 25 with exploding 6's, averaging to the 9 or 10 success range, skewing high.

If it does reset the device, then it would be necessary to do this in AR for a -2, dice pool of 21, average more like eight.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Darzil on <05-27-16/0739:45>
Actually, does jacking out of VR reset your device?
Yes.
From Core, pg 240, Jack Out matrix action : "This jacks you out of the Matrix and reboots the device you are using"
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <05-27-16/0803:02>
But if you did it in AR, you could just cut the feed to your image link and keep it jamming while you shoot things with a shotgun, or use your cyber deck to direct connect to things.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Zweiblumen on <05-27-16/1324:59>
You can go from VR to AR without rebooting your gear.  But you'll still be online and vulnerable to cyber attacks... admittedly in a very noisy area so attacks against you would be difficult.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <05-27-16/1352:30>
Huh.

So, jam from hot sim, go from VR to AR, cut the feed to your image link, leave the metalink running for noise.

And if you get enough hits on the jamming, the problem is not overcoming noise penalties to attack you.  It's having enough noise reduction to get that noise penalty under your device rating so you can go online at all.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <05-27-16/1826:37>
Huh.

So, jam from hot sim, go from VR to AR, cut the feed to your image link, leave the metalink running for noise.

And if you get enough hits on the jamming, the problem is not overcoming noise penalties to attack you.  It's having enough noise reduction to get that noise penalty under your device rating so you can go online at all.

Sure, but what device is running your persona? I think you can only have one persona at a time, which means only one device at a time, and if that device is the Metalink, you could be in for a bit of ... fun.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <05-27-16/1917:45>
Why not?

A persona is nothing more than a device-generated avatar.  You couldn't operate multiple at the same time.  However, it's not like you're a technomancer forming your persona with your brain.  And the second you're not in VR, especially if you disconnect DNI, your device has nothing to do with you.

For a decker, the device is the absolute source of the persona.  The operator merely controls it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Zweiblumen on <05-27-16/1938:28>
Why would you need to run your persona on the metalink that's doing the Jam Signals?  Put the metalink online, go VR via whatever other device you want to use, pump up the NR as much as you can so you don't get dumped once you start the jamming, and then perform the Jam Signals command on the other device that you are an owner of.  Or worse case, Control Device on the device you own, you've got 4 marks on it anyway, to have it perform the Jam Signals command.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <05-27-16/1943:12>
Page 235 of the CRB. Persona. 4th sentence. First paragraph.

"You can only run one persona at a time; switching requires you to reboot both the device you're currently on and the device to which you want to shift your persona"


Me thinks you need to refresh yourself on personas Blue Rose, as you understanding of what they are is a little off, going by your desciption VS what is written.


Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <05-27-16/2027:45>
*Reads.*

But... why?  How?  That makes absolutely no sense.

You don't need DNI in any capacity to operate a matrix enabled device.  It's just an object.  A thing.  If you have a commlink in your hand, it's doing its own thing entirely.

The way that paragraph reads, if you have a phone in each hand, no DNI, pure analog interface, and Google search taco stands in Touristville, only one of them works because you can only generate one persona with which to interact with the matrix.

Which... is... impossible.  Machines don't work that way.  There is no connection between you and the machine.  There is no place that persona can possibly come from other than the device, because it is not you.  It is not connected to you.

What the frag?


Not that it particularly matters, in this case.  The idea is to take down the entire matrix in the area so no one can use it.  It's gonna be a shotgun in your hands from that point, not a cyberdeck.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <05-27-16/2140:39>
My guess?

To prevent cheesemonkey players and GM's from doing a  gang-bang matrix F-up by daisy chaining 200 decks together to act as a 'team' for tests..... using the line of thought you just outlined....

With the rules being what they are (online with a single device at a time) you cut out such antics, thus making both the rules AND flow of the game simple and fast.....


And also by limiting both the number of decives that can be used simutaniously, you also cut down on the traditional 'Decker mini-game' that decking used to be back in 1-3 edition days..... where opening a single door could take up to 30 minutes of table time rolling dice on checks.....


If you have the time, and want to know what a mental breakdown feels like, I encourage you to read up on 2e decking rules :D

I'll call the hospital and make sure they have padded room for you :D


<My old GM put it like this: If given the choice of running a complete decking run in 2e SR, OR chewing broken glass for 5 minutes before eating a bag of lemons rinds and all..... He'll take the glass and lemons. Less pain inducing.>
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <05-28-16/1508:58>
Smackdown, CRB, 57.

Do you need to have available Edge? Can you burn without daily Edge uses?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <05-28-16/1653:49>
You do not need any available edge in order to burn edge. Generally, if you're doing a smackdown, it's either because you're out of edge or you are trying something crazy. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <05-29-16/2249:21>
Punch, CRB, 283.

Enemy defends with Reaction + Intuition. Is it a Defense test? Do you add Combat Sense (adept power or spell) and/or Dodge/Parry/Block/Total Defense?

If you're invisible/hidden and you use Punch on an unaware enemy, does the enemy has a Reaction + Intuition test?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <05-30-16/0035:51>
Yes, it is a normal defense test, just like if you were defending against a gun or fist.

However, you just need to touch the target.  Blocking does not help, though I'm 50/50 on parrying.  Combat Sense helps, Dodge and Total Defense help, and if you take the target by surprise, they don't get to defend.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <05-30-16/1020:08>
Thanks for both answers.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <05-30-16/1614:16>
Yes, it is a normal defense test, just like if you were defending against a gun or fist.

However, you just need to touch the target.  Blocking does not help, though I'm 50/50 on parrying.  Combat Sense helps, Dodge and Total Defense help, and if you take the target by surprise, they don't get to defend.
Incorrect; a defense test against a touch attack is no different than any other defense test. By RAW, you can use both Block and Parry to defend against a touch attack and if the defender gets more hits than the attacker then the attack fails. Your interpretation would be a house rule, and a valid one, but it's not RAW.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <05-30-16/1643:07>
Makes you wonder how you block someone from touching your body... by using your body. O.o

That said, important note; touch attacks only need to touch, so you don't need to beat your opponent's defense roll; only meet it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Herr Brackhaus on <05-31-16/1633:41>
The same way you block someone attacking you with shock gloves; by not letting their hands touch your body. Nowhere in the RAW is it specified that you can cast a touch attack spell by rubbing your crotch on your opponent; as no exceptions to the general rule that a touch attack is still a melee attack are given, one must therefore conclude that the normal rules for making melee defense tests apply.

And if you look closely, you'll note that I already specified that the defender must get more hits than the attacker in the case of touch attacks.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Zweiblumen on <05-31-16/1645:47>
Yes, it is a normal defense test, just like if you were defending against a gun or fist.

However, you just need to touch the target.  Blocking does not help, though I'm 50/50 on parrying.  Combat Sense helps, Dodge and Total Defense help, and if you take the target by surprise, they don't get to defend.
Incorrect; a defense test against a touch attack is no different than any other defense test. By RAW, you can use both Block and Parry to defend against a touch attack and if the defender gets more hits than the attacker then the attack fails. Your interpretation would be a house rule, and a valid one, but it's not RAW.

Touch attacks ARE different than any other attack, in a normal attack ties go to the defender.

Quote from: CRB p.187 TOUCH-ONLY ATTACK
If the intention of an attack is to simply make contact, whether to discharge a spell, plant a RFID tag, or just playing tag, than the attacker gains a +2 dice pool bonus. Additionally, if all that is needed is contact, the attacker and not the defender succeeds on a tie.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kiirnodel on <05-31-16/1717:09>
Yes, it is a normal defense test, just like if you were defending against a gun or fist.

However, you just need to touch the target.  Blocking does not help, though I'm 50/50 on parrying.  Combat Sense helps, Dodge and Total Defense help, and if you take the target by surprise, they don't get to defend.
Incorrect; a defense test against a touch attack is no different than any other defense test. By RAW, you can use both Block and Parry to defend against a touch attack and if the defender gets more hits than the attacker then the attack fails. Your interpretation would be a house rule, and a valid one, but it's not RAW.

Touch attacks ARE different than any other attack, in a normal attack ties go to the defender.

Quote from: CRB p.187 TOUCH-ONLY ATTACK
If the intention of an attack is to simply make contact, whether to discharge a spell, plant a RFID tag, or just playing tag, than the attacker gains a +2 dice pool bonus. Additionally, if all that is needed is contact, the attacker and not the defender succeeds on a tie.

Asked, answered, repeated. Everyone is agreeing that ties go to the attacker for touch attacks, nobody is disputing that fact.

The rules make a very specific call out explaining the changes for touch attacks. Zweiblumen quoted this text, it states the attacker get +2 dice, and that a tie means that you touch. It doesn't state anything else regarding methods of defense. Therefore, we infer that all other rules regarding defense (block, parry, etc) applies as per normal melee defense.

Any other ruling/disallowing of actions is house-rule or alternate GM interpretation and is diverging from the Rules-as-Written.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Zweiblumen on <05-31-16/2014:19>
Asked, answered, repeated. Everyone is agreeing that ties go to the attacker for touch attacks, nobody is disputing that fact.

The rules make a very specific call out explaining the changes for touch attacks. Zweiblumen quoted this text, it states the attacker get +2 dice, and that a tie means that you touch. It doesn't state anything else regarding methods of defense. Therefore, we infer that all other rules regarding defense (block, parry, etc) applies as per normal melee defense.

Any other ruling/disallowing of actions is house-rule or alternate GM interpretation and is diverging from the Rules-as-Written.

I was just pointing out the missing data about ties going to defender as HB said that Touch Only defense was "no different."   To be clear, I agree about dodge/block/full defense/etc etc.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <06-05-16/2251:59>
Hey, once again!

Is it possible to make a Teamwork test with Spellcasting? I am aware that under certain circumstances like Ritual Spellcasting and/or Spirits involved it's possible: I am asking 'bout two spellcasters with a Spellcasting test.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <06-06-16/1935:10>
Hey, once again!

Is it possible to make a Teamwork test with Spellcasting? I am aware that under certain circumstances like Ritual Spellcasting and/or Spirits involved it's possible: I am asking 'bout two spellcasters with a Spellcasting test.

This is a great question. After going through the rules for an admittedly short amount of time, I think the answer is no. The Teamwork Test rules are explicit about people being able to work together, and Spellcasting is explicitly about channeling mana through oneself as a force of will. I think it doesn't work for the same reason you can't get Teamwork on a Surprise Test or a Toxin Resistance Test--it's entirely internal.

This is one of my looser interpretations, though, and I only looked at the core rules. I'm certain that the rules as intended are that teamwork in Sorcery is Ritual Spellcasting.

Thanks!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Gingivitis on <06-07-16/0139:59>
Huh.

So, jam from hot sim, go from VR to AR, cut the feed to your image link, leave the metalink running for noise.

And if you get enough hits on the jamming, the problem is not overcoming noise penalties to attack you.  It's having enough noise reduction to get that noise penalty under your device rating so you can go online at all.

From what I read, "As long as you do not use the device for any further Matrix actions, the device adds any hits...".   Switch Interface Mode is a Matrix Action.  Therefore as soon as you "go from VR to AR, you break the jam.  Furthermore, if you Jam Signals while in VR, the Noise would likely kill your own connection, causing dumpshock to you.  Jam Signal says absolutely nothing about your own device being immune.

I see this as an AR only, fire-and-forget, if-I-can't-deck-then-no-one-can Action
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <06-07-16/0230:53>
Hey, once again!

