[Tecumseh]

The weird thing for me is that somebody would voluntarily chop off four perfectly good limbs and replace them with prosthetics, just because. No worse than the eyes, I guess.

Welcome to transhumanism.

It's been a long time since I read it, but welldressedgent's response is the same as Dirk Montgomery's when he meets Argent in 2XS. What really throws Dirk off is the "voluntary replacement" he sees in Argent's file, and the notion that someone would go into a cyberdoc and say, "Here, chop these off perfectly good arms."

But, to Ajax's point, 2XS takes place in November 2052. You get the sense that the Sixth World has changed quite a bit in ~30 years, to the point where voluntary replacement wouldn't necessarily raise the same eyebrows anymore. Perhaps in polite society, but not in the shadows I wouldn't think.

Anyway, just thought I'd mention it. I haven't read that book in ages but Dirk's response still sticks with me after all these years.

[Mollari]

I think there would also have to be a very good reason someone chooses to burn out. Being magical is like winning the lottery. There's a guaranteed corp job for you and likely far more money then the cyber you burned yourself out on is worth.

It'd be an interesting build and I wouldn't veto it, but I would expect a very good roleplay explanation and have it feature heavily in the characters behaviour.

Was it done to him against his will, did he hate his magic etc.

[Ajax]

If I recall correctly, it was in Chrome Flesh that we got rules for bioware limb replacements and the commentary indicates that cyberlimbs as prosthetic replacements have fallen out of favor for those who can afford it. As with all things in cyberpunk this is part of the class divide: the über-rich get bioware replacements, the upperclass get synthetic cyberlimbs, the working drones get obvious cyberlimbs, and the truly down and out get a crude pegleg or a hook.

Then there are the borderline psychotics and near sociopaths in the shadows who opt to voluntarily have their arm lopped off and replaced with arm strong enough to punch through concrete and containing a concealed Uzi. I think we can all agree that Shadowrunners aren’t quite all together right in the head.

[neomerlin]

. I think we can all agree that Shadowrunners aren’t quite all together right in the head.

I think it is weird how little this is mentioned.

The 6th world might be dystopic but it is full of distraction, and when a corp owns you it alleviates the burden of choice and responsibility in your life. It would be so easy to just get by as a wage slave. Even for the SINless there are easier and more sensible ways to survive, especially if you are okay with crime.

Add to that how skilled and capable a runner needs to be to survive and that those skills could probably earn them a SIN if they wanted a legal job, it leaves me with the impression that to be a Shadowrunner by choice kind of requires you be a bit mad.

Absolutely mad enough to say "I will replace my limbs and become robomage!"

[Stainless Steel Devil Rat]

Well again, not everyone who has cyber replacement parts replaced perfectly good body parts.

Noone thinks laser surgery is crazy IRL; replacing the eyes entirely just to correct vision is probably more common than going to the bother of wearing glasses or contacts.  That's even before factoring in how cybernetic replacements not only improve upon the crappy hand your genetics dealt you, you can have superhuman vision!

Ditto for limbs.  Maybe there's birth defects.  Maybe there's injuries.  I tell you what- I have a niggling ankle injury that isn't crippling, but it is annoying as all hell and if chopping it off and putting a shadowrun style cybernetic replacement in its place were an option, I'd be sorely tempted to exercise that option.

And in the setting where cyberlimbs are available and reliable, there may even be some who replace "perfectly good" parts simply to upgrade.  Maybe they're transhumanists.  Maybe they want buff "muscles" without working for them.  Maybe they just want to express themselves with extreme body modification.  It's not like that's not a thing in real life...

[Shinobi Killfist]

I think there would also have to be a very good reason someone chooses to burn out. Being magical is like winning the lottery. There's a guaranteed corp job for you and likely far more money then the cyber you burned yourself out on is worth.

It'd be an interesting build and I wouldn't veto it, but I would expect a very good roleplay explanation and have it feature heavily in the characters behaviour.

Was it done to him against his will, did he hate his magic etc.

I think one of the issues as rules changed along in the editions things like increasing your initiative became easier and easier through magic, in this edition spells are potentially the best method.  When the burn out made sense, magic was still probably too good but it didn't easily cover your combat bases like initiative. So there was some logic to getting things like wired reflexes or boosted reflexes because your 4+1d6 initiative put you behind the curve especially when Ms 14+4d6 rolled a 33 and went on 33, then 23, then 13 and then you went. And now that your magic is 3 or 4 and your spells are weaker, do you take a bit more cyber and keep your magic for small tricks or do you stop and try to get your magic back.  Now, just take focused concentration and  a sustaining focus or two.  Adepts are a different story as its brokenly good to combine the two.

[Reaver]

I think there would also have to be a very good reason someone chooses to burn out. Being magical is like winning the lottery. There's a guaranteed corp job for you and likely far more money then the cyber you burned yourself out on is worth.

It'd be an interesting build and I wouldn't veto it, but I would expect a very good roleplay explanation and have it feature heavily in the characters behaviour.

Was it done to him against his will, did he hate his magic etc.

Sometimes you don't have a choice.

Disease and injury do come up, and sometimes Magic isn't the option, or not available. so now your choice is to live with a disability, such as being blind, or missing a limb. Or getting a cyber replacement. (Yes you could get a custom grown Vat job... for 10x the cost...)

True, from a game mechanics POV this doesn't make sense as we don't have rules for serious injuries like losing a limb or an organ.. (well, not since 2e anyways. And some of us get to live with the poor decision to use those optional rules...)

[Tecumseh]

True, from a game mechanics POV this doesn't make sense as we don't have rules for serious injuries like losing a limb or an organ.. (well, not since 2e anyways. And some of us get to live with the poor decision to use those optional rules...)

SR4's Augmentation has rules for severe injuries, including loss of limb and irreparable organ damage, plus lots of other potential unpleasantness (broken bone, brain damage, paralysis, and much more). See pages 120-122. There are also rules about transplants and organ replacements. I've used both successfully with SR5 with minimal changes and enjoyed how they worked.

Bullets and Bandages has much more limited rules regarding severe wounds. It doesn't go into the same level of detail as Augmentation.

[Glyph]

Taking priority D, then 4 points in augmentations, may seem like it is giving you two "free" points, since your Magic only goes down to 0, not -2, and you can buy it up to 2 with 15 points of Karma.  But your maximum Magic goes down the full 4 points.  If you want to raise it past that rating of 2, you will have to initiate first.  Like Marcus said, it is usually not worth it.  Usually the sweet spot for augmented adepts is 1 or 2 points of augmentation.

[Chalkarts]

I'm hashing out a cybered mage as well focused on counterspelling.
The number of people I can defend is based on my magic rating so I wanted to try to keep magic 2, so I was going to take A magic for the 6 then B $ for the ware and let the cyber drop it to 2.

Counterspell works off of the skill rating not magic rating.  The number of targets is based on magic but if i'm selfish, meh. 

[Marcus]

Saying someone is not right in the head, comes from  our current view of what is normal. However, the question who said the perfectly good is applicable. We already see people going under the knife for many cosmetic surgeries. If limb technology was now as good as the limbs in the core are I'm sure we would see people electivly replacing limbs. If you could go from being the 5th best at something to 1st place simply by having your arm replaced, you don't think plenty would go for It?