[default_108]

I don't really have all that standing to make a comment on this since I just started playing Shadowrun (or rather I'm about to start playing my first game) but my impression of Negative Qualities is they should be use, to a degree.  No single quality (Born with, earned, et cetera) should be judged as a group but should be judged individually.  For instance Sensitive System is something you are born with (probably) and would be a good definition of why you're character chose Bioware over Cyberware or chose not to get chromed.

But if someone took the quality Wanted then that means a bounty hunter or hit man should kick down their door on occassion looking for the large Nuyen reward. 

But the way this system seems to be designed is it expects you to take negative qualities and to "Munchkin" the game a little bit otherwise something like Simsense Vertigo would not exist as an option of anyone with Magic.  I'd like to beleive the guys at Catalyst would have simpy put in the rules "Not for mages" if the quality somehow was only for power gaming if power gaming was not to be expected.  It's a game not real life.

I think this subject should come up not as a GM thing but as a GM discussing the negative quality with the player.

So as the GM if you plan on using the negative qualities against a player's character then that player and that GM should discuss how and why you are doing it.  To simply use it against them is kind of cheap.  But if I'm playing a Global Fame Magician allergice to silver.  and my identity becomes compromised then my Enemy or Bounty Hunters after my Wanted quality should be blasting with silver bullets. 

Well I think any quality worth anything to the character should be deeply discusses so the player is happy and the GM is happy.  It's all about communication with each gaming group.  No right or wrong answer if the group it happens to has fun.

Not that I wanted to sound like a smelly hippy here of course.

[JustADude]

I usually use karma gen (German version) for home games, but I almost always toss out an extra 5-50 karma for: 20 questions, detailed backgrounds, and 3x3x3s if the players are willing to take the time to develop them.

So, what the heck is a 3x3x3 anyway?

[Irian]

Never heard of it before, but a quick google search leads to this thread... Could be "3 friends, 3 contacts, 3 rivals".

[JustADude]

Never heard of it before, but a quick google search leads to this thread... Could be "3 friends, 3 contacts, 3 rivals".

Ah, cool. I like the expanded 3x5 version the guy who (claims to have) invented it suggested:

- 3 Friends: NPCs connected to your PC, someone who would help you because they care about you. From your father, to a loyal fan, to someone willing to die for you.

- 3 Contacts: NPCs connected to your PC, someone who would help you because you pay or trade favor with them. From the neighborhood bartender, to a police commissioner, to an old friend.

- 3 Enemies: NPCs connected to your PC, someone who dislikes, hates or has a grudge on your character. From a childhood bully, to a someone who thought you cheated them in poker, to someone wanting you dead.

- 3 Locations: Placed created in/for the setting that are connected to the PC, someplace that is special good or bad to your character. From the place your parents were killed, to your childhood home, to a place you watch the sunrise.

- 3 Organizations: A group created for the setting that is connected to the PC, something for which the PC has worked for or against. From a police org, to a secret society, to a big corporate machine.

The last two, though, are probably best used in a situation where the GM really doesn't have a strong investment in the story beforehand, though.

[Lethe]

I fail to see the difference between I want Sensitive System to come up as part of my story and I want my enemy to come up as part of my story. Both cases are a character taking a flaw to become part of his story.

Not all negative qualities are flaws that have to become a part of the story. Choosing an enemy or an allergy obviously have to be a part of story, because its the only way it can affect the player as a negative quality. Other negative qualities are just limitations to the character, during creation, further character development or in another way. So they are kinda automatically in effect without any action of the GM needed.

If you think, sensitive system is not worth the points for awakened characters, who barely take cyberware anyway, then just house rule that they will get only 5 bp for that.

[Crash_00]

So, what the heck is a 3x3x3 anyway?

The google found it. Yep, that guy put it up on the 7th Sea forum ages ago.

The 3x5 is nice, but it works best when all your players know the setting really well.

Not all negative qualities are flaws that have to become a part of the story.

Not all character flaws have to be taken as negative qualities. I view it the opposite way. If you don't want it to be part of your story, don't take it as a flaw.

If you think, sensitive system is not worth the points for awakened characters, who barely take cyberware anyway, then just house rule that they will get only 5 bp for that.

I've never once made it out that I would only do these things to awakened characters. Awakened characters can take just as much ware as anyone else. They probably shouldn't, but that doesn't stop them, after all burnouts do exist. I've seen more mundanes take Sens. System than awakened, and I treat them the same way.

[Dracain]

I forgot the arm was a bonus to the payment, sorry, that was my mistake there. 

I'm actually playing a character that rolls around in a wheelchair or has those forearm crutches and leg braces when he moves about.  He's a polio victim, but that is only an explanation for his low physical attributes.  I never actually took paraplegic.  One of these days, after I improve my physical stats, he's gonna jump out of the wheelchair and run off when faced with danger...

That is genius!

[Stry]

I am more relaxed about flaws, because they are essentially a BRIBE to give your character a few weaknesses.  And it's less "Here are some free points", and more "If you don't take some flaws, you will have 35 less build points than the other players".  That pretty much encourages a cynical kind of attitude about negative qualities.  If you really want to discourage that, introduce a new negative quality, called "answered the 20 questions and gave me some genuine weaknesses to exploit and plot elements to introduce", worth 35 points.

No it means your character has 35bp in less weakness than the other characters do. 

[DoubleTap]

Doesn't necessarily means the guy is a asshole either.  Could just be a social wall flower, or inept.  The runner might be great at his job, but has social interaction problems.

[ArkangelWinter]

Doesn't necessarily means the guy is a asshole either.  Could just be a social wall flower, or inept.  The runner might be great at his job, but has social interaction problems.

You even meet Con men like that: salesmem who are afraid of meeting people because they can't talk to new people becausr they can't turn "sales mode" off, security personnel who are intimidaying for a living all day and dont think they can be "normal" enough to interact outside work...

I hate that Uncouth also affects Social tests via Matrix because the internet is where a lot of peoole like that go to be "normal". New Qualities time!

[CanRay]

The hell with you all, I can be however I want to be! 

[CitizenJoe]

Wait.  I thought everyone on the internet was uncouth.

[Dracain]

Wait.  I thought everyone on the internet was uncouth.

1+ My good sir.