[_-Target-_]

  I was doing SR research a couple months back and I can no longer find the thread.. However someone was complaining about invincible trolls in armor in SR4 I think, and someone said to shoot them.. I remember the troll would have to soak like 50 or 60 dmg from being shot with high rolls, and like 40 dmg from average rolls.. At the time I didn't see / understand the math..

  Since I still don't understand the math, and I can't find the post to try to work through the math, would someone show me the math on how to get extreme damages from NPC's shooting.  As I recall he was using bursts, or Full auto, and I think there was a follow on example of a sniper rifle.  I have a hard time seeing like a 7p weapon getting to super high numbers..

Thanks

[FastJack]

Was it in this thread?

[Mäx]

  I was doing SR research a couple months back and I can no longer find the thread.. However someone was complaining about invincible trolls in armor in SR4 I think, and someone said to shoot them.. I remember the troll would have to soak like 50 or 60 dmg from being shot with high rolls, and like 40 dmg from average rolls.. At the time I didn't see / understand the math..

  Since I still don't understand the math, and I can't find the post to try to work through the math, would someone show me the math on how to get extreme damages from NPC's shooting.  As I recall he was using bursts, or Full auto, and I think there was a follow on example of a sniper rifle.  I have a hard time seeing like a 7p weapon getting to super high numbers..

Thanks

I think there must have been a missunderstanding in either your part the posters part or the guy posting that was highly exaggerating, becouse it's not realistically possible to get that high damage with shooting.

You can get get 20-30 points of damage with very good rolls(6P weapon fired full auto needs 5 nethits to do 20 points of damage)
Damages in the range of 40-60 are while technically possible very very damm unlikely think(technically its possible to get an infinite amount of hits, but even something like 25 net hits needed to raise that guns damage to 40 isn't really something you should expect to get,ever)

[Dead Monky]

Yeah.  If you want to reliably get 50-60 damage you need high end milspec vehicle weapons and/or lots and lots of high end explosives.  Or you could crash planes and helicopters into people.  That would probably inflict that much damage.

[Mäx]

Yeah.  If you want to reliably get 50-60 damage you need high end milspec vehicle weapons

Actually there are no vehicle weapons either that can do that much damage without the extreme amount of net-hit.

[Dead Monky]

True.  Okay, maybe crash a jet or t-bird into them then.

[_-Target-_]

Was it in this thread?

I don't think it was this site at all, it was dumpshock or some other site, it was before this site was really going, or rather before  I was aware of this forum, probably 2+ months ago..

I could be mistaken, that was all about magic based possession stuff IRC.. This was just some tough a$$ troll in armour that could effectively ignore basic guns as nothing got through..

So how does one reliably get over 20dmg then?

[FastJack]

Was it in this thread?

I don't think it was this site at all, it was dumpshock or some other site, it was before this site was really going, or rather before  I was aware of this forum, probably 2+ months ago..

I could be mistaken, that was all about magic based possession stuff IRC.. This was just some tough a$$ troll in armour that could effectively ignore basic guns as nothing got through..

So how does one reliably get over 20dmg then?

Critical hit with a Gauss?
Burning a point of edge with a sniper rifle?

[voydangel]

Was it in this thread?

I don't think it was this site at all, it was dumpshock or some other site, it was before this site was really going, or rather before  I was aware of this forum, probably 2+ months ago..

I could be mistaken, that was all about magic based possession stuff IRC.. This was just some tough a$$ troll in armour that could effectively ignore basic guns as nothing got through..

So how does one reliably get over 20dmg then?

There really is no reliable way to get 20+ DV with a single attack. Most likely you are going to need to look into the idea of multiple attacks which will add up to 20+ DV per combat round. That can be done quite consistently...

[Medicineman]

There really is no reliable way to get 20+ DV
Vindicator Minigun (Base Damage 20 P Full Auto)
Dicepool of 15 ,Edge 6 = Damage of 30P is possible
HMG (Base Dam 16P for Full Auto ) same Dicepool & Edge = 25P possible

with a possible Dance
Medicineman

[Mäx]

So how does one reliably get over 20dmg then?

There really is no reliable way to get 20+ DV with a single attack.

Any weapon fired in full-auto with awesome dicepool(20+) does 20+ damage quite reliably.
With a dicepool 21 dice you get on avarage 7 hits combined with the +9DV for full auto gets us to DV of 16 meaning even a machine pistol loaded with standard rounds do 20 points of damage.
Get a bigger gun and better ammo and your doing 20+ damage quite reliably.

[voydangel]

There really is no reliable way to get 20+ DV
Vindicator Minigun (Base Damage 20 P Full Auto)
Dicepool of 15 ,Edge 6 = Damage of 30P is possible
HMG (Base Dam 16P for Full Auto ) same Dicepool & Edge = 25P possible

with a possible Dance
Medicineman

Unless I missed an errata, or my math is wrong (both are entirely possible), Vindicator Minigun Base Damage: 6 + full auto bonus: 9 = 15 Modified Base DV, which would still require a dice pool of 15+ to hit 20DV. If you need to roll at least 15 dice, and hope that you get that many hits, I don't know if I would call that reliable. (I know the minigun uses 15 rounds per full auto burst, but I can't find anywhere in the rules where it states that its damage is increased from that. The way I read it, you still only get +9DV, it just costs more ammo to get there).

So how does one reliably get over 20dmg then?

There really is no reliable way to get 20+ DV with a single attack.

Any weapon fired in full-auto with awesome dicepool(20+) does 20+ damage quite reliably.
With a dicepool 21 dice you get on avarage 7 hits combined with the +9DV for full auto gets us to DV of 16 meaning even a machine pistol loaded with standard rounds do 20 points of damage.
Get a bigger gun and better ammo and your doing 20+ damage quite reliably.

As above, I don't know if I could call needing to rely on rolling a 21+ dice pool reliable.

Yes, these are both possible, but in what extreme circumstances are you going to have 21+ dice pool with no situational modifiers? I know its do-able, but how overly specialized do you need to get? It's viable sure, but I guess I'm just not a big fan of overspecialization.

Then again, being overly specialized or not is not what this thread is about, so both of these options are totally 100% valid - assuming you build up your dice pool to meet the minimum required hit average.

[Medicineman]

Unless I missed an errata, or my math is wrong (both are entirely possible), Vindicator Minigun Base Damage: 6 + full auto bonus: 9 = 15 Modified Base DV,
its 6 + 14 Full Auto because its a Gattling Gun
Damage is is allways Bullets -1

HougH!
Medicineman

[voydangel]

Ahh, yes, as per block text Arsenal pg.30. I was only going by the core, didn't recall the block text extra rules until I went looking.

[Mäx]

So how does one reliably get over 20dmg then?

There really is no reliable way to get 20+ DV with a single attack.

Any weapon fired in full-auto with awesome dicepool(20+) does 20+ damage quite reliably.
With a dicepool 21 dice you get on avarage 7 hits combined with the +9DV for full auto gets us to DV of 16 meaning even a machine pistol loaded with standard rounds do 20 points of damage.
Get a bigger gun and better ammo and your doing 20+ damage quite reliably.

As above, I don't know if I could call needing to rely on rolling a 21+ dice pool reliable.

If i have around 25 dice for shooting, then i get to roll 21+ dice pretty damm reliably.
I can't see how you can claim it not being reliable if i have the dicepool requiered to get that amount of hits every time(on avarege)
Also that 21 die pool was only needed to boost a machine pistols damage to 20.
Assault rifle loaded with Ex-Ex has a base damage of 7P, with that you need a much more modest number of net hits, 4 to be exact, to reach DV 20 using full-auto.