Is it possible to make a Teamwork test with Spellcasting? I am aware that under certain circumstances like Ritual Spellcasting and/or Spirits involved it's possible: I am asking 'bout two spellcasters with a Spellcasting test.

This is a great question. After going through the rules for an admittedly short amount of time, I think the answer is no. The Teamwork Test rules are explicit about people being able to work together, and Spellcasting is explicitly about channeling mana through oneself as a force of will. I think it doesn't work for the same reason you can't get Teamwork on a Surprise Test or a Toxin Resistance Test--it's entirely internal.

This is one of my looser interpretations, though, and I only looked at the core rules. I'm certain that the rules as intended are that teamwork in Sorcery is Ritual Spellcasting.

Thanks!
At the same time, there's nothing really saying you can't, nor that you can't help someone else guide the flow of mana.

So, like most rules questions, the answer is... "Eh."

Leadership can, without a doubt, help on Spellcraft rolls.  I find it less odd for Spellcraft to help Spellcraft rolls, though the fine details are a table call.  To help someone cast a spell, do you need to know that same spell?  Probably.  If you help someone cast a spell, does that mean you take drain, too?  I'd say yes, which can help mitigate the shenanigans of the party's mages teamworking with one another for every out-of-combat buff spell.

Rituals, meanwhile, have their own unique shenanigans that have entirely different effects from teamwork spellcasting.  And has its own rules for teamwork ritual spellcasting.  And ritual spellcasting can be done solo.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Bendicott on <06-17-16/1114:47>
I've seen it mentioned a few times on other forums that surplus hits on an extended test can reduce the required time. However, I haven't been able to find anything in the book to support this - is this a thing in SR5, and if so, do you know where I can find the relevant info in the book?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <06-17-16/1746:45>
I've seen it mentioned a few times on other forums that surplus hits on an extended test can reduce the required time. However, I haven't been able to find anything in the book to support this - is this a thing in SR5, and if so, do you know where I can find the relevant info in the book?

I think it depends entirely on the test. Some tests specifically say that you can split your hits between "go faster" and "do better."
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <06-30-16/2253:55>
Why 'm the only one askin' questions?

An icon displayed on the Matrix must give a hint of the function of the device. What about a deck? Could you use a "phone" icon for a deck? 'Cause cyberdecks may function like commlinks.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <07-01-16/0123:37>
What you describe is the function of the Wrapper program.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <07-01-16/0508:25>
I suppose you could make it look like a phone with the caveat that the metadata made it clear that it's a cyberdeck. The idea is that things look like what they are in the Matrix, notwithstanding what Blue Rose said. =i)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Prime Mover on <07-12-16/1726:02>
Touch and line of sight.
For a spell that requires touch or line of sight.
The target is safe behind a wall regardless of material as long as you can't see them it.
What about a full set of sealed armor with mirrored visor?
A heavy hooded cloak?
What do you actually need to touch/see to be able to target?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <07-13-16/0946:49>
Touch and line of sight.
For a spell that requires touch or line of sight.
The target is safe behind a wall regardless of material as long as you can't see them it.
What about a full set of sealed armor with mirrored visor?
A heavy hooded cloak?
What do you actually need to touch/see to be able to target?

This has come up multiple times.

The short answer is:
Anything that is worn by a character has the character's aura 'bleed' through it, thus allowing the targeting of both direct spells and touch spells with no problem or penalty.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Prime Mover on <07-14-16/1441:40>
I know the discussion isn't a new one.  I have a player that loves to argue semantics.

So the target is in his jockey shorts hiding behind a kevlar curtain. He's in direct contact and using the curtain as his armor rating.  Does this count as "aura bleed"?

I have to choose my answers carefully, cause I know he'll extrapolate the answer to some nefarious ends.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Tym Jalynsfein on <07-14-16/1539:19>
I know the discussion isn't a new one.  I have a player that loves to argue semantics.

So the target is in his jockey shorts hiding behind a kevlar curtain. He's in direct contact and using the curtain as his armor rating.  Does this count as "aura bleed"?

I have to choose my answers carefully, cause I know he'll extrapolate the answer to some nefarious ends.

A Curtain (Kevlar or otherwise) is not a worn article of clothing (and make no mistake, armor still counts as clothing, even the Full Body Armor). No Aura Bleed.

That said, if the Curtain is sheer enough to see through, even partially, you can target him... may have a small penalty for obscurement, but not much... If it is totally opaque, then no targeting directly through either eyesight or astral perception. You must go about it differently, or use blind fire rules.   8)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kiirnodel on <07-14-16/1755:07>
I know the discussion isn't a new one.  I have a player that loves to argue semantics.

So the target is in his jockey shorts hiding behind a kevlar curtain. He's in direct contact and using the curtain as his armor rating.  Does this count as "aura bleed"?

I have to choose my answers carefully, cause I know he'll extrapolate the answer to some nefarious ends.

Wearing armor doesn't affect spell targetting.

The rule of thumb I like to use is if the item is big enough to no longer be considered armor and is now a vehicle, then you can't target through it. If the item isn't carried by or affected by the character then it isn't worn armor.

If the character is making a ballistic version of the shower costume from the original Karate Kid, then the player deserves a swift slap to the back of the head.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Prime Mover on <07-14-16/1912:10>
Quote
If the character is making a ballistic version of the shower costume from the original Karate Kid, then the player deserves a swift slap to the back of the head. 

I'm adding the swift slap to the back of the head to my GM toolkit.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Aaron on <07-15-16/1733:13>
I think "wearing armor doesn't affect spell targeting" is the perfect way to sum up the situation, I think.

While the community here (in the form of Tym Jalynsfein and Kiirnodel in this case) has this pretty much wrapped up, I thought I'd poke my head in to point out that you can touch "a target through clothing, armor, or a layer of paint." (p. 281, SR5).

Thanks!
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <07-28-16/1429:34>
Element Aura, Street Grimoire, p. 115.

"Attacks are also treated as Cold, Electricity, Fire, or some other elemental damage (p. 105 and p. 170, SR5), and have the armor penetration appropriate to each attack.."

As written in Core (p. 170) only Fire has AP. Does Electricity or Acid has AP?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <07-28-16/1626:52>
I would default to force as AP as is pretty much standard.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <07-28-16/1637:39>
I would default to force as AP as is pretty much standard.

I understand your point but that's standard for Indirect spells. Fire is different: open flame, force and flame-based weapon.

Has any freelancer or dev said anythin' about this before? I've seen general consensus in reddit but that's it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <07-28-16/1737:54>
Except it isn't a flame-based weapon.  It's a flame-based spell effect.

Adepts' elemental powers are more arguably elemental weapon effects, particularly since there isn't a force you can reference.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: BobertTheTroll on <07-30-16/0251:55>
Question about the math behind Skill tests.

Say a decker is trying to Reboot a device.
She put 5 ranks into the computer skill, and her logic is 5, making her total computer skill 10.
The equation for Rebooting a device is computer + Logic, which means it would be her computer skill of 10 + logic because it is the stat called for in Rebooting device, for a total of 15d6 right?

The reason I wanted to double check is because of the way I'm adding Logic twice (skill points put into computer + logic to determine computer score, and the + 5 logic again because of the specific test)

Is this accurate, or am I giving her too many dice? I'm pretty sure I understand it right but I want to make sure I'm not messing anything up before our groups first run in a couple days.
Shadowrun has a bit more complicated rules than anything my group has done before, our ongoing D&D5e campaign is so simple, want to make sure I don't mess things up here.  :-[
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kiirnodel on <07-30-16/0638:11>
Good question Bobert, and a common misconception. Your concern over adding the attribute twice is correct, you only add once. Which means that the dice pool would be just the 10.

A lot of places will call for a test by stating the Skill + Attribute, which means you take the skill rating (5) and add the listed attribute (5).

"But my skill says it uses Logic," you say.  "So why isn't my total computer skill 10?"

Well, the answer is that you don't add anything to your rating in Computer when you are determining your skill. Whenever a test calls for the skill you always use the base rating. The attribute will often be referenced for clarity, to tell you which attribute to add to it. The reason for this is because you don't always use the same attribute when you use a skill.

Quote from: Core Rulebook pg 128
Skill ranks are independent of attributes, but they don't work alone. The most common dice pools that you roll when you take actions comprise one skill and one attribute. You can study until you know every aspect of Spellcasting, but if you don't have the raw Magic ability (as measured by your attribute) to apply it, you won't be as powerful as you could be. While a skill isn't always paired with a single attribute, each skill has a linked attribute to which the skill is most closely related. This doesn't mean you'll always roll a skill with its linked attribute, but you'll see the two together a lot. A list of linked attributes and their skills appears on p. 151.

The linked attribute is listed for each skill for the sake of having a "default attribute," but that doesn't mean it gets added to the skill ranks automatically. On the next page in the core book under the heading of "Skill Ratings" it goes over that again as well.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: BobertTheTroll on <07-30-16/1506:35>
Thanks for the clarification. I think our reliance on using the very useful Chummer5 app to help us make our characters didn't help us out here either, since chummer goes ahead and adds that in right there one the skill page in your character sheet. Glad I double checked.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kiirnodel on <07-31-16/0144:42>
Yeah, I frequently find myself introducing new players and using character sheets that have been printed out from a generator like Chummer or HeroLab. When I do, one of the first things I do is point out that distinction. The total dice pool listed on those sheets is already factoring in the default attribute, but it might not always be the case. And so I show them how to determine what the base skill rating is from the sheet and so forth and so on.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <08-15-16/1249:19>
Highland Forge Claymore and Iaijutsu. Run & Gun, page 18 and 122.

Claymore: The standard scabbard of the Highland Forge requires a Complex Action to Ready Weapon.

Iaijutsu: "With this action, the character may perform Quick Draw Simple Action (p. 165, SR5) with any melee weapon."

Can you combine both and draw the sword as Simple? And where is this "quickdraw sheath" Hard Exit speaks of?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <08-15-16/2122:02>
When you use iaijutsu, you are not making a ready weapon action, therefore by the book, there is no restriction on using iaijutsu with the standard scabbard.  That said, get rid of the standard scabbard immediately.

As to the quick-draw sheathe?  A quick draw holster is not exclusive to guns.  It reduces the threshold for quick drawing the holstered weapon, not gun.  It's a general term for any type of weapon that might be quick drawn, including swords and throwing weapons.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <08-19-16/1630:23>
When you use iaijutsu, you are not making a ready weapon action, therefore by the book, there is no restriction on using iaijutsu with the standard scabbard.  That said, get rid of the standard scabbard immediately.

As to the quick-draw sheathe?  A quick draw holster is not exclusive to guns.  It reduces the threshold for quick drawing the holstered weapon, not gun.  It's a general term for any type of weapon that might be quick drawn, including swords and throwing weapons.

The Quick Draw action, however, is exclusive to pistols, pistol-sized weapons, and small throwing weapons.  Iaijutsu allows you to use the Quick Draw rules with melee weapons and the Rapid Draw adept power allows a fairly broad application of the Quick Draw rules. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: El Diablo on <08-28-16/2213:25>
Fetish, Street Grimoire, 212. I did a research but only found houserules and 4th rules. Maybe I missed something new.

You gotta learn the spell twice if you wanna cast something with and without the fetish.

Do I need a fetish for every specific spell? Do I attune to it or something similar? I only pay 5 karma (to learn the spell) and 2,000 nuyens plus radical reagents?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kiirnodel on <08-29-16/0341:58>
Fetish, Street Grimoire, 212. I did a research but only found houserules and 4th rules. Maybe I missed something new.

