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Some Matrix Questions

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Mollari

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« on: <11-27-18/1810:02> »
Hoi chummers.

I've recently started a new campaign and it's been heavier on the matrix than before. Would love your help sorting out some elements I don't understand.

Datataps
So I understand that datataps allow one to access the device itself instead of the host/firewall that it may be slaved to. The wireless function allows it to be remove destroyed. Does this device allow a hacker to remove access it though?
eg. streetsam sneaks into facility, places datatap on camera and the decker hacks it remotely from the carpark across the street.

Datajack Plus
The Datajack Plus allows one to store some programs. Questions are:
a) does the datajack have it's own firewall and dataprocessing? Can one do anything with those programs or do you have to work it through another device?
b) If you're working the programs through another device, does it have to be a deck or can you use it with a comlink (firewall and dataprocessing)

Attack and Sleaze Dongles
What sort of action is it to switch one out for another. One would have to be AR at least, but I can't find reference to doing it on the fly. So far I've said that if ejecting a clip is a simple, then it must be a simple. Thoughts?

Thanks guys

&#24525;

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« Reply #1 on: <11-27-18/2214:24> »
1. Yes (afaik)
2a. Technically, however you do need a device that can form a persona.
2b. Idk
3. Id use a simple.

Sphinx

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« Reply #2 on: <11-27-18/2321:25> »
1. Yes, a datatap creates a wireless access point into a hardwired system. If a street sam hardwires a datatap into a device, the hacker can access it remotely (with standard Noise penalties for distance, interference, etc. — see SR5 p.231). I'd make attaching the datatap a Hardware + Logic vs. Device Rating x 2 Opposed Test.

2a. Yes, cyberware (including a Datajack or Datajack Plus) has a device rating (see SR5 p.421), which includes Data Processing and Firewall attributes. The rules for a Datajack Plus (Kill Code, p.65) state that it can run programs, but not that it can form a persona. You still need a commlink, cyberdeck, RCC, or similar device for that.

2b. Kill Code says the D-Plus can run programs with a commlink, but it would have to be relevant to an ability the commlink has. For example, the D-Plus could run Encryption or Toolbox to boost a commlink's Firewall or Data Processing attributes, but not Decryption or Stealth, because a commlink simply doesn't have an Attack or Sleaze attribute to boost.

3. Agreed. It should be a Simple Action to remove a dongle, another Simple Action to attach a new one. Not something you could do in VR.

&#24525;

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« Reply #3 on: <11-28-18/0148:38> »
3. Agreed. It should be a Simple Action to remove a dongle, another Simple Action to attach a new one. Not something you could do in VR.
Could you order a drone to do so?

Mollari

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« Reply #4 on: <11-28-18/0606:37> »
Hey guys. Thanks for all the amazing answers.

One more question.

Edit File
I know edit file can be used to edit, copy, encrypt files.
Something that came up in a game recently is, can an edited file be detected and restored?

Thanks again

Moonshine Fox

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« Reply #5 on: <11-28-18/0621:15> »
Hey guys. Thanks for all the amazing answers.

One more question.

Edit File
I know edit file can be used to edit, copy, encrypt files.
Something that came up in a game recently is, can an edited file be detected and restored?

Thanks again

I’d call for a matrix perception test to notice the edit, with a threahold based on how well the edit was done, or maybe a vs roll against the editers matrix stealth if they were trying to hide the esit.

As far as restoring the file, i don’t think there’s a hard rule on it, but for my own game it would depend. The larger the organization or the more common the file the more likely there is an original around elsewhere that could replace it. Could maybe let a techno with the Editer complex form use it to retrieve a pre-edit version from the Resonance.

Kiirnodel

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« Reply #6 on: <11-28-18/1654:50> »
Didn't they add a Shredder program in Data Trails that makes a deleted file unrecoverable? If it takes a program to make it impossible to un-delete a file, that would mean by default programs can be un-deleted. Likewise, I would assume other forms of edits could be undone.