Lets take a look at the text, I'm snipping here for space and so we're not just ripping off the full text. Emphasis with font modifiers is added:

Quote
[...]Such spells have to be learned specifically with the fetish, meaning that a character would have to learn a spell twice if he wants to cast it both with and without a fetish. An alchemist needs 1 dram of radical reagents to make the fetish functional for magical use. A magician casting a fetish spell [...]

So, the text in the book never mentions the magician needing to perform anything to attune themselves to a fetish. The bold text indicates that the radical reagent is part of the materials to create the fetish, not part of being able to make use of it. I took a look, and this is probably in need of some errata, because a dram of radical reagents is worth 4,500 nuyen (according to Shadow Spells). So that just doesn't fit with any of the pricing, period. For now, I would say ignore the bit about radical reagents...

As I was saying, the text never mentions anything about the magician bonding to the fetish, but as the first italicized section mentions, you must learn a spell specifically with the fetish. And it is later (in the other italicized part) referred to as the "fetish spell" meaning that it is about learning a spell as a fetish spell, and potentially means that if you lose the fetish you could have to relearn the spell entirely. None of these things mention a limit of how many spells can be learned with a specific fetish. So purely by RAW, you don't need more than one fetish. As you mentioned there are a lot of houserules out there, and references back to 4th edition. I won't go into those details, but purely from what is written there isn't a stated requirement.

And yes, if you want to be able to cast the spell with or without the fetish, you have to learn it twice (5 karma each time), as stated in the underlined statement. Since you weren't quoting the book, and that wasn't stated like a question, I wasn't sure if that part was confusing you or not...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lemmington on <09-13-16/0840:00>
I have a question about infected. In general, though more specifically for Harvesters for an example, how does it work if they have something like, say,  –1 Logic, –1 Charisma in their statblock? In the case of the Harvester, it's racial maximums for Cha and Logic were both reduced to 1/4 baseline, so 1/4(8) as far as I'm aware.

Is the stat penalty considered to be a part of their natural stats? Does it further reduce their stats? Is it just a penalty on tests related to those stats? Is it something else?

Also, their Initiative Die bonus. Given that this is an innate bonus, this does stack with inititive die boosters, right? You're naturally faster, and something like Increased Reflexes boosts your speed further?

Can an Infected purchase Optional Powers at chargen? Are they limited to only purchasing the ones listed under their infected type, for when they can purchase them?

Do Infected characters get the Essence penalty and associated Magic penalty for their strain? If so, why isn't it listed under their statblock?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <10-06-16/1930:17>
Do stun batons get the +2 dice bonus to hit since you only have to touch someone with it, rather than striking with it?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Zelte on <10-21-16/1310:01>
2 Questions:

1. What are the rules regarding the damage done for a "bite" by meta-type with no modifications?
[Think TWD where Rick performs an impromptu tracheotomy.]

2. Is there ANY disadvantage to a character who has NO Resonance and NO Magic to have almost Zero Essence?

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <10-21-16/1744:46>
2 Questions:

1. What are the rules regarding the damage done for a "bite" by meta-type with no modifications?
[Think TWD where Rick performs an impromptu tracheotomy.]

2. Is there ANY disadvantage to a character who has NO Resonance and NO Magic to have almost Zero Essence?

1: Without a "weapon modification" to your chompers? Not really covered, so basically it would be a simple melee attack... but with a -1 range modifier (as are most bite attacks).

2: There are several.
A: The "drain essence" power of some critters can KILL you very quickly! (as you don't have much essense left) - thankfully these are few and far between and are generally not a simple attack roll. Meaning its a more involved process.
B: You take a modifier to your social limit due to your disconnect to the Human Norms... But this is minor.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sphinx on <10-21-16/1802:11>
1. What are the rules regarding the damage done for a "bite" by meta-type with no modifications?
2. Is there ANY disadvantage to a character who has NO Resonance and NO Magic to have almost Zero Essence?

1. Unarmed attacks by humans or metahumans without natural weapons do (STR)S damage (SR5 p.187). I don't think there's a rule for biting. At the table, I'd rule it as a called shot (-4 dice pool) with the Unarmed Combat skill for (STR/2)P damage.

2. Having a low Essence attribute hurts your inherent Social limit (SR5 p.101) and makes you harder to heal. First Aid Tests have a -1 penalty for every 2 points of lost Essence (Healing Modifiers, SR5 p.208); and magical healing has a penalty equal to your actual Essence minus your maximum Essence, rounded up (SR5 p.287-288).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: kyoto kid on <11-06-16/2342:01>
...OK my question is about Mystic Adepts and learning Metamagics.   I the Magician's Way a hard fast prerequisite for learning non adept arts/metamagics? It seems an awfully expensive requirement considering the cap on positive qualities along with the character having to purchase power points with starting Karma at chargen.  Basically you get the Way and say your Mentor Spirit and that is it for positive qualities.

Part of the reason I bring this up is in the Chummer character builder I did a test with a character (who did not have the quality) where I initiated, chose both the centering (non adept) art and metamagic, and the programme accepted it (I made sure that the houserule box was not checked)

I also addressed this on the Chuimmer5 thread to see if it is indeed legit or a possible glitch in the programme.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Zelte on <11-11-16/1051:11>
1. What are the rules regarding the damage done for a "bite" by meta-type with no modifications?
2. Is there ANY disadvantage to a character who has NO Resonance and NO Magic to have almost Zero Essence?

1. Unarmed attacks by humans or metahumans without natural weapons do (STR)S damage (SR5 p.187). I don't think there's a rule for biting. At the table, I'd rule it as a called shot (-4 dice pool) with the Unarmed Combat skill for (STR/2)P damage.

2. Having a low Essence attribute hurts your inherent Social limit (SR5 p.101) and makes you harder to heal. First Aid Tests have a -1 penalty for every 2 points of lost Essence (Healing Modifiers, SR5 p.208); and magical healing has a penalty equal to your actual Essence minus your maximum Essence, rounded up (SR5 p.287-288).

Thank you.
GM went with (STR)P for damage, and my troll got his throat ripped out by a grappled elf. (It was just a "teach the rules" dust-up, but I was curious).

It seems like their should be SOME problem working your Adept powers through metal or even bio-flesh. But (sadly) there are no rules about it and I won't ex-post-facto house rules.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Blue Rose on <11-11-16/2016:36>
-4 dice pool and STR/2P seems a bit excessive to me.

There is a stock called shot from the core rules that lets you make a called shot to deal lethal damage with a nonlethal weapon for -4 dice.  So called shot is just fine, but I wouldn't halve the damage.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Zelte on <11-21-16/1524:54>
Do stun batons get the +2 dice bonus to hit since you only have to touch someone with it, rather than striking with it?

I do not know how other GM's manage this, but I will allow either:
1. Physical (from using it as a club) plus Electrical (Stun) damage
OR
2. Stun damage only with the +2 dice bonus for an attack that only needs to touch the opponent.
My reasoning is that the attacker will use entirely different moves for each attack.
However, when computing Defender resist/soak; the Physical blow and the Electrical stun Damage are applied separately.
A "glancing blow" will still deliver Stun damage.
All of this is dependent on the GM's interpretation of armor vs. Electrical Stun damage.

Anecdotally, I think that you could wire electrodes of a "stun gun" to a baseball bat and get the desired results.
This makes for a decent, low-brow, sprawl weapon; the Stun Bat.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: IntrepidVector on <01-10-17/0606:27>
I keep seeing it implied that a RCC's Device Rating is the highest Rating of Autosoft that can be run on it. That does not seem to be anywhere in the text. If this is true, where is it coming from?

For example, a DR 4 RCC, can it run 4 Rating 4 programs, or 4 Rating 6 ones?


Also: Do the sensor arrays in a drone have any Capacity for installing upgrades?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Jack_Spade on <01-10-17/0630:26>
It's from one of the writers. You are correct in that it is not called out in the current rules as such, only implied.
So until formal errata comes out you are allowed to use higher rated Autosoft on your RCC.

You can increase the rating of your Sensor Array as per Rigger 5e and you can decide which sensors are in it, but the number ( 8 ) stays the same.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: IntrepidVector on <01-10-17/0821:10>
Thanks for the info! A bit disappointed by that RCC rule being the intended one, but I will live. I'll even save a handful of nuyen :p

I think you answered a slightly different question than I had regarding sensors? I was asking if, by default, seeing something like "Sensor: 3" on a drone's statblock implies it has 3 Capacity I can fill with things like Vision Enhancement?
 

Rephrased, it would be "do drone sensors come with Capacity and if so, is that equal to Sensor Rating or something else"?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Jack_Spade on <01-10-17/0843:21>
Ah, I see what you mean. Well keep on to your head: The individual sensors have capacity equal to the rating of the sensor array.

Meaning: If you have a R6 Sensor Array with a Camera Sensor in it, you can give that Camera modifications like low light and thermo worth 6 points of capacity.
And your Sensor Array has 8 individual sensors so you can have more than one camera sensor in it.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kiirnodel on <01-10-17/2334:15>
Ah, I see what you mean. Well keep on to your head: The individual sensors have capacity equal to the rating of the sensor array.

Meaning: If you have a R6 Sensor Array with a Camera Sensor in it, you can give that Camera modifications like low light and thermo worth 6 points of capacity.
And your Sensor Array has 8 individual sensors so you can have more than one camera sensor in it.

It is worth noting that you can't just add the vision enhancements to a vehicle sensor array, you would have to buy a whole new sensor array. When you buy that new sensor array you can equip the cameras and microphones with vision/audio enhancements. But because they are modifiers to the availability of the base item, they aren't available for post-facto addition.

So, while yes, you do have some capacity in vehicle sensors to add enhancements (per the normal sensor rules), you have to do so as a step in the process of replacing/upgrading those sensors. Essentially, factory default is no special upgrades.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: IntrepidVector on <01-11-17/0527:19>
Ah, well damn. Everything costs so much money :p

One last question for now: Does it say anywhere how many Take Aim actions a drone can perform? On PG. 271 of Core, a character has a drone take several, so it at least seems possible. Substitute Pilot for Willpower, perhaps?

Edit: Also: What can an AI use as dice pools when jumped in to a drone from their RCC?
-Can they use an autosoft in place of their skill or is that only when loaded into a slot on drone itself?
-If they use an autosoft instead of their skill, can they still use their Attribute, or are they restricted to using the drone's Pilot?

I'm hoping to be able to use Reaction (based on Data Processing for an AI) + Autosoft to drive a drone/vehicle, basically.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ionic on <02-14-17/1501:38>
If I may interrupt, chummers...

Quote
Resonance [Program]: This echo lets you copy the effects of one common or hacking program (p. 245). Can be taken once per type of program

This Echo is from the basic rulebook but now there are more programs available in Data Trails. Can you use these program effects from Data Trails as well with the Echo Resonance Program? Would be very useful with the one that boosts your Sleaze attribute by +1 to 5 while causing static as well. ::)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Darkseid on <02-14-17/2254:56>
Ok chummers, can regeneration heal biofeedback damage? I would think it would fall under neurologic damage and be exempt?
Looking at a player with a dwarven decker using immortal flower.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Duellist_D on <02-16-17/0507:02>
If I may interrupt, chummers...

Quote
Resonance [Program]: This echo lets you copy the effects of one common or hacking program (p. 245). Can be taken once per type of program

This Echo is from the basic rulebook but now there are more programs available in Data Trails. Can you use these program effects from Data Trails as well with the Echo Resonance Program? Would be very useful with the one that boosts your Sleaze attribute by +1 to 5 while causing static as well. ::)
A program is a program, so yeah, why not?
The page number shouldn't confuse you, they could hardly anticipate on which page in which unnamed book they'll put further progs.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Ionic on <04-16-17/0557:26>
Another one:
Can I stack the transgenic trait "Synaptic Accelerator" from Bodyshop (+1 Ini. +1 D6) with the Physical Adept power of "Improved Reflexes" to gain 5D6 Initiative?
I am unsure whether transgenic enhancements are technical enhancements or if only bioware and cyberware implantation counts?
Thanks
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Darrek Workman on <05-03-17/0053:04>
Questions

1. Can you power bleed essence drain and use that to permanently buff your character's essence?

2. Can a spirit use endowment to give another character endowment? Say, a critter has an interesting ability and some smart alec thinks to summon a spirit to given the critter endowment and then convince the critter to give the character the critter's ability with endowment?

3. Power Foci also add dice to enchanting pools, so could a mage create a power foci and use it to create a better foci?

4. Spirit pact and hidden life combined with endowment: could a mage make a spirit with spirit pact or hidden life give the spirit power to his ally spirit and then have his ally use the power on/with him?  Would the spirit pact or hidden life end when the endowment wears off?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: marfish on <06-15-17/0935:06>
Quote
Lockpick set: These mechanical burglary devices have undergone only slight improvements in the last several centuries. They are necessary tools for picking locks.

This confuse me quite a bit...
my concern is: Is "lockpick set" real device?
Can it be hacked? Can Analysis Device spell have effects on it?

Or is the "device"  just another error?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <06-15-17/1337:44>
Quote
Lockpick set: These mechanical burglary devices have undergone only slight improvements in the last several centuries. They are necessary tools for picking locks.

This confuse me quite a bit...
my concern is: Is "lockpick set" real device?
Can it be hacked? Can Analysis Device spell have effects on it?

Or is the "device"  just another error?

Its a device in the sense that it is an actual physical object. Most lockpick sets are slim bars of hardened steel that are manually manipulated to depress the timblers in a lock.....

So there is no real moving parts or electronic parts..... which limits the effect of things like  analyize device... or even hacking (again, because its essentially just a hunk of metal).


Also note that lockpicks only work on mechanical locks. So things like a maglock can not be opened with lockpicks. (Just as an ordinary padlock can not be opened with a matrix test)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: The Bald Man on <06-16-17/1349:46>
Quote
Lockpick set: These mechanical burglary devices have undergone only slight improvements in the last several centuries. They are necessary tools for picking locks.

This confuse me quite a bit...
my concern is: Is "lockpick set" real device?
Can it be hacked? Can Analysis Device spell have effects on it?

Or is the "device"  just another error?

Its a device in the sense that it is an actual physical object. Most lockpick sets are slim bars of hardened steel that are manually manipulated to depress the timblers in a lock.....

So there is no real moving parts or electronic parts..... which limits the effect of things like  analyize device... or even hacking (again, because its essentially just a hunk of metal).


Also note that lockpicks only work on mechanical locks. So things like a maglock can not be opened with lockpicks. (Just as an ordinary padlock can not be opened with a matrix test)

I don't see why Analyse Device Spell wouldn't work.  As far as I can tell it would work on a knife or sword.  It should wok on lockpicks. 
Arguably, it would work better on lockpicks than most other equipment because of the relatively low Object Resistance.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: marfish on <07-30-17/1004:00>
One minor issue:
According to the Range Table (p. 185), the Missile Launcher has a minimum range of 20m. However, according to the Street Gear (p. 435), the minimum range is 10m.

So...which one is valid?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sphinx on <07-30-17/1502:10>
One minor issue: According to the Range Table (p. 185), the Missile Launcher has a minimum range of 20m. However, according to the Street Gear (p. 435), the minimum range is 10m. So...which one is valid?

I'd say 20m, since 10m isn't enough distance to be safely outside the blast radius.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: marfish on <07-31-17/0840:06>
One minor issue: According to the Range Table (p. 185), the Missile Launcher has a minimum range of 20m. However, according to the Street Gear (p. 435), the minimum range is 10m. So...which one is valid?

I'd say 20m, since 10m isn't enough distance to be safely outside the blast radius.

well, the save distance for grenade launchers was only about 5m, which was not outside the blast radius either.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Youneko on <09-25-17/0717:16>
Well, I have a question about the view of Matrix, both in AR and VR.
Is the connection between a Persona and his/her PAN visible in Matrix?

Or to be more sepcific, will the icon of PAN float around a Persona (running on a device which is the master of the PAN) in VR;
and will the PAN be beneath the Persona on the floating screen (despite of various UI) ?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: HP15BS on <10-10-17/0418:56>
(Tangentially connected to Youneko's query above)

1)
Rigger 5.0, pg 30 states "All of the following actions are Matrix action.  Yes, you can use them if you're not a rigger."  Yet, the language of many of those electronic warfare matrix actions seem to heavily imply that they can only be used by an RCC.

For example, Target Device says:
"Pick a wireless enabled device you've spotted on the Matrix.  You can target that device and feed targeting data to any pilot program or person with a Sensor rating or smartlink that is slaved to your RCC."

- So can you, in fact, use these matrix actions with a deck or a comm? 
If not, then why not?  What would enable an RCC to find / calculate / share targeting data it acquired by electronic warfare vs a Matrix icon, that a deck or comm would lack?


I suspect the true answer to the above is that comms and decks can in fact target anything that has an icon, and that this is partially due to the way that the Matrix overlays with the physical world.    This brings me to my second query of the day:

2)
Considering how AR Fashion is a thing that exists, combined with how pg 221 of Core's fluff states "... and the people walking down the street are occasionally highlighted by glowing auras--nice blue ones representing your friends, glaring red ones telling you that someone you know and should be avoiding is coming close,"   it seems pretty clear to me that you should be able to highlight a device's icon with an ARO, then anyone who has eyes on the physical world counterpart should be able to see that ARO highlighting the device itself as it moves around in the meat.

(Of course, this is very different from the Trace User action because it doesn't actually give you any kind of gps data. Instead, you (or someone you're sharing AROs with) have to physically be within AR range of the device in order to see it.   This is largely a quick and easy way to share data with your team about which person running around in front of you needs to be in your crosshairs, etc.)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: legionof1 on <10-10-17/1842:35>
@Youneko Think of a PAN as jewelry or the stuff you carry in a pocket like your keys or wallet. It is there but maybe not instantly apparent at first glance. Generally speaking this is the observe in detail action to find out what the PAN is about.

Knowing that some persona has one is trival, like "that man has a watch", anything else is detail.

@HP15BS

1: RAW the action is only doable by an RCC in your example. But that is contradictory to the bit on page 30 and the general tone of the section. Check with your GM/Table but i think there is sufficient intent for a different call to be reasonable. That said i could see RCC's with there focus toward data sharing and group actions being substantially better at it. But i can do exactly the action in question with my smartphone right now(associate a given digital entity with real world factors). Pokemon Go anyone? I'm mightily unimpressed if AR heavy shadowrun can't manage a basic AR principle if someone has the right skills(EWAR) to make it happen.
Note:Other considerations aside performing the action itself appears doable with any device, you just require an RCC to share the results. Which renders the action moot by RAW not unable to be performed.

2: The tables i play we allow such headsup display style info to be shared around. But the caveat is that such info is only as reliable as the person generating the ARO. Your matrix expert mis ID's the Johnson and suddenly your twitchy Sam has butchered your meal ticket. Forget to meticulously update/maintain your personal IFF? Guess the pizza delivery kid that you stiffed on the tip and where avoiding in embarrassment deserved to die.
Additionally keep in mind the penalties involved with AR for perception. And the fact that most magicals will forgo AR because tech interferes with casting, and rare is the mage with eyeball 'ware. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: HP15BS on <10-13-17/1702:14>
Thanks for the reply, but I'm afraid my group will only listen to official Catalyst sources.

Is this the wrong thread for that?

Edit:
Further evidence is the fact that Confuse Pilot is one of those RCC actions, but its limit is [Attack]   ...   which RCCs don't have.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: legionof1 on <10-13-17/1745:23>
You might check the errata subforum to see what's been said there. "Official" word is unfortunately very sparse. Outside of the errata thread there are a few users like Wakshaani that are catalyst employees that could offer insight.

But by and large rules question/clarifications are up to the individual table. There are problems by the truckload in every book published and Catalyst does not have a good track record with publishing corrections.

If your table is gonna stick to RAW and official sources only then your all in for a very unpleasant long term experience. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Johnson on <10-18-17/0014:58>
Hello all,

This thread is so long my question may have been already answered and if so I apologize, as a cursory search did not reveal a similar thread. 

I am a Demo agent and are prepping to run the prime missions at the end of the year at a local con and the function of a power focus came up in a discussion that I wanted clarification on.  In the core book it states that a power focus adds to the effective magic rating of the character, and I have not found an errata or a FAQ rule stating otherwise.  One of my players was told by another CDT agent that a power focus only adds to the dice pools of anything involving the magic attribute, and does not add to the effective magic rating.  So as far as drain is concerned or over casting, Magic is not at all effected by a power focus.  Since I can find no evidence of this in any missions document, I can only assume he was told this in error, but I would just like to make sure I haven't missed anything as this will have a significant impact on how I will play any enemy spellcasters in the events I will be running.

Thanks in advance for any ruling or information you all may have.

Tony
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: &#24525; on <10-18-17/0123:43>
Yeah there hasn't been clarification on Power Foci. It'll just be another thing you'll have to bring at the table before things get rolling.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: legionof1 on <10-18-17/0436:31>
Like shinobi said there is no official clarification.

Core  319 states "...temporarily increase your effective Magic rating.That means they add to your Sorcery, Conjuring, and Enchanting dice pools, along with any other test where Magic is involved."

The first sentence implies a state of the Foci being a attribute increase for Magic, akin to muscle toner or cerebral booster(important to note power foci as an attribute increase is not subject to augmented maximum). The second sentence could be read as implying a DP bonus only and as such does not apply to any check of "is character magic X" like for determining drain type.

Power Foci while expensive as foci go, are very efficient for resources spent for any character with more then Magic 3. Each level of a power foci is about 15 karma(accounting for 2k newyen=1 karma) or the same cost as raising an attribute from 2 to 3 with karma.  Some folks, myself included, feel that a pure stat increase is too powerful for the price point and use the DP bonus implication to make it a slightly less powerful option to mitigate folks trying to munchkin drain codes.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: HP15BS on <10-25-17/1651:52>
Where did I get the idea that registered sprite limit is Logic + Submergence Grade?  I just looked through everything I could think of, and found no mention of grade being a factor.

Was it just a house rule / misquoted rule at my table?  Or is it there, and I'm just not seeing it?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: oxford_fumble on <11-15-17/1125:23>
Another question on Fetishe(s):


Is a Fetish a "magical" item, that can be detected by Assensing?
I tried to find a reference, but didn't see anything in the book - on the Assensing table, there is a mention of "The class of a magical subject ( re elemental, manipulation spell, power focus, curse ritual, and so on)' on the 2-success line, which is where detecting Fetishes would fit IF they are detectable.

It becomes an important question when the magician is using Masking to make himself look like a mundane, and mask up to his initiate rank bonded foci. Potentially they could mask fetishes as well if those are detectable by assessing?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: legionof1 on <11-28-17/1755:51>
@oxford_fumble

I would regard most fetishes as inert objects with regards to assessing, unless the spell is actively being sustained at the moment of the assense test. I think of a fetish as a pipe/filter for the users mana. If there is no mana flowing it is no more astrally remarkable then anything else on the practitioners person.