In my games, if we have a Matrix centric group or mission, I will add more depth to matrix actions, like adding the fact that Hackers need to cover their tracks. I'll apply a lot of current-day logic to what can and can't be done in a computer system.

Boring7

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« Reply #7 on: <12-02-18/1021:53> »
'Allo!

I have a set of questions that's probably super-dumb, but it's teasing my brain and I can't find a hard 'no' so I'm going to throw it in here:

-Question 1: To keep things generic; let's say I have a subject who is hooked up with trodes for AR manipulation and communication.  His crap-grade commlink and nonexistent matrix skills mean a competent decker can basically do anything hacking allows to that setup.  Can the subject be flipped from "I'm walking around in my meat body" AR to "I'm unconscious on the ground because my brain is in VR" by someone else?  Can they be trapped in the virtual by an unfriendly decker and their own inability to hack? 

-Situation 2: If I already have someone unconscious, but I want to keep them disabled, can I trap them in VR by slapping my own set of trodes, sim module, and commlink (which I semi-legitimately own and has an *excellent* firewall)? 

-Situation 3: If I have a mage trapped in VR, can he astrally project, summon, or cast spells meant to get him out?  Like summoning a spirit to remove the trodes, or casting shapechanging spell that shifts his body so the trodes fall off? 

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #8 on: <12-02-18/1224:04> »
'Allo!

I have a set of questions that's probably super-dumb, but it's teasing my brain and I can't find a hard 'no' so I'm going to throw it in here:

-Question 1: To keep things generic; let's say I have a subject who is hooked up with trodes for AR manipulation and communication.  His crap-grade commlink and nonexistent matrix skills mean a competent decker can basically do anything hacking allows to that setup.  Can the subject be flipped from "I'm walking around in my meat body" AR to "I'm unconscious on the ground because my brain is in VR" by someone else?  Can they be trapped in the virtual by an unfriendly decker and their own inability to hack? 

The Matrix Action that governs this is Switch Interface Mode.  Not only must you be the owner of the device running the persona (and remember 3 marks does not equal ownership), it goes a step further to clarify:

"You can only do this to yourself; you can’t switch other
people’s interface mode."

Quote
-Situation 2: If I already have someone unconscious, but I want to keep them disabled, can I trap them in VR by slapping my own set of trodes, sim module, and commlink (which I semi-legitimately own and has an *excellent* firewall)? 

No, but you could probably accomplish what you want to do by Link-locking them (pg 229).  You'll have to figure out some way to prevent them from being able to achieve or even attempt the Jack Out action though, if you want to keep them imprisoned for some time. 

Quote
-Situation 3: If I have a mage trapped in VR, can he astrally project, summon, or cast spells meant to get him out?  Like summoning a spirit to remove the trodes, or casting shapechanging spell that shifts his body so the trodes fall off?

In VR "your body relaxes and your meat senses are blocked, as though your body were asleep" (pg 229).  Personally, I'd rule no.  Not unless you want to be saying magicians can cast spells and summon spirits in their sleep.

Something that could work (and has worked in the fiction) is tricking the user into not realizing he's in VR in the first place.  But there are no rules for doing this... it's a plot thing you'd have to wrangle for your specific scenario.


Edit:  If you're looking for a way to keep a captive mage under control, the Better Than Bad sourcebook that recently came out has exactly what you need: Blight Toxin *evil giggle*
« Last Edit: <12-02-18/1237:23> by Stainless Steel Devil Rat »
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, you’re fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

Michael Chandra

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« Reply #9 on: <12-02-18/1236:16> »
If you interrupt the rest of someone, they cannot recover stun damage so won't wake up, no?

As for mages: If they have bound spirits, they can just give those a mental command.
How am I not part of the forum?? O_O I am both active and angry!