I would agree that masking would serve to hide an active fetish.

But this is all GM realm as there is no RAW about this to my knowledge.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Stainless Steel Devil Rat on <02-04-18/1137:41>
I apologize for weak Search-Fu but I believe I saw something earlier and now I can't find it again, in reference to the -2 dice pool penalty for defending against AOE attacks:

Do you actually GET any defense tests if you're inside a blast or do you only get a damage resistance test?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Sphinx on <02-04-18/1305:25>
I apologize for weak Search-Fu but I believe I saw something earlier and now I can't find it again, in reference to the -2 dice pool penalty for defending against AOE attacks: Do you actually GET any defense tests if you're inside a blast or do you only get a damage resistance test?

There's no defense test against grenades, explosives, or other area-attacks (see grenades, p.181, and area indirect spells, p.283). There are some interrupt actions in Run & Gun worth knowing about (Right Back at Ya, Run for Your Life, p.124-125). Otherwise, skip straight to damage resistance.

The -2 "Targeted by an area-effect attack" defense modifier (SR5, p.189-190) doesn't usually apply, since most area attacks don't allow a defense test in the first place. The only time it seems to matter is defending against a flamethrower attack. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: legionof1 on <02-05-18/1543:51>
well technically the -2 would matter more, if anyone bothered to target a moveing person directly with AOE attacks. Hitting threshold 3 for a specific point just happens to be easier nearly all the time.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: catrone3 on <03-22-18/0849:34>
@Sphinx

Aren't you missing the motion sensor trigger and how that one does have a defence roll for it based on its wording? It should be changed to impact trigger instead of motion sensor since it explodes from a sudden stop or directional change, but that is beside the point.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kincaid on <03-22-18/0941:05>
@Sphinx

Aren't you missing the motion sensor trigger and how that one does have a defence roll for it based on its wording? It should be changed to impact trigger instead of motion sensor since it explodes from a sudden stop or directional change, but that is beside the point.

After a session, players and GMs simply aim for the floor at their target's feet.
Title: Alter ballustics
Post by: wylie on <04-02-18/1300:43>
Since I cannot find it with search-fu
I was wondering if alter ballistics, from forbidden arcana, negates a spirits immunity to normal weapons?
Is the bullet considered magic, like a weapon focus?
Or it's just the delivery mechanism, hence the bullet strikes first before the spell can effect a spirit?

Thanks in advance
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus on <04-02-18/1320:29>
Certainly the spell that the preparation delivers ignores the immunity.
But nothing in the wording of the spell suggests to me it does. The spells wording is that alter the ballistics properties of the bullet.
Now that fact that it's preparation, which makes it count as a spell I guess open up the argument that would do so.

But that's a separate question falling under characteristics of preparations, or I guess  you could add it to the list of possible effects.
However as written i don't think the spell does, and preparation question is also hard one to call, RAW I don't think it does. But again there is certainly room for debate on the topic. But please start another topic to have it.
 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: wylie on <04-02-18/1514:05>
Just looking for a black and white answer
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kiirnodel on <04-02-18/1652:40>
Alter Ballistics is an Instantaneous spell, its effects happen and then the spell is done. Since bypassing Immunity to Normal Weapons is not one of the listed effects, it doesn't. The preparation itself wouldn't allow any sort of bypassing because it isn't dual-natured (or likely even magical at all) by the time the bullet would hit [preparations only become dual-natured while sustaining a spell].

So plain answer: No. Alter Ballistics does not allow the bypassing of Immunity to Normal Weapons.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: wylie on <04-02-18/2151:55>
Thank you
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Excel on <07-16-18/0829:00>
Hi All!

I have questions about the metagenetic ability "natural venom".
In the "Run Faster" p117. there is the original table with severity with effects but here it is:

ANIMAL TOXINS TABLE
SEVERITY / KARMA COST / SPEED               / POWER    / EFFECT                                                      / PENETRATION
Mild         / 3                   / 1 Combat Turn   / 8             / Disorientation; Stun Damage                       / 0
Moderate  / 5                   / 1 Combat Turn   / 12           / Disorientation; Nausea; Stun Damage         / –1
Serious    / 10                 / Immediate         / 10           / Disorientation; Paralysis; Physical Damage   / –2
Deadly     / 15                 / Immediate         / 12           / Nausea; Paralysis; Physical Damage            / –2


So if somebody has Moderate severity natural venom, she gets all the effects or only one?
Can somebody has double natural venom ability? Like a moderate spat and a Mild inhalation?
Does somebody know hows inhalation works in this case? Like distance, diameter of the poison "gas" etc...

Thanks your help and clarify.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <07-16-18/1037:19>
Hi All!

I have questions about the metagenetic ability "natural venom".
In the "Run Faster" p117. there is the original table with severity with effects but here it is:

ANIMAL TOXINS TABLE
SEVERITY / KARMA COST / SPEED               / POWER    / EFFECT                                                      / PENETRATION
Mild         / 3                   / 1 Combat Turn   / 8             / Disorientation; Stun Damage                       / 0
Moderate  / 5                   / 1 Combat Turn   / 12           / Disorientation; Nausea; Stun Damage         / –1
Serious    / 10                 / Immediate         / 10           / Disorientation; Paralysis; Physical Damage   / –2
Deadly     / 15                 / Immediate         / 12           / Nausea; Paralysis; Physical Damage            / –2


So if somebody has Moderate severity natural venom, she gets all the effects or only one?
Can somebody has double natural venom ability? Like a moderate spat and a Mild inhalation?
Does somebody know hows inhalation works in this case? Like distance, diameter of the poison "gas" etc...

Thanks your help and clarify.


It doesn't list a range for any of them.
But, how far can you spit? 2 m? 3m? Sounds like a melee range.
same thing with exhaled poisons.... maybe a meter...

The difference is in how they work as that can make the difference in if they are effective. but they all appear to be a melee range attack option.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: &#24525; on <07-16-18/2248:58>
It might follow the Venom power (401 pg. Core) which is Touch.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Excel on <07-17-18/0147:12>
Hi All!

I have questions about the metagenetic ability "natural venom".
In the "Run Faster" p117. there is the original table with severity with effects but here it is:

ANIMAL TOXINS TABLE
SEVERITY / KARMA COST / SPEED               / POWER    / EFFECT                                                      / PENETRATION
Mild         / 3                   / 1 Combat Turn   / 8             / Disorientation; Stun Damage                       / 0
Moderate  / 5                   / 1 Combat Turn   / 12           / Disorientation; Nausea; Stun Damage         / –1
Serious    / 10                 / Immediate         / 10           / Disorientation; Paralysis; Physical Damage   / –2
Deadly     / 15                 / Immediate         / 12           / Nausea; Paralysis; Physical Damage            / –2


So if somebody has Moderate severity natural venom, she gets all the effects or only one?
Can somebody has double natural venom ability? Like a moderate spat and a Mild inhalation?
Does somebody know hows inhalation works in this case? Like distance, diameter of the poison "gas" etc...

Thanks your help and clarify.


It doesn't list a range for any of them.
But, how far can you spit? 2 m? 3m? Sounds like a melee range.
same thing with exhaled poisons.... maybe a meter...

The difference is in how they work as that can make the difference in if they are effective. but they all appear to be a melee range attack option.

Thanks! But what about the effects? Do you get all effect for the venom in the same row or only one?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <07-17-18/0154:04>
Core p408 regarding Toxins: "Unless otherwise noted, all effects occur unless the toxin’s Power is reduced to 0 in a Toxin Resistance Test."

So all would apply. And a Force #Power Detox, which has Drain F-6, would eliminate all side-effects (not the damage, of course) on a single hit.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: q132231 on <07-17-18/0157:44>
HI
My friend and I have a question about the 【R&G】HIGH-FASHION ARMOR CLOTHING P57-66.

a)MORTIMER OF LONDON Berwick Suit [CUSTOM FIT]  Wireless Bonus: +1 dice pool bonus to Social Tests

b)MORTIMER OF LONDON Greatcoat Coat [CUSTOM FIT (STACK)] Wireless Bonus: +1 dice pool bonus to Social Tests

CUSTOM FIT (STACK):This characteristic employs all the Custom Fit rules, but in addition these items can stack with other pieces that have been Custom Fit by the same maker, for the same person. The character has to select a specific set of Armored Clothing to have the piece Custom Fit with. The Custom Fit combination then allows the character to use either the base armor or add on the stack bonus for that set of gear.

Can I got +2 (+1 form Berwick Suit and +1 from Greatcoat Coat) dice pool bonus or only +1 dice pool bonus to Social Tests when my character wears both of a and b? ;)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <07-17-18/0200:02>
HI
My friend and I have a question about the 【R&G】HIGH-FASHION ARMOR CLOTHING P57-66.

a)MORTIMER OF LONDON Berwick Suit [CUSTOM FIT]  Wireless Bonus: +1 dice pool bonus to Social Tests

b)MORTIMER OF LONDON Greatcoat Coat [CUSTOM FIT (STACK)] Wireless Bonus: +1 dice pool bonus to Social Tests

CUSTOM FIT (STACK):This characteristic employs all the Custom Fit rules, but in addition these items can stack with other pieces that have been Custom Fit by the same maker, for the same person. The character has to select a specific set of Armored Clothing to have the piece Custom Fit with. The Custom Fit combination then allows the character to use either the base armor or add on the stack bonus for that set of gear.

Can I got +2 (+1 form Berwick Suit and +1 from Greatcoat Coat) dice pool bonus or only +1 dice pool bonus to Social Tests when my character wears both of a and b? ;)
I vaguely recall something about only the top layer applying for Social Tests, but I'd have to dig out the book for a check.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Excel on <07-17-18/0215:29>
Core p408 regarding Toxins: "Unless otherwise noted, all effects occur unless the toxin’s Power is reduced to 0 in a Toxin Resistance Test."

So all would apply. And a Force #Power Detox, which has Drain F-6, would eliminate all side-effects (not the damage, of course) on a single hit.

Thanks a lot for clarify this :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Reaver on <07-18-18/0457:33>
Hi All!

I have questions about the metagenetic ability "natural venom".
In the "Run Faster" p117. there is the original table with severity with effects but here it is:

ANIMAL TOXINS TABLE
SEVERITY / KARMA COST / SPEED               / POWER    / EFFECT                                                      / PENETRATION
Mild         / 3                   / 1 Combat Turn   / 8             / Disorientation; Stun Damage                       / 0
Moderate  / 5                   / 1 Combat Turn   / 12           / Disorientation; Nausea; Stun Damage         / –1
Serious    / 10                 / Immediate         / 10           / Disorientation; Paralysis; Physical Damage   / –2
Deadly     / 15                 / Immediate         / 12           / Nausea; Paralysis; Physical Damage            / –2


So if somebody has Moderate severity natural venom, she gets all the effects or only one?
Can somebody has double natural venom ability? Like a moderate spat and a Mild inhalation?
Does somebody know hows inhalation works in this case? Like distance, diameter of the poison "gas" etc...

Thanks your help and clarify.


It doesn't list a range for any of them.
But, how far can you spit? 2 m? 3m? Sounds like a melee range.
same thing with exhaled poisons.... maybe a meter...

The difference is in how they work as that can make the difference in if they are effective. but they all appear to be a melee range attack option.

Thanks! But what about the effects? Do you get all effect for the venom in the same row or only one?

Just to make sure we are all on the same page and understanding everything... because some of us have been drinking. (ME!)

The way this all boils down is:

If you want a contact vector poison, AND you spend say 15 karma on this (deadly) what you have is:

A spit ( 5 extra karma) poison that has a SPEED of immediate, a Power of 12, causes Nausea; Paralysis; Physical Damage and has a Penetration of -2.

All that costs you a total of 20 karma.

The only thing that the Spitting/exhaling/injecting has to do is with the delivery method of the poison; And thus what protects against it best for a modifier.
a Spitting (Contact vector) poison is only good if you can land it on skin..
A exhaled (Inhalation vector) poison is only good if they breathe it in...
A injected (Injection vector) is only good if you can break the skin...

The rules for poisons can be found in the CRB page 408, as MC pointed out. Refer there for which poison does what by how and what does it. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xen on <07-28-18/1231:18>
I offer some suggestions for later editions of Chrome Flesh with regard to Modular Connections and Limbs:

1) Rather than having the current confusing details of modular limbs and connections for wrist/ankle, elbow/knee and shoulder/hip, simply say that a switchable cyberlimb connection (ie modular cyberlimb connection) can be implanted at the wrist/...../hip joint of your body costing 0.1, 0.2 or 0.3 essence (basically as currently detailed for modular connections but most importantly leaving the capacity column blank).

2) Explicitly state that any appropriate cyberlimb can then be attached to a modular cyberlimb connection (hand/foot to a wrist/ankle, etc; perhaps alpha connection requires).

3) Also offer essence enhancers as limb accessories (at most 1 in a hand, 2 in a lower limb, 3 in a full limb). Each essence enhancer costs 1 capacity (and money) but reduces the limb's essence cost by 0.1

That would make the results mechanically the same as I believe was intended, but a lot less confusing IMHO.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: HP15BS on <07-28-18/1759:14>
Ok, so I've got a number of questions with magic and alchemy:

1)  Core says alchemical "healing spells" must be contact triggers ... does that mean everything in the Health spell category, or exclusively spells with actual healing effects - i.e. Heal and possibly spells like Antidote or Cure Disease?

1-A)  If not, does Potion Maker get around that restriction?
Quote from: FA 39
a Heal spell could have ground aspirin tablets, etc...
The entire volume of the liquid must either be consumed by or poured over the target before the preparation can be triggered in any way other than with a timer trigger.
^  This implies to me that the default for all potions, including Heal, is timer trigger rather than command, and that either consuming or pouring it all over a target circumvents that new default.
But... it's only (heavily) implied, rather than stated outright.

2)  Does the Atomizer only work on compound preps, or can it apply to healing spell preps, too?
   (If it can't, then why even bother?)

3)  Does Increase Reflexes spell apply to all initiative, or only meat?
-  i.e. can it increase VR Matrix Initiative?

4)  Does Elemental Wall have to be vertical , or can it be horizontal, loop, etc so long as it's attached to the ground? ... and/or possibly the wall?
-  I'd assume it doesn't have to be vertical since it can be a dome...

5)  Do biofiber pockets  trigger contact preps?
--   About how big are all of these pockets we have lining our jackets?

Official word would be really nice.     Thanks in advance!
- And sorry if these were answered earlier.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <07-30-18/0412:37>
3)  Does Increase Reflexes spell apply to all initiative, or only meat?
-  i.e. can it increase VR Matrix Initiative?
It increase your [meat / AR] Initiative.
It does not increase your Astral Initiative, Matrix VR Initiative (Cold Sim) or Matrix VR Initiative (Hot Sim).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Fedifensor on <09-12-18/2234:48>
Can I got +2 (+1 form Berwick Suit and +1 from Greatcoat Coat) dice pool bonus or only +1 dice pool bonus to Social Tests when my character wears both of a and b? ;)

The text of Social Limit Modifiers under Armor Features is pretty clear that the answer is no (despite what Hero Lab keeps telling me).

Quote from: Run and Gun page 59, Social Limit Modifiers
The value and status of simply wearing certain outfits help characters impress those around them, while on the other hand wearing camo fatigues at a social gathering isn’t the social standard. Some pieces of armor raise the Social Limit of the wearer. These modifiers do not stack; only the highest modifier of any visible clothing item counts (and “visible” means seeing enough of it that viewers get a solid impression of what the garment does on the wearer. Seeing, for example, only the edge of a cuff poking out from under the sleeve of a battered overcoat or the hem of a dress beneath a housecoat will not provide the modifier). Some increases are limited to certain social circles; those limitations will be listed along with the bonus.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: gungadi on <09-24-18/2313:52>
Adept Ways - Do they double in cost post char gen or not? 

I found https://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=23294.0 but the thread isn't official nor is it covered in the FAQ's current version under Shadow Grimoire nor the Errata, and merely speculation on the writers mistake. 

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Highlander on <09-28-18/1117:32>
Hi all. :)

So I'm new to the forums, but have been into the game and the universe since it's inception way back when (yes, I'm dating myself, lol). I'm currently playing a Technomancer, and I have a question about Diffusion of Firewall.

Now I get ROW states it can only be used on a device, and I want to hack a host. To me, it makes no logical sense that I can't Diffuse a host's Firewall. A Firewall is a Firewall is a Firewall. They're all the same thing. Taking down a device's Firewall should be no different than taking down a host (excepting difficulty). If it's a scale thing, keep in mind that scale has no real bearing in the Matrix (other than prestige/appearance), and if it did, then I should just be able to bore a hole through it.

Thoughts? Opinions? Rules that I may be missing? Looking forward to what all of you may have to say.

-Highlander
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: PiXeL01 on <09-30-18/0503:10>
Adept Ways - Do they double in cost post char gen or not? 

I found https://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=23294.0 but the thread isn't official nor is it covered in the FAQ's current version under Shadow Grimoire nor the Errata, and merely speculation on the writers mistake.

The writer has said numerous times that ways do not cost double after creation.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: gungadi on <09-30-18/1227:09>
Adept Ways - Do they double in cost post char gen or not? 

I found https://forums.shadowruntabletop.com/index.php?topic=23294.0 but the thread isn't official nor is it covered in the FAQ's current version under Shadow Grimoire nor the Errata, and merely speculation on the writers mistake.

The writer has said numerous times that ways do not cost double after creation.

Sure but what the writer has said and official policy i.e. - http://forums.wolflair.com/showthread.php?t=52339 states that until something official from Catalyst comes through they made it an optional rule and thus for both my missions play as Im just getting into the running (And to have a point of reference) and a popular tool won't make it a change until Catalyst officially makes a statement on it other than the writer's intention. 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: &#24525; on <10-08-18/2020:33>
something official from Catalyst comes through
That's like one of them unicorns I hear about right?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus on <10-08-18/2124:27>
Like I said from about 10 mins after that disgrace of magic book came out. Forget Ways in 5th, they are almost totally useless. Any character would be much better of dropping those 20 into stuff from FA. SG is best used for kindling or maybe propping up a table imo.

 
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-26-18/1845:03>
Given how it involves taking damage then immediately using the point, farming it won't be easy since you'd keep taking on damage and Heal spells take a while to become permanent, and a GM likely will not allow you to gain Protection points from deliberate inflicted damage due to the intent ruining the sacrifice. But whether they mean 'summoned' as in the 1 unbound summon, or summoned as in unbound&bound, is something I'm curious about.

Not sure why you're saying you could feed them force when you recover from wounds?_?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-27-18/0626:06>
(( Not sure how instant healing is that easy, given how it involves using tricks to keep more hits than the Force and then sacrificing hit(s) to push the sustain-duration down to 0, all while in combat. All in all it sounds like a risky tactic, not as easy as you're making it sound. ))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-27-18/1534:44>
((And I take it you're spending Reagents on every Heal spell you cast, so the limit is higher than the Force? ))
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-27-18/1543:54>
Okay, so there's no limit. Which means you can safely heal up to 4 damage per time before physical drain becomes risky. As long as you take up to 4 physical damage per time you cover people, and the damage doesn't become stun, and you keep your drain in check, you can theoretically keep stacking this. Which makes 'is this bound or unbound-only' relevant, in case you run into a scenario where a player can farm this without a wipe.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <10-28-18/0457:18>
You're only worried about 600+ karma?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus on <10-28-18/1232:13>
Notion i seriously don't think you understand how the magic systems works.
If you casting something at force 16, it ain't gonna be stun damage, odds are your character is gonna need doc wagon if they tried that.
Drain pools are very limited. Yes cha elf is best capable of dealing with it max possible starting is 13. Centering pool is limited by initiation rating.  You are NEVER going to reach 80 dice of drain or a magic of 40. If you do the math on 40 magic and 40 initiation rating which still wouldn't give you 80 drain dice, and it would cost you 4995 karma that decades of play. This is beyond the scope of play of 99.999% of games. Even in those .001% you won't being spending all that karma straight into that. It's complete unrealistic.
This isn't the purpose of this thread. You don't like SR that's fine, no big deal. But please move on to something you do enjoy.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: mbisber on <10-28-18/1311:36>
Well, my Chicago Missions character has achieved far more than 600K so far, with a few missions left to play, so she is not yet done. And, she can cast Spells at Force 24 with 35 or 37D.

But, dice can roll badly on occasion. She could not get enough hits with 46D and so ended up in a hospital. The higher and more powerful your character gets, the less you really want to take foolish risks.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus on <10-28-18/1813:07>
Look Notion, I never said you were stupid, nor did I insulted you in anyway, you're making a bunch false assumptions, and pretty clearly making the jump to Troll, so keep going if you want, but keep in mind that I asked you nicely to move on to something else you like. I'm prepared to and have no issue with dealing with trolls. I have done it for Thousands of posts.

You are wrong right here:
Re-read channeling on page 148 of Grimoir
"Because two minds inhabit this same body,
Mana spells or powers are resisted by the lowest
Mental attribute of the two. Damage from
Mana spells or powers is applied to both (no
free rides)."
 
Now to be fair I don't like Grimoir at all, FA is a much better magic book. If you read my posts subject I have said no shortage terrible about Grimoir but this isn't BESM or some other brand new easy to break system. SR is on 5th edition, there are holes in 5th, but nothing you can drive a truck like that through.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Stainless Steel Devil Rat on <10-28-18/2006:04>
Quote
Now to be fair I don't like Grimoir at all, FA is a much better magic book. If you read my posts subject I have said no shortage terrible about Grimoir but this isn't BESM or some other brand new easy to break system. SR is on 5th edition, there are holes in 5th, but nothing you can drive a truck like that through.

Dude, when I started reading SR5 core, it took me 30 minutes to find the possibility to use 3 characters with Leadership-Rally to create endless turns. That's not a truck, it's a whole flock of Australian Road Trains. The gate is wide open, it's a no-brainer.

You might wanna spend more than 30 minutes looking at the Leadership rules, then.  You can't have characters A B and C using leadership on each other.  If A uses Rally on B and C, B can't use Rally on A or C.  A is the recognized leader.  C can't use Rally on A or B, because A is the recognized leader.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: AJCarrington on <11-03-18/0835:04>
But tbh, can we focus on the Noble Sacrifice and Channeling topic? We are still nowhere near a clarification, while everyone tells me, that shadowrun has great rules that cant be abused. Can you make that poitn by clarifying channeling and noble sacrifice? Thanks.

Note that the people on this forum are fans/players of the game. Periodically, we get a couple of freelancers popping in, but for the most part there is little direct CGL input. The best we can do is provide our opinions...which may or may not answer your question(s).
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: adzling on <11-03-18/1234:58>
i think EVERYONE knows the rules are hot mess Notion.