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #10 on: <12-02-18/1240:54> »
If you interrupt the rest of someone, they cannot recover stun damage so won't wake up, no?

As for mages: If they have bound spirits, they can just give those a mental command.

You test for recovering Stun every hour you spend at "rest". It explicitly gives allowance to test if you spend the hour unconscious.  But yeah hit 'em with a bucket full of cold water or a cattle prod at least once every hour, and they never get their test to recover stun damage...

I slipped mention of Blight Toxin in as you replied... it's not Matrix related but it's perfect for managing captive mages.  No, they won't be giving any orders to their spirits after you jab them...
« Last Edit: <12-02-18/1245:14> by Stainless Steel Devil Rat »
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, you’re fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

Boring7

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« Reply #11 on: <12-02-18/1336:41> »
Don't have the book, but I wouldn't be surprised if blight toxin doesn't work on the current target, since he's a toxic shaman. 

Hopefully the multiple sets of mage-cuffs will work...and not kill him with damage overflow. 

Edit: on a related note our Banshee Shaman (oh dear) has figured out a way to cleanse Tsimshian.  You just get a few Veins of an Adept, drams of Refined Radical Reagent, and the relevant clean [element] spell.  Cast the spells at force 1000000, ignore the drain, and roll up a new character because the GM dropped magic rocks on him (and the rulebook on your head). 
« Last Edit: <12-02-18/1407:21> by Boring7 »

Stainless Steel Devil Rat

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« Reply #12 on: <12-02-18/1337:48> »
Don't have the book, but I wouldn't be surprised if blight toxin doesn't work on the current target, since he's a toxic shaman. 

Hopefully the multiple sets of mage-cuffs will work...and not kill him with damage overflow.

Yeah it'll work.  It turns magicians into mundanes.  No magical abilities whatsoever.  Sure it's not permanent, but that's why you hook up a biomonitor so when you see the drug wearing off and jab him again.

But with regards to imprisoning people in the matrix... I'll reiterate that while it's both possible and has been done in the fiction in the past, there are no rules governing doing so.  It'd require some handwaiving and/or house rules.
« Last Edit: <12-02-18/1341:01> by Stainless Steel Devil Rat »
RPG mechanics exist to give structure and consistency to the game world, true, but at the end of the day, you’re fighting dragons with algebra and random number generators.

Reaver

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« Reply #13 on: <12-02-18/1407:31> »
The easiest and cheapest way to deal with the mage are mage cuffs and a mage mask. Cheap, easy effective, and common enough to get a hold of.

SSDR is right that in the fiction, people have been trapped in the matrix unwillingly, but in all those cases it boiled down to one of two things:

1: a matrix accident (the CRASH, and CRASH 2.0. ASSIT accidents (ASSIT was the term for the neural bridging tech of early cyber decks. some of those testers got... trapped.)
2: Complex and expensive research tests on the limits of the human brain and long term forced VR immersion (Horizon and NEOnet I believe. 4e Wired book) and where not exactly mobile, cheap or user friendly.


But, that doesn't mean you shouldn't try if wish - just means you may have to rely on GM fait to a good idea. And like we point out there is some lore behind your attempt... (and from a GM perspective, may give ME room for a dramatic second battle as he breaks loose with the help of a summoned ally, or toxic spell... MUHAHAHH!!!)
Where am I going? And why am I in a hand basket ???

Remember: You can't fix Stupid. But you can beat on it with a 2x4 until it smartens up! Or dies.

kainite311

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« Reply #14 on: <12-03-18/0109:31> »
Gonna place this here to help keep a single matrix help thread...

As a technomancer using resonance spike, could you use the hammer program (echo) to add +2 DV? What about derezz? And for fun, hyperthread a derezz and resonance spike with hammer program (echo)?
Kainite
Actually, in most Shadowrun games, they typically have a Lifestyle so they're either Murder Hobos (Street/Squatter Level) or Murder Renters (Low+ level)