You're not "proving" anything that everyone doesn't already know.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Stainless Steel Devil Rat on <11-03-18/1350:19>
Someone tell me how to interact with people in this forum please.

Notion, do me a favor.  Everytime someone says 'up to the GM' or anything like that, translate it to:

"I agree that the rule is unclear as written and two different people might read it differently and without any sort of 'official guidance on the matter, the arbitration must fall upon the presiding GM, hopefully."
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Stainless Steel Devil Rat on <11-04-18/1212:37>
If this is supposed to an answer to the discussion between me and adzling, feel free to elaborate how it is related to the topic...

You said:
I do not want to force any "official" ruling, I just want people to acknowledge, that my problem is not myself being unable to read RAI, but is an intrinsical Ambiguity in the rules.


I don't think anyone has ever said you're wrong about there being ambiguity in the rules (please accept my preemptive mea culpa if in fact someone did without my having seen/remembered it).  In fact numerous people, including myself, have consistently agreed with you on that statement.  In fact adzling went so far as to say:

i think EVERYONE knows the rules are hot mess Notion.

You're not "proving" anything that everyone doesn't already know.

Now being honest with you, it does sound like despite what you said you do want more than empathy and you do want an official ruling on Noble Sacrifice.  If that's correct, you're hardly going about it the best way.  You've been told in effect that one will come if and when it comes, and in the meantime just roll with the GM on it.  And not just by myself, I'll point out. Whether you accept that advice or not accept that advice, it's unreasonable to expect the Powers That Be to change their entire paradigm on issuing errata just because you've demanded it.

If you feel so strongly on any given particular rules issue that the Powers That Be should hurry up on errata/clarifying, then my advice is completely unofficial and coming from a fellow plebeian: you should engage in a more emotionless, more logical argument explaining how and why the issue demands immediate attention.  Certainly stop with the name-calling. You need to convince people to reprioritize what they're already doing.  They won't do it based on complaints.

Quote
... because I can not see, where the "Strong-GM"-debate is in any way related to what we were talking about.

As far as I can tell, you don't see it because you've been arguing from an implicit premise that "Shadowrun shouldn't have to rely on a GM to clarify a rule's application".  Honestly until you drop that presumption, you're really never going to be satisfied with Shadowrun.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-04-18/1326:40>
I feel I should remind people that technically this topic is for asking for official statements, so any lengty unofficial debate between players that isn't a straight-up rule/source/reference-quoting might be best to handle in a separate topic in a polite manner.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-04-18/1508:40>
While some questions might be answered in this thread, it's mainly for the collection of questions, so please bear with us if folks aren't able to answer right away.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-04-18/1514:10>
Could someone involved in the Channeling discussion perhaps make a topic for it, if deemed necessary to continue the conversation? I've got too big a self-protection list to be able to summarise it properly.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: AJCarrington on <11-04-18/1625:03>
I can do, but if I do, Stainless Steel Troll Rat is going to troll it until it gets locked, so that wont help y'know?

No, I don’t know. I do know that resorting to name calling is a great way to get one closed though. I suggest you open a separate thread if you’d like to pursue the conversation further.

SR Mod
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus on <11-04-18/1734:20>
Could someone involved in the Channeling discussion perhaps make a topic for it, if deemed necessary to continue the conversation? I've got too big a self-protection list to be able to summarise it properly.

It doesn't work and for many reasons, the two most obvious ones being no one lives through summoning a force 40 spirit, and two you don't get to use the drain stats of a channeled spirit, unless those drain stats are worse then yours. Threading it will simply going to result in some moron trying to do this at a con, and with my luck it'll be at my table. So given the current situation unless you feel strongly about it Michael, I'd rather just leave sleeping dogs lie.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <11-04-18/1755:05>
Could someone involved in the Channeling discussion perhaps make a topic for it, if deemed necessary to continue the conversation? I've got too big a self-protection list to be able to summarise it properly.

It doesn't work and for many reasons, the two most obvious ones being no one lives through summoning a force 40 spirit, and two you don't get to use the drain stats of a channeled spirit, unless those drain stats are worse then yours. Threading it will simply going to result in some moron trying to do this at a con, and with my luck it'll be at my table. So given the current situation unless you feel strongly about it Michael, I'd rather just leave sleeping dogs lie.
Ah, makes sense, then a detailed debate doesn't seem useful, since the math is against the situation. I know that in my campaign my brother bribed a Force 20 with 1 dram of Orichalcum (refined from second stage to fourth=orichalcum himself) to please not edge-resist against the summoning, then spent 2 Edge on the Summon and Drain rolls to survive the summon attempt. That was a nice campaign final, with drone armies, big booms, F20 Energy Aura and worse. =)

Uhm... Let's see, I DID have a player who had like 30 Drain Resist dice, let's just derail 1 bit more and run the math on unedged Spirit vs Rerolled Drain... (I am a nerd...) F30 has 14.64% chance to k.o. with 10 Physical drain. Now if it's an edging spirit... Let's simulate edged dice with max 3 explosions, which averages to 0.399691 vs the real 0.4... Vs F30 spirit Pushing Limit, 30 rerolled drain dice have 13.27% chance to not take 10P or more drain... And there's 69.68% chance to die outright at 4 Body.

Code: [Select]
AnyDice:
S: {0:2, 2:1}
R: {0:4, 1:5}
E: {0:432, 2:180, 4:30, 6:5, 8:1}

output [highest of 0 and 45dE - 30dR]
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RickDeckard on <02-01-19/0511:43>
Was there a rules FAQ document published based on this thread?
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: PiXeL01 on <02-01-19/1928:48>
No, but many of the questions have been talked about by the Errata Team.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shredni on <05-28-19/1921:32>
Hi All.
Just looking for a consensus of opinion on a couple of topics that I have recently experienced. Please feel free to share your thoughts.
1) Adepts are too overpowered.
2) Adepts can effectively get two power points per initiation grade, one for raising their magic and one from picking 'power point' as their initiation benefit.
3) Adepts must turn all powers on or off. If they are on and they go through a mana barrier their powers are switched off and they may permanently loose them.
4) If an Adept has powers on, an astal mage can attack them with spells, by 'grounding' them through the adept abilities.
5) If an Adept has astral sight they still cannot affect astral space or anything in it.

Comments please...

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Stainless Steel Devil Rat on <05-28-19/1956:33>
Hi All.
Just looking for a consensus of opinion on a couple of topics that I have recently experienced. Please feel free to share your thoughts.
1) Adepts are too overpowered.

Powerful, sure.  OP? I wouldn't say so.  Unless we're looking at Mystic Adepts... in which case yes.  Adept Powers + Spells + Spirits = Stupid.

Quote
2) Adepts can effectively get two power points per initiation grade, one for raising their magic and one from picking 'power point' as their initiation benefit.

False.  Increasing your magic does not grant more adept powers.  Adept powers must be purchased with power points.

Quote
3) Adepts must turn all powers on or off. If they are on and they go through a mana barrier their powers are switched off and they may permanently loose them.

False on both counts (can turn all or some off; there's no risk of permanent loss unless essence or magic loss occurs)

Quote
4) If an Adept has powers on, an astal mage can attack them with spells, by 'grounding' them through the adept abilities.

False.  The one exception is Astral Perception, which does establish a link for the adept to astral space when in use.

Quote
5) If an Adept has astral sight they still cannot affect astral space or anything in it.

False.  Killing hands and Weapon Foci both work on purely astral forms, so long as you have Astral Perception active.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: PiXeL01 on <05-28-19/2310:53>
Actually Adepts gain power points from each magic they purchase so yes, potentially does each initiation grant access to two power point. It’s very karma expensive of course.
Mystic adepts only gain power point by choosing at initiation. They gain nothing from magic.

P. 69 CRB:
• Adepts gain Adept Powers that are purchased with Power
Points. Adepts receive a number of Power Points equal to their Magic rating.

So if their magic goes up they gain more power point
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Stainless Steel Devil Rat on <05-28-19/2321:08>
That's a chargen rule.

Adepts don't gain power points from magic increases just as full magicians don't get additional spells/rituals just because their magic went up.

The only way I know of to gain power points post-chargen is picking them at initiation.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <05-29-19/0039:48>
That's a chargen rule.

Adepts don't gain power points from magic increases just as full magicians don't get additional spells/rituals just because their magic went up.

The only way I know of to gain power points post-chargen is picking them at initiation.
MYSTIC Adepts do not. Adepts gain as normal, only thing errata changed is make extra very clear Mystics do not.
Quote from: p278
If you’re an adept, you get a free Power Point
whenever you increase your Magic attribute (though this
doesn’t apply to mystic adepts), and you can gain a Power
Point through Initiation (p. 324) instead of gaining a
metamagic.

Hi All.
Just looking for a consensus of opinion on a couple of topics that I have recently experienced. Please feel free to share your thoughts.
1) Adepts are too overpowered.
2) Adepts can effectively get two power points per initiation grade, one for raising their magic and one from picking 'power point' as their initiation benefit.
3) Adepts must turn all powers on or off. If they are on and they go through a mana barrier their powers are switched off and they may permanently loose them.
4) If an Adept has powers on, an astal mage can attack them with spells, by 'grounding' them through the adept abilities.
5) If an Adept has astral sight they still cannot affect astral space or anything in it.

Comments please...
1: An opinion-based question which is incredibly leading and should be in its own topic, not in a topic meant for official answers.

2: Yes? And? They get to pick between an extra Power Point and the metamagics such as Adept Centering, Infusion, Qi Sculpt, and a metamagic from whatever Adept Way they want to pick up. Given how all Magic gives them is an extra power point, not significant dicepool/summoning boosts, I don't see the problem with providing this choice.

3: You can turn powers off if you want, which can be useful in bad background counts, but having Adept Powers on does not make you dual-natured and the powers themselves do not have an astral form. So no, your powers aren't smashed off by crossing a Ward.

Quote from: p315/316
Adept powers and many always-on critter powers
are innate and so are unaffected by a barrier. The gam-
emaster has the option to have certain ranged and sustained
critter powers (such as Concealment or Movement)
suffer the same fate as spells.
This explicitly only allows GMs to make exceptions for specific Critter Powers, NOT Adept Powers.

4: No. Adept Powers do not have an Astral Form to attack. Furthermore, there is no such thing as Grounding. Even if someone had an active Focus or Spell on them, the best an astral entity can do is attack that active astral form, which will NOT harm the non-astral person. You can only be affected if you're dual-natured.

5: There are Adept ways of impacting astral forms. Also, ANYONE with Magic can buy and use Astral Combat, so they can still do an Unarmed attack without boosting it with powers. But the skill is non-defaultable, so they must buy it to be able to use it.

Also, literal quote from Astral Perception adept power:
Quote from: p309
Since you’re dual-natured while you’re using astral perception,
you can attack astral forms when you use this power.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shredni on <05-29-19/0635:53>
Thanks for the feedback. FYI I've been a ref of very nearly 40 years, and have reffed Shadowrun from 1st Ed.  I didnt really move to 3rd or 4th Ed, but recently was invited to a game of 5th Ed.
As you can imagine, these are some of the opinions and rules in the game I'm playing, so wanted to get a straight answer as to whether these are house rules or core. Your answers have confirmed my opinions and interpretation of the rules I have read.

Mr Chandra. Though I appreciate your answer, I was just looking for your opinions, with no judgement. Everyone is entitled to one. I wasnt sure whether it was a commonly held belief that Adepts are OP.

From my point of view, everything you have written makes sense to me, and surely makes for a balanced game.
I'm also inclined to go with Stainless Steel Devil Rat on the topic of Power Point gain, as I too read the CharGen paragraph to which he/she refers. This is mainy due to previous editions of the game following this very line.

With these rules in place, I can see how Adept and Street Sams measure up, they are just two different approaches to the same end.

Its good to know people in our community are there with help and opinion. Its all appreciated. Thank you.

p.s.: I have posted the exact same question on several other forums, and, as you may well imagine, am getting the exact same answers. 

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <05-29-19/0708:26>
I'm also inclined to go with Stainless Steel Devil Rat on the topic of Power Point gain, as I too read the CharGen paragraph to which he/she refers. This is mainy due to previous editions of the game following this very line.
It's not a houserule I agree with, since I find Mystic Adepts more of a concern than Adepts, but nobody's forbidding anyone from having houserules. As long as it's identified as a houserule overriding the p278 rules, that's fine.

As for the 'Adepts are OP' thing: That's a subjective question, and there's nothing wrong with asking it, but in a topic that's originally meant for clarifying RAW and RAI, it's not really at its place.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lormyr on <05-29-19/1050:50>
Shredni, most of your questions got tackled, but I do want to add a few thoughts:

Short term, Adepts are relatively on par with ware-focused street sams (with a notable exception that Adepts can be immensely more magic resistant if built for it). Long-term, anything magic wins due to unlimited growth potential of the magic attribute/initiation.

Adepts absolutely do get 1 power point for free every time they raise their magic attribute.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shredni on <05-29-19/1308:33>
Hiya.
Thanks for jumping in.

"Short term, Adepts are relatively on par with ware-focused street sams (with a notable exception that Adepts can be immensely more magic resistant if built for it). Long-term, anything magic wins due to unlimited growth potential of the magic attribute/initiation."

Yeah. Have seen this with other editions. The Steet Sam' cant fit any better cyberware than he has without going looney tunes, but the Adept can keep going for initiation. My only justification/balance with this, in my mind, is that Karma is worth so much more than money, and equivilently harder to come by. By this I mean; the Steet Sam does a run with his adept buddy and is awarded Nuyen and Karma. The Sam' can spend his money on Cyberware, and his Karma on Attributes and Skills (both improve his overall ability)- not discounting living expenses and gear which I feel have a lesser gain. The Adept can spend Nuyen on living expenses and gear, but Karma can be put toward Skills, Attributes or Initiation (Expensive!). So one rescource to cover any overall gain.
So, though the Adept can effectively continue to grow forever, and the Sam cannot, the likelyhood of the Adept getting the chance to do so, in any typical story or campaign is limited. (As is the amount of Nuyen to "Max out" Street Sam!)
As for being Magic resistant, I guess so, but they pay for it, and they could be spending that power point on other, possibly more beneficial, abilities.

'Adepts absolutely do get 1 power point for free every time they raise their magic attribute.'


This, however, comes as a shock. As I mentioned, up to 2nd Ed. didnt give two power points per initiation grade, and I dont see the need for it. This is one of the reasons my current ref cites as for why Adepts are OP. In his mind, when compared to a mage, for example, who gains one ability/metamagic, the Phys Ad gets twice as much. Frustratingly the rules later in the book dont make this any clearer, but the CharGen rules earlier in the book seem to infer that Power Points are linked to Magic Attribute during ChrGen only.

"As an Adept, you get Power Points equal to your Magic Rating at character creation. You then spend the Power Points on buying adept powers."
Quote Page 308 Core Rules

I'm putting this forward despite it not being in my favour ( ;D), but I do feel maybe two Power Points per initiation grade is too much.(?)

Please comment.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Michael Chandra on <05-29-19/1320:50>
They have several metamagics that are useful. As for the mage:

- Gains +1 die on all their magic tests
- Can summon 1 Force Stun, 2 Force Physical higher
- Overcasting drain needs 1 more hit
- Spells/rituals/preparations cast at Higher Force are harder to get rid of
- Can use more Force in Foci without suffering from addiction
- Some fancy awesome new advantage from the Metamagic

An Adept literally gets this from the Magic Point:
- 1 Power Point
- +1/3 bonus on Attribute Boost

And like I mentioned, there are at least 4 useful metamagics for Adepts, so it's not as if they're not sacrificing anything when they go for a Power Point instead.

So I strongly disagree with your ref, and with the houserule.

(Also: Initiating and Magic Increase are two separate instances, of 10+3*Rank and 5*Rank in karma costs. 48, 56, ... karma per combo.)

Quote
Frustratingly the rules later in the book dont make this any clearer
Uhm... I literally quoted the rules and posted the page reference from the Master Index PDF. The same sentence is in the official errata document. If you're just going to insist on acting like I'm just making up direct rulequotes, I'm backing out of this 'debate'.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shredni on <05-29-19/1342:07>
Beautifully summed up Mr Chandra. I agree.
As you put it earlier, though, house rules are house rules, as long as you are aware of them before you start then you accept them. I feel that previous experience of this ref has coloured his opinion quite drastically, and perhaps caused him to err to much the other way. But, its his game.
This topic was mainly to clear up any doubts I had about these rulings as it was unclear to me where they'd come from. I do intend to Ref some 5th Ed. in the future, so I wanted to know where I stand.
Again, thank you all for your input. Its all been good.
Cheers.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shredni on <05-29-19/1357:36>
Mr Chandra.
With regards to:
'Uhm... I literally quoted the rules and posted the page reference from the Master Index PDF. The same sentence is in the official errata document. If you're just going to insist on acting like I'm just making up direct rulequotes, I'm backing out of this 'debate'.'
Your input and your helpful quotations have been of great use, and I had no intent to challenge your input or the veracity of your quotes. I was simply making a statement from the point of view of first reading. I apologise if that did not come across as such.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Lormyr on <05-29-19/1531:41>
My only justification/balance with this, in my mind, is that Karma is worth so much more than money, and equivilently harder to come by.

This is generally true, and is a slight progress speed bump on the adept. That said, that money can also be spent on Foci, which are every bit as good as raw power points at a certain threshold, however.

As for being Magic resistant, I guess so, but they pay for it

A small price to pay considering magic is hands down the most devastating force in the game.

In his mind, when compared to a mage, for example, who gains one ability/metamagic, the Phys Ad gets twice as much.

I suppose it depends on how you look at it. To start, the adept does not get two power points per initiation - he potentially gains 2 per initiation and magic attribute increase. Both characters are paying x karma to initiate, then x karma to raise their magic attribute. Sure, the adept gains two "things" out of doing that, but the mage increases the potential force of his spells by 2 and adds one to his drain pool if he is worth his salt (centering) for the same cost. The mage will win this race every single time.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shredni on <05-29-19/1754:08>
Hm. Good points.
Foci. Yep, never really considered that. Haven't seen how much they can effect the 5th ed game, if i'm honest, as we are permanently reminded how vulnerable such things make you. (another conversation entirely).
You make a good point, and maybe i'm arguing from the wrong perspective. It just seems a lot to me.  ???
Still, you've made me think on it. The Karma cost maybe does warrant something more...
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Marcus on <05-30-19/1334:39>
Going with the no power point on raising magic interpretation just ensures adepts won't raise magic above whatever they had at creation. It will shape what powers are selected and it further weakens any chance of people using the ways. In the grand-scheme of thing I don't think it's going to hugely effect out comes, the ways were DOA in 5e, and combat adept have always been the most popular method. That said it basically reduces the chance of seeing more complex or nuanced adept builds.

Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Shredni on <06-01-19/0616:47>
True.
I think im looking at this from 2nd Ed. eyes.
There are, however, adept powers that do grow with Magic attribute, but as you say, not necessarily the standard picks.
hmm. Again, I cant argue with the logic.

Thanks
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Eherman150 on <07-07-19/1624:51>
I have a rules confusion concerning binding.  In the core book, page 301, it says that “additional net hits beyond the first add to the number of services the spirit owes.”   Does this add to those services generated by the summoning test?  I thought so, but a friend pointed to page 302 where it says “the number of services a spirit owes you is equal to the number of net hits you get on your summoning OR binding test” suggesting that they do not add.

I think page 302 is an example of vague writing and the rule on page 301 applies - but he is certain it is the other way around.  Since we both are playing mages for this season of missions, we need clarification if possible on which of us is right.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Stainless Steel Devil Rat on <07-07-19/1824:36>
I have a rules confusion concerning binding.  In the core book, page 301, it says that “additional net hits beyond the first add to the number of services the spirit owes.”   Does this add to those services generated by the summoning test?  I thought so, but a friend pointed to page 302 where it says “the number of services a spirit owes you is equal to the number of net hits you get on your summoning OR binding test” suggesting that they do not add.

I think page 302 is an example of vague writing and the rule on page 301 applies - but he is certain it is the other way around.  Since we both are playing mages for this season of missions, we need clarification if possible on which of us is right.

I'm not empowered to give official clarifications, but in my view:

The Short answer:
They stack.


The Long answer:
So the reference on page 301 is quite clear for everyone? The dispute seems to be not only whether pg 302 is in contradiction but also that pg 302 trumps pg 301 for some reason?

If so, the "they stack" reading on pg 301 wins by invalidating either leg the other argument relies upon. For "they don't stack" to win it needs both- losing either leg means "they stack".

1st leg: the two citations are incompatible.  Now, there are cases where this happens in SR5 with other rules, so it's a legit concern.  In this case, I believe that there's sufficient syntactic ambiguity to read pg 302 as simply meaning the same thing as "summoning and/or binding" despite using "or" in place of "and/or".  And since you CAN reasonably read pg 302 to be in complete agreement with pg 301, I wouldn't agree there's a solid case of conflict between the two.  You CAN read there to be a conflict, granted.  You can also choose to not read it as a Boolean statement.  If there's only a conflict because you choose for there to be one, then there's not a valid conflict. Ergo, "they stack" > "they don't stack".

2nd leg: even if we were to assume the first leg passes, errata has not addressed the theoretical issue of whether 302 trumps 301 or not. Now this isn't lethal to the argument, as there are STILL some legit conflicts that have never been formally errata'd, but this hypothetical ambiguity ends up just meaning it'd come down to your particular GM.  Anecdotal arguments are inherently weak, but still I've never encountered anyone who played that binding services did NOT stack.  Odds are good that a SRM GM you encounter won't either. But on the off chance you get a GM who's not in agreement about services stacking, then at least you know how it'll be at that GM's table.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Kiirnodel on <07-08-19/0042:53>
There is no distinction between services from the summoning and services from the binding, a spirit simply owes a number of services. The distinction comes from what a spirit can do; when a spirit is bound it can perform additional types of services that it couldn't do as an unbound spirit.

Pg. 302 states that the general case, number of services is derived from net hits on Summoning or Binding tests. This is the general statement.

Pg. 301 states that net hits on the Binding test beyond the first add to the number of services the spirit owes. Since the spirit can already owe services previously from the Summoning, this would qualify as the specific trumps general. The more specific ruling of what exactly the results of a Binding test do, is still the specific rule, even if it happens to come first in the rulebook.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RickDeckard on <06-02-20/1409:56>
Is this FAQ posted anywhere? I didn't flip through 114 pages, so excuse me if it's in this thread somewhere.
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: Xenon on <06-04-20/1455:27>
It is posted here. Isn't that enough? :)
Title: Re: [SR5] Rules Clarifications and FAQ
Post by: RickDeckard on <06-09-20/1348:00>
It is posted here. Isn't that enough? :)

Sure =). Was just wondering if there was a compiled list somewhere. The OP sounded so official like